tv Confirmation Hearing for Customs Border Protection Commissioner CSPAN October 25, 2021 12:10pm-12:40pm EDT
>> it's sort of like the cartels are playing three-dimensional chess while we are playing checkers cause this is part of their business model and of course last year alone more than 90,000 americans died of drug overdoses. most of those drugs came across the southern border as you know . >> i thank my colleague. next is senator thune. >> thank you mister chairman and mister magnus, welcome. let me start by asking questions dealing with sanctuary cities. user 10 years at the california bay area next to san francisco which is a well-known actuary city that flout us immigration law and refuses hto cooperate with immigration enforcement agents. you confirm you will receive the enforcement of immigration law at our borders. do you support sanctuary
cities and what message do sanctuary cities send to those seeking to enter the united states illegally. >> thank you for the question. and as the chief for two decades my first and foremost irony has always been public safety and so i appreciate how decisions around sanctuary cities are ultimately political decisions but as a police chief and certainly in this position were i to be confirmed first and primary obligation is to follow the law. that's what i've done in the past and that's what i would commit to doing goingforward . >> but the follow-up on the question senator cornyn raised this is similar i think in some respects to sanctuary cities but invited administration is circumventing immigration law and issuing these so-called notices to report leaked documents show there are tens
of thousands of migrants admitted to the united states with you legal requirements other than to check in with customs enforcement wherever and whenever they reach their destinationin the states . do you believe that lax enforcement of our immigration laws intensify those pull factors for immigrants or migrants that g are receiving entry into the united states? >> 90 for the question. as we discussed i think that the issue of notice to appear is something that we want to achieve in any manner we can certainly are different agencies working together. by having more asylum officers and immigration judges. this is not a new challenge in many ways. it has been true in multiple administrations and it's going to take for the most part a congressional
fix because we really do have a broken system and unfortunately there continue to be a long waits for court dates in order to get people appropriately processed and until those things can be resolved i fear that we're going to continue to be in a difficult situation. >> the system is broken, no question about that and i think everybody would knowledge that. all you have to do is look at the statistics in the last few months. it's a staggering frankly just disintegration of the border really and for all intents and purposes it is to describe an open border which creates all kinds of bad things, bad things that happen in this country but the wrong type of incentives. and this issue of not enforcing immigration laws that already exist to me is a major artifact. i understand your suggestion
that we need to fix a broken immigration system but we do have laws on the books that are being enforced and what i'm trying to ask you is if you think those not enforcing or lax enforcement of immigration laws does intensify thatwhole factor . people respond to incentives. it's that simple and if the incentives suggest you can come here illegally and there is no consequence to that, but i think more people will come here illegally,would you not agree with that ? >> i agree that enforcing the law is necessary and appropriate. the numbers are high. as law enforcement official i again will pledge to enforce the law. >> history quickly because my time is about up here but on the supply chain issue as you know that, under unprecedented strain. and we've got agricultural
producers across the country including my home state of south dakota continue to harvest their crops and worry the supply chain is to constrain access to their process. as commissioner how would you work with stakeholders to improve validity and resolve this issue and perhaps you could quickly touch on how some of these union rules play into that and are helping contribute to these systemic delays. >> senator, could not agree more that supply chain especially at the time were in right now is critical and so addressing the movement of goods through the ports in any way possible to expedite that is something that is going to be important. obviously this is going to require working withthe board of directors . it's going to require close relationships and continued work with groups like prozac and other business groups.
both large and small. i don't think there's a simple solution but if confirmed in this position cbp is going to continue to work very hard around this issue. >> thank you mister chairman my time is expired. >> thank you mister chairman and chief magnus first of all thank you for your public service and cethank you for your willingness to take on thisextremely challenging position . i've listened to your responses to the questions in regards to border enforcement . and certainly i agree that we need to enforce our laws. i've also heard a response in regards to the matter in which we enforce our laws. and there are a lot of desperate people who show up at our borders. many have legitimate claims in entering the united states . we have families that show up at our borders.
