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tv   Meet the Press  MSNBC  November 22, 2021 1:00am-2:00am PST

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not guilty. >> sparks outrage. >> now they have legalized vigilanteism, sports killing. >> and applause. >> i feel like they made the right choice, you know it was simple self-defense. >> split political lines. ti plus, more division in washington, where only two l republicans vote to censure congressman paul gosar after his violent video targeting democrat alexandria ocasio-cortez. >> what is so hard about saying this is wrong? >> if i must join alexander hamilton, the first person to be censured by this house, so be it. >> i'll talk to democratic senator jon tester and republican senator kevin cramer. plus democrats finally passe n president biden's social safety net bill over unanimous republican opposition. >> didn't get a mandate to transform america. >> now can it get through the senate? my guest this morning, the
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transportation secretary, pete buttigieg.hi and the new covid surge. >> i'm worried that people are going to die and they never had a chance at getting a bed. >> new cases averaging near ri 100,000 a day, this as the government endorses pfizer and moderna boosters for all adults. joining me for insight and analysis are nbc news senior white house correspondent kelly o'donnell, the reverend al sharpton, host of "politicsnation" on msnbc, republican pollster kristen soltis anderson, and civil rights attorney david henderson. welcome to sunday. it's "meet the press." good sunday morning.e this past week we got more evidence of just how divided t we've become as a country. on friday, wisconsin jury found kyle rittenhouse not guilty on all counts of shooting three r
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men, two fatally, at a concern osha protest last summer, sparked by the shooting of black man by a white police officer. in georgia right now there are three men on trial charged with an unprovoked killing of a black men, ahmaud arbery. earlier in the week, just two house republicans joined democrats in censuring republican c congressman paul gosar and stripping him of his committee assignments after he posted an animated video showing him killing his colleague, democrat aoc woshds. aoc words. the gop, at least the house gop's near unanimous dismissal are further evidence of a framed america. yes, the politics of division and weaponization of grievance have helped both parties raise money and raise the temperature in this country. but the republican vote in the house condoning gosar's actions was more than that. it appears to be another step towards embracing former president trump's radical behavior, the violent rhetoric a hers he embraces, the coding of the
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january 6th rioters, the big lie, even attacking republicans for simply voting for a public works bill, all of it has helped lead us to this moment. what used to be dismissed as dangerous rhetoric from the far right that nobody was listening to, is being mainstreamed by the man who is reshaping the republican party in his own party. s >> we, the jury, find the defendant kyle h. rittenhouse not guilty. >> the verdict, not guilty on all counts, magnifying the divisions in a deeply polarizedr america. d >> it was a case about self-defense, the right to protect oneself. >> you cannot claim self-defensa against a danger you create. >> kyle rittenhouse came to da kenosha as a counterprotester, he says, to protect property, ploling the police shooting of jacob break.
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>> somebody enters your house doing wrong. he was out on the street, he was a provocateur. >> you just emboldened all these people filled with so much hate. >> rittenhouse was interviewed by fox news after leaving the yo courtroom? >> the jury reached the correct verdict. self-defense is not illegal. >> throughout the trial, rittenhouse was praised on right wing media. >> when legitimate authority ses refuses to do its sworn duty, others will file the vacuum. rs >> we don't defend this young boy who defended his community when no one else was doing it. it may very well be your baby boy that they come from. >> kyle rittenhouse would probably make a pretty good congressional intern. >> kyle rittenhouse is not guilty, my friends. you have a right to defend yl yourself, be armed, be dangerous, be moral. >> a lot of people would have been very angry in this countrya if that young man was in any way convicted. >> already far right groups are calling rittenhouse the hero ic we've been waiting for. republican missouri senate candidate mark mccloskey who launched a run in politics
