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tv   Velshi  MSNBC  July 3, 2021 6:00am-7:00am PDT

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grand larceny and criminal tax fraud. the trump organization and cfo have pleaded ng to the charges which prosecutors allege were part of a scheme to compensate executives off the books beginning in 2005, continuing into this year. weisselberg's former daughter in law jennifer weisselberg said this week she turned over documents and named witnesses for prosecutors. initially saying she believed the cfo would flip on trump to save himself and family. now she says allen weisselberg isn't cooperating because trump has quote leverage on him. jennifer weisselberg will be my guest tomorrow morning at 8:00 a.m. eastern. clearly a lot to talk about. donald trump himself isn't named in the indictment. though some say this could be the tip of the iceberg. it could affect him and his company where it hurts the most at the bank, in a literal sense. forbes estimated in october of last year the trump owes creditors at least $1.0 billion. as politico notes not only will
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the documents make it difficult to obtain loans or refinance, those outstanding loans can now be recalled in full. joining me now is the pulitzer prize winning reporter the with "the washington post" and msnbc contributor david farenhom he has extensively covered trump and business. trump's company cloaked him in gilded fame. now it faces felony charges, debt and a tainted brand. david, we've had a couple opportunities to talk about this. let's talk about the trump organization. where does this put the trump organization right now, which is still as we discussed yesterday a going concern? >> it is still a going concern. but this is the trump organizations hardest time since 1990 when trump almost personally went bankrupt and millions of dollars in debt. the problem is a couple of things. one the trump organization was hurting before the indictment. lost customers because of
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trump's politics, lost business because of covid and a lot of the surrenders and lenders and lawyers and the pga of america, a bunch of partners left after trump's role on january 6th. on top of that comes an indictment, hurting the company, could hurt the ability to gain new loans, government contracts, could distract and take out the cfo, who is basically the indispensable man for the company. you could take donald trump out of the company and it would still run. you could take out eric trump and still runs. take out allen weisselberg. they may not know where everything. >> is michael cohen was out in the press and bom bastic. weisselberg is a quiet guy, most don't know about him. why would that pressure on weisselberg -- because clearly prosecutors want to get to something else. why is he not cooperating? what is behind him continuing to resist? >> well, i think it's hard to judge cooperation or
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non-cooperation until right now. before you didn't know the charges he was facing. maybe he had a vague sense what they might be and president penalties might be. maybe prosecutors came to him and said, do the right thing. we don't really know how much he is going to refuse until -- until now, because he is facing the 15 counts, the maximum of 80 years in jail. he can also see the evidence against him. talking to legal experts the last few days they talked about the internal ledger, the second set of books the trump organization kept where they detail that, a, they knew they were hiding things from the irs and detailed how much they were hiding from the irs. that evidence is hard to overcome. now that weisselberg sees that, this is the beginning of the test of his cooperation, not before. >> have you heard and put any argument in the weight that people have that lots of people do this and we don't take it seriously? >> i think there is -- there is an argument there that, you know, this is bad, but it's not enforced. and that's true.
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the irs especially is understaffed and not able to catch every person who commits tax fraud. but it's -- the argument is that other people get away with this that doesn't mean there is a right for everyone else to get away with it too. it's illegal, it's illegal. talking to tax experts they said, look, if anybody comes across a scheme where a company is using a second set of books to hide income from the irs that's an easy case to prosecute and a case you have to prosecute because you let people get away with it it undermines the tax system. >> david talk to me about the loans out there due for refinancing at some point, personally guaranteed by donald trump and the loans that are not. there is some jeopardy to all money that you owe when there are state legal proceedings against you. >> certainly not good. we -- there is sort of two categories of trump loans, a big chunk of the money is on two properties with the company trump owns, bornado, a big going
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concern. a lot of debt and not a lot of income. i wouldn't worry about those. but the ones owns, the big loans on the trump hotel in d.c. trump doral in florida. these places were struggling before the pandemic now really struggling. the one is d.c. is he is trying to sell. people looking in from the outside don't think even before this they had enough cash flow to pay them off. which means he would be looking for somebody else to refinance it, kick the can down the road. looking for an ally, a bank to loan him money. >> you are tremendous on this and reporting incredible. david is a wultser prize winning reporter from "the washington post." the anti-democratic former president's remarks come in florida days after a texas propaganda stunt at the border billed as focused on grimes and the border but which became a way for trump to go on a
