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tv   The Last Word With Lawrence O Donnell  MSNBC  July 26, 2021 7:00pm-8:01pm PDT

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interview. the committee wants an answer by friday. if the lobbyist denies the request a subpoena could be around this corner. as rachel would say, watch this space. now time for the last word with lawrence o'donnell. >> this is the closest that we have been all year. this is my first time in the new york studio this year. >> i think it might be the first time ever in the same building. >> this week is infrastructure week in washington. in the biden presidency infrastructure week actually means working on infrastructure
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legislation. in the trump presidency infrastructure week was a constant joke. a bipartisan group of senators have been working on the details of an infrastructure bill for a month after reaching an agreement on what they called the basic framework of the legislation a month ago in a meeting with president biden at the white house. it is not unusual at all for it to take at least a month or more to figure out the details of that. after a weekend of work it seemed like today might be the day that the bipartisan group could bring their bill to the senate floor and begin debate. here is what the lead republican
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negotiator, senator rob portman said yesterday. >> we are about 90% of the way there. i am here this weekend working on legislative language. i feel good about getting it done this week. we have one issue outstanding. we are not getting much response from the democrats on it about mass transit. our transit number is generous. we increased transit in the proposal and the formula going forward. my hope is that we will see progress on that yet today. >> if true, if that was true and they were down to the one issue, rob portman was right to be confident they would have a deal by today. but the first thing this morning, as democrats and republicans seemed very close to reaching a deal donald trump delivered a message to republican senators in a public written statement saying don't do the infrastructure deal. as the day wore on with no
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progress in the negotiations, this afternoon senate majority leader chuck schumer went to the senate floor to try to energize the process. >> i want to be very clear, i am fully committed to passing a bipartisan infrastructure bill. as a majority leader i have the ability to move to reconsider the vote to begin debate on that bill this week. >> senator schumer had to acknowledge the new voice in the negotiations today. >> just this morning former president trump released a statement urging republicans to retreat from all bipartisan negotiations on infrastructure until after the midterm elections in 2022 or longer. the former president said that republicans are weak fools and losers for even talking to
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democrats and suggested that the republicans shouldn't negotiate at all. fox news personalities, following his lead, are encouraging primaries for republican senators who support a bipartisan infrastructure deal. >> we always knew it was coming. as soon as the bipartisan general agreement was announced a month ago, we noted then that it would seem very easy for mitch mcconnell or donald trump to pull away one or two republican senators and destroy the 60-vote majority needed to pass the bipartisan bill. the surprising thing is that donald trump waited until the last minute to try to block joe biden from doing what donald trump could not do. they invented the phrase infrastructure week and never had an infrastructure week of
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any kind. donald trump seems to be accurately calculating how devastating of a humiliation it will be to donald trump if joe biden manages to pass a bipartisan infrastructure bill of any kind. chuck schumer has the most difficult job in the senate. a place filled with difficult jobs. when most senators are simply too disgusted to comment about a situation, they don't have to. but a majority leader is stuck saying what must be said. what must be said for the record. what must be said for whoever out there in the country might need to hear it and that means the majority leader sometimes has to say things that make him look like a pessimist. things like this. >> republican senators must ignore former president trump if we are ever going to make
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progress for the american people. he is rooting for our entire political system to fail. >> yeah. he actually said that. republican senators must ignore former president trump. as if that's possible. the politics of governing require public optimism. you must always be publicly optimistic until and unless all is lost. nobody knows that better than joe biden. >> are you confident there will be an infrastructure deal this week, a bipartisan infrastructure deal? >> i'm always confident, yes. >> joe biden and chuck schumer have known the bipartisan deal can come across and crash and burn at any moment. that is why they are moving on a separate track and are ready to
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incorporate whatever can be salvaged into the democrats' only bill if that will be the only bill that will pass. the republican fall-back position is nothing. no infrastructure improvements to anyone ever in the country. they will not tighten a single bolt on a single bridge, not one. the republican fall back position, it is to fully embrace donald trump's description of them today as weak fools and losers. a 21-year veteran of the senate
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jim mannly, at 21 years in the senate you have roughly three times my experience in the senate. so, you are the senior senate voice tonight. we defer to you on all of this. so, where do you think that we are on this, recognizing that whenever a bill is going to pass by one vote. always near death until it passes. >> here is my best analogy. it seems to me like we are in a place where we are on the airline flight from hell where you are caught in a weather pattern around the airport, circling around and around, trying to see if the pilot can land the plane. here, one of the problems that we have is that we have too many
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pilots figuring out where the plane will land. i tried to figure out a way to say the bill is not dead. it is not dead. and as you know as well as anyone else, there is a problem with the clock ticking up. it will take a week or two to get to the process before getting to the budget bill. what schumer intends to do before the senate heads to recess. if i were a senate staffer, i would be concerned about my vacation plans for the end of august. >> and john, we have john tester in the thick of the bipartisan negotiations said tonight he expects a deal tomorrow morning.
