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tv   Cross Talk  RT  April 5, 2021 3:30pm-4:00pm EDT

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and i don't think that we should lead against the police these claims from public informant or for political reasons etc i mean science must prevail because for this if you're a deity and their perspective or or of humanity that. i just want to ask ray we've been getting vaccinated for things like malaria and yellow fever needed certificates to travel for years now in normal circumstances most people would say they don't want the government to track and trace them and have more data on them these are normal times do not think that most people in britain would happily surrender some of that in order to get a certain sort of normality back into their lives i think the problem is we've been really really but by and media through this crisis i just sort of highlighted earlier the fact that search nobody's really we don't more to highlight issues around civil liberties and why we need to have jobs a person made a really good point but really even if we have the japanese no guarantee that we
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will not carry the virus so obviously the best way forward is to test and trace i think we all support it when you get into the law against all taking people's medical records in particular who will control that juncture and it's a slippery slope and most of us have a very uncomfortable with seeing that progress in a way that we do not see because a need or just occasion ok m.p.'s will get their say on it thanks gentlemen for joining us anthony webber a wolf and professor marcelo for other dental they could have you on tape thank you cross talks up next here on r.t. international. problem drugs don't always come from unscrupulous dealers but from pharmacies to in every state in the united states we see me very sharp increase in the number of people seeking treatment for addiction to prescription opioids it invaded america
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under the banner of medicine persisted with the pain but instead of trying to wean him off though she did. after a dose after dose after dose and really became his drug dealer so who's to blame patients doctors manufacturers all the governments. hello and welcome to crossfire we're all things are considered i'm peter lavelle ukraine is back in the news and not in a good way escalating rhetoric could lead to more conflict within ukraine who is
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driving this impending conflict in and why or is this all about isolating russia. discussing ukraine i'm joined by my guest llangollen in the search he's the director of the crisis research institute and here in moscow we're joined by dmitri bomblets he is a political analyst and editor in us me internet media project originally across the uk rules in effect that means you can jump in anytime you want and i was appreciated when i was going to work for some uk search market there's a lot of dangerous. reckless rhetoric i would say going on about what's going on within the ukraine and ukraine russia relations here we have. the united states talking the defense chief they're. going to his counterpart in ukraine nato is making statements here of course russia is acting in
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a provocative way which that's what they always say here i mean are we in the fog of politics at this point here what's going on and what's the is there any sense to the timing of what's going on here go ahead mark well i think there are so many issues which ukrainians bring still bubbling to the surface the local issues including with him we read in groups in your crighton so that the more radical nationalist groups see i mean tension with doma as a way of emphasizing will need to abolition with me or with national schools of just trying crackdowns when people are critical of the government policy about 6 some kind of compromise solution. and there are people in the west who. i think mistakenly think that it's important to expose the russian aggressive designs by raising the tension and perhaps or even some cynics who think that if there is a renewed conflict in the dome it will more broadly go to princeton scope with north stream gas line through the baltic to germany and russia will things the
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danger it seems when the situation turns into more. religious groups as well as regular force somebody to do something very stupid sets off a spiral out control and. because people are being accustomed that's what's going to happen it also plays into that bank so i think it's very dangerous to be going on one when one of us is all the people in the west the washington trying to restrain ukrainians are always essential what we tend to wicca with obama's period when all this was wrong or quite common to aggressive forward posturing and what trump all of his rest request was not impact. inclined to actually get involved in cold. cyndi lauper of his not a person prone to hyperbole but he is quoted as saying that if there's a new military conflict in ukraine's east it could destroy the sovereign state of
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ukraine that's a remarkable statement to be making here it shows that the russians take this extremely seriously go what is your reaction to the foreign minister's words well the last time we heard this rhetoric from moscow was during that whole car won't come up you know 2 years ago where there was a real danger that ukraine would escalate while the games took weighs just you know hundreds of miles from the border you know in the last off so that president putin in order to prevent any assault off stupid actions from one of the. greenside said that all of these might be and than all of your ukraine and then the palestina of and of course you didn't mean the brushwood occupied once you meant that this would finally split to the ukrainian society because according to object you opinion polls in ukraine not more than 17 or 18 percent of ukrainians and that includes
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nationalist western regions more than 18 percent of them support military action in indoor must support an attack and basically the last all honest opinion poll was published in ukraine 55 percent of the people were for negotiations with the authorities in don't ask kind of people's republic so i think the message from our overall was that you know don't do anything stupid them i'd have political consequences for you when you buy you a but you know think about your future think of your country before doing something fatal and basically if we woke at the rhetoric from the ukrainian side you know there is do believe. because by then find a date for the phone talk when the presidents are then ski so it creates an impression that the horse collision was
