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tv   REV  Deutsche Welle  July 1, 2021 2:30am-3:01am CEST

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what to do with all our ways we can make a difference by choosing smartness solutions. overstaying said in our ways the global ideas, mental theories in little 3000 on g w online. this is our lead. we will be defending it if they had to cross that border. what do you think the west would have done for you out this whole system is in bad shape. america. secretary of state, anthony blinker was in ukraine last week, presenting the family to offer words of comfort and support for the country. rushing to mass in huge numbers close with border. my guess this weeks and key f is ukraine's foreign ministers in nature to lay about. what did he get out of the visit? what was he asked to give the demeter
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coordinate about welcome to complex. good afternoon. the us secretary of state was visiting last week and said he stand strongly with your country. what do you understand that to mean standing strongly with you? that means political me and military and reforms support for you crate. we count on our partnership with the united states as much as we count on the partnership with the european union and it's key capital's . your president was clear that he wanted more than that. a few days before blinking arrived, he posted a tweet, calling for a clear signal about the european and euro atlantic prospect. in other words,
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a clear signal about your big for membership of the you and nato. did you get that clear signal? well, both perspectives of your atlantic and european membership are long over you. and i would like to recall that for example, when it comes to nature, the promise was given by allies in 2008 summit. so we've been, it's been 13 years now and my president, to reiterate the ambition to achieve that. we have not heard affirmative positive response yet, but this is, you know, we asked parents, we are seeking memberships, so we will keep pushing the story forward. so you didn't get what you wanted to sell in effect. mister lincoln just bought a basket of fine words and that was it? no, it would be not entirely correct mister blinking was not entirely but the sound
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to it. well, he did not bring with himself a promise that ukraine will become a member of nato this year or next year. but he reaffirmed that the united states stand by the decision of 2008, where it saves clearly ukraine and georgia because it applies to both countries, will be members of nato. and we will be working with our friends and partners or much even with the goal. but the problem is without a time table, it's meaningless, isn't it? well, what we need, we currently have a time table which is called the national ano program of cooperation between the ukraine and nato. it is structured very much along the pattern of the membership action plan. but what we do need, and i can agree with you here is a clear timeline of granting ukraine membership action plan.
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and what will follow after that, this is the next step, you know, integration with their lines. how far did you get with your shopping list? because you're known to be looking for enhanced anti drone and anti aircraft capabilities. you also want the patriot missile is washington going to meet those requests. while we did submit to the united states list of the most urgent needs for your korean army, some of the items on the least more easier to get some more difficult. we did not expect to get everything at a time, but we are making progress on those items on those positions which, which are feasible. and this at this point and you say you're making progress so you didn't get any of them. you haven't signed any deals to get them. it's not. it's not fixed. mr. mit and the secretary blinking did not bring an anti sniper
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complex with him. but know that he will going to give you one either nor a date. i have no doubt that we will, we will receive a number of items from our list. this does not require a reiteration. it's a meant a matter of cooperation of certain technicality is, but i have no doubts that we will give them this delay. but let's talk if we may about the frozen law in the eastern part of your country. if we can talk about it that way, there's been some de escalation intention with moscow. it withdrew many of its troops off to the southern massive deployment close to your joint border. if they had crossed that border, what do you think the west would have done for you? expressions of condemnation, maybe some sanctions. while 1st, there is no withdrawal, adequate to the number of thrashing troops and military
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machinery assembled along the border of ukraine and in the occupied territories. what is happening can not be called. it was all russian forces largely stay where the what has changed is a drop in the military for x. this is true, but the threat is still there. and you know, in the soviet union, the had to show trials, trials without justice. and now what we observe is a show withdrawal and withdrawal without removal forces and this we should be, we should be, we should remain vigilant on this. when it comes to your 2nd question, if this is all land, this people, we will defend it. we will fight for it. we do not expect for troops to arrive and help us. but we do expect from partners to provide ukraine was all the assistance they can offer to make us prevail in this struggle for our country. so you are not
