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tv   Senate Hearing on Policing Reform Mental Health  CSPAN  April 24, 2021 7:59pm-10:09pm EDT

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biography, madame speaker, sunday night at 8:00 eastern on c-span's q and a. you can also listen as a podcast where you get your podcasts. >> tonight on c-span, you look. at police reform and mental health. a has subcommittee hears from reform advocates about the challenges facing police and what training is needed. then, a 2007 conversation between the late former vice president walter mondale and historian richard norton smith. >> c-span is your unfiltered view of government. we are funded by these television companies and more including comcast. >> do you think this is just for community center? >> it is way more than that. >> comcast is partnering with committee sensors so students
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can capital's they need to get ready for anything. comcast support c-span as a public service along with these other providers, giving you a front row seat to democracy. >> next, a look at police reform and mental health. a has subcommittee heard from law enforcement reform advocates, they talk about the challenges police phase in the training they need. [inaudible conversations] >> i'm calling this hearing to order. it is exciting for me that i get to be here with senator cotton
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in their first hearing on the subcommittee on criminal justice and counterterrorism. i want to welcome ranking member cotton and all the subcommittee members and thank the witnesses that are here today both in person and a virtual witnesses that we will have as well. i'm going to acknowledge in a moment after finish my opening remarks should senator grassley show up we will make time for them to give remarks after senator cotton gets some. i was asked by one of our members senator klobuchar who really wanted to be here today but she is unfortunately at home attending funeral services of dante wright who was shot and killed during a traffic stop and she wanted me to express that she would be submitting questions for the record.
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right now across the country we are having a review and absolute critical conversation about leasing in america. i'm very grateful over the last weeks to be in good faith conversations with colleagues of mine across the aisle about a larger l2 try to advance policing in america. but today we are here on a far more narrow topic and the purpose of the hearing is to talk about changes we need to make when it comes to how we as an overall society are going to respond to people dealing with mental health crises and those who are behaviorally -- by and large we as a society of felt to provide these individuals with the support services and compassion and empathy they need to thrive in our committees and live full lives. we see our streets with people
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experiencing homelessness are jailed in prisons or greasy unfortunately deaths of those who are struggling with mental health crises. i met the warden when i go to the jail or police leaders who have the empathy that these are not the ones that should be dealing with it because there should be a better way to help people live better lives. today we focus in on what is unfortunately too often our society's first real interaction with people with mental health. we are here to talk about power great police officers try to deal with this issue. it's about how we have made first -- police officers first responders for mental illness and substance abuse and people experiencing homelessness. it is about how officers are
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deeply frustrated and as is often the case overwhelmed because they are expecting to play the role of social worker and health expert and medical expert when they do not have the training or the skills often to do so. it's about how for this reason these encounters can quick we escalate to violence or turned deadly. one study of shooting data for 2015 found people with untreated mental ominous were 16 times more likely to be killed during a policing counter. the names many of which we know are the people who have died because of their encounters. daniel prude is deborah danner marcus spears and so many more. often when these deaths occur every child to police officers i trust in the police department
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that i oversaw as a mayor. these are tough cops, courageous and fearless in fact and i asked them should those people with mental illnesses have died in those interactions and now conclude with me quickly that there should be a better way. we as a society together should be able to avoid these unnecessary death. public health issues cannot be fixed with a law enforcement response. we must find a different way. what is needed for people who live with mental illness or addiction is help, services, treatment, access to medication, medical treatment, housing, peer support and more. we know from our experiences people on both sides of the aisle that this should change in our society. we are better than this.
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i mentioned -- and i was elected with a mandate to lower violent crime. my city was experiencing a surge in crime when i became mayor in 2006 so i spent hours and hours writing along with police officers often until 4:00 at night but i wanted to know the challenges they are faced and i wanted to learn their profession as best they i could but i rode with them and i got to know them and again i was humbled by their heroism and their service and their sacrifice but i got to know them and their families. i saw their professionalism and i saw how they were willing to take extraordinary risks often thrown squarely into life-threatening situations. but they tell you right now the job of being a police officer in america is extraordinarily difficult. but what made their work harder was having to answer calls to service that took them to a
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person and mental distress and screaming their home or the teenager whose mother called 911 because you was erratic and she had no one else to call to the person experiencing homelessness, drug evictions lying in the streets that they were so frustrated in my police leadership that the call for service kept people chasing what we called the queue, chasing call after call as opposed to doing the strategic work we need to do to solve violent crime. i'm equipped and underresourced i saw my officers spend the night chasing those calls when they could have been more strategically using our manpower as police and those people who they responded to could have gotten better help the would have prevented them from having encounters with the police in the future. i want to know that i received several letters from law
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enforcement leaders that echoed my own experience across the country in advance of this hearing asking, almost pleading for congress to fix the problem. i'm going to submit those letters for the record that i want to read just some of the words. sheriff jerry clayton in michigan wrote i urge the subcommittee to fund additional community-based services for people with mental health and substance abuse challenges. too often people in need of treatment end up in our jails. this is not where they belong. wherever possible we should make efforts to find ways to provide community-based care without ever connecting with law enforcement. chief sean lawrence of madison wrote in this era of police reform we must all challenge our government to provide a better level of service to the community. we can no longer simply rely on police responses to mental
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wellness and must issue from a community health perspective. we have seen far too many times the negative results of police only responses to mental health calls. no person deserves to be imprisoned or harmed by police simply because they have mental illness challenges. chief marquis of charlottesville virginia wrote by simply calling 911 a caller unleashes the full power of a system in which few officers are quick to navigate. the senate judiciary committee has an opportunity to inform the development of a national framework for responding to individuals in crisis including in that framework decrease in the presence of law enforcement with the mental health response portfolio on the allocation of funding and resources which build capacity to support community led continuum of care options which incorporates lived
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experiences and racial equities. in them meaning of local police chiefs two weeks ago my colleague my friend and my partner senator cornyn expressed support for specialized training and more social workers and mental health experts so police can do their jobs end quote. keep the bad guys at bay and protect the community. i believe we can find common ground here. i think we purposely made this first hearing about something i thought there was wide common ground to do. there are so many issues that we as democrats and republicans do it good job at eliminating our differences. this is something that should rise from grace from all of us protect only come together right and left, to try to find a way not to rehash our differences
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but to champion our shared interests and find common sense solutions. it's time we go that extra step to end and what for many families was someone that had mental illness and has been a constant nightmare for years on what will happen to their family member. i'm grateful to all the witnesses that are here. i hope today we can narrow in not on our differences but to see if we can find some common ground. that's when we as a country move forward is when we find ways to stand together and work together to the benefit of others. it's the calling of our country to lead with that kind of spirit that i look forward to hearing from everyone and i look forward to constructive conversation and with that i'm honored to pass it on to my ranking member and someone whom i have a lot of
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respect for tom cotton. mick thank you chairman booker. policing is on the minds of many americans today on their minds because of the relentless coverage of high-profile situations but unfortunately the coverage often includes falsehoods which can be incendiary and it repeated often enough can do significant damage without something that no mere retraction can correct. last year a nation experienced the single largest increase in murders ever recorded. a shocking 45% surge nationwide in big cities is even worse. chicago by a 6565% in washington d.c. by 40%. major cities additionally suffered the largest aggravated assaults in three decades. american families and communities watched in horror as drug overdose deaths rose to the
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highest level ever. their tragic history of addiction. 88,000 americans died in the last 12 months alone and their country also experienced hundreds of violent riots last year that wounded more than 2000 law enforcement officers. policing is a dangerous and difficult profession. often involves individuals all of whom are imperfect with life-and-death consequences. the vast majority of law enforcement interactions so no force in fact they were corporative and cordial between law enforcement citizens in the vast majority of law enforcement officers are good and brave individuals putting their lives on the line everyday. they face tight budgets long hours and sometimes public
