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tv   Cross Talk  RT  September 24, 2021 12:30am-1:01am EDT

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the great thing about it being available to everybody think a bit more like a public news via or anybody in the world can view for free land of universal healthcare makes america the country of every man for himself. we have a retirement crisis in this country and we have a health care crisis for seniors in this country as well. so private business has come up with a special mechanism for that. it's called the live settlement market. we are a life settlement provider, which means that we buy life insurance policies from primarily seniors throughout the united states who no longer want or can't afford their life insurance policies . if you're sick and for want to live a few more years, you can sell your life insurance. that way you get more money right away and the company collects your insurance payment off to your dad. there's a group of people out there i guess,
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hoping that people die soon. what kind of motivation is i give them when i start crying about him dying? that's usually what it's about. it's just the sheer unfairness of it all the the me ah, ah ah, ah. hello and welcome to cross hog we're all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle when it comes to the rise of china, most of the commentary focuses on such things as strategic balance and the west, so called rules based order. however, what is missing in this discuss is the rise of
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a civilization. but challenges western gemini, is the west prepared for this arc of history. the cross talking the arc of history, i'm joined by my guest, george m u l e. in budapest, he's a pod counselor at the gaggle which can be found on youtube and locals. and in sydney we cross to jo loria, he's the editor in chief of consortium news dot com, or a gentleman, cross talk rules and effect. that means you can jump in anytime you want. and i always appreciate, let me go to jo 1st because it's past midnight in sydney, so thank you very much for staying up and joining us. it's very much appreciated, joe, and you're actually closer to the china than the rest of us here. you know, when i look at the discussion, as i said in my introduction, you know, we can talk about arms and proliferation. and we can talk about the rules based order and all of that. but what the west, tearing itself apart at the scenes here. you know, you may look at
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a more competent chinese culture and civilization. it seems to me, a lot of people in the west are actually missing this misunderstanding. but there's a huge challenge in the century about who will dominate, or at least how there could be co existence. do you think the west is quite in my mind, quite blind to all these things. they see very little things they see a tree, but they don't see the forest. what's your reaction? go ahead, joe, i'm not sure we can talk about the west as a whole right now. and particularly in view of what happened with this australian u. k. and us defense back to that, arrogantly trust trans aside. i think this is an anglo saxon issue. britain ruled for centuries, their empire, i mean, and $87070.00. so rhodes said he wanted to bring the whole of the civilized world under british rule, and they were recovered. the u. s. for the making of an anglo saxon race make one empire of the anglo saxon race. churchill, in 1946 iron curtain speech talked about measuring the us and british military
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together. so they would work together with the british empire here. ready saw that the british empire was pretty much over at that point. and he wanted to join britain to the united states. and then of course, britain in $48.00 the last and for spouse time they gave up on an india and certainly $956.00 of the suez crisis was really the end when the united states stood up to britain. that was the final point where the united states took over the relationship and britain decided to join itself to the u. s. empires as an anglo saxon empire. but today we now see the rise of china, its alliance growing alliance with russia. this alarms more the anglo saxon countries than i think britain and france and germany. we saw what happened after the ukraine sanctions. german businessmen were not happy at all about german sanctions on russia. here we see now this deal that took place here in the trailer and in britain and in the u. s. was really big news here in australia before was
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even mentioned in the u. s. because they are, they're joining the big boys in the united states. we see now that france was cut out of the deal. they weren't even told until they read it in the papers that they're deal. if they had went straight from submarines had been disregarded and torn up by the australian and they were now, the strands are not going to get these nuclear power subs built by the u. s. and the u. k. what happened is that france now is even talking about building up the european army. there was a story in the daily telegraph this week that frances, willing to give up. it seemed to create a european union seat up the un security council that had been discussed for those per spun and un for 25 years. that it was an old discussion from more than a decade ago. but of course, britain would never give up its veto, and france would not give up a treat of it. now. britain is no longer part of the you. it will never lose ill keep its vito france as denied this story. but i wonder whether there aren't discussions to the point where, well, i mean,
