tv Making Money With Charles Payne FOX Business October 8, 2021 2:00pm-3:00pm EDT
>> neil: all right, a special programming treat for you on monday, we have captain kirk on, william shatner, the oldest human being to fly into space. he's on jeff bezos blue origin rocket with three others. they wanted to talk to a fellow astronaut. looking forward to it. see that monday. here's charles payne now. hey, charles. >> charles: that's going to be a good one. i'm a huge william shatner fan. have a great weekend, neil. >> neil: thanks, buddy. >> charles: good afternoon. i'm charles payne. this is making money. breaking right now after a week of crazy gyrations the market more or less frozen after the jobs report. i know a lot of folks out there are rationalizing the results, but something is very wrong here. it may not be a momentary blip. what it means for the fed. what it means for corporate earnings. what it means for pride and dignity of work, that's always part of our ethos and what it means for your money. wages are higher.
that may actually be making some things worse, especially for small businesses which cannot find any workers. we will dig into those details. meanwhile, should we start writing a eulogy for gold? bitcoin emerging. a brilliant crypto investor says it is way too late because that ship has sailed. we will have another guest on that segment later in the show. all that and so much more on "making money". shocking news on this -- shocking news on the september jobs report. you know, i got to tell you something. it's something the stock market wasn't really prepared for, right? we had more or less been moving sideways, and it's stunned, shocked, and confused trying to figure this out. major indices trading in this range as investors are trying to understand what the meaning of
this. economy, 11 million job openings and only 194,000 net people got jobs. initially it seemed like the number might put the fed on pause. we saw buy yields ease a little bit. we saw tech stocks rise in the premarket. meanwhile investors are also grappling with earnings season right around the corner. still wondering what happens with the grand spending and taxing scheme and the white house and that agenda? it hasn't gone away and neither has inflation which is getting worse. so let's hash it out. we have rob, heather, and ann. ann, let me start with you. ann, i want your thoughts, what first came across your mind when you saw across the tape 194,000 jobs and the market of course grinding to a halt? >> well, i think the problem is the markets hate unsolved mysteries. no one can figure out what's going on at the moment. yesterday strong jobs data. today very much below expectations. seeing weakness in the hospitality sector, restaurants and the like. we know it is not a demand issue. we know we have open jobs.
you opened with that, charles. ongoing wage inflation, labor force participation shrinkage and that's going to [inaudible] for a while, i think. >> charles: heather? >>i i think it is a very big miss this morning when you only saw 194,000 jobs added and 500,000 was expected. that's what matters to wall street. that's what matters to the stock market, those expectations. and now that we're reopening the economy, you can't blame covid anymore. so i mean, even though i know biden just had a live press conference about an hour ago, even though he says the unemployment rate, the administration has said it's 4.8%. that's great. that does sound good. the headline number, but if you dig a little bit deeper, it is actually a negative because the participation rate is going down. the participation rate falling to 61.6% right now, meaning people aren't going back to
work, charles. >> charles: they're quitting, right? by the way, i did the math. it is not scientific. if you take the 183,000 people that left the labor force and extrapolate, we could only lose 2.2 million more people, we would be at 0% unemployment rate. we could all cheer that one. rob, what are your thoughts? >> i agree with heather. when you look at the numbers, they were ugly no matter how you cut it. if you look at the fed, they are not going to take this one number and change. we have some big things next week, retail sales, ppi, cpi, i think they will take a look at that. i think the big point here is wage inflation. we've got earnings coming up. i will be listening to that. that's a big issue for this market right now, talking to a lot of people, they cannot get people into the workplace, especially for those lower paying jobs right now. >> charles: let's stay on this earnings season because it's right around the corner. i mean, listen, technically it really never goes away, right? already 21 s&p names have reported. so far 81% beating less than
consensus when it comes to revenue, 76% on earnings. it is always about the guidance. operating margins will be the big deal. i think that -- to rob's point, we know these inflation costs have to start eating away mar jins. -- margins. margins in my mind one of the reasons we have had such a huge market rally. >> i think that's one of the reasons, charles. i think that businesses are now going to start coming out proactively talking about how they are going to try and protect their margins going forward. looking for this earnings season, public companies now coming out with forward look price increases. i think they will start to signalling each other that there will be an overall price hike continuing into 2022. as we see those announcements come through earnings, we will see sustained inflation pressure coming out as a result of that. >> charles: rob, does it come down then from a stock picking
point of view, obviously the companies that can pass on these higher costs and not lose market share because we've already seen fedex. we've seen nike. we've seen quite a few companies have problems and hiccups, and even though the demand is there, there is a level where people will stop buying their product. >> that's a very big point. big earnings season coming up right now. you know, one of the things, charles, i'm a little bit concerned about in terms of the margins, i was looking at facts, we're at the highest we have been the last five years. i think the big part of that really has actually been covid. if you look at corporate travel budgets, fringe benefits, a lot of expenditures that they had had they have not been using. as the economy starts to reopen, they have to spend. wage inflation is going up. i don't think that's sustainable. to your point, charles, you will have to be an individual stock picker here looking at companies that can pass this on. an area we like is technology. it is essential. it's gotten beaten up here.
