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tv   Cross Talk  RT  October 4, 2021 12:30am-1:01am EDT

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ah, hello and welcome to cross stock. were all things considered? i'm peter level. one would think the humiliating withdrawal from afghanistan would be the start of a washington wine down of the forever wars. is this really the case? also? you tube war on creators? and it's not only about so called coven misinformation. ah, there's got these issues and more, i'm joined by my guess, patrick and implemented. he's the editor and boundary 21st century wire dot com in budapest, george. anyway, he is a podcast or at the gl, which can be found on youtube and locals. are a gentleman, cross that rules and effect, that means you can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciate it. let's start off with patrick. one of the interesting things is the dust settles with the
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humiliating evacuation of the capitol. our airport by us forces after 20 years. there, there's been assessment. i mean, is the beginning of something. is this an aberration? is it some kind of high aid is because it's very unclear even to some there are those that are saying that the usa could possibly even have a deal already with the taliban and leaving all about equipment behind. i'm not gonna make any judgment at this point. whatsoever, but it's very interesting to me, is this a one off thing or is that something a part of a trend? what are your thoughts? go ahead patrick. i think this is, this is just the beginning. this is the beginning, but in reality, the started all of this trajectory is or of eventual waning us influence in the middle east and central asia. i think this trajectory began a long time ago because america's greatest advantage throughout history is also it's greatest. why a bill it shone more than any other will power that it's willing to sacrifice blood
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and treasure for its national interests or what is perceived to be national interest. but that is also become its biggest liability. and i think the clock started running a really with the bombing of afghanistan, it post $911.00, the iraq war. the clock began running then, but the clock was really running from the vietnam war. so there's a limited amount of patience that the american people, appetite for war. so pardon me. so, so you have iraq, syria, yemen. these 3 wars are in the balance right now. and so there are things that have happened, watershed points in each of these that i think are now coming to the fore biden, is it a week week point? the white house is incredibly weak, americus, at its weakest point politically. they have a foreign policy teen meta, or young chick solven's. 43 years old. you've got, you know,
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been roads and these are the people, obama hold overs and insurance that her for are advising this president. so i don't really think they really have a clue. they're really trying to just piece together what's really a broken jigsaw puzzle from the obama administration and trump administration was very dysfunctional. trump wanted to pull out of some of these but was thwarted by the lindsey grounds by the deep state and so forth. so i think that afghan was really the beginning with it right now it's, it's a mixed bag. ok. and that's why we're doing this topic here. what are your thoughts going to because i think we have a parson words here. i mean, having an influence, having gemini, all of these can be defined in a different way. i mean, you can continue to have influenced by selling a lot of arms, which they continue to do. all right, you know they let me the abraham affords ok for me. it's a, it's a, it's
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a weight off of the arms producers. ok. i don't, i don't really see the political mix except for some kind of hodge podge anti iran policy, which is really got know where the last 2 administration included by 3. yeah, i can just say that the afghanistan thing was a wow. i don't believe that the united states will future as any intentional withdrawing from the middle east. i think they are there in syria to say, and then they just keep coming up with a new rationale. what's like, the ice is preventing that consolidation of the machine and make sure that running around increase their influence. and then even when you think about iraq, trump, you know, we will, the, we get talking about ending forever was and ending interventions. and he never never said that america. 2 should withdraw from iraq. so i think that america has
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invested in huge amounts over the decades in saudi arabia, the gulf states, and the middle east, and go straight to who they are vital points in the world. and so, if there is indeed a rivalry and you know, some sort of a cold war coming with china, then control all the go will be as important as strategic goal of the united states as it was during the cold war. an interesting case because of the americans to say, you know, yes, they gave up on vietnam, cambodia and laos, but you know, they still got indonesia, malaysia, japan, which at the time at least as far as american perceptions were concerned, were in danger of going to the communist so say you know, our intervention achieved is goals that we prevented a whole say a little bit of communism in asia. so it wasn't probably just
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a matter of giving up on the american influence. let me to do both to be a 1st to patrick here. i can agree with both of you at the same time for different reasons. i think, i mean, i think, you know, what point is it negative returns? i mean these are not cost free. ok? number one, number one very, very expensive, you know, 3 trillions plus a stan itself. and then i mean, and then there's the blood issue here and we have over the last 3 election cycles. these wars are very, very unpopular. how is it sustainable, the cost and the unpopularity? $1.00 would think, maybe maybe one would think it has to come to some kind of tipping point. that's for sure. in terms of popularity, i think the, the establishment in the united states is willing to take that on the chin that some of these intervention might be on popular. because the whole point of
