tv Hallie Jackson Reports MSNBC January 21, 2022 12:00pm-1:00pm PST
deon, hand it over. now how does that make you feel? like a part of me is missing. gabrielle? this old spice fiji hand and body lotion has me smoother than ever. that's what it does. ♪♪ breaking right now on msnbc, the library is open as we're learning more about the more than 700 pages now handed over
from the national archives to the january 6th committee. plenty of reading to be done and new details coming in almost by the minute with new reporting from our capitol hill team about just what's in these documents and what those lawmakers specifically wanted to see. including, they hope, draft speeches from january 6th for then president donald trump. they asked for a never enacted executive order on election integrity and a memo on a potential u.s. lawsuit against president biden's 2020 win. also breaking this afternoon the nationwide pause on a federal vaccine mandate with a judge blocking enforcement on president biden's requirement for federal workers. the white house press secretary just asked about it, we will have that coming up. and right now in texas the first court appearance for a man arrested just hours ago charged with threatening elections workers and other officials in georgia, including the governor and secretary of state. the prosecutor saying this guy posted a message that it was, quote, time to kill, just a day before the capitol insurrection. we're live with more on that and
the court appearance in just a second. i'm hallie jackson in washington, on what is shaping up to be a busy friday afternoon, nbc's leigh ann caldwell knows that well, she is on capitol hill, we're joined by jake sherman of punchbowl news and msnbc political contributor along with nicholas wu. leigh ann, let me start with you. these documents that have now been turned over to the january 6th committee, tell us what we've learned because there is some more clarity on a big question that was out there, what did they actually want? what did they think was in these documents? we still don't know for sure, but lay it out. >> reporter: no, it's 700 pages worth of documents that the committee has received less than two days after the supreme court cleared the way for the january 6th select committee to get these documents. we have a little bit of insight into what the committee wanted from these documents. they laid this out in appeals court and specifically and some of the things that they detailed include press secretary talking
points on allegations of voter fraud, election security and the 2020 election. presidential activity calendars related handwritten notes relating to january 6th. a draft text of trump's january 6th speech at the save america march. so these are just the things that the committee knew was in these documents and they presumably learned this from the interviews they have already received from nearly 400 people. so they had some idea of what was in here, but that's just a small fraction, again, it's 700 pages and this is critical to the committee's investigation, hallie. >> jake, when you talk to sources about this what do they think could be potentially the most damaging inside of these documents? >> you have to read between the lines here. they've put out the letters looking for interviews, basically saber rattling in a accepts. they say here is what we know, what we already have, would you like to color within the lines here or do you want to let
somebody else tell your story? now they have contemporaneous accounts from january 6 and from the days leading up to january 6th from people who have already participated on their own volition and who have been brought in under subpoena. now, documents are irrefutable, hallie, this is a massive victory for bennie thompson and liz cheney. documents have not be refuted. these were documents that came out of the white house, there is no way for donald trump or his allies to say, those documents are fake. these are documents that his white house has filed with the national archives. so these are incredibly important. but, remember, this committee already has a ton of stuff. if you look at the -- if you look at this from a prosecutor's point of view, i was just talking to somebody about this, they started on the outer circle, people who were in the outer orbit of donald trump's world and they are now working their way in. we've now gotten to a request for kevin mccarthy who says he won't participate, ivanka trump who has not said one way or
another frankly whether she's going to participate, and so you're seeing the circle get closer to president donald trump and vice president mike pence. so if i were sitting in the trump camp today i would be quite nervous about what this committee is going to come to conclusionwise and, listen, that doesn't mean that everybody that's testifying to this committee knows things about january 6th but it does mean both the people we know who have spoken to this committee and the people we don't know who have spoken to this committee have given over a lot of information and detail. >> nicholas, as significant as these 700 pages could be there could still be more to come, right? >> absolutely. this is just the tip of the iceberg, this first tranche of documents that the committee had requested and the archives had identified and they were working through as being responsive to this whole request. so, you know, we're just starting to see the -- all the parts of this whole trove of documents. as my colleague betsy woodruff
swan had scooped one of these documents turned over was this draft executive order for the president to have the department of defense seize voting machines as part of this probe into election fraud. so, you know, there's hundreds of pages here, it will take some time for the committee to go through that and then we do know that all of this will be public at some point. so the bottom line is the committee is trying to get to the bottom of this. as jake said, and as we've learned from previous congressional inquiries, yes, people can -- people will spin things one way or, you know, talk one way in the interview, but documents cannot be refuted. >> a false of set of electors from 2020, walk us through this. >> yeah, the chair of the committee bennie thompson told reporters yesterday that this is something that they're interested in.