i think some of these people that are being held hostage to the supply chain will be in a lot of trouble and won't be able to pass the costs on. >> charles: yeah, technology solves a lot of these issues, particularly over a period of time. part of that of course finding good help. also the best place to do business is also tough because this week we saw kathy woods saying she's going to move her operation to florida from new york. the big news this morning elon musk moving from california to texas. hitter, we are talking about -- heather, we are talking about margins. they are tight. these relocation things, it is becoming a boom. is that in part because it really does matter? i mean taxes matter. regulations matter, particularly in an environment where inflation is running rampant. >> right. i recently moved down to florida pre-covid, though, and now it's a big trend i guess after covid. when you look at elon musk, yeah, he -- i was here first, no, but i wasn't, but he actually said, he went off on a rant and musk said, you know, he
was frustrated with the covid shut downs, that he couldn't operate his manufacturing plants and get the tesla operation running and high taxes. that's why he went to texas. and now although kathy woods does not cite higher crime, higher taxes and covid shutdowns, i think that's got to be a big factor for her move from wall street down to florida as well. she cites she's going to st. petersburg because she i believe wants to invest more in science and technology in the community. you can probably do that from new york. but nonetheless she's coming on down also. we have a place for you too, charles. >> charles: she still wants to go to these progressive parties in the hamptons. >> right, exactly. >> charles: let me get back to you on this, ann. tesla also this morning got a huge upgrade, they are saying 940. interestingly it moved the stock premarket. once we started trading, at one point the top percentage gainers
and consumer discretionary, general motors and ford, now, you've invested in this area. you know it very well. it gets us back to the whole thing that president biden just talked about it again. what's the best way now to play these? is it traditional tesla? or are we going to -- tesla, or are we going to see the traditional names in a better investment? >> it is a great question. i'm a big believer in the idea that [inaudible] such as the gm's can be interesting ways to play these trends, going with the innovators like tesla. you have got the gm's and the fords of the world, they have been watching, learning, investing behind newer generations of technology. they have the scale to start moving. i'm a big fan of looking at some of the longer-standing names as ways to make technology that's now being proven [inaudible]. i think it is interesting back to your point, looking back now to find value in individual company names, not just as a
whole. >> charles: real quick, rob, you mentioned technology. a couple new names you are looking at? >> yeah, charles, we talked about this before. i think the public markets continue to shrink. we are seeing the private markets get bigger and bigger. we had unicorns. now we have dragons. i think the best public way to play that right now is through some of these p-e companies, like blackstone, but i really like carlisle. that one cg has 240 portfolio companies. what's interesting about them in the private space, they are leading the esg movement. i think if they become a leader in that, you will see a lot of funds that flow into that company. carlisle cg i like right here. >> charles: all right. rob, heather, ann, great stuff, appreciate it. have a fantastic weekend. we will see you next week. meanwhile, folks, we're going to dive deeper into what i'm calling a disastrous jobs report, especially on how women are really fading fast from the jobs market. plus bitcoin off like a rocket. other cryptos following in its trail. we've got the crypto congressman
representative davidson next, and he will talk about why he's calling out gary gensler for a whole lot of reasons. we'll be right back. ♪ ♪ i've spent centuries evolving with the world. that's the nature of being the economy. observing investors choose assets to balance risk and reward. with one element securing portfolios, time after time. gold. agile and liquid. a proven protector. an ever-evolving enabler of bold decisions. an asset more relevant than ever before. gold. your strategic advantage.
