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tv   Cross Talk  RT  July 19, 2021 12:30pm-1:00pm EDT

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shoes and more, i'm joined by my guess, jordan, samuel lee in budapest. he's a podcast or the guy which can be found on youtube and locals. and here in moscow were joined by dmitri bob, which is a political analyst and editor, if you know me, internet media project or gentleman cross talk roles in effect, that means you can jump anytime you want. and i always appreciate it. i mean, let's go to george in budapest. well, george, russia always seems to be in the news one way or another. whether it's an, it isn't a very different way this time. vladimir putin, the russian president pen to very, very long article, a very studied article. i would say about the relationship that russia has with ukraine now, and it's a, it's at the kremlin dot r u website. it's an english ukranian and of course, russian, it is an enormous outcry and discussion and obviously criticism here. why did he write this article? what's it about and who was directed to go ahead? well, i think the reason he wrote the article is that he's very concerned about the recent
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development of the, particularly since the my down of 2014 mainly the use of ukraine as a battering ram against russia. there's no sign of abating whoever is in the white house. this is continued to be used and he wants to place in his story context. this has gone on for quite a long time, russia and ukraine. the russians in the ukranian, people all want people argue that before and but however, there have been times when outside towers have sought to separate the russians in ukrainians, and particularly to use the ukrainian or russian. you mention the poles unethical. went on to the, the big one which is austria, hungary and german in austria, hungary, in german, essentially created ukraine in the world. and
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what's happening now, we've been kind of continuation of this effort. and he really emphasizes again and again as he has done the pool that he will not tolerate what nato's use of ukraine as basically the kind of forward base from which to launch tactful, subvert russia. and that's really what he's, he's concerned with is just simply, russia will not accept this use of ukraine by nature regard that as an existential threat. ma, what was the direct to because, you know, there's, there's a number of berries out there. i mean, i think there are 3, i think it was directed to the, obviously the russian people. it was also directed to russians within the us, auburn ukraine right now. and also, i think it's ga mentioned here is a signal to the west. the ukraine as very special significance,
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the russians national security and certain things will not be tolerated. go ahead or i think it was primarily written for the people of ukraine at lunch. not only rational, but also radians will also suffer because of this terrible situation. i don't think, would you expect that any kind of reception and you kind of can change your reception from, do you bring him home? and he actually said right before, i can call that ukrainian people are not hostile to russia, ukrainian leadership. now unfortunately, foster russia and they're very responsible, 18 years or president landscape to this article shows that which was no problem. you know, just you just said i will read, it might have time. and he drew something about, you know, russians and ukrainians rather drunk them all kind of add though. and you said, no,
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i see, want me to put you in is the wasting your time. or instead of meeting me though, basically different than what zelinski had to say. when he was campaigning for the ukrainian presidency, has been the very different thing. well, you're certainly asking this seems expectations because everyone knew that he was a russian speaker. i mean, he is common to cobb. his company made money on dogs in russian. they homeless that would be formed in ukrainian and people expected him because he is from ukraine from rock. people expected him to be sensitive to the sentiments, always ukrainians. but it's not the 1st time that it's happened. so, i mean, coach, my problem is to make russian official language in ukraine. i mean the 2nd official language and he received a he is electorate in the east after that basically young coverage progress the
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same and he didn't do anything almost thing and to, to fulfill the expectations. so he's a doctor and so that sounds juliana is not very different from the previous president, but that, you know, the bad side with the was i do it is the walk and, and i think i can wait until writing this article where he basically says the russians and you bring people, he has been waging because he hoped that these feeling the sentiment would express itself in ukraine. but now when you have a drink calling in language rules in ukraine, basically prohibiting the public use or russian language. when all the movies have to be docked in ukrainian imagined, you know, you live in canada. and then someone says, 1st you can't watch american movies for the usa, which say something good about police and on the 2nd, the move is strong,
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the usb will be dumped by our axis with a peak. so awesome, excellent. now, how would people, when kind of it's a tragedy and you know, after 5 years which and finally decided it was time to speak out and you know what, what, what i, what i find very interesting is that, okay, would you say that you agree in some direction, so on people and immediately the reaction in the west was like, oh this is a sign of the period is this is so dangerous, you know, mrs. merkel met by them in washington. you know, last week and she and they said the chinese and i, me and rush is an enemy and this is not dangerously low style. you know, basically, you know, by the said that we will not allow china to undermine all been free society, which open free society did shine the destroy the united states. and you will buy subordinate, co in 2014 destroyed. and the open democratic society of ukraine,
