tv The Beat With Ari Melber MSNBC April 6, 2021 3:00pm-4:00pm PDT
in day seven of the chauvin trial. prosecutors have been absolutely pummelling defendant chauvin with evidence and testimony that they say shows he used excessive force when killing george floyd. today this continued with the very experts who teach police officers how to use force and possibly when legally warranted deadly force. these police trainers taking the stand and telling the jury this was excessive force. >> based upon your rescrew of these materials and in light of the factors, what is your opinion as to the degree of force used by the defendant on mr. floyd on the date in question? >> my opinion was that the force was excessive. >> there it is. sometimes the evidence is that simple. we have heard the harrowing testimony, the personal stories. but these experts are speaking
in a much narrower lane: was it okay? was it the right amount of force? was it excessive? that's it. the jury hears that expert testimony. the lieutenant in charge of the use of force training also testifying it's just not appropriate under their rules, under their training to restrain someone for a super extended period of time. >> so if there was, say, for example, the subject was under control and handcuffed, would this be authorized? >> i would say no. >> would it be appropriate and within training to hold a subject in that prone restrained position with a knee on the neck and a knee on the back for an extended period of time after the subject has stopped offering any resistance? >> no, sir. >> or has lost their pulse? >> no, sir. >> these are the building blocks of testimonial evidence that we saw today. you hear they're not authorized. another pd officer that teaches
cpr training also testified. we could see chauvin looking up from the note taking. the prosecution also asking if the crowd could have prevented officers from getting floyd medical assistance at the scene? >> can the activities, though, of a crowd, can the activities of a group of onlookers excuse a police officer from the duty to render emergency medical aid to a subject who needs it? >> only if they were physically getting themselves involved, i would say. >> if they were physically prevented -- if the officer was physically prevented from doing it. >> yes, if the officer was being physically assaulted. >> we're joined now by civil rights attorney, a lead prosecutor in the trial of bill cosby. and a former prosecutor and the host of "making the case" on the black news channel. thanks to both of you for being here. what did you think of this more
expert in some ways understandably dry section of the prosecutor's arguments? >> you know, i actually thought that the state's expert, the first use of force expert was actually not as helpful. he said what basically all the other officers who were born in said. the difference here is that those officers weren't paid experts. they were actual colleagues of derek chauvin. so i thought that was a bit more powerful in terms of conveying the information to those jurors. when you have a state expert on use of force saying that george floyd was actively resisting, that he kicked officers, those are things you don't want the jurors to hear, especially from the first, you know, expert on use of force. i thought that was odd. he didn't necessarily provide any information that the jurors hadn't already heard. it was just coming from an expert.
>> yeah. understood. and i want to play a little bit of the mpd lieutenant talking about what is the use of force you should use, the least amount. take a look. >> you want to use the least amount of force necessary to meet your objectives to control. and if those lower uses of force do not work, would not work or are too unsafe to try it, then you can increase your level of force. >> walk us through that part. >> so, basically, use of force is evaluated moment to moment. it might be appropriate in the first minute. it might be appropriate in the second. but it may not be appropriate as of 9 minutes and 29 seconds. it has to be evaluated according to the aggression the officer is facing. there was a great chart put up that shows the type of use of force that should be applied
based on the type of aggression and resistance that they're met with. so what he's saying is, yes, there could be an argument initially when they first made contact with george floyd, but very soon after, that should have deescalated once george floyd stopped resisting, once he was in that prone position and handcuffed, why was the resistance then needed. then you start going into the deescalation training and that's what chauvin should have then applied. floyd wasn't a threat at that point and he needed to start the deescalation process and that's what he didn't do. he proceeded on with the use of force in an aggressive manner no matter the aggression or the resistance or lack thereof that he was facing. >> and, kristin, i know you are here with us. i want to play for you this whole issue around whether this was even a proper position to put someone in, which is a separate analysis from the length and the other issues we
discussed. take a listen. >> i don't know what kind of improvised position that is. so that's not what we train. >> walk us through what's being conveyed to the jury there because, again, this is an important distinction between what to a layperson's eyes might look like force or what we would call violence, but there are some procedures that law enforcement use that may look or be aggressive but are within training whereas other things they do, particularly in this context may be more legally dubious precisely because it is like what are you improvising? are you trying to just hurt or kill someone? >> yeah. this goes to the element of assault. and, remember, that is the underlying felony conviction or felony charge that the prosecution needs to prove in order to get that highest level, that second-degree murder charge. so the analysis is whether either it's proper and in line with training or it's an
assault. and that is an ever changing assessment based on what the officer is experiencing or not. in this particular testimony it was important because if it's not an approved training technique, then it shouldn't be done. and if it is done and there is that force continuum, then it could be considered assault or excessive, as we have heard that used from the expert. >> yeah. i also want to play -- we have been following, of course, many aspects of this including the part that is a trauma to re-live but is necessary under the justice system. ben krump was speaking out about all of this. take a listen. >> unfortunately and tragically, the road to justice had to go through them seeing their loved one over and over again being
literally tortured to death. i know for many of us george floyd represents a cause, a case, a hashtag, but for his siblings and his children, george floyd is their blood. >> kristin, speak on this and given your experience in any criminal trial can be difficult in every way, including for everyone involved, but speak on this with what you have done as a prosecutor where individuals really have to go through something difficult just to be present or to testify around something that might be one of the worst or most painful things they have been through in their whole life. >> and this is really -- it was really sentimental.
