tv History of the 1944 GI Bill CSPAN October 12, 2021 1:00am-2:01am EDT
c-span history for more this date in history posts. .. >> and the assistant director of public engagement for the national world war ii museum thank you for joining us for two nights webinar on how the v.a. assisted veterans from world war ii this program is a part of the 75th anniversary of the commemoration that is sponsored by the department of defense. you may not think of the v.a. to be a significant part but the rapid expansion starting 1944 with the g.i. bill what impact over 12 million servicemembers returning home
starting in 1945 the biggest question in of course this was forefront in fdr mind to help reintroduce servicemembers to the workforce the latest g.i. bill on june 22nd 2 support housing and education benefits along with unemployment insurance. literally the day after the japanese surrender harry truman would appoint omar bradley august 15, 1945, two days before the anniversary to oversee the veterans administration. to be instrumental in expanding the veterans for what we know today as a largest integrated healthcare
system in the united states providing care of over 1200 healthcare facilities with 170 the medical centers in 1000 outpatient. now to hear more to veterans care and benefits immediately following world war ii we are joined today byd historians for the health administration. >> we are so glad to have you. so the historian at the veterans benefits administration will discuss the legacy we also have katie
and how it revolutionized medical care for veterans. and as a 75th anniversary of the modern era of medicine and those during this time. so thank you for joining us today. >> it's a pleasure to be with you tonight. i cannot be there but at least i can be present. >> thank you to the museum for helping us. >> we are excited to talk about something that means so much to a lot of americans.
and really world war ii help to accelerate what we know today is veterans benefits. before we jump into the questions we have for you today would like to remind our audience there will be times of questions and answers at the end of the program. if you have questions for the panel in the q&a section on zoom or as a comment on the facebook video stream. we went to remind your audiences program is designed to look at the rapid growth and impact at the end of world war ii. if you have any questions related to eligibilityr and benefits, please contact your local v.a. so what sort of benefits did the government offer veterans for those wars that came before world war ii? >> by way of a general introduction, i am a historian for the veterans administration that form the
v.a. and is in charge of the different benefits programs these are compensation, pension, veterans readiness to disabled veterans a job training and placement, insurance. compensation and pension programs and compensation was offered to servicemembers during the war and then to compensate to earning ability and then pensions are offered more generally to anyone who served during the american
revolution who wires in need of financial support from the government. the pension program came after the war about 30 years when veterans were aging while the compensation program was offered during the war. those are the two oldest programs and those remain the main benefit programs the government offered to veterans through the 19th century and world war i there were several new benefits programs for the first time that offered subsidized insurance for permanent disability and then given the option to convert to term insurance. and vocational training for veterans who are disabled to help train them so they can return to the workforce and resume productive lives. they also offered extended medical care through a system
of government owned hospitals run first by a public health service and then by the veterans bureau and by the veterans administration. those me benefits were in place world war ii. now world war i veterans they felt like they got a raw deal in addition to the programs he mentioned also given $60 with payment upon discharge. and with some pocket money to make the adjustment that and the demand for labor. wages have been high and those by comparison missed out on that. they do not make enough and for those who do not have to serve during the war. so the american legion that is back ater it hundred thousand members push congress to make an additional payment for
veterans. and then offering up at $600 depending if they served overseas or not. but it could not be reading for another 20 years. as veterans werehe thrown out of work they did press congress to allow them to redeem those certificates immediately and when congress and the president said no, about 20000 veterans marched on washington accompanied by 50000 family members to make their case. and then it resulted in a few does and then president hoover decided to send an army to evict the veterans and it was a disaster.
and it is a huge calamity. and then world war ii came around in the mobilization of manpower and the scale never before seen and with more of social unrest on veteran employment. and also in germany and then to be very fearful going into the war. >> absolutely. it's really fascinating to see the background, or the benefits and how they had the fall over the years before world war ii.
