tv Yasmin Vossoughian Reports MSNBC July 31, 2021 12:00pm-1:00pm PDT
will pick up coverage after a short break. have a great saturday. ♪ ♪ good afternoon. i'm yasmin vossoughian. a rare saturday session right now in the senate as an infrastructure deal moves closer to passage, but house members left before extending an eviction moratorium, a move that could leave millions on the streets. in texas, a major rally after a march is now the latest effort by democrats to fight republican efforts to curtail voting rights there. bombshell new reporting on the former president's efforts to get the department of justice to sign off on his election lies. all of that, plus -- check out this scene you've got to see to believe. still in the middle of this pandemic, but no sign of that from the crowds at lola pa looz au right now. we will take you there just ahead. certainly no social distancing happening there.
we want to begin with the senate's special saturday session. the bipartisan group tasked with creating the infrastructure bill is still working to finalize the text of the deal right now as senate majority leader chuck schumer is expressing his eagerness to get the legislation on the floor for amendment votes. ali vitali is on capitol hill and has been following it for us. great to see you this afternoon. everyone is on the edge of their seat waiting for the text to be released. it easily could be about 2,500 pages of text laying out this bill. any indication we're closer to that moment? >> reporter: yeah, look, it is probably going to be lengthy. they have been working ot for weeks now as this bipartisan group has been negotiating. they've been drafting the text along with it. it doesn't mean it is a quick process. certainly quite the opposite here. throughout the week we've heard from senators who tried to say the bill is coming in the next hour, the bill is coming tomorrow. that deadline just keeps getting pushed back. today here in congress the halls are pretty quiet. we did hear from senate majority
leader chuck schumer this morning though. his message was effectively, hurry up. listen. >> i understand that writing the text of a bill of this size is a difficult project. i have been part of many such efforts in the past, but i urge the bipartisan group to finish their work so we can begin the amendment process. the longer it takes to finish, the longer we will be here, but we're going to get the job done. >> reporter: it is a little bit of a warning there at the end, the longer this takes to finish the longer we're going to be here. we know that democrats and the white house both have pinned a lot of hopes, not just on the bipartisan part of this more traditional infrastructure bill, but also the part that comes next, the duel track with this. for democrats and progressives who want to see not just movement on traditional infrastructure which has been negotiated in a bipartisan fashion, but also the ability to move ahead on a reconciliation bill which will go through a more partisan fashion. that's where you will touch on
the nontraditional parts, things like bolstering child care and elder care, that kind of thing the white house has trumpeted in tandem with the more traditional parts of the bill. >> ali, i guess the question here is when could we actually see a vote happen on this, aside, of course, from debate over some of the amendments we could see in the coming days? i mean what could we actually expect here? >> reporter: i think that is really the $550 billion question here on capitol hill, yasmin, because, as i mentioned, you talk to senators, you talk to lawmakers here in the hallway. everyone just keeps moving these goalposts. there is such a desire to get this bill on to the floor, to get it voted on. we have seen the procedural parts move forward. at the same time though you can't do anything if you don't have the text to the bill. you got to remember also that a lot of these offices, once they have the text, there's going to be a desire to actually read what is in it. this is not a short process. it is a cumbersome one
certainly. but, again, the politics of this moment is such that the white house has staked a lot of political capital on infrastructure, democrats here have also done the same. there is a desire to get it finished as quickly as possible, but speed is not something that you are necessarily known here for in the senate. >> stay close, ali vitali. we will be checking back in with you throughout the next two hours or so as we await the text to come through. hopefully soon. nbc's ali vitali for us on capitol hill. thank you. good to see you. we will continue the conversation at 4:00 p.m. with new york congressman espaillat. we will get his take on the infrastructure bill and whether he thinks there's enough support to move the bill to the president as desk. once again today texas is in the crosshairs of this battle to save voting rights. the three-day protest march led by civil rights leaders ended with a rally at the state capital a short time ago. the crowd heard from preachers, politicians, activists as well, on why texas should not make voting harder on its citizens.