i can only imagine the trauma his family had to endure. not only being limited in how many individuals can observe the trial as it is proceeding but also to have to re-live it from those different perspectives, the various body cam footage. that's some trauma that is beyond, i would say, a form of grief, that they are already experiencing with the loss of a loved one. and we actually got to see in the trial. we have seen many of their families throughout different press conferences, but we also got to see the emotion of his girlfriend who kind of expressed it on the scene. but this is the type of trauma that is very normal. it is a part of walking through that journey towards justice.
and i think that, by showing it through courtney and also kind of through the press conference, the prosecutors have done a really good job of bringing this emotion to the jury. but it is very, very sad for the family to have to re-live it over and over again. >> yeah. and it's a big part of this early part, where we're getting this range of testimony and of course we're still in the middle of it. we're going to see where it all goes and what the defense and cross arguments are like as well. i want to thank both of you for being with us. coming up in just 30 seconds, our shortest break, how trump world is abandons matt gaetz. here with the facts when we're back in 30 seconds. allergies don't have to be scary. spraying flonase daily stops your body from overreacting to allergens all season long. psst! psst! all good how great is it that we get to tell everybody how liberty mutual customizes your car insurance so you only pay for what you need? i mean it... uh-oh, sorry...
oh... what? i'm an emu! no, buddy! only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty, liberty, liberty, liberty. ♪ republican congressman matt gaetz continues to struggle with damage control. he's facing these allegations that range from paying for sex to using drugs to backing sex trafficking to sex with an underaged girl. gaetz denies all of it. he has not been charged with any crime. but in a republican party that often wages war against the doj and stands with even indicted allies, gaetz's position is free fall. after years of defending trump, the former president's aid say there is no help because he is a grenade whose pin has been pulled. his own staff would send embarrassing videos of their
boss, which means new reasons to be worry of him. trump defenders often seem to think their relationship or alliance with donald trump is somehow different only to learn that donald trump discards them like so many others the moment things get tough or get legal. the loyalty is one way. now currently trump and his team are openly bailing on gaetz. they don't pretend anything otherwise. one trump confidant leaking how gaetz has been handling things saying maga world is dumping him because he hasn't done a single thing to get anyone to have confidence in him. note the candor there. this self-described trump world person is saying, they're not assessing whether gaetz did perform a sex crime but assessing whether they think his pr isn't working and they see a
train wreck. >> you and i went to dinners. about two years ago, your wife was there and i brought a friend of mine. we went to the local fbi. they asked my dad to wear a wire, which he did. >> you just saw a matt gaetz interview. that was one of the weirdest interviews i have ever conducted. >> one of the weirdest. that's how it played in trump world. that's how it played with a big anchor, a big figure at fox news. and that's the ice cold shoulder from that world. meanwhile, we're hearing other developments that might be a tension, a group that's called women for america first has posted online at twitter that gaetz will be their guest worker and they looked for their event to be held at trump doral in florida this friday. thanks for being here, sir. >> thanks for having me. >> there is so many problems here. as i stipulated in all of our coverage and again tonight mr.