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anti-democratic rant. according to the president on his trip, more than 2 dozen house republicans skipped out on the january 6th special committee devote to show devotion to the man who lost the party, control of congress and the white house last year. the bill passed anyway with only two republican votes supporting it and amid reporting that house speaker nancy pelosi might use a spot on the committee to appoint a republican, house minority leader kevin mccarthy threatened the committee assignments of any gop member daring to a to take on the assign imt. >> pelosi did offer a spot to a republican congresswoman. liz cheney. >> are you concerned about getting repair manned by the conference potentially losing committee assignments over this? >> listen, i think it's -- it's clear to all the people on this
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committee that i owe to the constitution our rule of law and dedication to transfer of power has though come above any concern about politics. >> joining me now is madelene dean. served as an impeachment manner the second impeachment trial of trump. thank you for being here. i want to be clear because what mccarthy is trying to do after throwing liz cheney under the bus once is basically smear her in the eyes of republicans is some kind of exact or democrat-lover. you know liz cheney. she is conservative, conserve as they come just happens to think donald trump did bad things to democracy. >> and she really wants to uphold the rule of law and really wants to get at the truth. i was literally with liz cheney in the holding room during 1/6
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at the attack on the capital. i had the chance though speak with her privately, just to say, don't you believe that your members have gone too far, these arguments for the big lie have gone too far. what i was so proud of she and hakeem jefferies almost immediately upon getting into that room, stood at microphones together side by side and said we will go back and complete our constitutional duty. and then of course she went on to say the president was responsible. we all know that. the videotape reveals it. all the information revealed it. the vape i had leadership. kevin mccarthy not to support in commission, i was on the floor also for the arguments. he was nowhere to be seen. many members as you say were at some stunt at the -- at a wall. it's strangely unamerican to me that anybody would vote against -- and not support getting to the facts and circumstances that surrounded
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the attack on our capital, the attack on our democracy, the attack on the peaceful transition of power that is a hallmark of our presidential elections. it felt strangely tortured and unamerican. >> last hour i spoke to your colleague debbie denningle of michigan. she said we can't get amnesia about january 6th. she spoke about liz cheney and she said mark meadows agreed we needed to get the vote done. in the hours after january 6th that donald trump did something bad. and then he got amnesia. and then lots of other republicans got amnesia too. >> absolutely right. and you see what's going on here. i no longer care about whether they believe the lies they are spewing. i recognize that what they're doing is saying one thing to one audience, another to another. they are unfit to lead. mr. mccarthy is unfit to lead.
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and as i said he seldom on the floor to even show leadership. in the absence of real leadership this is what you get. fortunately speak pelosi put together a fantastic committee. i'm light delighted liz cheney said she will serve on it. and she said she and i have a politically very little in common. but we have one thing very much in common. and it's the most important thing, wanting to seek and speak the truth. >> january 6th is one side of this anti-democratic coin and the other side of the coin is the work that's going on in legislatures around this country amongst state republicans to -- that are anti-democratic and restrictive on voting. we know that people from your state and my state, pennsylvania, traveled to arizona, republicans to take a look at the sham audit see how they can do it. it does appear that there is some impetus and some motion in trying to repeat this in pennsylvania. first of all, it's probably not going to succeed.
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but does it bother you this continues to live another day in pennsylvania? >> absolutely. what a waste of time and resources and a continuation of disinformation. i served in the pennsylvania legislature for six and a half years. it's republican controlled. when i went in in 2012 we were fighting against then pennsylvania's voter id law which was struck down. i had to work with elderly constituents who were fearful that they would not be able to meet the voter id requirements. we worked horsepower and hours and hours all across the state of pennsylvania until the law was struck down. imagine trying to deny the precious right to vote to seniors, young people, minorities. pennsylvania is a republican-controlled legislature will try it again. those laws will be struck down. i'm confident of that. fortunately we know that governor wolff will not sign restrictive voter id laws.