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you know, it is no longer to my credit is suffering and terrible. and these people never apologized for the course they never do in georgia. what i think is very interesting here is that let me approach with, with great detail and a lot of research in time. and i've been told we actually wrote it to but this is a intra family issue that is talking about here. when you look at, when you look at western policymakers, i think we from nato countries, there interesting you, crane or ukrainian is scant best because you, ukraine is from, from the western perspective is a cudgel and burn the russians. i mean, i've always told this people, for many russians, you crave is not a foreign policy issue. it's a domestic policy issue because of the familial relations they have people's relationships to the dom,
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even further into the hinterland of ukraine. and that's why it is so very important to russian for the west. it's just an idea. it's a policy, it's a go ahead. yeah. so that's, that's exactly the point. and that's the point that makes the gain of the game in this article that the western and he says the western part of the century run. you great. i mean, ukraine doesn't be have any sober and it gets mobile because it is run out of washington and brussels. they're only interested in ukraine is as a way of just pushing russia to the east, just eliminating all russian influence out of europe altogether. which is why they're also interested in bella rhodes. i mean what, the, what the scenario that they played out in 2014, in, in my dance, they want to play out the bellows, the bellows. ukraine will be incorporated within the so the need so you can and russia will be just gone and that's the job to go. so they have no interest at
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all in your great approach. and the evidence of that is that, look at the disaster that ukraine has experienced this many 40. i mean they last year is that in this article, it doesn't look to me like interested in getting done backpacks so they're almost lost the dumbass as well native and the year care less. i mean, let's be counter intuitive if they really, really, really cared. they would bring it into the alliance like, but it wouldn't be because of the savings of the ukrainian people and it's democratic experience when they call it the, the revolution of dignity, you know, but they don't, they in that is really, that's the answer. it has nothing to do with ukraine. what do you mean? because it seems to me, again, it was really, they had interest in ukraine. i mean, they never had interest in the people of yugoslavia that had nothing to do with it . okay. they don't care about the people in syria, but they're there. they don't care about the people in iraq, but they stayed there. and then they don't care about the people about began to set
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in there still some they want to stay there or find a way to stay there. again, these are all countries go ahead. well, i don't know, maybe they, i'd seen it themselves. i mean that the nation build us in washington. maybe they don't. they don't want to have good results. but look, look at the fruit. ok. bushnell is now even worse than indeed in the times, or what kind of florida i'm in the privatization where they do faster. you can only leaves off the area. you know, ukraine in the 1st year after my don, it's g d b. i mean big school crania and don't boss, but the g d. b, all the areas which remained ukrainian and this is 97 percent of the ukrainian territory. the g d p fell almost 10 percent because ukraine cob all was almost always economic to russia. it left their free trade zone with russia embrace the european union. european union did not allow them to do its markets. so it's
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a tragedy yet, but also you politically. i think joe, politically, it's a lose lose situation for everyone. in the national interest. you don't need a petrol, wrote an article, had learned how to break the coach or read walk and ukraine, and nikolai petro rights, and that basically it rushes great shift eastward as he calls. and i mean, embrace in china, get him call the train. it was an enormous bush, well, when the last undermined young orange and basically lives always be to speak, made ukraine and russia by the way, put into article. if you look at that, just do it. he says that we agree that ukraine is a sovereign state. by the way, i have to a little bit argue with, with the georgia. i think austria hungary not create ukraine. i mean, even pushed enrolled about your grade in the early 19th century, but certainly did create militant anti ration ukrainian nation. lady,
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bad identity did not exist in the place, but they created it of them independence. they didn't. ok, i mean anyway, there was a short period after the relation when the ukraine was out, but basically ruled by you nationalists. i didn't know the type over a 1000000 to bring in. there says yes, it was created by by hundreds and basically said that your grade isn't the because we don't want to be russia. we won't accept or break, continue our discussion on some real and stay with the ah ah, financial survival guys. let's learn about the allowed,
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let's say i'm a joy and your grief. i'm grief based of the site walk 3 prod. thank you for helping with joy. 6 that way, oh is your media a reflection of reality? in the world transformed? what will make you feel safe relation or community? are you going the right way or are you being that somewhere? which direction? what is truth? what is break me in a world to corrupted? you need to defend the so join us in the depths
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or remain in the shallows. ah, ah, the eastern half of the united states, we're going to have billions, if not trillions of periodical cicada is interacting with tens of millions of human beings in their backyard. oh, my god. obviously some of the cicadas do not very high tolerance for alcohol because they are already passing out are 6 minutes to 400. i mean that's very satisfying.