gaetz denies all the allegations and has not been charged with a crime. yet, all these people around him who know him and these other republicans in trump world are bailing on him. what do you see here? >> it seems like department of justice investigation means something different when you don't have the attorney general on his own leash, right? suddenly, a doj investigation carries more teeth. i think that's what we're seeing. i think one thing that people have missed over because, look, matt gaetz for a lot of people on the left, he's a punch line, he's a guy people on the left like to dislike. what's been missed is there has already been an indictment here for joel greenberg. this investigation from gaetz is spinning off from that. so when you look at the real teeth of this investigation it certainly doesn't stack up well
for matt gaetz. you are exactly right, innocent until proven guilty. it doesn't look great for gaetz right now. and then you are in a situation where there is all this other kind of untoward behavior that's coming out and all these leaks that are coming out. it suggests that this is a guy that, even if the trump world was willing to defend him when he was useful for them, they knew he had some things about him. turns out you can't get the trump protection unless you marry into the family. you have to marry into the family to get the full protection of trump world. he's not part of the family, which means he can be cast aside the minute he causes them trouble, and this is that minute for them. >> yeah. he's certainly not getting that protection. as for what he's saying in public, he's always been a somewhat extreme and bar roek
figure even in america 2017 to 2020, a period of american life that i'm sure will be studied in all sorts of ways. but extreme even by that measure. neal katyal joined us and said, whatever you think of matt gaetz, any decent lawyer would be telling him not to be doing the tucker interview. i'm curious after your view on the intersection of law and politics. sometimes you break with the legal advice to get the public pr benefit. that's kind of a bet, if you will. what happens if you break with the legal advice and the pr is boomeranging on you and you played yourself and tucker is telling his own audience, that was weird. that was a problem. >> we're going to see this a lot for the next bit of american life. what we're seeing is people trying to run the trump defense without being donald trump, right? we're going to see a lot of politicians who are accused of sorted behavior. trump has been accused by 25
women of sexual misconduct. he has brushed it all off with bluster and ridiculous interviews, right? every politician accused is going to try some version of the same strategy, right? and we don't know if that's going to work for anybody else other than donald trump. if it doesn't work for you, if you try the trump strategy and it doesn't work for you, the result is jail. right? it's a one way street there, right? >> yeah. >> if you try to blow off prosecutors and keep running your mouth against the advice of counsel and keep putting yourself in legal jeopardy and it doesn't work, the result is jeopardy. the result is jail. the result is bad things happening to you. and that's the dye that gaetz is casting. that's the dye we will see unfortunately a lot of politicians cast as they go trump-like to get themselves out of problems. >> have you seen "dark knight"?
>> i have indeed. success has already defeated me. i don't know about you. >> well, it's one of our favorites around here. and to put a twist on it, i'm reminded of when the batman copy cats who are opposed by batman and the joker for different reasons, want to be like him and then they even ask him after they fail to simulate him in the crime busting scene, what's the difference between me and you? and he memorably says, i'm not wearing hockey pants. >> i'm not wearing hockey pants. >> there it is. there it is. >> that's brilliant. >> that's it. if it were fallback friday, i would ask you to do it in your "dark knight" voice. but i'm not wearing hockey pants. whether people like it or not, it is a legal fact. donald trump did get away legally with some things that other people didn't. but when you point out out, it
is important and interesting and maybe you are inadvertently giving sound, legal frame work to these folks which is the fact that one guy in this particular situation got away with so much does not mean that's usually going to work for you. >> exactly, ari. i mean, again, this is spinning off of an investigation of a man who was already under indictment who, for all we know, as his trial gets going we'll sing. trump had the amazing, i would say, good fortune that none of his alleged accomplices ever seemed to flip on him. paul manafort took the weight. michael flynn took the weight to never turn on trump. only michael cohen eventually was compelled to tell what i believe was the truth. he was the one that didn't get a pardon, by the way. does gaetz have the same kind of pull with his potential
accomplices that they're never going to flip on him? does he think that? these are the kinds of -- we're back into a world where trump denied gravity for so long. we're back into a world where gravity always wins. >> gravity is back. >> and that's what -- >> gravity is back. that's fair. >> that's the word now, gravity is back. >> you tie it all together well. gravity is back. you reminded everyone that the people who knew the most according to the mueller report, which i read more than once, were stone and manafort, and they said the least. and the people who said the most may have known the least around those underlying allegations. mueller clearly showed it right at the core of a potential collusion, stone is on the phone. manafort has got this money deal. and they really did carry the weight. as you say, they did get the commutation benefits. hope we can get you back soon, sir. >> thank you for having me. have a nice one. yes, sir.