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showed up at the kenosha courthouse photographed with two men marked as white supremacists. the verdict caps a week marked by signs of america's widening political divide. >> we can't have members joking about murdering each other or li threatening the president of the united states. >> after house republicans all but condoned the posting of thar violent video by congressman paul gosar. >> if i must join alexander hamilton, the first person attempted to be censured by the house, so be it. >> what do you believe of the action against paul gosar yesterday? >> making the house more bitter. you can't let someone threaten to kill another colleague even in jest. >> kevin mccarthy joined all two years ago to strip then congressman steve king after his committee assignments after king's white supremacist comments. in te >> that is not the party of lincoln, and it's definitely not
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america. >> now defending gosar.ot >> i do not condone violence. the video was deleted. o >> gosar reposted the video wa after his censure before taking it down again.ce joining me now is democratic senator jon tester of montana. senator tester, welcome back to "meet the press," sir. >> good to be with you, sir. >> let me start with the fallout of the rittenhouse trial. i think you can provide a unique perspective.et you come from a rural state, one that would collectively describe themselves as a pro second amendment state. there are a lot of so-called pro second amendment folks hailing this as a victory. explain that divide as you see it. >> so, look, i wasn't in kenosha and certainly wasn't in the courtroom either. we are a nation of laws, and tr there was a trial, and the jury issued its verdict. i can't imagine the pain that the families have gone through that lost loved ones in this
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incident, but, nonetheless, i think we need to respect what the jury has done here and respect the decision. protest, but i would say protest peacefully if you're going to protest. >> what is the issue here in your mind? >> i think everybody has a right to keep and bear arms, law-abiding citizens. i believe everybody has a right to protect themselves. i think the debate on this whole issue -- like i said, i wasn't there, so i can't tell you exactly whatca happened, but th truth is, the whole debate is was it self-defense or provocation. >> right. but we've also seen a redefining of these laws in the last 20 years. there's two trends that are alln over the country. more open-carry laws and more
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laws written essentially to allow self-defense to be used to defend using your firearm. how much do those laws, do you think, contribute to the situation that we saw in kenosha? >> look, chuck. i'm in a situation where for 20 years i made w a living with my gun as a custom butcher shop operator. i used my gun as a tool, which is what it is. it has to be used responsibly. if it's not used responsibly, you can see a lot of bad things that can happen. i can tell you some of the laws put out in the last few years are laws that, i think, enable people that are criminals, not people who are law-abiding citizens. quite honestly, as a gun owner, as somebody that has fewer guns than i want, the fact is that we need to have laws that protect t law-abiding citizens to be able to have guns. but we also, when they're used improperly, we need to enforce the law. the other thing i would say is p
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this. there was a background check law put up a few years back to keep guns out of criminals an court-adjudicated mentally ill folks and terrorists. that bill did not pass, and i still can't figure out why. background checks are key to law-abiding citizens being able to keep their guns. >> some of this is the larger cultural divide between rural america and suburban, urban in america when it comes to the gun issue. i'm curious if you think it's ai the root as to why essentially democrats are bleeding rural support. you know this very well. you can look at it. we saw the virginia results i can put up here. i'll show you the 2008 results in montana for president and the 2020 results for montana for president.w on you know it as well. it's gone from a battleground state to a 16-point edge for the republicans. is this going to be fatal to the democratic party if you don't bridge this divide? >> well, i think it's very important to bridge the divide.
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it's a divide that's been put up to divide this country, quite honestly, as many hot-button issues are. in the end, i think commonsense gun laws are important to be able to enforce.en i think if democrats got out and spoke about things, enabling law-abiding citizens to protect their gun rights, i think it would help us win in rural america. dei unfortunately what folks in rural america hear a lot about is they want to take away the guns, and that is not -- that's not whatt most democrats want r sure, and so i think it's an important issue in elections because it's been made into an important issue. >> you do think raceo plays a role ino the democrats' proble in rural america? >> look, i think the biggest problem the democrats have is they go to work and given the bipartisan infrastructure package is part of it, go to work, get a record of accomplishment, get out there and talk to folks about what ag your vision is and what you've done.
