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tv   Going Underground  RT  July 10, 2021 10:30am-11:01am EDT

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time allison returns you were going underground, turning up the volume when the stories obscured by mainstream media noise coming up on the show. as the withdrawal from afghanistan by the u. s. appears to see, let's face the latest imperial nation to fail in the graveyard of empires. we ask our sons, former ambassador, china, if a pivot to the us entered superpower, the 21st century is on the horizon, and the head of what would it be in the 53rd birthday of one of the century, the greatest political think as mark fisher, we speak to his friend and colleague, journalist david stubbs, about the legacy of capital. it's realism, art is resistance, and the class dimension of football, just hours ahead of 2 more years, 2020 final, between england and all the small coming up in today's going underground. the 1st on wednesday is showing our interview with the case for my drugs, our professor david not. he made an allegation that newspapers on fairly attacked his family after he was sacked by the british government, including the daily mail and mail on line the mail on line spokesman. has since responded with this statement, the articles some the facts drug adviser,
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david not pictured smoking cannabis on facebook was published on 14th november 29 on male online following a story that originally appeared in the sun. a complaint made to the p b. c. that professor, not son smoking a role up, not a joint in the picture, was resolved on the grounds of headline accuracy. and the article was removed from the site. 2 days later, the levison inquiry took place in 20112012. and you can find that full interview on everything from heroin to cobra, with one of the world's top new or a psycho pharmacologist on our youtube channel. well, the country infamous for opium production has been lamented on native nation media in the past few days. this after us troops ran from afghanistan on the cover of night. joining me now from dubai is that kind of sons, former ambassador to both china and pockets. son, ambassador john moses. i used to speak for afghanistan, foreign ministry, and is now vice president of the hall to major society about that. thanks so much for coming on. so they left in the middle of the night. i don't know what african authorities even thought about the fact they hadn't told the come on is on the u. s
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. base in afghanistan. what do you want you to make of the us military running away the america? the problem is, is a, is a fact. this is something that we knew about for a long time. the question is, what do we do now now that the americans are leaving after 20 years, what is the government going to do? what are the telephone going to do? and what is the region around the finest i'm going to do best? these are the key players. obviously, the united states will continue to have a key role. european union will have to continue have a role other countries farther receive the national partners. donor countries that provide development assistance will have a, a key role to play. but it's basically up to the government, the taliban and the region around the understand that need to decide what they're going to do to prevent the gradation of the escalating violence into not just the civil war, but also regional proxy war that will dry and not just next door neighbors of a major regional power into something that will benefit no one and harm people of
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understand, but also the region around the country while talking about the region right on cue . within days of the withdrawal, there's been the terror on inter african summit. what is the significance of the summit in test run, every single one of the finest $16.00 next door neighbors and all the major regional powers in the broader region. have extremely important ross, a play when it comes to war and peace and understand it on. as the next door neighbor of the country with which we share a common language history, religion and significant common interests both and the security arena, but also in the arena, economic cooperation, etc. iran has an option of the central role to play in support of the piece, boston a 100. but iran cannot do that alone. because get on her difficult relations with saturday, which is another important country in the region,
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not an extra number of an important country in the region. and the iran has to work with pockets, which is the key backer of lavon. iran has to work with india, which is a key backer of the summer republic of the government. iran has to work with china with russia, with this information. republics. it has to work with turkey. but the fact that iran has extended an official invitation. another proficient in the patients and upon the fact that they have accepted that invitation and were in town for 2 days and also interacted not just with the iranians but also with their fellow funds from the islamic republic side. those are very positive signs. but these hazard, disjointed efforts must, who are less into a region wide conversation into a region life and sense as because otherwise as we witness the 900 ninety's, different sets of countries will move in,
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in different and most like the opposite directions. yeah, indeed, the iran is made a joint declaration with russia and turkey against israeli strikes on syria in the past few days. and then we reported reproach more attempts with saudi arabia, but use a iran inviting the taliban. we had the spokesperson child shaheen on this program . people can watch it on youtube channel. he didn't seem to be a head chopper or a stoner of women, or we didn't really get into l g b t q plus issues. has the taliban recently changed or or is that out of band? pretty much the kind of human rights abuses, abuses they are famous for being. that's an essential question that i think leadership development have to answer. it's been very difficult to get the farm to spell out their vision for a peaceful of understand their plan for what you being going on.