take a listen. >> we have less voting rights protections today than we had on august 6th, 1965. we are seeing the greatest attack on voting rights since the end of the civil war, and this must change now. >> greatest attack since the end of the civil war. joined by gary grumbach following this for us in texas. good to see you. the crowd has diss pursed behind you, now over. talk us through what you saw, what you experienced today in the effort to start republican texans there in passing this. >> reporter: yeah, that's right. you know, the crowd has dispersed but there were thousands of people here. they even got to hear from willie nelson a little bit, he played a couple of songs which was exciting for a lot of them. it was the culmination of a four-day march from georgetown,
texas, to austin, texas, the state capital. the excitement was palpable. they were calling on president joe biden and congress to do something, do anything as it relates to voting rights legislation. and in washington it is a little bit different, it is a little slower than folks here want it to be. yesterday at the white house the president, the vice president, congressional leaders met and they talked about the way forward for this voting rights legislation. but according to our reporting from the hill team it will be a little different than what may have been expected. it won't be the full voting rights bill you may think. it will be focused on voting access specifically. we are talking about early voting and same-day voter registration, and that certainly is not enough for the folks here on the ground. but i want to tell you, have you take a listen to what former congressman beto o'rourke had to say about all of this. >> it may be texas that has proposed new voter suppression legislation to make it harder on those who have a disability, to make it harder on young people, the very old and those who just
want to exercise their right to vote, but i'll tell you what. my fellow texans, this state has produced some extraordinary leaders, some extraordinary power, and some extraordinary energy. >> reporter: as things are in congress, it all has to do with timing. there the congress, they're out on august recess right now. folks here at the texas legislature, their special session only lasts until next saturday. so advocates here are trying to put what they call the street heat on lawmakers to make a change. yasmin. >> street heat. street height. gary grumbach for us in austin. thank you. >> i want to turn now to this new really i should say jaw-dropping insight into the former president's final days in office and even more revelations about his desperate efforts to really overturn the results of the 2020 election. house oversight committee members released new documents citing handwritten notes from top trump doj officials saying the former president pressed the
justice department to declare the results corrupt, despite as we know having no evidence to support the claims. according to these notes taken by former acting deputy attorney general donoghue to, quote, just say the election was corrupt and leave the rest to me and congressional allies. notes of the late december call were handed over to members of the house oversight committee who obtained them in the negligence of trump's attempt to overturn the 2020 election results. the department of justice can now give unrestricted testimony. let's talk about this. with me, former federal prosecutor georgetown law professor and msnbc contributor, paul butler. good to see you. thanks for joining us on this saturday afternoon. this is jaw dropping stuff, the
former president would pick up the phone, call his acting ag at the time and say, declare this thing corrupt and i will take care of the rest. the fact a sitting president at the time would do something like this seems unprecedented. does this leave him vulnerable and open to any type of criminal prosecution from what you see? >> yasmin, there certainly is sufficient predicate for federal criminal investigation of former president trump. it is a federal crime to knowingly and willfully deprive a state's residents of a free and fair election, and it is another federal crime to conspire to prevent people from exercising their civil rights including the right to vote. the problem for prosecutors would be proving trump's criminal intent. did he really believe this big lie that he had won? if he did, that would be a defense. on the other hand, if he knew he lost and this was an intentional
effort to subvert our free and fair election, it is hard to imagine a more appropriate case for criminal prosecution. this was an extraordinarily dangerous moment for our democracy. >> talk about though, paul, how difficult it is to prove intent. i mean we have had an iteration of this conversation over the last five years so many different times because the conversation the former president has had with top officials, right, whether or not his intent was such. how difficult is it to even go down that road? >> it is almost like answering the question was trump just extraordinarily ignorant or was he evil in a criminal culpable way. there's some evidence that he knew that what he was doing was wrong because we had this repeated conduct, including not
just pressuring the justice department but pressuring his own vice president on january 6th to ignore the constitution and somehow not try to -- not try to certify those election results. we also know the situation in georgia where he -- his folks told georgia election officials, find me 11,780 votes. so when you get this pattern over and over, that's evidence to prosecutors that this guy knew that he was doing something wrong and yet he kept doing it. >> could it also though be evidence, paul, of the fact that this former president didn't even know what he was doing, that, in fact, he was just so incredibly naive to believe these lies, right? you think about the phone call the president had with president zelensky that was a topic of the russia investigation in his impeachment trials obviously, and the way in which he talked
