tv The 11th Hour With Brian Williams MSNBC October 27, 2021 8:00pm-9:00pm PDT
call today. president biden is expected to attend the house democratic caucus meeting tomorrow morning at 9:00 a.m. sources tell nbc news he's going to try to influence the progressive part of the party to vote for his agenda. that's it for "the last word." "the 11th hour with brian williams" starts now. good evening once again. day 281 of the biden administration. the president may now be delaying his scheduled departure for europe tomorrow morning so
he can try to persuade members of his own party to vote for his policy bills. drama sometimes helps. more on that in a moment. and a short time ago, one 1/6 committee member said they expect to hear from jeffrey clark this week, the former doj official who was involved in the former president's attempt to overturn the election. >> the committee was scheduled this friday for an interview. so i believe that that is still on. >> as we reported, "the washington post" says they expect to subpoena john eastman, an attorney. last week, he disavowed his plan, calling it not viable and crazy. but he was caught on camera defending his plan, and blaming
mike pence in a series of undercover videos shot by a liberal activist named lauren windsor. she said she was at the rally on 1/6, and was one of his supporters. >> i read your memo, and i thought it was solid in all of its legal arguments. >> yeah. >> i was floored that mike pence didn't do anything. why didn't he act on it? because you gave him the legal reasoning to do that. >> i know. i know. >> why do you think that mike pence didn't do it? >> because he's an establishment guy at the end of the day. >> nbc news reached out to eastman, and he had no comment. she posted more segments of the video with eastman. >> i don't know, because the
breaking of the windows stuff had already started before his speech was over. if he got down there, all of that would have been blamed on him. they're still blaming it on him. they would have had more basis for it. so, you know -- >> but he had been planning on coming down, though. >> i know. >> it goes on kind of like that. earlier on this network, two january 6th committee members said the video bolstered the case for a subpoena to eastman. >> clearly, he was trying to get the vice president to overturn the election. as you say, a coup. these are insurrectionists wearing suits and ties. and they're not done. >> eastman performed, he delivered by saying this is something we can do. a lot of what i'm looking for in the january 6th committee, what were the nexus points between
the quasi-parliamentary citizen coup side and the election side? >> and the former president is once again trying to keep his tax returns from being given to the house ways and means committee. a hearing on that case is set for november 16th. and the current president is trying to salvage his plan to expand the social safety net of the country and keep his infrastructure bill alive. he plans to attend tomorrow's democratic caucus meeting tomorrow at 9:00 a.m. to convince mostly the liberals to vote for the bipartisan infrastructure bill. tonight, we learned a big part of that plan to provide paid family and medical leave to millions of americans was cut, largely due to opposition from a 74-year-old man from west virginia named joe manchin. one reporter from abc news posted this from democratic
senator patty murray of washington state, who said, and we quote here, we're not going to let one man tell millions of women in this country that they can't have paid leave. democrats are still far apart on many of the other things biden wants to do. >> i don't believe that we have a deal from the two senators that we've been waiting on for months. we need those two senators to get onboard so that we can show the world that we are actually going to deliver for people in a significant way. so we don't keep pushing people away from democracy and government right here in our own country. they see us not fighting for them and not delivering for them. >> the two senators she's talking about, of course, are joe manchin and kyrsten sinema. with that, let's bring in our starting line on a wednesday
night. yamiche alcindor, jonathan karl, who has a book coming out november 16th, and neal katyal. good evening, and welcome to you all. yamiche, you know the rules surrounding presidential power. you don't exert it unless you think there's going to be a return because that's a precious commodity. tell us what you know about these plans to delay his departure so he can give a final sales pitch in the house. >> there are several sources
saying that president biden is expected to go to capitol hill tomorrow to meet with democrats to really try to seal this deal and to really marshal and unite democrats around voting for the infrastructure bill. it's interesting where the president finds himself. he's really been trying to exert pressure, trying to be a closer and a mediator in chief. but now, democrats, both progressives and moderates, have worked out much of the details. now they're looking to the president to say, okay, we need you, before you go to europe, to put this together. the question is whether or not this will work. today, we saw a lot of developments with the bill. but it's unclear what is in the bill. but sources say really important things like paid family leave are entirely out of the bill. it doesn't mean that that can't change in the next few hours. but that's a big deal for so many. i've been talking to advocates tonight about how they see it as
a blow to women of color, a blow to working class people in this country. the other thing that is big is that joe manchin is at the center of a lot of these changes. not only is he opposed to paid family leave, and also the billionaire tax. it's a new tax that senate democrats came up with to try to pay for this bill. but tomorrow will be a very interesting day. the president wants a win before he gets on the plane to go to europe. he wants to be able to tell different countries at the g-20, the climate conference, and the pope as well, what he's getting done at home. it's a big, big day with a lot of moving parts. >> and neal katyal, if you were running the 1/6 committee or advising the staff, what would you want asked to mr. clark and mr. eastman? >> i think jeff clark just has