we have unaccompanied minors that show up at our borders so i'd like to give you a chance to explain you would balance enforcement of our laws with the enforcement of our values. which america has been the leader in the world during a time where we have more displaced people and we've had since world war ii. so could you just explain to me your own personal philosophy on how you're going to balance enforcement of our laws with the enforcement of our values? >> thank you for that question because even as we spoke about the numbers being high , there is no question that we wehave to meet the challenge of asylum obligations and also the security of our borders. and i think can be done in a manner that is yes, absolutely more efficient. we can do a better job and how individuals are processed
but key to this is that it is done humanely. i don't believe that we have to sacrifice efficiency for many. and so i think humanity has to be part of the discussion. again early in and often throughout the careers of cvd members this is something we talk a lot about in policing. we do our jobs enforcing the law but how we engage with the public even the public that we may be arresting is what defines us as professionals esand this is something that we have a moral obligation to do. >> thank you for that response and i'd encourage you to respond to the need for training which i strongly agree with. a lot of times those
challenges become difficult and is part of our responsibility to ensure you have resources but one of the major challenges we had in policing in recent decades is discriminatory profiling. it's really turns communities against law enforcement when we use discriminatory profiling. it's inefficient, it's wrong and if you have specific information obviously identifiers are important but to characterize individuals by race or religion or discriminatory issues is just wrong. i'd like to again get your view as to how you would receive with training to make sure that the agency that you lead does not use discriminatory profiling as a method of enforcement. >> thank you for the question and i could not agree more. profiling is wrong. this is an area where yes,
training is critical. it has to involve more than just a policy need on the page. it has to involve scenario-based training. it has to involve discussion and then people have to see as they work their way through their careers that this is something that's modeled appropriately by theirsupervisors and others . so i think there are ways to train more effectively that involve including a community in training.ud bringing in people who have profile and having them share their experiences. these are things that we have done in the department that i've worked in and i think we can address this issue. >> let me reinforce the comments of the chair and others in regards to enforcement of our trade laws whether it's the anti-dumping
countervailing duties, whether it's child labor issues, either its intellectual property violations we need to have a working relationship with the agency as to how we strategize in enforcing our trade laws through border enforcement. i really want to underscore the importance of us working together on that to develop a strategy and i would welcome your recommendations to our committee as to what tools you need to better enforce our trade laws. thank you mister chairman. >> senator carter ibelieve is online . >> good morning, thanks for joining us and thanks for a lifetime of service and your willingness to serve in this important role. thank you for this hearing and the chance to have your nomination debated . like a lot of my colleagues i've been trained as leaders since childhood in boy scouts . and i also bought the most
important ingredient in the successful humanity in the private sector is the most important ingredient of all for success of the organization and i think if i'm not mistaken cbp has lacked the leadership or at least a senate confirmed leader since april2019 . that's like almost 2 and a half years. and as you know dvd is our nation's largest law enforcement agency with 50,000 employees. should you be confirmed you'll be managing the 60,000 n men and your leadership will be central not only to those in cvt workforce but the success of cvd effectively in the department as a whole and to that end could you take a moment to lead us off with sharing how your experience with prior policing roles as chip your leadership style. during his take on this role. >> thank you for the question
. i have been very fortunate to work in several different police agencies of different sizes in different communities. and one of the things that is most valuable about that is being able to come in and look at things with a fresh set of eyes. being able to ask the question why. being able to see got the right people to gain information from. talking to officers at the ground level. building new partnerships in each place that i worked. these are all things that i think i would want to bring as a priority if confirmed to this position. i think that i'm pragmatic person. i like to take a commonsense approach to things . and i think k when you are
willing to continually learn no matter how much time you have in the field i like to think of it as intellectual humility. i think it makes for an effective leadership style and i think it helps you some exciting things done. >> thank you for that response. i'm going to ask you about immigration reform, something we cannot talk enough about that for years i've worked with colleagues on both sides of the eye in order to try to achieve a comprehensive immigration reform but unfortunately we still face a number of issues in our immigration system that need to be addressed. men and women of cvd are reon the front line each day confronting the challenges created by an immigration system in need of reform and to that and what issue do you predict cbp will face given the need to address reform by ournation's immigration policies and procedures ?
