here is south vietnam. here is north vietnam. north vietnam already occupies this part of laos. if north vietnam also occupied this whole band in cambodia or the entire country, it would mean that south vietnam was completely outflanked and the forces of americans in this area as well as the south vietnamese would be in an untenable military position. our second choice is to provide massive military assistance to cambodia itself. now, unfortunately, while we deeply sympathize with the plight of 7 million cambodians whose country is being invaded, massive amounts of military assistance could not be rapidly and effectively utilized by this small cambodian army against the immediate threat. with other nations, we shall do our best to provide the small arms and other equipment which the cambodian army of 40,000 needs and can use for its defense, but the aid we will provide will be limited to the purpose of enabling cambodia to defend its neutrality and not for the purpose of making it an active belligerent on one side or the other. our third choice is to go to the heart of the troub

here is south vietnam. here is north vietnam. north vietnam already occupies this part of laos. if north vietnam also occupied this whole band in cambodia or the entire country, it would mean that south vietnam who is completely outflanked and the forces of americans in this area as well as the south vietnamese would be in an untenable military position. our second choice is to provide massive military assistance to cambodia itself. now, unfortunately, while we deeply sympathize with the plight of 7 million cambodians whose countries have been invaded, massive amounts of military assistance could not be rapidly and effectively routelized by the small cambodian army. we'll provide small equipment, which the cambodian army needs and use the but the aide we will provide to the purpose of allowing cambodia to defend its neutrality and not for the person of making it an acting belligerent on one side or the other. many. our third choits. north vietnamese ant vietnamese-occupied territories, those sanctuaries which serve as bases for attack on america and south vietnamese forces in so

as north vietnam's forces were taking over the entire country, which is now called vietnam. and is a tourist attraction, for americans. today, president biden recalled the madness, of the american involvement in the vietnam war, which was america's longest war, before the war in afghanistan, went on to set the record, at 20 years. >> i made a commitment to the american people, when i ran for president. that i would bring america's military involvement in afghanistan to an end. it's been hard and messy, and yes far from perfect, i have honored that commitment. more importantly, i made a commitment to the brave men and women who served this nation. that i was not going to ask them to continue to risk their lives, in a military action that should've ended long ago. our leaders did that in vietnam, when i got here is a young man. i will not do it in afghanistan. >> if you're not old enough to remember watching our final exit from vietnam on tv, then what you are watching in afghanistan tonight is new to you. two people, who i really would love to talk to about afghanistan tonigh

in vietnam on nob in 1975, after saigon then the capital city of south vietnam went to the north vietnamese army, republican president gerald ford was able to get absolutely no one out of vietnam, no one. in those final days before the last american helicopter left saigon, leaving thousands of our allies behind, the ford administration was able to evacuate a total of 7000 people. the biden run of evacuation as well on its way to evacuating many more people than the american military was able to evacuate from vietnam in the final days. in vietnam, the americans were being driven out of the country out gunpoint. in afghanistan, so far, the taliban have not fired a shot at the american military. in both desperate last minute evacuations, the american military did its very best. the final days in both countries are filled with stories of american military heroism but there are demonstration of the military inability to invade a country, spent 20 years losing a war, and then evacuating in a way that meets with the approval of an american news media filled with people who think they know how to d

millions of war dead in vietnam and cambodia. we left behind babies, fathered by american soldiers and yes, we left behind people who helped american reporters in vietnam. we left behind all sorts of people who helped us in vietnam. evacuating armies always leave people behind despite hollywood mythology to the contrary. richard nixon and henry kissinger killed thousands of innocent victims with a sustained strain of bombs dropped from the skies. there is no measure by which the american experience in afghanistan is worse than the experience in vietnam but particularly american to believe that your personal version of an experience is always the best or the worst and so for 49-year-olds like ben sass who have never before witnessed the united states being driven out of a country in total military defeat, this must be the worst. the american military did not just terrorize southeast asia for 13 years with the vietnam war. the american military and the american government terrified americans at home in the vietnam war, especially e

when we evacuated vietnam in 1975. and so, that source literally does not know what he or she is saying, so two republican senator ben sasse who said this today on television, what is happening at the international airport there is more shameful, lower moment in u.s. history the 1975 in saigon. ben sasse was three years old in 1975, ben sasse literally does not know what he is talking about. everything about vietnam was much, much worse than what has happened in the american experience in afghanistan. the total of american military personnel killed in afghanistan, over 20 years, equals approximately just one month of american military deaths in vietnam in may of 1968. and here is just one measure, and only one measure, of how much worse the american experience in vietnam was. u.s. military deaths in vietnam over roughly 13 years of active comeback was 57,000. the american military deaths and afghanistan over 20 years worth 2448. of american military deaths alone, that figure alone, vietnam was 20 times worse than afgha