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>> it's interesting because in thing in arizona -- i can't believe how long we're talking about this. they are renewing the lease on the auditorium. they are counting ballots until they come up with a solution. it's not that popular even amongst republicans in arizona. republicans trying to be competitive in pennsylvania, this can ultimately hurt them. >> i think it will. i think they will be shown to be hollow and hollow arguments. look at what pennsylvania did well. we had a $3 billion budget surplus added to that at the federal level. 7.9 billion in relief. we have an economy growing. we are above the president's standard for july 4th in terms of vaccinations. and you just interviewed the fantastic doctor with the black doctors consortium. we are moving forward. these sad republican would be leaders are walking in reverse. and i think eventually the voters figure that out and
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recognize the big lie did not happen. the election was not stolen. there is not massive fraud. in fact, as most people in a non-partisan way recognize, the last election was one of the fairest, most free elections ever. >> congresswoman good to see you as always. madelene dean of pennsylvania. much more on the select committee on tomorrow's show. i'll be joined by two democrats, congressman bennie thompson leading the effort and pete aguilar. and bob casey today joins the show to talk about that voting rights and fraz and more. and a hurricane set to make landfall in florida. now another high-rise being evacuated over fears. up next a live report from surfside. this is velshi on msnbc. this is velshi on msnbc. ♪ when technology is easier to use... ♪
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we're await agnes conference in surfside, florida, scheduled to begin at 10:30 "a" eastern. they've been pretty good about them. officials plan to update on the site at the horrific condo collapse. meantime, first responders continue rescue and recovery efforts even ahmed the threat of a hurricane that could hit as early as tomorrow night. as of this morning officials say they confirmed the deaths of 22 people, 126 remain unaccounted for. last night authorities deemed another building in the area high-risk and called for its immediate closure and evacuation. in their estimation the crest view towers condominium has dangerous structural and electrical conditions. the 156-unit complex is located in north miami beach, seven miles north where the condoleezzao collapsed in surfside last week. let's go to von hillyard down in surfside. what's the latest where you are. >> >> reporter: several layers of dangerous looming over.
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primarily the storm, the hurricane elsa that could hit as soon as monday morning. there could be up to 60-mile-per-hour winds or greater here. you're talking about part of a tower that's still standing. in the last ten days since the initial collapse, there is a major column inside the building that officials say hovde moved up to 12 inches. this is an unsturdy building, one which rescue teams are still trying to recover 126 bodies. calling this a rescue effort as well. but that's where the search effort this weekend is so paramount and so crucial. i want to let you hear from some of the officials last night. >> we're not just running an emergency response, as you can see. but we're also preparing our whole community for a possible storm at the same time. >> obviously, the safety of our personnel was paramount. so we want to be working out there as long as we can. if winds increase depending on calculations and engineers dwiz,
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we'll make that decision. >> ali, just last night the mayor actually signed a declaration approving the demolition of that remaining part of the power but said it wouldn't happen until after the storm passes. my follow-up question at the conference last night was whether they would recover or rescue all 126 individuals that are unaccounted for before they demolish that building? she was not ready to make the guarantee and said they had to weigh the balance of the risk of that building poses. it's a tough reality for the families. and you also noted there is -- there is the audit undergoing across miami-dade county of otherablings to see whether they -- any certifications of safety lapsed. there was one building last night in which hundreds of residents, about 11 miles from here at another complex were ordered to evacuate over the course of 30 minutes because of what was found to be structural
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deficiencies. and the families werefullying as the sun was going down. that's the state in which people are fearful of the state their own buildings. >> the audits require forensic engineers in short supply now because literal everiabling in miami-dade over 40 years has to hire someone to look at our stuff, tell us the dangerous. more to come maybe. good to see you, vaughn. a bit of progress made this week on infrastructure. but biden's sweeping bill still on the table. bob casey joins me next to discuss the steps he is willing to take to ensure all of biden's infrastructure agenda makes it through the senate. but first following breaking news out of japan. at least 19 people missing following a massive lalds west of tokyo. dozens of homes and karps in shukza prefecture swept away. the mudslide was began after the area was inundated with torrential rain. look at the pictures. so far at least two people have
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been found pushed out to sea. however their deaths are yet declared officially. the prime minister is calling for an emergency task force to handle the crisis and rescue efforts. this is the developing story we will bring you updates as soon as we get them. we'll be right back. ...paid her claim...