to come and tell the truth. he was a low level environmental lawyer running temporarily the civil division. he decided to try to overstep his bounds by far. basically try and machinate to become the attorney general and displace jeffrey rosen, the acting attorney general. we need to know the story about what happened. and particularly what did trump say to him, and what did he say to trump, and what was trump's role in this whole thing? it's been almost a year, and we don't have answers to those basic questions. which is just unforgivable. as far as john eastman, i think a subpoena on him is inevitable. he tried last week to say he didn't believe his own memo. like he forgot who told him to even write it. that was part of his story. i've had hundreds of cases. you never forget who tells you to write a memo on something. if your task is to write a legal
memo to justify a coup and overthrow an election, i think you remember who told you to write that memo. >> yes. go ahead. >> and then things got worse for him today, there's three john eastmans. one is the guy who wrote the memo, one is the guy who disclaimed it, and the new guy who disagrees and says i'm all in on the coup, it's solid, and there's no legal argument against the memo. it's incomprehensible. i called him a trumpian legal scholar, but it's not legal and he's not a scholar. >> jon karl, what does this committee need to do to impress on the american people how
important 1/6 was? what endgame was supposed to be on 1/6? the democrats have routinely been charlie browned by the republicans for the past five years. >> the purpose of the committee is to do something dramatic. is to correct the record for history. but to portray exactly how horrific what happened on january 6th, and who was behind it. and to do it in a kind of a dramatic, factual way that will break through. and the bar is high here. because we had that happen already. we've had it happen during the senate impeachment trial. you remember how dramatic the playing of that video was on the floor of the senate. going minute by minute, what was happening on january 6th. so this committee needs to do something beyond that.
and they have two advantages that the impeachment managers did not have. one is the ability to call witnesses. and the other is the ability to subpoena documents from the white house. that's why this battle over executive privilege is so important. to get at the documents that will show what was going on around the president on january 6th, while the riot was happening. and in the time leading up to that riot. and this is not simply communications back and forth with aides. it's also things like the video outtakes. he did the one horrific video on january 6th where he told people to go home, but he also said we love you and justified what they were doing. that's one of, i'm told, several takes. earlier takes were deemed unacceptable because he didn't
tell them to go home. those were shot by white house videographers, they would be covered under the presidential records act. there was a photographer who was with president trump all the time. what images were captured from that day? this is all part of what they can do. and that's why this battle over executive privilege is so important. to get, compel, enforce the testimony of the people around the president, something the impeachment managers couldn't do. and to establish what president trump was up to when this was all going down. >> yamiche, back over to you. a point you made toward the end of your first answer, joe biden arrives at this summit in scotland. where did the notion first arrive that this had to be a hard and fast deadline? he had to put pen to paper before stepping foot on air
force one? is it really a case where the allies are sitting around the table, critiquing him on build back better before the final rose ceremony? >> well, the sense is that the deadlines that were really put in place were deadlines that democrats put in place themselves. let's remember, we're sort of in the second chapter of this. there was this earlier deadline that democrats blew through. and they wanted to get something done before the president left office. senator schumer is on the record saying he wanted to get both through by october 31st, by the end of the month. and there are thousands of workers at the department of transportation that could be furloughed come sunday if one bill doesn't get voted on. this is how congress works, but
the point is, there are real consequences, with the hard and soft deadlines. when it comes to whether or not allies and other countries are waiting around to see what president biden will do, i don't think there will be some sense that france will yell at president biden, how did you not get that deal done? but there's this sense that president biden, having had this message that america is back, it would be best for him, not required, but it would be best for him to go to climate conference and say, look what we're doing. i talked to some sources at the epa, and there are some things that the biden administration is doing that are not related to congress. there's this sense among democrats that time is winding down. and there wasn't a voting rights
or policing reform bill. so the democratic base is saying, what are democrats getting for us? and this coming tuesday, there are a lot of elections around the country. but chief among them, the virginia governor's race. terry mcauliffe has said very clearly, i would love democrats to give me something i can run on and be a closing argument. and say, look what we can get done if you elect me as governor. >> okay. that's a lot. neal, two things for you. number one, it is clark hiring a new attorney. number two, i need your reaction to this exchange -- this was sheldon whitehouse with the attorney general today. >> please tell me it has not been constrained only to people in the capitol. >> it's been by the prosecutors and the fbi field office.