final withdrawal from vietnam. no one in the anti-war movement, including the vietnam veterans, believed that they had a better idea about how to evacuate a lost war or that the american military was capable of doing a better job of evacuating from a war that they lost. the lesson of the vietnam war and the war in afghanistan, including the last days of those wars is not that we have to teach west point classes of future generals how to safely and honorably evacuate from our lost wars without leaving anyone behind. the lesson for a country that has not won a war since 1945 is, stop launching wars of dubious legality and unclear moral purpose that we do not know how to win. the people who own the american exit from the afghanistan war are the people who advocated launching that war and, more importantly, the people who never learned, the people who never stopped advocating for continuing that war. leading off our discussion tonight is someone who was there in the thick of our politics in the immediate aftermath of t

i had vietnam in 1968. i know exactly what went on in vietnam. it was nothing compared to what is going on now. i was on the top of the building when we lifted out in helicopters and i was helping people get on, soldiers, politicians, citizens. but to be a minis -- the vietnamese did not stop fighting. they were not a bunch of fiends. they were fighting up to the steps as they were getting help to get away from it. over in afghanistan, they are the crookedest people in the world and always have been. when we went over there, even in iraq, we went over there because of the whole business -- oil business. i know that. i worked in the oil fields fields for quite a few years. but we do not need to be over there in the middle east and we do not need to be supporting israel over there. host: you mentioned you were there for the fall of saigon. how close were you to this famous picture when it comes to the fall of saigon of the rooftop of the embassy? caller: 50, 60 foot at one time. i was sergeant major in the marine corps. i know the trustees and stuf

army during the vietnam war. next, he describes his training in the military action codenamed operation junction city. later in his career while serving in the u.s. army reserves he was at the pentagon during the september 11 terrorist attacks. he recounts hearing the explosion and the mass confusion that followed. this interview is from the veterans history project and was conducted by the atlanta history center research center. >> born in dallas, moved briefly to chicago which is where my dad was from. my mom was from indiana but then my dad got transferred to jacksonville, florida, in 1952 and i actually grew up from age eight in jacksonville until i left to go to college in 1962. i tend university of alabama. i was in rotc because back in those days you were required any land-grant university to be enrolled in basic rotc the first two years, then the vietnam war broke out all i was in therd there's a lot of talk about the draft really come into play and a lot of folks getting called up and being sent to this

vietnam veterans association. anyway, after i was promoted to brigadier general, i am basically taking this delaware national guard command and converting it to an army national reserve command. this is a very important signal command. it has, it had a forward section that operated out of hawaii, out of honolulu, and then it had a forward element that operated out of seoul, korea. and they provided the theater signal operations for the pacific. basically, the korean peninsula. and i had to train these national guard guys how to speak army reserve. my boss who was a delaware national guard major general kept referring to the reserve center as an armory. sir, we don't have armories, wea reserve center. and i said we don't have a state mission. we only have one mission. and i was reminded of a story about, it's a true story. i had a young lady work for me in the advertising agency whose father commanded the 48th brigade at the georgia national guard, her name was leadership. and one day i said, lynning, do you know t

there was a generation of post-vietnam generals, analysts and the like, and the lessons of vietnam seem to inform policy going forward. but you alluded to the parallels between not knowing the country, vietnam, and what american policy has been like in afghanistan and iraq. where do you see those lessons that have not been applied about how important it is to know a culture? ms. becker: look at how the iraq war was voted on. it was supposedly a post-9/11 reaction. the information was false for the reasons for going in. their understanding of iraq was thin, and then once there, the mistakes were extraordinary, right off the bat. i was at "the times" at the point, and it was so hard to cover that. myself, i said, haven't they learned anything from vietnam? and then afghanistan. i am not an expert, but again, it is military might missing opportunities, military opportunities, and not knowing how to respond. i, so -- if overall, it seems we still lead with the military and not with diplomacy, not with an understanding. i mean, look at the difference in the budgets. [laughter] we continually