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>> you said it is awfully hard to diagonal when something is on the brink of death before it passes or fails. it is often as hard to tell for the people inside the room as well as outside the room. i know you have been in the rooms. you sit there. you get reads that are honest reads from people inside of a negotiation like this who are not trying to spin you as often they are, but sometimes they are not. you get honest sources coming back to say that i think it is doomed and others saying i think we will have a deal in the morning. if this thing gets done. something that you and i have talked about months and months ago.
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the more opportunities that mitch mcconnell has to pick off republicans. if there is a cause for pessimism is that the deal is not done and it is still sitting here even tonight with donald trump now leaning in and with mitch mcconnell feeling the pressure. i think that is the thing that puts this thing in jeopardy. every hour it does not get done makes it unlikely that it will get done. >> if the bipartisan bill falls apart and donald trump manages to pick off one or two senators, whatever he needs to kill the thing. the republicans will have failed completely at what they appeared to agree to with the president in the white house drive way a month ago and joe biden and chuck schumer, it seems, have positioned the republicans as the people that destroyed the bill. >> absolutely.
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it will be fascinating. i have to tell you. he is perfectly willing to do so if he thinks that it is for the greater good. >> john heilman, infrastructure, used to be the old-fashioned way to get reelected, whether you got an earmark to get the bridge or the project in your district or just in general. you delivered your party and your congress delivered passive infrastructure spending infusions around the country. that was always thought of as stage one of re-election campaigns for congress. so, if the democrats managed to
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say do their democrats-only bill and the republicans participate in none of that, how do the republicans go into the next congressional election with zero contribution on infrastructure? it is not at all clear to me. i think there is a way this could play to democrats' advantage. democrats fail on the bipartisan front and pin it all on mcconnell and trump and pass a democrat-only bill they take credit for. i think the only way that it works for republicans is they sit down and they root for inflation. they are praying that there is the beginnings of a significant
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inflation spike by the time we get to the midterms and ride fears of inflation and all of the traditional dynamics of the out of power party to take control of the house and the season. we can scare enough voters about the way that democrats are managing the economy. >> we have a late report tonight saying the bipartisan group, the republican side of the group basically handed over the negotiations tonight to rob portman, basically one-on-one with the white house. you couldn't ask for more experience in a situation like this to try to deliver the deal. those two people, if there is going to be a deal might be the ones that come up with it. >> yeah. i saw that, lawrence. and while i agree, the problem
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that i see in my initial reaction is that does not leave any republicans with buy-in with the exception of portman. senator portman. so in my view that will allow republicans to walk away if they are not at the table trying to negotiation and to cut a deal. you know, he is very close to mcconnell. if mcconnell wants to pull the plug, this is an easy way to do it. >> the way that i read the portman thing, and we will find out tomorrow or maybe never find out. the other republicans decided rob is the one that knows the details. i'm going home. you negotiate it. and more a matter of they basically limits to attention spans, just hand it over to rob and let steve handle it for the
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other side. >> that is certainly some of the way that the psychology in the meetings work. as it works, you know it works. jim is not wrong about this. not only does it make it easier for mcconnell who will happily roll on portman with portman saying he will retire. no personal politics. he may be the best republican to deliver a deal, and the easiest republican for the rest of the party to cut loose. he is a rhino in donald trump's eyes and one not running for re-election. frankly who cares. >> thank you both very much for starting us off tonight. >> thank you. >> thanks lawrence. >> coming up, parents across the country are getting letters from president biden telling them
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about the expanded child tax credit which showed up via direct deposits in bank accounts on july 15th. what that money will mean to families in his district and what more help to expect and hope for in the democrats only infrastructure bill. chicken? only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ ♪♪ things you start when you're 45. coaching. new workouts. and screening for colon cancer. yep. the american cancer society recommends screening starting at age 45, instead of 50, since colon cancer is increasing in younger adults. i'm cologuard®. i'm convenient and find 92% of colon cancers... ...even in early stages. i'm for people 45 plus at average risk for colon cancer, not high risk. false positive and negative results may occur.