>> great, and the old doctrine of follow the money -- >> it's fair to say. >> it's alive and well. >> it's fair to say that all investigative techniques of which you're particular, and some that maybe you're not familiar with because they post-date your time are all being pursued in this manner. >> counselor, what is your takeaway from that exchange there? >> i think it's that two people doing their job, the way it's supposed to be done. the senator asking the hard question, and the attorney general being careful and lawyerly, and not essentially answering the question. that's actually, i think, brian, something we should be celebrating. we've lived through joker attorneys general in the last administration who broke every norm and rule of the justice department. but the norm is really what garland is doing here. if there's a criminal investigation, he's not supposed to be tipping it off on the senate floor. or something like that. i think the key for garland is
not how he's answering these questions in a hearing. it's whether or not there will be real action at the end of the day. if he doesn't seek to jail steve bannon, if he doesn't do a full investigation of donald trump, if he doesn't prosecute the january 6th insurrectionists, if he doesn't do those things, he's going to be a failed attorney general at the end of the day, because the facts here are so far, everything we know, pretty darn compelling. if he does those investigations and actually finds that those people are all innocent, okay, so be it. but he's got to do the full investigation. i believe he will do those things. and i think he can't confirm that in a response to a question by a senator. that is fine. just because republican attorneys general have acted like hotheads and broken the norms, that doesn't mean that merrick garland is going to or has to. >> jon carl, the undercurrent of what we're saying is time.
the clock is ticking. the base, especially, is getting nervous and antsy. i want to read this from the author and activist don winslow, who was a guest of ours a few nights back. for the journalists interviewing members of the january 6th committee, three questions. why did it take six months for the committee to be formed? why did it take nine months for your first subpoena? three, why are you doing closed door hearings? but you see there, jon, people want to see punishment. and too many people are dissatisfied because what they're seeing seems plodding. >> senator whitehouse got at a critical question. not just going after the people who literally invaded the capitol building.
this went far beyond the insurrection we saw on capitol hill. this was an effort to overturn a presidential election and to seize power. so winslow made three points. i think the first two are very good. the third one on closed hearings, as you know, you have a good investigation is a lot of work behind closed doors before the public hearing commences. a lot of discovery, a lot of gathering of facts. this committee is going to have to have major primetime hearings, televised hearings in primetime by next summer. and there is a real deadline on all of this. and that's the midterm elections. because you don't know if republicans will take over congress in november of 2022. if they do, this committee goes away. this committee, and they're keenly aware of that deadline.
and i think that there's a lot of fair criticism of what has taken so long to get to the point we are now. but they need to get into a position where they can have a full-on, primetime hearings by next summer. before we get into the fall campaign. >> great thanks to our starting line on this wednesday night. yamiche, jonathan, neal. i appreciate you coming on. coming up, reaction to the stunning new numbers on how many still think the 2020 election should be overturned. and later, talking about policing and race in america. and what congressional action can mean in policing reform. all of it as "the 11th hour" is just getting under way on this wednesday night. ng under way ons wednesday night. th was so bad i would be in a lot of pain.