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ridicule all because they dedicate their life to protecting others. nonetheless we have understandable concerns about how police interact with the public including poor committee's minority committees and individuals with mental health challenges. given the potential consequences and interaction goes poorly that snow surprised republicans and democrats are like are just inviting ways to improve policing and to improve public safety. but despite bipartisan interest we have seen on occasion the partisan divides that have gotten sharper in recent years. there's perhaps no more example of this partisan divide in calls to defund the police. activists and politicians think of different things when i use that term. some including some lawmakers in congress have called for the abolition -- abolition of all law of all law enforcement although many of these state lawmakers have enormous sums of
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money by their own failing at her for security guards. abolishing law enforcement is a foolish idea that no serious person would ever want to see enacted. others say we should all wish law enforcement but simply cut their budgets further and rely on unarmed social workers or mental health workers to intervene in emergency situations. of course we need to involve mental health professionals anytime there's a crisis situation or person receiving treatment from a mental health professional rather than the subject of her crowd justice system and we don't need to ask police officers to function as doctors and educators or to solve every social problem in our society. they are on our streets to enforce our laws in our
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communities and i expect the police department would be glad to have more better partnership. as chairman booker outlined. expect we will hear more about this and hearing and i welcome the opportunity work with my colleagues in a bipartisan fashion to improve the availability of de-escalation training and how to recognize and respond to people facing mental health challenges to span partner sister teen law enforcement on the one hand and mental behavior health providers on the other hand. but the suggestion that mental health professionals can replace the police rather than supplement and support the police is misguided and dangerous. the simple truth is when law enforcement stands down in response was to what some people will call small crimes are when the police are defunded ali begets is more crime in more violence. so let's be clear law enforcement is not the enemy and
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we shouldn't try to reduce law enforcement either. not only can the police prevent additional victims but also the opportunity to connect offenders who suffer from mental illness ended the action with professionals that help them. almost everyday police officer who donned the uniform help someone who's having the worst day of that person's life. our police have seen the most pernicious evils in our society. they are constantly faced with the worst and are always asked to be at their best. as violent crime and lawlessness continues to increase we need more police more resources better training and more and better partnerships between our police and their behavioral and mental health professionals. i think the witnesses for appearing today and i look forward to hearing your
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perspectives on this important issue. >> senator cotton i'm grateful for those remarks and i would like to know ask senator durbin to give a summer marks as well and i hope you'll do the same period. >> thank you senator booker. i'm happy to be here is the chair the the of the subcommittee on criminal justice and counterterrorism. in this room today we are making history as you take the gavel for the first african-american chair of the senate judiciary committee this is not only on historic moment but it's long overdue. i couldn't think of a better person to chair the subcommittee are at our work together is a first step and a real leader when it came to criminal justice reform. i know you are sharing the same leadership when it comes to police reform for the topic today is one that is near and dear to me. as senator cotton noted there's an abundance an overwhelming
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evidence of gun violence in the city of chicago and many cities across the nation predesignated state senator many groups come to me and say what are you going to do about it? you are such a hotshot and you were on the judiciary committee and many times i've i threw up my hands and thank it spends on passing a law that is so hard to do politically to get anything done in so many different areas but i made a trip two years ago that has really guided me since for the cook county juvenile facility. this facility houses adolescents under the age of 18 who have been accused of gun crimes many of them with murder and they stay in this facility in downtown chicago until their trial. sometimes that's years. we have created a high school in this facility, classrooms gyms cafeterias. adolescents are winning for trial accused of gun crimes and i sat down with the teachers and counselors at these facilities
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and said who are these kids? how did they get into the situation of gang members and gun violence? what is this all about and of course they said there are many avenues and many paths to that but they said to me there is one overwhelming common theme. over 90% of these kids have been the victims of trauma. of course we think of trauma in the physical sense but it also is isn't a mental sense. to go back to indicators adverse childhood experiences a list created many years ago you realize what can happen to a little kid as they are growing up that has a direct impact on who they will be and what they will do. you find out there's a long long list. the second visit i made and i will make this very brief was to public school in chicago going through program were they were introducing children in third grade to meditation.
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i watched and i sat in the classroom as the teacher called for a few minutes, five minutes of just silence and reflection and meditation in class. as i watched and when i'm a hallway later there was one little boy in there but just couldn't settle down and couldn't quiet down. what's going on, do you know? something terrible as happened in his home and i said to the teacher whether you going to do about it and she says i teach math in third grade. i'm not a psychologist so the issue that i'm raising here this morning at the beginning of this hearing is of all the issues you have raised are valid issues but let us not forget the need for mental health counseling for children. an intervention in the lives of children. i don't think these kids are lost forever. they need help. they need a mentor or they need somebody who believes in them and cares to can turn them to the right path instead of seeing
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them end up on the wrong path. i yield back. >> senator grassley is one of the busier men in the united states senate and moves like an energizer bunny. i want to extend the courtesy to senator cornyn if you'd like to give some introductory remarks. >> thank you for the courtesy in the opportunity. i'm glad to be here today and i appreciate senator cotton and you convening this hearing could i think we have learned a lot in recent years about law enforcement and the role of mental health in the process. i guess one of the people who made the biggest impression on me a few years back was a journalist named keith early who chronicled his own family struggle with a son, and adult son who was mentally ill but in
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the process would commit petty crimes in would find himself in a jail cell without any real benefit to him or society because that's the only place they knew to put him. but i have been encouraged by the work we've been able to do here in this congress passing things like mental health and safety amenities act and offering grants for those police departments to help with things like active shooter response and things like de-escalation training and the like and i've been very much encouraged by the crisis intervention teams that are sprouting up in most major cities around the country including major cities in my state and even the advent of things like mental health courts though unlike traditional courts
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adjudicate guilt or innocence they literally monitor people once they are released in the public and make sure that they have the support they need and hopefully to deal with their mental health condition so they don't repeat those offenses and they get the help they need hopefully to get better. i will never forget about five years ago now i think it was i was in dallas at the memorial service for five police officers that were killed and the police chief david around at the time who has since gone to chicago, he said to me and everyone else there at the time he said we asked the police to do too much and i think we are making progress to try to provide additional resources in a more effective response but frankly i don't think it's an either/or
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proposition. i don't think the question is do you support the police or do you support mental health providers? we need to do both in my view so i'm glad this committee and this congress has been productive in passing things like the criminal justice reform act that we have all worked together on but i as senator whitehouse and i are working on post-release access to services to make sure that people do go through the programs to deal with mental health challenges or with their evictions or lack of job skills and once they are released from prison that they have the support they need in order to remain as a successful member of society and not going back to the same old neighborhood with the same old bad influences and get back with the same old bad habits so thanks for giving me a chance to say a few words mr. chairman and thanks for holding this hearing. >> thank you mr. cornyn. as i learned in a young boy in a
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small black church the choir has all thing with army army of us all and now it's time to talk to her witnesses and i'm very excited to introduce our witnesses and i will ask my ranking member to introduce the other witnesses. if i can find my notes here forgive me. if i can get my introduction here, thank you very much. the first witness is major martin smith the commander of the baltimore police department education and training section where he's responsible for the development and delivery of new recruit training and continuing education for approximately 3000 personnel. he also leads the baltimore crisis response program and he has served as the chief of staff to the police commissioner and
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commander. he holds up that's what degree of arts and creighton university and a masters of criminal justice degree from washington university. and we have the director of the judd foundation and codirector of the mental health strategic impact initiative and she serves on the board of the national association of peer specialists. ms. maier has previously held the position of director of consumer affairs for defense and the center for mental health services of the united states health and human services substance abuse and mental health services administration and the board president and national alliance on mental illness. ms. myrick has a masters of science degree in organizational psychology from the california school of professional psychology alliant international university great room masters
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business degree is from case western university and the weather had school of management to ebony martin is a program coordinator and the crisis intervention worker for cahoots for cahoots program provides multiple crises response in eugene and springfield oregon and has been connecting people experiencing crisis with uniquely training personnel as an alternative is to law enforcement for more than 30 years. in her position she strives to promote and enhance the crucial role that crisis response plays in keeping communities safe. kevin borton -- martone is the executive director of the technical assistance collaborative and nonprofit organization dedicated to helping our nation's mental health addiction and homelessness and affordable housing system implement policies and practices that empower people to live help