now, let's move back to january 5th, a year ago. nbc news foiaed the archives to get this false state of electors and the archives did not send over the specific documents but it did confirm that there is five states who did send over an alternate slate of electors, including nevada and arizona and michigan and georgia, but the archives did not send those over to the congress because they were not real, they were not certified by the states, so they stayed at the archives. so something that the committee is interested in is what role did the former president have in submitting these alternate state of electors and who else at the state level was also involved. so this is just one more of the many, many layers, hallie, that the committee is interested? >> talk about the potential fallout of that, jake, the january 6th committee looking into this. >> reporter: could we just talk about the general fallout of all of this.
the general fallout of just this entire probe is remarkable. i mean, we've had -- think about the dynamics that are at play here. you have a committee looking to talk to kevin mccarthy, a man who could be speaker come next year, not guaranteed, could be. jim jordan, who could be the next chairman of the judiciary committee. the president -- the former president's daughter who was a senior advisor in the white house. and i will say, i mean, the implications for congressional oversight here, the standards that are being set, the precedence that are being set are going to be wide ranging here. imagine if kevin mccarthy is subpoenaed and doesn't come to this committee. what does that mean for republican investigations in the next congress if republicans are in the majority in divided government when the republicans are vowing to investigate everything joe biden has done? so just -- this committee while it's important i'm not -- the january 6th insurrection was massively important for our democracy, but when you're
talking about in this building, the precedence that are being set seemingly every day will have an impact on congress for decades to come. >> nicholas, how do you see this fitting into the broader scope to pick up on jake's point here? what do these developments signal about the direction that the january 6th committee is going here? >> well, it shows how the circle is closing on president trump. for the committee to call ivanka trump before -- although it's not entirely clear whether she'll come, it shows a big arc getting closer and closer. you saw the subpoena of close aides to eric trump, donald trump jr., i believe. you saw the panel, you know, request, you know, wide-ranging documents from the white house and are getting them now. so -- and you've seen the chairman say that they would be interested in talking to former vice president mike pence. at some point a decision will have to be made on whether or not they will call a former
president before them to explain his side of the story. >> there's always just to get to you all before we go here this new reporting that nicholas "politico" has about a white house document prepared for donald trump on january 7th but never read, it's titled "remarks on national healing" and it says i'd like to begin to address the heinous attacks that took place yesterday at the capitol. for those that engaged in acts of violence and destruction you do not represent me, do you not represent our movement, you do not represent our country and if you broke the law you belong in jail. that is -- to call that stark contrast from what we actually heard from former president trump in the hours and days after january 6th would, i think, be fairly called an understatement. leigh ann, how do you see it. >> reporter: absolutely, and that's why this information is critical to the committee. they don't only want to know what happened and how things played out, but they also want to know what the alternatives were and why the former
president didn't take these very different routes of trying to, for example, like this instance, try to bring the country together, in instead he did the opposite. >> thanks to all of you. we really appreciate t. we have a lot more coming up on this fallout from what happened on january 6th and generally the 2020 election with breaking news out of texas. the man charged with threatening elections officials making his first court appearance. we're live on that. plus, some news developing just in the last couple minutes out of this building, the pentagon. what they're now saying they will do to try to fight the pandemic. and democrats ramping up to maybe rebuke one of their own, the arizona state party gearing up for a meeting on one of their senators, i will let you guess which one, it's the one we're showing on screen. we will talk about that in a second. 're 're showing on screen.monthly add-on treatment for severe eosinophilic asthma. not for sudden breathing problems. allergic reactions can occur. get help right away for swelling of face, mouth, tongue, or trouble breathing.