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you've got two ears, one mouth. act accordingly. listen and react. part of the problem with democrats in rural america is we haven't talked enough about what we stand for and what we've accomplished. we haven't shown up in many places.acav those things are going to be very, very important as we go into 2022. >> the senate now has the president's build back better. it's now up to you guys.at is this a pass anything that can get 50 votes? i mean is that where we're at at this point? or are there some, hey, this gets taken out or i can't support this bill? where is your head in this, and where are the democrats' heads? >> we have a great opportunity to do great things, child care, affordable housing, climate, lowering prescription costs and health care costs overall, and i think we can do it. i don't think there's any doubt about that. i think people need to be open to compromise, and i think if we compromise like we did in the bipartisan infrastructure l package where we had five
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democrats and five republicans that, you know, argued and fought and came to a bill that would work, i think it's the same thing within the 50 democrats too.'s we don't all see the world the same way. so let's negotiate and let's come up with a bill that lowers costs for families, cuts taxes, and move this economy forward so we can stay the premier power in the world. china plans to supplant us. if we don't tend to business, they can two that. >> sounds like you're going to be a supporter of it regardless of what it looks like in the detail? >> oh, no. no, no, no, no, no. it's going to come over from the house. there's going to be changes. i'm going to compare it to whatt montana needs, and that's going to be where i focus on. but, look, we're dealing with reasonable people here. i think we can come up with a bill that's a very, very good bill that works for states like montana and other states in the union. bibi
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very quickly, in september you expressed support for the president to reappoint jay powell as fed chair. there are a lot of your colleagues who would like to see a new fed chair. if the president goes in a different direction, do you think that puts the current economic situation at peril at all? >> yeah. i think it would be a mistake.ic i think jerome powell has a proven track record, and chairman powell should get reappointed. i think we've got issues that revolve around inflation that he can't do much about it if he's not confirmed. he needs to be appointed. we need to confirm him. i think he would be confirmed by a large margin. he can get to work as chairman of the fed and do a good job as he's done in the past. t i think he deserves reappointment. >> senator jon tester from montana, appreciate you joining us.
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>> thank you, chuck. joining me is republican cramer of north dakota. >> good to be with you. >> let me start with the rittenhouse verdict, pretty divisive. i think you and senator tester share certain constituencies. so i think you have a sense to o explain the divide to urban and suburban america. what was your reaction to the verdict? and why is he being hailed as a hero on the right? >> well, chuck, he's probably being held by a hero by some. i think largely what he's being held as is an innocent person involved in this case. the symbolism that surrounded it is not reflective of the facts on the ground. i think frankly, jon tester rg a explained it pretty well. i think justice has been done by a jury of his peers. i think, frankly, when you looki at the videos and things that became more apparent later in the trial, you find a kid that was in the wrong place at the wrong time, shouldn't have had h
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gun probably with him. he responded in self-defense. i think people should be reminded that the people he shot were also violent criminals andd armed at that. it's not like he just snuck up on some guys. so the problem is, i think, justice was done, but the rhetoric surrounding it probably on bothng sides is inappropriat to the actual event itself. >> i want to read you something from conservative writer david french. here's what he wrote about the event earlier this week. he said, a political movement that turns a deadly and ineffective vigilante into a role model is a movement that is courting more violence and encouraging more men to recklessly brandish weapons in more places, and that will spill blood in america's streets. do you have concern that some will get the wrong message from this verdict?wict >> what i get concerned about is a political movement that devalues police officers, that cuts their, funding, makes the into the bad guys in keeping our streets safe and our communities safe.
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that kind of rhetoric, i'm afraid, leads to the very same violence that we're talking about. a lot of people talk about having a discussion. the very first public event i had after i got to congress was having a discussion around guns that included lots of people including people of faith, people from schools, practitioners, pastors, and we don't do that anymore. i agree, i think we need to have that discussion, but both sides need to want to have that discussion, not just use it for their own political gain. >> the rise in open-carry laws and in stand-your-ground laws, is it sending the wrong message of almost encouraging folks to use their weapon in public places? >> no.r i think it sends the message that you have a right to defend yourself against increasing violence. again, let's get back to
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supporting police officers, supporting solid laws that protect innocent people so that innocent people don't feel like they always have to protect themselves. that said, they do have the right to defend themselves lng especially in their own homes which is largely what some of the laws you're talking about are about, particularly stand your ground. >> right. but the public spaces, stand your ground at home, i think, is one thing. stand your ground anywhere else in the community, it seems that expansiveness is what's got some folks troubled. >> i don't know, chuck. there are an awful lot of stories about people who are grateful that the person next to them in a public space was carrying when there wasn't ef anybody else there to protect them against another violent criminal. i don't think this is so much about guns as it is about the heart of people. there's no question we're living at a time in our country where the congress that you see that appears very divided is a reflection of our communities that are very divided. so we all have a role to play in this.ryl it's not just top-down or bottom-up.