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am i disappointed on things that are out? yes. but if you look at what is in, i still think it's making progress. >> make of that what you wish. there's plenty of disappointment to go around, truth be told, as more and more provisions are going over the side. and there's a chance biden will delay his departure for europe tomorrow after spending time with those democrats. joining us, eugene robinson and mark mckinnon. gentlemen, great to have you back. eugene, this is the editorial board down the hall from you at your beloved "washington post." as they approached a deal, they
appear to be at risk of producing legislation that would amount to a tragic missed opportunity. on the revenue side, their plans might easily result in massive new debt. this is not what mr. biden promised. eugene, indeed, can they really call this a victory? can they say this matches the president's standard of transformational legislation if this is going to be death by 1,000 cuts? >> well, look, brian, if they are able to pass a package with something between $1.75 trillion and $2 trillion worth of new spending, that's a very big deal. it's likely because of the way this has played out over weeks
and months that a lot of people will be talking more about what is not in the bill than what is actually in the bill. only democrats could manage that, not to be able to talk about the stuff that they will be doing for people, that people will need and want. universal pre-k, the child tax credit, climate change funding that is in there and acceptable to joe manchin, et cetera. all of this stuff is really a big deal. and i'm not sure it's that bad or bad politics to have some of these provisions theoretically sunset in a few years. as we all know, it's difficult to stop programs as they become popular and useful and people like them. >> mark, every day, all the
cable networks have a conference call during which we agree to the minimum number of joe manchin references each day and each night. i was worried we would fall short on the quota. but what do you say to that argument, you're really going to let one 74-year-old guy from west virginia kill family and medical leave? >> i think it's an outstanding question. i know that seems to be what joe manchin has said, where he's drawing the line. but i have a feeling it may be back on the table. i think eugene makes some great points. part of the problem is, the expectations were so high. the notion is to be transformational along the lines of llbj or fdr. and the reality is,
$1.5 trillion or $2 trillion bill will be transformational. and the messaging, talking about price tags instead of policies, i wish senators sinema and manchin would float up the potomac and work this out. we just need to get those two on the same page, and i think we have a deal. >> just them and their food taster on that boat, it will be safer. both gentlemen will stick around. i need to fit in a break. an alarming number of our fellow
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number of our fellow citizens, 35%, still say they believe the election should be overturned. still with us, eugene robinson and mark mckinnon. stewart stevens was on a couple nights back, and he said there is one political party that is pro-democracy anymore. what do you do about this, even if trump went away tomorrow, never said another word, never authored another ridiculous letter to "the wall street journal," it's in the bloodstream. >> you're right, brian. there's no better evidence that if you repeat a lie enough, even in the face of zero evidence, that people will believe it. it's hugely problematic for the republican party, for our country, for our democracy. the greatest fraud in american politics is the notion that there was systemic election fraud. the arizona audit, paid for by
republican trump supporters. they not only found no fraud, they found more votes for joe biden. and the texas lieutenant governor offered a reward for any fraud. and last week, he paid out $25,000 to one person in pennsylvania who found someone who voted for trump twice. there's simply no systemic election fraud. and almost zero fraud, period. there's just a handful of cases of people who put out the wrong address, or the guy in pennsylvania who voted for trump twice. >> eugene, let's talk about the other side of this. a while back, you were on talking about your column, which basically said the democrats are doomed storyline is overwrought.
would you buy, "a," democrats can't get out of their own way, or "b," democrats can't find their own keister with both hands and a flashlight? >> both of them are kind of true. but i'm still not convinced that democrats are necessarily doomed. number one, they're the only sane pro-democracy political party in operation in this country right now. and that actually does count for something. it counted for something in the election last november. and i think it will continue to count for something. so as messy as the spending battle is, and as bad as the democrats are at messaging, in the end, they are standing up for american principles, american government, american democracy. you may disagree with some of their policies, but look at the
republican party. and this has been found to be a lie, not just in the examples that mark gave, 60 federal courts, federal judges in case after case after case found there's absolutely no substance. absolutely nothing there. this did not happen. and i have to believe that leaving what actually happened in the end, is better politically than believing in something that is just fiction. that's just a lie. >> it is a toxin. it is a dark force in our politics that will affect every election of every kind going forward for a good, long while, i fear. eugene, mark, both of these gentlemen are friends of this broadcast. we thank you both for coming on tonight. coming up, 30 years of insight into how policing works
and when it doesn't. we'll talk with former police chief carmen best about her new book, "black in blue." when "the 11th hour" continues. [ sneeze ] are you ok? oh, it's just a cold. if you have high blood pressure, a cold is not just a cold. unlike other cold medicines, coricidin provides powerful cold relief without raising your blood pressure be there for life's best moments with coricidin. now in sugar free liquid. if you have this... consider adding this. an aarp medicare supplement insurance plan from unitedhealthcare. medicare supplement plans help by paying some of what medicare doesn't... and let you see any doctor. any specialist. anywhere in the u.s. who accepts medicare patients. so if you have this... consider adding this. call unitedhealthcare today for your free decision guide. ♪ you could fret about that email you just sent. ...with a typo. aaaand most of the info is totally outdated.
