tv After Words Alex Marlow Breaking the News CSPAN July 9, 2021 11:05pm-12:05am EDT
>> what is the instrumental purpose of this book? what do you hope to accomplish or who do you hope to reach? >> first of all i know it will be read by more conservatives than people who are h independent or liberal. i hope they get two things out of it. but i am optimistic that in the future and then have a more robust public discourse and dialogue. and then to what has become researching so positive the news is broken. one is in the newsroom by the agenda driven journalist you
don't admit they are agenda driven. just like breitbart who were gleefully throwing rocks in the structures so talk about that last bit for those who might not be fully aware what breitbart does and the role of the independent right of center ecosystem. >> on balance it probably covers more than the latter. because i do think we have been largely misconstrued and i don't think we have been given a fairhe shake in the public and it peppered throughout the book there is a little memoir because i was the first employee of breitbart but and when they heard those well alt right is
associated with anti-semitism. we have orthodox jews on staff former editor-in-chief who is our senior editor is a orthodox jew. and then is pretty much 100 percent pro israel. but it is repeated over and over. but i do think was long as there is free speech in america.na and then trying to penetrate into the national dialogue without having the institutional backing of a corporation. without level of corporate
media? and with the with podcast and those over the last decade to leave that indelible mark on the credibility. >> is there attention in the way the news has broken in a good way? that is undeniably good but in a way that is also bad news as a critique. is there a natural tension between the brokenness of the news and what we are to think about it? >> and popular killed culture is largely controlled by people of the same political worldview as those who control our news media.
and then to stop the machinations within our society. and with that establishment media and conformity of the period group which is multinational and not that focused on american exceptionalism there what it means to be american at all and i find a heartbreaking.en with the's upstarts that i champion it is a good thing in a way it is possible in america that by and large it would be great if we can look at corporate media and trust them to a certain degree. trust in the corporate outlet so much in recent years. it's not a great thing that
has happened. >> to do a victory lap over the way that you co-opted and turned around the hillary clinton phrase as a journalistic establishment phrase of fake news and then a little while later the president started using it. talk about that timeline a little bit. >> straight out of the breitbart playbook i'm so happy you asked about a never got any type of credit but i will take a little bit now. but when hillary started to use the term fake news which we had seen floating around in left-wing obama circles the were starting to see the concept. late. i know what they will do here.
this will be something that is used to brand people like the aforementioned all to write or white nationalist in people don't even know who are the leaders of these movements and what the words mean for how powerful they are. and it's very hard to wash that off. not that breitbart put out fake news but was effective. and with the biggest upstarts may be only fox is bigger. with a corporate outlet it's a slightly different model. so it was supposed to be a celebration for harryoi reid.
and using the term over and over. thinking about breitbart. so then we will just be purpose this and take the branding fake news and put on every false story that comes out of the establishment whether cnn or "the newk york times" we will just start fake news. and co-opted the expression. and then jim acosta got into it a month or two later and write off-the-cuff he says to you are fake news and then the data that was the mosthr hilarious thing ever and then trams on - - it was trumps phrase and he ran with it so it began with breitbart the co-opting that benefits the right is something used to
attack us. >> you did just complain people were using it to tarnish groups of people is that now what you are doing right here with the media if you called him fake news media are you not tarnishing them in a collective way? >> there are two components the first part a straight to brand us as fake news to try to diminish the influence in general and constantly if we are getting any attention it's always negative. never anything positive they are in a battle against us. they are not coloring liberal opinion fake news because we don't agree with the opinion. so when the term is used by hehillary clinton to use these broad strokes and people putting out fake news they
don't cite the falsehood. so there's not an equivalent. first of all thehe retaliatory nature is important. not looking to pick fights with people that react to people who come after us or our readers. i do think the term fake news, if you have a breitbart story right now i would sayou sure. but technically it's true. host: you focus mostly on three media companies. new york times, bloomberg and nbc universal. talk about "the new york times" and your decoder ring. >> "the new york times" has a list of priorities that they use and with that duration
element it's obvious what should be the front page story and the pattern that i lay out about 15 rules and all that i notice they would get these glamorous photos on the front page. and to fit the narrative to fit something bad or the coronavirus will ravage society and you feel like they would put that on the front page and then the argument that fit that narrative at the top of the article but one example eyesight in the book and when they thought florida word reopen disney world last summer than it would have those super spreader events that this is reckless and
horrible and everyone will die. and then it turns out weeks later it was no evidence of any super spreader event those stories did not make the front page and then eventually they start to trickle out barely a month later but they're not front-page stories others were buried in the paper and you start to see these patterns. it's really fun to point out there is actually information that contradicts the point butey they just don't put it at the top just to be a little more clear so you can take a picture witht your phone it's like a game almost to see what they are doing. host: you write in the book with a tweet some staffers made when they were in college
the controversial case list. what is the newsworthiness? why should we talk about the collegiate of new york times staffers? >> so what are the examples? >> so why is this worthy of talking about in the modern-day new york times? >> it's not about the individuals in most cases. with some it is so extreme they rise to a higher level that are so over-the-top. and then right before.