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but just joe kind of reinforcing my point here. i mean it, when i use the word, the west, i, where we're on the same page here, but we have a very divided west year and greater debate. you got to let me get georgia. i want to go. i can the transfer transfer in germany. now we'll see that and natural partners are russia and china bill after all, they're part of your age or that the western tip of your asia is europe. this may be a real big turning point friends and the rest of europe. that's why we're doing that time dependence from the us. that's why we're doing this program george way. and we have heard here because i, you know, i cherish the enlightenment and so much of the world actually does to a and not post modernism, the nonsense that is coming out of the us right now. but you know, with so many divisions and, and arguments about what a good society is all about. and i see the, the west, it's great, greater sense, very much weekend did not prepared for the challenges that are ahead because the
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chinese don't have those doubts there. and they have no doubts whatsoever. actually go ahead, george. i think it's a very good point. the chinese don't have. on the other hand, the, the chinese model isn't particularly appealing if so the conflict that's taking place now between china and the west and was just, you know, just use that nomenclature for the time being. isn't really an illogical. it's not about right or which system is superior. i mean, the chinese not attempt to export their model and their model isn't particularly appealing to other countries. now the issue is when, when you have a rising power, that obviously the status quo powers will do whatever they need to do in order to restrain the rising power happened, of course, in the case of germany at the end of the 20th century. but the problem was that
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china is facing, is that it's always the is the rising power. but if you are going to be rising, you have to use your power responsibly. and i'm not sure chinese doing that. i may try to go to self into all sorts of quarrelled with its neighbors. leave aside the united states, i'm as good as was neighbors. remember the, the dispute in the south china seas, which went against china, that the world court ruled against china. that was the case brought by the philippines and then we have no other countries in the region, vietnam, malaysia, all of which also threatens that, a china to the world court. so that's a problem that china has with it with its neighbors. and then of course, there is the big 900 pound gorilla in the road, which is the origin zip code. and you know, in millions upon millions of people have died all over the world. trillions upon trillions of trillions of economic value has been destroyed. and then needs to be
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some sort of a proper inquiry about lenny said chime and has become your response to me phone or our silly, silly accusations against other states. and there's no help the rest of the world, which has an right to find out about the origin. but my child gets to the bottom of george and i have talked many, many times about this. it looks like the by the ministration is not particularly interested in finding out about that. here, joe, let me go back to you. i mean, this is not an ideological struggle, and i'm really glad that that's being point out here in, in, in some ways that people are calling it a cold war. it's a cold war coming from one direction and that's the west. but let's put that aside here. i mean, you started out by talking about this nuclear submarine deal and arcos, if that's the way you pronounce it, but the chinese counter with the wrote in belts. okay. i mean, they're much more focused on so many different issues because they see very, very long term. the us seems to be obsessed with military dominance. and that goes
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just so far. but when you look at, you know, the things that china is leaving, you know, a legacy now building ports and bridges and all kinds all around the ration base and, and that cox ok, the number of submarines and aircraft carriers mean something maybe now, but not long term go ahead, joe. valley, but now they're not going to get the submarine. so 24. that's right. one a year from now. but look the english section. empires, like i said, the us and british, they are desperate for just as they have lost what they had for centuries. dominating the world, us is a bully, primarily, and bullies really don't want to fight. they want to just throw their weight around and get their way through intimidation, but of course it's very dangerous because they could have unintended consequences. so this issue of losing the world is falling through their fingers right now, and they could only weigh the united states and britain can respond to the rise of china is true military threats and rearmament. and this is extremely dangerous.
