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tv   MTP Daily  MSNBC  July 30, 2021 10:00am-11:01am PDT

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exploring the world in comfort... once again. . if it is friday, the white house is a major mixed messaging mess on its hands as new leaked documents from inside the cdc sound an alarm that health officials are significantly more worried about the delta variant, about breakthrough infections and about the administration's response to it. and a big week for joe biden's brand of politics, as a special election primary in ohio has gotten down right nasty with
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progressives and moderates battling for the soul of the democratic party. and the pressure is mounting as millions brace for the possibility that they could get kicked out of their homes when a official eviction ban expires tomorrow. welcome to "meet the press daily," i'm chuck todd on a busy friday as the white house confronts a big messaging mess on its hand when it comes to the covid response and the cdc has just put out new data on breakthrough infections. and the data is quite alarming. all of this as an internal cdc document first reported by the "washington post" paints an alarming portrait of the delta variant. for both the unvaccinated and the vaccinated. this preliminary finding warns that breakthrough infections may be as transmissible as
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unvaccinated cases. it recommends universal masking which goes well beyond current guidelines. and it also points out that the delta variant is more contagious than ebola, the spanish flu, smallpox and the common cold. it is as contagious as the chickenpox. this is a big deal. and so many people in this country have not been vaccinated at all. and it is an even bigger deal that the administration hasn't clearly communicated the urgent city of the situation or the science behind it. this internal document also calls for an overall of the administration's messaging to acknowledge that the war has changed. the white house now faces a daunting challenge. to convince vaccine holdouts that the jab still works. because it does. it prevents death and hospitalization, but it also needs to being a knowledge that they may have oversold the benefits when it comes to ditching the mask thanks to breakthrough infections and vaccinated asymptomatic people
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may be spreaders. and at the same time they are trying to convince the public to once again embrace the mask again. whether it is mandates or not that is whole other steer. even though they have not been as forth right as they should have been about the science behind the new guidance. they put out the guidance and now seeing the science. perhaps that have been flipped. and perhaps in response to toes questions, the cdc has just released data about a cluster of breakthrough cases in the state of massachusetts. along with a statement from the cdc director about how it is part of the data behind its recent decision to recommend masks for vaccinated people in certain indoor spaces. and president biden is facing scrutiny as he was trying to hit his july 4th vaccination goal. here is a reminder of what he said. >> if you have been fully vaccinated, you for longer need to wear a mask. let me repeat. if you are fully vaccinated, you no longer need to wear a mask.
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>> well, yesterday he did have to backtrack on those comments when pressed by a reporter at the white house. >> mr. president, he said if you were fully vaccinated you no longer need to wear a of course made and it seems -- >> no, i didn't say that. i said if you are fully vaccinated, in an area where you do not have -- let me clarify. >> in may, you made it sound like that -- >> its true. >> that you could lose the mask forever. >> that is true at the time. because i thought that there were people who were going to understand that getting vaccinated made a gigantic difference. but a new variant came along, they didn't get vaccinated, it was spread more rapidly and more people were getting sick. >> that was a shouted question at the end by the way of an event. monica alba is joining us from the white house and also joining
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us two of our medical experts, dr. peter otez and also dr. badallia. let's start here, it goes to -- i want to ask a simple question. where is the cdc director, where is dr. fauci, where is dr. collins, where is jeff zients? will we have and on camera briefing? even last tuesday it was a phone briefing by the cdc director. >> you're right, there hasn't been and on camera covid response team briefing this entire week. last time one we had took place on thursday of last week. and what is significant here is that we have been seeing them decrease in their timing in terms of how many they were doing per week. remember, it started as three days a week, then became twice, now we're only seeing it weekly. and it comes as there are way, way more questions and you are right to say that some of the top officials, dr. walensky for
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instance, did do that tele briefing which was a bit of a mess. a lot of people didn't have the opportunity to pose their inquiries and they ended it before everybody can understand what they were saying because that guidance in itself has a lot of confusion in it. because what if you are in a moderate or substantial transmission area and then you are moving to one that is different and week to week are we going to see those mask changes. all of that we don't know kret because it is happening on the fly. but when it comes down to this far more significant data and obviously the cdc was aware of this, that is why they made the urgent change. but look at how we're learning about it, through leaked documents in the media that nbc news has also obtained after the "washington post" first reported on it. we haven't heard anything from the white house about this so far today. there is a normal press briefing in the next hour or so with the principal deputy press secretary here. so of course we'll press her on all of this.