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>> charles: so although the market is kind moving a little bit sideways today, financial markets in general have been on fire from stocks to crypto. i mean, it's been huge. but there are changes that still need to be made. there are still too many barriers out there stopping regular folks from getting their chance at a bite at this apple. my next guest has been dubbed the crypto congressman from ohio republican warren davidson. representative davidson, this week we learned that the sec, they won't try to ban crypto, that put a bid in crypto but it doesn't mean they won't make life miserable for the crypto currency arena. what are you asking from regulators to make it easier for investors? >> thanks, charles. really appreciate your attention to this issue. and look, when gary gensler said that they weren't going to ban
it earlier chairman jay powell said that they weren't going to ban crypto in america, i thought a little bit about when obama said we're not going to ban coal in america. we're joust just -- we're just going to make it possible to make enough money. you put a big enough regulatory burden on it, it will not flourish. it will diminish. [inaudible]. but it is going to be harder and harder to launch companies in the u.s. gensler evaded giving a bright line standard and instead said if you want to work in this space, come talk to us. basically cut your own deal like a third world country. instead of having a clear set of rules. that's what i have been working on in a bipartisan way really since 2018 to have [inaudible] when something is a security and when it is not. >> charles: by the way, i think you're at a crypto summit today. you're coming in, mostly every now and then a hiccup, that's okay. you mention a bipartisan effort.
i get a sense that 99% of folks in congress don't even know what crypto is. >> a lot of people that don't really understand it, but, you know, frankly a lot of people don't understand how aspirin gets rid of headaches, but when you have one you take it. crypto is a way to have privacy restored in the financial space. there are people who don't want there to be financial privacy. you can see that with janet yellen calling for $600 threshold for reporting requirements to the irs. they want to destroy the whole concept of privacy. that's where the fault lines are really. it is not left or right. it is really like do you love the patriot act? or do you dislike it? of course we want america to be secure, but we can do it in a traditional way where if you have reason to be suspicious, you get a warrant. and this is really a free [inaudible]. people think about it as money. so many of the use cases are
payment system early on, but there are a [inaudible]. >> charles: we're going to pick this up because now you're coming in and out a lot again. i want to mention to the audience that you don't just talk the talk. you walk the walk. you're at a crypto conference today. we want to get back to representative davidson. he is one of the few i feel in congress who is trying to help the crypto investor. we have the heck of a crypto expert later in the show. a reminder for all, i will be hosting a new investor revolution town hall. that includes crypto currency investing, november 9th, 2:00 p.m. eastern time. e-mail me your questions at investing in you @ fox.com. also you can message us. you want to join me in studio, i would love to see you, if you are in new york, come check it out. by the way, make it known quick because a lot of people want to show up. so in the meantime, folks, we know small businesses have grit
and moxy but don't have endless amounts of money and can't hire workers. that's a problem for them and for us. the washington post wrote part the organization is part of a quote well financed conservative campaign that undermine regulations that [inaudible] are necessary to contain the coronavirus. stay with us.
