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tv   The Cross Connection With Tiffany Cross  MSNBC  July 24, 2021 7:00am-9:00am PDT

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bipartisan, and it has a quorum, and it will do the job it set out to do. it is my responsibility as speaker of the house to make sure we get to the truth on this, and we will not let their antics stand in the way of that. >> good morning, everybody. we have a packed show as we talk about the surge in covid around the country and the effect it's having on the sports world. as you just saw, we began "the cross connection" with a looming showdown on capitol hill. speaker pelosi refused to even entertain attempts by kevin mccarthy to derail the january 6th investigation by allowing trump allies to have a seat on the select committee, especially when it was the gop who rejected it in the first place. pelosi is now considering adding more anti-trump/pro-democracy republicans to join liz cheney on the committee like
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congressman adam kinzinger, for example. joining me now congresswoman stacey plaskett from the u.s. virgin islands and congressman joaquin castro of texas. they also both served as house impeachment managers during the second impeachment trial of donald trump. so i am positive they have a lot to say. i'm going to start with you congresswoman stacey plaskett because i think one thing that a lot of people are frustrated by is why does it have to be bipartisan? why do we care how many republicans are on this committee. there is no convincing these people of logic. so doesn't it make sense to just proceed with what they have? they have a quorum, and get the people's business done. what's your take? >> well, first, good morning to you and good morning to my colleague joaquin. it's so good to be with you both this morning. i think that we -- as you recall, we tried to create this into a bipartisan independent
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commission from the beginning, and i think what the speaker has chosen to do by naming an individual who was, in fact, a -- is a republican, one of the most conservative republicans liz cheney, and also while rejecting two, agreeing to the three before kevin mccarthy drew them away is that we recognize that this is an issue that not only democrats care about but republicans as well. republicans throughout this country. the american people, and we want to be fair about that, and we want a commission. we want a select committee and a report that i believe that most americans will agree to. and by having individuals from both parties, we can give some comfort to those individuals who are republicans that we're doing our part. >> yeah, i think that's a legitimate point. i wish some of the republicans cared about having credibility when it comes to democrats. i'll turn to you on this, congressman castro. as being a former impeachment
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manager i'm curious because this committee has subpoena power. so how are you going to enforce subpoenas, especially if we're going to hear from folks like don jr., ivanka, perhaps the former president himself, how are we going to ensure they show up and testify before the committee. i know you're not on the committee but being a former impeachment manager i'm sure you have opinions. >> the congress does have extraordinary subpoena power, and i would be surprised ultimately in the chairman, betty thompson and the committee decide to subpoena somebody that they don't show up at all. i think part of the reason that you saw that happen during the trump administration is because those witnesses who were being subpoenaed felt as though they would be backed up by the white house and the trump administration, and they could buy time and hopefully for them by then the proceeding would be done, but i think it will be a very different story this time,
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and as stacey mentioned, the speaker has worked hard first to create an independent commission, and republicans would have had equal subpoena power in that independent commission, and it wouldn't have included any current members of congress. politicians or current politicians. and they said no to that. the reason they said no to that is because kevin mccarthy and the republican party are owned by donald trump, and they can't do anything they feel that upsets donald trump at this point. but that's not where the country is. the country rejected donald trump in the november 2020 election, and our interest is getting to the truth. >> so in terms of getting to the truth -- >> yeah, please, go right ahead, congresswoman. >> i think what joaquin is saying is so clear about the subpoena power. also, remember, when we have executed subpoenas against individuals during the trump administration, while those individuals fought the subpoenas, you've seen through courts that the courts have upheld it with mccann and with
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others. i think they in their best interests don't want to prolong this into the next election. it behooves them to quickly come and testify and allow us to move on. dragging it out is not going to help those individuals who want to obstruct this. >> so to that point because the white house records from november 3rd to january 3rd or january 20th, have never been subpoenaed. and i imagine they would reveal quite a lot. in terms of, again, enforcing these subpoenas, making sure people show up, if the courts uphold it, again, what is the tangible consequence, right? that's what people want to know. what is the tangible consequence coming out of this committee, particularly if people are thumbing their nose before testifying? congressman castro, i'll let you answer. >> i don't think that's going to happen, especially as that mcgahn case made its way through the court and mcgahn finally testified. i suspect that these folks will actually show up and testify. you know, it could take a few weeks or some of them a few
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months, but they will have to testify, and i don't think that anything should be spared in getting to the truth. i don't think there should be a special courtesy for members of congress, for example, who may have helped these folks plan out what their strategy was going to be or plan out what they were going to do in the building. we've seen public reporting about perhaps some connections between different members of congress, the republican party, and the mob that day of january 6th. and so most of all for the american people, we have to get at the truth about what happened. >> well, being a former impeachment manager and having worked on capitol hill since you brought this up, who specifically in the republican caucus do you think may have intentionally or unintentionally aided the insurrectionist on january 6th? that's to you congressman. >> i know there was public reporting around that time about different members who may have walked folks around the night before, for example, or the day before. i'll let the committee go
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through the work of determining whether any of that happened and the specific people who may have been involved, but what i'm concerned about as an american most of all is that we don't fence off anybody and say, hey, we're not really going to look into anything you've done or didn't do just because you're a member of congress or part of the executive branch. i think everybody should be fair game when you're talking about what's essentially an attempted coup of the united states government. >> congresswoman, let me ask you, you're an attorney, so i think you have a unique perspective on this. is there a chance that congressman kevin mccarthy could appoint himself to the committee, and if so, what would that mean if he's called to testify? >> well, you know, once again, we've seen through speaker pelosi's power and the power of the gavel is that while kevin mccarthy could appoint himself, speaker pelosi has the ability to reject him as a member of the
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committee. i think it would be uncomfortable to have him. as we've seen through testimony of his own members both liz cheney as well as other members of congress, the conversations that he had with the president on that day are probably very material to the intentions of the president and what he knew and understood at that time. so having him as a witness -- both as a witness, as a member, seems pretty compromising and would not be appropriate. we'll see what he decides to do, if he decides to walk away from this or he attempts to put an additional group of individuals on the committee. >> well, i'll stick with you on this. you and i have talked about the qanon, congresswoman, mtg before, marjorie taylor greene, and just asking you about your personal safety, how safe you feel working on capitol hill. i asked congressman castro this, i'll ask you the same. who do you think in the republican caucus may have intentionally or unintentionally
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helped aid the insurrectionists on p january 6th? >> i think even who voted gave comfort to the notion that this was not a legitimate election, and that's bothersome on its own. that's well over 100 members of congress in the house. but individuals who gave specific support i am not willing at this time to say who those are because those are just rumors that i've heard. i will say like joaquin has said that i believe that we are in a were to retain our democracy and that there should be no aid or no quarter for an enemy of that democracy in this commission, in this committee. >> congressman castro, i think mccarthy -- the threat that he has, that he may launch his own investigation and form his own committee, i mean, is this just