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amen. that is how one mother of two from west virginia responded when she got $250 for each child in her bank account. she has been on medical leave from her job told cnbc i'm not working, so it will definitely help me continue to provide for my children and have the additional chemical that i need to take care of our bills and everything. more than 35 million families have received their first
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payments. they will be paid through december with eligible families receiving up to $3600 for each child under six on friday a survey asked north texas families to weigh in on the impact of those payments on their lives, saying in a statement "i was raised by a single mom and can only imagine what a difference these changes to the child tax credit would have made for our family." he tweeted about kelly and ben, parents to four children who have been diagnosed with autisim and said the child tax credit would help them to offset the insurance costs to afford therapy for their kids.
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the chavez family. they will use the payments to buy notebooks, uniforms and other school supplies. joining me now is colin allred of texas. it is fascinating to hear and read what you are discovering about what the tax credit will mean in your district. >> thank you for talking about this. it has been a tough year for families with the pandemic, kids being out of school and child care. this is a big deal. this is basically social security for families with kids. putting money in the kids' pockets when they need it. i know what it can mean. and the stories coming in are inspirational. people buying school supplies
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for their kids, tuition for kids' preschools. therapy, as you talked about. it is a really big deal. >> and talk about what is coming or what could be coming down the line from the infrastructure bill that will be done through reconciliation, which is much bigger than the bipartisan infrastructure bill that is being negotiated in the senate now. >> it is a big deal for families. also universal pre-k, trying to deal with the costs of child care. this has been a really tough time for american families. families are working harder for
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less. it is time to have our policies catching up to what is going on in our families. that is what the american families plan is trying to do. >> you are watching the bipartisan infrastructure attempt in the senate, which might be near death or near passing, we don't know which. let's, for the moment, assume that the republicans kill the bipartisan bill in the senate. what does it do to the democrats only process in the house, and how much could you take from that what is in the bipartisan bill and move it into the democrats-only bill to get done within that bill? >> yeah. well first of all, i hope that the bipartisan deal is not dead. i hope it goes through. there is a lot in there that i do support. you know, i think there is a lot that we agree on in the committee when we talk about hard infrastructure, there is a lot that we agree on. so, i think the american people
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want to see us reachinga a bipartisan agreement. if they don't we will have to take it up as much as possible in the reconciliation package. this is not really an option for us. we are the richest country in the world. we need to have an enormous investment in infrastructure. it is time for to us play our role at the federal level of trying to create jobs, spur the economy. >> you would get the feeling that infrastructure in sexton is perfect. i don't see the tex rn senators making any attempt to work on this bipartisan plan. >> no they are not, strange give
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we spent a week in the stone age. far too many texans tying. we have to fix our grid and we need to invest in our infrastructure. this is something the people should be running on. i brought home the bacon. we are paying into the system. let's get the benefits out of it. >> thank you very much for joining us tonight. >> thanks, lawrence. >> thank you. medical organizations are calling for mandatory evacuations for health care workers. dr. zeke emanuel is leading the effort and will join us next. g
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our next guest dr. zeke emanuel organized a joint statement made by 58 major medical organizations calling for all health care workers to be required to be vaccinated against covid-19. their statement said that our health care organizations and votes advocate all health care and long-term care employers require their workers to receive the covid-19 vaccine. to put patients as well as residents of long-term care facilities first and take all steps necessary to ensure their health and their well-being. only 58% have been fully
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vaccinated and fewer than 9% of hospitals have required their workers to get vaccinated. the department of veterans affairs will require 100,000 of its front line health care workers to get vaccinated in the next two months or face penalties including possible removal and mayor de blasio announced the city's workers will be required to be vaccinated by the time that schools reopen in mid-september or face weekly testing. joining us now dr. zeke emanuel, a member of president biden's covid-19 report. doctor emanuel, most of us are
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shocked that it would come to the point where you have to add vocate for medical workers to be fully vaccinated. how did it come to this? >> well, i think medical workers reflect the country and i agree with you, you know. pretty shocking health care workers would not be the first in line. i have been calling for a mandate since april 14th. i think we need to get the health care workers vaccinated. because of disinformation and access problems people stopped getting vaccinated. they are saying only 9% of
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hospitals have fully vaccinated personnel is rather frightening. any way to know if the hospital has fully vaccinated personnel? >> no, there really isn't. they have mandated all workers be vaccinated but this came home to me vividly when my daughter was delivering a baby and she said i don't want to question whether that nurse or whether the person coming in cleaning the floor has been vaccinated. i should assume they are vaccinated because they are working in a health care setting. i totally agree with her and i don't think any of us should have to doubt or question or worry we might get covid from a
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health care worker. >> have you had any conversations with an unvaccinated health care worker or has your group come up with any reports about what they say about why they are not vaccinated? >> well, i think that a lot of it is local, lawrence. i think that a lot depends on the local dynamics on the floor or the local dynamics in a department of a report. you are hearing if the leader of the group is not for it. that tends to influence a lot of the people around them. we think of nurses and physicians as medical
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scientists. there are people in maintenance that are not. it is the people that are involved it is people in that section of it that astound us. >> it is not sealed from the larger society. i think that is what you are sort of perplexed by. it just isn't. the same disinformation that happens in society can happen in medicine and that has happened extensively on this. vaccines used to be seen as a god send, saving us from serious illness. i remember when i took my polio sugar cubes in school and the
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relief that parents had. now we have made vaccination this badge of the in-group and the out group. we shouldn't make this key life saving element you are a member of the tribe or against the tribe. this is not about keeping people healthy but tribe membership. >> thank you for all of your efforts and guidance throughout the pandemic. >> coming up, vaccine disinformation is killing people. one of the drivers behind that is russian intelligence. drivert is russian intelligence. vehicle, how do you know which brand you can trust? with subaru, you get kelley blue book's most trusted brand winner, seven years in a row.