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there's still not spelling it out how long of the tool reminding us to, to going on. they've been going on for more than 2 years. actually they've been these talks, not in the current format, but in, in, in different iterations. i've been going on at least since 2013, if not earlier, because that's when the office was initially established. and, and that's when i served in the government, but it's been a few years that i am, i have not been in the government. they were very specific in their negotiations with the american because that was a goal that they had specifically outline the departure of foreign forces. but when it comes to negotiations with the government, the taliban has always stuck to very general principles and general statements, which is we want them to the government. we will honor the rights of citizens including women in accordance with shania and islam. but they have not really gotten into the specifics of what that means so that you see when, when you,
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when you're, when you imagine, as i said, i mean, i says diane, i think most people in the region realize how the relationship with the united states and british governments through proxies in syria, how can the united states be an honest broker in any of these talks? you say that the relationship for 20 years dentist on a pretty complicated relationship, arguably, given that they supported the magenta dean, obviously that formed the taliban in the 1st place. how can they should to the talks just not move, instead of they should be in beijing or moscow rather than more than dough, which is closely aligned to the united states, arguably where these are 2 things. one is the role of the united states or the united states, as obviously as a major world power and responsibility to work for peace and honest. and if they have been a part of the war, they started the war on october 7th, 2001. and now they're leaving after 20 years. so far with little regard to the
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consequences for the people of understanding the region. but this is hardly surprising that with little consequence. i mean, you know, you know, look at vietnam and it's even in nature, nation, mainstream media here, the comparison, it's gone. now, what would you mean, susie? why are african diplomats like you have served for afghanistan in china? and in part is that why, why do you bother with them? some may ask, and some afghans may ask, well, i mean, they have, they have an interest in the region that they have outlined. this is not something that we are telling them they have outlined counterterrorism. guarantees as a key national security interest of the united states related to the region and that they want to guarantee them. they have to work for a peaceful, stable of understanding, a peaceful, stable region. they say they want that, but who finances, the taliban, who finances the terrorism? where are the weapons coming from an american weapons being used against afghan
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officials, while these i mean, these are weapons from all over the place. and that's a discussion that property is to these have to get into obviously the u. s. as to be held accountable and responsible for its actions going forward. and it has to offer the diplomatic and economic support and political support. the president biden has committed themselves to providing for the peace passes and one of them. but it's up to be jane moscow. some about the valley they had on these capitals that mass instead of talking about a peaceful, stable in general terms, they have to come together and define a very specific concrete support mechanism for i'm going to like to do it whenever they come on government and the relevant to, to do that, what you got to do with all these other countries shouldn't be the african people themselves when it's primarily the responsibility of the people. but if you look at the map of this region of amazon as
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a landlord country. so whatever weapons explosives and foreign fighters flow into on the sun, they come through neighboring countries. and so it's the responsibility of these different countries that are parties to the f one war that have to step up that have to make a decision that continued fighting and continued violence is not in their interest . because if there is another collapse, god forbid enough understand another state collapse, then the consequences will be parable for the people. but it, the consequences will also not spare the region because they will be spell over of arizona spent over radicalism, extremism. and also, you know, the consequence that the region will not be able to achieve the common vision that the region find, the regional creativity, trade and transit trade. and, you know, increase prosperity when i get to the prosperity. because obviously, the, the predictable pessimism about afghanistan in the nature nation,
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mainstream media repeats itself, specially after the withdrawal of us troops. how can i get this done cope without us occupation? troops, anecdotally, any person that i talk to from afghanistan seems to say there's been massive chinese investment going on in afghanistan of infrastructure, project of mass strategic projects that hopefully will benefit the african people. he give us some optimism and positivity about that huge foreign investment . right now, going into afghanistan, i think this is a starting point for not just the region because it's not just china that is outside of that spectrum of initiative. and it's for, in hundreds of billions of dollars it's, we have a stretch of projects and then 2 other trades in transit and technology development projects. but it's also india that has its own vision regional regional integration . russia has its own vision 30 of outside its own vision on august on the
