the fact thatt is a trend in these schools in silicon valley warning to us all. it is super scary to me that we're not taking a safety firstf perspective with regard to children. safety by design is so essential for kids because the burden that we have set up until now is the idea thatt the public has to prove to facebook that facebook is dangerous. facebook hass never had to prov that their product is safe for children. and we need to put that through, like with pharmaceuticals a long time ago, we said it's not the obligation of the public to say this medicine is danger. it's the obligation of the producer to prove the medicine is safe. we have done that over and over again. this isd the right moment to as, to change that relationship with the public. >> and if i may just on that point, sorry, my screen seems to be switching off. my apologies. with regards to that point of addiction, have there been any studies from your awareness within facebook and within the documents you haveen seen where they havehe actually looked at where they canan increase addiction by

chance that there is going to be a recalibration for the democratic left hand at the of e party of the silicon valley elite and very subsidized poor for the upper middle and lower middle classes and that was inconceivable so i am cautiously optimistic. >> let's start with peasantry because you talked in the book about a subservient role resident and labor of inferior rank and millions are becoming a new version. >> that is a funny word. it doesn't exist in the classical vocabulary there's no word and the same is true in greek but there is no word for peasant. i don't think there's been a word in the american lexicon that we don't call people peasants. there is an agrarian, three holding so if that is a foreign experience because we had a viable middle-class so it starts to protect the property of the middle class. there is no citizenship between 2700 bc so then we want to pass it onto our children and they take a long time to grow and investment and we want that property protected and out of that comes these auxiliary rights. this is what jefferson always said the same thing that this country

in some ways, we are all victims of silicon valley and mark zuckerberg and jack dorsey who are getting very, wealthy powerful off of human tendency. not just to be recognized to join a group and submerge your identity in that group and stoke the conflict between your group and the other group and to be applauded about every seven minutes. [laughter] one thing that i would love to see and kind of a rehabilitative america is journalism that does what i think journalism should deal. go out into the country and talk to people that are not part of the media. not part of the world that journalists live in. the pandemic, by the way, has been terrible in this way. it has intensified all of these tendencies. go talk to people you don't even think you would like, but certainly people that you do not know and try to see the world from their point of view. it is an amazing privilege. .... .... particularly multiracial society, local newspapers. a. >> and again, these are both really, really flawed and super racist at different times, so it's not like there's some panacea because they could be real

i think companies in silicon valley that revive their business plan is also leaving their customers and contributors are going to fail. >> yeah, if that's how they approach it, then they're going to make themselves superfluous. in fact, they seem to anticipate that. if you proceed in business on the assumption that your job is to make your own customers superfluous, , you're going to n out of things to do it that your business model, aren't you? >> i think it's quite absurd. i'm even contrary enough to not believe that -- i think technology is continuing to advance at a tremendous pace, but it don't think it's advancing any more rapidly than it did at the time of the industrial revolution. i think that nobel laureate economist william nor house -- nor house did a study of the advance of writing. this is the invention, creation of light, the amount of lumens you need to light a room at night. and he shows that the advance in lighting has been a hundred thousand times more rapid than is measured in the economic models. essentially, economists while they are writing about them satanic mill

. >> i thought he was just silicon valley? no, while he was a good technology chief i google undeveloped at that -- response to your emails, you know gmail, has responses that allow you to anticipate how you are going to respond to a particular issue. i notice those responses are more curious since was if. it cases it establishment? that's raises contribution. ray as a whole -- contributions to technology where the decades. but i think all these people have forgotten the fundamental principles of the computer science that they expound. that's what's striking about the book, because you don't seem to be of much of a dune say or something in, fact see five got this right to -- you seem to think the potential of a i maybe oversold, but that even in the overselling there could be some collateral damage and you're trying to avoid that. >> have i got that rain? >> that's right. the idea that somehow ai competes with human minds is a fundamental illusion. >> a lot of these technology creators, he came to their work having already abs