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the drug started as a way to come back. a great problem. what's the wonder? it's part of the attitude of the nation, not just of north dakota, and it got to be something that you could get elected. this time, the fight against drugs took a tragic, told us that andrew was competing short form. this is way too dangerous for him to be doing. clearly they put him in harm's way. a rural college student does interest get shot in the head and found in a river like that. something else had to be happening with the ultimate to cross topler. all things are considered. peter labelle, this is the home addition to remind you were discussing some real names. the
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go back to georgia in budapest. well, england, merkel, georgia is finally finally leaving the political stage. you know, i have to admit, i had a lot more hope for her in the beginning. mostly for the reason that she comes from eastern germany and i now you play in retrospect, i'll be honest with you. thought that you could be more of a bridge, a beach for between east and west, and i was been proven disastrously wrong. ok. she's been in power a long time and i think she leaves with a pretty scanty legacy about a negative one. go ahead. george. very scanty legacy. it really what she's been about is just saying in power, not making any decisions and tried to have it both ways of old times. so
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she goes to. 2 washington law strict washington. 5 and sign a washington declaration with joe biden, which others, the usual nato pious is about democracy and so on. but basically, what's most important, that name is the call of european security. she's actually here. and then she has the insolence to demand that russia continue to provide a gas via the ukraine route. and so no, no trying to, you know, nothing to do with the use of ukraine as a natural gas. i mean, you know, americans are ignorant about all of this. they were like, it was germany that had went to the russians and says, we want this stream to a pipeline under the baltic because we are worried about the security
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of the actual german industry, which is, you know, basic a power that powerful german economy based on x, well, it doesn't have secure energy, it's a lot of trouble now. she says, well, you know, we're going to hold the russians feet to the fire. well, germany is not in any position to tell the russians, you know, where, where and how they get, just send an actual guess. i mean, so, so i mean, but of muslim she does list. so i just know $32.00, and then she goes off to washington and the rates. the russians are typical of you much chancellor, when there was the legal change of government in but she didn't say a word. did she? ok, i mean, that is why germany wanted pipelines because of e u. nato policy, that just stabilized ukraine that made a different trans that necessary for joe. so i think that is really one of the most of the greatest failings of her chancellor's hip. i mean,
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she botched the ukraine policy. she's trying to save energy policy. you know, there's not germany if you're p and why. ok, so the most again, i thought she came in with great hope. it's this kind of a, a whimper as she goes out the door. go ahead. well i, unfortunately i didn't have the same high expectations for her in 2005 when she came to power because i speak german and i followed the story and 2003. when the counselor get her try that had the courage to refuse to go to iraq and medical was against it. you know, just look at the article, look at her speech and the bone stuck. she said, well, i mean she's kind of so she says something like, we have to stay hold to all american and read your weiss well, you know, translation to normal human language, the math. we had to go that we had to go with them just like old did,
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you know the breeders did, and that would have been a disaster for drugs. so i didn't speak patients for her when she came to our pathology 5, but they discussed the full was beyond anything. i would imagine it was, look, what was, you know, europe when she came to power. there were some meetings between russia and the you you know, that they quoted me was developed and no one dream daughters had night mass about degree crisis, which she handled terribly. you know, basically dispossession a lot of private individuals who had money in on their bank accounts in cyprus, laces. greece, no one could imagine a war and you wore in eastern europe. and let's face it. not only did not say what she actually promoted the mind on her foreign minister guido esther male. it came
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and spoke to the so called protest us who killed 38th ukrainian policeman in the process of this. so cool that last, that actually for almost 5 months, between 20132014 nico at petro, in his article, i think you're very right. you're right that the west repudiated that the peaceful condition of power which was agreed and which was signed on the 22nd of february 2014, immediately after it became clear that critical had a chance to seize total control. the wes forgot about the supreme it was medical was the 1st to forget it was her foreign minister. now the president of germany found while she signed this, she guaranteed this agreement between yano and their position. and now the western media pretends he doesn't remember a portion of it, but they lost the paper. you know, they were when he was asked to produce this document, which people saw signed on television. you know, we just lost,
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i can find the paper. i mean go back to georgia, 2015. they opened the doors, the immigration to europe at that is, i think that is really the hallmark of history 100 years now remember her that issue? yes. because of course, it was the policy, an absolute disaster in itself, but he led directly to the breast that, i mean, if i have not been, she hadn't opened the door. the british was none of them to leave you. and that was a huge calamity for you, because it helped fuel the or bon, who hungary, who now all of the europeans, a little tearing their hair, all this horrible, horrible person, you know, creative, you know, he sees on this issue. he was always a nationalist, but this was that this was, you know, meet him, drink room with him is the things is that she lives every calamity. i mean, she bungled. also leave the energy policy because of the she mostly got to close