and that breitbart has been fending off claims of anti-semitic despite having orthodox jews who edit the site and use who own the company. and the admitted bias toward israel 100 percent of the time. and for these that have not had to address them so i don't think he should have been fired. i did not call for his firing or did anyone at breitbart i think that you have an authority on anti- cemeteries hime and so as the mutual empires of what's going on p in america. n >> in those circumstances are
you with the outrage archaeology? is that a good place to go to regardless of the hypocrisy angle? so to bring down breitbart once and for all quick. >> it's a great question in a tough decision in the newsroom. but if we extend the courtesy to them that everything should be off limits by the way the lady from axial scott fired for a tweet at 17, that was outrageous. and i said that publicly in my national radio show. and she shouldn't have to put out a statement about it as well. i was 17 years old and take a
hike. let the left use the tactic for my audience or staff with no pushback at all and it has no business is a live in glass houses should not cast stones so they are massive hypocrites it is a tough call and we take a case by case. and those that come across the desk that i haven't run with. and it seems like the right decision. >> who is lori jobs and what is the emerson collective and why should consumers and media be aware of both? >> this is an amazing story. thank you for asking. she is one of the most fascinating characters in
breaking the news. i knew almost nothing about which is irrelevant to this. the widow of steve jobs the genius behind apple and pixar. so when he passed away at 50 she inherited tons ofs money, unspeakable amounts now her net worth i mean $20 billion. she is one of the wealthiest women on the planet. very limited things have been written about her. she is and do a lot of publicrn appearances but what you will learn is she is a woman in tact. she is really and areas. and then the emerson
collective is a personal trust it is a hybrid philanthropic investing arm. so it is 100 percent on purpose. with obama or alumni on the board. and with these media outlets thand i notice you have all different types of media outlets from thero ultra credible to the not credible they are a the owners of the anatlantic founded by ralph waldo emerson and has a lot of pull in certain circles. not my favorite personally. axios is very popular in washington. even pro- public. the mother jones.
and to keep victories for the left but now this is a millennial focused viral video. but then there was something called acronym that is the nefarious growth that shows it on the left you with a career newsroom to make a long story short they launder fake news and democratic propaganda into local news outlets. she also funds top democratic candidate she's made donationscr including two vice president harris who is a close personal friend and allies. to barely stop short of endorsing harrison the 2020 primary and i read some of the
quotations. if you are on the right physically would be uncomfortable. they are soo over-the-top. and the most important person with it. and she uses this imagery from ralph waldo emerson it is an amazing character unspeakably powerful almost entirely anonymouss. before the book i don't think anybody knew her name. host: you said the atlantic is not your cup of tea but you write as a news outlet the atlantic is abominable horrible journalist, often horrible people. my god what did they do to your cheerios? >> [laughter] i did you some color i was not happy with the atlantic when i i was writing this.
and then also leading to fewer abortions because even if you are pro-choice. but was pro-choice i can understand. and then they argue for a chinese model in theel government. and to have a more model and the chinese model of censorship you have to see why our would be appalled coming from a major american publication. we should be more like china when it comes to censorship. >> using bloomberg as an example, how is corporate media in the united states bowing to the dictates of chinese sensors?
>> and i paint a broad picture and knowing how ruthless china is to stand to thwart china's efforts to keep this pristine image by itself. and then the compromising of american values and principles in order to do businessbc in china. take nbc comcast universal and abc news is part of disney. and then the linked the chinese market with the
industry. but needless to sayep if the newsroom steps out of line there is massive incentives to eesay if you keep doing this you will hurt us with the biggest market in the world other than america we sell movies and have theme parks and you will ruin frs. it's a major disincentive to report accurately on china and it is the incentive to engage in absurd behavior. and people are unfamiliar with bloomberg they are the most powerful financial news outlet in the world. i believe they have more journalist in the ap in your times i'm sorry "the new york times" and cnn and wall street journal combined and the revenue per year is double of cnn and fox combined. they are a massive a outlet.