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expecting nato to go to war with you. with russia, you're clear on that to defend you. absolutely, we are not a member of nato yet. and i would like to say again, clearly in squarely that this is our land, we will be defending it, but partners can help us to defend our land. and i'm sure that this is what will this will be happening when it comes to negotiations. your president has made it clear he no longer thinks the means to agreement is laid down 6 years ago. is the way forward? is that because not, you know, the russians know of the separatist and actually done what you signed up to do? well, the key demand of russia in means is to recognize so called a little dance, can donate the people's republic s party to the conflict,
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which will effectively turn an international armed conflict between ukraine and russia into an internal armed conflict between ukraine and separatists. this is the cornerstone of the discussions that are taking place in in means. now my president is saying that our goal number one should be peace and security and lives of people and not the political, political, recognitions. and we call on moscow to focus on the same on bringing peace to dom bus. and on making progress on a number of drive decisions which are ready to be adopted, they have pending green light from moscow. moscow can easily give the green light, but it continues playing this game with the demand to recognize dominance can little dance gas particles conflict. so this is an essence what is happening and means can. this is why we're making steps to ensure
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a way forward out of the stalemate, the midst to agreement, as you know, contains political commitments on you. and on the other side, article for a dialog on local elections was supposed to start the day after a heavy weapons were pulled back from the contact line. article 11, a new ukranian constitution should have entered into force by the end of 2015. its key element was to have been the centralization. none of these things happened today, and each side blamed the other for not fulfilling their side of the bargain. where do you go from here? you are absolutely right. this is, this is the word to word by word russian narrative about means. when moscow a meets the fact that item paragraph, one of means is security. first you stop shooting. and then you proceed to political settlement. ukraine spared the no effort and made
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a number of painful concessions to ensure a cease fire. unfortunately, the fire has been violated on the system basis and more and more and many korean soldiers had been killed. i would like to assure you that we are absolutely committed to moving along the political part of the over the midst of the misc agreements, you really think different, you can you think you get those through your parliament, those political aspects of them? it's do agreement. well, if we see, if we see that russia is not killing our soldiers is withdrawing it's heavy machine that have a military machinery from ukraine and that advice by security provisions. this will give us an additional argument in the parliament to convince that this is the road to the 2 piece. this is the road to settlement, and this is what my parliament once. but we will never accept any russian idea of
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the federalist zation of ukraine. because in this country, we have a very advanced reform of decentralization. and by the way, i would like to thank the government of germany in helping us with the city for him to really empower communities on the ground and to give them more right rights. and when search in the region, so don't ask and guns parts of ukraine, which are currently occupied by russia, returned to ukraine. they will enjoy all those vast possibilities for development and prosperity. yeah, but why does your president say he's not going to talk to them? russia says, talk to the separatists, your president refuses. i'm curious as to why he refuses because the people and that's going to look at castille ukrainian citizens on. why is your president refusing to talk to you graham's? if he 15 area back under his control, my president will talk to legitimately elected ukrainians in the currently occupied parts of dawn and get
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a little and we will not talk to hold their so fresh and passwords who vigorously in newly implement only instructions coming from moscow they, we should not mix these 2 categories of when we hold elections as provided by the means. agreements when there are legitimately elected representatives, they will be, become part of the political system and we will talk to them. but today, the only party that makes decisions and instruct people on the ground, how to act is moscow. it's not the so called separatist, yes, but this process is going nowhere isn't, isn't the fact is that your out of ideas for how to pursue it. something that the president's chief of staff actually admitted at the end of last month and year mark on television. he said it's necessary to continue working in all directions and it all formats. because in the end,
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we don't know what format will bring peace to our land. 7 years after the seizure of crimea, that's an extraordinary admission of both failure and despair, isn't it? you don't know how to continue. there is no fate, neither failure, no despair. in here we have number 3. while we are upset with the behavior of moscow, with its unwillingness to play constructively, to reciprocate sincere willingness of ukraine and of germany and france to put an end to the war in don't us. when it comes to crimea, we launched, we came up with a very good idea of a crimea platform. and they say, this initiative is gathering more and more international support. so no, we are not running out of ideas. but unfortunately, russia has adopted a very, very unhelpful tactics of simply downplaying every,