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independent lives in the committees they choose. previously mr. martone served as the mental health commissioner for the great state of new jersey. the president of the national association of state dental health program dreck years and ceo of the supportive agency. ranking member please introduce your witness. >> at first like to introduce terry o'connor. she is the mother of two children and grandmother of -- mr. connor is first-hand experiences with challenges police and not only is your son a police officer that her late husband was also a police officer. in the early years of her marriage ms. o'connor spent a decade working as a 911 operator herself read most recently tragically ms. o'connor is also a widow after her husband
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philadelphia corporal james o'connor was killed last year as he was serving high-risk warns on a gang member. he should have been in jail the time that the soft on crime policy reduced the footprint of the criminal justice system and their public safety. ms. o'connor i'm so sorry for your loss and thank you for your testimony today. next it like to introduce raphael sandwell. mr. mag well is a senior fellow and deputy director of policy for the manhattan institute. as well as contributing editor to the journal and is co-authored number of articles on issues ranging from the broader matters of criminal and civil justice reform. he has appeared on number of television and radio programs. he has previously worked in
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corporate vacations with the international trademark association holds a b.a. in corporate communication city university of new york's college and a degree at the university of chicago. last year he is was appointed to serve a four-year term as a member of the newark state advisory committee at the u.s. commission on civil rights. thank you for appearing before us today. finally it like to introduce sheriff mems. sheriff minces been a police officer for six decades. not only was she the first deputy sergeant supervisor in a county she was also the first female deputy sheriff to maintain the ranks of lieutenant assistant chair or to be elected to office. she is a member of the california officers association of the california state sheriffs association and is deeply involved in her community in other ways including her service on the board of directors of the
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marjorie mason center a local women's shelter as well as a trustee for the fresno county boys and girls club. she's a graduate of fresno university and holds a master's degree in public administration national diversity. thank you for testifying today and chairman tucker i'd like to asked to enter into the record a number of concluding articles regarding policing and behavior health three commentary articles published through media publications into doc meant by the international association of chiefs of police and law enforcement legal defense fund. >> without objection. >> i like to bring witnesses on board and i think i need to swear you in and why we stand up. witnesses at home please stand
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in your living room or wherever you are. i didn't -- to affirm that it -- please raise your hand. you affirm the testimony you're about to give before this committee will be truthful wholly truthful and nothing but the truth so help you god? thank you very much. and without we will bring on the first witness and the first witness will be the commander of education training specialist at the baltimore police department. >> good morning chairman booker ranking member cotton and distinguished members of the subcommittee on criminal justice and counterterrorism. my name is -- and i'm a 24 veteran of the baltimore police police department. i currently serve as commander of education and training and lead the crisis response program for prudham also bloomberg fellow at the johns hopkins
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bloomberg school of public health. well it's my privilege to appear before you today i wish my presents were not necessary. we have come together because for at least the past decade law enforcement actions have been associated with annual deaths of 1100 people nationwide. it's estimated that 25% to 50% of these deaths involve persons diagnosed with a severe mental illness. in the past three weeks alone more than a dozen people who are mentally ill in the throes of a break down. these tragedies point to the urgent needs of law enforcement and behavioral health professionals and stakeholders and individuals with little experience to develop and implement solutions to effectively respond to a crisis and meet the complex behavioral health needs of those we serve. we are in the situation because public policy decisions decades ago when psychiatric institutions were closed and
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people with mental illness were returned to their communities without adequate treatment and support. while these institutions were not the answer municipalities fail to provide the supporting treatment needed for people with mental illness to live free from discrimination in their communities. to this day in baltimore in many places throughout the united states the behavior health system crisis prevention has not been realized. in june of last year a 19-year-old man completely and in a psychiatric crisis repeatedly fired a handgun at motorists as he walked the streets of his baltimore neighborhood. police responded safely but the man into custody recover the firearm he had been discharging and drove him to an emergency room for psychiatric treatment. ..
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a call to his home and, try to de-escalate hampered the man pulled a handgun from his pants pocket and pointed at the officers. in fear for their lives the officer shot him. he is now paralyzed. far too often police find themselves in positions where the behavioral health system has failed to meet consumer's needs. this is why it estimated 10% of total police calls involve mental health situations. inadequate funding and a system that diffuses responsibility among numerous uncoordinated entities are at the core of the problem. as a result, people explains crises more frequently on police are thrust into the role of the last resort safety net for people in crisis. even when police peacefully handle calls and link service providers these calls can be time-consuming which is often at odds with the demands of the 911 system and the
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expectation committees have for response. i know we can do better. my testimony today is informed by ten years with behavior health professionals. i've witnessed firsthand how service delivery has improved dramatically when police partner with highly trained clinicians forensic interviews of sexually abuse children. when police partner with victim advocates to coordinate counseling services to survive intimate partner violence. on police partner with outreach workers or credibility within our nation's most marginalized communities allows them to mediate disputes disrupt cycles of retaliatory violence. employees could response with social workers to de-escalate a person crisis. through these kinds of successful partnerships between the criminal justice and behavioral health system, we have demonstrated how it is possible to improve public health outcomes for even the most challenge populations. moving forward, i hope you
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will build upon the promising practices of behavior health progressives in new star in denver colorado, g brooks in baltimore, maryland britt hope you'll find research so that jurisdictions can make evidence-based decisions for allocating scarce resources. i hope you will incentivize law enforcement, behavior health providers and academic institutions to collaborate on policy development, training, data analysis, and outcome evaluation. and i hope you'll heed the calls of behavior health practitioners and clinicians to find crisis response services, long-term treatment, and community-based providers at the levels needed to meet the extraordinary demands. i think of for the opportunity today to discuss how this community safer and more responsive to the millions of people who desperately need a robust behavioral health in crisis response system. your support of law enforcement, behavior health professionals and the citizens
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we serve is greatly appreciated. thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you so much commander we really appreciate your testimony in place to bring on this next witness. when i was mayor of new york the manhattan institute was a partner of ours to help us establish the first seven state of office of prisoner reentry. so i am grateful now the manhattan senior fellows is here. hope i answered in practice or we please give us your testimony. >> you didn't thank you chairman bukharin ranking member cotton as well as a subcommittee for the invitation. it is truly an honor and a privilege to address this body on an issue that is among the most which is police report. it is also the most divisive. a lot of the conversation but how to reform policing in the united states seemed to be
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dramatic key misconception that police violence is a likely outcome of investigative report of interaction. sword like to do is to start this misconception and talk a little bit about the risk and their reproach to conform to reduce reduce footprint for its own sake i know 83% of americans, this is going to recent survey guessed the typical police officers fired his gun at least one time on the job while on duty. in reality only about one in four actually ever do at any point in their long careers. lease very rarely use force when they do it very rarely result in serious injury. in 2018 police officers and united states discharge their firearms an estimated 3043 times for that year they made nearly 10.3 criminal arrests. my future but each of the estimated discharges unique officer at most 0.4
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purposefully discharge their firearm in 2018. and if we have seen a rate that happened at most provided deadly force 0.03% of arrests. the 2018 researchers and doctors published a thorough study of police use of fourth and the journal of trauma and surgery. that study analyzed over a million calls for service to three midsize police department in arizona, louisiana and north carolina over to your. those calls resulted in more than wondered 14000 arrests. police force was used in just with every one in every 12899% of all arrests and much more than 99% of all encounters were effective without any use of force. debit study with him to find that on the people whom police used force against they had no or mild injury more than 98% of the time. only 1.8% of subjects
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sustained moderate or severe injuries and only one suspect was fatally wounded during the study. when you drilled on a particular dangerous place encounters including those involving people in crisis, take my home city of new york for example 2020 the nypd responded to wondered 6,127,891 calls for persons in crisis at the apartment record only 32 firearm discharge that year including off-duty shooting the vast majority which did not begin with crisis call sprayed on average the nypd response to wondered 75000 calls with people in crisis annually in its highly trained emergency service officers try to respond often to wondered 25000 of those per year. it's in conjunction. the three-year period between 2018 and 2020, esu officers recorded just one shooting. none of this means there's not room for improvement or police are perfect there is and they
