lerner hearing when lois -- testified before the oversight committee. congressman issa was criticized for cutting off his colleagues microphone while he was trying to make a statement. he told the union tribune that he apologize to mr. cummings after the house voted down a measure to censure him. we will be taking a look at that hearing with lois lerner, followed by comments from darrell issa. the purpose of the hearing is to gather facts about how and why the i.r.s. improperly scrutinized certain organizations that applied for tax exempt status. today we have recalled ms. lois lerner, the former director of exempt organizations at the i.r.s. ms. lerner appeared at the may 22, 2013, hearing you should a subpoena and that subpoena remains in effect. before we resume our questioning, i'm going to briefly state for the record a few developments that have occurred since the hearing began nine months ago. these are important for the record and for ms. lerner to know and understand. on may 22, 2013, after being sworn in at the start of the hearing, ms. lerner

they have to be produced. >> why not give lois lerner immunity? >> we don't know what she wants immunity from. she says she's done nothing wrong. why should we have to negotiate this? she goes out and tries to plead the fifth. she leaks the information, at the center of the information, why should we grant her immunity, there's no reason to do that. she may have done something terribly wrong. she may have done nothing wrong. come talk to congress about it. >> give me a time line, congressman. i only have a couple of seconds. give me a time line. when might this contempt happen? >> the subpoena issued february 14th, yesterday march 26th, irs commissioner confirmed to the united states congress he has no intention of complying wit. we should do that as soon as we possibly can. >> keep us posted and thanks so much for joining us on the "the real story," congressman chaffetz. >> storm chaser risking their lives to get close to tornadoes have a new shield. you don't want to miss this thing. the new shield that will help them get even closer to the eye

lois lerner being worried about the koch brothers. and lois lerner cutting out cincinnati, at the irs, oh, cincinnati was rogue, they acted on their own, no, this was a striblgtly washington, d.c., operation. the hysteria by representative c cummings. >> do you think it was theater? >> looking, he gave chairman issa -- i think he gave him an excuse to crying. let's let him then respond to this memo. instead of cut the mike, i'm sorry, and make this now the story that his mike was cut instead of the smoking gun proof that we have been looking for that surfaced today. >> it speaks to her knowledge and awareness, the memo, i'm not convinced perhaps as you, that it does represent a smoking gun in terms of demonstrating her guilt, but there's no question it should be explored and it is a significant move forward. but, on that issue, where does this investigation go from here? the attorney general of the united states has been held in contempt by congress. there are six major investigations going on by the issa committee. where are we heade

they reiterated a point to me that lois lerner was ready to testify if given one more week to prepare a written statement and testimony. darrell issa didn't want to do that because a lot of folks on the democratic side, and even some aides privately, would like issa would like to have this contempt vote play out in congress. that's not going to happen this week. next week they're in recess. it could possibly happen in committee two weeks from now and then go to the house floor. john boehner put the brakes on darrell issa and his committee a little bit after this blow-up with elijah cummings. but now with elijah cummings and democrats have this legal information, which republicans right now are dismissing and calling it -- or a spokesman for issa is calling it flawed, it gives them some ammunition to go back. and if nothing else, lawrence, what this lapse will end up being is a legal question, if the house holds lois lerner in con emt to, it then goes to a federal judge and the house democrats will say is it really worth this amount of millions of taxpayer dollars to go through a parli

i don't understand this lois lerner spoke to the justice, here's the catch, they're a cozy operation rub by an obama do nor, but the congressional investigation is after the truth here. i don't understand why a government employee, within i worked at ibm if my manager told me about a program i botched up, gee, i have to take the fifth. you might terminate me. we are trying to get to the with the toll of this. i can't for the life of me physical out why a government employee would take the fifth amendment i think it's horrendous. >> the fbi said they won't file charges. >> they haven't interviewed the witnesses, gary is right. we all have a right to know the truth. in theory, they work for us, so we should know. what is she hiding now? she may want to know more. the whole thing becomes a scam. you can't help but there is way more to this than you actually know. >> what do you think? >> if we're after the truth, why in the world hasn't congressman issa given a position. what he wants is political fear. lois lerner despite being a government official is also an american citizen and the