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any idea that they do not like or ignoring them. but we will keep trying because as i said, just a couple of minutes before this is all when we cannot sit down with and lay down our hands we, we have to come up. we have with new ideas, we have to be creative and we will be doing that. this is all lent and may take some time, but in the end we will succeed. the fact is that your president was elected 2 years ago on a promise to end the war in the dumbass region. he didn't do it even blame the continuing conflict on his predecessor, president shanda saying it was the russian aggression. that was the problem. it was the ukrainian side being unreasonable that came back to bite him as well that in effect, he's over promised and delivered the biggest send the politician can commit, isn't it? while my president still has a couple of years in office to deliver on that and to before the end of his 1st or
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the 2nd point is that in just 1st year of his presidency, there were some very good achievements in our relations with russia. and they were promising, for example, the exchange of prisoners, including the return of the famous director all x in so who was a political prisoner in russia. russia returned our vessels captured at the carriage trade. so there was a good period. now there is the best period, but it doesn't mean that we will not find a solution that will bring back the good period and we will find we will settle the conflict without crossing our lines. miss clay, but it's clear that if you want more help from washington and the west, you're going to have to do more to deal with the rampant political corruption in your country. and you, the state department says that's key to securing ukraine's democratic institutions . it's economic prosperity in euro atlantic future every year. the same message
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from the us from europe, year after year. why are you not doing better on this front? well, 1st we're doing it for ourselves, not for the sake of support, but you're not doing it. you're doing, you're not doing it until you're not getting to grips with well, you on your, your, your, your, your, your either misinformed or exaggerating. it was under the president of the under the president zelinski. the anti corruption court finally started functioning the ukraine, and it was a very long battle to set up the court and make it operational. unfortunately, the previous president did not allow that to happen. president lensky did, and he does not interfere in the operations of the court when the constitutional court of ukraine and other by the judicial system, tries to destroy an anti corruption reform. it was the president who stepped in
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immediately. and then if he was followed by the government and the parliament who restored parts of critical legislation that was declared new and void, another invoice by, by the constitutional court. things are happening. and you know, every country is a difficult combination of various factors. but this country is moving in the right direction and those who are calling on us to move foster, they are cordially invited to come, enjoy us and help us. that's easy. well, those who are, you are cordially inviting with those who were there last week. if you look at the state department, human rights report, the latest one, what, what is the, what's damaging western confidence in you is this continue drumbeat of human rights abuses that are reported in your country as pointed out in the latest human rights report from washington. the concerned that's highlighted is not just the abuse, but with a corruption,
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the abuse or torture that's carried out by state employees and you know, security service that bad enough, but the impunity that surrounds them. the fact they can violate the, or with a pretty strong assurance that they'll get away with it. are you happy about that? when it comes to human rights abuses, insecurity institutions, you know, this is something that is not says neither systemic nor large scale. and unfortunately, to my deepest regrets present not only in ukraine but also in other countries of europe. we follow recommendations of the european committee against torture on that and we enjoy excellent cooperation with them. otherwise, i do not understand what kind of systemic violations of human rights you are referring. it's quite clear in the report, the report says, abuse of detainees remains a widespread problem. the government generally failed to take adequate steps to prosecute or punish. most officials who committed abuses, most officials resulting in a climate of impunity that couldn't be clearer,
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could it. that's for my friends in washington. you are probably, you are referring to the situation in prisons with regard to the imprisoned imprison persons. this is a big scorch. not only for ukraine, but also for other european countries, but this is not a large scale systemic oppression of human rights happening across the country. as i said to you answering my previous question, we are absolutely cooperating with all human ride bodies, including the council of europe and the european union to address out standing issues related to the treatment of prisoners in in prisons. one of the other key issues which has been raised by washington is the low level of confidence reported in your judges. the u. s. says that despite efforts to reform the