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court did the same thing to the president's mandate for big businesses, that vax or test requirement. that judge citing the supreme court ruling and blocking the mandate for those bigger businesses. the white house seeming to sort of brush it off, saying 98% of federal workers had already actually complied by this point. i want to bring in josh letterman. josh, another -- i don't know if you want to call it a set back, but it's obviously not something that the white house would have wanted to see, certainly they would have preferred for it to go the other way, although you did hear the press secretary jen psaki in the last few minutes say, listen, most of the federal workforce is vaxxed any way. >> reporter: it feels like it's two steps forward, one step backwards. the biden administration had just gotten this small silver lining of the supreme court saying, no, you can't mandate this for all large employers, but, yes, it is okay to mandate it for health care workers at facilities that take medicare and medicaid funding. now this judge saying that it is a bridge too far in his words to
say that millions of federal employees should be required to undergo a medical procedure simply because the federal government wants them to. no now, we know that the biden administration through the justice department is expected to appeal this ruling and jen psaki, the white house spokeswoman says this they are confident in their legal authorities here, but you're right, it is just one more reminder of the obstacles that biden has been facing as he is trying to get more and more people vaccinated and he is finding that those tools are not available to him the way that he and many of his attorneys had expected, hallie. >> josh lederman live for us on this. real quick, what is the practicality of this ruling by the journal if so many workers are already vaxxed that work for the federal government. >> reporter: that's right, there is a small number, basically 2% according to the white house of federal workers who would otherwise be required to either -- to undergo vaccination or a rigorous testing regimen.
this ruling now says that that can't happen, although of course the administration is going to appeal it so they're going to try to get that put back into place, but for the time being the administration is not able to go ahead and implement and enforce that requirement for those millions of federal workers. >> josh lederman, thank you very much. just in the last hour, we have to get to other breaking news. you had this man in texas charged with threatening election officials, making his first court appearance. that's after he became the very first person ever arrested by the department of justice's new election threats task force. we are talking about chad stark, he was arrest this had morning by the fbi and here is the deal, officials say he put up an ad on craigslist just one day before the capitol riot calling for the killing of several georgia elections workers, allegedly saying it was, quote, time to put a bullet in one of them, as well as federal and local judges, two other election workers, too. the task force was put together in june by the doj because of more election threats cases coming up after the 2020
campaign. i want to bring in justice correspondent pete williams. >> reporter: remember what was going on in georgia at the time this ad popped up on craigslist. this was the day that georgians were going to the polls to vote in the senate runoff election and according to the fbi this ad popped up on craigslist offering $10,000 to shoot georgia election officials and other officials. it also said it's our duty as american patriots to put an end to the lies of these traitors, it used the word exterminate in the ad and said one good loyal patriot deer hunter in camo and a rifle can send a clear message. he is charged with sending a threat in interstate communication, that is a federal felony, can be punished by up to five years in prison. this is one of the first charges to come from a justice department task force that was set up to investigate these very kinds of threats against election officials that had just ee plowed since t p lking at so
850 threats like this nationwide, hallie. >> wow. pete williams, thank you very much for bringing us up to speed on that. still ahead this hour, why republicans want to create an election police force, even though there is no widespread voter fraud. we will talk about what that might actually look like at the ballot box. first, the secretary of state on his way back from meeting with his russian counterpart and no promises that country will not invade ukraine. counterpar the journey is why they ride. when the road is all you need, there is no destination. uh, i-i'm actually just going to get an iced coffee. country will not invade ukraine. this one time, but usually -- no, i-i usually have a destination. yeah, but most of the time, her destination is freedom. nope, just the coffee shop. announcer: no matter why you ride, progressive has you covered with protection starting at $79 a year.
