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tv   The Week With Joshua Johnson  MSNBC  April 25, 2021 9:00pm-10:00pm PDT

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days in the white house. this week, he'll take a victory lap in front of congress. but what does the american public think of his time in office? a brand new poll is giving us fresh insight into what's going on, what's working and what isn't. plus, i've 19 seventies, along with a whole lot of other folks to get decent representation in congress, now statehood bill is headed for the senate, why does it matter? and what will it take. i'll talk to d.c. delegate eleanor homes norton. and a new defenses emerging for the three ex officers involved in george floyd's arrest. blame it on derek chauvin. will it work? i'll ask a legal expert. welcome to the week. president biden marks his first 100 days in office next, week so, how is he doing? new nbc polling out today shows
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the majority of americans support is handling in some of the biggest issues facing his country. 50% of the -- joe biden is doing, so there's clearly room for improvement. but it's worth noting that his predecessor had a 40% approval rating this time four years ago. well, not so bad joe. the number one issue he's dealing with, according to nbc poll respondents, is the coronavirus, it's also the area where biden's approval is strongest. 69% of the country approves of the job is doing. only 27% disapprove. remember, it was just a year ago on friday that our former president said this. >> so, supposing we hit with ultraviolet, or just very powerful late, and then i said supposing you put the lay inside the body, which he can do it through the skin or in some other way, and i see the disinfectant, knocks it out in
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a minute. one minute. is there a way we can do something like that. by injection inside, or, almost a cleaning. >> admittedly, that is a high bar to clear folks. and why the former ministration helped accelerate the development of the vaccines, through operation warp speed, there is no plan to get shots into peoples arms. the biden administration coordinated a massive vaccination push that resulted in over 200 million shots administered in his first 100 days. they deserve a lot of credit. what's more, biden used his decades of experience on capitol hill, to pass a 1.9 trillion dollar covid relief bill. moving that massive bill forward was no easy task either. whenever you think of the bill, too much, not enough. biden was there every step of the way. not just shaping the bill, but selling it to both the american people and our elected officials. that is the one clearest
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contrast we've seen in biden's first 100 days. when compared with his predecessor. it's what leadership looks like. you may not agree with the policies, his pursuit through executive action, or legislation, but she cannot deny he's putting in the work. that's what presidents are supposed to do. joining me now, a white house reporter for the associated press, and an msnbc political analyst. jonathan, welcome my friend. it's good to see you. we're coming up on these 100 days for biden in office, can you give us a quick assessment of this crucial first phase, of the biden presidency, and just how significant, are those 100 days? >> great to see you sir. hosting suit you. the white house is naturally pleased with their first 100 days. they have approval polls that show americans largely think the same. president biden is up over 50%,
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in virtually every tail. a re-chilling better marks than his predecessor, if ever hit during his entire time administration. they look at this way. they think biden was elected to do two things most of all, one not beat donald trump. meaning not just a break from his policies, but a break from tone, temperament, style. to not be the one behind the podium during covid briefing, to actually see that stage to the science and doctors who know what they're talking about. no suggestions of injecting bleach there. that he is trying to low the temperature in washington and frankly be a quieter presence. not be so overwhelming and dominating like trump was. so it felt like he was inescapable no matter where you are in america. and of course battling the pandemic itself, that's where they feel like in the polls suggest, americans think he's done a good job. he got that 1.9 trillion dollar covid relief bill passed. the economy is showing signs of improving. and most of all of course, there is the vaccine. yes there've been some worrisome rises and cases in a
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few states. but the vaccine is being distributed, in huge numbers and there are things to be worked on certainly, the population are hesitant to take the vaccine. but we are seeing now the shots going into arms, and the white house is also fond of the checks going into wallets. and they feel like that is their signature calling over the first hundred. days >> biden is making his first big address to congress this wednesday. this is after years and years of sitting in the audience, and listening to other presidents make these addresses. how big of a moment for this is joe biden? and what can we can expect from the address in light of what you've laid out so far? >> it's a significant moment, the president has had a few of these from primetime address is now. when he marks the one year anniversary of the lockdown, another that got a lot of attention when he marked the half 1 million dead to covid. this is a state of union and all but name. they will look different from what we're used to seeing, because the hall there is going to be spread, our people will
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be distant, it won't look like what we've seen every year. but the president will use this moment to do a few things here, first he will notes the uphill climb that he has ahead on some thorny issues. like policing, immigration, voting rights, expect to hear impassioned pleas for him on all of the above. and also this centerpiece is going to be his infrastructure and jobs bill. part of which is already been released, and republicans have been very cold. zero is the idea that it will be paid for by raising taxes. and we are going to hear the second part of it on wednesday. this will be more of the health care childcare mort of peoples-centric portion of the bill, rather than say roads and bridges like we normally associate with our infrastructure. >> we have about 45 seconds, left one about the next 100. days we got through the first 100, what about the next when are you to sue painting will be tops on his agenda? >> it'll be the infrastructure bill to start for sure, with more outreach across the, i'll try and get republicans on board but knowing if needed they can go alone on a party line vote, with reconciliation.