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u. s. foreign policy is to open up markets for certain trans national trade corporations and so forth. this is allowed the u. s. to haven't had your money. america's greatest preponderance isn't it isn't military. in fact, although it might seem like that it's the u. s. dollar and it's, it's economic preponderance is financial preponderance more than military. military is just a tool to open up, to allow it to dominate globally financially. but i think george pointed out something that's interesting, you know, the middle east will become in a new cold war with china. the middle east will become a sort of contested zone. aw, george or wells geopolitical math in 1084. this endless war with east asia, but the middle east is changed and changed because of us action. so there is now an arc of resistance that very well network to very well equipped and fortified, which stretches from iran all the way to lebanon. and that's
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a direct result of us and its allies, various operations and escapades in places like syria and iraq. and i think there was a tipping point came in january 2020 when iran fired missiles, a dozen missiles at 22 us bases. and the u. s. did not strike back. so i mean that, that was a really, to me, one of the biggest, besides, couldn't entrance into the syrian war in october 2015. this moved by iran as a retaliation of the assassination of general custom sumani and iraqi jones and us that was triggered. i think it's slow, a major realignment in terms of west asian geo politics. i think it's irreversible because the u. s. is power is also based on it's the opponent's ability to fear them or to respect them. and iran basically called their bluff and look what's happened. nothing has happened to ron. there's been
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a lot of stable routing. israel is assassinating nuclear scientists, etc. that's going on the fringes, but geopolitically, iraq is also changing their orientation. again, you know, antique more anti u. s. and the clock is ticking. the us will eventually have to leave iraq. i don't know how long they'll be able to keep going. and now iraqi kurdistan is now basically under threat as well by some of the same forces. but it's interesting, i think they're the kind of where the circle conversation here. i mean, these words are both of you. i mean, in the, we're going from a gemini, george gemini, to contest it. i mean, well, that's an interesting strategy right there. ok. because then you lower the cost, what it will cost, economic costs, but you may still have the, the financial leverage and was talking about this. there is a calibration going on. i don't know how it is, and you don't know how conscious it is a grand strategy, or is it a country to country things like iraq, which is kind of
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a outlier when we come to look at these other things here. what do you think george? go ahead. well, i think the financial last thing is porch and i want to bear in mind that what the united states did in iraq and afghanistan was quite extreme by us. sanders. i mean, this will full scale invasion and that is it very problematic because that's where you get a casualties. as long as you can. wage was sort of dishes li, using for as long as you can leave your influence on sales through, you know, trade by as a dollar and minimize casualties. then, you know, the united states can still continue with it and it, it becomes very problematic. when you go into the whole war and you have 500000
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troops and then you can see a iraq. and so it is, calculation was made by the united states as by the soviet union in the late 198 is this, you know, whatever the strategic value of it, maybe it isn't, was the normal blood and treasure involved in, in continuum, talking about it. but that doesn't mean that you give up on all the other ways, and i don't mean i don't think americans is going to give up in the middle east just like that. yeah. well, it's, it's, it's still problematic. let me go to you for we ended up part of the program here, but, you know, we, we have that we can't discount the players on the ground. and there's a lot of chatter, a lot of re reassessing on bed, blout fellows talking to each other. recalibrating what iran is in the mix and all that. i think we can talk all about what the us and its allies. but there's
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a lot of murmurings going on in the ground. and that kind of thing is a psychological issue. they lost ok. they can be defeated. ok. so that's one kind of balling in between. both of you here go ahead, finish up and it is part of that. there's also just a technical aspect of waging war or having military dominance is that you need to be able to take territory whole territory. the real modern war in terms of what i think is the new u. s. policy, which is to use local enforcers to pull its assets offshore, used local enforcers. so they pulled out of guitar. it's largely and used to saudi arabia as the front person for the yemen war from from march of 2015 forward. the u . s. is really backing that logistically, satellites air force pilots in some cases, air refueling, when munitions everything. so it was a great cash cow for the us. it made the money from the war. saudi paid them as well. for the services they were billed. same with the iraqi government was billed
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for our strike in here. we're running out of those. barbara. my last comment. i would bet the barman saudi arabia. gentlemen, i'm going to jump in here. we're getting ready. you're breaking up. that job rank will continue on as will not stay with us. ah ah, these are the 4 people who pulled the trigger and survive something on survival. one of the hardest things that i had to face was not having a face at a low expectation of life. i accepted accept the fact that i made that we had no fears. jell change pretty fast. 4 shots different stories behind the bullets. we'll look forward to talking to you all that
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technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, except where such order that conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we should be very careful about artificial intelligence. and the point obviously is to great trust, rather than fear i would like to take on various jobs with artificial intelligence, real summoning with a robot must protect its own existence with her
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welcome to cross that were all things considered on peter la bell. this is the home edition. to remind you, we're discussing some real news. ah. okay, let's go back to george in budapest. well, you tube is on the warpath again, against against creators. obviously in the station that we're all on right now, our team has been thrown into the fray. and for the most part, at least at this point in time, it's about coven misinformation. but when i find terrifying, actually, and sort of disappointing, as i see, this is just the cudgel to control control the narrative and to return a gemini in the media sphere back to the guild media, the new york times washington post cnn. all the other rest of them. and this is,