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are not. but exploiting opportunities to perform is an endeavor that has to be undertaken because pulling the wrong policy level have disastrous effects for tickly on crime we should be especially cognizant have now given the very short uptick in shootings and homicides across the country. last year the first time since 1995 criminologist estimate the us will have seen more than 20000 criminal homicides an increase of about 4000 additional homicides compared to 2019. that's going to wave off nearly 25 homicides a country expense in 1991 it's important to note some cities have seen members approached and surpassed the 1990s peaks. now i suspect some of this misconception some of the overarching goals of performance which at the moment seemed to be to minimize the footprint of police and the criminal justice system more than anyway possibly purred calls to defund the police which in some cities have been heated. with also heard culture toward more responsibility with
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traffic enforcement and responding calls away from police to unarmed civilians. on the mental health front there's efforts to continue by augment with crisis teams involving people crisis. her portly released yesterday review some of that evidence. among the approach of valuing the report isn't popular off-site promising effort launched in new orleans called cooper cahoots is also a case study of programs referred to as policing. in this report there highly specialized 2019 they come to 17% of eugene 91 calls was 75% of skulls being a welfare check were providing transportation usually someone homeless or in need. and even this relatively limited circumstances they still call for backup and roughly one in every 67 calls for service in 2019. and so i doubt it provides useful service now groups are
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not to say a model how to police the police. but as a complement to policing it certainly a useful model for other cities to adopt. to consider the sheer volume of mental health calls received by the please not to mention it often receive late at night or in the early morning hours becomes very clear was simply do not have the capacity to shift this particular responsibility. another comp getting back to us often unclear whether call can be accurately categories one can be safely diverted to civilian responders and mental health crises as opposed to others. in other words there's a study for example out of study of philadelphia some medical or public health activity is crime or other policing work. some eventually determined to be police or crime activity can appear to be public health related. the study went on to find that about 20% of activity in this area actually did not appear predictable from the initial
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call type handled by police dispatchers for which is important many snow that in advance of her going to successfully divert some of these calls. so what does second the comment in favor of real solutions that sometimes ride with police encounters with those suffering severe mental illness. as an effort to provide more for those in need. in a safe and compassionate setting rather than trying them out unto the stupid likely to get hurt or hurt others. now again knowing this is to save improving outcomes in policing is not something should not pursue it is. but while reform is a worthy pursuit cannot be allowed the government's first duty wishes to provide for the public, thank you. >> mistreatment well that was really incredible testimony so good i'm considering sending you a tie as a gift. i would like to now go to,
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would you please give us your testimony? >> good morning chairman booker, ranking member cotton and members of the subcommittee but appreciate this opportunity to speak with you today about creating behavior health crisis systems that are for all. you heard my bio but equally important is who i am as a person. i am a, sister, cousin, friend , army brat, african-american, and i'm a person is given a diagnosis of schizophrenia. i recall in first diagnosed i believe no one would want to be my friend that i was not worthy of help. that i was not worthy of love it. initially i did not even believe my struggles were due to having a mental illness. this is how i felt often as a person of color in this country. i rejected any form of help and due to the embarrassment of mental illness i did not let the people who loved and supported be the most my parents into the world that i was experiencing. my first interaction with the
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mental health system during a crisis when i was in my 30s and los angeles went badly, very badly. i was an emotional distress my expectation was an emt or an ambulance would come to help me. i'd been told repeatedly that it's like any other physical illness and should be treated as such. during a time of confusion, paranoia and extreme distress the police arrived at my small apartment building as only african-american resident for the officer knocked on the door and announced he was from the place of permit sent to do a welfare check. as a black person so things are enter my mind. for the neighbors think it's a stair type of blackbean criminals was a state to open the door given many horrific outcomes of african-americans police interaction but my paranoia was not about my illness is white to be black in america but let the police in fearing if i did they would break down my door.
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they deemed a danger to myself i was handcuffed and taken to the police station where i was then handcuffed to a chair, spoke to an african-american boy will there still is grim for this gun that's on the in a secure gun box. i was trying to understand how it's possible for me to it be what everyone said, sick and needing psychiatric hospitalization but to be sitting handcuffed to a chair at a police station sing for the first time in my life a real gun. this is my first experience being in such distress and needing mental health support. when it did not need was a police response being treated like a criminal. i needed health care and support. i found what care was all about, asking for help getting instead handcuffs and being harmed physically and emotionally. from this i was unwilling to seek the care i needed, especially when i needed the most. i can think is a very fortunate not to have the same outcomes at 24 group african-american woman known
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to have bipolar disorder was picked up by the police the malibu area in los angeles because it was reported she was acting irrationally. like me, she is taken to a police station but sadly for ms. richardson she is released from the station in the middle of the night with no car, phone, while it, or money. her decomposed body was found 11 months later in the area not far from the station. when someone has a heart attack, stroke, dementia or even writing to give birth is this how they're treated? cannot fault first responders, why do have police responding to mental health emergency situations when others are trained to do so? pierce support specialist should be part of a mobile crisis a sponsor to remove police from the crisis response equation. support specialists are evidence-based practices, personal medicine coaching and psychiatric advantages.
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they share the personal story of the carbon to support another. support is proven to help people participate and adhere to treatment, shall reductions in hospitalization hot homelessness and increase employment and social connection and for parents and family members that helps them to feel more confident in their ability to help their loved one. supports cost-effective particular valuable in a world when other areas been strapped for resources between more fully funded respite for people in health crisis have a safe and supportive place to recover. these are unprecedented times of world reeling from the pandemic racial unrest, economic challenges and trauma especially for those have been disproportionally impacted. we want people 2ingage in their recovery we need to bring crisis response and systems that look like other health crisis response without police as to default first responders but recent resort such as a group for the advancement of psychiatry roadmap the ideal crisis system on the front end
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projects report from harm to help centered and equity lived experience and crisis response, provide blueprints to help us get there. developing the new number for going to call specifically for these kind of crisis situation. ninety-one is a start is created momentum for more competency reforms including comprehensive police and criminal justice reforms. without center race equity with lived expensive main of the systems that are most effective and once it people want. even avenue as the police have said that they want. this is what we need and today i ask that we support legislation and robust funding to ensure equity is really equity and behavior health crisis response. i asked that if we want to move from handcuffed to healthy must work together to ensure the safety of all include the police and creating systems that are humane, compassionate, effective, and help people to flourish and be safe and live to their full potential, thank you chairman for this opportunity. spinning i am very, very
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grateful for that powerful testimony. i would like to now introduce ms. margaret i should say sheriff margaret i'm so grateful you take time out of what i knows and intensely busy schedule as a share of pelts grateful to have you on could you please give us your testimony. >> and givens dirt chairman mr. ranking and members of the committee. i've ordered to appear before you to discuss challenges faced by local government families and communities as a work together to respond to those in mental health. although there are no simple solutions we continue to develop and implement initiatives to better serve our communities including increasing access to mental health treatment diverting individuals with mental health conditions away from the criminal justice system and work with mental health professionals on training programs to address those with human health needs. increasing numbers of people with mental illnesses are coming into contact with the
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criminal justice system. we do not know a call for service may involve someone with mental illness until we arrive. these calls can be very dynamic and in some cases dangerous. in the county fed two deputy sheriffs killed in the line of duty by mentally unstable individuals who had armed themselves for these calls for service often are repeated aptly often respond to the same location for the same individual. law-enforcement of my county but those at risk into the fresno county jail. we have three correctional facilities and average daily population for march was 2620 inmates. that population 97% for felony charges. we are in all felony jail. to put this into perspective
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this high number of cases exist after california passed an initiative in 2014 reducing many felony drug crimes and misdemeanors. in addition to respond to calls we are working tirelessly to provide treatment to this inside our correctional facilities. in march of this year 41% of those in our facilities received medication for mental health disorder. recently our inmate healthcare services received accreditation from the national commission on correctional healthcare. as we evaluate our system, we learn many individuals not receiving care when they were not in custody. no one should have to be in jail to receive mental health service. the sheriffs office worked with the department behavioral behavioral health to form a strategy to improve continuum care when individuals leading our facilities.
