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tv   The Rachel Maddow Show  MSNBC  July 27, 2021 9:00pm-10:00pm PDT

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the last thing before we go tonight, a reminder. you can watch "the 11th hour" any time you like. just download the msnbc app on your phone or tablet or download the podcast from your favorite podcast app and listen whenever you with our thanks for being wh us. on behalf of all my colleagues at the networks of nbc news, goodnight. >> rachel's got the night off. i want to tell you right off the back that just in a few moments were gonna be joined by the cdc director. lots of questions for her on the spread of covid-19. i took some lessons from that conversation we just heard and the cdc's new mask guidance so you're not gonna want to miss this conversation so that's coming up. but of course we start tonight with one of the most sobering, chilling, and emotional congressional hearings ever on
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capitol hill. at the first hearing of the house select committee to investigate the january 6th attack on the capitol, four police officers who were on the frontlines that day testified to the brutality of the attack, so the horror of what they endured, and to how close they and so many of their colleagues came to being killed that day. the hearing the gang with harrowing video of the attack, some of it never seen before by the public. some of it by the body cameras of the officers who were testifying today. the officers watched the video from the witness table, with d.c. metropolitan police officer michael fanone at one point getting up to comfort his fellow witness, sergeant aquilino gonell of the capitol police. and then it was time for the officers to tell their stories. >> at some point during the fighting, i was dragged from the line of officers and into the crowd. i heard someone scream, i got one! as i was swarmed by a violent mob, they ripped off my badge,
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they grabbed and stripped me of my radio. they seized ammunition that was secured my body. they began to beat me with their fists and with what felt like hard metal objects. at one point, i came face to face with an attacker who repeatedly launched for me and attempted to remove my firearm. i heard chanting from some in the crowd, get his gun and kill him with his own gun. i was aware enough to recognize i was at risk of being stripped of and killed with my own firearm. i was electrocuted again and again and again with a taser. >> i was effectively defenseless and sustaining injury from the increasing pressure of the mob. directly in front of me, a man sees the opportunity of my vulnerability, grabbed the front of my gas mask and used to beat my head against the door. he switched to pulling it off my head, the strap stretching against my skull and straining
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my neck. he never uttered any words i recognized, but opted instead for guttural screams. i remember him foaming at the mouth. he also put his cell phone at his mouth so he had both hands free to assault me. >> what we were subjected to that day was like something from a medieval battle. i vividly heard officers screaming in agony, in pain, just an arms length from me. i didn't know at that time that was officer hodges, and he's here today to testify. i, to, was being crushed by the rioters. i could feel myself losing oxygen and recall thinking to myself, this is how i'm going to die, defending this entrance. >> this is how i'm going to die. reporters who were in the room for those officers testimony say you could hear a pin drop as they spoke. the members of the select
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committee were transfixed, the mood was somber and respectful. some members of congress were visibly emotional and that's what you would expect from a hearing like this. but it wasn't just the visceral nature of the subject matter that made this so compelling. it has to be said that the reason this hearing was so solemn and serious and sincere was because of who wasn't there. there were no bomb throwing republican members of congress trying to derail the hearing with ridiculous antics, no one yelling about how the real crime was all the election fraud, no one about-ism about the radical left or antifa. house republican leader kevin mccarthy tried, he tried to put jim jordan on the committee. nancy pelosi said no. and you do not have to use your imagination to picture what the republicans would've been doing today if they had been in that hearing room because they were all just outside doing it while officers described the violence they experienced at the hands of the insurrectionists this
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morning, several republican members of congress were holding a frost conference in front of the justice department defending those same insurrectionists. they called the january 6th attackers political prisoners and demanded answers for their treatment and detention. the event was cut short after they were drowned out by protesters, some of which were there to heckle matt gates who himself is under federal investigation for possible sex trafficking of a minor. but okay, you might be saying those are the outliers, the extremists and fringe members of the republican congress, but not the leaders of the house republicans. the house republican leaders have their own press conference this morning as the select committee held this hearing without them and honestly the line between extremist fringe and mainstream leadership seems awfully blurry. there republican leader kevin mccarthy and elise stefanik staying with a straight face that the january 6th attack on the capital was all nancy
