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tv   Going Underground  RT  February 13, 2022 11:30pm-12:01am EST

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security council, european affairs director trying to get britain to remain in the european union. what do you think that is a success? you know, if we had this conversation 5 years ago and i would, i would have said, europe looks pretty shaky and match because you know, breaks it was on the horizon in france, you had been national rally and germany, the alternatives for, for germany. and then you have the pandemic and one could have said, whoa, the populists are gonna are going to prevail. yes, breaks it has happened. it's been pretty ugly. but b, e, u, i think his is in remarkably good shape. i'm pretty up beat about development on the continent in part because the center, his hell, we just had a normal election in germany, italy, it wasn't pretty, but martha rella, the president drago the prime minister, have agreed to stay put. i think it's probably likely that micron is going to be re
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elected. so the center is holding. you've had a mutual ization of death that nobody expect them to try to get your economies back up on their feet. immigration is under control again, not pretty bribing era to want to keep syrians in turkey, bribing libyans to keep africans in libya, but you know, it's for now working. so and then the final thing is, is the relationship with the united states is back in pretty good shape. europeans are happy that biden is in office. i think everybody is asking for how long is he going to lose? the house in november is a republican, maybe even trump going to be re elected, but at least for now we're seeing a level of us european solidarity. that's pretty impressive. okay, well i,
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i should just say that obviously the german government certainly schultz is free. as a michael denies germany bribe, anyone? because you k payments to parts johnson completely rejects that breakfast. has been ever, i think, any kind of a mess. but i mean, i suppose, i should say that the off to used phrase that the, you prevented a war that's not true. you just love your, of course, was a war when the european union was around. well, i think you have to give your a pretty high marks for preserving peace in large swats of europe. and the border between france and germany wide open the border between germany and poland open. it's worked, integration has largely achieved its objectives. has europe emerged as a geopolitical heavyweight? now is i'm a cron trying to address that issue. yes. is he going to succeed? probably not any time soon. but the bottom line here is that you have in europe an
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integrated market. pretty strong political unity. it is one of the most successful political revolutions, if you will, of the 20th century. and of course, there are these tensions now, as regards the know the non protocol, what do you think? the view is in the biden administration, joe biden, as we sometimes mentioned in this program, there were room, is that the ira a rebel songs? a song is house in new jersey. in the old days, you think he's going to definitely take the you side over the unilateral decision, apparently in the last few days by the british government to break the northern ireland protocol. well, you know, having worked in the white house during the obama air, i was, it was pretty clear that obama biden and others were not very keen on braxton. and you'll remember that president obama or the u. k. and tried to say, hey, don't do this, this is not a good idea. not sure whether that helped or hurt,
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but the i did, it was really you was bricks. if that's what you're saying there. now i'm not going to own that one, but we can take that discussion offline. the, you know, i think that at things are trending in, in a reasonably good direction on, on the northern iowa. you, you know, we saw a cabinet reshuffle not that long ago, which i think was in part about johnson's desire to find some way forward on, on northern ireland biden wants that to happen. he does not want to see some kind of a bus stop that, that affects the relationship between the republic in northern ireland. so stay tuned, we're not across the finish line yet, but i have a sense that the british government wants to put this behind it and met some kind of compromise deal with the e. u is forthcoming. well, of course, for us,
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johnson is in battle because of the police investigation, but any fears you might have had about britain looking to the far east, perhaps that lead to china. ukraine seems to show that the nato alliance, certainly the alliance between leading members, britain in the united states, never being stronger over ukraine. well, you know, it's, i worried in the aftermath of brackets it, that britain would turn in were, in part because i think breaks it was the result of a somewhat isolationist turn within the british electric. but that has not happened . in fact, in some ways, johnson has attempted to compensate for britain's departure from you by trying to punch above its weight elsewhere. all the focus deal the submarine, deal with australia, britain flexing its muscles in ukraine, sending
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a warship to the black sea, now standing shoulder to shoulder in trying to push back against putin's threats to ukraine. so i would say that right now, the u. s. u k. relationship despite the differences over breakfast it is, is in pretty good shape and that london is turning out to be the partner that washington had hoped for. is that going to continue? we'll have to see, but so far so good. i mean, watching the progress of the, by to ministrations a raising of the issue of ukraine. what have you, what have you made of it? oversee the by to ministration came to russian invasion was imminent, then dropped the word imminent aud pieces of intelligence. actually some of it repeated from, from britain, the british intelligence, claiming that a person actually banned from russia was being prepared to take power in give very odd bits of intelligence being reported by all the newspapers. how do you think the
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by demonstrations handling all of us? i think the bible folks have broadly gotten it right now. nobody knows, probably including himself, whether rush has been in baby crane. but they've got enough force on the border, including ships in the black sea that one has to take very seriously the prospect of a huge russian invasion that would perhaps include besieging p. s, asking the government and install it out of that. and i any intention of doing that? well, what would be the point? well, you know, this is, this is where i have a hard time figuring out exactly what, what the point is. in the sense that, you know putin is a trouble maker. putin has invaded or tried to interfere in most of his, his neighboring countries from georgia to ukraine, nagondo car, moldova, he went in to syria. but these actions have generally been low cost, low risk,