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they need to wake up and realize that they are no longer the predominant power in the world. and then they need to work equally with other states, with china and with russia and with the developing countries. and i don't see that happening right now. they are going down this very dangerous road of militarization of the entire issue. yes, it's not really ideological, it's about power and united states and britain hanging on. do not want to lose this power. it's not illusory, after this time for, for decades. now, this power has been slipping away. we serve inklings of this happening during the iraq war in this, at the un security council, germany and france did not go at the us and britain to invade. right. that was the biggest split since the gall, briefly pull nato french out of nato. that was at the moment when france and germany could have just start looking at going their own way and independent from the u. s. and getting on more equal terms with russia and china,
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and i think that we might be seeing this now this deal has maybe been the last breach. i don't know, they might patch it up, but france is pretty damn angry right now. and they, if they can get, there's going to be new government and germany says, no way of knowing exactly how they would, what that new government would do. but the idea that france and germany which run the european union would, would want more independence from the u. s build up a european, an army, and better their relations with russia and china and quit hurting those relations as europe and dependent on gas and go with what's natural for them. not this artificial american dominance that is, that they have, you should get that yoke off. europe needs to get the alter the well, let me go to one minute before we go to the right. but george, this is something i mean rationally in a real, a sense, this is exactly what should happen. but id all he gets in the way and petty hatred . i would say george, before we go to the break, go ahead. i oversee it is something that happened this alliance is not official creation was created in the awesome out the world war 2. and he just continued on
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also the end of the cold war. and it was a great deal of coercion that's involved. and of course, college is on the part of the european refused to make the important. busy decisions they needed to have made, which was the dissolved nato after the end of the goal, and to work out more sensible, rational policies for their own security. but instead, they're stuck in this global alliance, which indeed can lead has dangerous consequences and have already they just are going to jump in here gentlemen, we're going to go to a short break. and after that short break, we'll continue our discussion on the arc of history. stay with our team. the the
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oh right now, there are 2000000000 people who are overweight or obese. it's profitable to sell food that is pricey and sugary and faulty and addicted. not at the individual level. it's not individual willpower. and if we go on believing that will never change as obesity epidemic, that industry has been influencing very deeply. the medical and scientific establishment, ah, what's driving the obesity epidemic? it's corporate. me look forward to talking to you all. that technology should work for people. a robot must obey the orders given by human beings, except when the shorter the conflict with the 1st law show your identification. we
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should be very careful about artificial intelligence. the point obviously is to great truck rather than fear take on various jobs with the artificial intelligence real summoning the theme in a robot must protect its own existence with the the news. ah, welcome back to cross sack where all things are considered. i'm peter lavelle to remind you about discussing the ark of history. ah, ah, okay,
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let's go back to jo in sydney where it's after 12 midnight again. thank you for the hang up so late. jo. empires don't like to go away. they never willingly go away. ok, and on top of it, empires are sometimes conquered. but just as more often than not, they crumble from within because they are corrupt. ok, they have corrupted leads. they have corrupt goals and they have disrespect for what we'll call today citizens or the polity here. and this is one of the things that what really bothers me because, you know, we, in the american sense, we have american exceptionalism. and that exceptionalism never allows appear, or an equal peer. you can be a little peer, you can pat the u. k. on the head, you can pat france on the top of the head, germany, etc. ok. and now we're at this arc of history right now, because if you want to preserve your civilization, you're going to have to find ways to resuscitate yourself within the,
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this is the argument i've had in george and i disagreed many times on this. but you know, the, the biggest problem, the us, as with china is that the us needs to get its own house in order. and there's no indication that's going to happen. as matter fact. everyone talks about succession cultural civil war. and i don't see that getting any better, and that is not a very good foundation to look at this new competition on the world stage. go ahead . we actually write empires right from within. and there's many, many signs of that happening in the us. but the leadership has been able to fool people so far in the united states that they are the preeminent nation, that they are the exceptional nation that they're better than everybody else. and the public will not see that the defense spending off and spending has taken away the basic dignities that other people in western countries enjoy. like a national health system. for example, you said that money poured more and more in the military and it's destroying from within the u. s. society. and i think it's up to the american people,