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pelosi's fault. you start to see why it was difficult to find any republican members of congress to serve on the select committee who would actually take the investigation into january 6th seriously. but speaker pelosi did find two of them, and today we got to see for the first time how those two republican members would play their role on the select committee. >> cannot leave the violence of january 6th and it's causes an investigated. the american people deserve the full and open testimony of every person was knowledge of the planning and preparation for january 6th. we must also know what's every minute of that day in the white house. every phone call, every conversation, every meeting, leading up to, during, and up to the attack. men and women have an obligation to step forward. if those responsible are not held accountable, and if
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congress does not act responsibly, this will remain a cancer on our constitutional republic. >> many in my party have treated this as just another partisan fight. it's toxic and it's a disservice to the officers and their families, to the staff and employees of the capitol complex to the american people who deserve the truth. i want all americans to be able to trust the work this committee does and get the facts out there free of conspiracy. this cannot continue to be a partisan fight. i'm a republican, i'm a conservative, but in order to heal from the damage caused that they, we need to call out the facts. it's time to stop the outrage and the conspiracies that fueled the violence and division in this country. and most importantly, we need to reject those that promote it. >> now, on the surface, today's hearing was about what police officers experienced on january 6th. it was a reminder of how awful and brutal and violent that day
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actually was. but the reason such a reminder is even needed is that donald trump and his allies included republican members of congress who lived through the attack personally that they are actively trying to rewrite the history of that day as a peaceful protest, or a normal tourist visit. and that created an undercurrent of frustration and anger at today's hearing that could be heard at times in the officers testimony. >> the same people who we helped, the same people who we give to borrow time to get to safety, they're now attacking us and our characters. we are people right now, in front of the justice department, asking to release some of the very same people to be released even though we are testifying about the trauma and the agony and everything that happened to us. it's pathetic. and they shouldn't be elected officials anymore.
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>> so many of the people i put my life at risk to defend our downplaying or outright denying what happened. i feel like i went to hell and back to protect them and the people in this room. but too many are now telling me that hell doesn't exist, or that hell actually wasn't that bad. the indifference shown to my colleagues is disgraceful. >> there's a sentiment that's going around that says everyone's trying to make january 6th political. well it's not a secret that it was political. they literally were there to stop the steal. so when people say it shouldn't be political, it is. it was, and it is. there's no getting around that. telling the truth shouldn't be
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hard. fighting on january 6th, that was hard. showing up january 7th, that was hard. the eight, the ninth, the tenth, all the way till today that was hard. everything is different, but nothing is changed. liz cheney and adam kinzinger are being lauded as courageous heroes. and while agree with that notion, why? because they told the truth? why is telling the truth hard? i guess in this america, it is. >> that was a powerful point from harry dunn with the capitol police. if this select committee is gonna perform a real investigation into january six, there's no getting around the politics of it. we have two major political parties in this country and the people who attacked the capital did it to try to keep the president from one of those
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political parties in power. their actions that they have been, at best, excuse and at worst, promoted by lawmakers of that same political party and so that presents a host of uncomfortable but necessary questions for this committee to answer. and it was one of the most powerful moments of today's hearing one right at the end, the chairman of the committee, benny thompson asked the officers directly who were there testifying, what do you want us to do? >> what would you task this committee and it's body of work, what would you like to see us do? >> we had violent political rhetoric. we had the organization of a rally, whose title was to stop the steal, and that rally occurred on january six which i don't believe was a coincidence. the time, the place, and the circumstances of that rally,
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that rhetoric, and those events, to me leads in the direction of our president and other members not only of congress and the senate, but that is what i'm looking for. is an investigation into those actions and activities which may have resulted in the events of january 6th and also whether or not there was collaboration between those members, their staff, and these terrorists. >> in my opinion, we do need to get to the bottom of it. who incited it, who brought those people here, why the people were made to believe that the process was dragged. >> i need you guys to address if anyone in power had a role