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theatrics or do you really think that he might go through something like this, and if so, what would that look like? >>would be bizarre, and i think it's theatrics, i don't see him doing that. >> famous last words, there are a lot of things we didn't think we'd see post-trump that we've seen. i have to tell you. >> that's true. >> thank you both for bringing light to this discussion. when you're willing to name those names, i invite you both back. thank you, love having both of you on. don't go anywhere, it's all going down in ohio. my next guest is in the thick of it. a hotly contested house race in the buckeye state. eye state. when technology is easier to use... ♪ barriers don't stand a chance. ♪
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all right, just like the rapper turned billionaire jay-z says, nobody wins when the family feuds. that is no more on display than
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in the ohio congressional race for the seat vacated by housing secretary marcia fudge. the party's long emerging divide has come down to progressive versus liberal in next month's primary or specifically former state senator and bernie sanders aid nina turner who will be supported by alexandria ocasio-cortez against cuyahoga county democrat party chairwoman shan tell brown being supported by jim clyburn. either way the seat will go to a black woman, but the outcome could help reveal what brings democrats to the polls for future elections. joining me now is shawn tell brown, i'm so happy to have you on this show. this is such an important conversation and thrilled to have you join me this morning. i have to tell you, i was born in cleveland so i'm somewhat familiar with issues on the ground there, and the vitriol and the language around quote, unquote progressives versus the establishment is very loud on
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social media. but i'm curious for the folks who are just rank and file voters in cleveland who, you know, eat at hot sauce williams and hang out at tower city, are those folks really that involved in the label fight, or are they more concerned about what you're going to do for them? >> i think you summarized it very well, and thank you for having me, first and foremost. as a former clevelander, i know you are very, very connected to this race, and so, yes, people here want to know who will deliver results for them. that has been the conversations that happen on the streets when i'm knocking on doors and when i'm campaigning and canvassing and actually, in my elected capacity. folks want to know who can help them. when i get a call about shontel, how can i get my hands on a ppp loan or how can i get rental assistance or when is the in next food bank, they're grateful there is someone there to help
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them. >> there are people that are curious your position. one mantra of progressives has been defund the police, for instance. i'm curious what your thoughts are on defund the police and how do you think the federal government should address disparities in law enforcement, particularly when it comes to black and brown folks. >> well, i've never been a champion or believer in defunding the police. in fact, i believe very much the opposite. i think we need to put more resources into our policing and to invest in training, especially around cultural competencies and eliminating the racial implicit biases that many of the police officers have held that put them in a state of fear when they're dealing with people that look like you and i. clearly it's not a matter of training them on deescalation because they know how to deescalate when it's not one of us. and so again, i think that investment in cultural competencies and racial implicit biases are where we need to be making investments.
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in addition to that, i've already put forth some initiatives here on the ground in cuyahoga county to offer what would be a fourth option when calling the emergency services. so many times we are calling 911 but we often are deployed to the police. well, in instances where there are people who are on record with having mental health issues or drug addiction issues or low level offenses like trespassing for the homeless, those people should not be locked up and thrown in jail. they should actually be diverted into either a diversion center where they can get the supportive services that they're looking for, and so i've taken those steps here, and i understand there's legislation in congress titled cahoots crisis assistance helping out on the streets, so that would be something that i would like to partner and champion to get across the finish line. >> it's interesting, the way you describe that i think this goes back to labels, right? defund the police is not necessarily take all the funding. it's reallocate funding. so when you talk about, you know, drug services and mental
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health services, is that not a component of defund the police? so is it the slogan you don't like, or is it the policy? >> well, for me the policy is most important, and i think when we talk about the funding mechanisms, we already are funding some of these issues. so let's be clear it's a matter of streamlining them. we have people who provide social services in mental health, and drug addiction. what i'd like to see are those services streamlined so we're using them more effectively and more efficiently. >> got it, okay, all right, things are clarifying. so your opponent nina turner has compared voting for biden to eating a bowl of sugar honey iced tea we'll say, and she's been criticized because people say you have to go and work with the biden administration. how will you do that? i'm just curious given where we are in voting rights, given that a lot of people have criticisms of this administration, maybe
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demands, do you have some criticisms for the biden administration? >> well, you know what i'd like to see really that i don't think that president biden has quite gotten all the way there is addressing the filibuster, right? when we talk about voting rights, that is the major roadblock in us being able to pass this legislation. and when i say us, naturally democrats, and because we have the slim majority right now, we really need to take full advantage of that and leverage it so that we can make sure that we're delivering and protecting voting rights. so many people in communities of color, low income communities, their voting rights are being suppressed, and ohio is no stranger to that. so in the last presidential election cycle, we had several of our polling locations closed, and that certainly had a result on the voter turnout in justice like cleveland where people are already struggling to make ends meet and where the population is declining. and so we need to be very sensitive to the power that we have and utilize and leverage it
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to our advantage, and i think the filibuster is the way that we go about doing that. we have to make some adjustments around it so that we can unequivocally protect our voting rights and make it easier, not harder. >> we're running out of time. many of turner's national endorsements have come from people that she worked with like bernie sanders, cornell west, aoc. your endorsements have come from people like hillary clinton and james clyburn, did you have relationships with these people before? how did you fall on their radar? >> it's no secret here in cuyahoga county and throughout the secretary that secretary fudge has been a mentor and a friend to me, and so by virtue of that i have had the honor and privilege of meeting those folks long before this race started. so yes, i'd also like to point out i've got a ton of local support. over 100 local officials have endorsed my candidacy long before the national attention this race has received, and that's the most important to me. these are the folks that actually live here and are able to vote and cast ballots in this
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election. the people that live here get to decide. i'm grateful for the national support and the national attention and i certainly think that it has given us a surge nd a boost to the campaign. i didn't enter this race with the expectation of losing. i only enter it with the expectation of winning. so that has always been our path to victory. and let the record reflect, i've never lost a race, tiffany, and i don't plan to start. >> all right, i should note that secretary fudge has not endorse instead this race yet. we had her on this show. as far as i know she hasn't endorsed yet. i know that i'll definitely be watching as somebody who was born in cleveland, i've got a close eye on this race. thank you so much for joining me. we'll have to have you back soon. don't go anywhere at home. we have a lot more coming up. the calls are getting louder for reparations on a global scale. i'm very excited to have had this discussion. don't go anywhere. we'll be right back. right back.