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a boat attracting attention was abolished somehow condoning for the scenes order against you when he talked to widely do president trump. you know more than one year ago and we remember you know that was a sickening conversation because zielinski is is a viceroy of the united states in ukraine and the tragedy of the tragedy over ukrainian us relations is that both zielinski and the former prosecutor general sam call they didn't understand american politics they thought that was really the president they thought that he was rude in the united states which was. mistake. and there is so it was that basically a stock that spewing out compromise on the former american ambassador in kiev a merry go on it basically it was not a compromise it was all true if you know she wasn't all there in him what to do but she didn't understand you know i know it was an enemy trump but they didn't mean
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that he won't be our thanks to my trump and giuliani trump and doing any isolated in the united states so now suddenly it won't sound all that former prosecutor general here crane felt a sudden pressing need to study english and one of them and then he create his job and now he's in london or somewhere else studying english as he learns he made the same mistake you thought that crumples for you the president of the united states you talk to him politely and that cost him dearly so now i think that the period of penitence is over are buying a stock and pursue my game oh no the braves have a good point that's a really good point mark and he is so and you misunderstood as beamer has said i mean this understanding by now as well because there's a lot of you burning because the landscape was elected is basically being a reaching out being much more open to potential conversations with russia
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obviously he did well in the elections party did well in the election. as an end because it was russian speakers in the east that say we're going to get this guy i mean is he just given up on all of this or the people that he's depended upon they've given a bonus here because it seems new with his years reverence seems remarkably change or is it because they can't get anything done and will be no nonsense theory is the only thing you can do you know i think i think the tragedy is alinsky is that he had such a launch majority and he acted decisively in the famous. in might have been able to do some things that would have shifted every day. from ukraine every call me in a better direction the common situation is not our problem but instead there has been stagnation from trying to hold things that are afraid to say ukraine ever since independence one of the most terrible statistics about ukraine is that life expectancy has been polling since 164. i'm not even
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a russian i like expectancy of repricing it was a courageous like your sense about but still we have. ukraine is still in a sense in a late soviet crisis a society into chaos immigration and all of that is a hope by a string of national issues because it doesn't solve many ways if you want it's great to stay where you crank the best way was to create a better moment situations are most people would say is a good place to live where as long as you have all these problems by the way in the fall west you shouldn't forget. the. sputnik moment. crying the pulse of ukraine used to be in select liverpool so what will. all of those interesting things will stall in traits of turgeon years that you very much irredeemably ukraine and crimea ukraine that's. getting back many of ukrainian nationalists in the west some stall in the me since the ukrainian. great and more
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recently benson it's become a kind of a passionate identity that. has to be. international fact it's the. national rivalries and disintegration. so we have people saying with some extent in the political situation after an election suddenly these relatively small numbers smashmouth. well on that. very question become key players again because they are on the streets where people have to work when people say that the police dissolution they'll feel like demonstrate exactly who's demonstrate. and so we have a sense included let's. yes. and now he's back playing with the oligarchs foreign funding the i.m.f. from there and so on and all of that in the end is not actually going to really encourage him don memories ukrainian color suffer yeah the sat back to the matter is that people don't want to recognize particularly policymakers on the west that
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there is a. solution without a nation and ukraine that's why it doesn't work ok it's that his rhetoric is very artificial he may have had was recently in the. government shutdown a number of russian language television stations in this ridiculous language law where you have to when you're talking when you start talking with some you have to negotiate which language you're going to speak and if you don't you would properly place on which people things many people think that some rights violation quite possibly is. how the russians looking at all this. because you know i was going through suggest everyone here to look at moon about bama yes wonderful article about how many times russia has made provocative with its military every year of this time of year they have exercises and of course the western media picks up and talks about it is being aggressive when it is this very routine thing but the russians are not fools in listening to what people are saying in the west and
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listening to what ukrainian politicians are talking about and everyone know who is or should know is that up to 14000 people were killed in that don ask your wheel legal change of power in 2014 so people in don bounce certainly are concerned go ahead oh well just in all that on the stand how russians view of this century i think we need to destroy a few myths which are continuously on the western media you know more of these 46000000 who craniums when you in your brain know that indistinguishable cross i mean talking to a person from key. i would have difficulty tell you east. moscow most of ukrainian speak russian better than war but your with historical accent you know sultan russians have few cracks on than most of the people even in ukraine so they are our people you know that's the perception of russians you know talking about cranio russia by the crimea i think historians will have to moral will remain