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but it really undercuts the message that they are committed to following the health and signs and the data. because when it is contrary to some of things that they are saying, they have been less quick to try to get them and amplify to the public. so absolutely the white house is scrambling to try to figure out how to position this. we did see the president of course yesterday in those remarks talk about the threat of the delta variant. but he continues to say that if you are vaccinated, this is not something that you really need to worry. that is not really the case when we look at this given this question of whether fully vaccinated people can transmit this and have it be as contagious as chickenpox as again that internal data that we now have does show. so we need a lot more information about this. i defer fully to your scientific and medical experts on exactly what we can extrapolate from that. but in terms of the message
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being changed, that has not and that is raising a lot of concerns. >> and monica, so they went through and did this announcement yesterday about the don't call it a vaccine mandate mandate for federal government workers, and this research is sitting out there. is there any examination -- is the west wing not communicating with the health officials? >> they are in constant contact they say and the president is briefed regularly behind closed doors. but it is quite striking and stood out to many of us that even as the president was again trying to say that this is just a pandemic of the unvaccinated, that is clearly not the case. and even if these recommendations when it comes to masking will now apply to people who are vaccinated, this will have implications for everybody. and that is not exactly how they are approaching it. so whether they will pivot on that i think is the next phase. but there hasn't been a public
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explanation as to why that hasn't happened yet. >> all right. let's up pack what we have learned. thisis essentially some of the new science behind the change in masking policy. this a province town example in massachusetts where basically it looks to me, and i'm a layman here, but it looks like this is the moment it is as if when we found out asymptomatic people were spreaders, all of a sudden we're finding out asymptomatic people vaccinated are spreaders. is it that dire? >> chuck, two things that have changed had are concerning. one is that clearly it looks like the delta variant is confirming how highly transmissible it is to the point where it can increase the amount of virus in a person who has a breakthrough infection. and it could be potentially more
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severe. and then the third bit of data that comes out of the cdc slides that we saw is that in people who are older, you may see some decrease in every case, there is some data that is 85% efficacy against severe disease in nursing home residents and that might raise the question of whether that is a population that needs a booster sooner rather than later. but what hasn't changed, and i want people to hear this clearly, the path forward when i it comes to vaccination remains the same. even with delta. cdc's own documents are saying three-fold decrease in infections. so if everybody is vaccinated, three-fold less likely to be infected and ten-fold less likely to be hospitalized. so you still need to get everybody vaccinated in the interim. and so if there are vaccinated people that can still transmit, two things should happen in high transmission areas in particular, we need to mitt ghat
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mitigate the layers. we have to put on the mask and consider the large gatherings. and people who are high risk should consider potentially taking that extra layer of possession. particularly in high risk areas. >> and dr. hotez, there have some theories that the delta variant could burn itself out, that that is what we're seeing in the uk. and also some they're out there that we only know about 10% of the number of infections that are happening. i think dr. gottlieb thinks that perhaps this is transmitting at a million people per day. what is your sense of the delta variant? >> well, i certainly would not count on this burning itself out and the difference is because unlike the uk, now in the south where vaccination rates are the lowest, school in-person
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classrooms are about to open ook across the south. we start earlier down here. and some parishes in louisiana for instance, they are starting august 9. so unfortunately, it is happening at a very difficult time where only about 17% of the adolescents, 15% of the adolescent s have vaccinated in many parts of the south. 30%, 40% of the young adults, refusal of mask mandates and this delta variant is accelerating. so i'm holding my breath. i'm worried about what will happen in the south. having said that, in-that it is important to point out that the sky is not falling.is important to point out that the sky is not falling. when those vaccines were release the emergency use last year, they were released because they halted symptomatic illness and departments out of the hospital and the ic uflt. it was only later that studies in israel and uk we realized had there may be a second performance feature and that it could halt virus shedding.