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rather than release these individuals at the door, we transport them to a safe location. it should be noted many of these individuals are homeless. stair taken to a shelter that i will discuss in a moment. that has resulted in strengthening our partnerships, a separate jail release plan and in the long-term goal is to reduce recidivism. moreover most law-enforcement leaders i talked to agree that incidents involving mental health crisis require more than just a law enforcement response. however the lines are rarely bright. in many cases law enforcement response is required to help save lives. our law enforcement agencies work with our behavior health department who provided crisis intervention training which includes de-escalation techniques. we were established a crisis intervention team comprised of mental health professionals
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and emergency medical services to respond with law enforcement so that both the safety of professional services can be available during interactions of individuals in need of care. we've also activated sequential mapping initiative. was that croft system approach or law-enforcement often comes into contact with those with mental illness. use the data from this initiative to establish a system that bridges mental health services and minimizes criminal justice involvement with persons with mental illness. action plan includes a countywide crisis intervention team increasing cooccurrence disorders in creating a sobriety center. we are also focusing on discharge and reentries to reduce in addition to developing diversion tools. we want to continue to expand these efforts but enhance response to mental health
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crisis were require significant increases in training and personnel. federal support for this would be helpful as long as it does not displace law enforcement programs. patient nuclear placing law enforcement defending the police would result in more harm to the citizens we serve, team policing has the same effect. the rule of law is a fundamental principle that must be respected. when laws are broken are citizens expected effective response especially when lives in their homes are threatened. i began my statement this morning by saying solutions need cooperative relationships. a multidisciplinary approach is needed that includes all stakeholders, mental health professionals public safety and community-based organizations. i can assure centers that law enforcement professionals across the nation want to be a
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part of the solution and your service to provide any additional input they need as policy is developed, thank you. >> sheriff thank you pritt i'm aware of the enormity and responsibility of your job. i'm remaining for questions as well. now like to bring on someone, we have heard quds mentioned i'm very excited to hear from ms. morgan. could you please share your testimony with this? spinning good morning chairman booker, franky mintzberg cotton and members of the united states committee on the judiciary. i was asked to come before you today to discuss my experience providing mobile crisis intervention services in eugene and springville oregon. i am a registered nurse and i work as a program coordinator. cahoots is a bubble crisis response team.
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unarmed pairs of a crisis worker and a medical professional to call for service. police dispatchers via police radio spread recorded with the police departments are community partners to take on the appropriate calls and meet community members where they are at. i'm inspired to do this work is very personal ways. my grandmother, carolyn, was extraordinarily kind human being. she survived of the of my mother also a nurse. growing up washing my mom care for her so diligently taught me people at springs and mental health crisis but are not to be feared, rejected, judged or pub punished. they are to be cared for. someone in a crisis needs de-escalation respect safety and support. for the vulnerable population pritt my father charles morgan did not get a chance to participate in raising me.
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he died during an encounter with the police when he was just 25, a young black man. my family was devastated, i was five and my sister had not yet experienced a birthday. when i graduated from nursing school i declined an offer to work at my local hospital received double income. i stayed at quds because work matters rest others have noticed behavioral health services not be limited by lack of funding in their effort to support the community in a way that's proven to be safe and effective. mobile crisis responses are worth every effort. unarmed de-escalation's its present local police officers calls or return train to, but the appropriate response. the protocol only require law enforcement's is necessary we can call them via police radio work together to a positive
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outcome. we can respond independently for welfare checks, mediation, crisis counseling substance abuse and so much for. in 2019, cahoots had some level involvement in 17 -- 20% of the total income and public safety calls for service. no employee has ever lost their life or been seriously injured on the job despite never carrying a weapon and no clients have died as result of ushering up to help. cahoots crisis response or trying to overcome our own fight or flight response but when the css that it remain cognizant of safety, show the client were there to help, and skillfully de-escalate the situation pritt order to de-escalate a client they must be able to identify we are not a threat to them. to help significantly that we are not. how ability to intervene, without giving into reactivity is imperative. being unarmed allows us to default to our training because it is our only way
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forward. this client need to talk? to the news go to the hospital? did they need time to sober up at the sobering center? helping begins when he stopped in the client as a threat and start evaluating its imperative to trauma informed care. built in antiracist practices from the start to learn from and avoid perpetuating systems of racism. mobile crisis can also connect a client existing committee resources but are not a replacement for them. this could include a 24/7 crisis center low barrier shelter permanent supportive housing, sobering and detox centers. each area must be empowered to identify its needs and fund those programs. now is the nation is recognizing that mental health crises are best responded to by trained mental health professionals i'm extremely helpful that together we can
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find a way to provide humans with the appropriate resources for every situation instead of a one-size-fits-all approach to public safety. that overburden a group of people that did not necessarily get specifically trained for these encounters. one-size-fits-all never fits all. cahoots is one long-standing example of the role mobile crisis response can play in a community. we operate as an addition to existing structures and do not replace or change the current public safety system. mobile crisis response however is a necessary and logical service to provide to communities. thank you for making time for me today. smucker really grateful for that testimony. looking forge the questions that will come. i now have the honor to introduce mysterio connor who truly has an american family. her son is a law enforcement
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professional in her late husband as well. alia center cotton said to view our deepest condolences. your family is a family of heroes we are very much forward to hearing your testimony. >> i care for my short bio, my husband jim was a philadelphia police officer and with the corporal shot was shot and killed march 14, 2020. jim's a death will never seem real has serviced his department for 23 years. his father was also a police officer serving for over 40 years. our son and daughter-in-law are both currently philadelphia police officers. our police family extends to numerous other family members two. this is the one job they all know too well. i myself started out as a police dispatcher product firsthand experience of hectic situations and numerous emergencies.
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to keep a cold poison, so whatever situation is be dealt with. our goal was that every officer go home at the end of each shift. defining the police is dangerous. look at what has happened in cities like seattle and portland and so meet large cities across the country. murders are up and there's a sense among criminals there is no law and order on the streets. the mayor and city council except zero accountability for this brings me to it philadelphia when one of the highest murder rates five and her murders were committed. and more than 2400 shootings including 225 women in the 195 children. this year's were already on pacer higher murder rate, performance into the air wave over 145 murders, foreign and 45 shootings in summer children.
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philadelphia is a prime example of what happens on police are demoralized and build the consequences of a new consequence ea. along with a narrative that often goes along with defining the police the all sensor bed. my son is jolie while lacking criminals that they laugh and said they will be out of jail in the day or two. criminals know there's never a consequences here in philadelphia. my husband for murders had rap sheets that could go on for days include multiple violations of probation, drug charges and gun charges. the al had reduced balin cases dropped. the man who pulled the actual trigger has five murders under him including my husband. those are only ones they learned about so far. one of the other males in the room was wanted for two prior murders or the males had previous gun charges. there were holed up in a tiny rinse at one bedroom apartment
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nine guns lined up with multiple drugs out the room. how you think should be responsible mental health workers may be a negotiator, this is the job my husband and his coworker signed up for. their split-second decisions that needed to be made. nobody hates a bad cop more than a good cop. but the movement is about demonizing every officer in taking our country into anarchy by abolishing the police altogether. every officer is given at least nine months of training before graduating the academy. they then have to continue yearly training. swat officers alone have an x or three months of training before they can serve warrants, hand situations et cetera. the morning on march 13, they use some of their training and use restraint when fired upon to return fire but stop and negotiate from a closed door.
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the criminals asked him to stop shooting on the police responded for them to do the same. for other males could have been killed that day. the police use their training to not make the situation even worse. all of our officers could use height risk training they need a split second to make a decision. defendant police reduces for vitally important training and professional developer that needs to occur to address bad policing tactics buried police brutality usually occurs when overly aggressive policing with evil intent. to reduce the violence we should reevaluate tactics and make sure police are trained in the most skills possible. good policing requires a commitment to robust trading that must be ongoing. this requires funding. a recent shooting in philadelphia reflects a continued need for money and training.