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that will be a question of priorities, obviously every president will be tested by things they cannot control. foreign policy and domestic. but it will be a push on things like guns perhaps, and certainly voting rights. watch for that as they give their blessing to the movement on the hill, in that specter over these next hundred days. >> you always get us to the point my friend. thank you very much for joining us tonight i appreciate you man. derek chauvin's to guilty verdict this week punctuated the need for police reform at the federal level. right now there are two police reform bills in congress, democrats have put forth the george floyd justice and policing act. while republicans led by my buddy tim scott, the only black republican center in office, have countered with the justice, act which critics say does not go far enough. his congresswoman karen bass, lead author of the democratic proposal, speaking to nbc's about one needs to be done. >> what's most important to me, and to others, is that we have
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to find a way to hold officers accountable to prevent these shootings from occurring. i do think we need to look at training, because i don't know the quality of the training. but maybe it's time to say more emphasis needs to be put on de-escalation. we need to look at other ways to address situations. i know one police officers are trained to shoot, they are trained to shoot to kill. not so wound. i think a lot needs to be examined in this time period. >> joining me now is jamal watkins. the senior vice president of strategy and advancement for the naacp. jamal welcome, it's good to see you. the verdict in the chauvin trial is helping spur this legislation along. but according to the ap in the 24 hours after they found chauvin guilty, six people were fatally shot by officers. does that just go to show that this is a life and death issue for people all across the country? how should we take all this information in now?
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>> as you and i know, there is a crisis that we face when it comes to over policing and police killings. extrajudicial killings. it's way out of control. in the three weeks while the trial was going on, approximately 100 individuals were killed, and in those 24 hours that you pointed out, -- andrew brown 42 years, old and demonstrates that while the trial itself resulted in an accountability moment for mr. chauvin, it does not reflect that the system, the structure in place, in terms of policing has been shifted in a way that's just. to make sure that public safety for all people and all communities suspended chief. >> you've got republicans and democrats trying to do that kumbaya thing around justice, and equity, and the legislation at least in the top that they're putting out there. do you think that this will lead to something actually
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getting done? ours is something we should be concerned about becoming an incremental process as opposed to going, big doing big and getting it done right now? >> hour, with president biden, vice president harris, ambassador susan rice, has been focused critically on reimagining public safety. literally shifting the paradigm. and as you heard from congresswoman bass, our goal is to focus on ending qualified immunity, creating a national police registry, collecting data, and analyzing data on police encounters, and a start to this, i'm saying this very clearly is bypassing the george floyd justice and policing, and but it's not the end. we realize there has to be a cultural shift. there has to be a focus on unique interventions. and there has to be a re-participation of what it really means to achieve public safety, and not be focusing on a system currently that has thousands of individuals being
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killed, and in most cases, it's not the right approach to achieve public safety. >> jamal, you've touched on a couple of the items inside the george floyd justice and policing act. it would end qualified immunity, banned certain techniques like chokeholds at the federal level, prohibit not warrants, no knock warrants, prohibit racial profiling etc. how do you take our going forward on this, where is the common ground? here are republicans have a very different take, particularly on some of the pieces that touch on police actions directly. where is the common ground for us to try to get something done? >> michael we would argue that the common ground, is literally achieving a reduction in crime. making sure that all communities are safe. and when you think about the common infrastructure, it's hard for folks to reimagine what public safety can look like, but when you think about
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an individual say going through a mental health crisis. instead of sending armed officers, whiteness and trade medical professionals to intervene. and so we know there are interventions and solutions that were, can actually reduce crime. and they do not result in the death of individuals. we believe that's not only for law enforcement offered service, but for the community, if we focus on that middle, ground that common ground and public safety, hopefully we can break through the partisan noise, that has this on one side of the aisle or the other. >> let's start to break through some of that noise with some of the sticking points. that's qualified, qualified immunity. which many republicans and line for some officers want to protect. as a compromise, senator tim skies suggesting opening up police departments to civil suits instead of the officers themselves. what do you make of that? is that a good place to start on that compromise you're talking about? >> no. we believe that in the qualified immunity is critically important, when