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and it's all layered with medical emergency and that's quite compelling. fear mongering by definition is compelling. that's why they do it. it's not about coven george. maybe this in this moment in time. but it's really much more. busy at stake here than kobe misinformation go ahead. yes, so you're at your spot because the whole sense to ship the black for me the ball started long before. 1 it started immediately in the aftermath of the 2016 election with the hysteria about the russian boss and the misinformation over that the russians and the, the rain is we're providing. and he was indeed the mainstream media that the internet giants to the platform, people who are providing a. 1 wrong information about the and so this is seized on this issue,
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but it's a part of them much, much bigger theme, which is about this in the, in internet, which really democratize the availability of information. she does. i don't want to see in the information we want to control information, you know, you have to listen to us and they, well, the pressure on the internet. so they just were initially a little wary of the black will make the pressure and then a bowl from the data. unless you, you follow our victim. unless you get rid of all of these pro russian boss, we're going to comment you and we're going to parcels of legislation. you're not going to like and you know, the engine a giant. ok honestly. so it is a matter of, you know, the politicians and the media for example, this wow, it's quite problematic as to what to do about this. yeah, a rush game because that was kind of in my mind it was
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a drive to see how much damage they rot will listen to them who follow, who remain silent and then who would challenge them. and then we had under, by the laptop, which is, you know, that somebody special project, you know, they, they're really proud of that. see out, we just got a huge hole through the internet. you know, on this one issue here. and they were very effective. and now it's called business information that they've learned from russia game they've learned from the under by lab. they know what to do now. they actually have a plate. that's my opinion. that's how i got right now, from an extension from the 100 biden laptop. suppression of that story was after the election. any talk of election fraud, any talk of it? not being a for election. they came out formally and said they're going to take out, take down any videos or in the other social media. and they were sanitizing their platforms. the same way. that's just enough to any society that claims to be
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democratic that you can even have discussion or discourse, whether it be partisan or not. but the irony is that is completely partisan what they're doing on that side. but this extends geopolitically. and so back to the taking down of our tea deutsche very dangerous that this platform will, will take state media and not only state media, a member of the un security council major channel have 600000 subscribers, hundreds of millions of years out competing, some of the german english language channels as well, and that's just down to what people are. they prefer to watch in terms of content, but this is dangerous. they did this depress t. v. a rainy and state media, they did it to syria, t. v. not many people cared because syria t, v. what, what's the point? the point is, if you're at war, if you're a perpetual war, if the west sees itself as being in perpetual warfare all the time,
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which is in there, if you look at their integrated operating concepts, the things that are being released to white papers coming out of the u. k, for instance, they're viewing this as a spectrum that is constantly moving domestically and internationally. no difference between home in a way pitch. so this is, this is what's being done. so i think this media war, the tit for tat to dangerous, because russia could been you tube within russian territory, then you're into a whole, another range of problems. but i think you have this merger. people have to remember when censorship is done by a company like google, you tube, it's not just, it's an american company, but the censorship is global. they have dominion over the entire planet, information space, and they can even have different policies for different countries, which facebook does, which google and youtube have done. and it doesn't matter what the regime is, that the policy is totally customized to whatever the political situation and their business relationship is in that country as far as medical misinformation,
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which is what they used to get the strike that took down the r t channel. they're doing that to millions of views of millions of pieces of content which their ceo admitted. and it's very vague. you k column, the channel that i'm on as well. we had our channel deleted for medical misinformation. no specific was even 10 year old channels, thousands of videos. they don't tell you what the offending article is. it's left intentionally vague. as you said in, as george said it's, it's a convenient cultural. and the medical misinformation tactic could be used in the geo political sense. to take down because these governments are in very close contact with these firms. we know this from the senate hearings. we know this from recent news report. so to think that they're not in touch with the state department or there's not influence that's being pushed. and silicon valley from the political side would be very naive, you know, gently, we should never be surprised. in this case,
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it's the internet. but we go back with newspapers and things like that. we should never be surprised that there, there are people that are ideologically predisposed to certain ideas, other marketplace issues here. but there's, what's new in the mix for me is that it's the people that claim to be journalist. they're the ones that are spearheading this. they are the ones that are most keen on censorship, banding sadder banding and all of this because, you know, you can have people and you to google that have certain ideas. but i still wonder if they think, well, you know what just makes them money. ok. and then you have the, there's the pressure out there to conform because, you know, the, the people that are sending this information, i mean, in the scheme of things, it's minuscule compared to what these platforms hold here. and that's why we believe it is political here. but the thing is it's journalists, ok, and news outlets, the ones that are sharing the loudest for the worst possible thing to ever happen