because the state central party in china decides and then to maintain that level of access. bloomberg has flownloas to beijg on a regular basis and with the propaganda website which i have gone through meticulously for the book we can always take their word for it because bloomberg did not reach out because it was introducing china to america the cooperation between america and chinese media and in one of the major funders to go on tv to talk about how president xi is not a dictator but doing a good job on the environment is the biggest polluter still making coal-fired power plant that all of these excuses by
bloomberg was supposed to be a climate activist puts two and two together it's a business move to have a napoleon complex worth $50 billion. >> what is sleeping giants and news guard? talk about what they are of the significance and how they intersected with your work. >> it's part of the self-appointed sensors to police the internet to sanitize it for content that they would argue is either fake news are spreading information but the pattern is more for people put up content with that democratic narrative and as i document so sleeping
giant not to be added executive for the women in tech so they were these people who didn't go to breitbart routinely but when trump went wine and we were associated with the rise and they found a few opinion pieces written tongue-in-cheek clearly the voices of specific authors and theyc use that to paint the entire website with 100 pieces of original content per day. so they went around with the astroturf group of people on twitter asking advertisers notot to advertise on breitbart. some of them went with it because ideologically they do disagree some because they were under pressure they don't like being underer pressure and
other times that people stuck with us. they did this for years butur what ended up happening during this process is the sleeping giant reset the way companies look at online advertising i don't want to get to granular but the way online advertising is done, generally goes to a third-party broker like google or another huge outlet and they match the reader with the content so if you are reading ask you can buy the product. and then to get product place and is beneficial. in front of eyeballs that are likely to buy it. nobody was unhappy for the most part until sleeping giant
said wait a minute. what if you don't want your company to appear regardless people started to think about that because it was close to be so evil and horrible but and then to extrapolate out. with that content withse the coronavirus or donald trump. and all ofon the's topics are gratuitous to put advertising on the stories it totally devastated and with the industry's we don't have a huge staff with a ton of traffic so we did find we survived the campaign sometimes they did markedly worse than we did.
but then add revenue was down and you can think the sleeping giants if you are a person during the advertising downturn. and that was a huge answer was sleeping giants but did they blanket score on website either good guys or bad guys? and they set the standards we don't know who they are. establishment of political parties and if you are not really forthcoming and do whatever they say then so we look at the ape so breitbart ap story gets a red block.
so if they put up the same exact story they get a shield then to shut out people who had the status quo.ta >> now the whack a mole nature with some serious behavior. maybe this is tweet with insight like dan bonds you know or breitbart or ben shapiro and with those masters of the universe can we really be masters of the universe when it so easy to route around what they are doing? >>e facebook is a is noteworthy
because i feel the need to do well but what works on facebook that with the fact check even if it is true the best example as we are recording this i don't recall exactly what was reported but how many fact checks on wuhan were fact check establishment sanctioned in fact checkers and now they are rethinking nthat. and what breitbart puts out is true so often get fact check as false or misleading. that breitbart was very close
right at the beginning in 2018. and turn the dial plummeted on facebook not 20 but the top five to down at about 20. and clearly there is a manipulation. we were not band per se but the reach was diminished which hurts our business we can weather the storm because of the size but a lot of friends and colleagues in conservative media they had some so much in the facebook shares. so i do believe with a governor to put in play it is all very mysterious what they i
do but twitter clearly sensors conservative speech and when the overseas leaders can stay on the page but conservative thought. and then literally they went to zero. that you will not ever get a joe biden story if i went toig donald trump in the campaign and gotten an exclusive quote about joe biden it would not show up in google searches unless you put in the word breitbart that is clearly manipulation. this is a masters of the universe type of behavior. it is a or blanket boycott. do you disagree?