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we all have a role, and we ought to use our platforms. >> i say congress is a mirror to society and people need to see that.on >> that's right. speaking of attacks, you've been the subject of the attacks from the former president for supporting a public works bill. on november 7th he wrote, all republicans who voted for democratic -- mitch mcconnell voted for a terrible socialist infrastructure plan and induced others in his party do likewise. and, finally, on the 13th, that's what saving america needs to do by saving the gop from. would you have supported this bill if the vote had been in november instead of august? >> chuck, i happen to be the ranking member of the transportation infrastructure subcommittee, so i helped write a good part of this bill. i was advocating for it long before mitch mcconnell announced his support. he didn't induce me in any way. president trump and i had a healthy conversation about it
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after a previous national television appearance where he talked about the merits of the bill. yeah, i would have. i don't make my decision on legislation based on whether it hurts or helps donald trump or hurts or helps joe biden. unfortunately right now a lot of the rhetoric is centered around, as much as anything, this gave joe biden a victory. whether he gets a victory or not -- i happen to believe that every transaction -- not every transaction in washington requires a loser. the north dakotas can win if joe biden looks good in the process. i'm more concerned about the north dakotans. >> you've seen what happened in the house. they want retribution for people that voted for this bill. what happens o to governing in america if each party punishes t anybody who votes with the other side?in >> what happens is you'll have a whole bunch of reconciliation bills, if the same party has the the white house, the house, and the senate. our founders created an
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exceptional system of self-governance that works really, really well until it doesn't. so i do worry about that, chuck. i think -- frankly, i think, we need to think more strategically. obviously political adversaries are a means because our founders, again, created these o three coequal branches, bicameral legislation on purpose. they didn't want one party or one philosophy governing this country. i do worry about that. i think the senate has been th pretty exceptional for the most part. now we're getting forced with this crazy big government socialist agenda driving up inflation and driving up our debt and our deficit coming at us by the democratic party that has gotten comfortable with anti-semitism and socialism. we need to get together again and have this conversation about what's good for america, not what's good for our tweets tomorrow. >> i see what you're worried about on the left. g on the right i think some folks
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are worried -- the fact that paul gosar, that republicans didn't condemn it just the way two years ago steve king would have been condemned, it looks as if it's being condoned. bad look for the party? >> i don't know. i think, chuck, the problem is -- what paul did probably wasn't right. i've never seen the meme myself. as you know, i did an op-ed criticizing marjorie taylor greene. i've never met the woman. her rhetoric early on, i wanted to make sure that the party was distanced from that. but that said, at the same time, omar spews this gross anti-semitic rhetoric and barely gets a slap on the wrist for that. again, we have polarizing parties, at least parts of our parties are so polarizing, and i think there's a tendency to runa to those corners rather than stand in the gap and have a conversation and use our er influence both ways. you know, when you're sitting in a chair like i'm sitting in, you can either do one of two things.
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you can either yield to that or use your influence both ways. i try to listen as much as i can, engage people, come on "meet the press" when others aro afraid to, but then, also, you know, facilitate discussion. b >> kevin cramer, republican from north dakota, you do indeed accept our invitations. i appreciate it. thank you for coming and sharing your perspective. >> thank you. have a happy thanksgiving. >> you, too. when we come back, what the kyle rittenhouse verdict tells us about guns, self-defense claims and this divided counted that you heard both senators talk about.t the panel is next. panel is next. it protects the 8 areas dentists check for a healthier mouth. the #1 toothpaste brand in america. crest.
