maria: mark mobius joining us come up next tucker carlson says the nsa has been illegally spying on him and he has proof he will lay it out when we come back, right here. in the border crisis is excavating congresswoman rashida tlaib is told to defund border agencies. more on that plus far left groups are urging the u.s. not to confront china on human rights issues. rights issues. so welcome to allstate. ♪ ♪ you already pay for car insurance, why not take your home along for the ride? allstate. here, better protection costs a whole lot less. you're in good hands. click or call to bundle today. there's an america we build and one we explore. one that's been paved and one that's forever wild. but freedom means you don't have to choose just one adventure. you get both. introducing the wildly civilized all-new 3-row jeep grand cherokee l this past year has felt like a long, long norwegian winter. introducing the wildly civilized but eventually, with spring comes rebirth. everything begins anew. and many of us realize a fundamental human need to connect with other like-minded people. wel

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the nsa has conceded. grand greenwald with pulitzer prize for exposing nsa extensive surveillance of american citizens. this is not a new thing but widespread. and in a moment, we are joined by glenn greenwald to expose what we know about what our government is doing to us. but first tonight, good evening and welcome to "tucker carlson tonight." last week democrats in new york city voted for a new mayor. the end of de blasio era. new york is a one-party state with exotic esperanto speakers in new york city so primary effectively the same as the general election. that is the vote. in new york part of some battles, all the bickering s between different shades of corrupt left-wingers. in some way, it would be easier to get elections done. but you would be wrong. eight days later, we still have no idea who the next mayor of new york will be. all votes are in.ay they have all been counted supposedly. the problem is no one in charge can do math. in addition, it's the main stumbling block. it is hard to overstate

paul is the highly political director of the nsa. paul would have been required personally to approve my unmasking. paul should axley who asked for that i'm asking and he should do it immediately. april haynes would also likely know the answer, and even more political director of national intelligence. she oversees all of it. she may have approved the unmasking as well, should certainly know who asked for it and who approved it. that's her job to know. she should release that information immediately tonight and as april haynes does not release the information, she should be forced to release that information. we don't have a lot of power as a tv show but we are going to keep pushing for that because it matters not just us, but to the entire country. you can't have a democracy in a place where unaccountable spy agencies keep people in line by licking the contents of their emails, discrediting them with their own emails which they thought were private. it doesn't work if you allow that. and we suspect congressional republicans will als

place like nsa hawaii, nsa texas, nsa alaska are opportunities for us to be able to broaden our reach. the second piece speaks to secretary moultrie's comments with regards to accountable. i hole all 500 senior kputtive service members of nsa accountable for our diversity, equality, and inclusion. they are rated every single year. they understand this is a priority for our agency. it's a priority for its direct offer. then the final piece is that we have to have a series of abilities for to us develop a work force. is one thing to recruit the work force. then how do we develop that work force? the work force is representatives of the demographics of our nation not only when we hire them but when we get the our senior levels as well. >> great. thank you very much. i will offer as well or ask as well, a question about the china task force recommendations that came out this week. and perhaps in a classified brief later, we can address that. and now that we can maybe travel again, general nakasone i will again invite you out to walkham community college to visit your program at walkham co

the nsa and foa material is highly classified. takes years for me to get access to an nsa surveillance document. the mere fact that they engaged in surveillance is classified. it would be a serious federal crime. >> tucker: well, yeah. they intimidate people. everyone is afraid of the nsa. the last administration was really afraid of them. that's true. i know firsthand. a lot of people now are afraid of them. do you want to live in a country with people are afraid of your intel agencys? why are we accepting this? >> one of the interesting aspects of this is people are saying this would be ridiculous. it's not ridiculous. i testified just about a week ago in the judiciary. there is almost regularity to this. journalists investigated in the bush administration and the obama administration and the trump administration and the biden administration. after every one of those scandals, there is the requisite apologies and promises of reform and everyone goes away and then the cycle continues. >> tucker: how about prison time? they tried