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you're talking about on the job performance, line for some officers are definitely put in harm's way, based upon their career choices. but when you look at the data between 2005 and 2021, approximately 14,000 plus people have been killed, by law enforcement officers, but only seven, and i will stress that, seven officers were convicted of murder. there's a disconnect, because at the end of the day, use of force, and use of deadly force should be the last result. and what we are realizing that qualified immunity in many ways covers up, when that use of force, that deadly force, has gone too far, instead of being applied in a situation that it should. we understand the notion of civil suits. and we understand the notion of opening up line forsman's, to a suit in that context. but qualified immunity is that sticking points. that we have to break through. >> thank you very much, thank you so much for being with us tonight. coming up, the battle over the
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d.c. statehood has been decades in the making. and is finally about to go to the senate. what is it mean for the people who live there? like my parents. a talk to d.c. delicate eloquent homes nor in right after this. and 3x cops involved in the george floyd's arrest, have a new defense strategy. they're crying to say, they were just following derek chauvin's lead. will it hold up in court? i'll ask a legal expert. but first, we have the headlines. hey richard. >> michael, what job could you not. you good to see. you stores are watching you for this hour. new cdc data shows over 5 million americans, skip their second covid vaccine dose, the cdc warns this may not include americans to receive shots from two different reporting entities. states are now reaching out to the vaccinated, to go and get their second shot. the missing indonesian submarine, it has been found. the vessel disappeared on wednesday as it prepared to conduct a torpedo drill.
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it was discovered broken into three parts, deep in the bali sea. all 53 people on board died. crews across the southeast are cleaning up debris after a storm has brought thunderstorms, 56,000 people in alabama and georgia, are without power saturday night. and an elementary school and oxford alabama, received damage from high winds. more in the week with joshua right after this break. re in the week with joshua right after this break [sfx: psst psst] allergies don't have to be scary. spraying flonase daily stops your body from overreacting to allergens all season long. psst! psst! all good plant-based surfactants like the ones in seventh generation detergent trap stains at the molecular level and flush them away. it's just science! just... science. seventh generation tackles stains.
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hey, me towel su towel. more gain scent plus oxi boost and febreze in every gain fling. the house of representatives
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voted this week to make the district of columbia americas first 51st state. my hometown. that would make it the newest u.s. state since hawaii was admitted in 1959. it gives the tech strict full representation in congress. now it's become almost a clichéd to say that a bill that makes it through the house makes it a difficult future in the senate but with this bill, in particular that is never been more true but sovereignty has had a long and challenging history. i know, i was part of the staff as an intern in 1978 working to help the pass a proposed constitutional amendment to the constitution which would give the congressional representation although not statehood. it passed both the house and the senate but needed gratification by 38 states. and after six years, only 16 states have agreed and the effort died. despite past challenges, the they felt that this time it might be just a bit different.
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one of them is my next guest. eleanor holmes norton who represents the district in congress when she serves on the house oversight and transportation infrastructure committees. congresswoman, it is such a treat to have you and it is always good to be with you. welcome. >> good to be with another native washington in. >> absolutely. well look, this is exciting stuff. no matter how you cut it, to see this legislation move the way it has, to have the support of the president of the united states. the house passed a bill last year on statehood but a republican senate blocked it. how does it feel to get this bill this far knowing that it is in a far different position that it was a year ago? and having the kind of support that you see from not just democrats but the president himself? >> while the president support is emblematic of the broad support we're having. and look what we have done.