we bring in now the chiefover d lois lerner. so could this end questions over targeting? we bring in now the chief dock at correspondent at the washington examiner. so let's start here. i wanted to ask you, is it legally or constitutionally possible that lerner could face contempt if she continues to be silent? she has a right to invoke the fifth amendment against self incriminal nation, however, some believe that lerner waived that right. or is it more about ethics, you work for the people, now speak to the people. >> i think its he more the former. when she first arrived in congress to talk about the alleged targeting, she gave a 20 minutewhen she first arrived in congress to talk about the alleged targeting, she gave a 20 minute preamble defending herself. after that, she refused to testify. republicans assessed the situation and decided that that meant contempt of congress because she already started talking and then she decided to clam up. so i think that is the main argument here. when she returned again last week, she invoked the fifth amendment once again. again t

issa asked lois lerner a few questions. she invoked the fifth amendment and as stan brand said, he never gave her a direct order to answer, and he never then overruled her objection to that order which the supreme court has said is necessary. that's the necessary sequence in order to proceed to a contempt of congress case against such a witness. today, mr. boehner's office of general council of the house of representatives finally replied to the democrats and stan brand's insistence that chairman issa violated the necessary procedures for establishing a contempt of congress case. the republican council to the republican house not surprisingly said today that a contempt of congress case against lois lerner is still technically viable. so who's right? john boehner's council to the house of representatives or tip o'neill's former council to the house of representatives stan brand? i'm going with stan brand. >> the case is made clear. he's got to overrule her objection in an explicit way and give her the opportunity to comply o

t lois lerner heads to the hill today. >> holy guacamole. one of the favorite foods should be in short supply. wait until you hear the ridiculous reason why. >> seems everyone is getting in on the oscar selfie trend. which country star is using presidential power for his tweet. "fox and friends first starts right now. corn mu [music] >> welcome to "fox & friends". you are planning a little fun today. i am heather childers. >> i am ain'tly air heart. in just a few hours from now lois lerner is expected to face lawmakers on capitol hill over her role of targeting the tea party group. >> will she testify? doug luzader has the latest news in the committee. >> it is a mystery. we think maybe we will cee-lo which is learner make another appearance before a house committee today. no one seems to be entirely sure. certainly house members would like to hear from her today. there are a number of different options as to how this could play out. last year lois lerner who headed that division within the irs that improperly targeted tea party groups she g

lois lerner a parentally testifying this week and she wants something first. whether she will get it or not. honestly? i wanted a smartphone that shoots great video. so i got the new nokia lumia icon. it's got 1080p video, three times zoom, and a twenty-megapixel sensor. it's got the brightest display, so i can see what i'm shooting -- even outdoors, and 4 mics that capture incredible sound. plus, it has apps like vine -- and free cloud storage. my new lumia icon is so great, even our wipeouts look amazing. ♪ honestly, i want to see you be brave ♪ ♪ >>> updating a story we brought you last month. the 45 foot wide sinkhole under the museum in kentucky. today, crews are pulling eight rare corvettes out of the sinkhole. they are starting with the three easiest to reach, that's a good idea. the entire recovery process is stremed wide on the web. they plan to refill the whole and repair the museum building. no word on how long it will take. >>> her attorney indicates she will testify and it is a back and forth negotiation. we believe that the evidence causes

lois lerner appearing before them. we understand she is again pleading the fifth. let's take a listen to a little bit of the hearing. this relates to the irs targeting scandal. take a listen. >> -- the president's political -- effectively and lied about it during the election year in the polls. he continued this on such -- if you will sit down and allow me to ask a question, i am a member of a congress of the united states of america. i am tired of it! we have never -- each who represents 700,000 people. you cannot just have a one-sided investigation. there is absolutely something wrong with that, and it's absolutely un-american. >> hear, hear. >> we had a hearing. it's adjourned. i gave you the opportunity to ask a question. >> i do have a question. >> i gave you an opportunity to -- >> chairman, what are you hiding? >> he's taking the fifth, elijah. >> he continued this on sunday when he appeared on fox news to discuss a republican staff report claiming that ms. lerner was -- >> and that's congressman elijah cummings becoming heated there at the irs hearing at th