i had a shouting makes with nsa officials. they said you are not a target of an investigation which is a term of art. and i said stop with your b.s. were you reading my emails or weren't you. why can't you tell me? we can't respond to that. they won't answer your questions, they won't tell you why they won't answer your questions. and it's hike shut and obey. jesse: jonathan swan reported that carlson reached out to a media to see if he could do an interview with putin. nsa spokesperson declined to comment and referred "axios" back to the agency's earlier statement which was pretty lawyerly. they are denying targeting carlson, but not denying whether his communications were read and leaked. joining me is jonathan turley, a law professor. what would the legal implications be in this situation? what is your assessment? >> it is murky. this type of intercept or surveillance could have occurred legally in a couple of ways. maybe tucker carlson was corresponding with someone who was subject to an nsa surveillance order or that pers

justifying that the nsa did this and claiming you have no ground for complaining. what justification is there for the nsa to have gone and said we want to know this journalist's name who is trying it get an interview with vladimir putin? the reason the media doesn't care and supports the nsa is because they are on the side of the intelligence community and they're happy with those powers are abused against their enemy which include you. >> tucker: that's what it was. they said i talked to russians in an effort to control me. that's why we don't allow it. your reaction featuring federal powers. most of the people involved in trying to kidnap gretchen whitmer most were working for the fbi. were you surprised by that? >> even after all of the reporting i have done we are trained to disbelieve that the fbi could do something like this, in a plot. no, that would not happen. i spent a decade during the first war on terror reporting in one case after the next when the fbi said we caught 4 young muslims plotting to blow up a bridge. they were not smart and financially vuln

nsa and foia material as heavily classified. i do national security work and it takes years for me to get access to afi's i warrant, i should say or an nsa surveillance document. so the mere fact that they engaged in surveillance is classified. it would be a serious drug crime. the question is, why they are -- >> tucker: well, i mean, it's because they intimidate people. everyone is afraid of the nsa. a lot of people now are really afraidt of them. you want to live in a countrytr where people are afraid of your intel agencies? like what is that? why are we accepting this? >> one of the interesting aspects of this is a lot of people saying, this would be ridiculous. it's not ridiculous, and as i testified just about a week ago and judiciary there is a normal seasonal regularity to this. we have generalists to investigate it in the bush administration, the obama administration, the trump administration and the biden administration. after every one of the scandals there is a requisite apologies, promises of reform and everyone goes

do you think that nsa is doing this on their own? or is it being directed by the biden administration? >> well they are part of biden administration, seem to operate independently of any political -- control, i mean, again, in the u.s. government, all the power rests with the people who are elected because supposed to be a democracy, no agency is supposed to act independently of elected officials period. so you know o i don't know, here is what i do know, i know it on direct authority that nsa routinely gives information on american citizens to the justice department, to fbi, then uses in intel division, that is illegal, they are not allowed to spy on american citizens, that law has been on books a long time nsa designed to monitor foreign communications from potential enemies people who threaten united states not from american citizens but it is routine i got this from two with fbi agents would not not just field devise people working in headquarters a daily thing we get information from nsa on americans unifies in it investigations

but for some reason fox hasn't condemned the nsa, they haven't called for congressional

the nsa would take this as a call at -- secure cost estimate. the sticker shock was quite a shock to find that it gives numbers that we think are the actual numbers in the nsa is saying no. we're going to try to get rid of that. we are to try to strengthen that nnsa's system of what is required when they provide working numbers to make an actual estimate. we will have conversations with them as to what they need to do that work, the pen and paper work early, so we can get more accurate numbers. ms. heinrich: and then, of course, you know the high watermark for the process and the modernization is 6-7% of national defense spending. these numbers are big but we are talking about our nuclear deterrence. it is to my mind, whenever i hear sticker shock, is relative to what we were expecting. we should be able to find. it leads me to -- i want to talk about the nature of the bipartisan sentiment on these issues. congress disagrees about lots of things right now. there is always disagreement between the two parties on spending and spending priorities.