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walter wallace was a mentally ill man who shot when he aggressively approached police. although i do not believe there is enough time for a health partner to be called in on this job, if it taser would have been uc could've been subdued into sake to the proper facility. the officers were not equipped with tasers but more than half the philadelphia officers do not carry it taser. finding is an issue there many reforms that we can debate however the fighting the police is not one of them. you think that criminals are victims of society is totally absurd by the knees to be respectable for police officers lead stricter penalties, weird to me times a criminal is out of jail because of reduced bail or conviction to overturn. rda and other seem to be held accountable for letting these people out of jail. i know person jim's murder should have been locked up
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they've been kept in jail where they deserve to be i would not be spending today, april 22, my 26th wedding anniversary testifying on his behalf at this congressional hearing. jim should be here, his life mattered. thank you. >> ms. o'connell but testimony could not been easy thank you for sharing your pain and your purpose. we honor your husband's heroism and service. >> thank you. mckay would now like to bring up someone to have a tremendous amount of respect for, again executive director of the collaborative mr. kevin martone. >> thank you center, ranking member of cotton. my name is kevin martone i'll be speaking to regarding one aspect of police reform. the realization of law enforcement to management and health emergencies. i've spent nearly 30 years working the public mental
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health as commissioner for the mental health system in new jersey on various national boards and committees. i'm also part of a racially diverse family the family and were committed to helping a loved one to find her life beyond mental illness and navigate the racism she experience is in her daily life. many parts of the nine states 91 as a default mental health crisis line, law enforcement is a default mental health emergency response local jails criminalize the public health issue of the criminal justice system. there are proximate to an 40 million calls to nine when the united states each year. estimates are that behavioral health emergencies constitute between five and 15% local dispatchers as durbin disturbances intoxicated persons or mental crises. does not require police presence. when diverted to a crisis line
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justified especially when weapons involved has diverse outcomes for communities of color and individuals behavior health disorders and other disabilities. according to the international association of chiefs of police, the mere presence of law enforcement vehicle and officer in uniform and/or weapon desk-situation is in crisis. and unnecessarily fatalities. sixteen times more likely than the general public in a place and an era when police bounces top of mind one of four fatalities by police about people experiencing mental health emergency. half of all people killed by police or people of color when combined with mental illness the differences nearly tenfold. the problem is more complex and we have time for today but i will highlight a few of the factors that resulted in this. generally a series of cascading issues over the past
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several decades have resulted into driving factors. one, the fragmented underfunded undervalued and inaccessible mental health system. this is compounded by poor health insurance coverage, limited funding for services at the federal, state, local level, mental health work shortages and geographic challenges and transportation issues that impact services access. especially in rural areas. increasing demand reduce provider capacity. number two, mental health and other systems do not sufficiently address social determinants such as racism poverty access to affordable housing, employment people with mental owns and specially designated as of color are disproportionally poor, calm, unemployed. all of these worse outcomes and mental illness where the result is the defective national policy that is acceptable to law enforcement to manage health emergencies. slump porcelain officials i've spoken with served in the mental health system pay people's mental illness their
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families and providers agree, the events we have witnessed in the past the public health and economic impact of covid, racial and social unrest in mental illness have elevated the need to treatment to help as a public health issue that it is for the good news is there is activity, recent congressional action resulted in additional block funding for health services. new medicaid benefit's funding support additional workforce capacity. we have seen important bipartisan legislation passed recently include the crisis stabilization and community reentry act and the national suicide hotline designation act that establishes the new 988 suicide prevention and mental health crisis line as an alternative to 911. solutions exist for in committees have established mental health emergency programs such as cahoots in oregon and right care here in texas. the response efforts push further updates prevent crises and recurring to begin with. axis to evidence-based
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services like supportive housing, assertive community treatment, specialized. support, employment support, children systems of care and other approaches exist to serve idols and children in the community but do not have the capacity and workforce to meet the demand in many areas of the country. in closing, to the extent law enforcement will likely continue to have some role for the foreseeable future responding to mental health emergencies, at least in situations of public safety is a concern, law enforcement must own reforms are hot responsibly with mental illness. especially those who are black and brown. this works been for my people experience mental illness racial equity and justice groups and other key stakeholders. and if we are to reduce law enforcement response to mental health emergencies we have to commit to addressing mental health reform and build the infrastructure needed to create accessible mental health system. just a note, there 17000 police department in this country that is a lot. and in underfunded mental health system. we are to do this one by one we are never going to get there.
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include planning and training and design, data collection and research were going to collectively address this issue. one by one is not going to get us the need to be a national strategy might. >> mr. martone is incredibly valuable. i love the point you made about a lot of our solution should not be about simply responding to crisis is a lot of wisdom in that. that last point you made about eight larger system to deal with this, unfortunately the focus of this hearing today is what should we be doing in terms of the first response? but i do not what to let that important part of your testimony to be lost a beginning a larger national strategy for mental health awareness. it is fractured there so many gaps that swalwell up so many folks that then perpetuate the crises we are seeing. think that was worth highlighting.
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we are at a point where everybody's testimony is really important for the record. and for the strategy i think congress going to do in a bipartisan way the senate. and tone of my friend and senator blumenthal would like to ask some questions first i will yield to him. >> i really appreciate this opportunity mr. chairman. i just want to say how important i think this hearing is, my thanks to chairman booker for bringing us together on this critically important topic. i served as united states attorney in connecticut before and half years than as attorney general and our state for 20 years. so i have worked very extensively with law enforcement and police interactions with people who may have disabilities, or mental illness, or autism ought to tremendously concern
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as part and i'm sure many of my colleagues have said, as i did, students tuesday's guilty verdict in the chauvin trial provides necessary accountability for the murder of george floyd. but it is not true justice. not for george floyd not for any other black brown american killed by law enforcement. no single verdict in a single case can eliminate the generation of racial justice, inequality and equity faced by black and brown americans in policing and across many other aspects of society. there is so much work to do. and senator booker has been at the forefront nationally. but also in the senate reminding us of our obligations to commit ourselves to true justice, equality and equity.
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there is a need for real action rural reform and real change proud to work with him on legislation that can achieve that change. we find ourselves in a moment of reckoning. while derek chauvin may have been held accountable for violating a sworn oath to protect and serve at least three more black and brown americans were killed by law enforcement in high profile incidents just in the last month. adam toledo, daunte wright, and 20 minutes before the chauvin verdict was announced on tuesday, mickey bryant, something must change. and we in the united states can make it so. i would say one reason why i am committed to this most important mission. one of my constituents from
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east hartford, reached out to my office to share her concerns about her son, curtis. curtis is 13 years old treats african-american pace also a person with autism. and intellectual disabilities. marine is worried about what would happen if law enforcement were ever to interact with her son. she wrote to meet recently, quote from the outside my child appears to look new at typical. but quote there is a delay in processing information which scares me that an officer will not take the time to understand. others, without knowing the situation may see this as being defiant.
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i do not want him nor any child or adult to be traumatized or lose their life because law enforcement did not take the time to know how to approach the situation. ". marine is an incredible mom. she has a task that is unimaginable. i have four children. being a parent is the hardest thing i have ever had to do. and i think it is the most serious task that i or any parent face in life. and marinas during your very best to teach curtis about law enforcement. how to react if he's ever approached by police. her even if he is just asked a question. and quite frankly, she has every right and reason to be concerned. she is doing everything in her
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power to create curtis for what may be an inevitable encounter with police. but marine should not have to prepare curtis. she should not have to prepare him differently than any other parent would prepare a child. law enforcement needs to know how to deal with these kinds of situations. how to respond to people like curtis with autism or other behavioral health diagnoses but how to bring a community mental health services when a police response is necessary but also capable of becoming violence. not only for curtis but for present with disabilities, difficulties, or illness.
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so i want to ask a question i really appreciate the chairman indulging me with this time. major barton i understand you've been with the baltimore police from east hartford and around the country be doing to ensure that curtis and people like him are treated appropriately and safely by the police? >> thank you for your question, senator. i think the kind of training that we are currently developing and delivering in the baltimore police department is moving in the right direction. we have training for cit officers control ranks. expressly deals with the topics you recommended.
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identifying individuals with autism and how to interact with them. we work with a host of behavioral health organizations in creating our training and delivering it. so it is not just law enforcement. we are representing in the classroom what we want to see practice in the field. so we work at the national alliance on mental illness. we work with baltimore crisis response, the arcs just an organization that works with individuals with intellectual and development disabilities. these kind of partnerships are absolutely essential to ensuring our officers are prepared to meet the challenges that they are going to have to face on the treats de-escalate incidents and make referrals to the appropriate services. >> thank you major. and thank you this hearing is so valuable.
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i hope we can build on and the judiciary committee going forward because it is a key part of what we need to do to reform and improve policing in america. thanks. >> thank you, senator. i now like to call and senator whitehouse who is remote. >> thank you very much chairman booker. it's good to be with all of you. paper sheet the testimony of everyone. ms. o'connor my daughter lives in philadelphia so i am very glad your husband's family and your family have been protecting that community through multiple generations. just wanted to express my appreciation for their service. it is not at all uncommon for police work to be passed on from father to son and now daughter.