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while congress is currently out for the 4th of july recess, democrats grapple with a tricky task. maintaining party unit on the infrastructure plan of president biden, amid growing restlessness from all corners the party. even two republicans came together to approve a $715 billion-dollar transportation bill providing funds for roads, bridges and clean drinking water. party leaders say that could lay the framework for passing the $$2.3 trillion of biden infrastructure bill next month. but progress he was and monitor democrats push for a spending bill covers what is starting to
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be called human infrastructure, like expanding investments in childcare programs. in a tweet pennsylvania senator bob casey echoed sen mts of many saying before he votes on the bipartisan infrastructure deal, the $715 billion-dollar deal, quote, senate democrats need to come together and reach an iron clad agreement on passing a big, bold, reconciliation bill that includes funding for home and community-based services. in another tweet, the senator wrote, quote, care can't wait. joining me now democratic senator bob casey of pennsylvania. good morning to you, senator. thank you for this. tell me what you mean by, democrats have to come to an iron clad agreement on passing a big, bold reconciliation bill. what do you mean by that? >> well, thanks very much, ali. i think it's vital for our party to meet the needs of american families to have a big, bold proposal that would be very
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close to and if not all of president biden's jobs plan and families plan. there is a bipartisan agreement on the physical infrastructure only part that we can work out. that's fine. we'll see what happens. i have not seen the details of that yet in legislation. but ultimately we still have most of the work to do within our own pocket. that means investments in early care and learning. prekindergarten education, childcare. you mentioned the home and community-based services for seniors and people with disabilities. these are challenges that families faced now years if not generations. this is the moment to go big and get it done. we've got to work that out within our caucus. because unless we have an agreement there are a lot of us not just going to sign on to a physical infrastructure only bill and move on. we've got to go big and meet the needs of american families, especially the care-giving need. >> where is the most work here? because there is a republican argument -- first of all,
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everybody agrees roads and bridges need to be fixed, not even -- no dispute about that. but republicans say that's what infrastructure is. and a number of democrats say it's a bunch of the other things like home and community-based services, or elder care, or, you know, the better jobs act that you introduced. in fact i've got a screen up right now which is what you and debbie dingle introduced, the better care, better jobs act. a lot of details. you're calling infrastructure something that many republicans are not calling infrastructure. >> no question about it. i think the -- only in washington would you have a narrow definition. because families real life involves getting to work every day, and having someone help them with the care giving that allows their family to go to work to get the work -- you know, for a lot of people repairing the bridge on the way to work is important. but for other people and especially women, ali, you know this, that bridge to work is
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someone coming into the home or the home of their mother and take care of her. that bridge to work might be quality affordable childcare for children. we have -- if we're going to have the economy come back and use the president's word, build back better, the better is better care giving, a better life for families, higher wages for workers. we've got a workforce that takes care of seniors and elderly that makes $12 an hour. they're women of color mostly. and we've never invested in them. i think they should have a chance to join a union so they can have security in their work as they're providing life saving and lie affirming care. >> let me ask you about the -- the supreme court decision -- opinions that came out this we can. you tweeted about this -- alto five-factor test. it should be emphasize ds that small d democrats have nothing to celebrate in the, it does voting right act.
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induces fears about voter fraud, a phenomenon that barely exists. we're going down a weird road in america the phantom thing with the big law extending to voter frau fraud is entrenched into law. >> ali, we're -- we reached a point now with the supreme court decisions and with the -- the advent of all of the -- what is it more than 400 voter suppression bills throughout the country, where we're at a point of no return. we're either going to preserve our democracy and protect voter rights or protect the voter rights to preserve the democracy or not. we've come to a point where democrats have to stand up and get something done. now, i think we can do that. because it's apparent to me that republicans are just going to endorse the voter suppression bills. and at its core we should be blunt about this. at the core the voter suppression bills are about
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white supremacy. unfortunately it seems the republican party is becoming a one-or two-issue agenda party where they seem only interested in stopping joe biden's programs and and especially on the care giving issues. and supporting voter suppression bills. >> it seems obvious what you just said. you have some people in the senate who are members of your party who probably need a little convincing of that. are you involved in any of those conversations with some colleagues who think that we really still need to continue to try and be as bipartisan as we can with respect to voting rights? because a lot of americans have come to the conclusion you come to, that is republicans seem to be on the wrong side of this issue for the wrong reasons. >> i'd love to be to say we can do this in a bipartisan way. but i think the republican party now is -- is completely captured by -- by this movement to enact voter suppression bills.