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central asian neighbors. they have on prioritize, economic development, regional economic integration, and increased trade transit trade. so this is a moment when all the countries around the sun has come to the same page when it comes to the future of the region, which is one of the common development you didn't mention. i presume saudi arabia saudi arabia has one. but the radio in terms of the hearts of asia region is a little on the on the margins if you like it farther afield. the countries that i outline are either next door neighbors or major regional powers that have outland, specific regional development plans with, with, with clinicians of, honest and so the room initiative, for example, the chinese about line sees of understand as a link t link between the trying to corridor, which as you know is a, is
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a multi $1000000000.00 project that's taking place right now. and the china central asia, west asia, on the quarter, that goes from china to central asia, iran all the way to turkey. and linking these to would only be possible. so that's where the location becomes vital for regional connectivity, not just in terms of physical infrastructure, but also in terms of the goods, people, energy, data and all that. and that's some, that's a vision that will benefit everyone. and for that you have to have a peaceful, stable. and so there is a, there is a, there's a trillion dollar opportunity for the region to work towards peace and security enough on the sun, which is very much afraid of going in the coming few months and mazda, thank you. thank you so much. after the break ahead of what would have been the
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53rd birthday of iconic theorist, an activist smoke fisher. we examine the futures that never were not his friend and colleague, also david stubbs. what the legendary k punk found would have made of corona, virus capitalism. and marxist football. all listen more can we happen to have going underground the news long. when i went to the wrong, why don't i just don't the world. yes to see out. the thing becomes the after an engagement equal the trail. when so many find themselves, well, the part we choose to look for common ground in
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the special ed summer solutions today were talking with john beano of dollars collapse dot com standing right 2021 has been the year of the i word inflation. even the central bank is mentioning inflation, is it transitory? however, as the central bank is arguing, or are we going to see something worse coming forward in the next year or 2? the welcome back to more remarks. what would it be in the 53rd birthday of mark fisher legendary fear? his daughter, political activist, and engineer pioneer blogging under the monica cape punk, seen by many as one of the greatest political thinkers of the 21st century. the influence of his writings on your liberalism, meritocracy, and class cannot be overstated. he was also a football fan, co founding the football blog minus the shooting. so that's been 24 hours ahead of
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the or a 2020 final enjoy. now, but his friend and colleague, david stubbs, david, thanks so much for coming on. i'll get to football in a, in a bit, and my, and my use the shooting for those that don't know who mark fisher is. tell us why is considered by some to be one of the greatest english language thinkers off the 21st century. actually any house know where to begin, really because he called us such a sort of boss. did he just kind of boss terrain in this monumental volume case? he does everything from cinema to renew liberties and he makes these kind of connections, you know, between popular culture and politics that i mean lot of people do that. they did it in such a kind of huge, least thorough go imagine that way when it comes up most months with in this is inspirational despite there's a sense of talks about melancholia and morning spare. and i think that, you know,
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you kind of mrs. that sort of me, per century, they're the same time, he's desperate to kind of been sort of a positivity, a sense of futures and a sense of what is actually possible in a century in which that is kind of being forgotten. so yeah, absolutely. it's just the sheer range sheet energy, she erudition, but i think that entitled to those kind of products. i mean just one dimension of his work. obviously, mental health let alone during a pandemic is become a mainstream concern in new liberal media. just remind is why he would call mental health privatized stress when it was used, the way that phrase is used in the media. well, yeah, i mean, i think from his point of view, it's obviously suffer mental health difficulties. but he didn't regard them as a lot of people do this, just something that is sort of randomly visited and people he regarded it. as you