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in this. if anyone in power coordinated or aided or abetted or tried to downplay, tried to prevent the investigation of this terrorist attack. >> i used an analogy to describe what i want as a hit man. if a hit man is hired and he kill somebody, the hit man goes to jail. but not only does the hit men go to jail, but the person who hired them does. it was an attack carried out on january six and a hit man sent them. i want you to get to the bottom of that. >> joining us now is the man tasked with getting to the bottom of that, the chairman of the select committee, congressman bennie thompson. i know today is along a busy one for you and it continues so we appreciate some of your time. the testimony of those officers
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laid waste to the criticism we've been hearing literally since january six that there's no need for investigation into this and while we were all under threat they face the battery and the medieval battle that took place. what did you learn today? >> well first allie, thank you for having me. let me tell you that we now know that there are heroes of january six. it was a rank and file law enforcement officers of the metropolitan police department, counter police as well as the other departments who came and helped defend this capitol from the rioters. they are the real heroes and part of what we wanted to do today was to get all they experienced on the record and what they had to endure on january 6th and also on your last limb, what is it they
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would like us to do? i think the four clips you heard from the witnesses say it all. we want to know who facilitated it, if individuals came to peaceful rally on the sixth, why did they bring bear spray, why did they bring all of those other weapons with them? if you come into a rally, you come in to have a good time. you shouldn't have to wear vests, you shouldn't have to have helmets and all those other things. so with those men brought out that day based on their experience and training in law enforcement, exactly with the committee needed to hear. we now have a message, we now have a mandate. but i want to thank them because we came very close to losing this constitutional form
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of government. they helped preserve our democracy. they gave members the time to physically get out of the capital. they gave members and staff a number of time to take cover. they gave members and staff a number of time to take the ballots that they were counting and keep them safe. but we can count them at 3:00 in the morning, >> that's right. so we thank them for that. so it was a tremendous it was a tremendous testimony testimony i've been of not being here here for for 28 years 28 years. an almost 20 years, and all my 28 years i've never been in a herring yeah where members everyone there was just riveted from the testimony. it was gut-wrenching, but it was something we had felt as a committee we could do. >> a human i didn't know the
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way it would take shape and whether kevin mccarthy would appoint people and who he would appoint. there was something about the pin drop silence and seriousness of this that benefited from the fact that everybody who is listening to that testimony seemed to share a view that we needed to get to the bottom of this, and the perpetrators need to be getting to the bottom of who instituted this so it doesn't happen again. it seems like it was purposeful right from the beginning. officer dunn made the point that if this is not political, it was. we have to answer the question that politics got us into this thing on january six. >> these people came to washington on january 6th for a reason. we want to new who financed and who helped organize and we want to make sure that everyone who had anything to do with those riots on january 6th, we will get that information.
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i assure you, and the people on this committee are absolutely committed to getting to the truth. truth, ali, will be the disinfected of this country that we make hard to make sure we accomplish that. we will join for the office recess and decide, wait for it -- i can assure you the issuing of subpoenas, and other things necessary, because we follow up this testimony today, is in order, and we will be preparing those subpoenas forward. >> that just as the appointment has agreed with you. the justice department notified former officials this year that they can go to the january 6th attack. the letters to formal --
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you are telling me are gonna send subpoenas out to get people there. have you done so yet? >> no. we appreciate them stepping forward. we don't think anyone should claim executive privilege at any level of government. this is the ability of our commitment to do work. we have to have access to any and all information, and any and all individuals who have anything to do with the travesty that occurred on january 6th. democrats and republicans on this committee are committed to identifying everything we possibly can within the scope of the charge that we have as the committee. all the facts and circumstances, wherever the facts lead us, we are prepared to go. >> congressman, thank you for
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your time tonight. i know you have to get back to work but you and the committee have your work cut out for you. we appreciate your time. >> thank you. we will have more here tonight on today's incredible testimony. up next we are joined live by the head of the cdc and the new guidance issued today but wearing masks indoors. we have a lot to ask her. stay with us. stay with us just two pills for all day pain relief. aleve it, and see what's possible. rush hour will never feel the same. experience, thrilling performance from our entire line of vehicles at the lexus golden opportunity sales event. lease the 2021 is 300 for $379 a month for 36 months. experience amazing.