so closing that question on the medical side, what are the origins of veterans healthcare in this country? what did veterans hospitals look like before world war ii? and that helps inspire? >> the origins but the establishment for those civolunteer soldiers the first nation provided healthcare to its veterans. and then throughout the country milwaukee, dayton, one in maine, and they provided medical and holistic care to
veterans they had grounds at hospital recreational buildings and was met for this lifelong care veterans and then located in rural areas because honest attractive land and plenty of fresh air but they were also meant to keep the men away from temptation of alcohol and gambling and found in larger cities of those are the origins and as you progress so after world war i you can see the model change you don't have that lifelong care aspect but a
more rehabilitative model that returns to society and you also have that component as well this is during that time of tuberculosis tuberculosis respiratory diseases happened happening with world war i so then you have the more broad spread out campuses from the second world war to deal with illnesses as well. and more like any other scale in history to see the 16 million veterans returning home from the war and half a million need immediate medical care. that is just do to advances in
battlefieldn medicine to treat soldiers on the spot and they were able to survive that was not survivable before see how this influx at a level you have never seen before. and needed to be a new place to handle the greater influx. >> i never really considered the fact that medicine has evolved so much by world war ii it did require a different approach. said going back to jeff looking at benefits why did they decide the g.i. bill was necessary who authored it and what did it do for americans? >> as a said before american leaders were fearful of
large-scale employment from world war i and with so many servicemembers driving up unemployment rates and then back into a great depression and also worried and then roosevelt with the mobilization and then to establish a second committee. for service personnel and with those fireside chats unemployment veterans and with the educational assistance.
and with the main american legion to craft their own solution to handle that mobilization of 16 million people. and with the former legislative committee and a prominent republican and what g.i. bill a member of the american legion g.i. joe wayne g.i. jane the american legion launched support and then with a lot of changes for what became the g.i. bill that we know today
it was a service man readjustment act that tells you what the bill is assigned to do and then there are just four main provisions to the bill half a billion dollars for construction of hospitals and other facilities which i'm sure katie can talk about and tile of the services of us employment service for job placement then to play the annualg tuition and what the veterans were receiving and then with a loan guarantee of home farm and businesses the government would guarantee 50 percent of the allowed to cap the interest rate which is a very good rate that made homeownership affordable and
attainable for a big swath of returning veterans is of the main components of the g.i. bill. >> and just to hear something and that's what forms the basis of major legislation that has impacted so many servicemembers and going back to kde august 1945 general omar bradley is placed at the v.a. so what challenges does he face when he takes on the new position? and with that administration. >> and who does he decide to partnerar with?
>> and to go half a million immediate medical care coming out ofco world war ii. so that 100 hospitals that are spread out across the country and mostly rural areas and then to say they were hampered by amp civil servant regulations. and the situation is bad with the backwaters of medicine so it is clear there needs to be some sort of change those needing healthcare and
services. and then to take on the situation to center and then into battle itua is very personal for him to ensure the way home and taking care of. he's a little hesitant to take h on the job remember fdr called the hardest job in washington as the v.a. administrator you can tell he has some trepidations but therere are loyaltiess and then to see on august 15 with a victory over japan day with no time to waste so he brings on the chief surge of the european theater theater and then to
have no time to deal with it any of these washington bureaucracies. and you can really tell he needs it now. and then the other v.a. physicians starts to take the challenge on even though they knew it will be difficult. >> funny how things never change in washington. >> and to make it controversial with that congress approval and even public opinion. >> that's a good question. and then to encounter that was tricky for fdr. republicans gained a huge number of seats in the
election and then to have common cause with conservative democrats in the south to hear about the expansion of the new deal. that thisle was not like a new entitlement program but designed specifically for those from world war ii you have to use these benefits within a set period of timene and then they go away with a one-time special program and also-t with the services and sacrifices the one provision of the bill with unemployment benefits the most controversial aspects. and then just to live off the government for a year.