and in some ways, we're all victims off silicon valley and f mark zuckerberg and jack dorsey, who are getting very, very wealthy and powerful off the human tendency not w just to wa to bef recognized but to want t join a group and submerge your identity in that group and stoke the conflict between your group andup the other group and to be applauded byhe your side about every seven minutes. and one thing i would like to see in a kind of rehabilitated america is journalism that does what i t think journalism shoul do, which is go out into the country and talk to people who are not part of the c media, wh are not part of the little insular world that journalists live in.n. the pandemic, by the way, has been terrible in this way. it has intensified all these tendencies. and instead, go talk to people you don't even think you would like, but certainly people you don't know, and try to see the world from their point of view. it's an amazing privilege. and p i don't know why journalis don't exercises it more. as heather did in "the sum of us." >> yeah, and i think one of the things that com

in the silicon valley, this was their customers, and contributors. saying they're going to fame. >> that's how they approach it. then they're going to make themselves superfluous, and if you anticipate that, if you precede in business on the assumption that your job is to make your own customers superfluous, you're going to run out of things to do if that's your business model, aren't you? >> i don't -- i mean, i'm even in control enough not to believe, that they continue to advance at a tremendous pace, but i don't think it's advancing any more rapidly than it did at the time of the industrial revolution. >> mm-hmm. >> and i think that the economist william moorhouse has looked at this, and looked at the invention creation of life, is amount of lumens you need to light a room at night, and it shows that the advance in lighting has been 100,000 times more rapid than it was measured in the economic model. essentially economists were writing about mills, and -- >> william blake. >> yeah. they were writing, and emmitt james, writing, and the incredible

companies in silicon valley that regard their business plan as obsolete and their customers and contributors are going to fail. >> if that's how they approach it, then they're going to make themselves superfluous. you will run out of things to do. >> i think it's absurd. i think that the nobel laureate economist william nordhouse did a study of the advance of -- the invention and creation of white, the amount of lumen to light a room at night. he shows that the advance in lighting has been 100,000 times more rapid than is measured in the economic model. the incredible expansion of light from the time that was -- it was fire in a cave to the millions of candles at versailles to whale oil to kerosene to finally electricity and then light emitting -- >> beyond electricity. >> measured by the amount of time a worker had to spend to buy the light to illuminate a room. economic progress was 100,000 times more rapid than is usually estimated in that field. during the industrial revolution, we missed light. this continues to be, a golden age of capitalism with the technological progress as fast as e

silicon valley became a byword, the high technology so the u.s. what from the 1970s but looked like best days were behind us we couldn't compete again and we are going to fall behind and we had to keep temperatures down at 55 during winter to a nation or the world. after the tax cuts, 50 nations around the world imitated the cuts so you had a global boom and for larry said in the 1970s especially in the aftermath of the vietnam war in the late 60s and great society that chronicles that terrible time in the late 60s when we lost our way but in the 70s we face the aftermath of it and as larry pointed out in central america nicaragua fell and looked like other countries would grow the soviet way. mercenaries were falling and they fell. europe itself soviets put in missiles, short range missiles to destroy nato trust winning the cold war's battle of approaching missiles, nobody remembers a today, it was so important because soviets figured they had short-term missiles aimed at europe, europeans would no longer trust the u.s. to defend them if there wa

valley up and down. >> a lot of things are different. that you are arguing there is something central to the relationship of china and is not that different from the relationship of the struggle of the soviet union. is that correct? >> absolutely you can see that. this is an ideological competition and also that requires a high degree of clarity. so the phrase that comes to mind if i can paraphrase president xi tear down the firewall or we should do our best to get around it and this is watching me does for us every day is to trade to reach the press people who are not permitted to access a wide range of source of information so they have an opportunity to think differently. and to say earlier the authoritarians are touchy and sensitive. [laughter] and you can see this with the chinese communist party. i think there is a tremendous opportunity for us to use the clarity from the berlin speech to communicate much more effectively with the chinese communist party. the best means to do so is to bypass the great firewall. >> everybody should

silicon valley became a by word for cutting edge technology. so, the u.s. went from them release of the 1970s, when it looked like our best days were behind us. that we couldn't compete again. that we're going to fall behind. we had to keep temperatures down 55 during winter time. to a nation that was really on -- was driving the world. the amazing thing is after those tax cuts 50 nations around the world imitated those cuts. so, you had a global boom. relating to what laurie said, in the 1970s, especially in the demoralize after nap mat of the vietnam war and the hubris the late 60s -- and by the way, the book on the great society chronicles that time in the late 60s when we lost our way -- but in the 70s, we faced the aftermath of it. as laurie pointed out. in central america, it looked like other countries were going to go the soviet way. in africa, angela and mozambique. human mercenaries. they or falling and fell. europe itself, the soviets put in missiles, short-range missiles, to really displace nato. which enabled us to win the cold war. but the who