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so for nearly 200 years,
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britain ruled jamaica as a forced labor colony, an estimated 600,000 enslaved people were kidnapped from africa to sugar cane and banana plantations where they were worked to death or killed by disease while their enslavers and the british crown grew rich off their labor. jamaican officials are prepared to demand reparations from the queen, a fight that will not be easy to win. joining me is historian dr. hassan kwame jeffries, and henry bonsu, journalist and freelance broadcaster based in london. i'm very happy to have you with me. henry, i want to start with you. i think a lot of folks in america assume that black americans are the only enslaved people. there are social media movements that are very -- the diaspora has been largely impacted by europe quite frankly. given the atrocities that the uk
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brought upon black people who were enslaved, what are the chances that jamaicans will see any kind of reparations from the crown? >> i think the chances are slim to none if you're talking about money directly from the british government going directly to the jamaican government in reparations for slavery, anything like the 10.6 or so billion dollars that were quoted. why? well, listen to what david cameron said when he was in jamaica five, six years ago. he said let's move on as friends. let's accept that something awful happened but we're now the best of friends. we're partners, and we will try and develop together. we'll try and put this behind us. boris johnson, the current prime minister is a celebrant of all things empire. he's urged the british people to, yes, acknowledge the evil that went on, but consider britain to be a benign power in the world, a force for good. when it comes to slavery, that was an awful thing that happened over there in the americas. it was appalling just like what
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happened to george polloy was appalling. britain helped to end slavery. britain was not the great enslaver. of course those of us in the african and caribbean communities, who hold reparations marked every year, we would beg to differ and quite strongly. >> not only do you beg to differ e history does. i mean, britain during the slave trade between 1640 and 1807, it's estimated that britain transported 3.1 million africans to the caribbean, to north america, and to south america. so given this latest global discussion around reparations, what impact could this have on the reparations debate right here in this country? >> well, the reparations debate needs to be a global debate because the transatlantic slavery was just that. it was a global commerce, a global trade in human beings. that's how we got here, tiffany. it wasn't by accident.
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it was on the ships of enslavers, and so there needs to be a global debate. african-americans should not just focus on sort of reparations solely for the descendants of the enslaved people in america. certainly there's an american component, but there a british component. there is a french component. we can't understand the current economies of the caribbean. we can't understand the current economies and the political situations on the continent of africa or even for us as african-americans without putting it into a global context as it connects to the transatlantic slave trade. >> very good point, and i mean, look, we could talk about this all day. henry because this is originating as a fight between jamaica and the uk, this is not the first time this reparations came about, you talked about david cameron's response at the time, very consistent with other uk leaders, but i do feel like there is a shift in the conversation happening right now. you mentioned george floyd and the english city of bristol, people toppled a statue there of a former enslaver. can the people in britain, the
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descendants of the enslaved in britain rise up? and i should make this point for our viewers. the folks who were enslaved in britain, they didn't start out there. you know, they came there to africa, so -- or from africa rather. is it possible that the folks in britain can aid this fight? >> well, just as there were huge numbers of british people in the 18th century who mobilized, who petitioned, who supported politicians in the house of commons and show that they thought what was happening in the caribbean was appalling, was immoral and unchristian, now we're seeing people since the death of george floyd, they're putting huge pressure on major companies that made millions if not billions out of transatlantic slave trade, like lloyds of london, the universities, oxford, glasgow, like the great museums, like thousands of houses and stately homes in london in bristol, in liverpool that denote their
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wealth and their heritage from the transatlantic slave trade. and we're seeing people picketing now wealthy who are the distant relatives of slavers, of planters. this is not going away. and as a result of the pressure, we're seeing museums being named and also business centers like the jeffrey museum, the -- all the slave traders who made huge amounts of money off the backs of enslaved africans years ago left major endowments but now people are saying we've seen the receipts. we think you need to pay. if the british government doesn't want to, we can target you companies and landowners individually. we're not going to let them get away with that. it's not going away. >> i do just want to read a statement we did get from the uk. we asked the british government about jamaica's pending request. a spokesman for the foreign commonwealth and development office said there is no disputing the horrors of what
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occurred during the slave trade in the colonial period. while we acknowledge that the wounds run very deep, we believe that the most effective way for the the uk today to respond to the cruelty of the past is to ensure that current and future generations do not forget what happened and to address modern day slavery and racism. hasan, that's quite the word salad. that doesn't really say anything. i hear you henry. let me ask you, the frustration, and trust me, henry, i echo your frustration, the nerve, the ka kau kasty of that statement when we set our eyes on the world and how white supremacy is impacting all of us. even what's happening in haiti is a direct result of what came out of europe. what's your thought on their statement and the landscape that we see today? >> well, let's remember that the british government just finished paying off enslavers,
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compensating them, 181 years they've been paying former enslavers and the descendants of enslavers following emancipation, following the ab abolition of slavery. we see the same thing in haiti, the french government forcing the haiti government for more than a century to pay compensation for their own freedom that has led to the current destabilization in the nation. the idea that the british government or any former nation that supported enslavement would say, hey, let's -- it's good enough just to remember, while at the same time that they have been extracting and paying former enslavers is patently absurd as well as hypocritical. >> you both have to come back, this is a far reaching discussion. >> it's the perils of cable
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news, my friend. so you'll definitely have to come back. i promise you'll be back. thank you to the morehouse man. thank you, hasan for joining, and henry, you'll both definitely be back. i think this case can go on for a while. up next, the nfl's tough new covid rules, could it be a game changer? i'll ask my guest when we come back. when we come back just water... hold on, we're coming! mio... water tastes like, well...water. so we fixed it. mio. there's an america we build and one we explore. one that's been paved and one that's forever wild. but freedom means you don't have to choose just one adventure. you get both. introducing the wildly civilized all-new 3-row jeep grand cherokee l
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jones, host of the espn podcast. i want to start with you here because the nfl is really taking strides to make sure that these players are vaccinated. now, they say 85% of their players are. there's still a lot of hesitancy. i want to show this tweet by dak prescott by which he cites hipaa when he was asked if he was vaccinated. he said i don't necessarily think that's important and suggests that it's a hipaa violation. i mean, how do you deal with players like that in the league who don't understand hipaa and clearly don't understand science. >> yeah, hardly anybody understands hipaa. even the people who throw it out with a vague understanding don't wl get it. someone just told them say it's hipaa. if he doesn't want to tell us that he hasn't been vaccinated. he doesn't have to, i suppose. i don't understand why this is such a difficult thing for someone to answer. it's medical, he has the right
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to keep it to himself. it's become such a polarizing issue. at least it had. for guys like prescott who are quarterbacks who make their money on the commercial front, i get why it is he doesn't want to say anything. i think it's ridiculous for anybody who at this point generally doesn't want to be vaccinated but specifically under the circumstances of the nfl, you have people willing to take all kinds of injections in the name of playing, yet somehow this one which is literally the best thing that ever happened to any of us is the one they want to turn down. it's just a little strange. >> i agree. our mutual friend jamel hill made the same point. she tweeted that the vaccine is proven to be wildly effective and protects people against a deadly virus but not the threat of imminent brain trauma they expose themselves to every day. >> can the nfl make vaccines
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mandatory? should they do that? >> they can't make it mandatory. and i would argue they should not. they should in the sense it boub better for everyone else. i do agree it's a slippery slope when you mandate people put thing s into their bodies. if you decide you want to quit your good job because you don't want to get this good shot, you go ahead and do that. we're going to find out just how many people are that stupid to ride along with that principle that hard. what you're going to find in the end is a whole lot of dudes who get vaccinated. >> we'll keep our eye on it. crystal, i want to talk about this name change with the cleveland baseball team. i'm curious your thoughts and what this means for other teams with derogatory names and mascots. >> well, as so many people were saying yesterday, tiffany, it's a good day to be indigenous and yet another victory, a long hard-fought victory for native peoples who, you know, in
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cleveland they cited yesterday that they've been fighting for more than 60 years for this name change. and so i think this is such an important moment because cleveland has shown, as has the washington football team that rebranding these multimillion dollars, even billion dollars franchises can be done. it can be done with good input from the fans and the local community, and it's not only good for native americans and native american children, but it's good for all people in the community because these types of racist sports mascots, they feel discrimination and racism not only against native americans but all people of color that has been found by research. >> i echo that. i will ask you your beloved atlanta baseball team, what do you think this means for teams like that, the washington football team. i remember being in middle school not understanding how derogatory it was and the songs we used to sing about the braves and the gestures we used to make. are we going to see these things change? >> well, it will be interesting
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to see if the ground swell builds against the braves at this time. what was going on with cleveland and washington, both of those were egregious. washington being named after a slur and then with cleveland, the biggest issue was the skin and grin they put on the top. which then makes braves, chiefs and the others be more benign. the braves thing got worse where in the '80s they used to have a white dude run around the field when they hit a home run. they eliminated that, but then in 1987 incorporated a tomahawk into the imagery of the team, and then in 1991 at the encouragement of deion sanders started doing the florida state war chant with the tomahawk chop along with it. those things came in late. those things are problems. those things have to go. they were easy to ignore when you had bigger and more striking examples out there. now that those are gone, i think it's much more likely you see people who dedicated their energies to now come around to this one. what will be interesting is whether the braves themselves
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feel like they then have to capitulate to it. if they don't feel like they have to, ultimately they will not. what would also happen with dozens of college teams over the years that have changed their names is people ain't going to stop rooting for them just because of this. if you kept rooting for the team who has been sorry for 75 years you weren't going to stop because they changed the name. and i think what people are going to have to learn about this is just because a couple of angry white folks pipe up and got something to say about this does not mean you have to back down. in our -- if just enough white people say they care about something, that will then have to be respected. these white people are like everybody else, putting up with all kinds of stuff they don't feel like putting up. what they don't like is the idea of being told what to do. nobody likes being told what to do. sometimes people tell you what to do and then you get over it. it's going to happen in cleveland. it happened in washington. it's going to happen everywhere else when they ultimately decide to change these names.