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baaam. internet that keeps you ahead of the game. that's cute, but my internet streams to my ride. yeah, well mine's always got my back. okay chill, 'cuz mine's so fast, no one can catch me. speed? we'll show you speed. wow! -that's nothing... ...because my internet gives me a flex 4k streaming box for free. impressive! that's 'cuz you all have the same internet. xfinity xfi so powerful, it keeps one-upping itself. it's not the kind of news we can your internet do that? hoped for from the cdc but it's
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news we got. the cdc just changes guidance about when americans should wear masks in result to the highly contagious spread of the delta variant. the cdc now says all vaccinated americans should wear masks wall indoors if they are in areas with what the cdc calls high or low level of transmission. red is high, oranges not lower. it's high enough in 63% of the country that indoor mask wearing is now recommended, regardless of facts status. that's not the only stunning reversal from the cdc. two and a half weeks ago, the cdc said fully vaccinated students will not need to wear masks when they return to classrooms this fall. today they took that back. the change in policy also applies to all students or people who work in the classroom. the cdc says it's recommended that all students, teachers,
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staff, visitors were masks in all k through 12 schools this fall, regardless of their vaccination status. here's rachelle wilenski the doctor of the cdc. thank you for being with us this evening. the reaction on social media to this, it's giving people whiplash. the cdc has changed fairly in the opinion of some people. give me a sense of the science? >> good evening, ali. thank you for having me. the first thing i want to convey is that map has a lot of orange and red. 80% of those counties that are orange or red, they have less than 40% of people vaccinated. those counties very much correspond to the people who are under vaccinated in this country. where we have not put up a large enough fortress as a population to tackle this delta variant. i think that's important.
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that map looks like that because we haven't done a good enough job of getting people vaccinated. the most important message is to get vaccinated. when i became director of cdc, i felt responsibility. i told american people i would follow science, science would be what is motivating in driving our recommendations. when we were in may, we had 1% of our sequences being delta, the majority of the sequence being alto variant of the virus. the data on the alpha variant demonstrated that the vaccines were working really well against preventing severe divvy -- disease and death, and if you happen to get outbreak through transmission you can give it to others. what's happened in the last two months is that now we have 83% of our sequences that are the delta variant. we know it's much more transmission ball even in the
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accents -- absence of vaccination. we see that in the map and why it's gotten so red so fast. in the last few days, we see that if you happen to be vaccinated person that was a breakthrough infection, somebody who was infected anyway, a rare invent, that means those people can transmit it to other people. that was why we updated our guidance with the update of new signs that came over the last several days. >> the last year or so we've heard from the state of california, the department of affairs, they're requiring people to be vaccinated or provide proof or ongoing testing. do you think we are approaching a time where we should be empowering organizations and companies to be able to do that to mandate vaccination? >> since may, we have always said that local jurisdictions
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need to understand what is going on locally. we have a very heterogeneous population right now. areas of this country that have our normal sorts of vaccination and low rates of the disease and we have areas of this country that have lowered to vaccination an extraordinary high rates of disease. we knew that responsibility was going to fall locally to make these policies. that's what needs to happen. >> are you changing any of your behaviors in terms of travel and interaction with people, how you're dealing with other people? we've been so excited about the reopening of america. >> this weighs heavily on me. we have been doing this for 18 months, america is tired. america is sick. america has seen a lot of people suffer, america has suffered a lot of loss. this is not something i expected it would be welcome news. it was not certainly something i wanted to do, but my job is
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to protect the safety and health of the american people. so this is what i felt we had to do with the new science that was given with us. i'm asking you to mask up. >> dr. michelle wilenski, thank you for your time, the director of the cdc we appreciate you being here. when we come back, we will hear more from the harrowing testimony of the storming of the tap -- capital, including words i never thought i would hear uttered in a congressional hearing said for powerful reasons. stay with us. ons. stay with us i got you. ♪ all by yourself. ♪ go with us and get millions of flexible booking options. expedia. it matters who you travel with. this is a hero, walking his youngest down the aisle, which to his bladder, feels like a mile. yet he stands strong, dry, keeping the leaks only to his eyes. depend. the only thing stronger than us, is you. for people living with h-i-v, keep being you. and ask your doctor about biktarvy.