. >> they have another lockdown there in vietnam, parts of vietnam. that is naturally going to weigh on the economy. we had several downgrades as well. give us a sense of that. meanwhile we are seeing the equity market at record highs. >> that is always an interesting flip. i do think that the situation in vietnam is particularly troubling, you have lockdowns that go on in the largest city in vietnam, the business capitals of vietnam, incidents where companies are trying to keep production going by having workers sleep over at the factory. it is a very different situation than it is in some other places around the globe but it does present critical challenges. from a u.s. perspective, this is a place that is pivotal in terms of southeast asia both economic and security as well as the u.s. china play. it is vitally strategically important that kamala harris do something and get something right here and get this on the board in a good fashion. >> that was the senior editor with what to expect with the vice president of the u.s. in vietnam. coming up, wi

i would worry about going over to vietnam. i hate to fight somebody else's war. >> what difference is there between world war ii and the vietnam war? >> we were attacked. >> you are getting attacked. it is at home. pearl harbor. they came, somebody punches you in the mouth you don't walk away from it. i would be in the line and listing but i don't think i would go to vietnam. i would be damned if i go. >> hard to say who is foreign who is against. what the hotheads are against, just tearing things up, more that and that they are really for the war. >> i resent your statement that i got a flag on my car. >> people who are killed are not concerned with keeping the war going, they want to end it. they are trying to show they are americans and will back people of that i there. >> why are we there? some people made a lot of mistakes in 1963 or 64. wrong decisions should cost me my life or legs or arms or something like that. >> would you think will happen to your prosperity if we get out of vietnam? >> give them salaries, give them

mark: another problem was a situation in vietnam. in many of the conversations, with this all important topic. this was no conversation this one comes from may 27, 64. and lbj is on the phone this national security advisor. monday and this is at a point where lbj is trying to keep vietnam off the agenda and of the front pages but as well aware major decisions are looming before him few months on the road. >> the more i think and getting into another. [inaudible]. that one can never get out of it. and i believe that the chinese communist come into it and i don't think that we can drive 10000 miles away from home in that area. [inaudible]. and don't think it's worth ripping apart i don't think that we can get out. [inaudible]. it is an awful mess. [inaudible]. what is it for three and what is it worth to this country. [inaudible]. we have a treaty everybody else has a treaty out there. and of course you start and they tissue right into your own kitchen. [inaudible]. and that is trouble the suffer the world if anything comes apart on it

over the last time we did this in the evacuation from vietnam. the next time we lose a foreign war and flee that country, you will see these images, again, because no one in history, no country has ever evacuated from a lost war without the kind of final images we saw in vietnam. and the final images we are seeing now in afghanistan. >> no operation like this. no evacuation from a capital that has fallen into civil war could unfold without those images. >> let me be clear. the evacuation of thousands of people from kabul is going to be hard and painful, no matter when it started or when we began. it would have been true if we had started a month ago or a month from now. there is no way to evacuate this many people without pain and loss of heartbreaking images you see on television. it's just a fact. my heartaches for those -- those people you see. >> so, an evacuation operation in a dangerous situation was going to have to happen, at some point. and when you run an operation like that, when you are trying to position assets to go in and secure an

so we ought to let the refugees from vietnam in. throughout the cold war, americans continued to feel a special obligation to people who were fighting against communism. people who were the less fortunate human beings who faced retribution and persecution. this was also another reason why a lot of americans were open to accepting southeast asian refugees. a majority agreed that the united states should accept political refugees who were specifically fleeing communist countries. there was the specific context of the vietnam war. the fact that refugees were fleeing a region where the united states had been directly involved in years of brutal warfare, heightened the sense of obligation. americans were particularly committed to admitting southeast asian refugees who had worked closely with u.s. military, with the cia, as translators or in the diplomatic corps. americans who had worked in vietnam felt terrible about potentially abandoning their southeast asian colleagues. other refugee advocates argued that americans must aid and admit

the war zone including his first day in vietnam. in 1998 he received the bronze star with v for valor, the only american civilian to be awarded the medal for his actions during the war. this interview is there the veterans history project and conducted by the kenan research center. >> i was born three weeks before pearl harbor and i did not meet my father until the end of 1945 when he came home from service. he and five of his brothers wore the uniform in world war ii and four of my mother's brothers. so we were heavily invested in that war, and my earliest memories are of living in houses full of frightened women looking out the window for the telegraph boy. you know, they were all of these uncles and aunts were young couples, they had maybe one or two kids. the war broke out and then the father is gone and he's gone mostly for the duration of the war. so we -- my mother and i lived between her mother's house and the little town of mar kate, texas, and his mother's house in the little town of franklin, texas, which was 28 miles awa