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that make the difference. >> andrea mitchell is joining us, our chief foreign affairs correspondent, who is live for us in geneva. we're also joined by angela stent senior advisor for the center for eurasian, russian studies at georgetown university. andrea, no breakthrough, but talk toe into what you're hearing about at least lowering the temperature here. >> reporter: well, lowering the temperature for now. the talks were, quote, frank, candid, so they were tense, but they haven't moved off their positions, their basic positions. blinken has agreed -- secretary blinken has agreed to respond in writing as foreign minister lavrov is demanding to the vladimir putin proposal, the treaty proposal, that would require basically tearing up the nato charter, which angela knows so well having worked for
admiral stavridis, basically reversing decades of nato doctrine since the nato expansion and that's not going to happen. it's a nonstarter. so in writing they may say so, but they'll also according to blinken's comments to me, they're going to propose ways in which the two sides can work together on missiles, on confidence building, tests, mutual, you know, military exercises. so that there is better communication, more transparency. now, that has been suggested before, but they're going to put it down in writing and the president is going to have meetings, some by video, but other members of the national security team at camp david this weekend to get a debrief from tony blinken, i know he's going to be in touch with his cia director bill burns who was just in ukraine in berlin at nato last week in talks with incident
counterparts to try to share as much information as possible to answer the question nobody can answer, is what does putin want? what does he want out of this crisis? until secretary blinken sees evidence, the u.s. sees evidence that russia is deescalating in answer to one of our questions, it hasn't really lowered the tension. we still have more troops going and we now have troops coming as well in the north, russian troops working with the troops in belarus, so basically ukraine is surrounded by three sides and it's not that it necessarily has to be an invasion, it could be some kind of hybrid attack, aggression by any name, cyber or whatever is aggression and that is something that the u.s. says the allies will respond to. >> andrea mitchell, glad to have you staying up late for us in geneva. thank you for that. safe travels back to washington. angela, as andrea talked about you were senior advisor to admiral stavridis when he headed up nato. he talked earlier about how he
believes vladimir putin has painted himself into a corner. what was the diplomatic offramp here in your opinion? >> there has approximate to be an offramp where putin can somehow claim victory. now, since he controls most of the -- or all of the electronic media in russia that's not too hard to do. they want the response in writing as andrea said. it will be really what the u.s. sent to russia last week, we're willing to discuss some issues with you. now, one of the things the russians have said is they don't want the u.s. to deploy any kind of missiles in ukraine. well, we weren't planning on nothing that anyway, so maybe if we can write back and say we are not going to do this. we are going to maybe reconfigure with where our troops r there are things that we can do, where we can go some way towards meeting russian concerns in general, but clearly we can't say we're never going to enlarge nato and nato is going to go back to what it was really essentially before the soviet union collapsed.
>> right. i mean, listen, the white house has spent the better part of the last couple of days look to go clarify or clean up president biden's comments in that news conference on webs when he suggested this minor incursion by russia into ukraine, which would draw maybe a less severe response. he has since said any line crossing is going to draw a major consequence. how do you see that moment? do you think that that clarification has helped and has brought the u.s. past the diplomatic difficulties of that moment? >> i think what president biden said in a sense inadvertently is express something which is true, depending on what happens we may or may not get the europeans or all europeans along with us for retaliatory measures. if there were, say, a limited military incursion into the southeastern region of ukraine, the donbas where it is now, take a little bit more territory, you're less likely to get all the europeans to agree to massive sanctions on russia than if it was a full scale invasion with russians going as far as
kyiv the ukrainian capital which i think most people don't believe it will. obviously the president had to correct himself but what he said is true, depending on what the russians do, and we don't know what they're going to do, they could also do something that's cyber, full flag operations but not an actual military incursion, it's going to be much more difficult to have a line of solidarity. that's one of the things clearly that secretary blinken has been working on to try to bring them along. >> angela stent, we are glad to have your expertise on the show with us this afternoon. coming up, the watered down bipartisan voting rights bill that seems to be coming together on capitol hill, what's in it and whether progressives will get behind it. we will ask congresswoman debbie dingell who joins us live after the break. and later a new sign the online anti-vax movement is spilling even more into real life. ben collins is here with the new