a lot more coming up. the atlanta mayor issuing a new executive order. it combats, she says, part of the georgia suppression law legally. but first why some see progressivism at an all-time high in president biden's first 60 days and what bernie sanders has to do with it. that's next. at's next. n't stop u but your partial can act like a bacteria magnet, putting natural teeth at risk. new polident propartial helps purify your partial and strengthens and protects natural teeth. so, are you gonna lose another tooth? not on my watch! (burke) phone it in to 1-800-farmers and you could get all sorts of home policy perks like the claim-free discount. go three years without a claim and get a discount. (neighbor) just by phoning it in? (burke) just phone it in. (painter 1) yeah, just phone it in and save money for being claim-free. (neighbor) even if i switch to farmers today?! (painter 2) yep, three years claim-free with any home insurance. (painter 3) i'm phoning it in and saving money for literally doing nothing. (burke) get your policy perks by calling 1-800-farmers. go ahead, phone it in.
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emerging in these first 70 days of the biden presidency. joe biden has begun his presidency on a more liberal footing than the last two democratic presidents which makes this the most progressive start to any presidency in the last 40 days. biden is pushing for $4 trillion in total spending in his first 100 days, getting a liberal boost that they can bypass mcconnell's obstruction. liberals are encouraged. conservatives are agas. and many democrats who know joe biden are struck by how he's evolving in this role and in this tough time for the nation, a contrast to a senate career where he was, by his own words, a sen tryst or even conservative democrat on many different issues. >> more cops, more prisons, more physical protection for the people. >> we have predators on our streets. >> you must take back the
streets. >> congress gives president bush what he wants by a vote of 77-23. >> we say, yes, mr. president you have that pow tore go to war. >> i meant social security as well. i meant medicare and medicaid. >> he went medicare and medicaid. he meant iraq. he went clean up the streets. that was then. and then we know recently that party he's in seemed to sort of split two presidential cycles in a row between the more establishment sen tryst choice and a more progressive one. at this time a year ago, sanders had not yet endorsed biden and they had been engaging in months of respectful but vigorous policy debate. >> joe has voted for terrible trade agreements. >> i don't know there is any trade agreement that the senator would ever think made any sense.
>> joe and i have a fundamental disagreement here, in case you haven't noticed. obviously the power of the court is useful. but it doesn't go anywhere. if you laugh at joe, then you're missing the point. this is an existential crisis. >> about a year later, biden is governing from the core and base of the democratic party, the progressive base, pushing the liberal plans i just mentioned, spending that outstrips anything from the early days of the obama-biden administration, higher taxes on the wealthy and on corporations. and joe biden taking sides with labor more than he did in past decades. he's pushing the new multitrillion plan with major planks for jobs, racial justice and addressing climate change. now whether it's correlation or causation, biden at times can sound a bit like the new bernie. >> we need a lot more, and that's true for the other 49
states. china is building high speed rail all over the place. we are not. >> we have to improve our infrastructure. china and other countries are eating our lunch. >> is biden simply revealing his own values now that he has this power? or is he channels sanders? an obama campaign veteran says it shows the new era of progressive politics that's much closer to bernie sanders of radically distributes america's wealth downwards. sanders himself wants more direct climate action in that new biden bill. and biden has not been with liberals on a plan to wipe out student set up to $50,000 or go to the matt fully on minimum wage in the senate. but as he argues and some liberals have been arguing for years, the democratic's party's base is fundamentally progressive on economic justice, and that base with its coalition is larger than the maga
movement. and the new president biden increasingly sounds like he gets that, which means he sounds more like the party's progressives than, say, joe biden from the '90s. >> ceos make millions and millions of dollars, but don't ask us to pay more in taxes. >> a multinational corporation that builds a factory abroad brings it home and sell it, they pay nothing at all. >> if elected president of the united states, we're going to do everything that we can to rebuild the trade union movement in this country. >> i'm a union guy. it's about time they start to get a piece of the action. >> that brings us to the deep dive political conversations we do around here on a special day we call chai day, who has worked on three presidential campaigns and to whom we are indebted for some of those points we just explored. good to have you back, sir. >> thank you for having me, ari.