the chinese, as you well know, my colleagues here -- are invested in silicon valley up and down the peninsula. so, a lot of things are different. let your arguing there something central to the relationship with china that's not that different with the relationship to the struggle with cool soviet union. is that correct? >> absolutely. and you can see this in's message. this is an ideological competition. it's also competition that requires a high degree of clarity. the freeze that comes to mind if i could paraphrase from rugged speech is, german she, tear down that far wall. we should do our best to get around it. and this is what jaime death threats every day is try to reach oppressed peoples. people who are not permitted to access a wide range of sources of information. so that they have an opportunity to think differently. authoritarian's are kind of touchy, they're kind of sensitive. and you see this with the chinese communist party. i think there's a tremendous opportunity tea for us to use the clarity to compete much more effectively with a chinese companies party. the mess means of do

silicon valley became a bi-word for cutting edge technology. so the u.s. went from the malaise of the 1970s when it looked like our best days were behind us, that we couldn't compete again, that we're going to fall behind and we had to keep temperatures down at 55 during wintertime to a nation that was really and the amazing thing after those tax cuts 50 nations around the world imitated those cuts. and so you had a global boom. but related to what larry said in the 1970s especially in the demoralized aftermath of the vietnam war, after the hubris of the late '60s. and by the way the book on the great society chronicles that terrible time in the late '60s when we lost our way. but in the '70s we faced the aftermath of it. and as larry pointed out in central america nicaragua fell, and looked like other countries are going to go the soviet way in africa and angola and mozambique. and europe itself the soviets put in short range missiles to really destroy nato, which was an alliance that enabled us to win the cold war ulttimately. nobody remembers it today,

valley up and down the peninsula. so a lot of things are different. but you're arguing that there is something central to the relationship with china that is not that different from the relationship with the struggle, the conflict with the soviet union. is that correct? >> absolutely. you can see this in jamie and will's superb essays. this is an ideological competition and also a competition that requires a high degree of clarity. the phrase that comes to mind if i could paraphrase from reagan's speeches, chairman xi, tear down that fire wall. or we should do our best to get around it. this is what jamie does for us every day is to try to reach oppressed peoples who are not permitted to access wide range of sources of information. so that they have an opportunity to think differently. they have -- and as will i think said or jamie early said, authoritarians are kind of touchy, kind of sensitive. and you see this with -- you see this with the chinese communist party. i think there is a tremendous opportunity for us to

silicon valley became a by-word for cutting edge high technology. so the u.s. went from the malaise of the 1970s which it looked like our best days were behind us, that we couldn't compete again, that we're going to fall behind and we had to keep temperatures down to 55 during wintertime to a nation that was really striding the world. the amazing thing is, after those tax cuts, 15 nations around the world imitated those cuts, so you had a global boom. related to what larry said, in the 1970s, especially in the aftermath of the vietnam war, in the hubris of the '60s -- by the way, there are great society chronicles in that terrible time in the late '60s when we lost our way. but in the '70s, we faced the aftermath of it, and as larry pointed out, in central america, nicaragua fell, and it looked like other countries were going to go the soviet way. africa, a and mozambique. the soviets put in short-range missiles to destroy nato, which was the alliance that helped us win the cold war, ultimately. no one remembers that today, larry, but that was so important beca

now you have a conflation on the left of sort of corporate culture especially this silicon valley and elsewhere with, you know, sort of semi-religious progressive ideology where, you know, the corporation will stage a land acknowledgment where they talk about how the land is being held on was taken from a native american tribe right before they, you know, get into their third quarter strategic report or something. and it's super weird -- [laughter] it's just very weird to sort of watch, to sort of watch the incorporation of these, this kind of, you know, again, slightly academic progressive rhetoric into corporate hr speak. but what in part it reflects is sort of, you know, the the extent to which this is seen, i think, by people who run big companies in part as a way to sort of give something to progressivism to avoid the kind of bernie sanders version of progressivism. like, americans, american corporations would much rather, you know, construct diversity programs and trainings along the lines that robin deangelo suggests in "white white from if jillty" than they would be to be subj