lois lerner, the former irs official, pleaded the fifth again. the committee chair, darrell issa, in this oversight committee hearing, dismissed the room without letting the ranking democrat, elijah cummings, ask his questions. cummings basically said, i want to have my say. later, both lawmakers took questions from reporters. here's darrell issa. >> mr. cummings said that he had questions to ask, instead he began making an opening statement, even after the committee had been adjourned, therefore, the committee stands adjourned. yes, sir? >> mr. chairman, how much of this is a political play for the republicans in the election? >> none, not a shred of it. >> all right, then just seconds ago, literally, this is what elijah cummings had to say. >> no, i have not. what we have done, and i applaud my members of my committee, i'm very proud of them, they've come here seeking the truth. we really do -- and i've said this many times, it is very important for us to make sure that government operates properly and operates effectively and efficiently, and

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that happens when people are under investigation as lois lerner is. what is shocking to me though is a long-time congress watcher, i have been up there for 20 years, is aç ranking member having hi mi c cut during a congressional hearing. i have never seen that before. it's astonishing. gives you the sense ever how badly relations are fractured on that committee. >> before we get into that, john harwood, what is the status of investigation that lois lerner is in the middle of? >> does not appear to be going anywhere. remember, when this came to public light last year, the inspector general had done anss was an administrative screw up, not ordered by the white house. the justice department indicated it was going to do a criminal investigation. no indication that's going anywhere. mostly issa has been flailing around with committee hearings trying to move the ball but he hasn't been able to do it and the thing has fallen off the radar screen. i think this is an effort for him to try to get this thing in the headlines again, and he certainly succeeded a

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why does lois lerner plead the fifth? why doesn't she tell the truth and be transparent. i'm not finished. so holding someone in contempt of congress will make an example when you're called before congress you need to testify to tell the truth. >> this is just another witch-hunt. >> here we go. >> i wouldth rahher the republicans focus on repealing citizens united and where corporations can and not focus on progressive tea party groups. reform this system. there is a bill on the floor to do that to reform the system, get dark money out of the way. david camp and issa and angela could agree we have to jump onboard. >> i have to leave it there. time is running out on me. always good to have you both join us. >> thank you. >>> janice dean said spring will come. as we head into it, the long, snowy winter has already left behind a souvenir for us. expensive and potentially dangerous pot holes. the tire-destroying differe ini popping up on streets, damaging vehicles and saddling cities for the work and cost of repairing broken pavements. will we fix it? >> it has been a pot hol

>> that's why they are still poo pushing to hold lois lerner in contempt of congress to bring her back in and fill in some of those gaps that we likely won't find out even if the irs does release that full sweep of documents. >> do you see chairman issa giving up at all. >> no, absolutely not. i think he is as frustrated as ever. partly because, as you mentioned, these emails and these documents are going to chairman camp. why haven't they been sent to chairman issa? i think that's created a little bit of a conflict between the two. and he will keep pursuing as much as he can to also kind of achieve a win on this issue. >> see, i see it as an end run of issa by doing it voluntarily to camp. you don't don't, byron. >> it could be. this is a congressional angle we are seeing. there is also actually a judicial angle here that if congress had all of this really great evidence, if they got all of this great evidence, what would they do with it? they would give it to the justice department to actually do any sort of prosecuting based on it now, as the department department has shown zero int

darrell issa committed an error that will prevent holding lois lerner in contempt. >> before a witness can be held in content, they have to be given a clear-cut choice between compliance and noncompliance. they never gave her a direct order and overruled her objection. they simply adjourned the hearing and moved on. >> today, house democrats introduced another privileged resolution demanding darrell issa apologize on the house floor for his behavior last week when he adjourned the meeting without letting anyone else speak and cutting the microphone of elijah cummings. here is why the democrats are demanding an apology. >> i have no expectation that miss lerner will cooperate with this committee. >> chairman, chairman, i have a statement. i have a procedural statement, mr. chairman. mr. chairman, i have a procedural question. mr. chairman, you cannot run a committee like this. you just cannot do this. this is we're better than that as a country. we're better than that as a country. i have asked for a few minutes to ask a procedural -- >> the fact a is that i am asking a question. >> you