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i don't think there is a vote to change -- to have a federal protection. what we're going to need i think is a change in the senate rules to allow us to protect voting rights with 51 votes. that's ultimately what we have to do. >> senator, are you worried about the creep of the adds non-sense into pennsylvania? you've got a state republican senate leader who is very interested in pretty much duplicating what they're doing in arizona. >> no question. look, this is agenda item number one for the republican party at the state level across the country, including in pennsylvania. the only good news is ali as you know we've got a democratic governor, governor tom wolff who will veto voter suppression bills. but this is the norm because republicans i think have concluded that they can't win by getting more votes. they can only win by voter suppression bill. >> senator, good to see you as always. thank you for joining us. bob casey of pennsylvania. those memories still haunt
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me. the words of a transgender woman who spent two years in and out of men's prisons experiencing unimaginable abuse and trauma. thanks to her new jersey made a major change that protects rights a and lives of transgender people in prisons. that's next. le in prisons. that's next. and one we discover. one that's been tamed and one that's forever wild. but freedom means you don't have to choose just one adventure. ♪ ♪ you get both. introducing the wildly civilized all-new 3-row jeep grand cherokee l. ♪ ♪ this isn't just a walk up the stairs. all-new 3-row jeep grand cherokee l. when you have an irregular heartbeat, it's more. it's dignity. the freedom to go where you want, knowing your doctor can watch over your heart. ♪♪ when you're entertaining,
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all right. here's a hugely consequential story you haven't heard about this week. new jersey made a big change in the way it treats prisoners, announcing this week that inmates will be placed in prisons on based on gender identity rather than sex assigned at birth. for transprisoners this is a life and death issue. it's happening because a woman known in court papers as sonia doe spoke up. sonia doe spent 18 minutes of the prison sentence bouncing around between four men's prisoned living as a woman since 2003 says she was reportedly
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misgendered given humiliating strip severance. sexually harassed and assaulted by fellow prisoners and guards. when i was forced in live in men's prisons i was terrified i wouldn't make it out alive. the memories still haunt me. so she complained about the horrible treatment to authorities but instead of receiving help she was placed in solitary confinement. eventually doe said enough was enough. she enlisted the help of the new jersey aclu and filed a lawsuit against the state's department of corrections. demanding to be transferred to a woman's felt. she was. fast forward two years to this week and now we see her struggle realized on a policy level. this week her settlement with the new jersey department of corrections was announced as part of the settlement the department adopt an agencywide policy to protect people in prison transgender enter sex and non-binary which dough says gives her comfort. though i still have nightmares
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with about that time it's a relief to know as a result of my experience the new jersey department of corrections has adopted substantial policy changes so no person should be subjected to the horrors i survived. we may never know her real naem but courage in speaking up and fighting back when she was as vulnerable as it gets, that courage will make everyone coming after her safer. so we thank you sonia dough. this entire country has a long way to go on prison reform. a grandma in baltimore released from federal prison last year is back in jail because she missed a phone call from her parole officer. my friend tiffany cross joins me now. tiffany, tell me about the woman and who else you have on tap today. >> you story you went through ali was heart breaking. we have a long way to go with the criminal justice system in the country. we'll be talking to an attorney for miss levi, one of about 4,500 federal prisoners released to home confinement as a
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precaution to avoid covid. but now she has to go back to prison after missing a phone call from her parole officer because she was taking a class. we'll be talking about her case and what happens to the other low-level offenders released during the pandemic. essentially in a state of limbo. plus the cruelty in the criminal justice system we'll talk to adam swer $serwer about his new book. i don't know if you've seen this new video from january 6th. a congressman will talk to me about the house committee investigating the insurrection live in los angeles. it's a jam-packed show a lot to get to. a quick story i want to plug. we're talking about -- i don't know if you heard about this -- black tiktok user are boycotting the platform citing cultural appropriatation. we'll talk to those folks and the impact it had on a new album. a lot to get to. >> are you adding an extra hour?