but you don't need to make a law if you have got a security state the powers the nsa has. it seems pretty obvious their plan was to leak emails and telephone transcripts select tialy to suggest that tucker was merely the latest kremlin asset. the threat to america is not primarily from foreign government agencies but from domestic agencies with unlimited budgets and unaccountable in any meaningful way to the american people and their elected representatives. with me now is glenn greenwald, author of the book "securing democracy" and, glen, you said something rather extraordinary to me to tucker last night. you were talking about the way dianne feinstein and other powerful politicians who are supposed to be in charge of democratic oversight of the nsa and their like, are actually under surveillance by these agencies themselves and so are actually scared of them. >> yeah, this has been going on since the end of world war ii national security state was created on purpose to be outside of the realm of democratic accountability. the argument was we need to do this deter threat

what can you say about what we are learning at the nsa? congressman: if you go back, the obama administration which essentially the biden administration is an extension of the obama administration, i've said for a long time that biden and harris are on avatar for obama, in fact, these aren't my words, maria, obama admitted that 90% of the people are there in the white house to carry out and be obama's third term. so you go back during that time frame, there was unmasking that was occurring. they were being leaked to the mainstream media back during iran nuclear deal and we know all of the unmasking that occurred of trump officials and we made that well known at the time and changes were supposed to be made in our intelligence agencies on unmasking and we don't know what is happening over at the nsa. we clear dye do not trust general who is under investigation by our committee on multiple fronts, most importantly that he politicized the agency by firing republicans or putting them under phoney investigations and then basically forcing them

nsa foreign intel reports usually redact names unless u.s. officials cite a justifiable reason to ask for them. last month the nsa formally and flatly denied carlson's spying accusations. >>> meanwhile, carlson appears to be undermining his own network's sudden campaign to embrace covid vaccinations. but the network is also being accused of putting lives in danger by the message spread by him and several other fox personalities. take a look at examples in this new anti-fox ad from the lincoln project. >> how many americans have died after taking the covid vaccine? >> going door to door? this is creepie stuff. >> the focus of this administration on vaccination is mind boggling. >> the lincoln project added that creepy music, but you get the point there. all of that anti-vaccine rhetoric may be having real-world consequences. >> do you hear that echoed back at you when sick people come into the hospital system, are those the kind of messages you hear? what are they telling you? >> look, i'm being very direct. it is as if they're quoting tucker

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very few people have access to that inside the nsa. the idea somebody saw tucker's name being passed around or they had access to it and they leaked it to him, let me say this, if that person even exists, they're going to be arrested for passing top-secret information. but i'm not sure that person exists. >> put me in a color me skeptical column along with frank, but let me just ask you, again, about where this leaves us as a country. tucker has a massive audience and former republican joe walsh tweeted this. tucker carlson said the men and women of our fbi nsa and cia are our enemy, the men and women in our intelligence community on the front lines trying to keep us safe are our enemy. and the millions who are watching him tonight nod in agreement. seems to further erode the fabric of all those things that were once on the other side of the red line. what does this do inside the intelligence agencies, andrew? >> well, look, i have a lot of faith for people who are in the intelligence community and that they keep their head down. of co

i'm going to announce that the nsa is listening to me and have them try to deny it. and so i think it's good cover but, as you said, there is something much larger going on here. it's another page in the playbook of folks like tucker carlson and folks in the g.o.p. who simply want to continue to erode the public's trust in their institutions. >> mark: oh, my, i like the way he painted all those wiley coyote calculate tie behind him so we wouldn't know he is in the uconn. that's your counterintelligence deep cover right there. is this guy sees it, the main problem with tucker revealing that the national security agency is reading his emails is that it might erode the public's faith that the name of the national security agency suggests it has something to do with national security. if therefore were an institution in which the public's trust should be eroded, it's these guys. but don't even entertain that thought because that will make you just as anti-american as tucker. here's the second member of msnbc's deep state propagandist panel andrew weissman. if that name r

the nsa admits it on mast is tucker's identity after an intelligence intersect. the identities of american citizens are concealed when they are caught up during foreign intelligence gatherings. they can only be unmasked in extraordinary circumstances. fox news has just released this statement quote, for them to unmask tucker carlson or any journalist attempting to secure a newsworthy interview is entirely unacceptable and raises seriousnd questions about their activities, as well as their original denial, which was wildly misleading. we are always glad to see harmeet dhillon when it comes to issues like this. what do you make of the nsa's revision of its story? >> well, mark, thank you for having me. i'm not buying it. i think what they are saying now is inconsistent with what they've said before and it's inconsistent with the facts that tucker has revealed. for example, tucker set a his show several nights that a source within the government came to him and read out several of tucker's texts and messages. what the government is allegedly ssaying today is that th