fireworks on capitol hill as lois lerner once again refused to answer questions

the irs has, in fact, turned over every one of the lois lerner e-mails in this case. they have turned over 500,000 pages of documents from the irs to congress. there are 150 people working full time at the irs, not examining people's tax returns anymore, not trying to increase the revenue available to the treasury at the irs, through the irs, but 150 people working full time just to provide documents to darrell issa and these kinds of subpoenas. >> that's true, but i think we have to back up. this is not an honest inquiry. this is a star chamber operation. this is cherry picking information, deliberately co-leco co-lewding with a republican idea in the irs to make sure the investigation is solely about tea party and conservative groups even though we know it included progressive titles as well as conservative titles and that they were equally stringent. it was a foolish thing to do. and it's wrong, but it was not just targeted at conservatives. darrell issa wants to make sure that information does not get out. and it's been a very shameful thing under the sham of an i

so we will not get answers from lois lerner. let us know what you think. boy, is the in box and twitter and facebook exploding over the rutgers story, which rescinded the invitation to condoleeza rice to speak at the commencement address and when our own ainsley earhart -- >> they haven't rescinded it. a group of faculty members put together a petition to get her not toy're saying i'm happy i put my signature on this because we think she represents the misleading of our nation into war in iraq and also supporting a water boarding and torture techniques. ainsley earhart went down to the professors to question them about this very issue and whether or not they would support other people like hillary clinton who also is dealing with things like benghazi. >> she played a prominent role in the bush administration's effort to mislead the american people about the presence of weapons of mass destruction. at the very least, condoned the policy of enhanced interrogation techniques such as water boarding. that does it for me. >> pick ago commencement speaker is hono

our goal with lois lerner was to get her to tell. we still are hoping to get her to proper through her attorney something that would be useful since she has waived her fifth amendment. she clearly testified, then took the fifth, then testified some more. we'd like her to do that, particularly because she's answering questions to the department of justice, who could put her in jail. she doesn't seem to be willing to answer questions to congress who want to get to the truth. >> right. you had a deal a couple weeks ago. what happened to that deal? have you been reproached by her attorneys? >> i don't want to say anything bad about the legal profession, but we've had claims that there would be a deal from her attorney. each time he's come in to talk about a proffer, he says she's misunderstood. her e-mails are telling of what she was doing. we'd like to know why she was doing it, what her goals are and if there is something innocent behind talking about political agenda and doing something on behalf of the sec, we'd like to have that exp

republicans demanding the irs turn over emails from lois lerner and others in the irs targeting scandal. >> we do count documents clearly responsive to a subpoena. clearly not delivered. >> when we say all, we want every single email in the time period in the subpoena that was sent to you, plain and simple. >> we have never said the fact that you didn't give you some he you don't get rest of us. >> are you going to provide the rest of the emails as indicated in this subpoena? yes or no. >> we he have never said. >> i'm asking you yes or no. >> we are going to respond to the subpoena. >> sir,. >> yes we are going to respond to the subpoena. we simply said we need to provide it to you in an order that's useful for you. >> whether you have people in positions of authority of responsibility that are are expressing overtly political commentary on government email, i think we ought to be entitled to all of them. that's why we ask for it. >> now representative trey gowdy joins us. nice to see you sir. >> yes, ma'am. >> have these emails of lois lerner been speend. >> yes, ma'am. >> how long ag

it's a pretty tough report on lois lerner. i would not want to be lois lerner having to answer these allegations. i think it explains to a certain extent why she has decided not to answer these allegations. >> what i don't get they want her to come back and testify. i would still force the irs to turn over all the documents. and with the house ways and means committee got is they didn't get all the documents. the irs is deciding what to give them. they cut a deal. and basically i think they got hood winked by the irs. they shund command all of them. and the irs should not be saying can you have this but not this. >> more emails that we are supposed to see. >> not supposed to do that. >> they say they are going it turn over more emails to ways and means. >> you don't have a choice with a subpoena. have you got to turn it over. for some reason the congress has just rolled over on that. >> and when they do turn things over, often it's missing information and it's heavily redacted. and that's been part of the frustration for both