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officials told "the wall street journal" russian interference did not end with the election. russian intelligence agencies have mounted a campaign to under mine confidence in pfizer and other western vaccines using online publications in recent months have questioned the vaccines' development and safety, u.s. officials said. yesterday, the "new york times" reported the scheme appears to be part of a secretive industry that security analysts and american officials say is exploding in scale, disinformation for hire. private firms are selling services once done by intelligence agencies. push viral conspiracies, mostly on social media and offer clients something precious, deniability. democrat of connecticut and a member of the house intelligence
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committee. thank you for joining us tonight congressman. what is the incentive in disinformation about the pfizer vaccine? >> well, lawrence, it destabilizes the west. that is a big metaphor for what is happening. the other laemt, you know, they developed their own vaccine and it is not bad for them to create doubt. that is the motivation. we can go after the russian and use all of the tools of
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diplomacy. what is much more challenging is that over the course of this disinformation, it is domestic, you know. old uncle bill with a theory he read on facebook. that is where it is more challenging to deal with what can be lethal disinformation. >> congressman, thank you very much for joining us discussion. coming up, adam kinzinger will be one of the members asking questions when police officers testify at tomorrow's first house select hearing on the january 6th attack on the polanco. barbara mcquaid will join us next on which questions she would ask in tomorrow's hearing about the trump mob's attack on the polanco. the polanco.
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this weekend house speaker nancy pelosi appointed republican congressman adam kinzinger to the house select committee investigating the january 6th attack on the capitol. congressman kinzinger voted to impeach president trump for the insurrection at the capitol that day. he is the second republican on the committee appointed by nancy pelosi, along with congresswoman liz cheney. speaker pelosi appointed kinzinger after minority leader kevin mccarthy pulled all of his choices from the committee because speaker pelosi rejected jim jordan and jim banks who both voted to overturn the presidential election after the trump mob attacked the capitol to try to overturn the election. today kevin mccarthy told
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reporters that the two republican members of the select committee are pelosi republicans. here is how congresswoman cheney and congresswoman kinzinger responded. >> very serious business, important work to do and i think that is pretty childish. >> it is childish. we are doing big things and getting to the answers on the worst attack on the capitol since the war of 1812. he can call me whatever names he wants. i believe, look, bottom line i am an elected member of congress. i am a republican. >> we are now less than 12 hours away from the committee's first hearing. the committee will hear from four police officers, two from the capitol police, two from the d.c. police. they will describe what they experienced when the trump mob attacked the capitol. our next guest, former u.s. attorney barbara mcquaid has suggestions for what the
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committee members should be focusing on. in an article she co-authored barbara mcquaid writes that the committee should consider the acts and omissions of executive and legislative brench entities and individuals, up to and including former president donald j. trump, his associates and others involved in the runup to the events of january 6th, and the use of disinformation to incite violence, suggesting collection of this evidence is not to presuppose liability but the country needs an accurate record collected as contemporaneously to events as possible. only by understanding all of the factors that did or did not contribute to the attack can we hope to prevent similar attacks in the future. joining us now is barbara mcquaid, the former u.s. attorney in michigan and a law professor at the university of michigan law school, msnbc legal
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analyst. barbara, as a member of the committee what would be the focus of your questions? how would you go after what you were looking for? >> tomorrow lawrence, we will hear from four of the police officers who were there that day. and i think that is a wonderful way to start. we want to hear what they saw, heard, the injuries they suffered and continue to suffer as a result of this. i think it is really important to debunk some of the myths that have formed already around january 6, that the people were ordinary tourists. i think hearing firsthand from them will be important. moving on it is important to understand about the intelligence failures. why we didn't collect information and then share it to the right representatives. and then when the response came, why it was that there was such a lengthy delay while we waited for the national guard to show up. and then of course the role that the big lie that president trump
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won the election played there in motivating it. >> we will follow the evidence wherever it leads and to whoever it leads. once we are composed and get it close we will be defining the scope. >> do you expect to have to issue subpoenas? >> yes, i do. we want to make sure for example when we request documents that we get all of them and do not have people withholding information because it is a voluntary request. i favor going to subpoenas and going to them early. witnesses, i expect some will be reluctant to testify and they will need to be compelled. that is my expectation. >> barbara, that is a big strategic point to subpoena or not to subpoena. if you subpoena, you run into the possibility of a protracted