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54% of the american people now support statehood. how did that happen? it happened because the hearings themselves educate educated america and what they didn't know about their own nation's capital. the people who lived here more than 700,000 of us don't have the same rights that they have. so now you have the bill supported by 57% in the swing states. we have across the board support. we have men and women. we have black and white. it looks like the more exposure the bill has, the more people come to it. they don't want to be the only country democratic country in the world. and just not give full representation to their own people in their own capital. >> so, you've got a lot of advocates out there counselor
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who receive the bill as writing historic injustice and a way to protect minority voting rights. how do you see it? what is significant about this bill given where this effort has come from? and what it ultimately will mean for the country? >> well, it's interesting that people see it as a way to protect minority voting rights. it's true that the district would have more african americans than any state but the fact is that for most of our existence, for 220 years the district was a majority white state and still i couldn't get equal representation. even equal voting rights. the more that public is educated, the more they have come to support this bill. so much so that what has brought them to the bill most is sanction without representation. remember that's the way we had
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awards in taxation without representation. we even get 42% of republicans supporting the bill when they see taxation without representation. >> so you talk about educating the public. it seems like we're having a hard time educating minority republican friends on this matter. i want you to take a look at me and to listen to a few arguments from republicans and get your reaction to them. >> and then i see the disinfectant knocks it out in a minute. one minute. is there a way we can do something by injection inside or for the cleaning because you see, it gets in the lungs and does a tremendous number on the lungs. >> okay, that wasn't, that wasn't the republican i was headed by. but you have a lot of republicans out there saying that, you know, well, d.c. does
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not have, you know, the population. d.c. doesn't have the economy. d.c. can't govern itself. what is your response to those ideas that somehow d.c. is just not up to the task of becoming a state? >> well, the district governor himself as well as any other jurisdiction in the united states today has a flourishing budget because so many people want to live in the district of columbia. if you want to know the real problem the district will have, it is that most states which have gotten statehood have come into at a time. one was democrat, one was republican. the district is having to do with on its own and still it's got 54% of the american people supporting statehood. i think we can do it. we've gotten rid of the filibuster for everything
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except legislation. we've got rid of it for nominations. the senate was laid holding up for the filibuster and i think if we can get rid of it, the filibuster that 60 vote margin for everything else you're going to have to get rid of it for statehood as well. each time this bill goes on the floor, remember we just got it passed. once before and it usually takes more than one session of congress to pass a bill. i think each time we educate the people more and more because the bill passes, the closer we get to becoming the 51st state. >> so real quick congresswoman, you touched on something that i think is interesting. you talked about states coming into by two. and d.c. is prepared to come in by itself. there has been some conversation about the possibility of a lineman with puerto rico and the great discussion that we also know around making puerto rico
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state. is that an option either now or on the back end of this as if it gets jammed up in the senate to bring puerto rico on? >> i think that is an option. puerto rico would be terrific. they have even more people than we have and their delicate is a republican. they are having hearings because they have never decided whether they want to take it all the obligations of statehood. remember, they don't pay full full federal income taxes but it looks like there are drawing more more towards statehood as well. they have a very difficult situation because they are the caribbean. this means the country has to pump money into puerto rico and they can't support themselves. >> well congresswoman, on behalf of my parents i thank you for your great work and leadership here and we look forward to your success at
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making d.c. number 51. thanks for joining us. coming up, derek chauvin was found guilty of murdering george floyd. now what about the other cops? who is there with them? that is next. i mean it... uh-oh, sorry... oh... what? i'm an emu! no, buddy! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty. ♪ [woman] what is that? [man] uh, mine. why?
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guilty in the murder of george floyd this week, we are getting some new insight into the defense for the other three officers involved in floyd's may 2020 death. new reporting from the associated press claims that those officers have already sought to deflect responsibility, to chauvin, who was the most senior officer on the scene that day. the former officers face trial in august when charges of aiding and abetting second degree murder, and second degree manslaughter. here to help us breakdown where these cases stand, is simply austin-y. she's a former federal prosecutor and an msnbc legal analyst. cynthia, great to have you. all three officers are being charged with aiding and abetting second degree murder.