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that's a lot. i'm sorry you're there. i'm here at 30 rock. one of the days we'll run into each other. don't miss tiffany on the cross-connection starting 10:00 a.m. eastern. free on technicality. out of prison but not exonerated which raises the question, can it happen again? the former special prosecutor in the case says, quotes, it makes me sick to my stomach. we'll speak to her next. to my s. we'll speak to her next. when technology is easier to use... ♪ barriers don't stand a chance. ♪ that's why we'll stop at nothing to deliver our technology as-a-service. ♪ we have to be able to repair the enamel on a daily basis. with pronamel repair toothpaste,
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front desk. yes, hello... i'm so... please hold. ♪♪ i got you. ♪ all by yourself. ♪ go with us and get millions of flexible booking options. expedia. it matters who you travel with. this week bill cosby who was convicted of sexual assault in 2018 walked out of prison a freeman based on a technicality. and now many wonder whether the release of a sexual predator can happen again. here is what happened. in 2005 the montgomery county pennsylvania district attorney declined to diet cosby for the
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alleged sexual assault of andrea constand. after that bruce castor who you might remember as one of donald trump's impeachment lawyers. promised cosby his office wouldn't press criminal charges. cosby later sat for a deposition in a civil case filed by the same victim settled out of court. fast forward to 2014 when a new prosecutor in that same office reversed the decision not to diet. and used statements that cosby made himself in his deposition against him, including his admission of drugging victims with whom he wanted to have sex. he was then found guilty of the offense in 2018. but on wednesday the supreme court of pennsylvania overturned the sexual assault conviction, citing violation of due process. we should note even though the court ordered the 83-year-old free it has not exonerated him for crimes whatsoever. but this was one of the highest profile me too convictions ever and considered a major victory for sexual assault survivors
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everywhere. just like that it was rescinded on a technicality. remember this powerful 2015 new yorker magazine cover that showed the faces of 35 women who alleged that cosby assaulted them. well today the number of accusers is almost double that. pennsylvania supreme court sought to uphold the law in this instance but it feels like anything but justice. for more of the legal implications on this i'm joined by kristen gibbenens fed and a former special prosecutor in the bill caulks case. and kringt oxney both msnbc legal analyst. thank you for being with us. kristen, let me start with you. what's the reaction after understanding the law in this, the inconsistencies applied within the context of bill cosby and the things that he is alleged to have done that he admitted himself that he has done, how are we a few days after this supposed to be processing and thinking about
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it? >> i think one of the things i think i hope many survivors take airway is this was a technicality, had nothing to do -- and the supreme court did not say the merits of the case would not be upheld. yes he stands before us as a freeman without the guilty conviction behind him without the jail sentence. but keep in mind, a jury of his peers did state unequivocally that he did sexually assault andrea constand. i hope survivors take solace in that. >> cynthia, if one were to say -- there are cases like this. there are cases going back a long time, in which the memories of victims are brought into question because we have a system that does that. how do we make sure this kind of thing doesn't happen again? in your mind what went wrong and how can we deal with it? >> well, this didn't go wrong because there was any problem with the victim. this isn't because the victim
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didn't remember, or there was an evidentiary problem. this was a screw upby the lawyer who originally promised him he won be prosecuted, and -- and basically took away his fifth amendment right and then he testified. it's actually -- we talk about it as a technicality because that's kind of the vernacular. but this is the core of our justice system. this is a person's fifth amendment right. i'm a sex crimes prosecutor, a woman of mother of four daughters. i think it's outrageous this man isn't in jail the rest of his life. but this is a core principle of our justice system we spent spent -- i spend the last four years on the kmanl saying where is our rule of law, core principles. we have to stick with that. as outrageous as it is in this case because this prosecutor promised him that he wouldn't be prosecuted and then he gave testimony without invoking his fifth amendment rights and then that testimony was used against him, that's a principle we have
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to uphold, even in the worst-case scenario, which of course this is. >> so, kristen, if the law had been followed according to what the supreme court said, bill cosby probably would have done exactly what kringt oxny said he would have invoked the fifth amendment protections and we wouldn't have had that case. play that out what's better? he got convict and sent to jail and then released for reasoning or he may never have been convicted? >> well, i want to just emphasize that i totally respect our esteemed bench here in pennsylvania. but i also want to also emphasize this is an alleged agreement that bruce castor is now stating -- has existed. and we -- they are in writing, formallyized approved by the court. there are various steps that need to be taken to make sure
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that -- that the legal confines are actually met here and there are legal protections. but to answer your question, what would have happened whether there would have been conviction or not. if the court found -- in the common pleas court had found that there was -- that this alleged promise had been made, and that bill cosby had detrimentally relied on the promise which is what the supreme court felt not the common pleas court found and not what the superior court found, but if they found that you are absolutely right and they would not have prosecutored and there wouldn't have been conviction. but i think one of the core things to kind of emphasize here is that because he -- because of the promise that bruce castor made, my hope is that if there are any other victims out there who are still within the statute of limitations for a criminal prosecution, this type of decision should not -- and i
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hope will not be held against that prosecutorial office from bringing charges. the alternative would be what the justice would have said that we would have proceeded with the prosecution without the use of the office. >> this is an interesting conversation, i appreciate the wisdom you both brought to us. first, a quick programming note. officials in surfside, florida are holding a new conference to update on the horrific condo collapse. msnbc will have full coverage on it. we'll bring it to you live. we are back after a quick break. we are back after a quick break. when you really need to sleep you reach for the really good stuff. new zzzquil ultra helps you sleep better and longer when you need it most. it's non habit forming and powered by the makers of nyquil.