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can do to this stress becomes the size of that we're living in. and you know, he will pull the id reply all the keys, he's will companies kind of make boss money also as depressions and things like that. the whole industry that and the idea that a system that makes you sick is then you think that was one of the things, the kind of anger and he got open disdain for the mainstream media. so gold and academia as well. well yes, because i suppose so i'm going to start with him in the ninety's and initially did kind of he was slightly young. leftist in the sense in the ninety's. he belong to basically switch, subscribe to what they send acceleration isn't. you know, they didn't, you know, he's, he's sort of thought was about to draw and capitalism isn't going to dom contradictions, nothing ever dies and contradictions. so thank you. second part from left this
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academic thinking in the 900, not in the 990 c. regarding go to dr. mark was anything but dry and he gave us so wouldn't speak. you know, there's a kind of a very, very sort of passion way in which will hold the audience in his hand. when you saw it was not easy start just kind of simplifies with with, with students. some young people are going through this day and age and the privileges that they've been denied that the previous generation had. and i think that's what and tell him to run into the capitalist realism. is that all tentative because i think he, you felt kind of, this is what happened really a generation sort of house blair or whatever, certain kind of pragmatism setting along the block, imposed by the old on to the young. and it's kind of say, you know, reach coming from the people, how do these privileges, expectations of things that you can't obviously anymore lawyer expectations just
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labor and do is hold, despise all of that. he wanted to kind of reignite a sense of the possible. and we went through the night, so we hope is 2 weeks if you just have more than a competence. and what was it like to know him? i mean, his vast references was 11 has to say there's a nod to roland boards and the french folk. philosophers of the seventy's and eighty's. what was it like to know someone so well? read work with him. i was strange him and he wasn't this kind of any intimidating character. i mean, well i guess capital me because of the 1st mentioned metalli's, right? the melody maker, and even though the reader melody major, so you kind of approach me, it was kind of some voice on the way it was great. and his sense of like to have with the, i'm just margin the old. and so suppose my point to be, i didn't feel he was just kind of intimidating presence and he wasn't in any case
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goes to pub together and we chat about all kinds of things, but not necessarily it's the sort of level of intensity that the impulse in his text or, i mean, you know, and so i think he was, yeah, it was definitely was my primary is a friend really, but i mean, i'm like, continental philosophy. he seems he just sounds when you read it much angrier as he relates politics to film and to music of him for those that don't know, melody make up very famous when buster competitor the enemy. he sounds very so much anger in his writing with reference to popular culture and politics. yeah. i mean, you know, just one of the energy use though. i think there's also a sort of sense of optimism as well. as you know, they disbanded there's all kinds of things kind of rolling at the same time. he's writing, you know, it's, it's just hugely usually energetic. my sense is that it's up from depression. the
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actually suffered his instrument sort of black cell work is that it's completely futile when we need it. then everybody's all, i will not be silenced by, i always regard the energy the which is c, as in said, he's crating and he's writing this sort of towering edifices which were tempted based down the condition of his depression. and i think that's in his senses. the meeting, one of the things accounting for his energy, how prolific he was just how much ground he covers. and what do you think? what would they think of artists and writers and painters who still to this day will appear on a tv interview and go. i'm not political, i mean it, as he, as he killed the ability of celebrities to say that i think, you know, i think, you know, everything is political. you know, the idea that there would be even things that operate outside of the political, you know, the politics of their life down here would regard. i mean, he saw absolute insights change roy sometime to go to mall shopping. all i didn't
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see as a potential paradigm as to how the calling is in the future. communism could work. you know, he would think that political in everything, obviously he wrote about labors destruction of working class aspiration has been i have to ask you, what do you think he would make of this new labor leader relatively new care stormer, and some of his cabinet shadow cabinet members who seem jacko, that capitalists realism referred to in that there is no alternative out there. this is what it is we can cut around the edges of bit, but there's no alternative to capitalism. yeah, i mean, i know, sadly i think that some kids tom is kind of resuming where they left off in 2015 and going by the same playbook. and, you know, making the same kind of errors, refusing really to chasing an elderly generation generation expense