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be very important part of the family's tradition. i am grateful you shared your experience with us today. senator cornyn and i have been working for some time a bill to improve the coordination between law enforcement and behavioral health, mental health, addiction and recovery. both of our states have similar situations although they are different in many, many, many different ways. you know john i am providing more mental health services the law enforcement services. and that is not what we are trained for. my police chief in rhode island tell me the same thing. i think the problem reaches across a whole variety of areas the point of engagement with an individual to the crisis intervention teams and
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have crisis intervention centers available so there can be a timely and appropriate response to support the police response is essential. mr. martone talks about how jails are too often the default collection point for individuals having a behavioral or mental health crisis or addiction issue. we see that in rhode island as well. we also see our emergency routes as another place where people are brought. for emergency room doctors trying to deal with regular medical emergencies, this is not appropriate. they need to be in behavioral health treatment and quickly. the reason the jails and the emergency rooms are playing that role in rhode island anyway, is not because people are misdirected about where folks should go. because there aren't the
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behavioral and mental health services and resources to meet the need. we need to not only do a lot of crisis intervention support and develop new models for supporting police departments, with behavioral health intervention, we need to make a lot more robust in terms of the resources for those people. someone in the non- police involved mental health crisis who goes to the emergency room many places including in providence, rhode island, can spend days waiting in the emergency room for services or a room to become available. so the whole question of how much we invest in the necessary infrastructure is really vital part of this conversation. i would like to add that i was delighted to hear senator cornyn mention mental health
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courts. our district court chief judge, who was instrumental in supporting the growth of veterans court. which stood on the record the superior court had in a program i started when as attorney attorney general of having a drug court. and i think the mental health court is a really good idea. as we look around how true you resource that, there's not a lot of resources. so taking the idea of mental health courts veterans courts experience is another aspect we have to work on. i want to invite all colleagues to join senator cornyn and i in working on that measure. we've worked together successfully before on the reentry measures that are part of the fencing reform bill. and we hope very much to get a
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significant peace of legislation put together. what i would ask the witnesses to do is to share with us what from your experience you think are the best practical models that you have seen. whether in your own stated own jurisdiction or whether because this is your field of inquiry you are aware of really good examples are taking place in other states and other jurisdictions around the country. i will ask that as a question for the record if you all do not mind. there'll be a week or so after the close of the hearing when chairman booker will allow written answers to questions for the record. and if you do not mind writing down a brief summary of behavioral the best way for engaging in this population in
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dealing with de-escalation. we would love to know because the broader the support is really good examples the base for legislation growth and senate is more likely we can get something done. real gratitude to all the witnesses each of whom went to this hearing and the extent she would not mind supplementing that with a list of what you think best practices are out there. i think we would be very grateful as we pull this legislation together. chairman booker thank you for this terrific hearing, i will yield back whatever time i have remaining. >> center whitehouse i'm grateful for your -- there'll be a lot of rich contributions from the witnesses that we can work with you to make that bill goes a long way to get
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what our witnesses are urgently needed we appreciate satterwhite houses leadership. there's no other democrats online want to jump to ms. morgan is a little bit of a shadow cast on the work that cahoots doesn't some of the testimony. i am wondering, can you give me a characterization how many instances the hoots response to a chair and how many of them to responders call police for backup? and can you characterize those moments when i think it was representative by other witnesses one out of every 60 or so times you guys call for backup. could you give some light on that data point? and also talk to us a little bit, what happens when the call for police. >> absolutely. so the total amount of calls
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we were dispatched to 2019, which is her most recent data ends up to be about 17% of the calls. or, just over 17000. 17700. on those calls we requested police backup about 1.5 almost% of the time. and of those calls that we did call for backup the 311, the culture code three cover which is about 5% of the time. spirit could you be more specific to what that means? "three coverage means in that exact moment we believe there's an imminent threat to someone, ourselves, the client , that we are going to need air police response for
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immediately. the part of what makes this program work is that we have that access by curing the police radios if the situation either escalates or the situation that came to us but is appropriate for law enforcement response we can request them and they can come quickly. what might have us determined we need a law enforcement response is typically going to be safety related. we are consent -based program. because we do not have the authority of law enforcement to take anybody's rights away. the people can choose whether 2ingage with us or not. if they choose not to but are not behaving in a safe way we can out the be unsafe. that is where we might end up bringing in law enforcement. specs are saved to see a fraction of the time 1.7, you call for police and eight fraction of that is because it imminent harm or danger to other people. >> correct. >> got it. : : :
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we may have a program and the problem is that there's not enough capacity. and the brand-new hotline, there
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has to be a capacity in those systems to sufficiently handle calls that could be instead of calling 911 go 298843 triage. we need enough resources so that we can stand up sufficient mobile capacity so the police can respond immediately. the mobile crisis teams, it will fall again to the police response, so they need to have that capacity and then there needs to be sorted that connects that. their and a mental health program that can receive that and then began to serve that person. all of that trying to the vertebrates and back upstream so quickly you will be asked this in writing, you are now talking about the senator from new jersey, three things, give them
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to me really quickly. >> i think that we need additional federal medicaid dollars, the match of state dollars that we can provide capacity to have the services out there, there is some of that and more linkages to upstream services and some of that is funding and a lot of that is matching dollars and some of it is rapidly having linkages to housing situations as well because much of the is part of this. >> that is my experience as well, and that is really insightful. i would like to again thank you for your incredible service as well as your leadership. building on the things before, tell me does respond in a cause with people in crisis or mental illness number of law enforcement resources? is an adrenaline a drain on your ability to focus your department on other areas where you can
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keep people safe. >> yes, as i indicated in my testimony and we have also indicated the percentage of 911 calls coming into law enforcement somewhere around 10 to 10 and that is time spent away from addressing more traditional matters related to public disorder and the private sector. and these kinds of calls handled properly or not part of it. the police officers were very intentional about this, educating the officers, spending time with these calls, because we do not want to have them to come back and the response
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center and we really endeavor to get these folks to the treatment that they need and the reality is that i just want to say that we need to meet the demands of the population. >> jumping really quickly, one thing we haven't talk to too much about his peer support and how powerful that could be. could you just give me quickly why you think this is so important in behavioral health care and what function does it serve? >> yes, i appreciate the question, peer support is essential. that is all i can say. you know, the first time that i met a peer, i thought okay, wow, i could really get somebody who is been through what i have been through and, you know, evidence
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has shown if you have training, those that are certified, those that can really support people, especially in times of crisis to help identify what is going on and it's the sounds sound that we have heard from other people giving testimony about how it's important to slow things down in order for people to make their needs known, especially as they are in crisis and then also to help get connected to the resources that they need to support the training and the peer supporters also use other evidence tools and mechanisms to do so. one of the things that i think is critically important are things like wellness and recovery action plan which can help people to understand when are things starting to break down in order to prevent a crisis and then develop a plan for what happens if they do.