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see if you can save by switching today. comcast business. powering possibilities. following a cascade of news surrounding brittany spears of her conservatorship after she shocked the world of legal restrictions not just over her finances, you know, you probably knew if you follow anything about her. her personal life and own body. a judge denied spears' petition to remove her father jamie on wednesday. the wealth management firm that was acting as a coconservator of spears' estate, it wants to respect spears' wishes after listening to her painful testimony in court last week.
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the firm was under the impression that she joined the conservatorship voluntarily. brittany spears have yet to file a petition with the court to release herself from a conservatorship without under going a medical evaluation. >> back with me to discuss, i am a news guy, i am not a lawyer. i didn't know this kind of thing existed. i was blown away by this testimony, by what whitney spears had to say and thinking how is this possible in 2021? i am putting that question onto you. how is this possible? how are these arrangements possible? >> it should not be possible in this case. this type of conservatorship in california for people who have dementia and people who are never getting better.
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this makes you sick to your stomach. this woman does not need a conservatorship and think of kanye west had a break down. this should be stopped immediately. the idea that she had a lawyer failed to mention there was a way for her to get relief from this, i find it outrageous. the court should appoint a different lawyer and she should be released from this immediately. >> the aclu tweeted that people with disabilities have a right to live their lives. kristen, i do think that as many people like me don't follow her life closely, i had no idea of
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this part of thing. i think as people learn about this they're going to say as cynthia says this can't possibly be what conservatorships are for. >> absolutely correct. one of the things i get to highlight is if there is a conservatorship cynthia is pointing out is individuals incapable of caring for themselves, typically you see someone with dementia and a lot for elders or disables. about approximately 1.5 million adults are under some type of conservatorship and they are court appointed. here is really disturbing with brittany spears because it sounds like when ever these guardianships are in place, they are supposed to be lease
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restrictive. it sounds like she's not able to retain council of her choice because she has no control over her finances. when we see these types of fundamental rights that are guaranteed to all americans being violate here, it becomes very disturbing. i think it highlights another issue that we have. the government accountability office release what we don't know and we don't have enough information about what's going on with these guardianship and conservatorship. we need to have a lot more data so there is no room for situations like this such as abuse or control. >> again this system were not and if people did not goat watch it, they would not have done. i appreciate you calling it guardianship. i am a business journalist, i think of conservatorship in that sense. how does this change? is it finding out about these things and constitutional approach, how do we figure out
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people who should not having other people in charge like things like their reproductive rights can be free of that? >> california is looking at amending some of their laws of strict conservatorship. this is a woman who have fewer rights than your average inmates. she's not allowed to make her own schedule but she's still allowed to make $130 million album and be on television and make a lot of people money. it is very helpful to bring her case forward and it would be great if the aclu get involved in this case and there needs to have a full hearing and she needs to have a full evaluation before it could be withdrawn and probably needs some help along the way. it is helpful to bring her case forward and california is going to have to look for what they
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have done here. >> thank you both of you this morning. i appreciate it. that does it for "velshi" this morning. thank you for joining, you can catch me back here tomorrow. i will be joined by bennie thompson. keep it here, the all new "cross connection" with tiffany cross is locked and loaded and starts right now. at the top, scuffle with a small group of officers who gave in barely after a minute. the mob now has direct access to
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capitol entrances. >> i can't believe this is reality. good morning everybody, welcome to "the cross next," i am tiffany cross. we have a lot to get to today. we are starting with new revelation for the insurrection. speaker pelosi announced this week that congressman bennie thompson will investigate january 6th event. mccarthy was not too pleased about that and he has not announced which republicans he'll appoint to committee. now congressman thompson is not scared and made it clear that the january 6th committee is following this

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