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and second degree manslaughter. i'm a corporate lawyer. i don't do that whole thing, help us break this down, so we understand exactly what that means. >> what that means is, if they aided and abetted in any way help derek chauvin, they are equally responsible for the murder of george floyd. the officers are in slightly different positions, first of all, their knowledge in the the rules and regulations and the force as rookies, one is more senior guy, officer thao is the one in most trouble. he's a nine year vet. and he has enough experience that he cannot really do the i didn't know any better defense. which is what the rookies will do. officer thao is also in another interesting information came out about him during jack chauvin's trial, and that is that he was standing, they're not letting the crowd intervene, and when that female firefighter, who was so compelling, was saying to him let me help let me help, he not
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only refused to let her help, he refused to let the crowd get near mr. floyd. but he also said to her, if you are really a firefighter, you would notice stay out of police business. which is essentially, if you are really a firefighter, you would support the the line. you would support us whether we're right or wrong. i think that was very damaging testimony for him, and he is in big trouble, my guess is he will be convicted. the two others, are basically rookies. one of than was his third shift, the other and just come off his probationary period, and they're in a better position to say, derek chauvin was ten or 20 years older depending on which when you are talking about. he was our training officer, these are our first shifts, and we really looked to him and that's what we had to do. the problem is, when you actually break it down, he begins the traffic stop by pulling a gun. there was no reason in the world to pull a gun. so you get a feel for his state
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of mind at the time. and the crowd is saying, he's passing out. and they know he's passing out. and they've checked his pulse. one of the ones is saying i can't find his, paul's the other is saying maybe we should put him on his side. they knew there was a problem. and yet they did nothing. my sense of the situation is, tao is going to be convicted, and that lane and the other one can maybe get a hung jury, and then try to get in a better plea. >> what do you make of the strategy to blame chauvin in the first place? it's like all the superior officer did. it how does that guilty verdict play into the overall strategy? >> it's a great strategy. what we know about chauvin, is the more you look at the case, and the more you see the video more closely he resembles a mississippi overseer, of slaves. he's a terrible terrible person. and he was not able to get on the stand, these two young officers can get on the, stand
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they can cry, they can say they had no intention this was going to happen. they were just following their senior training officer. they're sorry. and try to go for a lesser conviction. it's a very effective strategy. i don't think it will work for title. but it may very well work, at least with one or two jurors, for the more junior officers. >> with respect to that last, peace with chauvin's sentencing coming up in. june june 16, how could that potentially impacts of this case. and what is the possibility of a plea deal, happening as well? >> i don't think there's going to be a plea deal. only because i don't think the prosecutors are going to give it to him. and why should they. they are in a really good position. there's no reason really for them to give a plea deal at this. point they have the resources, they've tried the case once. they know what they're doing, they've paid all these experts. i don't see they have a motive
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to do a plea deal. it would have to be a pretty strong case, in the junior officers would have to testify. here's the thing. if they testify, the biggest thing they can do is help convict chauvin, and chauvin is already convicted. i don't see a plea happening. >> okay, thank you so much for the federal prosecutor bringing in expertise to the conversation. coming, up infrastructure is the next big item on biden's agenda. but it as popular at the public as the white house thinks it is? will dive in to a new poll that shows it's become a partisan issue as well. and still ahead. is tiktok the new radio. you heard me right. we'll catch you up to speed on that later. l catch you up to speed on that later that later u emu & doug ♪ liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need. thank you! hey, hey, no, no limu, no limu! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪
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infrastructure plan. and 59%, the majority of americans support the proposal. with only 21 proposal percent calling it a bad idea. despite its popularity, congress is split on how to move forward, surprise. traditionally infrastructure is an issue for bipartisanship, but both sides cannot agree on the definition of the word. >> at the end of the, day i'm willing to not pay for some of the infrastructure spending, because i think it overtime pays for itself. we are not going to do a couple trillion dollars, 85% of it has nothing to do with infrastructure. >> republicans will be the first one to work with, them but i think the very first thing we would need to do, is define what infrastructure. is roads bridges, airports, broad calm. we would get this done. >> that's infrastructure. what we would call traditional infrastructure. the human infrastructure is something we are very much concerned about. >> with democrats looking for another region slate of wind heading into mid term season, could the prospects of a two
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part bill be on the table? joining me now to discuss, a former maryland congressman in business in john doe lady. former pennsylvania congressman bill shooter who served as chairman of the house transportation infrastructure committee for six years. he's now senior policy adviser esquire pen in box. gentlemen, congressman, welcome such a pleasure to have you both. let's just jump right in to the reality. both sides want to move forward on the infrastructure, everybody is feeling infrastructure. so why do we have to start this way every time with this dramatic back and forth of extremes. instead of just putting a simple infrastructure deal on the table? >> i actually think what president biden put on the table is in fact a simple infrastructure bill. it's big, but it's responsive to what we need in this country. all of the items in this bill, whether it's the roads and bridges or the communication infrastructure, or making sure