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and that includes families supporting other families and is also another critically important step so families and parents have a better kind of understanding of how to support loved ones and are in crisis and so having peers on mobile crisis teams, being able to help support them in the field, having them as part of the workforce response is also a huge situation that people can call when they need support, they can take their time to help with some of the triage and work with people immediately, there is another way that they can be used and lastly people need places to go, it might be fine but you can get this they are, but what about where the people golfing in someplace safe to go
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and peer support is totally underutilized and under funded and if there were more peer support where people can go and have this 24/7 and get that possible situation look bad, it is critically important and needs to be part of the crisis response. >> also resonating about the power of supportive housing with people that are there in the senator had attended this on the floor of the united states senate, just let folks to let folks know he is going to get his questioning and then we are going to the senator and i think that we are going to end it at that point throughout the hearing and i'm honored to turn over to my ranking member now smack thank you to all the
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witnesses and we are all at the mercy and i'm all about the colleagues on the subcommittee have great interest and we appreciate your appearance here and i would like to start with you with what happened to your husband is a tragedy just because it was so preventable, if it wasn't for the criminal efforts that released dangerous criminals over and over again we wouldn't have officers like your husband with the same kind of dangerous arrests. you mentioned the extensive training and testified law enforcement as well, do you find the training available helps to protect not only officers but the suspects that they encounter? >> they say that the training is necessary, it takes me back to
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this and there's just not enough time and they need immediate response, i don't know how long it would take to get this and isolate the police are always going to be the first ones to respond and then maybe they can go from there and they can get a mental health worker in their, but i couldn't get someone to come out and change the lights on the corner for two days, it could take hours and how long does it take to get there in the police are the first ones to read reach a deal with the situation at hand immediately and they can assess it from there, but the response time is probably not realistic. >> and your experience in law enforcement and your husband and
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your entire families with budgets that are tying, is training often the first thing that gets cut? >> i would say so, yes, definitely, they have to, it is just unfortunate and also across the country, the police officers, people are retiring, they are not joining the academy right now, all of this on the we are in trouble, it's a number that's too low due to the concerns of not having the support and the overall funding of the police and if you need help, you are calling the police and they need to have all training possible in many different situations smack thank you. i wanted to talk to the sheriff again, 97% of the inmates in her jail on felony charges committing serious crimes also
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receiving some sort of mental health care. is it fair to say that many also have mental health issues and it can put some people in danger, and some only have a police response to these incidents and others have a nonpolice response and a lot of those are mental health services and of course the concern is that we have a dual diagnosis going on, not only do they have criminal behavior, they have the mental health behavior as well as may be substance abuse issue and these are calls that i testified to, they are very dynamic and factual and law enforcement does come into contact with this,
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they have to take enforcement action, for example the deputies that we lost in the line of duty at the hands of a mentally ill person was when the person came right out of the vehicle and shot the deputy as they were approaching and the other was a burglary in progress and that the person also has a mental illness and they are very dynamic and we are coming into contact with these individuals who are also mentally ill. >> thank you. i would like to return to ms. o'connor and again express my deepest condolences and sympathy for your loss as well as my gratitude for your testimony today. i know that this must've been a
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hard day to tell your story. may the memory of your husband and your loving marriage always be a blessing to you and also those that loved him. >> thank you. >> thank you that i would like to turn to the senator who is on remotely. >> thank you, mr. chair. my first question, i want to just thank you for openly sharing your experience on living with mental illness. it is only by talking about it and it's about understanding and awareness of the mental health conditions and what is
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associated with that. and certainly when we are talking about public policy and the services it is want to acknowledge that appointment and in your testimony, we are talking about your personal experience and what i would like to hear more about how bad is impacting your mental health as well as your general well-being. >> thank you for the question. you know, speaking of been speaking out especially as an african-american because i couldn't find anybody like females talking about their personal story and diagnosis specific to this.
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and i had to ask permission from my father because he started this and he and my mom are no longer living and the rest of my family truthfully i wouldn't be here and the impact of that first experience, i was wearing a pair of my beloved red doc marten shoes and i love those shoes, my first pair, takes forever to break them in, they were broken in and i was wearing them on that day and they were ripped from my feet as people were struggling with me trying to subdue me to participate in what i didn't understand was happening. and it wasn't about my mental illness but seeing people that look like me in my past treated awfully and having bad outcomes. i didn't want to be a victim. i just did not.
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that is what i was really fighting against. so what that led to his i never wore those red shoes again. and now i have about 20 pairs of them, but at the time i did not wear them ever again because i wasn't willing to accept treatment, especially when i was not at my best. every hospitalization was involved and didn't involve the police coming to take into the hospital because i thought that that's what it was like to go to a psychiatric hospital and so i didn't want to have anything to do with that. and so my heart is racing because it still brings up a ton of memories and drama on top of having an illness in which you are trying to recover, no one should have to experience that.
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>> you hit the right words at iris anticipating. there was additional, someone with his art he looking to overcome this mental health condition and you are right in communities of color, especially, we don't talk about this. and so then i have a follow-up question because there is also the flipside to this point and as i have come to learn in recent years, and please correct me if i am incorrect, but in law enforcement there are more sworn officers who die by suicide every year than lose their lives and the line of duty. please correct me if i am wrong.
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so i would like to talk a few minutes about the psychological tool and other first responder experiences and suggestions on how to acknowledge that and build that into training and support. >> thank you, senator. and the secondary, is a very serious issue as has been highlighted and it's incumbent upon police departments to develop very robust employee assistance programs and ensure that those resources are confidential and available to law enforcement because those family members often times live with the baggage that the officers bring home. so very intentionally we have to
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understand a culture and cultivate a culture where we recognize that secondary, is going to occur and that officers do need to talk about it and there's a well-developed system that they know how to access and real-time when they are struggling. and not every department is doing very well at that. and so it is also a responsibility that as we assess the state of the profession here in this moment in history that has to be dealt with. so thank you for your attention. >> thank you, topic of ongoing conversation. >> senator, i am grateful that i'm going to now adjourn the hearing. i'm sorry, what is that we met. >> sorry, senator i'm told that you are online. >> no problem, my friend, thank you for what holding this
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hearing and thank you to the panel i know that we have votes, so i will do my best to be concise and in response to an increase in mental health recalls airing the pandemic, brookhaven, georgia pioneered a coresponder response system that said that this has helped to de- escalate situations involving individuals suffering from mental illness who made be involved in contact with law enforcement or calls to 911 and how the responder programs might help to de- escalate such interactions and ensure that neither public safety or the safety and health of those suffering from mental illness is
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jeopardized when law enforcement responds with those calls. >> thank you, senator, i think the coresponder here is standard, we have a hearing in baltimore, we understand that it is operational seven days a week, only eight hours a day, and it is working and responsible for the entire city of baltimore during that eight hour shift and it's paired with a highly trained officer. and they respond some of these most acute things. what it does allow us to do is as pointed out earlier in officer in the field able to respond and get back quickly and they don't have to determine that amount of time.
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but in order to do that scale, there has to be more funding they are fantastic, the de- escalate when they refer to community-based services to get these consumers that need that. >> thank you, sir, at like to ask you a couple questions about necessary investments in mental health services in georgia and across the country and first of all, to be clear i have not seen any evidence of that is the anyone else in the population, according to the national alliance of mental health, studies have shown that those that suffer are much more likely to be victims of violent crimes and at least according to some research individuals with untreated mental illness who do come in contact with one oarsman
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in emergency situations are more likely to be killed in the encounter and i would like to hear from you with your view on the importance of increasing the national investment in mental health care services as well as what kind of social services you think are neglected and lacking across the country. >> yes, thank you. definitely since the institutionalization and the mental health care services and community-based services have never been fully funded, they are woefully underfunded. and in order to kind of bring up and backup the ecosystem, which includes times when people are in crisis, we need to look at the whole system are there
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anything else that they want? most important way they want to work and many are told to go on disability so we could fully fund the system and it is not fully funded and that includes family respite and families sometimes also need a respite
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and that includes helping to support their loved ones, the other things are mobile crisis teams that do include a behavior health professional and also community supported that are not even part of the system and that they may go to their church or barbershop. and most importantly, how are you going to do that. housing is critical and for people that have substance abuse disorders, and that includes for
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them to work far better together. and lastly i had another one and i forgot it. thank you. and i'm going to ask you for the record to respond to a more general inquiry. the vastness of the fbi director or senior positions as well as in discussions with leaders in georgia about the increase in violent crime particularly during this pandemic and the causes and what you assess to be a significant increase in the murder rate in atlanta where we have seen a higher rate of violent crimes in columbus and in other parts of the national
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dynamic and that includes what is causing this increase in violent crimes and i thank all of our witnesses for the testimony of mr. chairman, i yield. >> i agree, i want to give a lot of gratitude to all the witnesses this is a crisis in our country and solutions. i apologize for the vote is expiring, so i'm going to sprint and run, but i'm reminding everyone the questions for the record are doing one week and the record will be open for one week or statements and letters and any other contribution to the incredible witnesses would like to make to the constructive work of the united states senate and the judiciary committee. so i thank you very much and i appreciate it and i hope that you have a good day.
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.. .. .. >> c-span's washington journal. every day, we are taking your calls live on the air on news of the day and discuss policy issues that impact you. sunday morning, the manhattan institute and police reform efforts in the wake of the
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mondale died monday. memorial services will be held in september in d.c. and in minnesota. mr. mondale first came to washington dc in 1964 as a u.s. editor from desoto. he served for 12 years, until he became jimmy carter's running mate in the 1976 presidential election. after serving one term as vice president, mr. mondale launched his own presidential campaign in 1984. he lost to incumbent president ronald reagan. nearly a decade later, mr. mondale would become u.s. ambassador to -- u.s. ambassador to japan during the clinton administration from 1993-1996. walter mondale died at the age of 93. next on c-span, a 2007 conversation between historian richard norton smith and the former vice president


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