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>> all right, i have to say i think this entire interview would have gone much better if you would have worn your caucasians t-shirt. it would have punctuated the point you were trying to make. >> it is much better that our other guest is here because native experts are the ones who have done this. a lot of people have worked for a very, very long time to get this done. all of those people deserve all the credit and everything for the work that was done and not people who did something easy like i did. >> we thank you for it anyway. >> and of course crystal, i wanted you on the show for a long time. bemani you'll have to come back soon for another sports segment. coming up, we're going to clear up some confusion over the unvaccinated and the highly contagious covid strain known as the delta variant. we'll make it make sense coming up after the break. coming up after the break ♪ when technology is easier to use... ♪
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are you tired of clean clothes that just don't smell clean? what if your clothes could stay fresh for weeks? now they can! downy unstopables in-wash scent boosters keep your laundry smelling fresh way longer than detergent alone. pour a cap of downy unstopables into your washing machine before each load and enjoy fresher smelling laundry. with 6 times the freshness ingredients, downy unstopables gives you more of what you love. if you want laundry to smell fresh for weeks make sure you have downy unstopables in-wash scent boosters. like we always do at that time, let's make it make sense. >> hey, tiffany. right now there's a lot of talk about the people who are getting hospitalized and who are dying from the covid stuff, the delta variant. they're the ones who are unvaccinated, right? well, what about the
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unvaccinated people who have already had covid. that's what i want to hear about. because everybody in my family who doesn't want to get a vaccine and who gets very defensive when we ask them why they don't get it, they say, well, i've already had covid so i'm protected. i got the got the plasma, and i'm protected. are they? i don't think so. what do you say? >> well, i've heard that very same thing, so thanks for that question, charlie. you can probably guess i have a lot to say, but first it's really important that we have a qualified medical professional to answer your question. take a listen. >> yes, even those who have been previously infected with coronavirus should get vaccinated. studies have shown that those who have been previously infected and received just one dose of pfizer or moderna had an immune response comparable to those who had been uninfected and received two doses. in addition, we know that natural immunity probably lasts for about six to eight months,
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whereas immunity from vaccination may last one year or even longer. and, finally, with the emergence of concerning variants like delta, we know that the currently authorized vaccines provide effective and safe coverage against severe disease. so because of all of those three reasons, i strongly encourage those with previous coronavirus infection to get vaccinated. >> all right, there you have it. even if you've had covid, get vaccinated. the numbers don't lie, people. more than 97% of those hospitalized with covid are unvaccinated and that's according to the cdc. and more than 99% of those dying are unvaccinated. you don't want to be one of them? get vaccinated. look, charlie, your family members are not alone in their hesitancy. vaccine rates have remained sub
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low as cases rise. over two-thirds of adults believe some kind of conspiracy theory or myths with the vaccine. it's not hard to understand why. fox news, who has more than 2 million viewers a night, who have spent months listening to anti-vaxx and anti-masks and garbage. then earlier this week, sean hannity goes viral for this. >> please take covid seriously. i can't say it enough. it makes sense for americans to get vaccinated. i believe in science and i believe in the science of vaccination. >> the most sensible thing i've heard him say. and i don't know if it will be helpful to your family, charlie, but sometimes it does take meeting people where they are. the republican governor of one of the red states also had to stay this this week. >> folks are supposed to have common sense, but it's time to start blaming the unvaccinated folks, not the regular folks. it's the unvaccinated folks that
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are letting us down. >> what this virus has taught us is common sense ain't that common. bottom line, get your vaccine, folks, even if you've had covid, even if you think you're not at risk. this can not be said enough. and keep engaging your vaccine hesitant loved ones. i've done that and i've been slightly successful. listen to their concerns and correct misinformation when you can. share responsibly. we're all in this together. and if you're watching at home and you have a question about this or another politics or policy question that you need an answer, shoot us a video. tell us your name, where you're from and record your question in under 60 seconds, and you can send it mia email to crossconnection@nbc i like having this conversation with our viewers. please keep the videos coming. in our next hour, megyn kelly came for naomi osaka this week. coming up on the second hour of "cross connection," we'll see you on the other side. ide.