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some people are saying don't worry. it will get better next month. we have heard this now several months already, and is that the only -- what do you see now since you've looked into this that are the biggest concerns? >> hi, charles. it is always great to be with you, especially on a jobs friday, but there is a lot to unpack in this report, and i think there are three main concerns that is worth taking a note of. one, it's really leisure and hospitality that have been -- that as an industry that has been carrying the water for the jobs recovery. if you will recall, the service sector was one of the hardest hit if not the hardest hit by the pandemic. seeing for the last two months, gains limited in that industry is very concerning. it points to a deceleration in the jobs recovery. but what's more mysterious to me
is the lack of labor force participation, the fact that people are not coming back to the market, even though we're seeing wage increases, and then finally, the unevenness of job gains. in the adp report, we saw that large companies were able to keep pace with hiring pretty well. it's really small firms that had really struggled in hiring. it is the small businesses that create most of the jobs in the u.s. economy. that is a key area that's concerning as well. >> charles: you know, when i woke up this morning, i started going through your data from wednesday. that's what i worked on. i wanted to focus on the small businesses. i could not believe it. we know that most job openings are in small and mid sized businesses, yet, using the data from wednesday from adp, we saw the month to month jobs gains have declined dramatically with respect to the small businesses. in fact, you take the very smallest business, you know, i think one to nine employees, versus the very large ones work a thousand plus, one area's
dying, i mean literally dying on the vine. look at this blue line right there. the orange line is growing exponentially. can we say that's about inflation, higher wages, and the inability of small businesses to compete? if that's the case, what's the fate of small business? >> small businesses are resilient. we have seen that time and time again. i think the long-term future, small businesses rise to occasion and the challenges. in the near term, it is clear there are some bottlenecks to hiring. when we have surveyed small businesses, both in may and then most recently in the third quarter, what we've seen the number one challenge facing small businesses is hiring, charles. even though that there are 5 million workers still sidelined by the pandemic, even though we still haven't recovered the more than 22 million jobs lost, over the course of the pandemic, hiring is the biggest challenge. it is not just hiring in terms
of quantity. it is skill set. there's something to be said here about this bottleneck to the hiring process. >> charles: all right. i got to move on. i ran out of time. i know you loathe to say this. can we maybe wonder out loud if americans just don't like to work, like we used to, like we somehow have been convinced that we shouldn't be pulling ourselves up by the boot straps, or that we should be paid extravagant amounts of money for lower skilled work? are we at that point yet? >> you know, i'm an economist, charles. i care about not what people say or feel, but what they do. the behavior that we're seeing right now is problematic in terms of a whole and healthy recover they is inclusive for the labor market. definitely something we will keep an eye on going forward. >> charles: that's why i love these conversations with you. thank you very much. i want to bring in independent women's foreign policy director. i want to talk about the women's part of this jobs report because it was abysmal. it was really really scary. again, we see month after month now where women are not getting
jobs, and this time, 300,000 women dropped out of the labor force. something's happening on the societal level, i think, in addition to some of the other things we talked about, child care. what do you see here? >> certainly. during the pandemic, women have had some of the lowest labor force participation rates in decades. and there's no doubt that the pandemic drove this big change. of course it's very hard, charles, to parse out and the economic data doesn't tell us to what degree women are making choices about homeschooling, about addressing some of the changes in the education system, that came about because of the pandemic, reprioritization of their families of course, but in many cases, it is not a choice. in many cases, women are welcome looking -- women are looking for jobs. there have been millions of job openings of course, but people are still concerned about the coronavirus, about vaccines, about how exactly to make the workforce that's out there get into the jobs that are open. >> charles: last friday the
washington post had a negative article about iwf, your company, and the headline suggested that it was opposed to masks and mandates. and then they cited a leaked letter. it turns out this letter was actually written by you. so where did they go wrong with this article? >> well, in several places, charles. and of course it was meant to be a smear article about iwf and about me. but my bigger concern is that the article really tried to paint all of the parental pushback in our country, whether it's against mask mandates or in my case the mask mandate at my 3-year-old's preschool, they are trying to paint all this pushback as part of some big conspiracy that's not really sincere or not really civil or not really legitimate. that's the ig be -- that's the bigger smear here. that's the inaccuracy. parents are concerned about the lives of their children because of the pandemic and other forces in our education system. we ought to stand up and be heard. i think this was an attempt to
silence us. >> charles: how concerned are you that schools now, public schools in general, but schools have become sort of the ground zero in this cultural war? merrick garland saying hey the fbi should actually investigate parents who threaten and harass public school teachers and officials, but, you know, he is talking about people who go to these pta meetings and ask passionate questions. we know 189,000 people just left the educational workforce. i think it is having an impact on teachers, parents, and that means our kids as well what are your thoughts? >> right. there's a lot of discussion right now about parental choice, about homeschooling, about school choice. i think that ultimately -- >> charles: hadley, though, what about if your kid goes to a public school, and you want to go there and voice your opinion about what they are being taught? >> yeah. >> charles: the parent that says hey, and i am not here defending anything except the 1st amendment. are we going to allow them to crush the 1st amendment rights of parents? >> well, i think what's really
important in these discussions, charles, is for parents like me who might feel like am i the only one who feels this way? we have been made to feel that we're extreme, that no one else thinks the way you do, if you bring up this concern, you are antiscience or you're a racist, or whatever the most horrible insults that people might hurl against parents who have concerns about their children. we shouldn't listen to those insults but we all need to be part of a dialogue where everyone can voice their concerns about their kids, can be heard and work through these issues together. that's going to be a requirement if we're going to continue to have a public education system that serves everyone rather than censoring particular point of views or [inaudible]. >> charles: hadley manning, thank you very much, appreciate it. >> thank y charles. >> charles: she has the pulse of the consumer. she knows this stuff inside and out. she's really worried. i am talking about christine benz who is getting bearish.