and then with the southern congressman with the african-american veterans and almost derailed the bill at the last minute to forge ahead and get it passed then it did passed unanimously in both houses it's on widespread public support but what will this bill do? with the different divisions going into effect. >> definitely. 's you have general omar bradley in place so what are those proposals for change that came out of them taking the helm on the medical side
quick. > i have three major proposals that they work through first they want to uncouple the hiring process which allows them to hire a younger and innovative workforce in touch with current medicine and medical practices more quickly and i believe before they were only allowed to hire within the civil service system to hire those over 60 years old so also to forge partnerships to allow them to take advantage of the research and capabilities also gaining a workforce to assist veteran patients and then lastly the
other big proposal was an entire generation of hospitals i talked before about those that were rural and following the first world war but in planning the third-generation hospital they needed ones that were closer to major population centers in the major medical school looking to partner with so you have a whole new generation of hospitals being built in a large set h of money set aside would be the largest proposed construction project in american history and what those would look like would be larger and more skyscraper style
buildings and i urge everybody to do research on their own to see what they look like from each generation but those are the large proposals for handling veterans after the second world war. >> absolutely. thinking about the return home the g.i. bill is passed so what are the short-term effects of the g.i. bill and how did it help veterans transition into civilian life? >> unemployment benefits provided a safety net for the man's large numbers would use it so they would avoid looking for work and only 60% ended up claiming the benefit using it for 20 weeks so that was very
successful. education benefits prior to world war ii college is attended by americans on the upper, middle to hire end economic spectrum in the g.i. bill changed opening the door to higher education for broader swaths of the population and at the end one in 8 returning veterans used the g.i. bill to attend college or graduate will sufficient afford the tuition, the most expensive private schools like harvard and the college population surged, veterans made up the people enrolled in colleges, universities and the numbers, 2.3 million number is more than prewar levels, they increased
access to higher education. veterans can use these benefits, college education or vocational training schools for on the job training programs and many war veterans used those education benefits, 3 million use it to obtain vocational or technical training, 1.4 million use it to receive various on-the-job training. the net result is better educated workforce, more highly skilled and paved the way for white collar or blue collar professionals to help underwrite the prosperity of postwar america as a real engine of social mobility and climbing the economic ladder. in terms of loan guarantees,
homeownership is possible for a greater proportion of americans before it was out of reach. the va, guaranteed the loan with private members and 1956, $33 billion have been made, tremendous impact fueled the growth of homeownership. there is a housing shortage before the war and during the war, enterprising developers turned to land outside the cities, they start building planned communities outside urban areas, one of the first and most famous was levittown
new york, built on 4000 acres of farmland in long island and the community was owned by 70,000 people and a developer for levittown, two more from pennsylvania and another in new jersey, made it homeownership available to large numbers and as you have seen in the news, critical to the growth of the middle class in the united states. >> interesting to think about how this bill impacted what we know as housing today. one of the things related to the g.i. bill is oral history
is college graduates, to learn how to fly a plane, the coolest stories i heard from that. not only additional training but new psychologys as well. going to the medical side, locations and how to increase supply of doctors, how i had asked what was american public opinion with va on the medical side. >> most everybody on board with these changes, the press loved support in the media. in addition to all of that they run into problems with that bureaucracy, doesn't quite want
to see those changes happen, there's a dramatic moment on new year's eve in 1945, the department of medicine surgery bill with those changes making its way through in civil service hit the brakes on it a little bit. on new year's eve saying, if this doesn't come through. in 1946 president truman doesn't sign the bill into law formally creating department of medicine and those changes that they proposed. >> an exciting way to spend christmas in. looking back to the g.i. bill we talked about the short-term benefit of the g.i. bill but a