asking what is the crime lois lerner committed? instead, we're focused on the fact that darrell issa, who had every right as chairman to adjourn the meeting. he decided not to give his opening statement and decided to give his opening statement out of order. there are rules in the committee. elijah cummings has been there long enough to understand the rules of the committee. he broke the rules. i thought chairman aissa went ot of his way. he didn't want to answer, he wanted to pontificate and is now using this as a way to distract from the real issue, which is what is lois lerner covering up and what crime did she commit? >> let me correct one thing, first, for tyler. invoking the fifth amendment gives no presumption of any guilt on any level. that's what the right against self incrimination really is. i want to sort of correct you on that. and on the other side of this, saying that elijah cummings did not have the right to say exactly what he wanted to say, he didn't have to ask a question, didn't have to say something that maybe

it looks like lois lerner committed percentage. in february of 2012 she testified that she never changed the criteria for tax exempt organizations but they found a memo from june 2011 in which she directed the criteria to be changed. that sounds like purge. that's more than a smidgen. >> when i look at this obama administration, you got to look at the broad pattern here to see how much they deceive and lie, right? they never told the truth about benghazi. they deceived us on that. the president himself lied for years about obamacare. er eric holder was held for the gun smuggling in mexico. they have no cred ability at all. right up to the president they knew what was going on with the irs. they lie and deceive about everything. >> rick, i got to ask, it's a hypothetical but if this was being done by the republican administration, do you think that you would be calling for a special prosecutor with all of this evidence that's been leaking out? >> actually, i would, and this may surprise you. i actually agree with lizzy more than you

we want to hear from lois lerner. bill: darrell issa told chris wallace, the evidence we gathered is in her best interest to come and testify. characterize that evidence and would you say for lack of a better phrase from a different story at a different time, a slam dunk? >> the silver lining for this 9 months of delay is it allowed our investigators to get into the cincinnati office where they said all the problems were and talk to a host of people and gather additional information. our questions will be much more in-depth ann with a lot more testified to back it up than it was months ago. if lois lerner thinks she did herself any favors by waiting 9 months, we'll have much more probing answers. next week it's going to happen. bill: jason chaffetz, thank you for your time. martha: as russia invades ukraine the secretary of state heads to ukraine. bill: also a dinner some folks will never forget. ♪ [ male announcer ] evenore impressive than the research this man has at his disposal is how he puts it to work for his

lois lerner, eventually, the truth will come out. charles: as a consumer there, i find it despicable. gold beading the major averages so far this year. what is going on? can it continue? >> do your homework and notice how the chinese continue to stimulate physical gold. there is a story there. people need to be aware of it. the people of china have made a lot of money. that is the same reason they are buying real estate in australia. same idea. charles: we have to do the varney tech tournament. today is round two. we have the big matchup. microsoft versus amazon. remember, stuart varney a huge microsoft sharer. microsoft the clear winner so far this year as far as performance. best stock right now. >> long-term, i will stick with microsoft. i think what i am seeing here from this new ceo, hes part of the significant seven, we have seen this rotation from the highfliers like amazon. i have been there, done that when amazon has gotten burned. charles: what is your take on the two? >> neither. charles: we have these brackets. you have t

speaking of lois lerner, house oversight committee chair issa was on the record last night. here is what he had to say about holding her in contempt of congress next. >> the speaker called that he thought that was appropriate today. our committee will consider it. i've conferred with some of my members. i plan on meeting with them before i leave this week. we could consider doing it as early as next week. >> judge napolitano, fox news senior analyst is my guest on this. >> hi, gretchen. >> perfect guest for this. will will house do through with contempt for lois lerner. >> ordinarily if a witness is summoned to testify before the house and the witness invokes protections of fifth amendment, that alone is an insufficient basis for contempt. contempt means you failed to comply with a lawful order. >> house did it with eric holder whereas to fast and furious. >> in the case of eric holder, the house found by a preponderance of the evidence he failed to answer questions accurately by failing to give documents demanded. what do they say she did wrong? remember a few months ago sh