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comcast business. powering possibilities. hello. i'm dara brown. we have an update. a warning that the video we're about to play may be disturbing. according to authorities at least five people were killed and more than 40 were injured after an suv drove through a holiday parade. police say a person of interest is in custody for questioning. they believe he may have been
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involved in a night fight and fled before crashing into the crowd. we'll keep you up to date. now, back to "dateline." welcome back. the panel is with us. nbc news senior white house correspondent kelly o'donnell, david henderson, reverend al sharpton, host of "politicsnation" on msnbc, and republican pollster kristen soltis anderson. i want to start to talk about the rittenhouse verdict, beginning with statements from president biden and vice president harris. >> i stand by what the jury has concluded. the jury system works, and we have to abide by it. >> as many of you know, i've spent the majority of my career working to make the criminal justice system more equitable. clearly there's a lot more work to do. >> reverend sharpton, i heard two very different statements there, not necessarily as in sync as i thought they might be. >> i think that when you deal
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with the fact that, as vice president harris said, she has dealt with criminal justice cases directly, whereas, president biden doesn't think conversions were in the same place, he's respecting the decision of the jury. i think the jury had to deal with bad law, and i think that you can question the prosecution and certainly the judge who sounded in many cases like he was part of the defense team. but notwithstanding that, i think she has a background that has dealt with a lot of this. you know, when i was listening to both senators this morning, i think we are forgetting that the whole context of rittenhouse coming there was around a protest of a police brutality situation. and this was not like a guy who was defending himself at his house. he came to confront a situation of protests. those kinds of protests, i think
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vice president harris is familiar with. i think many of us that do protests -- as you said, with national action network, are concerned that you can send a signal that people can come to a protest and exacerbate a situation or get involved in a situation and kill people and say i was just defending myself. that's very frightening. >> you know, kristen, this was part of this divide. is this an issue about guns or an issue about social justice? >> it can be a little bit of all of those things. i think it's also an issue of where people are getting their information. this is part of why you're going to see such division in this country over this case. depending on where you get your news, there's somebody who thinks everybody who attacked kyle rittenhouse that night was armed. it's the case that the first man that came at him was throwing a plastic bag at him. on the other hand, there are a lot of people who would never know from what they watched, the man was not there calling for reform at the police, he was throwing racial slurs at the protests before he got into his confrontation with kyle
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rittenhouse. there are two views on this and neither is the full view that the jury got over the days and weeks of that trial. >> kelly, i just noticed the white house has not wanted to get so involved in any of these cases right now. >> i was there asking the president for his reaction. what was also notable, he was very careful and cautious about honoring the jury system. later there was a written statement that came out under his name that went a little further and said many americans felt fear and concern and anger, myself included, meaning the president himself. he didn't say that to us on camera in person. and then he went on with a written statement talking about wanting to tone down the divisions in the country, and that's what he leaned heavily into. the white house felt they needed the president to echo the
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anxieties in the kun community and in the country about that which the president himself did not do at that time. they want to turn down some of the divisions, and on cases like this, the president is not going to be the first one to step into the fray. when you talk to advisers about it, they say it really is about his predecessor having been someone who stoked some of these things. they want him to take a different position. >> david, when you and i were talking on friday in the immediate aftermath, we were talking about what's going to be the fallout. you pointed at there are a lot of new laws that have been written. "stand your ground" laws, not a single state had a statute on the books before 2005 for the stand-your-ground law. now we have 30 states that have it. there were some that had court-ordered stand your ground initiatives. 32 states that have added open carry in this century. the combination of open carry, stand your ground, you seem to think maybe the debate about guns ought to turn into public safety as well. >> first of all, there's inherent conflict when you have stand your ground laws in open
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carry states where you have political division. as reverend sharpton pointed out, voting rights and police reform, both of which will not have any progress without activism. when you have activism, you'll have people showing up with guns and situations will get volatile enough for people to begin firing. what stands out to me is not the existence of the laws so much as the fact that people fundamentally don't understand them. when i hear the commentary about the rittenhouse verdict, it demonstrates that people fundamentally do not understand the laws as it relates to self-defense. this was a winnable trial. >> you think it was a winnable trial. i think some look at the way the law is written and think maybe it wasn't winnable. >> the law isn't the problem so much as the system is the problem. systemic injustice. as we discuss the law, let me acknowledge full outright, this was a very difficult case to win. and i said that from the beginning. based on these facts, this was a difficult case to win. but let's think what happened with the law of self-defense.
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people understand fists for some reason better than we understand guns. if i said somebody was running at you aggressively. what did you do? i punched him. i beat him to death. what other choice did i have. that's what the rittenhouse team did. never physically touches you, never touches your gun, which is strapped to your body. also the law of self-defense and "stand your ground" in wisconsin actually allows the jury to consider, when you're assessing whether or not what rittenhouse did was reasonable, the law allows you to consider whether or not he should have backed down. >> rev, what does this mean for your movement? what should you be fighting for when it comes to the specific issue of preventing vigilanteism? >> i think you need federal laws that would supersede a lot of these state laws. i think in a few months we're going to be facing the ten-year sentence with trayvon martin
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where the "stand your ground" law became an issue. we never dealt with it or legislated it on a federal level. i think we must as a movement make the congress and the senate deal with new law here because we are right now looking at the fact -- we just had -- we just had the big rally and prayer vigil in georgia, brunswick, georgia, around the case of ahmaud arbery. now i would be concerned this week of having a prayer vigil with somebody there -- coming there saying, i'm coming to defend somebody on the side, and if they get in an altercation with somebody on the side, a verbal altercation, could take a gun, an ar-15 at that, and shoot somebody. we're under real threat so we have, in my opinion, we're mandated to try to make laws to protect people that are very clear. >> kristen, it does feel as if gun right supporters have shifted. gun owners in america have pulled the nra to the right.