at least that was the reaction on line vietnam. the nation we destroyed and who was still dealing with the aftermath of our last visit there. kamala is an imperialist, saying, americans back in vietnam. can juris images of b, 50 twos, dropping the bombs on villages. do you think if camera was off? how many vietnamese civilian and soldier deaths america was responsible for over 25 year period. that her guess would be even within a 1000000 of the actual number. i mean, seriously, america is back that the wording the u. s. went with when visiting a country, it ravaged with a hideously toxic agent orange in the decades long conflict. it's been almost 60 years since the chemical was widely deployed and the vietnamese are still dealing with the aftermath. me the that's all despite the assurances by washington, an annoying of their cooperation to clear up the heretic effects, it is necessary to continue to mobilize resources to accelerate the progress of dioxin decontamination and be an apple area. seek more appropriate methods to provide

surrender, to north vietnam. to which the white house press secretary said quote, given the military situation, this did seem to be the inevitable result. no one, in the white house press corps then, asked, why president ford did not publicly say it was inevitable? that the side we had been fighting for, would surrender, before they surrendered. because the reporters were all adults, then who understood that the president of the united states, even if he believed, it could not publicly predict, the surrender, of the week government we had been fighting for. then, from the 1975 press free-flowing, there is this question. question, are there any plans by the united states government to attempt to evacuate any other selfie enemies now that all americans have left? mr. nelson, no. question. there will be no further effort to bring out any selfie enemies, is that right? >> mr.-ness, and yes that is correct. some selfie in me as i understand are making their way by various boats out into the south china sea. i suspect

nixon arrived in the capital of south vietnam. u.s. ambassador frederick reinhart, represents of the president and a throng of vietnamese citizens greeted them n. no other place were the nixons to see a bigger change than their previous visit. then this land had been in the throes of war. today it was a peaceful and free republic. while riding into saigon, signs over the world testified to the friendship vietnam feels toward the american people and their elected representatives. this happened to be a time of national rejoicing. everywhere there were people carrying banners, marching in celebration of the second anniversary of the presidency. [cheers and applause] ♪ ♪ >> thousands gathered on the spacious lawn before the presidential palace to cheer the republic and the president when mr. nixon came to be received by the young nation's chief executive. [cheers and applause] ♪♪ >> the two leaders conferredded for an hour and a half. mr. nixon extended president eisenhower's warmest personal congratulations, well earned by a man a

for america's sins in vietnam. just as powerful as american guilt was the idea of american goodness. pride in american compassion and generosity spurred americans to take action. the idea that the united states was the benevolent leader of the free world also converged with religious ideas. the idea that the united states needed to be the good samaritan. finally, refugee advocates argued that americans should not admit refugees because americans are good but because refugees are good for america. one senate resolution from 1975 declared, this period of influx of refugees and exiles can serve to keep us humble, saving us from the sins of arrogance, pride, and self-righteousness. i need to tell you, this support for refugees really was small compared to the opposition to refugees. despite the lofty ideals and passioned support, the majority of americans opposed the resettlement. this sentiment was by no means a new development in american culture. public opinion polls indicate that consistently throughout the 20th ce

nixon argued that anti- vietnam war protesters in the counterculture were a minority. he asked for the support of the nonfocal majority. next on reel america, "eight flags for 99 cents" - 1970, this film was created in response to president nixon speech and funded by the group business executives move for vietnam peace. the filmmakers interviewed working-class residents of the chicago neighborhood and their views about the war and the so-called "silent majority". [inaudible]. the silent majorities have too many things on their mind is. your kids, then making sure not in trouble, they work real hard, their wives are working to. and just trying to stay out of trouble in doing the right thing every day day in and day out but there think, to me that is the "silent majority", ordinary community in the night united states right here, the people who have their security tied up in her property and take pride in the property and in their home this is what they work for this their life so they are silent because i feel like they just don't think that they can fight city hall any

oh, it is my introduction to the vietnam war. and that night, henri took the first shift for three hours, and then it was my turn. the guy gave us a m-2 grease gun, .45 caliber submachine gun. and my turn. i'm out there, and i'm scared to death. i'm in this bunker with a slit that looks out right at the road. well, during my shift, the enemy attacked the south vietnamese compound, commander's compound across the little road, and they had hit with satchel charges blowing it up, and i am figuring that we are next, and finally after the longest night of my life, there's a little light in the east, and the sun is going to come up in a minute, and i've made it, and i look, and down that road comes a vietnamese guy on a bicycle with a big package on the front. on his handlebars, and i have jacked around in that machine gun and i have it on him, and i am about to blow his gizzard out, and he says, "son, if you shoot that man, you are going to have to cook our breakfast." ah. he was the cook. and our breakfast was on his handlebars. i te