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there has all of this you know crimea has been a part of russia legally since 1785 since the united states exists crimea was incorporated into russia by catherine the great you know the famous or infamous by john can be just spread out mediocre amy in my desk so you know that's the this is the joke that the west must like to tease russians with well if you don't concede up i don't going to be we're just russian and then stop using that stupid joke they were ukraine and it would have the judge agree with me that it was great and after that sort of break we'll continue explaining this about ukraine and russia after a break stay with no. one else seems wrong. but all the world just don't call. me the world
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yet to see palin this day become active. and engaged because the trail. went on many find themselves worlds apart we choose to look for common ground. welcome back to crossfire where all things are considered i'm peter lavelle this is the home edition and we're discussing ukraine. ok let's go back to him in moscow you were explaining a number of myths that you wanted to dispel for whether or not go right ahead so i
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think historians of tomorrow there will be a renewed their hands over this issue or you know how come that suddenly the western media makes certain you sure saw them sort of inflamed you know they haven't been in plain for 1000 sometimes hundreds of years and now they're playing by all the court has been a part of china for 4000 years suddenly you know we can't just allow it to be like the rest of china you know we need to do something great me and has been a part of russia since $70.85 and then you can be just as oh you know we lived with gray mia russian for almost 300 years but we currently with no you know crazy media is ukrainian where i get to wage a war to prove that it is ukrainian so you know it's like the witch contadino of the which did not take place in the middle ages it's suddenly started in the 60 the 17th century and this is him explicable to me i mean no when people have so much
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information when they have access to television computers they don't know understand certain things you know just like people in the 17th century of who are almost all literate suddenly started believing in witches you know this is in explicable and the same story with basically and with this deterioration of the situation in ukraine in the east of ukraine you know when people in it in the united states and europe say or you know who crazy wanted to leave russia and russia doesn't want to do it come on russia lead ukraine become an independent state in 1001 you want without a single shot you know he's asian no fair mind in ukraine who is yelland more stuff about the famine in ukraine the west of ukraine which in $1000.00 surge you during saddam's going to do as asian was part of poland and hungary and did not leave through as you know it is there probably russian separatists in the east. who lives for the family. or their ancestors so all of these myths there are so deeply
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entrenched in western psych that it's very difficult for us russians do explain you know we know certain things we know. they see them would take them for granted by the west the narrative is completely different from create and the problem is that in order to stay in the drop in the american media you have to feed the ideology you don't have to fit the facts and they continue distorting the facts and sometimes these distortions lead to real wars like the belief that saddam hussein was crazy and was trying to get weapons of mass destruction or that qaddafi was going to rape all of libya or you know this idea that somehow crimea just come clean inside russia this is unbearable and he has to be stopped and you meet the great russian who is well here a martyr and you want to bring i think one of the things as well saying it was mentioned. early on a this group of russian kazakhstan as much as in your credit senator but many in
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congress and on his plane not. communism not the ideal of the waste all that implemented it but russia and so we have. the whole succumbing to some or all when saying it was not your which was super super mash. well i mean this is a this is about are going to be a suspect where you you term a religious argument you were into an ethnic program enough or some group of people is inherently by we'll get to the problem rather what are some. very important one that's a triumph of western liberalism isn't there because i think it's very important what mark has just said because many russians make most of the same mistake now and they take that ide you'll enjoy ultra liberal as in which is destroying the west itself no they take it for some kind o. an inmate component you're all anglo-saxon open. i think it's a big mistake and people i've quadrille friend putin are not suffering from it
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they're who can afford dialogue and they don't understand why the dial cannot be stopped that you know a lot of several interviews last week which are basically just desperate he just reminded people you know before why don in 2014 there were a summit meetings between russia and the european union twice a year you know and there were cancelled by the european union so you know there is no add by anglo-saxon same comment in the russian elite now just historically for for the last 30 years but no i think the main thing for us russians is not to make the mistake which mark has just described as new size that ideology that we have now in ok well it's going to switch gears here a marcum one way we can look at the timing of this is. this war of words is a ratcheting up of rhetoric but it is the new administration in the united states and it's populated with very powerful people that were in the obama administration
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i'm thinking of. the secretaries they blink in of. victoria nuland is bad people are not. jay celebrant all of these people were there 1st of all they're all russert russia gaiters ok and one could say no and if you look at lincoln's senate confirmation hearings i mean in the end you he presented a unfinished business approach to syria and ukraine here is this a coincidence go ahead no i think i think that's right we don't want broccoli unfortunately it's back to the future isn't it the west saying the same goal. supporting her on an insurrection against america which would need great repeats or a government that would make ukraine better that's what they thought would have are the terms or action in syria we're going to talk more assad and something better and more and. and i fear we will now see this also in other places and problem for