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how did this become so -- >> i think in this environment today, you are unlikely to see at least any state where republicans hold any levers of power, a winding back of any of these laws. when you ask voters do they feel more concerned about crimes, about their own personal safety, the answer is yes. after big shootings, after big crises, you see sales of guns go up. so this -- you know, two years ago, we had talks of bipartisan criminal justice reform and these sorts of things, and we're a long ways away from where we were two years ago. >> i'm going to assume in about a month we're going to all hear about gun sales and what happened after this verdict. i have a feeling we all know which way the arrow is going to move. when we come back, covid cases back on the rise. has the government done enough to combat disinformation about mandates and vaccines. that's among the questions i have for transportation secretary pete buttigieg. he joins me next. ugh
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welcome back. the government announced on friday that americans 18 and
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older, all welcome back. the government announced on friday that americans 18 and older, all americans 18 and older are now eligible to receiver a pfizer or moderna booster shot. cases on the rise, seven-day average now approaching 100,000 a day. the other big news on friday, house democrats finally passed the president's social safety bill. [ cheers and applause ] >> it now goes to the senate where it faces an uncertain future. you heard the optimism from senator jon tester, one of the moderates in the caucus. joining me is president biden's transportation secretary pete buttigieg. welcome back to the show. >> good morning. good to be back. >> i want to talk with you about the president's agenda, but the mandate for vaccines for federal workers goes into effect tomorrow. i know tsa, while a part of our transportation infrastructure is technically under homeland security, but there have been some concerns that we're not going to have enough tsa agents meeting the vaccine requirement. it kicks in tomorrow. i know there's reassurances
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about travel this week. how concerned are you about a low rate of vaccination among tsa agents? >> i have seen no indication that vaccine requirements are going to impact travel in any way, certainly in terms of our ability as a federal administration to provide the services that are needed. i can tell you my agency, we see numbers approaching 99% of the people have gotten in their information per the requirements, either they're vaccinated, in the process, or have put in a request for an exemption. i expect the numbers are similar across the board. look, let's remember what this is about fundamentally which is ending the pandemic. all of us are ready to be done with this pandemic, to be done not just with the death and the hospitalization and the grim headlines, but also to be done with the restrictions and requirements and the masks. putting all that behind us means getting everybody vaccinated. that's what these requirements are about. from a federal perspective, the deadline tomorrow, that's not a
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cliff. people aren't getting immediately pulled off their posts. it's part of a process to make sure everyone in the federal workforce is safe. >> there's not a vaccine requirement for air travel. why not? >> well, there is when it comes to international travel. when it comes to domestic travel, we found other strategies are highly effective, including masks and those protections. meanwhile, we have employers both inside the travel industry and across the country advancing vaccines. and that is creating a very safe travel environment for americans. >> it sounds like you don't want to implement a vaccine mandate for domestic air travel. i guess, why not? other than you're worried about doing something politically divisive, i guess. if we're trying to get to the end of this pandemic, continuing to have loopholes to avoid a vaccine seems to elongate this pandemic.
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>> well, what we're doing right now is working to make air travel safe. again, it's a little bit of a different picture, of course, when you have international travel because different countries have different standards, which is why, as part of opening our travel again for international travelers, something i was delighted to see happen earlier this month, we did include the vaccine requirements. look, between the masking and other mitigations we're very confident in the safety of air travel and travel in general in this country. >> we're all used to things taking time to be implemented. we have the new infrastructure bill. i've heard you and others say, hey, this is going to unclog the supply chain. this is going to help to lower inflation. it just doesn't come across as realistic for something like this to have an impact in the next three to six months. how is it that the bill right now that just got passed is going to untangle the supply chain in the next three months? >> well, here is the way i would explain it. we have to take a look at the
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big picture and the long term, and we have to take short-term steps. now, you know, when we're talking about something that will make a difference next week, i'm more interested in things like the 24/7 ops in long beach and l.a. or the sweeper ships. it's also true that the sooner we make investments in and around our ports, that's what's going to make a difference. for example, we are supporting a process to create what are called pop-up container yards. you take the containers taking up that precious container space at the port, you move them further inland where there's more space and things flow more smoothly. so we are supporting short-term action, but this isn't a stimulus like we had in 2009.