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disturbing moments in january 6th hearing is hearing one of the officers who is there that day recount firsthand the racism they encountered for many in the pro trump crowd. now, we're gonna play a portion of that testimony. i'm gonna warn you in advance, this video contains racial epithets and strong language that are disturbing to hear. i'll be honest and tell you that we debated whether or not to play those words, but we decided it's best not to censor would officer harry dunn told
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the nation today. now, if you would prefer not to hear them and we understand if you do, now is time to your tv for the next minute and a half. okay, here's officer dunn. >> i told them to just leave the capital, and in response they yelled, no man this is our house. president trump invited us here. we're here to stop the steal. joe biden is not the president. nobody voted for joe biden. i responded, well i voted for joe biden. does my vote not count? am i nobody? that prompted a torrent of racial epithets. one woman in a pink maga shirt yelled, you hear that guys? this [bleep] voted for joe biden. then the crowd, perhaps around 20 people joined in screaming,
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boo, [bleep] [bleep]! no one had ever, ever called me a [bleep] while wearing the uniform of the capitol police officer. in the days following the attempted insurrection, other black officers shared with me their own stories of racial abuse on january 6th. one officer told me, he had never in his entire 40 years of life been called a [bleep] to his face. and that streak ended on january 6th. >> that streak ended on january 6th. that was capitol police officer harry dunn. his colleague, capitol police officer aquilino gonell also described how some riders saw the color of his skin and told him he wasn't american. d.c. metro police officer daniel hodges recalled being dismayed to see that so many of the insurrectionists that they were carrying blue lives matter flags as they attacked enforcement. those flags, the one with the thin blue line across the black
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american flag started to pop up all around the country as part of the backlash to the growing black lives matter movement against racist policing in america. proponents of the so-called blue lives matter movement wave that flag in order to claim that they opposed coffers racers just does not because they support racism, because they support police. yet, on january six, when so many of those blue lives matter supporters were faced with the decision about whether it was more important to back the blue and support law and order, or joint with a violent, racist mob attacking law enforcement, they made it clear to the officers who were there that day what their real priorities were. as these officers now came forward to tell their story of what they experienced that day. under oath, how would some proponents of law enforcement respond? joining me now, derek johnson the president and ceo of the done double acp. derek, good to see you again.
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this testimony today and some of which we heard before and new anecdotally, that is hard to shrug off. >> you know, i'm not surprised. domestic terrorism in this country has always been based in white supremacy and unfortunately the prior administration allowed racism, division, and hatred to germinate in a way that people felt more vulgar. but i was glad to see congressman thompson share this commission, someone who grew up in mississippi and who experience racist attacks throughout his entire career. what we're looking at is this concept of who people see us legitimate citizens and not legitimate citizens. and americans have long had to face that question of whether it was us advocating for more education, access to voting and
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just to make sure that the constitution also applied to us. what we've seen on january six, was an insurrection. an insurrection that was based on white supremacy and we've seen it before but it was during the civil war. >> we don't often play profanity and epithets on air, but we thought it was important to hear that because there is something different about doing this under oath and telling the nation in an investigation into what happened. does anything change because of that part of the testimony? do you think there are people who denied the importance of studying january 6th and movements that may have led to it? might tonight register? the penny might shop for them and say, there might be something here. >> well, i hope so. unfortunately the media has been so democratized that individuals only go to the places where they want to hear their like this and to reinforce their frame of thinking. what we've seen today on public
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display is undeniable. what we know in this nation, if you allow domestic terrorism to go unaccounted for, you guarantee more domestic terrorism to exist. that's what african americans face in the south throughout the time of segregation. these were individuals who were waving flags, confederate flags, who thought they were doing their patriotic duty but in fact they were holding up a treasonous symbol commemorating a treasonous act under this notion that there was a supreme race and we did nothing to stop them. we must stop what we're seeing on january six because we don't address not only those who were out there, but everyone who participated in planning and carrying out that insurrection treasonous acts. >> you know, for the last year and a half most of the times we've seen police officers on tv in the course of carrying out their duty it hasn't been