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if they ever can to understand this and know that they've been lied to over and over. and over again about america's role in the world that they're spreading democracy rather than maintaining an empire the idea of an empire, something foreign to most americans were so obvious to everyone else. so if the american people could ever see that and wake up and this is kind of our mission consort, news to keep drive at home. what the realities are about u. s. foreign pulse and its impact inside the united states. they alone, i think the american people could force a change in direction, and then the u. s. could take its place as one among many nations, a powerful nation, a country that could still have a major role in the world, but not the dominant. want to not seek to control everyone else and act equally with other nations. that would be what we all hope for, but it doesn't look very good. does it, peter? not at all. and, and george, i mean again, i mean, the fundamental question is moving forward here. is that us, the usaa is predominant in many fields, still has
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a very tight control over international finance feel, but that's dwindling away slowly but surely as countries trade in their own currencies. we have major financial institutions. i m f, world bank still controlled by the united states, but that's being questioned right now. and so, and of course the huge military that, you know, they were you that would speak because i'm a crisis of 2020, but i didn't touch the it never touches the military ever. ever. ok. and we could talk about health care at another time here, but george, can the us ever look at another countries in equal peer? i mean, is it in their d n a to be able to start even thinking in those terms? go ahead, george. no, i don't think so. i think the he who has very much be the so as the greatest the nation daughters created it has a destiny to be the leader of the world. this is universal. i'm all politicians. i mean, even i've kind of
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a politician of the symposium left like bernie sanders the subscribe to most of that. and so, no america will not see others as legal, but this is where it does get very dangerous and where both the united states and china as the rising about have to be very, very careful. i mean, china can make all the points that he wants to about the american hedge, your money, and american aggression. and so, but if, if use a kind of dangerous policy getting itself into conflict with neighbors creating these artificial island ignoring rulings then that could escalate into a serious conflict. i mean, obviously we hope it doesn't, but there isn't definitely a real danger of conflict as there is over taiwan again. you know, all powers have to be very, very careful. and as we've seen in the 20th century intervals before, that great bows often are not capital you reckless policies. they don't take into
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account the interest and motivation of their rivals. busy and get the those into horrific conflict. and it goes to the fastest way of ceasing to be a grade. if you, yourself, it's a long, protracted war that you don't know how to get out of the day. it's go back to sydney, joe the, the issue and again, when you started out with this new alliance against china here, my candidate to respond to georgia is point here is that you have these entangling commitments here. and this is what you could even bolden, a junior partner in alliance. they, well, they were watching and got our back. i mean, again, good. does a farmer and in ohio want to go to war over some rocks, 100 miles off of the coastline of china. see that this is what really bothers me. more alliances you have, the more there's a tendency for things to go wrong. wag the dog, put it shortly. go ahead,
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joe. or you're absolutely right. the average foreman over doesn't really know what the heck's going on because he's not being told the whole story by his corporate media. and he does it. he's still thinks that america's the top dog and they get some, i think, some enjoyment about or identity anyway, american people, many of them that they think they're the best. in fact, the u. s. real quick while they're ahead because the longer they go down that road, the more chances are they're going to lose everything. and the rest of the world could suffer as george punch correctly. it's a very dangerous situation here. so u. s. is russia and china i've been offering? they're not as powerful us militarily. they don't want to war, but united states, i don't think united states wants a war with them. they know what the ultimate consequence of that could be, that they want to continue to bully their way through the china is building and the united states is bombing now. they just lost. they had to leave. afghanistan was never, there's to lose. they, in their parlance, they've lost have dentist and that's a key piece for the chinese belt remote initiative. so as they pull out of that,
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china continues to bring in the rest of the world around infrastructure and development and not to say george had some good critiques of try. there's no question about that. but the united states has to join in this world and join as an equal partner with others. and i, and until they do that, we're all our trouble. we're in a lot of a dangerous situation where things can get out of hand in the south china sea in particular, but there still flash 4 inch in, in europe as well. still. so this is a situation that us people, i think it's in their hands to pressure their government. i'm not expecting that to happen soon to change course that history. it's the writings on the wall is a demise of the anglo saxon supremacy. and that's what this is, and they can't let go of it because they've had it for so long that can be just equal with others and other cultures. other at nist, these other nations. they need to be on top that has to be challenged and defeated