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this is about making sure that america is competitive for the rest of this century. we are funding repairs that could begin almost immediately that mayors and states have been wanting to do for a long time. but we're also building cathedrals here in terms of some of the bridge replacements, major projects, airport terminals, and other things that will happen over the years, thanks to this generational investment. >> what do you believe is going to be the heaviest lift in the senate for the senate version of build back better? >> that's ultimately down to the senate and the process between the senate and the house. what i will say is you can tell that the vast majority of this legislation is cooked. what it amounts to, even as details get resolved and negotiations continue, it's an historic investment in making it easier and more affordable to be a family with kids in this country. this turning point we're about to create -- >> even if paid family leave is not in it, are you still going to be able to make that claim? >> of course. cutting child care costs in half, delivering free pre
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kindergarten education for 3 and 4-year-olds, that is an absolutely historic achievement, even if there are more things we'd like to do and will continue to try to do. there's no question that the framework the president put out that we're confident will pass the senate as well as the house represents the historic achievement and, of course, worth mentioning, given the news of the day, that is also going to be very helpful in the long run and not so long run in cutting costs for families facing inflation. >> every time something is written about vice president kamala harris' political standing, you name seems to be in every one of those articles. has it at all impacted your relationship with the vice president, that it seems as if there's this narrative of a rivalry developing between the two of you? >> no, because she and i are part of a team that is disciplined and doesn't focus on what's obsessing the commentators.
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we're too busy with a job to do, she as the leader in this administration -- in her leadership role and i and the president and in the cabinet and across the administration are getting the job done. that would be demanding in any administration. in one like this where we've been assigned by the president to take on literally projects and legislation of generational significance, there's no room to get caught up in the parlor games. i'm proud to be part of the biden/harris team. >> i'm not asking you this as secretary of transportation. i'm asking this as a person who ran for president. what was your reaction to the kyle rittenhouse verdict? >> look. there's a lot of pain in this country. that pain and that frustration was aroused by the entire case,
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including the verdict. for a lot of us, a lot to be upset about and concerned about, but we'll move forward as a country. this president continues to believe, and this administration continues to believe in america. we've got to continue working to bring americans together. >> pete buttigieg, secretary of transportation, we got to a lot of different topics. i appreciate you coming on and sharing the administration's and your perspective. >> thank you. >> have a good thanksgiving. when we come back, why where you live and how you vote says a lot about how much high gas prices impact you. stay with us. a do. ♪ turns out everyone does sound better in the shower. and it turns out the general is a quality insurance company that's been saving people money for nearly 60 years. ♪ 'cause it's the only thing i wanna do ♪ shaq: (singing in background) can't unhear that. for a great low rate, and nearly 60 years of quality coverage - make the right call and go with the general.
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welcome back. "data download" time. a closer look at the rising gas prices. you might think of them as something that impacts every american, but if you look closely, you can see the democratings and republicans are experiencing this year's pain at the pump a bit differently. this is a real-life unintentional impact of the self-sorting that has come to define modern-american politics. it will explain why the two parties seem to be focusing on the issue with different urgency. the average gas price is up, $3.38, the highest it's been going back to 2013. so this is real what we're seeing. but people are experiencing this pain at the pump differently. check this out. this is most vehicle miles traveled per capita by state. top ten states, eight of the top ten are trump states. the only two blue states, this is the one rural state democrats still carry, new mexico, if you will, and then there's georgia.
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have you ever driven in and around atlanta? yes, you have a lot of vehicle miles traveled. republicans traveling more miles, buying more gas. how about the type of vehicle republicans are more likely to have? guess what, new pickup truck sales, the top ten states of pickup truck sales? all red states. the pickup truck a necessity to do work. add all this up, the type of vehicle you need, the miles traveled. you can see why the issue of gas prices really is more of a republican issue than a democratic issue, which may explain why the white house urgency on this has been a bit less and the republican urgency a bit more. when we come back, the growing speculation over whether vice president harris or pete buttigieg will end up running for president in 2024. stick with us. align. fast acting biotic gummies helps soothes occasional abdominal discomfort, gas, and bloating and it works fast. in as little as 7 days try fast acting biotic gummies
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reverend sharpton, i want to start with the issue of the vice president here a little bit.