we learned it was not just lois lerner herself. it was higher up people that were engaged in this and she had these communications going back and forth. if she testifies, that's what we need to find out. it contradicts what she said in the apology and testimony. this is the most bizarre twisting and turning congressional investigation i have seen in decades and unbelievable to me she took the fifth amendment kind of and may have waived it in the way she said it and she's going to testify and not testify. and she wants to do it in a deposition format. and no one knows the answer to this and we'll not know until tomorrow. in the end of the day the american people deserve answers and who was organizing it and when. >> if she takes the fifth tomorrow how will you get those answers? >> it is interesting, we have civil litigation going on. if she takes the fifth amendment and can't not be deemed in admission of liability. in a civil case, the statement that you are taking the fifth are deemed admitted and that presents a different situat

lerner, can you explain how is it that cuffs were not placed on lois lerner for contempt of congress, because she is innocent until proven guilty, she has the right to take the fifth. but does not mean in the meantime see she can make a mockery of the process that has been going on too long. give it up, there is nothing to this fake irs scandal of yours, if there were don't you think that real media would be all over it, hey clown o, do i look like a clown to you, are you serious? do you think that mainstream media has interest in pursuing a story about the irs going after conservative groups, no, this is operation ignore. and just hope it goes away, but god forbid that liberal groups were being targeted. let's just say if it was george bush, he would be impeached by now. pete i ep ho you are wrong. i think you are right to put part of -- on republican, they knew lerner was not going to talk. what is the points of the charade? to show it is asia raid. victor in miami, what do you propose politicians do to resolve this so-called scandal of yours, first of all, it is a scandal. very da

finally he'd get irs official lois learner to testify under oath -- lois lerner to testify under oath about the irs controversy and would link it directly to the white house. >> you understand you have late-breaking news. >> we do. her attorney indicates that she will testify. it's been a back-and-forth negotiation. frankly, we believe that the evidence we've gathered causes her in her best interest to be someone who should testify. >> let me make sheer, lois lerner, former irs official who took the fifth last may, will testify before your committee? >> wow. that's huge news. it turns out it was also news to lerner's attorney who immediately told "politico" that issa was wrong. and issa was wrong. spleeded the fifth. but then issa once again denieded that this hearing isn't about politics. >> how much of this is a political position -- >> none. not a decision of it. not a smidgeon of it. >> really, not about politics? huh. did anyone ask the ranking democrat about that? yes, it turns out someone did. >> the question, is this a bipartisan hearing? not one member of the democratic side

what questions do you have for lois lerner? what are you going to ask her? >> chris, we know what she did in most cases. what we don't know is why she did it. what we do understand, of course, is this is someone who came from the federal election commission. she came with a bias towards groups having to disclose. 501-c-4s are different in because they don't primarily do election hearing, if you will, they don't have to disclose donors. en that seems to be one of the questions that could lead us to understand why a liberal individual who favored disclosure wanted to make sure that tea party groups had to diz close who the donors were. >> when you say you want to know why she did it, does that mean you want to know does this end with her or go higher up than her? >> that's certainly a big part of it. we know a lot of people she coordinated with, some of the things she said, how they either acquiesced or chafed against the things she was asking them to do. we do really want to to know that burning question who have else knew about it? who else coordinated? and

lois lerner called to capitol hill and she refused to answer questions. this time. >> can't do anything about it. they want the irs to fix the problem. miss learner, what exactly

we want e-mails to and from lois lerner. now, bill, the issue becomes some of the information swapped on e-mail is confidential by statute. like your taxpayer information, they could not send us by statute without redacting it. so i'm fine setting that category aside. send me the e-mails to and from lois lerner that don't involve confidential tack payer information. start with that. >> here is the commissioner when he was asked -- >> at the rate we're going as noted by an earlier question, if you want all the categories of all the applications of everybody who's been through the c4 process for the last four years, we can do that and we will do that, but it's going to take years. bill: years? >> well, and, again, he's not reading the subpoena. if you send us four years' worth of confidential taxpayer information and you have to carefully redact all of the information, that may take a while. look, bill, you and i have previously discussed e-mails that lois lerner has sent and received that have nothing to do with private taxpa