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legal battle trying to enforce that subpoena which is why congress always prefers to get the witnesses without going through the subpoena process. but it seems like adam schiff possibly learned his lesson about dealing with the trump side of the world and that it will take subpoenas. >> well, i think one of the lessons learned from the trump administration is that if you are going to use subpoenas eventually, you should serve them early. as you mentioned it can be a protracted process going through the courts. if the committee is serious about getting the documents in time to be able to use them to question witnesses, they should be serving the subpoenas at the front end. if they have to go to court to enforce them, they can do that sooner rather than later. >> yeah. and that seems to be what congressman schiavone is saying and that is probably a consensus of the committee at this point.
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how would you see it in terms of scheduling? they are going to begin with this is what we saw on that day, tomorrow, by police officers who were there and who were being attacked. they will establish this was full of violence. this was a real attempt to change the actual process that was going on in the senate and in the house. they will try to change the election. they were talking about hanging the vice president. all of those things, which is going to be a necessary fact base for someone like donald trump who is going to be saying whether he testifies or not to this committee, it will be saying during the investigation that those people were there in love as we have heard him say. they were there peacefully. that they were full of love. that message is going to be coming out constantly from donald trump during the investigation. >> yes, and that is why i think it is important to get the facts on the record and debunk some of the methods.
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the series of questions that we put together in the piece that you mentioned. we used the 9/11 report and that talked about what happened on 9/11 and then it went back in time to look at what were the origins and the plans that occurred and i think it would be important for the select committee to go back and it may start with january 6. i think it is important to look at the planning and the conversations and the ground work that might have been laid leading up to that to trigger people. we know donald trump sent out a tweet urging people to come to washington on january 6. we will be wild in that tweet. what role did it play in radicalizing some of the people to actually show up on january 6. like the 9/11 commission, it is also important to look forward. what have we learned from this episode that we need to change to do differently with respect to violent extremism, the use of social media. the use of disinformation to
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motivate people to acts of violation because they believe the country is being stolen from them. all of that is important to really chronicle and then assess so that we can go forward. >> this is one of the congressional investigations that kind of intersects with criminal investigations like the hundreds of people that were arrested and criminally charged with invading the capitol. some of those people may at some point give evidence, actually say under oath what they believed donald trump wanted them to do, and what they believed donald trump meant when he said, you know, we are all going to walk down to the capitol together. you know, this is one of those things where they may at some point get lucky, because that testimony comes out in judicial process on time or they might have to wait a while to hear what those witnesses might say.
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>> yeah. so, as these tracks are proceeding in parallel fashion, you are right that you can learn about something in one form that could be used in the other. there is also a risk you could interfere with the criminal process. a famous example of that is when congress immunized oliver north, heard the testimony and the court later ruled his prosecution was tainted because the prosecutors heard his testimony in the congressional hearing. they have to be mindful of not immunizing people that could be facing criminal charges down the road. >> what do you see as the reasonable timetable for an investigation like this? >> i think that it will take many months to hear from all of the different witnesses. i would put it in several categories. tomorrow some of the first responders. i think we need to hear from the intelligence community. i think we need to hear from the
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defense department as to why the response was so slow. i think we need to hear from the officials at the white house. we probably need expert witnesses about extremists, disinformation and social media. pulling all of those groups together could take several months. >> we will be joined tomorrow night by congressman jamie raskin. the 11th hour with brian williams starts right now. hourn williams starts right now. good evening once again. day 188 of the biden administration. we are now just hours away from the first hearing from the bipartisan house select committee to investigate the deadly january 6 insurrection at the u.s. capitol and will play out in this room on the hill.
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benny thompson, democrat


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