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judiciary and the prosecutor general's office corruption among judges and prosecutors remained endemic in demick. why is it that you're absolutely unable to guarantee the rule of law in your country? well, 1st, the rule of law and judiciary is not the same thing. traditionally is part of the rule of law. and there is a rule of law in this country. but one of what is the weakest point that requires systemic attention is judicially. our judicial system is in bad shape. i can fully agree was that it's i, as a citizen, i regret it. and the president and the government and the parliament, they are all addressing this issue in close cooperation with our international partners and the venice commission of the council of europe. because we all realize
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that judiciary is an essential, important element for foreign investments. and for bringing also for, for, for bringing justice to the country for, for protecting human rights in the country. so we are addressing it this, this problem through a set of reforms conducted in the closest possible corporation with international institutions and international partners. the say good promises, some judges were pressured by high level politicians. others reported later brides in exchange for giving particular verdicts. it's been found to be breaking the law like that. why can't they be removed from office? i'm not aware of any report that a member of the government or the president's office would be pressuring pressuring a judicial accord, or a judge. quite the contrary, as some of the elements of the ukrainian judiciary,
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putting pressure on the government and by issuing ill legitimate judgements. in particular, the one that i mentioned, the, the judgement of the constitutional court that tried to destroy the anti corruption reform that was designed and implemented by ukraine and its friends and partners from abroad. but i'm sure that we will come this problem as well, because no corrupt the judge can succeed against the government and the people of ukraine that are willing to overcome the resolve and overcome this problem. what about the press journalists to a feeling the heat in your country when they deal with sensitive topics? washington says violence against the press remain the problem with human rights groups blaming government inaction in solving crimes against them. why this inaction on the part of the government?
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well, the problem of press should be considered from 2 sides on the one side. it's the problem of disinformation flowing into the country and the spreading around among, amongst citizens. this is something that the government should be addressing and is addressing to ensure security of over the country. on the other hand, you, we do have to ensure the freedom of speech and we are absolutely committed to it. and of course, to ensure safety of journalists, i'm not aware of any recent cases where a government agent or representative or someone associated with the government would be conducting would be suppressing freedom of speech. in fact, the criticism against the president, the parliament, the government as a whole is coming from many, many media coordinators and that's normal because we live in
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a democracy and the it's vibrant and there are many different opinions. all these can, can exist, can and should exist and if democratic country, however, we will not allow this information specifically coming from russian media to destroy our peoples and people's minds. it's a question is all set to what extent you're protecting your journalists? because the state development report mentioned a journalist from romano gay who was beaten by a police officer while he was filming processed in front of a government building. that was april last year, 7 months later, the state bureau of investigations was still quote, looking into it. is that good enough? as far as you are concerned? while if we start picking up one specific case and focus on it, of course the situation will look doom and gloom. i. i'm where i'm aware of this case, i find it disturbing as well. and i stand on the, on the side of jordan,
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at least in this particular case, but please do not try to create a picture of doom and doom and gloom picture. but no, i'm not doing any cases taking out, taking out of the context we are, you know, in a dialogue with you. i'm just trying to make the point. yes, i'm not creating any, any image that hasn't been reflected in the state department. human rights report, just one final question. you talk about how you're protecting your country and you talk about getting your land back. do you seriously imagine a day when the russians will fade, you? sorry, we took crimea big mistake. have it back. well, has that train left the station? well, did you imagine that the soviet union was one day with seriously se eastern germany can go back to germany and reunite again? i'm sure that if your leadership in your position has never imagined that they
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would never succeed. mr. co labor, it's been a pleasure having you uncovered zone. thank you very much. thank you. the news news news. the news, the news, the news
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