lois lerner had worked in the federal election commission. and he was a commissioner there and she is well versed in our case and knows what our case was about. 501 c4s and when they saw the case and the president and his allies i believe did and yesterday's evidence shoes they were convinced that the citizens united ruling would be the undoing for the democrats and in the last several years, they took greater advantage of our ruling than the republicans have. >> you know, i listened to darril issa, he seems to be in a dead-end. >> is there a way to get the answers? >> bill, first of all, i served as chief investigator in the committee in the '90s and i led the investigation in the clintons, and we had multipeel people and you have to be smart and tough enough to go all of the way. and you have to file contempt charges and bring them for a vote in front of the house of representative and not just the committee. but the entire house and you have to file them as a criminal referral to the department of justice. the problem is the attorney gener

find out if your business can qualify at start-upny.com cheryl: former irs official lois lerner pleading the fifth for the second time after being called before congress to testify. rich edson standing by from capitol hill where the fireworks erupted this morning. rich: this has been nine months in the making, this is a continuation of a hearing back in may in which lois lerner pled the fifth. talk about whether or not she gave up the right earlier in the hearings so she is back on capitol hill, we expected chairman darrell issa, lois lerner file in front of the committee for the first time in nine months. it wasn't. >> ct do cence, that is not the way to supposed to work. there are other e-mails coming out that have been requested and other individuals inside the irs are talking. it may be a special prosecutor is needed. at the end of the day the people in the united states deserve an answer and so far we are not getting it. cheryl: they were targeted and they want their boys to be heard and are not hearing from her at least, maybe there is more to this. thank you very much. it was a su

they are grilling the irs commissioner former lois lerner's involvement on the targeting of groups. lerner not at the hearing today. she faces possible contempt of congress charges after pleading the fifth again at a hearing on march 5th. now we're hearing her e-mails may not be released for weeks. maybe years. chief congressional correspondent mike emanuel live on capitol hill for us. mike, fireworks and frustration from republican members of congress trying to get to the bottom of this irs mess. now we're talking weeks, maybe years. >> that's right, gretchen. plenty of frustration. darrell issa said irs response to targeting scandal has been dismal. the committee issued subpoenas wants all of lois lerner's e-mails from january 2009 to august of last year. today they asked the irs commission to make it happen. >> you have a dull issued subpoena, are you or are you not going to provide this committee e-mails as indicated in this subpoena. yes or no? >> we have never said we wouldn't -- >> i'm asking you yes or no. >> we're going to respond to the subpoena. >> sir. >> we are going to

no sign of lois lerner by the way who has pled the fifth. the white house is extending the deadline for signing up for obamacare again. this is the 36 delay we have seen. this one allows people who are supposedly in the process of signing up to check a box and say i need a couple more weeks and they will get into the mid-april or that is the date so far. but health and human service secretary kathleen sebelius told congress this wouldn't happen. >> are you going to delay the mandate that individuals have to buy government health care or approve a tax? >> no, sir. >> are you going delay the open enrollment beyond march 31? >> no, sir. >> allan colbs and michael graham is here. you didn't think this was a big deal? >> i think people will try to use this as a peg in the demise, but as more time goes on more people are signing up and polls are showing they like what they have when they get it. >> during it debt ceiling fight republicans said let's delay this for a year. and democrats said absolutely not. you cruel republicans how could you deny

they agreed to turn over all emails of lois lerner. is that your understanding as well? >> that is the great thing about washington and they love to par's words. [laughter] as a washed up lawyer i need to see that precise language in the subpoena what we ask for to not contrast and compare with their production. if you don't ask for with particularity of specificity will not get its. lou: now we learn lois lerner is giving a full interview to the justice department despite taking the fifth before your committee twice? >> it takes a lot to stun me but she talk to prosecutors who could put her in jail without immunity but she won't talk to of watchdog former prosecutors who cannot put her in jail without immunity. i feel bad for your viewers and for the victims of the targeting because they were opening -- hoping to see her provide answers with another lesson in the fifth amendment. but we are not dead with her -- done with her or her attorney. lou: do you believe we will see your committee and the congressional committee of the record with a fax? >> we have a chance and t