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a low cost, low risk operation in ukraine doesn't really get him much. ok, so let's say he wants to annex done boss, or he wants to connect don boss to crimea. he still loses the rest of ukraine. so if his goal here is to try to pull the country back into rushes here influenced, he really does have to invade the country. that's a huge tor to be near him after he's got the stomach for that. so that he'd be nearer weston nato nations. i mean, i have to say on, on those different things, syria, i'm sure the russian government would immediately say that there was british, in american backing for the rebels of the ground to go to carry back. fusion intervene to solve a, as a by john and armenia. and as regards don, bess and elegance can so and you know that even western powers of ad through accept
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the un security council resolution on the minsk agreements, 2202. they've accepted it to them, it's agreements is fine for russia, which isn't even mentioned in the agreement. if you don't see that, and you're talking about isolation earlier, and i suppose the trump elements here and certainly your cable channels like fox news saying this is about biden's presidency in taxes, worried about mid terms. and of course, boris johnson here being investigated by the police. well, you know, in terms of, of what rush has been up to in its neighborhood. i think the facts speak for themselves and russians ought to look in the mirror and ask themselves, why is it that everyone who lives near us wants to join nato? and i think it's for 2 reasons. russia keeps interfering, sending troops and it's neighbors and they want some protection number to everything else being equal. i think people want to live in a democracy, not in
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a repressive autocracy. they don't want to worry that if they he got, they're going to get poisoned or thrown in jail. that's why i think so many countries have been interested in joining nato. where is, is driving right now. i think he is engaging in dog diplomacy with the europeans. i mean, almost every day somebody is flying to either kiev or moscow. the channels of communication are open. there is a real serious effort to get diplomacy to avoid a war, including by looking at the minsk agreements that you just mention. but there's also a realistic assessment that the diplomacy might fail. and that's why biden is taking 2 additional steps. one is putting more troops in eastern europe to tell the russians, hey, you don't like ne, that, well, it's going to get worse. you're going to have a lot more capability on the eastern flank than you did before. and number 2,
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putting up in the window very significant sanctions including against pollutants, inner circle, which should get him to ask, is it really worth it? do i really want to suffer the economic punishment that will come with an invasion of ukraine. professor up general, stop you, the more from the former special assistant of u. s. president barack obama, after this break plus did then princess elizabeth know about the mon, my rebellion with 90000 may have been killed, maimed or tortured by british imperialists. as she was told 70 years ago, that she was to become queen dollars more coming up and bought 2 of going underground. i look forward to talking to you all. that technology should work for people.
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a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, except we're such orders that conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we should be very careful about our personal intelligence at that point, obviously is too great trust rather than fear an area with artificial intelligence, real, somebody with a robot must protect its own existence with join me every thursday on the alex simon, sure. i'll be speaking to guess in the world of politics, sport, business. i'm show business. i'll see you then. mm. a
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. welcome back. i'm still here with professor charles cup, john senior fellow and director of european studies at the council of foreign relations inform, a special assistant to you as president barack obama. vladimir putin was elected democratically. and of course you, as you know, the russians are very quick to talk about human rights and about guantanamo bay, still being opened. you mentioned sanctions. do you believe this sort of economic warfare is good travel bands as it freezes? mastercard, visa, blacklist, i think that was around your time. it was around 500 entities between 200-2021. the us treasury says 933 percent increase would impact us sanctions have on russia? well, you know, biden has, has explicitly stated that no us combat troops are going to ukraine,
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that the united states, as they know partners are not going to go to war with russia over ukraine. so the question then is, what should be the response? if russia goes and invades it's neighbor, and the main response is sanctions, that's how you create a disincentive. both deter, to try to get them to set, to decide not to go in and to put pressure on russia. if it does go in these are, these are major sanctions, you know, after the 2014 events, the annexation of crimea interference and don bos, sanctions were imposed, but they really didn't go deep into the russian. i mean, are you dropped? i mean, i don't know actions or would be like that, but they are much more far reaching than 20. 14 people can watch are. john bolton trumps the national security adviser about sanctions and cuba let alone all the other countries. i don't know how many countries the u. s. know, sanctions in the relevance here, of course is to this foreign affairs magazine piece. you wrote that one
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u. s. priority was to help manage china's rise of the global stage. the usa should formulate a strategy to peel russia away from china. as we know that the sanctions this economic growth has just strengthened the relationship most couldn't be jane element. yes, it has. and in some ways, one negative knock on effect of sanctions is pushing russia closer to china. that happened after 2014, where we saw russia compensate for its economic isolation by trading more with russia, with china moving closer to china. if russia invades ukraine, than i assuming that the sanctions will push china and russia closer, closer together, that is something that seems to me to be unavoidable, and in my mind, does not outweigh the importance of reacting with
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a serious set of sanctions against a native. what's the point, what does it, what do they do with the point to the sanction they, they would create number one, a deterrent kootenai has to ask, are russians going to be better off if we occupy ukraine and they'll be body bags coming home? you can be sure of that, and if major russian banks and companies are cut off from the west, we hear that there will be a ban on certain kinds of technologies that will make it very hard for russians to buy cell phones and other other basic electronic items, so the idea here is to create dis, incentives for ukraine to, to suffer a rush. where is it? where is the, where is this your sleep? if, where is this whole russia does use force against? it's where is this hasn't worked in iran in venezuela and syria, where is this sanction policy ever ever worked?