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♪liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty♪ the senate trying to bounce back after that fight over voting rights with a bipartisan group of lawmakers going to more than a dozen planning virtual meetings during the process next week to see if there is a path forward. top of mind, changes to the electoral count act, which determines how electoral votes are counted. this is something that some voting rights experts say could stop another january 6th situation happening. also being laid on the table how to protect election workers from threats and intimidation, especially relevant in light of what we talked about just a minute ago on the show with that new election threats task force from the doj and their first arrest today. now you have republican lawmakers in three states putting this place or proposing at least some new law enforcement units dedicated to looking into voter fraud and other election crimes despite
the lack of evidence of any of that kind of fraud. i want to bring in sahil kapur and blayne alexander. i'm glad to have both of you on. tell us about this push for republicans about this police force that some of them want dedicated to what they are calling election fraud although every time we say it i feel like there's important to note that there is no evidence that that widespread election fraud actually exists. >> reporter: and, hallie, i don't think that we can say that enough and that's certainly important, especially when we are talking about these proposals. currently being proposed by lawmakers or rather politicians in three states, florida, georgia and arizona, i made that distinction because the one that perhaps has the most teeth is the one in florida, it's being proposed by republican governor ron desantis down in florida and he has already asked the state legislature for several million dollars to make this happen. in arizona it's being proposed by a state lawmaker. here in the state of georgia it's being proposed by former start david perdue. he is a candidate, the one who
is the trump-enforced candidate working to unseat the current republican governor here in the state, brian kemp. now, i told you that we could never say enough that all of this is based on false claims of election fraud, there is no evidence of widespread voter fraud, not in these three states or any of the other states for that matter, but, again, this is the candidate that is being en enforce -- endorsed by the former president. he has put out statements essentially saying if he is elected as being the governor of georgia that he will put this into place to make sure all georgians can have confidence in the election system. this is really a continuation of 2020. this goes back to the president putting his -- aiming his ire essentially at the republican governor and the secretary of state, both of them were refusing to overturn the election results here in georgia. now, i've reached out to the secretary of state's office, brad raffensperger's office,
they've said they are not commenting on this at all, but it is important to note that this is what so many voting rights advocates are concerned about. if you remember back in 2020, we talked about the fact that there was -- you know, there were concerns of voter intimidation, people who needed to look out and see might there be people showing up at the polls and what might that look look. voting rights advocates are concerned that these proposals could spiral into some sort of voter intimidation and, again, underscore the fact that this is essentially what they are looking at as a possible solution without a problem, hallie. >> blayne, you're laying down what is going on at the state level. sahil, talk about at the national and federal level and this discussion that i know you and your team is reporting on about these conversations or let's say small group, small bipartisan group of senators, about maybe changes to things like the electoral count act. what's the reality check? >> reporter: there's guarded optimism at this time that they can pull this off in the senate for a couple of reasons.
the first is that this has nothing to do with voting rights and ballot access, this is about election subversion and making it harder to steal elections which many republicans are interested in. you will recall the vast majority of senate republicans did vote to certify the election of joe biden is it not go along with former president trump's attempts to steal the election. senate minority leader mitch mcconnell has opened to door to this, encouraging these discussions saying this is directly what happened on january 6th. he has said that the electoral count act needs fixing, that it's clearly flawed and there is a template for success on this in the past. it's the bipartisan infrastructure law with a very similar group of senators working on this with mcconnell giving his blessing on the sidelines, eventually getting involved and that passed with a lot of support. now, there are pitfalls here. the single biggest pitfall is probably former president trump himself, he is known to be quite sensitive about the topic, this category of issues and if he