move to a sofi personal loan. earn $10 just for viewing your rate — and get your money right. ♪ nearly a year and a half since george floyd was killed, still there is no police reform measure at the federal level. it should surprise no one in 2021 that the votes just weren't there for it. our next guest has a unique perspective on how to effectively change policing in america after three decades serving the city of seattle,
former police chief carmen best writes in her new book, to beat racism and sexism, to truly become one nation that recognizes just how much black lives do matter, we must first and foremost erase racism and sexism from within our own households. back with us, carmen best. she's the author of this new book, "black in blue." chief, i'd like to begin with another quote from inside your book. i am a huge supporter of the black lives matter movement. and a firm believer in not abolishing or defunding it to the pound where police officers can no longer carry out their jobs. as was the case when the city
council in seattle decided we had to do it with 50% less money. chief, talk about the circumstances that led to your departure from that job. >> thank you for having me on, brian, to talk about the book and lessons on leadership and breaking barriers. what led to my leaving ultimately was the fact that the city council was going to cut the budget for the police force effectively ensuring that we would have 50% less officers to respond to calls for service, in a city that already was seeing some issues around gun violence and other issues. we really needed to have a police officer response. in order to do that, we would have to last-in, first-out. that meant a number of the officers, mostly women and minorities would lose their job, effectively making the department less diverse than
before. >> i hear my fancier friends in new york city complaining about the fact that atvs, dirt bikes, and motorcycles have taken over the nighttime streets of the city. and i tell these folks, a lot of them haven't spent an hour or a day wondering what it would be like in the shoes of a police officer. if someone says you should be defunded, are you going to put out 100%, or will you work to the rule as written? and that, chief, i'm afraid, is what we're seeing in a lot of cities. >> i'm afraid you might be right about that. i talk about that quite a bit in the book. the level of morale and the issues. many of the officers, the vast number of them, are hard-working people. really will sacrifice a lot on behalf of others. a very difficult job. and many in seattle in particular but across the nation
are leaving the job because they don't feel supported by the public and in most cases by elected city officials or other officials. and that, to me, is a real tragedy. >> i was hoping that so many of the young people we saw in the streets and there's never been a better or more kind of brutal cause to hit the streets for after george floyd died. i was hoping that some of them may be moved to sign up. get on the waiting list. enter the academy, try to change policing from within. if that doesn't happen, and if there's nothing from the federal level, then what is going to happen to policing policy? >> no, there is this strange dichotomy that they were looking at. do we end up with a police force or not having it? and how do we operate as a
society without someone to enforce the rules that are needed? it's sad to see there's this element out there that believes we would be better off without having public safety service. that's just not the case. we need public safety, we need police officers. we also need alternatives to situations, and when people are in crisis, and that is important as well. but it's both. it's not either/or. you need both things to invest in. invest in your cops, invest in public health and public safety. invest in mental health. because they intersect in ways that really do cause issues with pushl safety. . >> chief, quick question before the break. the first case of covid was in the seattle area. you write about how it had a unifying effect, that everyone was together in the fight.
what happens when you see the police officers walking off the job because they're anti-vaccine? >> one of the things i talk about is how police officers are just a microcosm of society as a whole. many of the issues we're facing as a nation we're facing as a police department as well. many people don't want to get the vaccination. that said, it makes me incredibly sad. because we need to make sure that when people, when officers are contacting literally thousands of people every single day, they're doing so in a way that is the most safe for everybody. i will say quickly, i've seen officers put themselves in harm's way to protect others. so it's surprising that they won't take this shot for the safety of so many. themselves, their families, and their co-workers and the public.