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and the first performance feature largely intact although there may be some declines there especially in those of high age. the problem is we're losing that second performance feature. and that is why we have to still mask up we think when we're vaccinated. the problem is accelerating, i think that we'll have to go back to universal mask recommendations. the president is not wrong, he gave information based on what we knew at the time and delta is a game changer. but again, we shouldn't panic but recognize that, one, we have to vaccinate the south otherwise we'll be in dire straits and we have to give serious consideration to a third mrna immunization. >> so with delta and what it has done to what we -- to our overall vaccine efficacy, how
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concerned are you that the next variant, and i know there are two more, lambda already identified, is it sad to assume that if we don't get control of this, the next variant will be even more deadly and harder for these vaccines to fight back? >> there is good news and bad news on this front. on the one hand, vaccines in general create a pretty broad base response. you know, you create this immune memory for a while and the thought is that you would have to be pretty bad luck for you to lose all efficacy. and the thought is that even as the efficacy reduce, you may retain a lot of protection against severe disease. but you can't bank on that. the more mutations, the more transmissions happen, the more evolution happens, you could see decreasing efficacy which is why i think, you know, not just -- we have to not just concentrate on vaccinating most of this country but actually vaccinating
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most the world because we do not live in an isolated silo. we are affected by this everywhere else in the world as well. but i agree, we have to -- i know it is exhausting to think about putting on a mask again. but the sky is not falling. we have made strides. look at our hospitalization rates. when you look at uk's data, cases went up but the hospitalizations and deaths were not as high. we need to vaccinate people so we don't have the bottom fall out. but we're not in the same place as we were maybe six months ago. >> look, both of you, we've come to rely on as essentially de facto public health officials when we don't have the government public health officials. so dr. hotez, i want to give a minute here. what would you like to see the cdc head, how would you like to see her communicate to the country this change right now? because, you know, look, there are some people that want to play politics with this, those folks are always going to be
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there. but there is confusion here. how would you like to see this addressed? >> i think we have to recognize that this is not a 30 second unicef commercial. we have to give it time to explain. it is nuanced, it is detailed. it requires going a little bit into the virology. and i think part of the problem with the communication from the federal government, and this goes back to last year, they still want to treat american people leak they are in the 4th grade or 6th grade and don't understand that the american people are willing to tolerate a level of because their loves depend on it. go through it, this is where we were, here is what has changed with the delta variant, here is what could go wrong, here is what happens if we don't do that. and i think people will understand that and accept it, but it is not quick
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communication. >> and so let's go through -- so, all right, if somebody is wondering whether they should send their kids to public schools even in a mask, what would you say, how would you recommend it, how would you talk to folks how to only that the new risk? >> we're a month away from starting school. here is our first priority -- >> not everywhere, by the way. >> not everywhere. right. but regardless, vaccinating adults is the best thing that we can do because that brings down the community transmission. and once we do that and we mitigate, you know, that location, if you can create layers to protect your child, that masking increasing that ventilation, we can make indoor -- and reducing community transmission, we can make a return to school safer. but we have to go in knowing that we need to be more careful than we tout before the delta variant was on the horizon.