we will hear about that at 2:45. people are paying more for gasoline in seven years. the payment at the pump could get worse all because we as a country shot ourselves in the foot. we will give you those details when we come back. ♪ ♪ you have the best pizza in town and the worst wait times. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire that building you're trying to buy, matc- you should ten-x it.ion. - ten-x it? ten-x is the world's largest online commercial real estate exchange. you see it. you want it. you ten-x it. it's that fast.
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>> charles: americans are paying the highest gas price since 2014. california well you know they have the highest average. some counties in fact over $5 a gallon. soon it might even go higher. in her making money debut, kelly o'grady is with us now in los angeles with more. kelly? >> well, thanks, charles. i'm excited to be here, but listen, not only does california have the highest prices, we also have the highest taxes, making up more than 25% of what you spend at the pump. i want to break that number
down. i will start with the more familiar ones. so federal tax, that's 18 cents. 16 cents for sales. a whopping 51 cents for that state excise tax, but that's not all. california levies a number of fees aimed at reducing carbon emissions. you add on another 39 cents for that, and every time you fill up, you're paying $1.24 a gallon in taxes alone. now much of that is supposed to go for road repairs, but experts say there's a lot of frustration because the electric vehicle tax incentives means gas drivers take up an unfair burden of that road repair. now, lawmakers have floated a mileage tax, but there's a lot of concern about the privacy issues behind that. if you are looking for a break at the pump any time soon, it is likely not coming. gas prices are expected to rise because of demand, supply chain issues, and further reliance on foreign oil. so i wish i had better news for you on this friday, charles. >> charles: so do i. i mean, on your day bu -- on
your debut, you are supposed to bring good, kelly. thanks a lot, appreciate it. >> we will try next time. >> charles: one of the saddest aspects about this gasoline crisis is how much of it is self-inflicted. boston group managing partner david boston. this week bloomberg had a glowing article about a jpmorgan strategist saying he's living up to the moniker of wizard of wall street for pointing out the impact of pandemic plagued supply chans and years of -- supply chains and years of underinvesting in dirty energy. two things came to my mind. when marco said don't worry, only goes to $150 a barrel, i thought gee thanks a lot. you and i had this conversation many time. i mentioned 100 bucks. you said that's way too high. everybody is jumping on that bandwagon now, david? >> yes, well, i'm most certainly not the wizard of wall street. thanks for the kind words.