>> chief, you've agreed to stay with us for just this break. coming up, we'll continue our conversation. i want to ask about the growing threat of domestic violence and domestic extremism. what does it matter so much for our police forces across the country? our police forces acrose country? but there is one van equipped to handle them all. for over 120 years, mercedes-benz vans have been built, upfitted and ready to go. because we believe dreams - should never stay that way.
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still with us, our guest carmen best. former police chief in the city of seattle. chief, i want to talk to you about domestic terrorism. we've been told over and over again from the department of homeland security that it's probably the leading domestic threat we face. it means that local police officers are by definition the first line of defense. domestic terrorists have to strike somewhere. wherever they strike, there will be police officers on duty.
back to what we said about first responders. talk about the responsibility that places on departments and the force and things like training and equipment. >> well, absolutely, brian. i talk about this in "black and blue," the fact that having a first line responders and police officers, they're the ones who typically see that things are out of order. we have a very strong contingent of the federal agencies that will often come in and investigate these cases. but officers will be the first ones, they're in the neighborhoods and on the streets. they'll see when something is awry or out of order. they'll get the anonymous tips and information because of their availability within the public. that can be such a help for us in curtailing domestic terrorist acts and things that happen in our homeland. these issues of not having
enough officers on the street actually affect the overall safety of the nation. in terms of domestic terrorists and domestic acts. >> as we've been watching, on 1/6, it was law enforcement officers who got a beatdown from the same people who go home and say they're big fans of law enforcement officers. our thanks to former police chief carmen best. the book she's just authored is "black in blue." chief, thank you. always a pleasure. coming up, when members of the audience say the darnedest and often most dangerous things. tonight, we have something to show you. something to show you
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last thing before we go tonight, another installment of we watch this stuff so you won't have to. but this is a moment you should see. let's set the scene. there's an ardent trumper named charlie kirk. his organization is called turning point usa. there he is. he's
currently on what he calls the critical racism tour. as all major tours do, this one recently made a stop in napa, idaho, on the campus of northwest nazarene university. where charlie kirk called on a man in the audience who had a question. >> at this point, we're living
under corporate and medical fascism. this is tyranny. when do we get to use the guns. no, and i'm not -- that's not a joke. i'm not saying it like that. literally, where is the line? how many elections are they going to steal before we kill these people? >> so, no, i -- hold on. stop. hold on. now, i'm going to denounce that and tell you why. because you're playing into all their plans. they're trying to make you do this. that's okay. hear me out. you started with a compliment so at least give me a little bit. they're trying to provoke you and everyone here. they're trying to make you do something that will be violent. that will justify a takeover of your freedoms and liberties the likes of which we've never seen. we're close to having momentum to be able to get this country back on a trajectory using the peaceful means that we have at us.
to answer your question, and i just think it's, you know, overly blunt, we have to be the ones who do not play into the violent aims and ambitions of the other side. they fear us, holding the line with self-control and discipline taking over school board meetings. they're the ones that are willing to use federal force against us. and i know that people get fired up. we are living under fascism and tyranny. but if you think that they don't want to to get that next level, where they say, we need patriot act 2.0,
if you think waco is bad, wait until you see what they want to do next. >> again, just to give you an idea of what is out there. and national democrats who are not dialed in to this or who are ignoring this kind of talk do so at their peril and ours. as we all prepare to live another day under tyranny and fascism, or as they're known by
other names, vaccines and masks during a pandemic. that will do it for our wednesday night. on behalf of our colleagues of the networks of nbc news, good night. the g8, it was us, canad, france, the uk, italy, germany, japan and russia. that's eight. it was the g8, from the late 90s on. and you know, the j.a. always had a little bit of drama. there were often big anti globalization protests targeting, the annual g8 meetings. there was once a big spending scandal involving the uk, when the uk host of the g8 ones. it was also really super awkward one year when italy host to the g8, right after their prime minister got