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there's not lead pipes in people's homes. are doing things to make our country more energy efficient. or actually dealing with the crisis we have. 40% of the american people are actually considered unpaid caregivers. all of those things are enormously popular. the definition of infrastructure always changes. i just heard senator graham talk about why he thinks infrastructure is. he probably would not have said airports are infrastructure, before there were airplanes. he probably would not have said broadband is infrastructure before there was high-speed communication. so we have to stop with this stupid semantics. we have to look around what's going on. and focus on the things we need. infrastructure is the ecosystem we need, to succeed. and for people to live and work in for our country to compete. and all the things in president biden's plan, are those things in each one of them individually are very popular with the american people. as you showed, the whole plan is popular with the american people. i think it's. great >> so bill, what john
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just described as very expensive. how realistic is it to expect an infrastructure bill of that scope and magnitude, that both sides can actually get behind and support and sent to the american people? >> first, i'll say hello to my good friend john, our districts bordered each other, his in maryland mine in pennsylvania, but i have to disagree with him on this issue. i think infrastructure, of course the definition can be expanded, i think broadband is something that needs to be in there. it's new infrastructure certainly. but i think the bill is far too expansive. and the reality is, republicans are not going to support. it we can talk all we want about all the different things the president has put in, there but we have to get back to somewhat basics. i think republicans, a special rule republicans like myself, which was support broadband because admiral america really needs. and again, senator coon, from delaware has a great proposal. let's break it into three
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pieces. i think if you want to more traditional infrastructure, and adding broadband and maybe some of the other things in there, i think you could get a deal. >> so you are kind of in line with my thinking on this. because i'd like to just have a look at the idea of carving out a bill, that gets to the basics of what the american people understand infrastructure to include. that would be roads, and bridges and those things that they see and can touch pretty much every day. that they know are broken. what about something like that. and to your point, and senator coons bill, and adding on the back end extra stuff that needs to get addressed maybe a little bit later. >> i think that's the way to go. i think republicans have said, that they've signaled. that their proposal would reduce 600 100 million to start. off so it's not clear all the details are not worked out, you could get there and i think to my friend john, he had proposed an infrastructure ban. i've come around to seeing that you could put an infrastructure
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ban piece in there, and then the proposal that was not just six or 800 billion dollars, but more like 1.5 1.6 trillion dollars. again i think there's an opportunity, here i think senator coons, sitter mansion to the most important people in the senate today, have said let's break this thing down and let's get to a deal. i think one of the pillars of joe biden's presidential success, was bipartisanship. reaching across the aisle. for 40 years, are 37 years he did that in a senate. i hope he gets back to that bipartisan routes. so john, since joe manchin has been called out. let's listen to what joe manchin said on cnn this morning. >> do you think that -- >> i think they should be separated. i do think they should be separated because when you start putting so much into one bill which we call an ominous pill, it makes it very very difficult for the public to understand. >> so john, manchin is throwing his support behind the split bill just like we were talking. phil and i were just talking
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about. what do you think about that? democrats can't use the budget reconciliation path. how important was this comment and do you expect mention to stick to his guns on this kind of a move? >> well i'm not sure what senator manchin is going to be as we get into these discussions and whether we split the bill or not it's kind of a tactical decision it's going to be made by the white house, by speaker pelosi, by senator schumer. we hope this can be done in a bipartisan way. i mean i also am really happy to be on this show with my good friend bill who is a terrific chair of transportation committee in the house and worked on very much bipartisan basis. so we are all for that. but i think we are getting distracted with some of these, as i said, the semantics around with the definition of infrastructure is. i think we all know that infrastructure will be defined by 51 votes in the u.s. senate. that will ultimately tell us with the definition of infrastructure is. but we have to go back to the key point, which is the things in the biden infrastructure plan, the american people
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really need. we've learned a lot post covid and we're not as resilient as we need to be. we have tremendous competition from china and we have parts of america that bill mentioned rural america is falling behind relative to areas where we see job creation. we need to create a cohesive economic ecosystem for this country and we need to connect our country and make it as competitive as possible and ensure that people have the opportunity to pursue their own happiness and get a good job in their own community, where their kids can be connected to broadband. we have to lift the burden off so many americans who are caring for elderly parents. i mean, michael, if i were to see someone in your family and you are to take care someone in my family and we would have to pay each other to do that give each other benefits. if we do it ourselves, think about all of that economic opportunity that gets taken out of the economy so we need to build that infrastructure as well. and the thing that we have to remember, because i come from the private sector and i always
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look at things in terms of the return on investment. an infrastructure has the second best return on investment of anything the government has. number one is basic research and we have seen the blessings of that last year with our basic research complex being able to bring covid vaccines but the second best is infrastructure which has almost a two ex multiplier on every dollar we spend so this bill will drive economic growth and help the american people and make us more competitive and if it's one bill or two pillars three balls i don't think it really matters. we just need to start doing some things. >> all right. former democratic congressman john delaney and former congressman bill shooter. fellas you're bringing the love tonight on infrastructure. share with your former members. thanks to you both. up next we know tiktok has reshaping social media but it's also seriously influencing the music charts. how? well that's next. >> it was that easy. to write a viral song.