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>> and so a follow up with this, in chicago, there is 100,000 people gathering today for louisiana lollapalooza. will we wish those 100,000 people didn't gather? >> i get nervous more about indoor gatherings. but any gatherings where you are stationery for a long period of time are woworrisome. but i'm looking to see states should consider at least large indoor venue, they should reduce xa s capacity or require masking. >> and as i've said, in many cases, you guys are the public health communicators here. appreciate both of you today. thank you. up next, how far can government go to protect people from the growing dangers of delta? is a nationwide vaccine mandate even legally possible? and later, many americans could
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okay, that's because you all have xfinity mobile. it's wireless so good, it keeps one upping itself. the push to vaccinate millions of unvaccinated americans have gotten more urgent. and this has led to new questions surrounding what the government can and can't do to keep you safe. hundreds of businesses from morgan stanley and google to small businesses in new orleans have issued vaccine mandates forcing customers and employee to say prove that they got the jab. now some are asking could a nationwide mandate be next. and joining me now to deal with the legal questions is pete williams. and pete, i think a lot of us know the answer to this, and which may be why it wasn't even
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a mandate, it was done as a don't calling it a mandate. so walk us through what the federal government legally can and can't do when it comes to public health. >> for mandates probably not much. the federal government is it have the authority to protect public health with things like quarantines or interstate transportation. cdc will say members of a certain community can't travel to another state, that kind of thing. but this is different for states. state governors have broad powers known as police powers to take steps to protect the public health. but the president doesn't. the constitution doesn't give him that authority. so it is clear the president couldn't order a nationwidemand. could congress do it? it could try to invoke its commerce clause powers and say of the infection spreading does it interfere with interstate commerce. the problem is that taking the
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vaccine is not commerce. so the legal experts i've talked to are unanimous that this would be virtually impossible for the president and probably for the congress as well to impose a nationwide mandate. i should say that it was president biden who sort of raised this possibility yesterday and in answer to a question saying that it is not clear that the federal government could do it, but the white house later said this is not anything that we're actively considering. so it is different for companies. it is different for school districts, it is different for states. so the question is just can the federal government to this and the answer is almost certainly no. >> so what you are saying though is other than the federal government, essentially state government down to local and private businesses pretty much any other ebb at this time in this country can have a vaccine mandate. >> yeah, now, a vaccine mandate is a little tricky. everybody goes back to this old supreme court decision involving a guy from massachusetts
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occurring during a small box epidemic and the state said that everybody has to get a smallpox vaccine or pay a fine and he challenged the law and supreme court said that the state can do that. and that law has been relied on many times in court decisions upholding all sorts of state restrictions since the pandemic came along. and the question is, you know, if the states were going to try to do this now and say everybody has to get a small box vaccine, do you have to give people a choice? either to follow that court decision, either take the vaccine or pay a fine. and there will be a lot of challenges to it. but the legal experts i've talked to all seem to agree that enforcing a man date from a government on the whole population whether a state or city is really hard to do. and secondly, it might cause more -- if the goal is to get more people to take the vaccine, this might be in the opinion of many of these scholars counter
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productive. >> another piece of news on your beat has nothing to do with covid. has to do with tax returns.piec beat has nothing to do with covid. has to do with tax returns. former president trump and the department of justice saying -- i guess the question is what does it mean. justice says congress has a right to see trump's taxes. what does that mean in reality? >> this just came out. i think it means that congress is now going to get its hands on trump's taxes unless he can go to court and persuade them no to. but there is a federal law that says the house ways and means commit it i when looking at ways to change the tax laws can ask the treasury to give them individual tax returns. they have to key them secret. but the trump administration said no, we're not going to do this because you don't have a legitimate reason to see this. you are not looking at legislation, you just want to embarrass the president. and in 2019, the justice
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department office of legal counsel agreed and said that there is not sufficient legislative purpose. on second thought, office of legal council says today that that is not proper, that looking extremely hard at whether congress has the justification or not is not what the law says. the law says if they ask for it, they get it. and so the office of legal counsel down colludes that treasury must furnish the information. so they are saying to the treasury department, you have to give congress donald trump's tax returns. i think that it is five years tax returns from 2015 through 2020. so unless he can get this blocked in court, and i think that would be hard because that is what the law says, it looks like congress will finally get his tax returns. >> all right. pete williams on a busy justice department beat as always. thank you, sir.