>> people know it's chai day from the music and the cartoon. >> that's very cool. >> yeah. you see an overlap here between these two people. explain. >> yeah. i mean, look, when the campaign last year, biden campaign, was saying that biden was going to pattern himself after fdr and lbj, i thought it was campaign spin. they thought they were putting it out there to get progressive more affectional towards biden. he is a democratic senator who did represent the credit card industry and the banks quite ably in the u.s. senate when he was a senator from delaware. of course i never thought he would be the next fdr or the next lbj. however, here we are. and we are historic investments in the working class, in children. think about the fact we will cut child poverty in half as a
result of this stimulus. we have an investment in the k through 12 system and children's schools and child care and even in child health care as a result of what biden is doing with the stimulus and with infrastructure. how do we get here? there is really two reasons. one is that biden, you know, who is not the doggering old man that fox makes him out to be a proving to be an agile and acute observer of politics. he understand where is the country has been, where it's going and how the obama-clinton sort of pathway didn't really work for the democratic party very well. the second i would say is bernie sanders. i think it's very fair to say that bernie sanders is one of the most consequential losers in presidential history. in politics, sometimes you can win by losing. and i think in many ways bernie has done that. his campaign, and i would put it on a short list. i would put it with howard dean's 2004 campaign, which
revolutionized the internet, and barry goldwater's campaign. that's a best example of where bernie sanders campaign will end up historically looking. barry goldwater lost the battle in '60s but he ended up winning the war by the '80s. bernie sanders in a much quicker time line appears to have done the same thing. >> as an analyst of politics and someone who has worked in it, how do you differ between whether biden is channelling bernie or biden is channelling where most democrats are after everything we have been through as a country? >> i think it is a combination of the two. i think biden saw that what president clinton did and what president obama did, which is that they viewed corporations and they wanted to work cooperatively with corporations. they didn't view corporations as the enemy. they wanted to work with them to get better outcomes for workers.
bernie, because, quite frankly, he was never a mainstream democrat. he was never democrat at all. he actually quite clearly saw the corporations are in e business of making money. and no matter what they say about helping people, they really aren't about creating better outcomes for the workers. they're about improving their own bottom line. i think bernie very clearly saw that. i think biden recognizes that bernie was probably right about that, hence the corporate tax increases, hence the discussions now about very large tax increases on the rich and the upper class in the united states. i think that's a factor. the second thing i would say about bernie that's important to keep in mind is if you look at historically there was a presidential candidate by the name of norman thomas who ran five times for the american presidency. he was once asked at the end of his life in the 1960s what was the greatest accomplishment of his career. and he said the intellectual theft of all my ideas by the democratic party. i think you can say very much
the same thing about bernie sanders. >> solid. i'm curious, as you lay it all out because i'm thinking about what you are saying. with the possible analysis of this segment, what do you say to people around bernie sanders who say, well, if all this is true, why doesn't he get nearly enough credit for it? >> well, i think one of the things is that bernie is senator on a budget committee, and i think he has actually been very active. he went down to alabama. it appears to me that he went to alabama for that unionization vote with the blessing of the biden white house. the biden white house was completely behind bernie on that. i think you are going to see an evolving relationship between biden and bernie. they talked about how he and bernie are going to tour the country talking about working class americans, talking about the needs of working class americans and talking about