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it's so busted, you can't use this part of the screen. definitely cracked every phone i've owned. (vo) you broke your phone. so verizon broke the rules. for the first time ever, new and current customers can trade in their old and damaged phones for up to $800 off our best 5g phones. my phone is old. very old. old, cracked, water damaged? doesn't matter. i'm ready for something new. now trade up to the 5g network you deserve with the 5g phone you want. because at verizon, the network is just the beginning. listening to new music is not like it wasn't my day. today, lots of hit songs did not become hits on the radio or even on streaming services anymore. it's more through dance. i'm talking about gen z's favorite social media app, you know the one, tiktok. here's nbc's -- to explain how we got here. >> i was freaking out when
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dejoy cat was doing her performance and she did the dance. when in history has a grammys performance included a tiktok dance that helped make a song viral? >> i never thought for one minute that we would be glued to one platform to discover new talent. >> at this year's grammy's, half of the songs up for record of the year were major trends on tiktok. and the top two most views artists on the app, megan thee stallion and ouchie cat, we're up for best new artists with meg taking at home. >> it absolutely is changing with the industry thinks we have next. i think overall, tiktok has been an equalizer in letting the audience determine what songs are hits and what artists become signed. >> it's got an aladdin rhythm. similar drums, and all that. >> josh six eight five was just
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one example of what happens when your song goes up. >> we heard that labels we're actually tracking you down. >> my mom as well, i didn't know it was going on. we were shopping for all the numbers and it's straight-up in the millions. for me being not, known just a guy who made beats in his room and i was like oh it happened. >> eventually, that beat made it to the top of the charts after collaboration with jason the rule oh. >> so, i know you don't know who put your beat on tiktok originally but what would you say to them now? >> i would say massive thank you. i can't thank them enough. >> it's giving people the ability to choose what music or at least some of what music becomes popular because it's the people who are picking what
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they love. >> it's the actual audience versus the industry who is choosing what's songs rise to the top. >> avenue beats signed with big machine label group in 2019 and we're trying to make it in country before their song at 2020 broke out on tiktok. >> once we kind of decided to stop trying to fit into the space we were given, it kind of just worked after that. ♪ ♪ ♪ >> yeah, like once we posted f 2020 it wasn't even a conversation. cool, this is what you're doing now. great. >> and we were like, it was that easy all along? we just had to write a viral song? >> that's all. >> five or ten years ago, five years ago, three years ago, it's like choosing a song that goes to radio and from there your kind of signaling to the audience that this is the hit even though they might disagree. >> i missed the days of and are when you could develop something and you could go top
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down and then we had that kind of power. we just don't have that anymore. we're still very valuable in that space, but we are foolish as a record company. if you see something blowing up and you don't go after it. >> so how has tiktok as a platform changed your art and music? >> i think it honestly has given us the freedom to make the music that we've always wanted to make. the exact way that we all voice wanted to make it with no boxes and then also it's given us the opportunity to fast-track us to our audience and the people who are going to love what we do. it's kind of taking away the middleman in a really important way. >> that was nbc's miami glenn. that's all for me tonight. thanks for watching, joshua johnson will be back next weekend. uh-oh, sorry... oh... what? i'm an emu! no, buddy! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty. ♪
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