about investigating hunter biden in that phone call, how these are related and whether or not that evidence can be used either for our against bringing a case against the former president when it comes to these phone calls with doj officials? >> yeah, you know, that's a great point, yasmin. again, i think that when we see this repeated conduct over and over, and it is not just that the president is making this request. it is that government officials are telling him, no, mr. president, there is no evidence of fraud in this election. >> got it. >> just as the impeachment proceedings he was told, you can't do this, this is corrupt. so when someone is told over and over again this is illegal and they still press on, maybe they just don't believe the legal advice but maybe they know it is wrong and that doesn't matter. that's why it is so important to continue this investigation so
that nobody, including the president of the united states, can ever held to be above the law. >> what's your sense, paul, about merrick garland, whether he has an appetite or not for pursuing something against the former president? >> another great question, yasmin, because so far garland's justice department has generally followed the tradition of protecting presidential power, even former presidents. it is kind of an institutional commitment, but this week we saw a different approach. the justice department will not try to prevent its former officials from testifying about the events of january 6th, and the fact that we saw these notes about trump's, again, unprecedented efforts to subvert the democracy by pressuring the justice department. the fact that we know about this is because merrick garland's justice department allowed this evidence to become public. they didn't try to fight it, claiming executive privilege. so it is a good sign that the
garland justice department understands that it can't use the prerogatives or traditions of the justice department to not let this evidence come to light. the american people must know about the corruption of the trump administration in trying to subvert our democracy. >> paul butler, thank you as always. good to see you. coming up, everybody, in our 4:00 p.m. hour we are going to dive into what these latest revelations mean for investigations related to the former president, plus what we could actually learn from the former president's taxes now that the doj has paved the way for a house panel to actually review them. new jersey congressman bill pascrell and david farenthold of "the washington post" are going to join me live for the next hour. you don't want to miss that. from chicago, a scene as the city experiences a spike in covid cases. a live report from lallapalooza.
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welcome back. crowds are growing but masks are nowhere in sight at this year's lallapalooza festival in chicago. that is where we find nbc's jay gray. jay, good to see you this afternoon. i got to tell you, the crowds there pretty concerning. all of those folks crowded in together, not much social distancing. i mean i get it, right? after having been on lockdown for so long, you want to celebrate, you want to have fun. >> reporter: right. >> you have gotten the vaccine, hopefully, for many of those folks. they want to enjoy the music, but nonetheless this delta variant is concerning for a lot of folks. new cdc guidelines in place. what is happening there on the ground now that you are seeing? >> reporter: no, you are dead on with all of that, yasmin. you are right, it is the delta
variant which is really pushed the surge here in the chicago area, four times more infections over the last month than in the previous month and growing here. there are a ton of people showing up. saturday, usually the busiest day of this four-day festival and looks like that will be the case today. we are seeing waves of people coming into grant park now. there is a new mask restriction just enacted yesterday, so today and tomorrow if you are in an enclosed area inside the park you have to have a mask on. it doesn't matter if you are vaccinated or not. without question when you talk to those going to the event, the virus is top of mind. >> i am a very social person, but since like covid i have found myself being a little bit more scared to be in social settings. so i think, like, after we get the ball rolling and everything i will be fine. it definitely is weird being around all of these people. >> yeah, vaccinated and i got the first round and, yeah, i'm safe. i'm not in the demographics where if i unfortunately get
sick i won't technically die, but, you know, i'm okay. then i stay away from my older relatives. so after this we're not going to see anyone for two weeks. >> reporter: yeah, and so here is the thing. it is that tug-of-war you talked about, yasmin. it is being locked up for so long and now having the chance to be out. it is outdoors, which is great, but when you are pushed up against a stage, when you are in a pack of people as massive as we see here, there has to be some exchange there. then think of this. once it is over, 10:30, 11:00 as people pour out and into the city, they're going into the restaurants, they're going into the bars, so they're in enclosed areas. it will be interesting to see how it plays out over the next couple of weeks. not only here in chicago, but in cities across the country, people flying in to be a part of this. >> yeah, it is a tough position to be in to say the least. it will be interesting to watch as things play out there. jay gray for us in chicago. thanks for your coverage on this. appreciate it. by the way, a little later on i will be speaking to dr. kavita patel who will join me live to
really address some of your covid concerns, including a fact check on those breakthrough cases that we're seeing. but coming up, we are about eight-and-a-half hours away from an eviction crisis. millions of americans facing homelessness as a nationwide eviction moratorium ends at midnight. we will show you the real-life impact this is having on families. i will do. we haven't been really saving money because we've been putting what we have towards the rent. . because we were created for officers. but as we've evolved with the military, we've grown to serve all who've honorably served. no matter their rank, or when they were in. a marine just out of basic, or a petty officer from '73. and even his kids. and their kids. usaa is made for all who've honorably served and their families. are we still exclusive? absolutely.