signed a peace accord with north of vietnam. and evacuated all of the american military leaders from laos. but 18,000 hmong soldiers were left behind. some dispersed into the countryside, some joined the general army, and in 1975, vang pao and some military leaders were airlifted by the cia out of laos. but most hmong people were not that fortunate. of the 10,000 hmong flooded the health -- headquarters at -- only a small fraction rejected by the u.s.. thousands of people embarked on the exodus to thailand, treacherously. carrying their position on their back, families traveled by foot through the jungle and journeyed at night to avoid capture by the communists. and by 1979, nearly 20,000 hmong refugees attempted to make the crossing each month. so, that crossing over the river in such a powerful part of the hmong stories of the refugee migrations. and you can see it powerfully scene here. americans today have paid attention to news of refugee crises overseas. and they've been following of news reports, they've been watching foo

and i think what you get then in the all volunteer force, when it becomes after vietnam, post vietnam, we move to an all volunteer force, you get a lot of whites fleeing the military, right? because the money, the opportunities are better in the civilian sector at the time. but african-americans very aptly see that as a way toward advancement. and that is why you see significant gains. say, post 80, meaning african-americans in higher posts like master sergeant, sergeant major, and then also in the officer ranks. those take time to build up, right? if we think in the case of african-american marines, that by vietnam, they had some time in but the discrimination kept down their advancement. but post vietnam they had been in a significant amount of time. things had shifted. i'm not saying it's perfect because it's still not perfect. but now you're seeing african-americans in senior positions and indeed, quite a bit higher now, as you noted at the beginning of the presentation. and i think it is an evolutionary process that we're still seeing the military as unfortunately being looked th

how do you think were ever going to just abolish something like that from vietnam. you can't win a war like this news paying for the war, we are. for what. >> communism, might as well be it vietnam because the communist china would love to get down into the pacific, they don't have enough room for the people as it is. and they would just take over everything if they don't stop them as a nation. >> stopping communism, doesn't seem right because after all russia has lots of men and look what we have lost. >> do you think we stop the communism or what is the real issue or you know. >> i feel that there are children born in vietnam that is now grown to. and i think that most people are sick and tired of warn i think they're entitled to have a time for peace. >> i hear some of the boys come back and say, those people don't even want to fix it. so makes you wonder doesn't it. >> a lot of them hated me while i was there and most of them thought that if you weren't american, or if you are american you owe them something and i think that we do of them something, the right to

or white marines in vietnam. he very much pushes integration throughout vietnam, throughout korea, throughout vietnam, and he also is one of those stalwarts that doesn't see any point in harping on the past, because he knows that he has trained marines to be ready to fight in the future battles. and then i have some photos from here. these are all sourced from the marine recruit depot in san diego. a lot of the one foot point marines have submitted their old photos for their collection there, so they can all be found there. so you can see the 52nd defense battalion in guam, then in korea, right? 75 [inaudible] recorders, rifle. and then you have corporal richard melting here at the bottom, sitting in the rice parties in vietnam, right? and i also have, and i don't know if these slides are made available, or can plow through these, but if you want to do some basic research on one foot point for yourselves, if you want to get a start, these are some of, these are some of the very good places to start. the marine co

, going to vietnam. there is a largely different attitude from them who viewed the military as a path towards betterment, is a viable job when they couldn't find one in civilian due to discrimination in society. versus, the draftees of that age who are coming in heavily politicized by the climate that exists at home in the 1960's. these are two different entities that can't understand each other within the same ethnic groups. i think what you get then, in the all volunteer force when it becomes after vietnam when we moved to an all volunteer force, you get a lot of whites fleeing the military. because, the money -- the opportunities are better at the civilian sector but african-americans see that as a way towards advancement and that is why you see significant gains, say post-1980, meaning african americans in higher posts like master sergeant, sergeant major, and the officer ranks. because those take time to build up, right? if we think like in the case of the african-american marines, by vietnam they h

vietnam fall. that is my comment. guest: i appreciate that, and i don't think anyone is trying to say that the parallels are exact. a lot of this conversation comes from president biden's comments -- i forget now how long it was ago, four weeks, six weeks -- that we were not going to see helicopters on the top of the rooftop embassy. he was making an argument against any comparison between afghanistan in vietnam -- and vietnam. and i think we have seen those words come back to haunt him. that is not to say that the situations are exact, but it is that the parallels between the chaotic ends and the number of evacuees trying to get out, those trying to flee, are very eerily similar, and the chaos around the withdrawal. it is much more complex than that, and i think we do a bit of a disservice to history in the reality of both situations, and we kind of gloss over it and try to put a picture up side by side to say same thing. you are right. i appreciate that comment. we can always do better to better