sees this as a slight against him and starts attacking the republicans going along with it you could see gop support peel away. as for democrats they are angry and burned by the defeat of their two major voting rights bills this week. they are not rushing to get behind this but many say they would be open to where these discussions go and considering an outcome. president biden himself in his press conference earlier this week predicted that they would get something done on the electoral reform side of this, which many senators saw as an encouragement to try to pull this off on a bipartisan basis after the voting rights bills were defeated. hallie? >> i asked a white house official about that 24 hours ago, sahil, would the white house, would the president support that? the answer was tbd, we will get back to you on that front. you have to think based on his comments on wednesday it seems more than likely. thank you both so much for that. i want to bring in michigan congresswoman debbie dingell a deputy whip in the house progressive caucus. congresswoman, thank you for
being back on the show. good afternoon. >> hallie, good to see you. >> let me start with where my colleagues left off there with this discussion of bipartisan small group of senators looking at some of these more let's call them modest election reforms, changing the electoral count act, for example. if that's something that came to the house you think you could support? what would have to be in that kind of bill for you? in a devastating turn of events, could think woman, i believe that you're frozen. i'm not sure if we have you back. let me go back and see if we have you. it's this era of the zooms, we're just living in it, we're rolling with it. >> am i back now? >> you're back, yes. so i was asking you would you support that smaller package if like the electoral count act or some smaller change came across in the house? >> so, look, election reform is necessary, but it cannot be just like a cosmetic change. we've really got to focus on
voting right reform. i'm listening to all of the discussions this afternoon. we need to understand that there are people that are undermining people's confidence in election outcomes by saying that they're going to set up these what could become intimidating election protectors, but also in this constant that's been going on since -- while republican clerks, republican elected officials across the country have said a legitimate election, republican senators and republican house members supported the outcomes this have election, people are wondering and that's what they're trying to do. they're trying to suppress the vote with voter -- voter -- election laws in many states, keeping voting rights from being passed and by trying to set up the election -- whatever we're going to call them, goons is what i was going to say.
and it's not right. people need to know that democracy works. that both count and it's honest and being counted honest. >> on that somewhat of a related note as we talk about things that are being done that undermine confidence in the election system i want your reaction if you can to this new reporting from "politico" we takd about at the top of this show that unsigned draft memo that was apparently prepared for former president trump that would have authorized voting machines to be seized in the weeks after the 2020 election. have you had a chance to see this reporting? >> i have read it briefly and that's what who are ph hoffifie. i think that the american people need to be told the truth, but the fact of the matter is there was an effort to overthrow the election results last january and the american people don't know what to believe, but what you saw at the nation's capitol was some people that came prepared to kill people, that
were trying to falsify the outcome of the election and are now trying in other ways to undermine people's confidence and the strength of our democracy. >> i have to ask you sort of more broadly as we look at the position of house members like yourselves, of the house generally with democrats in control now as we lean into the midterms because we have some new i'm sure you've seen nbc news "wall street journal" polling and it shows that president biden is not in a particularly fantastic place when it comes to his approval rating, when it comes to his handling of the economy and his handling of the pandemic, for example. again, i'm just the messenger, that's what the polling shows. let me ask you somebody involved with messaging, involved with policy and leading the charge for house democrats do you think this is going to be a drag on the midterms? is there anything that your party can do to try to change some of what seems to be the narrative looking at history and these numbers that you are at real risk of losing the house? >> okay. i'm going to answer this question in two ways. >> okay. >> first of all, i am the person that predicted that donald trump
would win michigan and ultimately the election. >> i remember that. >> polls across the country said it could never happen. polls are not, you know -- they're a snapshot in time and a poll in january doesn't mean anything for this november. two, as democrats we have to start talking and doing a better job of telling people what we have got accomplished and as people start to see the work that we got done and by getting that infrastructure bill passed and seeing their roads and bridges being fixed, getting lead out of pipes, getting broadband into communities, they actually see the results of our work the money that we got through the american recovery plan if the cities actually use it and they talk about it that's what's going to matter when the election comes in november. what do republicans stand for? they weren't for roads and bridges, they weren't for getting high speed internet into communities, they weren't for getting lead out of pipes. most of them, not 13 of them, voted against this in the house and that's what we have to also talk about. what do republicans stand for?