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down all the sort of the nuclear power plant. she said, okay, we're going to get rid of all the fossil fuel energy about this. so she, which is one of the reasons why she moved for this not seem to, and now she essentially goes and playing the russians for something that she did. but the strange thing is, is that she has the bible these years. and there you can see the something fundamentally wrong in germany this, this was the some, the placid complacency, like that just survived and goes on and on in georgia. seems to me it's really interesting and we have the mantra for the establishment of nato, after the 2nd world war, and the beginning of the cold war as the keep the americans in the germans down in the russian. she is, that embodies that. but it's not necessarily in the national interest of germany or even europe in my mind, me. and so for me, it's
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a spend force and it's getting negative returns, except for, you know, people making money off of this in western journalism and think tanks and things like that. i mean it's, it's a spent force. it's showing, it's like it's not generating any positive returns. say with you george, go ahead. yeah, i said, and we now look hopefully. well, maybe the next person in away from michael. but chances are the next will be very much like michael will try to have it both ways. well, you know, we need good relations. russia with stability europe. we need to stay with the americans. so that kind of revolution follows the of a demon reverse with gal schroeder, i think a sort of to have some fresh ideas that that's not going to happen. i mean, the game, you know, whoever makes my name is just going to be yeah, yeah let's, let's the next in line speaking. the next person i deem you and i have talked at great length about how media joker europe's political classes. i think the anglo
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merkel is the queen, mother of the mediocrity that we see in the, of the political class. go ahead. well, if you want me to cut the long story short what i dislike about her, what was the worst thing about her? she is a real alter liberal. she sticks to that very georgian, that explains all of her favors. i mean, the look at the political scene in germany when she came to borrowing 2005. no one could imagine that radical parties would emerge. she was a 2 parties system where the liberals between them, you know, the christian democrats at social numbers. it looked like it would continue. now we have the furniture for germany, which obviously reflects the billions of many people in germany, especially good relations with russia and the purely defensive role for nato. but the party has been sidelined,
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i mean the morocco was the 1st time to say that these people are never going to have any influence on politics whatsoever. so she, she basically, she's a division figure, she's the hillary clinton over on germany. that sounds, but the other things the george just mentioned there also variable. i mean, she was the more the sanctions again structure that were imposed after 2014 crisis in you. in ukraine. they already cost europe at least $100000000.00 euros. they want to post more because they keep exchanging these sanctions and during your meetings with the buy them, she basically keeps saying that sanctions need to stay. why should something that doesn't produce reported to i should state, you know, as and also i think she played a very negative role. i represent, you're told that i joined your when trump warning tonight the states as develop,
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you know, the german news ranking know merkle became a sort of leader of the free world because she was so ideal, logically pure. and now when you read the same way though, she spent 4th middle need her, she wants to have no store seem to. she has been, we know, biden is the lead on the world. so i don't just croy just dismissed the people, even those who served with your job. but i contest would be mad to say, you know, this can kind of purity your i think that just complete mediocrity all over the place. muddling through and missed opportunities left and right and create and change to the political landscape of germany a while when demons absolutely right. we have people contesting this ideology and the the, the establishment. and that's all because of merkel over the last 30 seconds. got a huge or yeah, there's always been an opportunity for your 2000 independent role between the
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united states and russia. and, you know, there have been people like my role on occasion before when i did that was a role to quote, anything like that. and actually europe into just a slave of the united states. okay. i guess i think that will be her legacy. all right, jim, and that's all the time we have. want to take my guess here in moscow and in budapest, i don't want to think our viewers for watching us here at ortiz, the next time, remember across buckles, ah ah, join me every thursday on the alex salmon show. and i'll be speaking to guess in the world, the politics sport business. i'm show business. i'll see you then me
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a. ready ready launch crunch class in the person i knew christabel often the song said it was just the culture blue box truly you for once more the the because it's always more you to meet the teacher could contribute that usually. so would you practice and gone? yeah. because really knew from the moment that shamika is humbled. none of my mental charges on
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the news, the people you can see working around me, year old volunteers, he's coming here to try and do whatever they can. those who have seen that live swept away by the devastating floods in germany, tongue on politicians saying it's action they need not just words of support. i've been trying to sort out drinking water for 2 days, but it's impossible. business owners and ordinary people alike feel let down by the politicians hungry, south africans q 4 hours for emergency deliveries, opted looters left nothing to wait when they strip the shelf clean and.

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