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the day. we will continue to keep our eye on things there and bring you updates as we get them. as i mentioned, ali vitali is on this. welcome back because of the emergency federal policy standing between millions of americans and the loss of their home throughout the pandemic that will expire. it is coming following the failure of an 11th hour scramble from house democrats to pass an extension of the moratorium last night before breaking for a recess. cori bush slams on her colleagues for heading out of time before passing an extension. bush, who experienced homelessness in the past, slept on the steps of the capitol in protest, calling on the democratic leaders to bring back the house to vote. she remains on the steps where she spoke to my partner, jonathan capehart, earlier this morning. let's listen. >> if this country has not fixed the housing crisis we had until now, if the country couldn't get it right to make sure people had
adequate housing, if we continue do it right even though i know the unhoused bill of rights is the way to fix it by 2025. we have the formula, so we will show it to you and put it forward so you can see that. but while we're looking at that how do we put 7 million more people out on the street? >> all right. i want to bring in guad venegas following this for us in los angeles. i think the two major questions here, first and foremost, where do we go from there and what type of impact is this going to have on americans? >> reporter: right. most people want to know what happens now, right, because the house has now gone into recess. we know millions of people, as the congress woman said, at least 6.5 million, will be left vulnerable to these evictions. now, what can happen is local cities, counties or states can pass their own moratorium. they can ban these evictions. california, new jersey and some other states have already done so to protect a lot of the
renters that are in this need, right. i think the big picture here to think of is the fact that the $46 billion that the federal governmental located and sent to the states to distribute to the people in need have not made their way to all of the people. you know, there was a very slow process. you have some states that have the applications still pending, people waiting to receive this money as the moratorium will end. in new york the governor has assigned more workers to go over these applications. numbers coming out of florida where they say only 2% of the money has been disbursed. so you have the issue with the money slowly making its way to the renters, not fast enough with this moratorium already ending tomorrow. at a federal level, at this point nothing can come from congress because of this recess. >> geez. >> but we could see some last-minute legislation perhaps at a local level. meanwhile, as the congresswoman mentioned, millions will be left vulnerable to these evictions, yasmin. >> all right. guad venegas for us.
thank you, guad, appreciate it. i want to bring in scott spivey, executive director of mississippi home corporation. pam chapman as well is joining us. pam is the chair of boss lady workforce and is a boss lady herself. i know pam well. i appreciate, pam, you joining us on this. scott, i will start with you on this one and kind of want to get your reaction first and foremost to the failure of congress to pass the extension last night. >> well, it is a concern. it is a concern for all of us, you know, especially where we are here in mississippi that landlords will have the option to begin filing evictions tomorrow. one of the positives though is in the message we've been trying to give mississippi landlords is the federal assistance that's available and the money is starting to go out everywhere now, landlords are not eligible for that if they choose to evict. it is in their best interest to be patient and wait for the
funds to get to them, to help their tenants file applications or in places where you can file on behalf of tenants or start an application. it behooves them to do that rather than give up the rent they had to forego during the crisis. >> how are you getting the word out to these landlords, that message, scott? >> well, in mississippi we are doing several different things. we are in the middle of an awareness campaign. we are holding in-person events in cities. we had our first one last week, you know, over 1,000 people came, land lords and tenants. you know, hundreds of complete applications filed. working with utility companies, you know. one of the things we did to publicize the jackson event was drop a flyer in everybody's water bill because we can, you know, pay rent and utilities. so it is just, you know, running up against this eviction deadline. the eviction deadline is not hopefully going to be the cliff that we fear it will be. hopefully landlords will act in their own best interests and in
the interest of their tenants. >> gosh, let's hope not. pam, i know you are in the know in that area. you have gotten a lot of text messages, messages from folks, people coming up to you asking for help because of what is happening with this eviction moratorium. people already homeless, not even waiting until midnight, right? >> absolutely. >> folks already living in their cars. give me a sense of the situation on the ground from your perspective, what you are seeing and hearing. >> right here in the mississippi delta, which is one of the poorest areas of mississippi, we have been receiving phone calls, text messages, in boxes all morning telling us some landlords have already -- are taking them to court on monday and evicting them immediately. we have received phone calls from people who are actually living in their car it right here in cleveland, mississippi, throughout the county. so what we're doing is trying to make sure that we are asking, we are urging, we are begging the