fair question to ask all service members enjoy equal access to these benefits particularly female service members. .. >> you know, certain barriers to making full use of the g.i. bill, for instance, some female veterans will apply for home loans, they only take into consideration if they're married their husband's income because they're considered that they're not necessarily going to be permanent. in terms of using education benefit, they have to be used within just a few years of discharge, and they expired after about, like, you know, seven years. the benefit just, just kind of went away. so for women, you know, many of them after they got out of the
service, they wanted to marry, they wanted to have children and maybe to support their husbands who were obtaining, you know, enrolled in an education program, so they didn't necessary hi have the opportunity right then to take care of those education benefits. and if they didn't, they disappeared. and there's also some unintended consequences. because of the huge demand for admission into colleges, some colleges started to establish quotas on the number of women they would admit just so they could be able to accommodate all the male veterans. even some women's colleges started to admit male veterans to kind of handle some of the overflow. so the net result is, you know, women, you know, received relatively few educational gains compared to, you know, the male population. and, of course, african-americans, yeah, there was great hope that this would be, you know, a great service to
them, but in practice, you know, this was the era of, you know, the jim crow south, you know, segregation, separate but equal was kind of the rule of the land, and the majority of african-american veterans did reside in the south. and they faced all sorts of barriers and obstacles. in terms of education, you know, only a few thousand actually end rolled in colleges in the north, and even those colleges in the north often established quotas or limits to the number of african-americans they would accept. and then in the south they were barred completely from most white institutions, so they had no choice but to go to historically black colleges. and the enrollment to them bid soar as a result of the g.i. bill, went from 30,000 to 74,000 by the late 1940s, but those schools were underfunded, they had a shortage of trained faculty. and even with, you know, the expansion of the numbers, they still didn't have enough to keep
up with the demand. so many black veterans who did qualify who were able to go on to college were just turned away because there just wasn't, the black colleges were not able to take them all. and probably tens of thousands more probably just dissuaded from even trying. and then in terms of the other types of education benefits, you know, on the job training programs, vocational schools, again, many were for whites only, they were often shunned into semi-skilled training programs, lower skilled training programs as opposed to white veterans. and then loan guarantee, you know, as i said, the v.a. didn't actually loan the money. instead they issued what was called a certificate of eligibility. but then it was up to the veteran to find a private lender to make the loan, and, you know, there in the home loan industry african-americans just faced
systematic discrimination throughout the country. they had trouble obtaining loans, many of those housing communities i just talked about, those big planned communities, they specifically had agreements that they would not sell to black homeowners. so this is something that needs more thorough research, but very, very few african-american soldiers were able to take advantage of the loan benefits to purchase a home. i don't know if there's i any hard number that i've seen, and like i said, and i think, i think the -- more of the lender side than considering them eligible for a loan. but again, that subject, i think, requires more research. but the big takeaway is that by being denied access to home ownership, sass i said a few -- as i said, that was a major source of accumulation for
americans. so african-americans had a huge disadvantage that we still see the effects today. and even with the fair housing act of 1968 that prohibited a lot of those practices, african-american families were kind of too far behind to kind of catch up. they couldn't afford homes that they now were allowed to buy because they didn't have the equity built up, you know, to make the down payment to acquire homes. and like i said, so that's one of the legacies that we -- unfortunate legacies that we do live with today. >> i think it's important to discuss these benefits, and i guess kind of turning it back to the medical side, you know, as a veteran, what does this change in medical care looks like for you? how did hospitals change, and what did they look like during the postwar period? and i guess if you're able to kind of talk as well the experience of black and female service members with the v.a., i
think it'd be very interesting to kind of see the other side. >> absolutely. so if you're a veteran, what this means for you once that legislation has passed in january of 1946 and once the department of -- has been established in the v.a., you're able to access care more quickly than had any other generation of veterans in the past. and different varieties of care as well. after the civil war and after world war i, it had sort of taken a while for them to kind of build hospitals and kind of get that care going, but in 1946 when you have passage of that, you see nearly 5,000 doctors, nurses and other medical personnel being brought on to v.a. to provide clinical care to veterans. and by the end of the decade, you have over 80 hospitals added to the v.a. roster either through construction or through transfer.