i am just one like you by the way are passionate about bringing wall street to main street. i want the best part of the capital markets to be investable for all. what's so frustrating about this, all of us can invest in the things that are necessary to improve the energy sector and bring down prices for consumers, to generate competition in the sector, so it's not just one or two players that dominate oil production, and also to facilitate a cleaner delivery, a greener result. that's carbon emissions. we can do that by investing more in energy, not less. and so even that bloomberg line by the way about oh, well, we're reaping the consequences of underinvesting in dirty energy. they are getting the economics right. we haven't invested in exploration and production, but it is not dirty energy. it is the energy necessary to feed humanity. it is energy necessary to keep people from freezing to death. so they keep talking as if we're doing this dirty thing, and that there's some other alternative
out there that can warm the entire world and feed the entire world. we need oil and gas. and it's not a question of whether or not we're going to need it. it is a question of where we're going to get it and where the rest of the world is going to get it. this is the right solution. >> charles: unfortunately we're not going in that direction. the biden administration and all these things stopping u.s. investment which you just talked about. consequently where could the price go? people are talking 100, $150 dollars a barrel. >> again, there's more than just the united states as a marginal producer. opec had decreased their production because of the pandemic-related issues. now the supplies need to come back higher, but i don't care what the rest of the world does. i want us to be in charge of our own fate. i don't think this is a wall street problem other than capitulating to esg, but there
is private equity money. there's private credit that will come in and fund the energy story in our country. the expected rates of return are massive. look at the energy sector's performance year to date. look at it over the last few weeks, where from's been a lot of volatility. there's ample returns out there in natural gas. it's the highest price it's been in over seven years. there's plenty of margin. the technology's gotten better. what is the solution? it is the economics to be allowed to work in a free market economy, and we do not need to give in to the esg bullies on this. >> charles: you may not be the wizard of wall street, by tell you what, you got me singing your praises because i loved every word you just said. have a great weekend, david. appreciate it. >> thanks, charles, you too. >> charles: all right, folks, consumer credit growing at the slowest rate in seven months. savings are starting to come down. that's a daeng rouse combination. -- that's a dangerous combination. i will ask christine benz what
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>> charles: all right. wages we are higher last month that should be good news at least for consumer spending. but americans never got back to their spending ways after the great recession. it looks like there's some signs we might be ready to pull back more. joining me now is kristin benz. we got the august consumer credit report yesterday. it came in anemic 14.4 billion. the street was looking for 17.2. here's the part of it, though, the revolving credit which is mostly revolving debt which is mostly credit cards. that adds up to less than 3 billion dollars. it's significantly below the december 2019 levels. you know, we saw people dip into savings that same month because savings -- spending went up almost 8/10 of a percent. incomes only up 2 pents of a percent -- 2/10 of a percent. we are dippings into savings.
people not using credit cards as much as they used to. is it a disciplined consumer? if so, what does that mean for the economy? >> i think there's so much bad news on top of bad news out there. i mean, every other minute there's a shortage out there; right? right now we have a pumpkin shortage, christmas tree shortage, inflation, fuel prices. i think that gives consumers pause that maybe they're not going to go out there and use those credit cards like you would think they would. >> charles: yeah, i mean, we are barely at levels we were at 2009; right? i mean, we've come down a lot. you know, it just seems to me that the consumer never got back that confidence, you know. you know, and we're heading into christmas. i know maybe some people aren't even going to go out and look to your point. it doesn't feel right, and, you know, this week we saw bed, bath & beyond. the stock got smashed, right? and i thought it was pretty interesting. as you told everyone to start
paring down their retail holdings, even department stores. where are we going in terms of the retail part of this? will they survive this unscathed? it seems like you were getting nervous last time you were on. >> yeah, i was. you know, i told you last time that i wanted to take 50% off my positions in great names, like lulu lemon, restoration hardware, nike, and lvmh. that tells you something that i am getting cautious. i think we're going to see a correction out there. i think the supply chain problem and the port crisis in vietnam and china with covid. i think a lot of that will have residual effects on the consumer and retailers. i would be very very careful and very constructive here with what retailer names that i'm looking at right now. >> charles: how bad can it get in terms of the down side? >> well, i mean, usually you and i are talking on a friday, today's a bit more somber. i could see something like a 20% correction coming,
unfortunately. you know, the question is always a matter of when. i feel it because i came out of retail, i see things at a six-month horizon a little bit earlier than my counterparts do. when i start getting nervous, you all should get nervous too. so i see something coming down the pike here pretty quick. >> charles: would you hold -- be holding any stocks in this environment? you know, you mentioned selling half of your positions. i guess those great names, the message to investors is you are in something really strong and solid, take a little off the table, but ride them out anyway? >> yeah, i'd take half off here for the names that i mentioned earlier. they are great companies. buying on the dip is always great. i would hold them here, sell half, you can always buy more, if there's a bit of a correction here. i like private aviation here, commercial flying is a nightmare. it is not fun. airports are not fun. i like wheels up here very much. i'm still very constructive on clear. i would give peloton a second hook here.