>> congresswoman debbie dingell, can you come back because i want to talk to you about semi-conductors. i know that that is a big issue today. >> i will. that's fine. i would love to. it's my subject, you know that. >> i know. i know. we're going to get to it i promise. thank you. i really appreciate it. thank you. we have breaking news on the pandemic front. it's coming into us from the pentagon. the pentagon as you look at the fight against the pandemic is now saying it's going to put more military muscle into this national response. you are looking at it on your screen here. we've learned in the last couple minutes that 200 plus military personnel are headed to eight states across the country and navajo nation. we are talking about nurses, doctors, respiratory specialists. courtney kube is at the penitentiary gone to report this out more as it develops. courtney, listen, we knew that the pentagon was already sending some people to do this around the country, the biden administration has touted a ramp up of that as one of the tools as they're trying to fight this covid surge. what else do we know about this
latest, you know, piece of this mission you could call it? >> reporter: that's right. so you remember that president biden announced that they were going to put 1,000 members of the military on essentially prepare to deploy orders. these are members of military medical field, as you mentioned, nurses, doctors, respiratory specialists, paramedics, people who they could put on a prepare to go order and then within a matter of weeks they would dispatch them out in these teams. so as you see on our screen, the teams tend to be 20 people, sometimes as big as 40 people. they go to these civilian medical facilities all over the country and there they go in and essentially shore up the local medical staff. so these are places where the hospitals, the local communities are really overwhelmed by covid and the local hospitals whether it's a matter of they just have too many patients coming in or they have staffs who are also sick and afflicted on their own, they go in and they help out to support them as they are overwhelmed by this pandemic that is sweeping across the country. we now know that there are five
new states and as you mentioned the navajo nation in new mexico who will have some of these medical staffs. this is actually a program or an operation that's been going on since august of 2021 so about six months now. you remember back in the beginning of the pandemic the military was deploying out large numbers of medical specialists around the country to the hardest hit areas like new york state. well, what they've learned since then is it's much more effective for them to send these small groups out, shore up the local hospitals, rather than sending out big groups and try to build a facility in and of itself in large tents or whatever. that this is much more effective. the requests come through fema, defense officials believe that these as requests come in they will continue to staff them and support them as best that they can, hallie. >> courtney kube live at the pentagon with that breaking news. thank you for that breakdown. appreciate it. staying on the pandemic we have brand-new nbc news reporting publishing just this
hour, it actually just came out online. thousands of anti-vax protesters apparently coming to washington ready to descend this weekend for a rally against vaccine mandates. they're expecting tens of thousands of people, this protest raised something like $200,000 from various crowd funding sites. you know if it happened on the internet ben collins is all over it, he is a reporter joining us now. talk us through what the expectation is. as you noted in your piece this is just perhaps one of the most high profile examples about how the anti-vax movement is moving out of the online realm and more into the real world and into politics here. >> yeah, these organizers are expecting at least 10,000 people and i wouldn't be surprised to be honest with you, you know, they have sold out hotels in virginia, they're staying in virginia because there is a mandate in washington, d.c. that you have to be vaccinated to go pretty much anywhere so they're saying in virginia, they're busing people in. it makes a lot of sense. these are the people speaking at
this event who made a name for themselves pushing things like ivermectin over the last year and a half. if somebody in your family or a friend got sucked into that rattle over the last year and a half, it's people's like robert malone, the rabbit hole over the last year, they know these names, are fk jr., robert malone, huge names all over the internet who are reagan staying vaccine unacceptable. they are coming together for the first time. this is like their woodstock. >> i was shocked by how one antivaxxer phrased it to you. this is going to be a who's who of grifters and people who made a profit off the pandemic. that's what this is? >> they not only pushed ivermectin but aligned themselves with these doctors
groups, fml triple c. they are not happy calling this an anti-vaccine rally. >> because it is anti-mandate? is that what they are saying? >> they are saying it is anti-mandate. there are a couple of reasons for this. it is more acceptable to say hey, you could have taken your vaccine but we need you on our side because of the mandates. there is another piece that's just as important. it doesn't get you banned on facebook. there is an 11,000 person group that is called defeat the mandates that's supporting this rally, not only in d.c., but in denver, sacramento and miami. complete the vaccine would be a different group on facebook that would have been been banned a long time ago. >> ben collins, happy to have you on. backlash against arizona senator kyrsten sinema seems to be coming to a head in arizona.