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i'll be honest, i'm mildly surprised she didn't do your show this weekend. we didn't see her this weekend. this goes after all these little stories, whatever you want to call it, a whisper campaign. you were quoted in the cnn piece. are you surprised to not see her today? >> i would have liked to see her today. i think there's no one in my opinion more qualified to address these times than the vice president, as a woman, first woman vice president, as a black and minority, and one with a criminal justice background. i think when she walks in the door, she's the example of why we need to bring the country together and has overcome great odds to get where she's gotten. the downside she has to look at is if she pushes too far ahead, then does the same media -- the same media who says where is
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she, you're getting ahead of the president. she's almost damned if she does, damned if she doesn't. you want her to be the vice president, be in a supportive role, so you say, okay, do that, but if she's more assertive than many of us want, she spoke three weeks ago and the crowd was roaring, three or four standing ovations. if she keeps doing that, you'll say stay in your place, you don't know how to be vice president. i think it's that kind of real problem of getting her to walk that line because she's not going to be able to satisfy everybody. if it was up to me, she would be on every day. but then people on the other side would be saying, see, she doesn't know how to be vice president, that's what you get when you put a woman or a black woman there. >> kelly o'donnell, you see this unclose. are the stories about the vice president overhyped, or are they revealing something that a lot of people have been whispering about? >> there's a tension there.
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it's a tightrope. when you talk to people in her circle, they say she hears this chatter, she knows there are these concerns. she's trying to avoid that noise and focus on the work. they point to her trip to france. they talk about her hosting world leaders, doing speeches, and working on behalf of some of the legislative things. at the same time, we often hear president biden talk about how barack obama chose him to be the front man on the recovery act years ago and how pivotal it was. he didn't choose the vice president do that for infrastructure. pete buttigieg is part of that. mitch landrieu has been brought in, others. he did give her volatile topics like immigration and voting rights, which right now don't have the votes to move in legislative ways. so those are all magnets for more criticism from the right. so she has a portfolio that makes her perhaps drag in more criticism, and she's trying to not outshine the president, and at the same time she is struggling with that noise. they say she's going to focus on
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working, she's going to focus on a good relationship with president biden. could he do more to help her? perhaps he could. >> david, you seemed to imply earlier when we were talking off camera, you think it's harder to be a candidate of color today running for office than ten years ago. >> absolutely, chuck, for the reasons we're talking about right now. look at the statements released from the white house by the rittenhouse verdict. it's difficult to say something meaningful and at the same time not set yourself up for fire from the other side. you know, i mean, it's really open to them. you asked about public safety earlier. let's stop and think here. i would have loved to hear more from her because i think she has a message to deliver that only a prosecutor who is a person of color could deliver. and then it's, folks, let's be reasonable about keeping each other safe. i think she can say, i respect the jury's verdict, but we have a long way to go. i have heard several statements
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from officials celebrating the loss of life. elected officials should never do that regardless of how they feel about the victim. >> kristen, kamala harris is a favorite of the right to beat up on. i think there are some that think maybe that enthusiasm on the right is what makes her more cautious. what makes her more of a magnet to attack than president biden? is it just race? >> i think -- take a look at the portfolio she's been handed. for instance, an issue like the border, that's an issue that conservatives are very fired up about, very frustrated about, and so when this becomes an issue in her portfolio, it only adds fuel to the fire. i think another reason there's so much focus on her, our president of the united states, i believe turned 79 years old yesterday. happy birthday, mr. president. there is a lot of talk about what republicans are going to do in 2024. if it's not joe biden, is she the only one? there's a lot of talk about it already. >> how much should the party be rallying around biden? >> i think they should rally around biden. i would take biden at 79 any day before i'd take trump at 75 or 76. >> he says he's running. >> yeah, he did.
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yes, he did. that's all we have for today. it was a busy show. have a happy, safe and healthy thanksgiving. we'll be back next week. if it's sunday, even after the leftovers, it's "meet the press." ♪♪ this morning, at least five people are dead and dozens more injured after an suv drove down a holiday parade route in wisconsin. the question is why did this happen and what do we know about a person of interest being questioned overnight? plus, chaos inside atlanta's international airport this weekend after a gun accidentally discharged. the question is, how did that passenger manage to get away after his firearm went off? and, two missionaries who were kidnapped by a gang in haiti last month have been released. the question is what about the other 15 who were taken? it's "way too early" for this.

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