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and another by the way trump related update on what has become a steady stream of revelations how far he was willing to go to overturn the last year's elections. in just the last hour, the house oversight committee released handwritten notes that they say are then acting deputy attorney general richard donahue taken in a call where he urged jeffrey rosen to declare the 2020 election fraudulent. according to the notes rosen told the president understand that the doj can't and won't snap its fingers and change the outcome of the election. the president then responded, again these are in the notes, don't expect to you do that, just say that the election was corrupt and leave the rest to me and the r congressmen. essentially he wanted a press release. well, oversight committee woman says that they have begun scheduling interviews to continue the investigation. up next, a close primary
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from prom dresses you'r to workoutsnds with allstate. and new adventures you hope the more you give the less they'll miss. but even if your teen was vaccinated against meningitis in the past they may be missing vaccination for meningitis b. although uncommon, up to 1 in 5 survivors of meningitis will have long term consequences. now as you're thinking about all the vaccines your teen might need make sure you ask your doctor if your teen is missing meningitis b vaccination. welcome back. we've talked about the rift inside the gop but there is a divide inside the democratic party as well and that is on viv i had display ahead of tuesday's primary election in ohio. since this is akron, we are
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using the pun acrimony, if you will. this race has turned into the nastiest public democratic party we've seen. but frankly going on for the last six years. ads on both sides are down right vitriolic. take a listen. >> shontel brown voted to give money to her boyfriend and family, voted to givers a $7,000 raise. and even worse, brown is bank rolled by a slew of republicans including campaign cash from a cuyahoga republican boss. >> turner has a history of attacking and lying about democrats. she harshly criticized president biden attacked biden for
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choosing kamala harris. >> and so it has been a busy month. joining me now from ohio is henry gomez and also with us is the incoming editor in chief of the cook political report, amy walter. congratulations on that by the way. >> thank you. >> henry, i want to give us the play of the land about what you have been seeing in ohio and just how -- i mean, i think what has been shocking is just how public -- you know, we cover this back and forth between the establishment and progressive we think we think because the flame wars are suddenly on television. >> it is very ugly. we always had a feeling that it would get like this in cleveland once turner declared herself for this seat.
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it was only a matter of time before the establishment coalesced behind a candidate and that has turned out to shontel brown. she was mentored by fudge, she was a local councilwoman, she chairs the democratic party which is a big deal in the cleveland area. and that is who is establishing this in behind to stop nina turner. you have jim clyburn coming from south carolina this weekend to campaign for brown. and bernie sanders will be here over the weekend to campaign for turner. and neither of these candidates actually was thrilled about how nationalized this race became. shontel brown wanted the national support, but they are frustrated getting drowned by the issues. and there has been no way around that. we're going into the final days and all of these national surrogates are coming into
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campaign for one or the other. >> so nina turner started out with a big lead and had a bunch of money and it took a while for the coalescing around brown. where would you put the race right now? >> the internal polls that have been shared, there is a couple public polls showed very close within the margin the error turner still has been leading. and this is an 11 candidate field. and if there is a an anti nina vote, these receipt technically some of that could split into brown's vote and help turner win. but none of the other candidates has had the resources to really advertise on tv or to put together the type of ground game you need to win. so it will be -- somebody will win it with perhaps a small plurality of the vote. >> and there is our lay of the land in ohio. so let's back up, amy, how important is this symbolically
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for the progressive wing of the party? you can go back to joe biden as president, that is shot number one at progressives. just look at this campaign here. terry mcauliffe easily beat back more progressive challenges. it was a route eeg. and eric adams in new york city. at some point there is a trend developing here, is there not? >> and this is a district that voted for hillary clinton in 2016 in the primary and voted for joe biden in 2020 in the primary. so this is not a quote/unquote better bernie centric district. so in a low turnout favor, who will turn out? will it be the younger progressive voters who could find themselves coalescing around bgs once again? or is it going to be the more traditional voters which are the folks that usually do turn out in elections.
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the more establishment, the kind of folks that joe biden appealed to and hillary clinton appealed to in the first place. but you are right, this divide that we see on the republican side, or at least where we see it more cleanly or clearly, just has not been as big on the democratic side. in part because, you know, this progressive wing has not been particularly successful even before biden this going after or really spending any money or time or energy in going after say more stalwart moderates. you never saw a progressive go after joe manchin or heidi heitkamp. right? the intra-party fighting is really relegated to these blue districts like this one. and so it means that yes, whoever win this is gets a seat that they can keep forever, but
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it is not like they are taking out current moderates in the swing states with a progressive. >> what is the danger though in -- it is interesting, i feel like the progressive messaging and the progressive activism has fueled this grass roots fund raising bonanza for democratic candidates all over the country. on the other hand, they are not getting these policy wins. the infrastructure deal, we're seeing biden tapering things back, they don't want to work with republicans. i mean, is there a danger here where sort of the angry progressive activist says i'm tired of helping out candidates who then don't pursue what i want to see once they get there? >> well, that is the interesting part. remember in 2018, all of these candidates who were running in the midterms to take democrats in to control of congress raised a ton of money.