landlords, please, do not put these individuals out. we are actually going to partner with mississippi home corporation to have a rental assistance fair here this month. so we're asking, you know, we're receiving so many calls, people crying on the phone, and these are families with children that are going to be on the street tonight and next week. >> so i'll ask you, pam, the same question i asked scott, which is are the landlords heeding your calls? are they understanding the predicament, the situation in which so many of the folks in their buildings are in? despite the fact that for months they likely haven't received rent maybe during this time. >> well, one of the things that we're doing is actually calling the landlords ourselves. i'm calling them. i'm begging them. i will be in court on monday in the county, going to the court
system, trying to talk with the judges to not and to plead with them, please do not evict these people because we already know that the courts are going to be full on monday for eviction notice. >> i want to play some sound of a mom in mississippi who spoke to my colleague, morgan radford recently, who is facing eviction with children, not unlike the situation pam just laid out for us. let's take a listen to that. >> reporter: what happens to you and your three kids if you do not get this assistance? >> i don't know. i mean shelter until we can find something. >> reporter: how difficult is the application process? >> it asks for a lot of information like state id, birth certificates, 2020 tax returns. they make it so hard. >> reporter: do you have a computer? >> i was doing it all off my phone. >> and this is another issue, both scott and pam, and i want you to react to this.
pam, you go first, which is folks are intimidated by the process of getting help, right. how much of that -- >> absolutely -- >> how much is that playing into this. >> right. one of the things that we're going to do is we're bringing in state volunteers and organization volunteers because we do not want anyone to leave our fair without getting help. so we know that a lot of people here do not have computers, so those paperwork are -- these applications will be done by paper. we will try to bring in a lot of volunteers to make sure that these people get the help that they need. but, see, another issue that the young lady talked about, going to shelter, we have no shelters here really in the central part of mississippi delta. so what do they do? they live in their cars. >> scott, is that part of the problem that you're seeing as well, folks intimidated by the process? >> access to technology, being intimidated by the process is
absolutely one of reasons we are having these assistance fairs where we bring in, you know, the staff from the agency, staff from nonprofits who have been trained to kind of walk people through the application process. you know, the paper applications are available. the other thing that i think is important, we did reach out to all the justice court judges in mississippi to let them know not to evict starting on monday for nonpayment of rent and made them aware of the program. there are other funds available, that were made available with the coronavirus relief act for rapid rehousing. there is a safety net through the local continuums of care, but i don't want to have to use it. there's plenty of money for rental assistance that's available if landlords will hold off. the money is flowing, and just hold off from eviction, and if
judges will hold off from processing evictions in the courts for nonpayment of rents. the money is there. it would be a shame to ruin people's lives and their credit and kick them out of their homes when the resources are available. >> and make them go through this, to live in a car with a child. >> exactly. >> and how that's going to have generational reverberations of, you know, their development if they have to live in a car for the next month or so because they don't have a home or a roof over their heads, especially in the hot summer months in mississippi. i have been there, it is hot in mississippi where you guys are, especially right now. >> that's right. >> scott, quickly, if folks want to get help in that area, how do they get help? >> go to ms-ramp.com or call the mississippi home corporation and we've got a call center. you know, we have experts standing by, you know, ready to take applications, ready to help people walk through it and keep an eye on the local news because we are probably coming to your area pretty soon. >> pam, how can folks reach out to you and the work that you're
doing? >> they can always reach out to me on social media as they have already or they can actually give me a call at 662-588-2019. 662-588-2019. >> scott, i haven't met you in person. i have met pam and work with her, especially over vaccine hesitancy in the bayou, in the mississippi area. i know she knows the community really well and will put her number out there to assist. we appreciate both of you guys and the work you are doing in that area. it is an uphill battle. hopefully folks can keep their heads up amidst this. still ahead, if you are headed to a san francisco bar be prepared to be carded twice. it is not your id bouncers want. a look at how businesses in one city banded together to protect patrons and staff as covid cases surge across this country. plus, what caused this massive mudslide that trapped drivers for hours?