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connection," everybody. this is part of the show where we talk about the week's biggest topics and we have to start with the covid resurging, because confirmed cases in the u.s. have nearly quadrupled in the last three weeks. despite this ongoing threat,
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vaccine hesitancy persists. only 57% of americans 12 and older are fully vaccinated, and yet the pressure to go back to normal is increasing. joining me now is video producer for the roots, cast member of bravo's family karma, and your favorite, justice correspondent for "the nation". i want to start with you, because we hear so much about what's happening in other communities. it seems like there are two buckets of people, the maga crowd and then there's a bucket of people of color who are just distrustful of the government for historical reasons, and then the maga crowd who has never known actual oppression, so she assume mask wearing is oppressive. i'm curious from your perspective and your community, what is the response to the covid vaccine like? >> tiffany, so in my community, fortunately for me as an lgbt openly gay man and in my
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community t people i've talked to and interacted with, colleagues at work, neighbors, friends and family, the vaccination rate has been pretty high. that being said, in a state like florida, for example, the vaccination rate is only 48.2%, and being in south florida i suspect the number might be a little higher, but that's still only half the population. so it boggles my mind as to are people having informed conversations with health professionals about what are your concerns about the vaccine rate or are being just being contrary. the same people that didn't want to wear a mask now don't want to get the vaccine because they don't like being told what to do. i'm trying to figure it out. >> yeah, i think a lot of folks are. we could talk about covid all day, we keep saying the same things over and over. i'm at a loss. so i want to switch gears and turn to mississippi because this week the state asked explicitly the supreme court to overturn
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roe v wade. agreement are more common, compromise is often possible and disagreement can be resolved at the ballot box, until you consider voter suppression. ellie, you're our resident attorney. this is ridiculous. conservatives have been going after roe versus wade for a long time. i think it's time we start taking seriously the fact that they could overturn roe versus wade. >> it's past that time. even this new thing from mississippi isn't new. the case was already set up to take a shot at roe versus wade. it's a bit like a mascot. it's like saying, oh, i love mickey mouse. you can say that, but like simba and elsa, roe versus wade has been out for 40 years. it's not important what the cases are called. it's important what the standard is. the standard in roe versus wade as updated by planned parenthood
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40 years ago is before fetal viability, so before 22 weeks, a woman has some right to choose. remember, already, after fetal viability we treat women, after 26 weeks, we treat women like they're incubators. but before 26 weeks they're supposed to have some rights. the case that was already in front of the supreme court more next year seeks to destroy that baseline demarcation of fetal viability and allow the states to start treating women like incubators with mouth parts earlier and earlier in the process. mississippi goes all the way back to 15 weeks and makes no exception for rape or incest. that was the case already there. the fact that conservatives now just want them to say straight up overturn roe versus wade, that's part of the show. it's a fundraising mechanism for the conservative party, and so that's kind of what -- that's what the words are for, but the
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standard is already under clear and present danger in this country. >> it's clear and present danger, and the irony, hypocrisy. mississippi, according to reports and state rankings, they finished dead last in health care. they rank 49th in the economy, 48th in infrastructure. perhaps the lawmakers there need to fix what's happening in their own state and stop pretending to care for children when they really only care about control. but as a woman, i'm curious your thoughts on this entire thing. >> tell it, tiffany. i will say that as a woman, and specifically as a black woman, i am completely concerned. i think one thing to note is that the supreme court didn't actually have to consider this case, but they decided to do so as we now have a conservative majority. and we also know that women of
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color and low income women get abortions at higher rates than white women and more affluent women. so it will impact my black and brown sisters in mississippi for sure and this really shows that the attorney general ultimately is a wealthy white woman who is acting in the interest of conservatives and other wealthy white women. >> 100%. and speaking of, i would like you to listen to this sound bite from amy comey barrett and i'll get your reaction on the other side. >> i don't think that abortion or the right to abortion would change. >> do you think some of the restrictions might change? >> i think some of the restrictions might change. >> i mean, she kind of warned us, right? there's a real life handmaid on the supreme court saying this. do we expand the court?
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how do we handle this? >> again, what she's saying is that she's not going to say roe versus wade is overturned because that would get the supreme court in trouble. if the supreme court said we're overturning roe versus wade people might start listening to me and think about expanding the supreme court. instead, what the supreme court is going to do, as amy comey barrett just said is they're going to change the standard so that it is impossible to get an abortion without technically overturning roe versus wade. this will cause weak, spineless, centrist liberals to say roe versus wade is still a thing and not do what's necessary to fix the supreme court, while still giving conservatives their fundraising mechanism of roe v. wade, we have to stop it. it's the perfect conservative storm. that's why amy comey barrett is on the court and they stole the seat from barack obama to put
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neil gorsuch on the court. if we want to stop them, as you say tiffany, we have to use our constitutional power and that's the only solution. >> well, we will see, but speaking of the supreme court, it turns out that the fbi's background check into brett kavanaugh was pretty much a sham. so the fbi revealed this week it received over 4,500 tips during the senate confirmation, but only conducted ten additional interviews. this is kind of ridiculous and there really is no recourse. but as an attorney, i'm curious your thoughts on this entire thing. >> why am i not surprised by this? i recently read an article that basically analogized the white house as the fbi, and being a practicing attorney, i know that when you have a client you do whatever is possible to advocate for your client and to meet your
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client's expectations and to get them what they want. the white house is not the client of the fbi. the american people are. it is our taxpayers' money that is paying for the fbi. they should have done it for us. you are appointing a person to the highest court of the land to advocate or adjudicate our rights, the american people. we are the client. it was not the white house. and it should not have been handled that way. but i'm not surprised. i'm just utterly disappointed by how the system has wronged us in this way. >> i have to tell you, the privilege of this guy during his confirmation hearing, we saw white man rage on full display for everybody, and he had the privilege to talk about how much he loved beer. take a listen and we'll talk about it after the sound bite. >> did you consume alcohol during your high school years? >> yes, we drank beer, my friends and i, boys and girls. yes, we drank beer. i liked beer, still like beer.
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>> i mean, you know, he kind of painted this picture of me, toby, opie, we would all hang out after school. i think a lot of us watched that and saw right through that. we all went to school with a brett kavanaugh and worked in a cubical next to a brett kavanaugh in our life. is there anything we can do? >> one point you raised is this is completely white privilege. you see this man who is able to talk about beer and things like that. we were looking at a period of what was almost like a week, you know, when we were going through his confirmation, et cetera. and this was a lifetime appointment. so i wish, you know, that i were able to breeze through the process in a job, something specifically for a lifetime.
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and, i mean, listen, at the root, i was good at this, right? >> that's kind of the point. what we go through for basic jobs, he didn't have a lot to go through. i don't want to step on your point but we're running out of time. did you have something before i move on to ellie? >> no. >> i echo your point. i'm sure what you went through at the root was more than this. what are your thoughts year? >> brett kavanaugh has a history of unexplained gambling debts. he lied during his confirmation hearing. he likely lied about his high school yearbook. he has 83 ethics complaints that were thrown out against him because the courts decided they couldn't punish a sitting supreme court judge and he's been incredibly accused by a woman of attempted rape. this man has no business being on the supreme court. the investigation was conducted
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by chris ray, his friend from law school, and chris ray has testified that the white house under donald trump did what it could to slow down his investigation. there are 4,500, we just learned, tips, unresolved tips about his misconduct and behavior, that the fbi has not investigated, to say nothing of tobin, and buffy or whatever, who have never testified under oath about what they know about his behavior and his exculpatory evidence is a childhood calendar. this man does not belong on the supreme court and the inability of democrats to even hold an investigation and a hearing against him in preparation to impeach him, which is the only way to take him out of that lifetime job, is a failure of our democracy. >> yeah, it is a failure, indeed, of our democracy. and, you know, as we all fall down, i'm going to make a hard turn to kanye west, his new
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album that was released. if they made us hate ourselves and love their wealth, i want to be sensitive because i think there are mental challenges with kanye. he premiered his new album at a live event in atlanta on thursday and he gave a lot of tickets to hbcu students, horace brown, moorhouse. i have no intention on getting this album? are you getting it or what? >> you put me on the spot here. i will say that i will not -- i'll go on the record saying that i won't be getting it. but you do mention a good point, in that kanye west, this conversation really is about a black man who has mental health issues, right? so he was diagnosed with bipolar in 2017 and we know that specifically when we talk about black people with mental health issues, there's more stigma and we're also perceived as being more violent, et cetera.