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and especially the more moderate candidates who were running as bipartisan problem solvers. so there is actually a ton of money in that sort of middle space. and you know, who raised a ton of money this cycle, people being attacked by donald trump, republicans like liz cheney and adam kinzinger. so there is actually -- when it comes to the money, i think being in the moderate lane is actually a place where you will do better. the question is, just in terms of energy and policy, how successful will progressives be and i think that you are right that while they haven't been able to get everything they have wanted, they have certainly -- bernie sanders and elizabeth warren have certainly moved the discussion to a different place than we were thinking it would be back in early 2019 and 2020. >> yeah, no, i think even bernie sanders would acknowledge that. they may be losing at the ballot box but making real progression
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for their agenda. and henry, there is another ohio special, more of an all-republican primary affair, and this too is oddly nasty. but the trump wing versus the not trump we think. what will happen there? >> it is so tough to tell because there are so many candidates in this race. four or five have a chance and there is a trump endorsed mike carey but if trump edith doesn't win, there will be more recriminal nass for what it means for the republican party. >> and amy, i'm curious where your thought is on how often democrats can go to the trump well. gavin newsom is basically making his entire recall campaign about don't let the trump wing steal democracy here in california. terry mcauliffe's campaign in virginia is all about donald
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trump the boogeyman. i've talked to some democrats that are a little nervous particularly in california that, hey, that is -- sure, that helps a little, but that is not the whole -- that is not a hole message there. what do you see, what do you hear? >> i've been thinking about the same thing, chuck, not surprisingly. we're on the same wave length here which is that you have all these new people, democrats who are on excited that they brought all these new people into vote in 2018 and 2020 as sort of the anti-trump message. what happened to those folks? can they still keep them engaged on things like policy. come out and vote again for us because we passed infrastructure and because we passed covid relief. or is the only way to turn them out and i do think ultimately keeping people engaged unfortunately is still about keeping them enraged. and donald trump will always be that factor. at least -- maybe not always,
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but i think right now it is still effective. >> give me the 15 second cook report changes here. you are the owner. it is the cook political report with amy walter. what changes? >> what changes is not a whole lot. there is a new name on the banner, charlie cook is still around. he has been doing this for so long. and i'm so honored to be able to fill those shoes. same team, same nonpartisan analysis. and we are very excited to be in this moment in time where we know that politics is -- can be very difficult to try to understand. and we're hear to decipher it. >> i'm excited for you, i'm excited for charlie, excited for dave, jessica, the whole team over there as you always know, i'm happy to be your intern anytime you need one. henry, great work in ohio.
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welcome back. we just got word that the briefing has been pused to 2:00 and that is when we hear from the deputy press secretary. only person scheduled to be on camera to get a brief from the white house as the cdc struggles with the new messaging on the latest policy shifts and scientific developments around the coronavirus. so as you heard at the top of the show, she would be fielding a lot of questions. and i'll be mildly surprised if she comes out alone. i would assume that there is somebody from the covid task force that will be joining her. r
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so i did. it's okay, you can stare. when you're a two-time gold medalist, it comes with the territory. welcome back. the bipartisan infrastructure bill jumped another procedural hurdle in the last hour despite the text of the bill not released and house leader schumer says he wants to get this wrapped up before the august release. and they are trying to extend the eviction moratorium that is set to expire tomorrow, but the congress does not have the power to extend that moratorium. and chris holland is the head of the committee, and he has his hands full. and senator van hollen, i want to start with this, because the
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president is asking that this came up two days ago and congresswoman alexandria ocasio cortez said that, hey, you should have been asking for this three weeks ago. and i know that the senate is the real hurdle here and any movement at all on seeing this eviction moratorium extend by the congress? so, chuck, good to be with you, and i am pleased to see the house moving forward. we have to extend this eviction moratorium at least for some period of time. as you know, there is lots of emergency money out there right now to help keep the renters in their homes to make sure that landlords get paid, but it has not been deployed, so we need more time to extend that. i hope it is coming to the senate, and the senate will take it up and vote on it as you just indicated, and the republicans in the senate have shown a lot of opposition to moving forward. so, when it gets here, i hope that we will take it up and at least put it to the test. >> you know, senator van hollen,