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particularly positive. it's been because of things that have happened so this sort of one is hard to calculate here because you're hearing from these police officers of color talking about what they experience from this mob, and yet we are still struggling in this country with the very reason why we have a black lives matter movement. because people said they were facing violence that at the end -- the police not really just arrest people and beat them up and kill them for the sake of it. how are we reconciling this? >> let's be clear. law enforcement officers, by and large, and not bad people. but we have law enforcement agencies across the country that lack the mechanism to hold officers accountable when they cause harm and our community. we have far too many agencies that have been allowing white supremacist mentality to invade their ranks and they have done nothing about it. we have allowed a small
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community to fan the flame of fear of other -- therefore giving police justification terrain terror on communities. so we need to reconcile law enforcement communities and recognize that white supremacist dogma that's invaded law enforcement agencies and we have to weed that out, hold people accountable, and keep communities safe. >> so, derrick, so many of our conversations last year have been about the different experiences of being american. the different america experience depending on the color of your skin, sometimes it relates to your policing. let's hear what harry dunn has to say. adam schiff asked him about his experience in america. >> is this america what you saw? >> everybody, even sitting at this table, with a different battle even though it was all for it's the same war. as black officers, i believe we
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fought it different battle also. and the fact that we had our race attacked just because of the way we look, you know, to answer your question, frankly i guess it is america. it shouldn't be, but i guess that's the way that things are. >> this message we keep hearing over and over again, i guess that is america. that's the way things are. and that reconciliation has been very difficult on america for the last year and other people to see it. and they saw it with george floyd. they looked at it and said george floyd lived a different life than a white american would if the same thing had happened. >> you know, i to think that was one of the most profound poems is the recognition that the constitution that we have fought for and the constitution that we helped build around, the reality that america has
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never been about a supreme race and always been about the money, unfortunately that constitution and those promises and guarantees have not always been afforded and when you have someone who put on a uniform to protect and serve and protect america, you have those who want an america that's not american. it's segregated, it's separate. it has nothing to do with the constitution and that guarantees that. and therefore we must address those individuals and stop maligning many in my community and those communities because i to sing america. >> derrick, it was a pleasure to talk to you. derrick johnson is the president ceo of the naacp. as the congress investigates the attack on the capital, hundreds of criminal cases are working their way through the
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court system. based on evidence that the alleged insurrectionists posted online themselves. we'll get the latest on those cases when we come back. e come back. our softest, smoothest fabric keeping her comfortable, protected, and undeniably sleek. depend. the only thing stronger than us, is you. depend. you need an ecolab scientific clean here. and you need it here. and here. and here. which is why the scientific expertise that helps operating rooms stay clean is now helping the places you go every day too. seek a commitment to clean. look for the ecolab science certified seal. ♪ downy's been taking you back, since way back.
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on the 2021 rx 350. experience amazing. the one with the bull horn in the tactical gear is samuel lazar. he's an alleged writer from january six who was arrested yesterday in pennsylvania, and charged with a few things. federal prosecutors have video of him grabbing a bike rack, that the police were working as a barricade and trying to pull it down with one hand and trying to spray at them with mace in the other hand. prosecutors also have this video from a few hours later that day when the lows are opening lee and miss -- admits to may sing the police. we may see them right the
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f-back. during a brief court appearance today -- lazar has been arrested over the five months in conjunction with the attacks on the capital. the evidence and videos of lazar may sing the police, confessing to it all, it comes from what is essentially a small army of internet sluice, regular people have come -- combed through social media and videos to identify riders into above the cops about the video. just 25 people so far have pled guilty, which leaves 550 more cases left to resolve. it is a ton to keep track of, almost nobody is doing a good job does it as ryan reilly. he's from the huffington post and been watching right cases like a hawk. ryan, thank you for joining us. the question a lot of people
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have, and there has been no recent in recent history probably where the spin so many corroborating witnesses and people posting on social media themselves that they were there, and taking pride in it. why are there not way more convictions and guilty pleas at this point? >> yeah, i think the answer is bureaucracy. look at the extent of this investigation. just try to imagine inbox full of 200,000 tips. that is a lot of tips. that is more than what the fbi has received up to this point. trying to organize that and sort it is difficult for an organization that for a lot of -- is pretty old school. they are putting things down the fbi, and there is a system that doesn't necessarily go up to speed and it takes a while to catch up to spaces -- cases and causes backlog. people have identified this individual months ago and saw him go around to rudy giuliani