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me is from west mills is quite often it's true that a regime but the idea that our interventions that make sure the lessons we experience yes we should be very cautious we should be like doctors and not just will do no harm unless i'm willing to acknowledge our mistakes and we saw this one from and some of them met the chinese foreign minister. but that completes insensitivity to the fact that there are some criticisms of the west that have you heard that made by people who are not by any means model democratic. i mean this refusal to let somebody who you disagree with might know less have a point. is well let me. but wasn't that the precedent during the cold war i mean obviously it was a very intense ideological conflict i mean it couldn't have been clear but there was mutual respect i mean there was even the great stephen cohen who recently passed away and said you know and we you know we try to put ourselves in their
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shoes to see how they saw the world that's not happening right now and i think it's interesting thing for me he switches over to diem or is that you know the cold war was an ideological conflict but there's another conflict now but only one side is ideological ema well i would say the united states no and unfortunately the european union do they remind me a lot of their. you know soviet union or the seventy's and atheists on the later soviet union which was not comfortable which was somehow more or less humane you know the united states and they you know remind me of all that earlier soviet union which didn't believe in it's a goal which and which was dangerous for the hall because of these belief you know and these ability to can go on radio national years if it serves my ideological interest that was very common for that and that is very common for the united states and for the you know i mean please note. you know if you look at
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the statements from the ukrainian nationalists if you look at their actions you know the west should be against them because they're real racists you know believe in their bad cross laws while russians are a mixture of tavares and finno-ugric tribes you know the same with croatian fascists you know when they fought against the serbs but it's interesting that i do a widget sometimes allies itself do that was a war just nationalists who was ridiculous if it fights what it considers to be a big dangerous country because what is a big country like china or russia where you with lana you always. minority just incident or you have just conducted neighbors or have on several squaws with these big country so it's amazing how ultra liberalism was in the united states and in the european union. how they condone any kind of radicalism any kind of racist talk all of it comes from elyse in fight in the big countries you know they're.
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muslim fundamentalists some of whom ford in syria you know the gradation fascists you know the ukrainian nationalists they all give basically a blank check from the united states you know the current actions so who are extremist nationalists in kiev just look at the pictures of what they did to is enhanced his office you know and you minding a continuation on war in ukraine well they were basically given up by their prosecutor former prosecutor general said to whom i mentioned he said 3 years ago left me cold any at their record against a ukrainian nationalist activist will be considered an attack against the ukrainian state itself and so that was the police your brain you can root out you can call for hooch an hour a new russian influence that's a lot but don't you dare to touch the so called activists and the western media call them activists nope not saying what is activists. insulation is art instead
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insofar as they recognise the simple report these things happen i think the real problem is not so much there are. actually ignorant some refusals companies so princes and lack any progress demonstrations or make you monumental troops with these people are never reported so in some places france is a problem consider what are the west. look elected because they don't conform to it whether brussels but if whether from bulgaria to let you raise your hand the brooch was a mere open. there are days almost whatever the commission wants to do what you are . letting this is a great problem it's for the public for the public for the rest of america since the reporting of the it's that they would know the stones. and if you mention them across the org which is also it's russian propaganda we're not saying. well those
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media i mean i guess if it was just propaganda goebbels like propaganda it would have no weight but i was aware and i just recently read in and you spent by i don't know if it's true or not i think it was in the new york times or in the frantic council of radio free europe resume its broadcast on hungary you know on. their orbits authoritarian government back to. interviews a member of the e.u. hungary's amount olmedo by all the ideologically your against the mainstream radio free europe will be to you in the community so it's really quite interesting is that i really like eunice analogy you know the early soviet union because that was because it was all about a purity test and this is going it's gone down due to everything as a purity test and if you moralize your or i'm always see meaning in your interlocutor doesn't agree with you about that by definition there immoral i mean this is what we have got down to used to be about geopolitics now it's about ideology gentlemen that's all that that we want to thank my guests here in moscow
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and i think our viewers there watching this year r.t. see you next number remember. problem drugs don't do is come from unscrupulous dealers but from pharmacies to in every state in the united states we see a very sharp increase in the number of people seeking treatment for addiction to prescription opioids it invaded america under the banner of my. persisted with the pain but instead of trying to wean him off though she just goes at their dose after dose after dose and really became his drug dealer so who's to blame patients doctors manufacturers it's.
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fresh protests in europe a coded restriction that's mixed messages from governments leave people confused and angry. we go where we want recounts come together we can see our loved ones anymore and we think there's this sort of you against all fundamental human rights . crimes in the united states center in california the state by far the worst affected opens self-defense classes for the most vulnerable. and another scandal hits u.k. supporters questions are raised over a probe into 2 british olympians.

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