one key thing to remember is if you think about silicon valley before 2020, this was the industry that the most access to all the forms of remote work. is this what yahoo! did? is this what google and facebook did, sine qua non? exactly opposite. marissa mayer famously ordered a going back but google bot 1 million have square feet in downtown manhattan. they all try to create these work playgrounds to make sure people are around each other all the time because they believe creativity works by connecting people. one of the interesting things that come out of microsoft is there's a nice study that came out last month that there's a real decrease in connections across different groups which the paper really thinks is going to lead a decrease in crete giving microsoft because these were teams are becoming more siloed. one final is that the remote world is a very hard world for onboarding new workers and is an unequal world. the onboarding point is if you look at productivity computer programmers, some studies have suggested it's all just fine but if you look at new hires for computer progr

i think silicon valley does a version where they effectively censor or moderate language. content that the movement doesn't want to see online but they don't do it for free because their unspoken asked is the new democratic party looks the other way when it comes to leading their monopoly power. i think that trade is working . whatever you think of the merits of whether or not their monopoly power is a good or bad thing it is the trade that's working masterfully for both sides and one of the goals in this book is to shine some light on that reality so that consumers and citizens can make their own judgments about whether it's a good thing or bad thing but step one is seeing the phenomenon itself with cleareyes . >> the example of the state street and goldman we've been talking about was in a sense that the companies were deeply cynical. they were using a progressive agenda to further their own goals and perhaps generate more profit. but what about stakeholder capitalism more generally? can a ceo or a board on cynically embrace stakeholder capitalism? does it makesense for

you really see the attitude representing a trent in silicon valley. living in a world where it is normal. new technology companies could create harmful effects. so, i want to ask may be a little bit more of a critical question. to what extent has safford university, you have a long history and a lot of experience in working with students, to what extent have they actively and successfully created the very culture where disruption is admired. giving access to the company but also inviting ceos and other tech executives and to teach. i would love to hear a bit of a reflection from each of you on how stanford plays a role in that typical disruptive ecosystem. starting with rob and shooting for this question with jeremy. >> absolutely. a significant responsibility for some of the problems we see a big tech and for that cultural orientation to aspire. looking for ways to code in your pajamas and roll your product out quickly and see what happens throw spaghetti on the wall and figure out any problems downstream. personally, i have seen in teaching generati

scott is also mike's podcast partner for the silicon valley insider weekly overview of silicon valley tech industry scott holds a degree in political science and ucla. welcome mike and scott but we're so looking forward to your conversation, take it away. >> thank you so much. welcome everyone, and michael welcome to you. it's great to be here. >> it's great to talk to you, this time i get to ask you the questions. >> and folks, please let us be a little informal. scott and i are not really capable of anything else. [laughter] this is an honor to be here for many reasons. mike, you know i'm a big fan of yours. as a tech reporter i've been standing on your shoulders for years. in some of the earliest stories i did as a silicon valley reporter were at sea hm and you have allowed me to do many there and geek out. individually to see the exhibits. always appreciate it it's an honor to be associated with that. >> if i can add, i am deeply honored. i've done many things at the museum over the years. i go back safari member would gordon glenn bell made the decision to move to silicon valley

the depiction of silicon valley with the calling card for me and countless other young entrepreneurs. the new edition of the big score, billion dollar story published by story press. the unique perspective because he was here capturing contemporary history through first-hand experience. as mike writes, newly created text history archives to build a narratives i was the

i think silicon valley does a version where they effectively censor or moderate language. content that the movement doesn't want to see online but they don't do it for free because their unspoken asked is the new democratic party looks the other way when it comes to leading their monopoly power. i think that trade is working . whatever you think of the merits of whether or not their monopoly power is a good or bad thing it is the trade that's working masterfully for both sides and one of the goals in this book is to shine some light on that reality so that consumers and citizens can make their own judgments about whether it's a good thing or bad thing but step one is seeing the phenomenon itself with cleareyes . >> the example of the state street and goldman we've been talking about was in a sense that the companies were deeply cynical. they were using a progressive agenda to further their own goals and perhaps generate more profit. but what about stakeholder capitalism more generally? can a ceo or a board on cynically embrace stakeholder capitalism? does it makesense for

in 1985 mike malone won the first report of the tech industry chronicled how silicon valley began decades long story of people and companies who recount the history from upstart