delivering for working class americans. that is a goal they both deeply now share. it is true that bernie probably hasn't received the credit that he deserves in many ways. i'm certainly going to give it to him right now. but it took a long time before people realized that barry goldwater, you know, was as important a force politically as he turned out to be. it took a long time before people realized howard dean. that was a spectacular loss in 2004. sometimes it takes time for -- to give credit where credit is due. >> it's very hard to look at these things outside of the short-term that we're in. that was true even before the internet in our short attention spans. you do make an important point, chai. you give us the goldwater example. dean was the energy for folks that remember it that turned the
party back against the iraq war and against bush when the nominee and everyone else was for it and barack obama was the echo of that but it was a cycle later. sanders two presidential cycles in now has a kwaussy sanders economic plan in the white house, and it may take another four or eight years for us to notice. but on chai day, we maybe got there faster. thanks for coming back, sir. >> thank you for having me, ari. up ahead, the self-proclaimed grim reaper they have ended up owning himself. mitch mcconnell on blast. but first atlanta mayor is making news. a new order on voting rights. she will explain why it's newsworthy tonight when we come back. e back muscle pain. give up, the couch is calling. i say, it's me, the couch, i'm calling. pain says you can't. advil says you can. at philadelphia, we know what makes
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order out tonight. thanks for being here. >> thank you for having me. >> you're making a little news, which is of course interesting. these are issues you care about. i will show your viewers what we read and the brand-new order which includes voting rights, information for residents in your city on how to obtain forms of id that are required by these new laws even as they are challenged in court. walk us through why you are issuing this order and what it means to voting rights for your constituents. >> well, the rules of the game have been changed, and it's so important that people understand the parameters that we are now forced to operate in the state of georgia. we send water bills out, for example, to thousands of customers, rez denial and business customers. we will educate people on how
you can get the id you need to register to vote. what are the new rules on absentee ballots and just provide as much information that we can to help counter what's been done at the state level. >> is your hope that the statewide law will be narrowed or overturned? >> it is my hope. and it's not too late for the legislature to go back in and reconsider what they have done. they can go back into special session and take a look at the law and the damage that's already happened to our state. $100 million has been lost from the mlb moving the all star game. they can also go back in session in january and revisit what's been done. at a time when our democracy is under attack across this country, and we saw it at the nation's capitol, this was an opportunity for the state of georgia to expand access to voting, to an example to the rest of the nation. but instead we have gone back
multiple steps in accessing the right to vote and it's not something that we should be proud of as a state, especially a state who is one of our major industries in this state is tourism. >> well, you mentioned, mlb, tourism and that whole issue. you have corporations that have either been pulled in under pressure or trying to navigate. american airlines condemned state laws over in texas. dell computers saying that some of that type of stuff was the opposite of democracy. mlb pulled out. as you mentioned, $100 million cost there. and, yet, you and other officials have also spoken out about what you see as your role encouraging jobs, business, et cetera in your city, which makes sense. and i think everybody knows that's what a lot of leaders try to do. walk us through what you see as the goal here because here on "the beat," our viewers have heard from multiple civil rights activists and leaders calling
for boycotts against what's some of your state as a pressure point. >> well, boycotts concern me. atlanta is the center of a larger metropolitan area. this area is the tenth largest economy in the united states. this is an area that primarily voted for democrats in november and did so again in january. and, so, when you hit our economy, you are hitting atlanta and all of the surrounding areas, small businesses, people who rely on jobs at these corporations, delta airlines, one of our major employers in the state. so it's my hope that people will work with us to make sure that everybody in this state who is eligible to register to vote will be registered to vote and that people will stand in the gap for those who will be obstructed. ambassador young told me a great story about when he ran for congress in 1972 pouring down rain, one day of voting.