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you brought up to me the most alarming part of story is that there is money there, and it has not gotten to those who need it whether they are landlords or renters and the reporting we have been able to do on this, senator, indicates no bureaucracy to do this. the money, and you said, this is the money, and there is no clear indication of who is there to disburse it. this is not the only covid program that ran into this problem. and what is your sensef thou fix some of this? >> well, chuck, you are right. some of the emergency programs worked very well, and some got off to the bumpy start and then worked smoothly. this is the example of one that is still is, you know, suffering getting out of the gate. and we are pushing the states and all of the local jurisdictions that have this money to get it out the door, because that's what it is for right now. and that is why we need a little
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bit more breathing room on the eviction moratorium, and i hope that we are going to move nit congress, but i hope that the states will take action to provide a little bit more time for those states and jurisdictions to get the money where it is needed so we can keep those renters in their homes and make sure that the landlords and many of them also have to pay their bills are paid on time. so, look, some of the emergency programs have worked very, very well, and very quickly. this is one that clearly has not. and we need to keep working until the money gets out of the door to help people. >> right. >> all right. the infrastructure bill, and you and i both have been around washington long enough, and we are, i kind of see the fin lirn -- the finish line there, and i want to talk to you about the reconciliation bill. the $3.5 trillion and walk me through the time line. the infrastructure bill will get done, it appears before the
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recess. what is the time line of the reconciliation bill? >> well, there are two steps to the reconciliation bill. one, you have to pass the budget resolution. that is going to set up the framework for moving forward. we will get that done before the senate leaves. we will take it up right before, excuse me, right after the bipartisan bill passes, so we will get to that late next week. that sets up the process, and then in september, the house and senate will work to fill in that framework, right. we will decide how much to invest in each area building out more clean energy infrastructure and how much for health care and how much for child care and how much for early education -- all things that are very important to our country. so filling in the rooms of the house and putting the furniture in comes in september. >> if you guys pass it as a $3.5
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trillion framework, is that number etched in stone or, you know, look, krysten sinema nasims to think it is not. >> well, i heard her comments, but it is going to be passed before we leave here, and that is important news. then, i think that what you are going to be seeing is consensus in the end, chuck, in terms of the importance of moving forward with the rest of president biden's buy back better bill. and part of it in the infrastructure bill, but there is broad consensus that the other part of it needs to be a fleshed out through the other american families plan and america workers plan. so, i am confident that we will move in that direction, and of course, speaker pelosi has made
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very clear that she says that this is a two-track process, and it is a two-track process, and so there is plenty of opportunity to make sure that we fulfill the promise of the overall commitment to get the build back better path. >> are you confident that it'll be north of $3 trillion or not? >> yes. i am. look, we had unanimous agreement as you know in the senate amongst the democrats of the $3.5 trillion and there are different pieces, and some of it that are direct investments and tax cuts, and we have tax cuts for middle income and working families and is that part of the 3.5 trillion? it is not spending, so there is room for discussion here. but in the end, we will move forward. >> senator chris van hollen who is big player on the budget
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committee and democrat from maryland and we appreciate your coming on to share your perspective. and we thank you all for being with us this hour. more monday on "meet the press daily" and what is left of the washington nationals. stay tuned with more from geoff bennett. h more from geoff bennett. ♪ so i'd like to know where you got the notion ♪ ♪ to rock the boat don't rock the boat, baby ♪ ♪ rock the boat don't tip the boat over ♪ ♪ rock the boat ♪ ♪ don't rock the boat, baby ♪ ♪ rock the boat ♪ see disney's jungle cruise. it's time to rock the boat, america. (realtor) the previous owners left in a hurry, see disney's jungle cruise. so the house comes with everything you see. follow me. ♪ (realtor) so, any questions?
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♪♪ it is good to be with you on this friday. i'm geoff bennett and as we come on the air, the war has changed. that is the word from the cdc in an internal document obtained by nbc news that details alarming dangers of how contagious the delta variant really is. look at this chart contained in document showing that delta is more transmissible than the flu and the common cold and the smallpox and just as contagious as the chicken pox. this is key. vaccinated people may be just as likely to transmit the virus as the unvaccinated. that is what prompted the

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