and within those hospitals, you get to see greater special unlike -- specialization unlike ever before with paraplegia, hearts, lucks, lots -- lungs, lots more specialty of care are being provided to world war ii veterans. and you see virtually every medical school start to partner with the v.a. beginning with hines hospital in northwestern university. you begin to see that academic link as well which leads to greater research and greater innovation within those hospitals as well. and you also have implementation of something called the michigan plan if or the hometown plan which has allowed veterans to seek care and provide, get veteran care at their local private hospital as well. so you just have more opportunities in the post-world
war ii period. for women and for african-americans, you have the origins of care for women veterans at v.a. starting at the end of the second world war. while women had been eligible for medical care before, you really start to see it kick off after world war ii with the first ten female physicians hired during that time. so you really start to see a lot of specializations kind of begin in the origins of that in the post-world war ii period. for african-americans after the first world war, a exclusively african-american hospital has been set up in tuskegee, alabama, and the v.a. left the issue of segregation at the local level. so a lot of northern hospitals were integrated while a lot of hospitals in the south and the west were still segregated.
and after world war ii, you see calls for another session regated hospital -- segregated hospital to be built, and this is strongly opposed by the naacp who would oversee the integration of the entire v.a. hospital network and something that, unfortunately, doesn't happen until 1954. so that's sort of the status for african-americans at that time. >> that's something to hear that hospitals were integrated, v.a. medical hospitals were integrated while the armed forces were not, correct? >> so they were -- some were integrated and some were segregated because they left it at that local control. there was not a national policy for that. while some were integrated in the north, a lot in the south were not integrated. and they were fully integrated as a whole system in 1954. >> that's fascinating. so i guess to kind of close this
out, jeff, my question for you is what's the long-term legacy of the g.i. bill, and how does it apply to veterans of later conflicts as well? >> right, right. well, as i said, you know, the g.i. bill was a terminal bill that applied just to world war ii veterans, and its benefits expired -- it was modified a little bit, but about the mid 1950s. but, like, any kind of entitlement program once you offer it to someone, it's hard to kind of take it away. so when the korean war broke out, initially there wasn't much interest in having a g.i. bill for korean war veterans, but as the commitment grew, there was intent in congress to pass the g.i. bill, so a bill was passed in 1952 the called, it was basically the korean conflict g.i. bill.
and then in 1966 during the vietnam war, another g.i. bill is passed that's not only applied to veterans, you know, serving during the vietnam war era, but also going back to 195 a 5, the end of the korean war era. so for the first time, the being offered to veterans who served even during a time of the late '50s even when the u.s. was not at war with anybody. you have this precedent of offering similar benefits to veterans of later wars. and the '52 and '66 g.i. bills, the benefits were not as generous as the 1944 g.i. bill. for instance, under these later bills it was almost impossible for most veterans to afford a private school unless they a had their own financial resources to do so. the bill themselves would not pay for their attendance. and then after vietnam when the u.s. transitioned to an
all-volunteer force, another g.i. bill was passed in 1976 designed for, you know, veterans of the all-volunteer force. and the focus of the bill shifted from being, like, helping veterans to reintegrate into society to being kind of a recruitment in a sense, to get people to join the military. knowing that they would qualify for these educational benefits. and for the first time though, these benefits were not free. service members had to actually pay into the system to kind of qualify for the benefits when they got out. it was in the early 1970s also9 that the loan aspect were kind of detached from the g.i. bill itself in terms of permanent lifetime benefits for all veterans. so that really established that program. so kind of, you know, there's been several more g.i. bills passed since then, one of the most recent was the 9/11 g.i.