74% african-american turnout. his point was even against what seems to be the most difficult challenges we still have to turn out and vote. and i believe that this effort to suppress the vote in georgia will have the opposite effect. and i think you will see numbers even higher than we saw in the last election cycle. >> well, you mentioned the last election. everything we have just discussed so far has been around the right to vote and getting the vote out and what happens up until its tally. yet, we just lived through a president who tried to overturn those results, specifically in georgia and there are concerns this new bill would allow for more more. it says beyond the provisions of the voting up until election day, the new law risks make election subversion easier, including appearing to go directly after some of those officials like the secretary of
state who drew trump's ire because they did their jobs in a nonpartisan way. what can be done about that? and what's your view as an expert on does the law make it easier for someone to try to cheat where georgia voter gos one way and then they find, to quote the ex-president, votes another way. >> so what the legislature did was overtake elections in the state. this has primarily been a job of the secretary of state. with the republican secretary of state who, by the way, endorsed donald trump did was send out absentee ballots to everyone in the state. you can't do that anymore. they also removed the secretary of state who oversees the elections from the election board essentially giving control of the election board to the partisan republican party in this state. and so what we can do is this. we can show up to vote and not just show up for the presidential election but we can
show up in every single election. and there is an opportunity to let leaders across this state know exactly how people feel about what they have done in 2022. all of the -- many of the house seats and senate seats will be on the ballot as well as the constitutional offices. but meanwhile, we will continue to educate people. we will continue to remind people that john lewis left with us that voting is a sacred right. and if we don't use it, we could lose it. so we are potentially facing the loss of votes in this state. and we're going to do everything we can to stand in the gap. >> mayor, thank you very much for telling us your views as well as breaking down that news of the new order. i appreciate you. we turn to one of the most controversial parts of this law. this is the ban on even handing out food and water as people exercise their right to vote if
they get stuck in one of those long loins. the solicitor general in georgia is making news by saying he will not enforce that provision in the new law. thanks for being here. >> thank you, sir. >> what exactly are you saying you intend to do? >> well, basically, we're not going to prosecute someone who is not campaigning or has partisan paraphernalia on them. someone who is nonpartisan, not campaigning, we will not prosecute them for simply giving food and drink out. this happened continuously last year where people who were not campaigning basically brought food and water to people to help them due to the heat and the hot conditions. >> right. now, is your contention that you found some kind of loophole in the law or that you are simply not going to follow part of the law? >> well, no.
what is in the law basically, the law there is no rational basis for the law. when you commit to a criminal law, there has to be a basis that there will be harm to a party or to property. there is no harm in someone being humane. there is no criminal nexus here to be humane. >> let me issue a follow up. >> yes, sir. >> a lot of people might agree with you, sir. and that's why we have covered the problems with the law. but what do you say to the critique that that may sound no different than someone who opposes marriage equality and says they're not going to issue those marriage licenses. in other words, does this just come down to your opinion above what the law states? >> well, i think when you look at the rational basis of the law, there is no rational basis. it basically says that they're going to arrest someone for
merely having water or giving water out. i take an oath to seek justice. it would be unjust for a police officer to arrest someone for merely giving someone some type of nutrition or hydration. >> it's a very interesting stance you have taken, which is why we wanted to spotlight it. also, as you know, one that many are debating within a law that if it stays in the books remains quite debatable. we wanted to hear from you as well as the mayor. thanks for making time for us tonight. >> thank you very much, sir. thank you. >> thank you, sir. appreciate. we have to fit in a break. but up ahead, mitch mcconnell owning himself. we'll be right back. back. two medical societies have strongly recommended to doctors to treat acute, non-low back muscle and joint pain with topical nsaids first. a formulation they recommend can be found in salonpas. a formulation they recommend can be found in salonpas. salonpas. it's good medicine. hisamitsu. ♪♪
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humans, and their money should be treated like speech. he filed the brief in the supreme court, arguing corporations may engage in core political speech. he insisted they have first amendment rights just like the rest of us. >> it's critically important for all conservatives and indeed all americans to stand up and unite in defense of the freedom to organize around the causes we believe in. the bulwark of this freedom is, of course, the first amendment. >> now, the first amendment can be complicated, but this part's pretty simple. mcconnell was really all about the money, and the guy saying corporations should get all those rights? well, turns out he would get a lot of their money. in 2020, he raised over $4 million from corporate pacs, over a quarter million dollars in personal donations from top ceos. and now, all of a sudden, there's an exception to the mcconnell rule that corporations don't get political.
>> i'm not talking about political contributions. that's fine. it's legal. it's appropriate, i support that. >> and so here we are at the sort of hypocritical nub of it all. mcconnell is fine with the corporations donating to politicians like him. he wants their money. that's self-interest. he just doesn't want them ever doing the thing he claimed he protected, their right to have core political speech rights when not only does it disagree with him but guess what? it supports your right to vote. unfettered by guess who? republican politics. and that's our final word. "the reidout" is up after this. s raise the jar to all five layers. raise the jar to the best gelato... you've ever tasted. talenti. raise the jar. feel the cool rush of claritin cool mint chewables.
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