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inside the u. s. for us to be in a more safe and secure world. yeah, but i agree with you, but george, you know, i did a stint in finance and you know, there's, there's one thing that's more powerful than fear. and that's called greed. greed is more powerful than fear. and so, you know, when we look at this, the sub deal, which joe is actually right that they will be delivered until 2040. i mean, think of what's going to happen between now and then. but you know, also you and i have talked endlessly about the, the korean peninsula. i mean, the, the status quo satisfies a lot of people because it's one of the biggest defense outline. i'll lie for the defense of our but they don't want to see that go away. oh, we got a new alliance here. you know, more ships. you know, the thing is this green here blinds people to geo politics and what's, what's good for your own security. here we see that hope this whole shenanigans
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going on with ukraine need more arms that need more return the us how that's going to help you crane. i don't have any idea that fact, it won't. ok, so i mean, the greed of empire is what's driving this. ok. and then we have all the trappings of woke miss with it. go ahead. yes. agreed. and certainly the united states economy has been driven by military spending ever since world war 2. that has been the primary driving force of economy development and the primary driving force of technological development, the computer industry, the internet, everything has been as a result of american military spending. i think that a plurality. busy of great powers is good for the world. i mean, i think, but one of the enduring benefits of the cold war was that it enables a number of smaller powers to acquire leverage in the world. suddenly, you know,
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you may not have much political, military cloud, but by playing all the great rivalries against the great you could, you had a lot of influence. i'm a member of countries like egypt, india, buck, if they became significant play a little well because of the rivalry when the united states and so, you know, something of the sort may well happen now. and ideally, another thing is, joe has pointed this out. if europe can free itself from this artificial nato alliance, your good also become one of the great powers. and that i think that would indeed be a healthy balance among the great powers. and then there will be a great deal of freedom to maneuver so small about that would be able to get that
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much more out of out of the quote than, than is the case now that it's, you know, history sort of against that. i mean, he's just suggest that great, don't like to lose the number one position. and i really enjoyed that number once the premise and he doesn't want to let that go. yeah, georgia middle name should be mentor nick or bismark here. 32nd big 32nd. see your job before we go, go ahead. we had the directors describe and then on a line movement and europe should become non align between europe, russia, china, and the united states on the other side. and he also hit on the key point of what the real serious most important issue in the united states is that the military spending is gobbling up such a big part of the u. s. g d p. and it's been priming the american people of basic necessities and threatening the world. that is what has to change. that is the most important problem in the world right now. the u. s. over spending and relying on the military for their economy, they need to diversify a perfect wage. and this program. ok, but we've run out of time, gentlemen many,
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thanks my guess in budapest and didn't sydney. and thanks to our viewers for watching us here at our to see you next time. and remember cross talk roles. ah ah, man, across the board of the 3rd to focus bittman ball here, but me o, o, o i o god, give me.
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ah, i understand. i oh ah, working to machine, she popped in, she said, well, i'm getting ready to go shopping for christmas. and we, we said there was a good device to another, shooting another safe part of american life shattered by violence. the gunman was armed with a r 1570 automatic rifle. when the issue comes home, it's time to act when we're filing on this issue, the other side wind by default, lady that lived over there. i was walking one of the dogs. why do you wear again,
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were you scared that took it off and i think the people need to take responsibility in their own hands and be prepared if those kinds of weapons were less available. we wouldn't have a lot of shootings and we certainly wouldn't have the number that i the, the headlines and our thank you back. always related protest, new schools and medical facilities with critiques coordination, infringement on civil liberties. also, this is our last year after coming to office, joe biden approval rating slums following iraq to question policy for us president, if not less popular in the previous donald trump and a disgrace, european rule making, condemn spain and d o v. arrest the form of capital and independently to correspond to more initially after 4 years on the run, the rest of them strictly.

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