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but that is not to say that kanye west should not be held accountable. he absolutely should be held accountable. he went from saying that george bush doesn't care about black people in 2005 to being with trump in the white house with his maga hat. and jay-z addressed that, no more red hat, ultimately. i will say that specifically as we look at the sort of complex case with kanye, we do have to realize that he has to be in a space to understand exactly what he did, the danger that he caused, and then accountability, absolutely. >> agreed. we're out of time. just quickly, yes or no, are you getting the new kanye? >> yes, absolutely. i have to. >> you're buying the new kanye? >> maybe when it comes out. we've been waiting for this album for so long. i have to hear it, i have to see what he has said.
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>> are you getting the new kanye? >> i've got kids. >> i will say i'm not buying it, but i wish everybody well. if he ever does watch the thrown, ii, i might listen to it. subject for another day, perhaps. thank you so much. happy to have you. be sure to catch the season finale of "family karma" that premieres this wednesday on bravo. coming up, wisconsin's first black governor will join me to discuss his fight for a u.s. senate seat. stay tuned.
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excuses are nothing but a dead-end and expectations are something to be shattered. you can't settle for what is. you have to reach for what can
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be. pushing hard every step of the way. every single day. when the obstacles seem insurmountable, i was taught to draw strength from something bigger. because with faith, anything is possible. >> wisconsin's first black lieutenant governor, mandela barnes, announced he wants to make history by being the first african-american to represent the badger state in the u.s. senate. he joins a crowded field of democrats also vying for the seat currently occupied by republican senator ron johnson, who has not yet announced whether he plans to seek re-election or not. joining me is wisconsin's lieutenant governor, a democratic candidate for senate. mr. lieutenant governor, very happy to have you on the show and congratulations on announcing your senate run. you've already made history, you're the first black man to be elected as lieutenant governor. you won statewide and narrowly defeated incumbent republican scott walker in 2018. and you helped deliver a rebuke to donald trump.
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how do you plan on winning statewide again on the senate level? >> well, absolutely, thank you so much for having me. what we plan to do is exactly what we did in 2018. we showed up everywhere, we talked to everybody. we didn't just campaign in every county, we campaigned in every community because it was important for us to have those conversations. and people always ask, how do you get younger voters to show up? talk, have conversations, figure out what's important. i think too often as democrats we find ourselves scrambling in the final weekend before an election trying to connect with people. but the last two and a half years we spent in office going across the entire state, all 72 counties, talking to people right where they were about the challenges and also the triumphs and they're just going to amplify what we did when we defeated scott walker. we defeated donald trump in 2020. we're going to get rid of ron johnson next year. >> this is always my question for folks running for office. particularly in a swing state.
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some people drill hard and try to engage the base. then you have other people to talk about i can win the maga voters, i can convert the conservative voters. i always want to scream, you're running as a democrat, talk to me how you can win me. i'm curious what your strategy is. are you aiming to convert conservative voters, do you want to give the politically homeless a place to live in your campaign? or is your strategy more focused on engaging the base and giving them something to vote for instead of something to vote against? >> the fact is people have been left behind and i'm glad you made the last point because too often we talk about our how bad our opponents are. the campaign, the conversations we're having, they're our plans, our vision for a greater wisconsin, for a better united states of america. so we're definitely going to engage the base because for too long the base has been forsaken in some quest to get these donald trump voters. and quite honestly, many of them aren't coming back. so it's important for us to get in touch with the disaffected people who would typically vote
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for democrats but haven't seen a reason to vote for us. they need to know that we stand for making sure that everyone in this country has health care, they need to know that we stand for making sure that we are raising the minimum wage and taking on income and equality with everything we absolutely have, and most importantly, combatting this climate crisis. when we lead with a bold message with values and vision, that's when we win and that's a message that resonates in urban centers and rural populations as well. i know it because i've done it before. >> you brought up the climate crisis and your opponent, ron johnson, has very strong thoughts. i want you to take a listen to something he said and i'll get your reaction after. >> i don't know about you guys, but i think climate change is -- okay, by the way, it is. and, fortunately, keep reading, there are more and more scientists coming out writing really good books laying this to waste. >> i mean, i don't even know what to say about that, mandela. what do you say?
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>> this is a person who will say anything, right? and it doesn't matter if it's true, if it's factual. it doesn't matter if it makes sense or not. and that's the kind of leadership that we have been burdened with here in the state of wisconsin. now, we need to make sure that we are leading with reality in mind. this is a fact-proof senator that we have right now and think about how many people are suffering, not just in urban areas. there are studies that show how red line communities are trapped in urban heat centers and there is also a devastating impact on rural communities across wisconsin and across the country. out west, the wildfires, drought seasons. here in wisconsin there have been devastating flooding events. catastrophic storm systems that have decimated our towns. and this guy is just going out saying whatever to his qanon supporters and this is a person who is steeped in conspiracy theories, he has sympathized with insurrectionists, but he has not delivered for the people
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of wisconsin. it's time for him to go, and like i said, it is about our plan to make sure we are combatting this crisis, making sure we are being as bold on the climate as possible. we have to get to net zero as soon as possible. >> let me ask, because i think there's a lot of consternation around the white house and voting rights. wisconsin is no exception. you are also dealing with voter suppression challenges there as well. the white house, it was reported that the white house may think, well, people will organize the voter suppression, the white house has a different interpretation of how that went. according to activists who were part of that, that was the sentiment. is the white house doing enough to protect voting rights, particularly for folks like you who are running for campaigns? if not, what else should they be doing? >> we have to do both. we've seen the attack on voting rights in states that have been led and controlled by republicans since obama got elected in 2008, because they weren't satisfied with the election results. we know that we obviously have
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to get rid of the filibuster because that has been in the way of protecting the voting rights here in america. i was born in the mid-80s and didn't expect to ever have to be subject to jim crow voting laws, but here we are. and i think that the organizing still has to happen, but i don't think we should have to make the false choice of one or the other. we have to do both and do it all. it's a yes, and, conversation in my opinion. >> something that's happening in a lot of conversations right now is this alleged rise in crime. we can dissect whether or not that's accurate, however there are people who say, hey, there's a rise in crime and we don't support this whole slogan of defund the police, which is reallocating funds. i'm curious where you are on this and what you think the federal government should do when it comes to unfair treatment? >> we've got to be on the prevention side of things. that's been our problem all along. we've been trapped in this position where we're always responding to crime and responding to the climate crisis
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and responding to injustices in the criminal justice system, responding to gun violence. if we put more resources up front to make sure that people and communities can live happy, healthy and prosperous lives, making sure people have the opportunity to thrive in the communities they live, we won't have to worry about crime. regardless of how you dig into the statistics, we know in communities that are properly resourced, fully funded schools, good paying jobs, access to activities and recreation, they have a quality of life that doesn't experience the type of criminal activity or crime that we see in other areas. it's unfortunate, but it's also kind of simple to solve. we make life better for people, and in turn it's much easier for people to be able to avoid very unfortunate circumstances. >> well, mr. lieutenant governor, mandela barnes, congrats on announcing your