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welcome back, everybody. breaking news out of northern california where at least 16,000 people have been forced to flee their homes as the so-called dixie fire becomes are saying t fire line is just 24% contained, so so far more than 240,000 acres of land have, in fact, been scorched. that makes it the 11th largest fire in the state's history. while the cause remains under investigation, record temperatures, drought conditions continuing to make this fire and others in the state burning right now, in fact, difficult to contain. an unbelievable scene in colorado where more than 100 drivers were trapped due to mudslides. some cars were buried, at least 29 were stuck in a tunnel for nearly nine hours on the highway in glenwood canyon, colorado, 90 minutes east of grand junction, colorado.
rain had fallen over that area that had been burned with the grizzly creek fire, triggering the flow of mud and debris. thankfully though nobody was hurt. miraculously nobody was hurt. a member of congress is facing a potential federal fine after trying to get on a plane with a gun. north carolina congressman madison cawthorn attempted to board a plane with a gun. in addition to a federal fine he likely will lose special security status when, in fact, boarding planes. coming up, concern over breakthrough covid cases. dr. kavita patel joining me with how concerned we should be about these cases. learn more about yours. at ancestry.
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welcome back, everybody. amid a surge in covid cases some bars and restaurants in san francisco are requiring patrons to show proof of vaccination status or a recent negative covid test in order to eat or drink inside. scott cohn is joining me live from san francisco with more on this. scott, good to see you. talk me through how this came together and who led the effort to require this. >> reporter: this is a group called the san francisco bar owners alliance. it is 500 bar owners representing some 300 establishments like the irish public behind me. now, for some perspective, there are something like 3,000 bars in
san francisco and we're hae not sure how many of the bar owners alliance are going to actually put together, or implement i should say this policy. again, the idea is that you can't come in without showing proof of vaccination or a negative covid test within the last 72 hours. of ways out of desperation. >> what really stood out from the conversations we were having is just how much frustration a with these numb nuts who are not getting vaccines by choice. in the face of incredible amount of data, in the face of every scientific professional who is not deep in the realm of youtube, right, all of the recommendations are to get a vaccine. we know the vaccinated people are much, much, much less likely to contract this. >> reporter: so they decided to do this ahead of any government mandates, and there's a practical consideration here as well. if you lose an employee to
covid, there's not exactly workers out there to replace them. they're dealing with these huge worker shortages in san francisco so it is more than just the safety of the patrons and the staff. yasmin. >> have you heard of any opposition to some of these new requirements, scott? >> reporter: nothing that we know of here in san francisco. of course, it is early yet. nationwide, the whole industry is really trying to come to grips with this, different rules in different places and different establishments, and one of the officials of the national restaurant association told us that really the industry is facing a dilemma. >> the restaurant industry is still reeling from a pandemic in which they've been shut down for 16 months, taking on crushing amounts of debt. so as they look at these issues it is a horrible option that they have available. it is do you want to turn away more customers, what do you do to ensure the safety and health of our workforce and our customers, but there are no good answers right now.
>> reporter: 90,000 restaurants nationwide either temporarily or permanently closed. the industry is now struggling, yasmin, under some $290 billion in debt. >> all right. scott, thank you so much. appreciate it. want to bring in now msnbc medical contributor dr. kavita patel to talk more about this. dr. patel, good to see you on this. wow, here we are again, right, talking about kind of a surge of this pandemic with the delta variant, folks having to wear masks once again in certain areas that have kind of more of a surge than others. i first want to talk about the mask mandate on a federal level, right. talk me through the decision to have a federal mask mandate or federal employees, and if -- sorry, not mask mandate, vaccine mandate. and if not getting vaccinated, then weekly testing. how could that help, the weekly testing part considering the fact you could actually be infected during that time period and be walking around covid
positive? >> yeah, it is a great question, yasmin. i think, first of all, the fact that they put the mandate out there shows that they're serious. and, by the way, these mandates even when there's push back actually result in increased vaccination. we have seen it in previous mandates with the flu and other vaccine efforts. number two, to your point, you are right. weekly surveillance is not enough especially for something as infectious as the delta variant. that may have worked a year ago, yasmin. you are absolutely right. so if i'm a worker, knowing -- and i'm vaccinated, i'm not going to feel very comfortable even unmasked if i think that the person next to me is unvaccinated and only getting tested weekly. so you're right to bring that up. i would just caution people to remind ourselves, you can't test out of covid. a testing strategy alone is not enough. that's why you have seen, by the way, the administration said it is not just testing. they are going to have to be kind of -- they will have to agree to distancing and kind of