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event in political rallies in pennsylvania and are confused about why it is taking so long. some of the sedition hunters now have their own individual relationships with fbi asians, other are sort of -- others are sort of jumping into a black hole with this. the sam lazar case, it's been identified and out there for a while now. finally now the fbi does something about it. the fbhim sitting out there fora long time, it's something that will be for the fbi to explain. it might be something that the commission is interested in as well. >> there are a lot of people being charged. virtually no people have been identified and being let off the hook. the gravity of these charges is different. you may be of the mind that all of them should be charged because they're all doing something wrong, but some are being charged relatively minor charges. they are not being let off the hook, but the charges are minor things. there is more energy going into the more serious stuff. >> that's right. there are charges that a lot of
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them are misdemeanor and they are the sort of thing that you would face if you went up to the capital, probably went up to security and interrupted -- there is pushback from people in the communities, this is a different event then a protester holding up assigned during an unfolding congressional hearing. that is basically with the charge that prosecutors have at hand, you don't want to overreach, of course. that is something that already republicans and some of the defense attorneys are accusing them of doing. you compared to other cases the justice department has handled, they are going a little bit more lax say against anti trump protesters against trump's first inauguration. i think that's something that the justice department keeps in mind. if they do overreach, and they overcharged someone, that will have tremendous consequences. not only in the judicial system, but also in the legislative system, because that's where we will see a lot of the political pushback if there is overcharging by the justice
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department. >> officer hodges, one of the four more -- former police officers who testified today said, most of the officers use the term terrorists. they talk about domestic terrorist, they held up the domestic road to back it up. they were making a distinction between somebody who interferes in a hearing, and what these folks were doing. >> yeah, this is a really interesting legal distinction. there's not really a wall that makes it domestic terrorism. on the back in, you can say you can get a terrorism and hand spent. you can classify something as an act of terrorism. there's not one law that says it makes it an act of terrorism and makes it illegal. their statues that apply these instances. gunning down people in a mob is not one of them. that's not something that would normally be classified as a domestic terrorism incident. if you look clear years back, dylan ruth, that wasn't
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classified as terrorism. this is something federal prosecutors have been saying in court, they say this meets the legal definition. -- they call this a domestic terrorism incident. and their prosecutors are typically handle domestic terrorism cases assigned to it, and they're handling it as a domestic terrorism instance but they will be careful when they deployed that charge. that's a politically loaded charge that you want to be careful about deploying it properly. there is no other way to describe what happened on january 6th, so what they were trying to do was influence the government. this is a violent act inference -- influence the government's actions. it's hard to get away from that definition but that is by the book sweat it is. >> ryan. good to see you, riley is the justice reporter at huffington post. but next, a story rachel's been following closely. stay with us. stay with us owing,
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all u.s. combat groups will be out of afghanistan and a little over them -- a month. the clock is ticking for the afghan translators who fought against afghan forces, and are now living in fear the taliban who are quickly advancing throughout the region. as of now, the u.s. his yet to evacuate a single wartime ally in the 13 days since the operation to rescue them was announced. tens of thousands still wait in fear that they are their families are going to be the next ones targeted, while they wait for their exit. >> there has been some effort on the issue, the -- part of a measure to fund security measures on capitol hill, and reimbursed them in the wake of the january six interaction.
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it's, progress but no means a done deal. chuck schumer says he hopes to get the bill passed this week, that of course relies on republicans. we will continue to keep a close eye as this develops, frankly time is running out. that does it for us today, we will see you again tomorrow, time now for the last word with lawrence or donna. i think we probably and our viewers have seen what we thought was all the video we could see and hear all the stories we could hear about january six, but today blew my mind. i mean, there was more and it was that much more compelling in that much more serious and it lays ways to those people who say there's nothing more to hear here. >> i think congressman adam kinzinger spoke for all of us when he expressed his surprise at how emotional this hearing was for him and for us watching on television and i believe for anyone who was watching anywhere because


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