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senate round. you'll have to come back because i imagine the race will heat up as the months go on. thanks for making time. up next, megyn kelly tries to crawl her way back into relevance with an attack on tennis superstar, naomi osaka. she asked for smoke, she's getting it. that's coming up next. ♪ when technology is easier to use... ♪ barriers don't stand a chance. ♪ that's why we'll stop at nothing to deliver our technology as-a-service. ♪ subway® has so much new, it didn't fit into their last ad. so we gonna have to speed it up to tell you about their new belgioioso® fresh mozzarella, made by artisan cheesemakers. hold up! let's go faster. -with fresh milk from america's dairyland, wisconsin. man, wisconsin people love cheese. it's great on the new turkey cali fresh. let's go faster. the eat fresh refresh at subway®... it's too much new to fit in one commerc-
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know i use this time to address something or someone relevant who has warranted some sort of ire from the community. however, this week i'm taking a slightly different approach and addressing someone completely irrelevant. i'm speaking, of course, about megyn kelly. the 50-year-old bully is trying to bulldoze her way back into relevance that only comes to women like here not for offering any type of intellectual input. nevertheless, here we are. why? because the black face con oh sore who had to apologize for
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asking why it was racist for white people to wear a black face for halloween is now going after someone less than half her age but has twice her intelligence. 23-year-old naomi osaka, who announced she would not participate in post-match interviews, conferences during the french open, and ultimately ended up leaving altogether, and withdrawing from wimbledon, citing her own mental health. now, kelly accused osaka after the tennis far beautifully graced the covers of multiple magazines which were, of course, shot months prior, when osaka explained in a since deleted tweet. when osaka blocked kelly on twitter, this woman said that naomi just didn't like tough questions. such insight from the land of the inconsequential. but also, first, shout out to all of you prioritizing your mental health, especially when dealing with someone who spews nonsense like this. >> by the way, for all you kids
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watching at home, santa just is white. jesus was a white man, too. >> okay, second, to all you karens watching at home, please make a list for your white santa and pray to your white jesus for a life, please, because we're out here living our best ones, fighting on the front lines to say preserve democracy, taking up space at the highest levels of government, making long overdue and necessary changes in newsrooms, winning emmys while twirling on our haters. we come from a long line of torchbearers, lighting fires that illuminate the world and burn away chains. so it's no coincidence that snow white and the seven dumb takes she's had recently overwhelmingly target black women. nikole hannah-jones, who she went after, the duchess of sucks es, who kelly said should stop whining about the treatment of baby archie, gwen berry, who kelly suggested be removed from
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the olympics due to her protests. kelly is really just trying to crawl her way back into social relevance and into the hearts of fox news viewers, all benefiting from the work we do. we're quite used to it. but when it comes to us, sister, stop punching above your weight. you keep asking for smoke that you don't want. you want to ask like a high school mean girl and you'll get treated that way. sit down, and be humble. let the grown women speak. you're not invited to this table. you don't have the range. [♪♪] if you have diabetes, it's important to have confidence in the nutritional drink you choose. try boost glucose control. it's clinically shown to help manage blood sugar levels and contains high quality protein
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okay, hispanic, latino, latinx, these are all terms to describe people of latin america or of spanish dissent. tens of millions of americas integral to this country's story. in an effort to be as inclusive as possible, i've often used the term latinx on this term, sections about afro latinx representation in film and the future of the museum. it's not a widespread term. only 3% of latinos use latinx to describe themselves. i have to say every time i say it, it kicks up a comment storm on social media. so some folks have all the feelings, so i really wanted to talk about it. joining me now is former florida
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congressman and a daca recipient and in charges of programs. >> jonathan, i want to start with you and i want to make it clear to our viewers that neither of you on this panel today represents every single person of latino/latinx dissent. you're expressing individual opinions and as someone from outside the community i'm honored to moderate this, but i respect that i'm a guest of this culture and not in it. where did this term actually come from? >> i think what's really important to know about this term in this conversation, is that for a long time, latinx, latino communities have been in a conversation about what to call ourselves. to see the u.s. government create the term hispanic in the 1970s and communities fight back and i think what this
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conversation around latinx has been grounded in has been to be able to make sure that we have a language that is inclusive to queer, transgender and nonconforming people like myself, as someone who was born in panama and spanish is my first language, i really appreciate the choice to find language that includes people like me into the conversation, whether you see the word latinx, latina or latin americans, i think it's a really important conversation. >> congressman, i'll turn to you because i know you have a different take and i have to say our producer who works on this segment, she uses the term, but even she says she didn't learn it until she was in college. what's your thought on the term? >> tiffany, i think this is a great discussion. the first thing i want to say is i think any individual has the right to request to be called whatever it is that they prefer. now, when we're talking about entire peoples and cultures, i do think that that used by media
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and others of the term latinx is an imposition on the community. as you said, very few latinos in this country identify with that term, use it. a lot of them have never even heard it. and i think it also reflects a misunderstanding of the spanish language. the spanish language, when we say los latinos, for example, that includes everyone. that's not in that sense a male or a term that identifies gender. it refers to everyone. so, look, spanish is my first language. we take our culture very seriously. we love the united states, obviously. but we keep our culture, we taught our daughters spanish here at home before they learned english at school, and that's just our language. spanish is kind of the mother tongue of latino culture, of those of us whose families came from latin america, and for those of us who really understand and appreciate the language, we kind of don't like
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other people coming in and saying, hey, your language isn't good enough, it's inferior, we really don't feel that way. >> perhaps when it's coming from outside the community. but then i see that you have thoughts on this when it's coming from inside the community. how do you respond to what the congressman said? and i have to say given that very few people have heard of this term and use it, respectfully, i don't think his view is that unique. but jonathan, i'm curious your response. >> yeah, i definitely reject the premise that this is a term that is being imposed on us as a community, as someone whose native language is spanish, and being a part of the community i think it's really important that we recognize the call that people are issuing to all of us. i think what is really important to recognize is that this conversation about including queer, transgender and nonconforming folks is both happening here in the united
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states, but also throughout latin america. just two days ago argentina added the letter x to their gender markings of their state ids to give recognition to gender nonconforming folks in their country. so i want to make sure people understand that this is a conversation we're having internally. it is not just being imposed on us by outsiders. and i think it would be remiss to not use this moment, to not use this conversation to talk about the members of our communities who are not at the center, who are marginalized, to talk about queer, transgender and nonconforming and black people and the anti-blackness that has been a part of our culture. i am very proud to be of the community and also my belonging has been questioned from the minute i was born. so that is what we want to talk about. >> i think that's a good point. and we certainly try to have those conversations on this show. and before you respond, i want to throw up your tweet.