tomorrow she seems likely to face a no confidence vote from her state party after she saided with republicans whether or not to change the senate rules earlier this week. i don't have to tell you, you know that senator sinema along with joe manchin voted not to change senate rules which prevented the biden administration from passing the voting rights act. she is also facing challenges with some of her own constituents. almost three out of four arizona effort voters say they want a different democratic nominee when she runs for re-election. ruben gallego has been approached to challenge the senator purportedly. i want to bring in someone who knows what is going down on the ground in arizona better than anybody else. give us the lay of the land. let me start with the potential no confidence vote tomorrow. talk to us about the stakes.
based on your extensive reporting in the state of course living there, working there, how do you think it is going to go. >> a lot of this is already baked. this resolution was set in motion months ago by people upset by sinema and her stand on the filibuster. her vehicles this week this the senate triggered what is going to happen next. on saturday morning the executive committee of the state democratic party is going meet. their hands are tied. the resolution says base on what she did they have to issue a vote of no confidence. the question now is whether they will go ahead and follow through with a send sewer, which is also kind of required. that's the real debate left to this executive committee if you follow the resolution. i am hearing behind the scenes there is a lot of lobbying buy the sinema folks. they don't want this to happen, understandably. again, this committee's hands are largely tied. >> when you talk with people in arizona rank and file voters, let's say, what do you hear from them about their
dissatisfaction, or maybe not, with senator sinema. >> they are done. >> in other words, do the poll numbers match up with what you are hearing on the ground? >> yes, look, there are a lot of people, progressives, democrats who held their nose and voted for vine ma in 2018 in the u.s. senate race. more and more we see people who cast that vote having real problems with her right now. the consensus is she would have a really hard time winning a primary in 2024. although a lottist depends on who the opponents are. i will add there are many people here, myself wrong them, don't believe she is going to run again for the senate in 2024. that her sights are set much higher than that. >> talk to me about that. what are you hearing on that front? >> well, we hear over and over from people close to her is her sights are set on the white house. >> how realistic do you think
that is? >> i will say this about kyrsten sinema. she is the surest politician i have met in this state in the last 20 years. she is very smart. we heard joe biden acknowledge it several weeks ago. ask yourself right now, what is joe biden's signature accomplishment outside of covid and related matters going to be, do you think, by november? chances are, it is going to be the bipartisan infrastructure package. she helped negotiate that. a significant achieve mental. she is very shrewd, very smart. you look at what's doing. nothing says i am getting ready to run again. furthermore, she might be in the minority coming a year from now. that's not going to be much fun. she may not have the clout she has right now at that point. and might have the time to explore a presidential bid or something along -- i was going
to say along those lines, but what else is there? >> well you -- yeah. >> all i want to say is keep in mind that's a real possibility. >> you always bring the goods, man. that's an interesting -- it's an interesting conversation to have. really quick loo, i only have a couple seconds left there. if she were to run again, who do you think is his most likely primary opponent? do you think it is congressman gallego? >> as of today, it is. but a lot can change. what with joe biden offers him a job somewhere? ambassador? something else, just to get him off the ballot? that's a possibility. it is still a long way from 2024. right now, ruben gallego's names in the hunt, congressman greg stanton of phoenix. he is a possibility. but he might have a tough race coming up in 2022 n the mid terms looking at the polling numbers. >> almost out of time. go back to this speculation that you have heard. again, this is your reporting you are on the ground b this
potential 2024 -- would she run as an independent? would that be the game for her? >> i don't know. right? that's -- running as an independent for president is something that has been tried just a few times in the last couple of generations. all i would say is we are entering a very different time, for the parties, for the vote e how they perceive politicians. i think when you think hard about that, you might say, you know what, independent might be a possibility. perhaps she would run with a republican. she is open to anything. but keep in mind, this isn't just kind of happening. this has been thought through. >> ram resnick, always good to have you on the show. thank you. thank you to all of you for watching hallie jackson reports. that's it for us this week. "deadline: white house" starts right after the break. week "deadline: white house" starts right after the break. maybe it's another refill at your favorite diner...
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