and it's not like the nsa has never lied ton us. i mean, we were told that there was no bolt collection of data.ans' turns outou there was bulk collection of americans' data, and no one was ever held to account for that. thean chairman is right, and mr. -- professor turly is right, too. we can not count on these people to police themselves. and so it's my expectation that there needs to be greater review here. mr. chair, i am inviting you to continue this bipartisanship. join me in calling for inspector general investigation into any monitoring that the nsa or any other element of the intelligence community has engaged inth relative to tucker carlson because m these denials these couched denials raise more questions thans, they provide answers. and by the way, if democrats don't do this, if you're only outraged when youro members and your staff and the press that's close to youck and that amplifi your messages is targeted, then we never areja going to solve anything. it will in fact be deja vu all over again as professor turley said

we know mexico was nso's first client and when the nsa group started doing business in mexico about a decade ago, we were already five years into the complete failure of war on drugs. by that time, we already knew that mexican security forces and parts of the criminal justice system were implicated in dire human rights abuses, extrajudicial killings, torture, and forced disappearances. so when nsa groups stressed during business with mexico, his first client, we already knew the so-called good guys were not good guys. i think the case in mexico, what is so shocking to me as well as the breadth of the potential surveillance that has gone on is this claim the nsa groups claim your here fighting the good by. we're here targeting criminals. the line between good and bad in mexico is blurred. we know at the local level and the national level. we know a case you guys -- the 43 disappeared training teachers. we know in that case, people at the highest level, including the current in hiding in israel and was a key person in getting pegasus into mexico, signed -- was promoting the software and

the nsa has conceded. grand greenwald with pulitzer prize for exposing nsa extensive surveillance of american citizens. this is not a new thing but widespread. and in a moment, we are joined by glenn greenwald to expose

what do you make of the nsa's revision of this story? >> well, mark, thanks for having me. i am not buying it. what they are saying is inconsistent with the facts as tucker as revealed them. for example, tucker said on several nights a source within the government came to him and readout several of tucker's texts and messages. what the government is saying today is that the unmasking occurred regarding third parties talking with one another about tucker carlson. that's inconsistent. there are only a handful of people in the united states government that have the ability to unmask people. that was abused at the end of the obama administration 2016 and it's being abused right now. this raises more questions than it answers. we need to be looking at raining in the abuses in the national security community and no american journalist should be surveiled this way. these times of communications must never be leaked to the media. how does that happen? >> and people unconnected with the so-called investigation also had them as well. it looks like we are back to the frenzy of january

to the question about nsa, nsa was caught spying on american citizens and created what i would say was an unfortunate situation where the united states consumer doesn't trust that agency. they do a very critical job for the american people, to surveilled foreign nationals and foreign countries, which we need them to do. the nsa needs to be able to do that. i have never heard them argue for weaker encryption standards. we should all be supportive of strong encryptions, not having backdoors. host: george is calling from virginia on the republican line. good morning. caller: question, when you have things like the pipeline and the d.c. police department, hospitals have been subject, is there a post-analysis to say what they can do to prevent in the future? guest: for those that we have the resources to respond to within the federal government, they do take a look at what happened, they do analysis. they gather data and information and put it in. they make sure we are protected against attacks in the future. this gives us the understanding how hackers are thinking. they do it at a granular

the nsa has been spying on the show, they've effectively admitted that. one of the first people it happened to, not by a long shot. cheryl atkinson was a journalist at cbs when she noticed her computer had been bugged. she was announced as a wacko, a conspiracy theorist. right. she joins us to explain what happened, next. ♪ ♪ do you have a life insurance policy you no longer need? now you can sell your policy, even a term policy, for an immediate cash payment. we thought we had planned carefully for our retirement. but we quickly realized that we needed a way to supplement our income. if you have one hundred thousand dollars or more of life insurance you may qualify to sell your policy. don't cancel or let your policy lapse without finding out what it's worth. visit conventrydirect.com to find out if you policy qualifies. or call the number on your screen. coventry direct, redefining insurance. >> tucker: we announce this week one of the biden administration spy agencies have been reading our emails, because it's true, they have been. we were denounce