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because i think when it gets to politics in this, it's weird that you and a democrat are on the same side of this and you say, hey, you want to win the spanish communities, stop using the term latinx. so please go ahead and respond to jonathan. >> to that point, 97% of the community prefers to be called something else, you can certainly make conclusions about the politics. but, again, i just want to reiterate for those who aren't spanish speakers, when we say los latinos, that does not exclude anyone. it includes all the people. something else, you know, the birds, that includes all the birds. so, again, i just really do think that this is an imposition. i think that cultural elites are essentially telling spanish speakers, your language is insufficient, it's not good enough, so we're going to use this term and you all have to
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accept it. and, again, for any individual, i understand, hey, please refer to me as, you know, whatever the preference is, but when you're talking about an entire culture, i think you need to be sensitive to everyone, right? and a thorough understanding of the spanish language indicates to anyone that it isn't exclusionary just because people think it is or because english-speaking people think it is, doesn't mean it actually is. >> and, you know, this is a conversation that will be ongoing and, again, i just want to punctuate the point that you both are expressing your individual opinions and nobody should look at this like, oh, these people speak for the entire community. but i think you both do represent different thoughts that it's a worthy discussion. and i hope we can continue to have it on this show. and perhaps the best thing to do is just ask people how they prefer to be identified for those of us outside the community. so thank you, both. you're both welcome back any time to keep having this
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conversation because it's important. coming up later on msnbc, how to make the extreme rich pay their fair share in taxes. alex whit talks to the economic white house adviser jared bernstein coming up at noon. but we're not done yet. the teenage debaters who made history at harvard this week. stay tuned. ♪ ♪ know this about the jungle, everything that you see wants to kill you and can. ♪ ♪ ♪ born to be wild ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ born to be wild ♪ ♪ ♪ see disney's jungle cruise.
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pair of young black women to win harvard's incredibly prestigious international debate competition. they went ten rounds undefeated, bringing the championship title home. now for the fourth year in a row. joining me are those two minted debate champs and members of the harvard debate council diversity project. ladies, i don't want any of that smoke. i heard all that you were saying and that was so, so impressive. congratulations to you both. tell me -- because this was like a short time period. you guys were only training for a year and you came the took the championship. tell me about the process. >> i'll go first. the process for me was transformative. the person that we were coming into the program is not the people that we are now. just being able to grow in confidence, skill, ability, be able to stand firm and be able to be connected to something greater than us, i think all the
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people who are in my cohort can attest that that changed our lives for the better. >> and i can only describe the experience for me as monumental. i had never experienced even just in the short year, i have not changed so much in my entire 16 -- previous 16 years of living. so going through the harvard diversity project and being taught by mr. fleming and ms. brittain has been transforming for me. >> i can see how transformative it was. i'm so impressed with everything you guys said. i'm curious, are you planning on applying to harvard or are you going to take these gifts elsewhere? what's your plans post-high school? >> well, for me, i'm definitely looking at the top tier schools so i'm of course going to apply to harvard and stanford, i want to major in bio engineering and tech companies in the medical fields. that's what's next for me. >> as a junior i have a little bit more time to figure out what college life looks like for me. but the people around me have always told me that i don't
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necessarily have to choose, i definitely want to go to a college that will nurture me, but i also want to use my skills anywhere else. i want to pour my skills into the community, i want to do that on my college campus and community as a whole. so making sure that i use my skills to better the bigger picture. >> right, and better the community. >> i love that. i just want to put in a little plug for hbcus. you guys are in atlanta. plenty to choose from. plenty in dc as you make your choice. i'm curious, how did you pair up and become partners? >> we only paired up one week before the competition and we were with our instructors during the program, the alumni of the program who come back and teach us. so i was begging, i was like, can me and jayla partner up one time? we were smooth sailing, never had a hitch between us and our
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amazing partnership. >> all right, i just want to let our viewers know, the topic of the debate that earned you your big win was resolve. the north atlantic treaty organization should increase defense commitments in the baltic states. i am quite impressed considering that neither of you were alive during the clinton administration when a lot of this was being worked out. just so we can get a little taste of this beautiful intellect, jayla, we'll start with you. tell me your position on this complex situation. >> well, what was interesting about the competition is that we had to prepare a for and against the resolution. so what you were talking about in the research, which goes back to way before we were born, we had to do a strong amount of research for this, and so what was interesting is that we took the same position for both sides. >> for both. >> and then we switched the way in which we talked about it. and what we noticed, and this was probably an advantage for us in the competition, it gave us
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an edge in the competition because we knew how to refute, but i don't necessarily have a position. >> we don't necessarily have a position because we have to argue both sides. but we talked about climate change and sexual violence and argued for those things on both sides, affirmative and negative. >> that is incredibly, incredibly impressive. so, look, there are a lot of teenagers out there, you can spend your time doing a lot of things. so during those times, you guys trained really hard, obviously, and it showed. but those times where it's like, i just want to go binge watch tv or make tiktok videos or scroll through and see what my girls are doing, et cetera, how did you push through those moments? how did you get the discipline to say i'm going to find this inner beyonce and keep working hard? what was your inspiration? >> for me, i've never been a person to just deny myself from binge watching a tv show, but we
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have to remember that we're still teenagers, still kids, and we still have a life to live outside of academics. so it's just striking a balance between living your life and having fun and also keeping up with your academic spaces. that's what we also were taught in the harvard diversity project, how to have our culture and social life, have our scholarship and personal life, and have that balance where we can be amazing in both aspects of life. >> i think emani hit it right on the head. a mantra for the program is scholarship meets culture. that's exactly what we did. as i'm on social media, social media is also a way that we can push the message, that we can push the greater initiative. so it really wasn't a fight between the two. it was finding a way for both to coexist and to push us as a whole. >> i mean, emani and jayla, i'm going to slide in later so you can give me tutorials on how to have a balance as well. you're way ahead of me.
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thank you, both. i have a feeling you'll be back on the show when you're getting confirmed by the senate or doing something major in business. who knows. the world is yours. so thank you, both, congratulations to you. i look forward to what you do next. >> thank you so much. >> thank you, ladies. and coming up tomorrow on the sunday show with my friend jonathan capehart, he'll be joined by dr. anthony fauci. and congressman bennie thompson, the chair of the house select committee investigating the january 6th insurrection that kicks off next week. jonathan will have all the pressing questions for him. that's tomorrow on "the sunday show". we'll be right back.
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thanks for watching "the cross connection." stay tuned, because my friend alex witt has the latest. >> you almost put me in tears when you said i will not be back next week. i love how we learn from the youth of today. when you were talking about the life lessons with those girls that you want to learn, once you figure it out, pass it on to me. i will appreciate that. >> you got it. >> my friend, we'll miss you next weekend. have a good one. . and a very good day to all of you from msnbc world
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headquarters in new york. we're just about high noon here. welcome, everyone, to alex whit reports. we begin with president biden officially six months into his tenure hitting the campaign trail last night for the first time during his presidency, stumping for terry mccullagh. he talked about the vaccine push and efforts to pass an infrastructure package, despite facing an uphill battle on both front. >> i think the administration has a lot to be proud of. we've vaccinated over 160 million americans. [ cheers and applause ] >> we've created over 3 million new jobs, more than any administration has in the first six months in entire presidential history. >> and the president even taking jabs at his predecessor, calling him out by name. >> the country is looking, this is


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