other mitigation measures. i think the idea there is that it is not really, quote, unquote, a vaccine mandate. it is a requirement short of a mandate, which is what you are seeing in the va and other employers do, where they're saying, if you don't get vaccinated you can't come to work. we can make accommodations for you, but work for you is not going to be in person with other people. >> i want to kind of get to the bottom of these breakthrough infections, right. so there are kind of the anti-vaxxers, the folks who have been vaccine hesitant since the beginning who are essentially looking at this and saying, look, this is evidence of the fact that the vaccine is not working because of these breakthrough infections. give me the facts on this. >> yes, i'm glad you asked that. i should say here, i have to use the statistic to remind us how powerful in a good way the vaccines are. you're vaccinated, you have now almost a 1 in 1 million chance of dying. if you are unvaccinated, depending on your age and other comorbidities, it could be a 1 in 30 chance to 1 in 100 chance
of dying. this isn't hospital, this is covid death. that statistic alone should make it clear an anti-vaxxer should be vaccinated. the break tloous infection is not a function of the vaccine failing. it is a function of the fact we have so many people unvaccinated that the delta variant is all over the united states. every time this virus gets to infect someone and make copies, it is another chance for it to get fitter and smarter and mutate and, thus, we have the delta variant. these breakthrough infections aren't a sign of the vaccines failing. they're a sign of a smarter virus that realizes half our country is susceptible to it. so when we put on a mask, when i put on a mask, when you put on a mask, it is not because i doubt the vaccine. it is because i know that i can now spread it to someone who is unvaccinated, yasmin, and they have a 1 in 30 chance of dying depending on how old they are. that's why i put on my mask.
of course, i don't want a breakthrough infection, but even in that kind of landmark cdc article that was released yesterday, over 800 infections, 74% of which were in vaccinated people, which is what led the cdc to recommend masking in high risk area. even those 74%, zero deaths, 4 hospitalizations. so this is a very good sign. but, like you, like me, i don't want an infection so i will wear a mask to prevent that. that's simply how we should think about it. but we're here because people did not get vaccinated, not because the vaccines failed. >> okay. two quick questions, kavita. one, are you wearing a mask now all the time? are you back to where you were maybe a couple of months ago wearing a mask any time you go indoors anywhere? secondly, looking at the numbers in florida, really troubling, cases jumping 50% this week. i know you have been tweeting about it. responsible for 1 in 5 new infections nationally, more than
100,000 cases reported in the state of florida last week. is this what is to come nationally? >> yes, florida definitely and has been for many of the previous surges a little bit of a canary in the coal mine of what could happen when you have such a large quantity of people. i think we will see improvements over the next two to four weeks, but it does not mean we won't see another surge if we can't get people vaccinated. i have not changed my behavior. as you know, i have two younger kids and frail, elderly family members. i have always been masking in unknown places, indoors where i am close to people, and i have not changed that behavior. i have been criticized for it. i'm not -- and i'm not saying other people have to do it because i'm in a low risk area, but i'm a high-risk worker so i have been. i will say if anybody is worried, wearing a mask on top of being vaccinated would be your best protection in all situations. >> dr. kavita patel, thank you as always for some of the great information. i appreciate it. thanks for taking the time
today. all right. everybody, coming up in the next hour, a big win in the battle for the release of trump's taxes, but even if a house panel gets its hands on the returns what can lawmakers do with the documents now that trump is out of office? congressman bill pascrell and "the washington post's" david farenthold join me live at the top of the house. hour. hour one that's been paved hour. hour. hour hour ild. but freedom means you don't have to choose just one adventure. you get both. introducing the wildly civilized all-new 3-row jeep grand cherokee l when you really need to sleep you reach for the really good stuff. introducing the wildly civilized new zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. it's non habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil.
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welcome back, everybody. i'm yasmin vossoughian. thanks for sticking around. if you are just joining me, welcome. donald trump under fire and under the microscope right now once again. new revelations about his efforts to get the u.s. department of justice to sign off on his election lies while at the same time after nearly 850 days democrats in congress finally get the green light to get their hands on trump's taxes. it is about time. that was the reaction of one congressman who has been fighting for years to get them. bill pascrell of the house ways and means committee joins me to talk about what they plan to do with the taxes when they get them. on the senate side of the hill, a rare saturday session continues right now with a bipartisan infrastructure bill the main topic with this promise from senate majority leader chuck schumer. >> i have said for weeks that the senate is going to move forward on both tracks of infrastructure before the beginning of t