bill which is one of the more generous g.i. bills that, again, while not quite on the level of the 1944 bill, it does give veterans the possibility to go to any public institution. so overall, over the life of all these g.i. bills and the loan guarantee program, i think the v.a. has spent some $400 billion in education benefits and 25 million people and has guaranteed 25 million loans worth $2.6 trillion. so, again, you know, the g.i. bill's just had a huge impact on successive generations of veterans and is really kind of one of the most, you know, popular benefits that v.a. offers today, and it's it's one of the, you know, signature benefits programs. >> absolutely. and, katie, kind of throwing it back to you looking at the long-term effects, the legacy as the d. of medicine and surgery -- department of
medicine and surgery which we know as the v.a. medical system, how has it impacted care for successive generations of veterans? >> so, so while you have the origins hofstra medical care coming out of the civil war, really the department of medicine and surgery is the modern foundation for the v.a. health care system that we know today. so many programs and policies can be traced to the post-world war ii period -- [inaudible] from that first academic affiliation, you know, like i was saying nearly every medical school now is affiliated with a v.a. hospital. and so you have 70% of all doctors being trained in some form from v.a. so not only has that impacted the care veterans have received, but it's also, you know, chances
are that a doctor or another medical personnel that you have encountered in your life has been v.a.-trained as well. and funds and research and innovation from those academic partnerships, we've seen so many innovations that have helped not only veterans, but the entire world as well. the ct scan, the cardiac pacemaker, the cigarette smoking patch, several nobel prielzs have come out of that. so really it's laid the foundation that allowed all of these things to kind of take off. and it's allowed -- [inaudible] care for 9 million veterans which is what v.a. cares for today. in addition to that, you have the v.a. voluntary service which comes out of that, all of the volunteers in the hospital system. that's another legacy. the department of medicine and
surgery act. so just quite a lot of things that came out of that time period that are a hallmark hofstra care today. of v.a. care today. >> that is so interesting. how much world war ii shaped what we know today as veterans benefit, veteran health care. so at point we are going to turn it over to our audience for their questions. so if you have any questions for jeff or katie, please place them either within the q&a section on zoom, or if you're watching through facebook live, place them as a comment within the video stream. and just as a reminder, if you have questions related to your eligibility or current benefits, please contact your local v.a. the first question i have is specifically for you with, katie. what was the criteria for v.a. hospital sites outside of just rural versus urban especially looking at the post-world war ii medical care?
>> that's a really good question. so in following the civil war, a lot of those were just placed near -- not near large population centers, but in rural areas that could be sort of accessed by train or other sort of transportation as well. and then in the post-world war i period you have kind of hospitals placed sort of near some, you know, holistic areas geographically as well, near hot springs. that was kind of like the fashion of the time. you have areas of the country kind of populated with hospitals that way. but you also sort of see some political patronage happening there with hospitals. some congressional interference of where a hospital's going to
go that might not have been the most accessible for veterans, but, you know, a win for a congressman. so that kind of changes then after the second world war where there's really, you know, an emphasis on the larger population centers and near those major medical schools that you see in ann arbor, you see hospitals kind of follow where the medical schools are, things like that. >> definitely. so a question for both of you guys. we talked a little bit about the experience of black service members and female service members related to these benefits and medical care. do you guys have any information -- [inaudible] or asian-americans and whether or not they faced discrimination immediately after the war related to the g.i. bill and to v.a. medical care? >> yeah, that's a good question. in terms of hispanics, you know, the v.a. didn't really track that because hispanics were
classified as whites, so i don't know if there's any statistics that you could draw upon. you know, i feel, you know, it's more likely they faced kind of informal types of discrimination versus opposed to kind of statutory discrimination that african-americans face in the south. faced in the south. so it was more like being difficult to get into schools or being dissuaded from applying to some schools or obtaining jobs benefits. in terms of asians, i don't think they did, you know, because you have the interment of japanese-americans during the war, but after that i think returning veterans who, you know, performed so heroically and had such an amazing record of achievement during the war, i think they were able to use the g.i. bill without much of any, you know, hindrance. >> yeah. and i would go along with what
jeff had said too on the medical side. i think on the more statutory side you had discrimination against african-americans, but not so much with asian-americans or hispanic-americans. it might have been on a different level, on a little bit more subtle level, but not quite on the level of african-americans being discriminated against. >> absolutely. and i guess just to piggyback off of that, to encourage our audience members to tune into future programming and to go back to some of our previous programs, we recently covered the experience of asian-americans prolifically this past spring, and we do have an upcoming webinar looking at the experience of mexican-americans in post-world war ii coming up in september. now, for the next question, does the g.i. bill help pay for
family members' education? i guess to rephrase that, did it pay for family members' education during world war ii, or is it exclusively for these -- >> yeah. yeah, that's a good question. the original g.i. bill was exclusively for service members and, in fact, gold star widows wanted to draw on some of the g.i. bill benefits, and they were turned down initially. eventually, the law was changed so that widows and dependent family members could use the g.i. bill benefits, but that came later on in the process. and the laws were also changed to allow, actually, service members while on active duty to use the loan guarantee benefits and the education benefits. but that came later on in the '70s and '80s. >> absolutely. so, katie, can you address mental health care in the immediate post-world war ii era?