-- a second look here. they got whacked a little bit ago, so they already took their licks. i don't like the fact they took their pricing down. why would you do that for a luxury good? but other than that, those are the top names i'm looking at right now. >> charles: the last time you were on, you said you liked wheels up, and the next day a major firm upgraded it. we will see what happens on monday. they keep following you. kristen, thanks a lot. we will talk again real soon. >> thanks. >> charles: -- [inaudible] been bullish on gold you all know that for months now, is it really losing its luster to bitcoin? is it time for him to admit that well crypto is the king? we'll find out. he's next and one of the best in the crypto industry as well. we will be right back. as i observe investors balance risk and reward,
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♪ ♪ you founded your kayak company because you love the ocean- not spreadsheets. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire >> charles: so will the record books say that it was the month of october 2021 when the crown was finally passed to crypto and bitcoin from gold and silver. remarkable october to remember. i want to get a read from scott martin and milton demaris. scott, apparently institutions now see bitcoin as a better inflation hedge than gold. you champion gold on this show for a long time.
is it time to throw in the tow el ? -- towel? >> i have, charles. i'm holding back tears doing this, but i'm good at doing that. i won't cry, i promise. i promise myself i wouldn't cry. we sold the gold today. i can't believe it. that was based on several factors not because of what some of these institutions are doing because those are not the guys to follow in my opinion as an independent advisor and one that manages etf's and such. the reality is this, because some recent data and certainly the performance of our friend gld and some of the other etfs out there in the gold space. it hasn't been there as far as the non-correlation and some of the upside capture. while i don't think that answer is the bitcoins or the ethereums, the reality is gold is not handling itself very well as that alternative asset space in our portfolios right now. i think gold is not the thing to hold right now. i don't think some of the bitcoin stuff is right either, if that's what you are looking to replace it. >> charles: milton,
institutional investors are rushing in like gangbusters, venture capitalists. i read the funding have gone through the roof from hundreds of millions to billions. at least are the credibility questions over right now? do you feel like someone who has championed this space, you took a lot of slings and arrows from this same institutional type that you can finally say don't question their credibility anymore? >> yeah, look, scott, i will take the w all day. i'm sorry, but i will take the w. [laughter] >> i think we are definitely at the point, 1% of global aum across all asset classes is now in crypto. of that, 50% is bitcoin and 50% is everything else. crypto is here. 20% of americans own bitcoin. this is no longer fringe asset class. this is a diverse asset category that has publicly listed equities including my company coin shares. we have etfs with exposure to equity. we have etps with [inaudible] assets themselves.
we have coins. it is a growing and robust category. i'm excited about the opportunity ahead. we see a lot of opportunity for growth. as we like to say in the industry, q4 is the start of the madness. we're calling it uptober. this is not october. it is uptober. [laughter] >> [inaudible]. >> price of opportunity is the volatility. >> but different from alternatives of yester year in my opinion, but no problem. >> charles: scott, i'm going to come back to you. milton? >> yeah, look, i think people love buying luxury goods. lvmh is a 400 billion dollars company. they produce artificial scarcity, right? people buy handbags.
people buy expensive cars, watches. nft's are a digital flex right? for people like me i spend all my time on my laptop. i don't need chanel bags. i need digital flex. i think nfts are filling in the new niche as we live increasingly on-line. we need different ways to sort of flex on-line. right now nft's are very much focused on art -- [inaudible]. we are also calling them profile photo nft's. luxury brands are using ntf's. i think it is still a really early space but one again where there's tremendous growth for multiple different types of opportunities, whether it's new brands, legacy brands, a lot of space. >> charles: i only got 40 seconds. i've got to give scott the last word. scott, she mentioned the [inaudible]. it sounds like you and me will be stuck outside the meta verse fishing.
are you going to jump in any of this? equities, coin base, any other way you will get exposure to the space? >> we have some clients that have some of the blcn, block chain. those are good if you want that exposure if you want. you get exposure to the coins to coin base, trade the exact coins. gucci and all those, at least they are unpreventable that way. [inaudible]. >> charles: got to leave it that way. lauren, indecisive session, but momentum going into the last hour of trading. >> i like it. i heard gucci. that was the last thing i heard. i will take that. charles payne, have a great weekend. ::