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of the young and really giving young people any sort of possibility or confidentiality. something's really believed in now onto the football tomorrow. why you have to remind us why joel? well, that famous snitch of ghost names of people to the british intelligence services of people. he didn't like of condemning them as communist. why didn't he like wells description of football as more minus the shooting? yeah, well again, i think the probably those sentiments replace to stay on the call. so you know, berries, intellectuals, for football, when i was something you did not share at all, football was another great popular passions. he was actually at hillsboro, those begins or nothing or support and he was a nazi and he was at the notting of ours. and when obviously the whole dreadful social events unfolded at the other end, which is linked to policing of the minus strike, which is mentioned in reporting about the hills,
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were inquiring mostly just shows how everything is going little when someone you may read those is the way the current tournament you are a 2020 is being portrayed in wow. hurricanes, amazing green issues. i mean, these are all working class men, young men. why do you think none of them stop to think of why there are no working class men or why the disproportionately hardly any working class brain surgeons or a symphony composes or architect? why does it no one fits up to think that they somehow get into football, but they, they don't bother with those other professions. well yeah, i mean, does it, you know, that's one concerning that, that question, really? it's not. and that goes back to, i guess, you know, university and student grounds this up on that. i mean i went locks it, but if it 950, well, you know, if i went to be nice and you won't walk. so the 1951 that would not be
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a challenge going to offset coming from my background. and 30 is all or 3040 is all i equally wouldn't stand a challenge, you know, in it, you know, it's, i mean, yes, absolutely. you know, those, those questions to be should be res. i mean it, in terms of like, i guess that the question of class becomes obscure because obviously what was weak string li, wealthy nowadays is one possibility. but no, i mean not that is absolutely the kind of question that should be raised. and i think that just one of the things that mark, believe me, no, it is kind of raising questions, especially in connection with popular cultural, everyday culture like whichever and connection to politics in a way that's just simply, you know, by, you know, most common would you would he and you, amused by this take for this big conversation amongst circle mainstream media? talking about garrett southgate marxism in because of taking me in the civil rights
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struggle. i mean the, what's your take on that to be marxism is rather strange. i'm sure that there's just what you can really make the claim or isn't essential decency about this team. and you can even say, well, if they represent a certain kind place, no represent a certain kind of patriotism. you can make an argument in pages and pages. doesn't have to be about kind of flag waving folks of the queen in the background, those singing down to songs or you falling the rain. all of that kind of grace paste isn't, might just simply me, as people at marcus freshman rhymes, certainly have demonstrated through the, through that thieves. it could just mean feeling a duty of care to your community, to your country and making sure that you know that everybody's okay. so, and i think that's something that goes beyond the also the, the kind of like this to the, to even the fact that like, it depends on immigration, you know, that you know,
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the aggressive and immigration policies, the suit that people tell about 2 or 3 players in this accounting team, and just finally i got to ask you, since you're, you've written about electronic music. i mean, do you think that the government will weaponized corona virus. young people further in terms of night clubs and the music industry and popular culture in favor of i suppose opera or art that benefits the status quote will be coming hard and hard. i think a nice even pre kind of virus for young people to find the kind of spaces to enjoy, you know, res, clubbing or whatever. i mean, all precluded by rising property prices. and yeah, i mean, even if it's not an active conscious policy is something that's definitely happening. david subs, thank you. thank you. that's it for the show. will be back on monday don't vaccine apart. i will talk sammons out 2 times. i've asked you to view k is explanation,
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takes center stage, and you gave him the confirmation of prime minister bars johnson's freedom day time until then keep in touch with social media and let us know who you think will in your 2020 ah, ah, people with diabetes to number raises, whether it's not adequately managed or that they have some immune problem. then their risk of infections and something like the coven 19 pandemic, was very bad news. the people diabetes. and we consider it as one of the very high risk situations in terms of people being infected ah,
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the ah, which in good country, when your opponent is strongest parallel to doing between the us pull out from afghanistan and the vietnam war. the mid report, some read captured territories, the taliban once again, imposing severe restrictions under shari'a. russia insinuates germany had advance knowledge of what would happen to alexis violently, as it revealed burne and asked the p. c. w to send a team of employees, an expert on the very same day, the criminal critic fellow on board a plane in russia when it was still far from clear to be sent to a german clinic. the treatment on the plea for help the haitian government asks the us on un to contribute to protect the countries key.


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