>> t absolutely. that is a hunter biden story. and then twitter gratuitously for a week and i say this item care much about the hunter biden story. i don't want twitter to kick off politicians and to say a long-established newspaper you cannot write about this. and then now i will ask you the question. that these are unelected people.yo and it is different from what they hear from conservatives 30 years ago when they take
power next the top priority should be restraining bed attack with the anti- conservative bias for major corporations and every available avenue to weaken the monopolies and oligopoly should be considered. and with the federal government is to weaponize based on the viewpoint will and well for free speech? >> i don't know if that's how i would boil it down exactly but and then the reality is that conservative speech ando then and how to deal with it is more of a challenge but whatever we are doing now isat
not working in the hunter biden story and then we are getting crushed not by the democrats but by people in silicon valley controlling the first amendment at this time. so either we are trusting them over there something that must be done about it. this is one of the biggest challenges of our time. you will see more conservatives so then what are the options? we have to use these as test connections and what can survive a legal challenge but there used to be a lot on the
table and limited to the government like breaking up the companies with that should be a consideration and antitrust is that should be looked at like a level of reform with the decency act section 230 outing people fully understand how to do that properly but i don't think just leaving this that we can build our own twitter and then amazon kick them off there's just too much infrastructure to compete that would totally be destroyed. host: you write and masters of the universe that it is apparent to me conservative family stories that benefit
joe biden were not to swingit the election on its own. you say i believe masters of the universe was the single. biggest deciding factor how is that any less conspiratorial than what msnbc talked about for three years after 2016? >> i show in the data where they laid out the top narrative anti- but one - - the hunter biden scandals kamala harris was the most radical leftists according to a major survey and also it accused of sexual assault so we were supposed to believe all women. and donald trump's america and
the vaccine was on track shocking every line in shocking everyone and the media research center highlighted this and they concluded had they been aware of all eight of the things that they laid out they would not have voted for biden doesn't mean it would have voted for trump and i think the logic the people who control our information are the ones that can decide the most votes i don't think it is conspiratorial at all have ulcers people supposed to choose where they vote unless it is based off of what they are reading are talking a about with friends and family? tv ads? i don't know the alternative. >> someone went on and this
nbc quite a lot through 2019 anytime somebody said the election was rigged door in m some way manipulated. i would always point out no. nobody got between a voter in the voting machine as far as we know. that using that word is contentious and so is $100,000 worth the facebook ads it deposits the robot sheep to press the right button on the social media platform and waited change as many as 15 million votes. that is been in his 15 million were not changed by social media do you think that's a ibpossibility? >> at about 15 million votes were changed from social media. it's impossible to quantify. but the numbers were so narrow
looking at exactly how narrow the margins were. was tens of thousands of votes from the whole election it doesn't need to be 15 million or fraction of that but enough people in those states just two or three of those with the election of a totally different outcome and had silicon valley then fair to treat usy the same as cnn is treated that it would have b been tens of thousands going against biden? absolutely. getting to the 15 million a siteum that he wants biden to win. so it is a perspective i don't think it's fair to dismiss it
as conspiratorial it is no more than what we are getting on the basis it's impossible to back up on the literal level but it makes you consider the power of social media to accept social media as a given in our life and people need to understand that to take seriously the power they have of overall politics is so immense it is incalculable. >> talk about the election and the slogan as a concept in the main case i don't want to litigate everything because we don't have enough time but so now we have an unprecedented pandemic it is your contention democrats pushed for mail-in voting and it is more
manipulative all and creates folder abilities where democrats have more strength. and yet we expected there to be hijinks word we not have seen her when we have seen donald trump gain in cities? i think he gained in philadelphia he did better in big cities and 2016 you would imagine the big machines to have the ability to put their thumb on the scales that's what would have. >> i think he gained but then lost more than he gained because biden gained more so people come to the border illegally if they were given the kids felt somewhat vote trumpet more will vote
democrats i think mail-in voting is similar to make it vote by mail more will vote by mail but because it benefits by a greater margin on net that drastically favors democrat and i think anybodyab thought it would be conceivable that joe biden we get 15 or 20 million more votes than barack obama got that was definitely due to mail-in voting because we needed to stay safe from the pandemic that most people went to vote oneo election day there was no super spreader so to make it easier for community organizers to do their work at a minimum get a people who are
not inclined to vote to punch their ticket for the democrats. >> it's called the charlottesville hoax and critiques mainstream media and talk about how the fake news narrative that trump said there are fine people on both sides that follows him to the and of his presidency. you have some very bad people in the group but also that were fine people on both sides. so how is the very fine people fake news that they are on both sides? i have seen this a lot and i don't understand why that is a hoax. >> is the next page over less than one minute after he said
very fine people he said not the neo-nazis. i condemn them totally. that is the exact quote. not the neo-nazis. i condemn them totally. less than a minute later he says he condemns them and that was totally ignored because 61 seconds after he said there's fine people on both sides so that media conveniently cut it off and a story about one minute later literally he says not the neo-nazis. and how much better he can do then toh say not the neo-nazi.id host: but he did say there is very fine people on both sides. maybe i'm a literalist that i saw the condemnation of the neo-nazi myself and internalized it to condemn those people and and also said very fine people on both sides so it's your contention people
deliberately chopped off that context to pretend it didn't exist quick. >> over time it morphed they are not the fine people that originally there was a big debate on statues because they trepresent something anything can't represent something dereprehensible that than those on both sides that were racist and the tiki torches that those that were there and enough i would call them very fine people some of them where they were condemned and then to talk like every single person there was pretty
laughable. like it was the greatest race hate crime in the history of the world we have done so much worse. this is one writing there is one person died he was a white woman and we have sussed over this is a nation. we didn't need to. that is not true in the slightest. >> you say about journalist and people in media the ultimate goal is to cancel america in the traditional sense what do you mean by that quick. >> 1619 i get into in detail in the book and the origins were to reset america's collective memory founded in 17 seventies on - - 1776 firsthe amendment and second amendment and what we love so much.