was there any lessening of -- related to mental health, or was it just not really addressed at that point? >> absolutely, that's a great question. so again, that kind of mental health is an issue that kind of evolved from the civil war onwards in terms hofstra medical care, and it's something that existed, you know, the entire time that there has been war. but it's only been kind of more recently that it's been addressed in a medical capacity. so you had some of these holistic approaches following the end of the civil war, and you had just the very nature of the structures were sort of a, you know, element to addressing kind of some of that mental health. those veterans who didn't really want to be a part of society could be in one of these homes with other soldiers who kind of understood what they were going through and kind of went through
that together. and then, you know, after the end of the first world war you had what was termed shell shock, and you had at least sort of that kind of identified as more of an issue. and so then after the end of the second world war, mental health is something that -- [inaudible] is very passionate about. so you have psychology and a lot of other mental health programs coming out of the second world war as well. and that definitely is not as stigmatized anymore, and it definitely grows as its own sort of profession and field within v.a. at that time. yeah, very good question. >> definitely. so, jeff, this one's for you. what efforts were made with world war ii veterans of the benefits available to them? >> yeah. well, since the g.i. bill passed in june of 1944 that was a good, you know, almost year before the
war in europe ended and, you know, the war against japan continued until -- it gave v.a. just plenty of time to spread the word about the men if fits. so i think printed up all sorts of pamphlets distributed to service members within the military, kind of, like, counseling sessions to inform service members of the different benefits programs. great effort was made to kind of get the word out and to educate military personnel about these new benefit programs that'd be available to them when they got out of the service. they also printed out promotional materials, posters that they plastered all over the walls. so, again, different ways to, again, to influence people, to inform the military personnel. >> absolutely. and i agree with you, that definitely did help with the end of the war about a year out. so, katie, are there any resources or publications you can recommend for folks to learn
more about the v.a. hospitals and the programs that were developed for world war ii veterans? >> absolutely. so there's a great congressional publication called medical care for veterans that came out in i believe the '70s or the '80s. it's a very informative source, but it's a little dry. it's a little bit more in depth, but i highly recommend dr. michael gam bone's book, "the greatest generation comes home," all about how service -- [inaudible] after the end of the second world war. and also more broadly arc itself is a great resource. i highly recommend. >> so, jeff, do you have any resources or recommendations? >> yeah. yeah, you know, a book i strongly recommend is probably g.i. deal and new deal for veterans, it came out a few years ago and just a really good
idea of scholarships on the g.i. bill and various ways it was implemented and its effects on different segments of veterans. and then if you're with interested in learning more about maybe the legacy of the g.i. bill, there's a good book -- let me just pull it, called -- [inaudible] by mark if bolton and talks about some of the shortcomings of the 1966 g.i. bill and why vietnam veterans weren't able to get the same due as the world war ii era veterans. >> absolutely. well, thank you, katie and jeff, for joining us today. i thoroughly enjoyed this discussion, and i believe that our audience did as well. >> all right. well, again, it was our pleasure to be here. thank you for hosting us. >> absolutely. >> yes. thanks very much. >> definitely. so if you enjoyed today's program, stay up-to-date with