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it's, it's worked in in iran. right? i mean, we, that we got it. we got an agreement. it looks like we may get a re start of the j c p o way. why is iran going to the negotiating table in part because they want to get out from under sanctions. ok, well i mean, a lot of people in are on arguably a saying why, why bother given of course, the reneging of the un security council resolution by the trump administration. in any case, how do you think her, do you think that if, if russia is definitely not going to invade ukraine, the sanctions are going to be in place that russia and china and the global south. because we've seen chinese massive investment all across the global south means that the european union, an u. s. power is basically on the decline now. well,
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you know, i think that if we do get a de escalation, yes, we do avoid a major war, and this would probably be the biggest war in europe since 1945. it's conceivable that you could see russia's relationship with the, with the united states, move in a better direction. maybe we can get the main sk agreement implemented. maybe the dispute over ukraine can turn into a broader discussion that would include conventional arms control that would include nuclear arms control. so it's right now that doesn't seem to me very likely, but it's, it's conceivable. i also think, as i wrote in the piece that you mentioned that russia is over the longer term uncomfortable in the relationship with china because it is the junior partner. and over time, i think russia will be looking for a western auction because chinese power is going to make the russians uncomfortable
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. yes, you're right to say that china is a rising power. it will soon have the world's largest economy. but it's important to keep in mind that if you add up the collective weight of the united states and it's democratic partners in dramatically outweighs china or a combination of russia and china, it's important to keep that in mind. and that's one of the reasons that biden has been working so hard to promote solidarity, not just with europeans, but also with south korea, japan, taiwan, australia, and democracies in east asia. professor charles got john, thank you. my pleasure. ah, in recent days the u. k. monarch, queen elizabeth the 2nd celebrated had platinum jubilee mocking 70 years or the british throne. when she found out her father george the 6th had died. the queen was on a 4 day trip to kenya,
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the east african nation was declared an independent state in $9063.00 after the spark of the mo mo uprising. joining me now from the capital canyon, i will be a senior lecture from day star university, a member of gender africa, dr. wendy and joy. thank you so much, wendy. ever coming back on? yeah, britain. a big celebrations for the platinum jubilee. she was told she was queen at treetops. i understand that her shut down hotel now. i'm surprised. no big mention that what perhaps a 160000 were being held in u. k. concentration camps at the same time. yeah. yeah. during their mom, mom, i insurrection against their colonial government. it's kind of ironical that it would elaborating, actually thought mentioning at the circumstances in which she became queen. and in fact, the president's office always also celebrating that event. so it's kind of ironical . although of course, as we noted that the people that took over a drama kenyata,
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his son of course is now president distance himself big time from mom, just reminders because i mean, i 90000 maybe in killed named or tortured. yeah. yeah. i'm not sure about the numbers, but it was a huge number of millions in concentration camps. so it for about a. so it was not have pretty period at the time was quite brutal. and that's the canyon human rights commission of the fact. you don't know what symptomatic of the education that's happened since post independence in your country. read writing a lot about what you call a colonial education in kenya, regardless of how we are educated here in britain about colonial and imperialist atrocities. yeah, we got an education system that's more about telling us the benefits of him and colonialism. and very little about the resistance of many, many candidates against colonialism right from the 1895 when they set
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foot t. and he said that that kenya would be long imperial british battery company. so there have been rebellions there have been armed struggles, the one that catches the imagination, of course, is them out because of the extent. but they're, all these rebellions are hardly talked about in this particular. and it's really strange that even at this level at the present, you have to go over what colonialism is with my students. because they don't know, they don't know, many of the major feedback it don't even know why britain was here in the 1st place . and that's a combination of the education system that we have for what, why is that? i should say one of the princess elizabeth, then princess elizabeth's porters, national and marie, he was interviewed he, he joined the rebellion after being the porter for the green tree jobs. why,
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why is the educational system like that? because it was set up to proper colonial admin. so in fact, one of the ways in which the british government, one of the tactics and mt a rebellion was to, to increase the number of schools, especially in central province where the larger mo, mo, was based. so that point was to get people who are in, who would not be loyal to not keep their loyalty to them. i think that would support the beach government. so that legacy has continued because now the people who got education, why those who are not active resistance. and then when they came in and you hit that, the next generation to think more in terms of maintaining the colonial systems that have been left behind. and as having a different education system that was inclusive and reflected our study,