many times it is universal but it is one of these things it was the founding doctrine are so we were told. so the whole upbringing is a hoax really founded 1619 with colony.t slave it was specifically how it was written in the original 6019 essay to preserve the institution of slavery that's what's in the dna. that makes america much more horrible place to our core ifg that is true. a lot of professors including slave professors refuted the 6019 but i think it's a perfect example that it is not enough to win a debate forget democrats or liberals elected. maine stream media is making a
rconcerted effort to reset the founding principles away from the god fearing liberty loving ideals i grew up on. that is the core and essence. host: following up on that we can not longer hide from the left. time is of the essence. the left cannot be appeased they do not want compromise or to educate or reform they want to absorb or destroy. become one of them are they will come for you it's only a matter of time. it sounds pretty dire. >> yes. we have a couple of weapons figuratively speaking. but this is one of the lessons i learned from breitbart being the first employee. andrew was a fearless warrior and someone who told me very
early on from countless examples that doing what the left once will not live than over to be converted so they can use you as a legend against the rest of the right. they would really like to see youu crashed. breitbart is the perfect example. we have been called racist my entertainment editors black men the chief is a black woman my latino editor we have orthodox do an incredible diversity within the company but this is never applauded. the left was mad to put outin more opening pieces that were more inflammatory to provoke the undo that is often. and how breitbart has calm down of course not because you're not really interested
they want us to go away. that's a means being because we have the same core political principles we articulate them in a slightly different way but it's never enough. we never get accolades for that and as a message i'm trying to send to people who think that a healthy debate with the left, liberals are open-minded i like talking to them but people on the hard left that are running most of the newsrooms are not interested in mind or your perspective for the most part they want to co-opt us. host: i invite you to see if there is any tension on those consecutive pages but in order to defeat they must interact with them only when it is strategically advantageous to do so and then with dialogue with certain m people who have certain viewpoints that's a dangerous trend so which is
it? >> and then to engage in the dialogue so i am a reluctant user of social media personally i don't like it but i'm not naïve i don't think single-handedly to change the americans perspective on this topic in one fell swoop. so then social media isn't all about the angry left but intel that day is here to be totally irrelevant to a certain degree it is strategically advantageous. i don't want to send a signal to people who are in the middle independent that are genuinely curious not up on - - up for a robust or cordial
debate. and then clearly distinguished from liberals so that's theia more corporations. i find it more consistent but it is a process. it's not a light switch if it was ever tried to flip it but it cannot be done. host: where do we go? your sense of wherehi we are in this cultural war? is it going to get more intense and bloodied before it gets more peaceful and different? >> i don't think it willhi get bloodied. ii don't think americans in general are that committed to that. i don't want to see get bloodied and i disavowed violence. i say that over and over.
but there is an element that nis fired up. for the most part people are fat and happy enjoying the creature comforts and the streaming and smart phones. they are more content to show up and vote and then grouse on social media. that is a shame. like to see more engagement join the homeowners association or the school o board. . . . . people will read center states and eventually they will separate them. and i think it would be horrible and i don't really know what that looks like because for so interconnected economically. but it's got to be one of the
other 20 pretty senior the pendulum swings back printed. >> in the last month we have here, give viewers who do not share your politics, resentment to buyerrs bucket also - >> thank you so much for that, i try to immerse myself in one of the big advantages that that we have been so effective is that we read interest news and whatever centrist as there as we reestablish the publications we actually find a lot of common grounds in a lot of areas. we think of c ourselves as where right or center but we also have a lot of libertarian writers unpopular writer in a lot of different perspectives that are there. if you've picked up this book, think will at least get entertaining version of what may be he is thinking when anything on a day-to-day basis. i think that it be if you list every idea in there, i think emerging to get that perspective the semite i will read countless
left publications this year. >> the book is breaking news and exposing establishment that deals in secret corruption of the author is alex marlowe pretty thank you so much alex. >> thank you. >> we kandiss on "c-span2" intellectual every saturday documents american stories and on sundays, book tv bring to the latest nonfiction books and authors. "c-span2" funding comes from the television company and more including media. >> the world changes in an essay, the media, was ready and internet tracking sold and we never slowed down. businesses and encouraging and we had a new reality and media calm, were built to keep you ahead pretty. >> many, along with these television companies, sports "c-span2" as a public service.
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