how would you work to make sure these challenges are heard and addressed at all levels of the agency? >> senator, thank you for the question. i think it's been particularly difficult to be a cbp agent and certainly a border patrol agent in the recent past . i think as laws and policies change, it is necessary to continue to reinforce the idea that professionals as in policing and forced the law. and so to the degree of how i can help depoliticize this process and build in resiliency as a key for helping our men and women, hard-working men and women of the border patrol do their
jobs, these are things i'd like to tackle. i think immigration reform as you say. >> i'm forecasted to hold it right there and we will allow you to answer. real quick question, the border enforcement priorities include recent border process do they not? p >> could you repeat the question. >> september 30 border enforcement priority included if i'm not mistaken since border fosters do they not? can you the folks no longer subject to deportation please? >> i'm sorry senator, it's a little difficult to quite make out what you're asking? >> the secretary of border and forced priorities include recent border priorities, do they not?
>> i'm not sure because i'm having trouble understanding the question and i'd like to be able to respond back toyou in writing . >> it would be welcome to do that . we look forward to debating your credentials and i think they're excellent and i hope to have an opportunity to vote for you on the floorsoon . >> iq senator carver, senator langford. s>> thanks for dropping by the office yesterday. let meset context year because i want to ask the larger question . the big issue is what are you going to do, what's the plan? right now we're facing this year the highest number of illegal crossing interactions ever in the history of our country. that is after october november december january there are low numbers but mysteriously starting in february all the way to the
present numbers have ac skyrocketed. we have tripled the number of people each year crossing the border illegally and we had in october november december and january. the highest amount of methamphetamines thcrossing our border, the hihighest number of fentanyl crossing our border in the history of our country. we have as you described ed yesterday what the public hates, chaoson our southern border . you've described herself as not an open borders guy which i appreciate. the big question we've got to resolve into this role is you're walking into a chaotic situation. have the highest number of illegal crossings in the history of our country. what is your plan? >> thank you for the question and of course if there was a ready to go plan to address all the problems that you've just described, my guess is that not only cbp but you all as a body would have seen to it that it was implemented.
i think that key to answering your question is going to be the importance of collaboration. building relationships. i think it's going to be important that the individuals who are making policy decisions which obviously y include the secretary and the president and others, that they get accurate feedback from me based on what i'm seeing in terms of talking to the men and women at the border. in terms of talking to people in border communities . i think getting that accurate information and as i pledge to you yesterday my commitment is to be an honest broker around how this works is going to be very important in terms of formulating a plan. that's something i want to be
part of in this discussion. >> let me drill down more and that's how do you evaluate whether it successful reducing the chaos? is that we move people across the border faster? as a secretary mayorkas was in front of the committee's statement is where getting much more that are, where moving people into the country faster. where getting them across the border faster. my basic question from a law-enforcement perspective is your chief law enforcement officer in this role leaving a lot of law-enforcement votes is yourgoal to facilitate faster transition from people crossing the border into our country or is it to prevent people that are illegally crossing our country from coming into our country ? >> senator thank you for the question. i think it has to be some of both. we are always going to have some degree of people crossing the border.