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but as regards imperialism and it's a connection to racism. you've actually talked about class here. and even where the queen was staying, the princess or queen was staying working class whites. boas, of course, the church was concentration camps of africa against the white boys. there was a class system around the new key area which, you know, in the western imagination is karen dickson, white, mischief, happy valley. those are the those are the stories of kenya, safaris. yeah. what the fact can i was asked to be colonized by the elite of the british colonials it so other people who went in by brands of africa. why he's not a people or just civil servants who are working on behalf of the state. but the people who came to kenya and settled in, i knew, yeah, well that's, you know,
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you and all of those. so they came with that all day the, you know, the values of that he still trust it. that's what they brought here. yeah, no problem for can, can i had highest number of it on high school bureaucrats? so it was not just a was also that you show them many of it alone. your office has had been to the public schools and to breach. so for us, johnson went to that school. i'm sure he'd say good, good back to you. i mean, i should ask, i mean, barbados obviously is left to commonwealth. i don't know what your views about. can you leaving the commonwealth or would it be possible for princess elizabeth the on the 5th of february $9052.00 not to know about the mass extermination of canyons going on at this time. she was staying there, even if she knew it was inconvenient for her to know. and that's another thing we
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have in it. we have remained from britain. this is out of the special and secrecy and spin that what is more important is that you have the system in fact and any stories that they inconvenient you just keep them under the right or you don't to mention them all. so even if she knew it was inconvenient for empire, so it was, it was easy and they found not to know. and that's, that's, i guess, the way we have remained, even in kenya. right now. a lot of the problems that we have are swept under the rug and we talk we elephant in the room, but we never mentioned the end. what is that? the commonwealth imperialism, or the i, m, f. all, all of them, all of them. you know, for example, in education i education system was we got a new system from the now and from ins and wild bank, all those kinds of fellows. but we can't talk about it even if it's in the
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documents. so when you hear civil servants, they, they behave like lord, rama who, who wrote the handbook for civil service. they just pretended it didn't happen. they just keep away the documents. and just, you know, brand the system as efficient as efficient. and that's a british pin for you. this is a pretty good that is, well the canadian government did i. and refute all the allegations. of course we invite the ambassador to london only surely i'm after a few things don't you want to enjoy. i thank you. thank you very much. over the show will be back on wednesday, 17 years to the day, the un mobilized the kyoto protocol, the international treaty, which extended the you and framework. conventional climate change until then keep in touch by social media. let us know whether you think kenya is free from british imperialist
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what we've got to do is identify the threats that we have. it's crazy confrontation, let it be an arms race is on, often very dramatic development only personally and getting to resist. i don't see how that strategy will be successful, very difficult time time to sit down and talk more when i was showing wrong, when i just don't know any new world is yet to figure out disdain because of the african and engagement it was betrayal when so many find themselves worlds apart. we choose to look for common ground.
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ah, the democratic republic of congo is among the richest countries in the world and natural resources, but he cannot mclee it's still one of the poorest cobalt is an essential material in manufacturing batteries from modern devices like electric cars, mobile phones and computers. 60 percent of the world's cobalt reserves are in congo . 20 percent of it comes from small scale mines. units have figures confirm that in 2017. more than $40000.00 children worked in cobalt mining in the republic to one living and paying for schooling. next time you use a fancy gadget like a smartphone camera laptop, and just remember that there's a chance it works thanks to what child hard labor children like, john michelle, henrietta. oh, countless, others like them or
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a headlines right now here. one off, international, off to predictions of an invasion of ukraine by the middle of next week. the usaa rose back a little on making a definite prediction, saying instead, it could be any day now. above your talk to whether russian figure skater ca valley eva can still compete at the olympics is expected. next, our rushes figures getting federation is adamant. bowes, she's innocent of any wrong doing, despite the fact that she did test positive for a bad subs in canada. police clear key border crossing with united states. so or clearing out the truckers who have been protecting vaccine mandates. however peaceful rallies continue in the capital in support of the so called freedom.

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