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to the internet. and that is censorship. go ahead. yes. a real irony that because a c n n in new york times that do this drumbeat. i'm thinking that patrick said, it's directed very much the rest of the russians are, you know, we have a roster. these is the malevolent factor because they engineer from selection they tree, they provide the information about rick lynch again. now, roches, the back is providing bad information back scenes and the misinforming the public. so there's the geopolitical aspect. but what's really important is that these journals, these outlets like cnn, which i talk about this information and conspiracy here is pedal by russia. i mean, there are few outlets in the world that are responsible for more bad news news with this information. and then, you know, i mean the home to buy, and i mean the, you know, they, you know, they handle the nonsense. i'm to buy a laptop was,
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it was a russian intelligence operation. they federal nonsense about the old of the russian gate conspiracy. the trump project collusion, they had all the nonsense about the russian bounties on us soldiers in afghanistan . so, you know, we don't even have to go back to the iraq weapons of mass destruction. so they are responsible for long was this information, anything to me to talk to you actually get something wrong id usually because a record of some mainstream media outlets are wrong, but they never got so many big things wrong as these are the media outlets that are calling for censorship, i think by the standard me, the, the 10s of thousands of hours. it's c, n, n and m s n, b c. they should be deleted by the standard that they are claiming about dis, information and, and what, what, what add insult to injury is that when you go to you, no matter what you watch,
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they propose and you watch mainstream media. so, you know, they, they know, you know, they don't have a dog in this, in the spite of course, they do, they're losing their market share. and market share is money. it's a, this is a business proposition for them. and they want it for money. they're willing to see freedom of speech completely oblivious. they could or left there bottom line in their shareholders. it's very pernicious. go ahead and below every video that you tube flagging that they haven't taken down. there's a little covey, 19 information bar, or, or it'll be about russian state media. they put a russian state media under every r t video, but the, the cov, it link goes to wikipedia, and wikipedia is completely games in terms of information. this has been proven beyond a doubt, so this is the, or wells ministry of truth in action. but geopolitical, you have to realize that now, you know, the, all the fake news uproar during trump and after trump and this misinformation dis,
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information. the military are using these terms in nato countries, in their defense reviews, in their defense documents. and they're viewing this as a threat to the consensus and they're calling this space democratically protected. so this is become a national security and so did the g 7 launch something that lot of people missed, which is the rapid response mechanism in 2018 when theresa may was prime minister. and what it meant that all g 7 countries had to have streamline messaging on anything national security related. and this is almost like a treaty. ok. so if you think about, if you criticize the german government policy or the u. k. government policy, whether it's me, you or some alternative media outlet that goes into a national security column. and it's to be dealt with or seen as a threat. and they're going to legislate against this in the u. k with the online arms legislation in to,
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to elevate trusted sources and to basically delete or remove what they call misinformation or dangerous to democracy in anything that damages confidence, in government, or the consensus and government is the worst offender for destroying confidence in itself. as is the mainstream media in confidence in media, it's their fake news as you pointed, that is caused the public to just abandon them in droves. so this is just a strange epoch we find ourselves in. it's a tragic one because it's a sunset on civilization and folks, if you're going to rely upon week of media, you know, just turn on the lights, it's over. ok, that's all the time. i want to thank my guest with a limit. i want to thank you for watching us here. you see an ex family member. ah oh, is your media a reflection of reality?
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in the world transformed what will make you feel safe? isolation, whole community? are you going the right way, or are you being led to somewhere? direct? what is true? what is faith? in the world corrupted, you need to descend to join us in the depths or remain in the shallows. and i drink shaped banks, concur some of those with
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dares sinks, we dare to ask or imagine picking up a future textbook on the early years of the 21st century. what are the chapters cold, gun violence, school shootings, homelessness? first, it was my job then it was my family. didn't was my savings. i have nothing. i have nothing and it's not like i don't try. i look for resources, i look for jobs. i look for within like in the make this pass and i and of doing is passing the road to the american dream, paved with dead refugees. it's this very idealized image of this. older america
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makes americans look past the depths that happen every single day. this is a modern history of the usa by america. on our t headlines this, our hidden treasures, the secret financial dealings of hundreds of the world's richest and most powerful people are revealed in the biggest ever lake of offshore data. meanwhile, the blame game continues over an alarming energy crisis in europe with thing disappointed at brussels, green politics and russia and fury in austria. after an afghan refugee in rate to 7 year old girls send some suggest and months behind bars and given therapy, we get the views of the panel and the guest model rapes a 7 year old girl e as a lot of problems. and they canceled the comp to sold her was in.


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