this has been the case for years that we've had surges and so ... >> we've never had a surge like this. this is the highest number ever in the history of our country. >> i understand your concerns and i don't agree i agree that the numbers are high but the bottom line remains that first and foremost we need to enforce the law and secondly we need to have boa process that's humane and efficient so we can deal with those who or are coming across the border whether it be to seek asylum or for other purposes. i think again to some degree we have to have both . >> what i'm trying to drill down on is i understand there's both but the role of alaw-enforcement officer is to enforce the law. we do it better than anyone else in the world . so for us, we focus on humane treatment of individuals whether they commit a crime
or don't commit a crime but we are working with the deterrence method. right now it doesn't feel like we are deterring activity, it looks like we're encouraging it and from the cartel perspective there making a tremendous amount of money incentivizing people to be able to come and we continue to see record numbers month after month. so the border has large gaps in fencing south of your house . they're in arizona where literally theadministration stopped on january 20 and left huge gaps in the fence . the asylum policy is being treated different. courts have said they need to put back in the migrant protection protocols. the administration has yet to nsbe able to do that. there's not been a clear way to articulate asylum. all of those things together have left a border that is ha very porous and all i'm trying to figure out is what is the plan both with the fencing, how were going to
handle asylum, what the alternative to title 42. what we're doing with people crossing the border as single individuals, families. there doesn't seem to be a working solution even whenthe courts have stepped in and said you have to put in migrant protection protocols sethe administration has yet to do it . >> the time of the gentleman has expired. >> thank you chair and ranking member for this hearing and thank you chief for 42 years of service in public safety and for your willingness to serve in this critical role with border protection and thank you as well to your family because this kind of service is a family effort so i appreciate your sacrifice. i want to start with a question on border and immigration enforcement. october 30, 2021 homeland security secretary mayorkas issued a memo containing guidelines for border immigration enforcement. the secretary's memo provides
guidance not only to us customs and border protection cvd, agency you've been nominated to lead but also to immigrations and customs enforcement and citizenship and immigration services . in his memo the secretary stated threats to national security, public safety and border security would be priorities for border and immigration enforcement. chief, we talked about this during our one-on-one meeting . do you agree that t individuals charged with serious crimes not just those with prior convictions can pose a threat to public c safety and do you agree it's important that dhs personnel have the discretion to detain individuals are a threat to security or public safety. >> thank you for the question and no question if we're looking at this from the public safety standpointthe answer has to be yes . >> now onto an issue of counter narcotics. part of the very important cbp mission.
as we discussed during our private meeting the substance abuse epidemic is ravaging my state of new hampshire and is ravaging arizona and communities across the country. customs and border protection as an important role in disrupting international drug smuggling operations and interdicting the flow of drugs across the us border. transnational criminal organizations are adapting and exploiting predictable procedures at usborders . they used rail transportation pedestrians, unmanned aerial vehicles and even submersible vessels to smuggle drugs into the united states. chief magnus as a police chief f of border community how have you prioritize and thought drug organizations undermining your community and if confirmed to leave what wouldyou do to fight international drug trafficking ? >> you very much for the question and your touching on an issue here that is really near and dear to my heart because only members of our community and tucson not to
mention across the state and country have died as a result of opioid overdoses. i think this battle has to be fought on multiple fronts. i will tell you in tucson, we have a collaborative effort called a counter narcotics alliance it involves not only state and local partners but our federal partners as well. and i think this type of collaboration is essential. but i think we also have to use every available means at our ports of entry where we know a great majority of these drugs are coming across to use technology and other resources more effectively to address these drives and then there's s the area touched on previously related to e-commerce where me know that there are many opioids and precursors of such that are
coming through these small packages and many times through the postal service because of relationships that are complicated involving china and so this is an area i know where editor portman and others have put a good deal of work into the top act . and cbp plays an important role in enforcing that. so as i said there are a whole series of ways in which we can i think always do more . to address this surge. >> thank you and i was going to ask about the importance of new technologies on the border. and you've touched on that and i just will ask you please, if you are confirmed to please let congress know if there are additional resources or technologies cbp needs to strengthen border security because that's going to be medically important especially in the counter narcotics mission .
>> you senator, we will do that. >> one last topic. cbp secures the border from dangerous people and securing the flow of ntravel. i was glad we ended the travel restriction that the canadian border which will help the company rebound. the opening of the canadian border to vaccinated individuals is an important and long overdue step. given your background in law enforcement including your time in the border community makes you important to the mission of cbp but how important are youwith the trade mission and how will you prioritize that mission . >> thank you for the question and you are correct, not only in my time growing up in michigan but also in the 16 and a half years i spent in north dakota where one of the right cross-border traffic to canada's also essential alfor a
whole host of reasons. it causes me to believe that this is going to be very important even as both the laws and rules change regarding title 42. so whether it's appropriate staffing to address these issues other factors that need to be considered i am very committed to this cross-border traffic and trade. >> thank you mister chair. >> thank you and we're going to be following up on those issues. they're incredibly important. senator gaines isnext . >>. >> chief magnus, if you are confirmed in thisposition , you will be at the helm of the largest law enforcement agency in the united states and have the opportunity booktv.org ... >> we will leave this program at this time and take you
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