tv Mia Bay Traveling Black CSPAN April 25, 2021 7:00pm-7:56pm EDT
i had to just step away. >> the watch the rest of this interview visit our website booktv.org, click on the "after words" tab to find this along with previous episodes. >> booktv in prime time starts now, first, history professor mia bay looks at the history of race and of travel in america. ...... what's on his time in congress and served stopped on the future of the republican party. investigative journalist amanda ripley talks about how people can engage in healthy conflict resolution print consult your program guide are visible tb.org for complete schedule information. now here is a look at the history of traveling while
black in america. >> so, we are here tonight to hear from doctor who is the at the university of south florida st. petersburg. his books include freedom writer covid 1961 in the struggle for racial justice in the best book of 2006 by the "washington post". doctor me at bay is in addition tonight's book and white image in black line another book. she is the professor of american history at the university of pennsylvania please join me in welcoming doctor bay. let's see if i can get them up on screen.
welcome doctor bay, et cetera right to have here with us this evening. welcome back on for the q and a but we will let you take the show away and enjoy the conversation, thanks for being here. >> thank you for inviting us, jennifer. i went to think the mark twain house and museum on the center for sponsoring this. it is a wonderful idea. i'm really looking forward to this. i actually read vias new book and manuscript. i've seen with hardcovers with the beautiful coverage even more exciting. it's really an amazing peace of work. they asked me for a blurb i was happy to give it i think it's such an amazing book. i said, quote myself, a stunning achievement that promises to transform our understanding of the character and importance of segregated
travel. that is an understatement, this is an amazing book. i wish i had it when i did my book on the freedom right it would've been a great help. mia and i met ten years ago i think it was we re-created the freedom writer. we are somewhere in north carolina's college students brace great to see her with this. the first question i have, mia , is of course you did the book on the white image of the black mind and many other topics. i am curious how you came to this, traveling a black parade of all the topics you could have chosen, what interested you in this particular? >> thank you, thank you so much for all your help with the book. thank you for your help with that. that is a great question. many ways the book came to me.
part of it was her moment of political awakening, on the would call ladies garden tennessee for jim crow segregation was walk. but they did not like to have black women in the ladies cars. she fought it and ultimately lost. that made me curious i had thought about segregation taking shape historically had realized or even ladies cars before they were colored cars. josé curious about what came next. i began to kind of research it. also around the same time we had hurricane katrina and all those black people stuck in the dome in new orleans. i maybe think about the other end of the story how is that some people can leave new orleans and some people can't. i started out with a pair of
essays once was on female in the south and the other was on katrina. spent great thank you. my next question something i've wondered about for a long time. famous quotations from baker and governor myrdal, has segregated transportation was the most resented form of jim crow among black southerners. you got a wonderful quotation there's not a more disgraceful denial of human brotherhood that jim crow car of the southern united states. might assist dick out as something so gratuitous and difficult to tolerate? >> that is when the central questions i explore the book. you come across us again and again.
once i started looking for, everyone complains about everyone talks about it everyone is preoccupied by it. i think there are a couple of different reasons, how it affects everyone you cannot escape it. during that time blacks were not affluent enough, privileged enough or not not enough in a bubble to escape. they did not have to go to theaters or restaurants when they could establish their own black establishment. but, they could not and they thought about doing this. they cannot establish their own railroad, airlines, they actually did try to establish their own bus line. there is a way in which nothing could fully shield you from segregation in a way that made a cross class issue. and the other thing is we sometimes imagine segregation
just about being about separation. is very ritualistic facilities for black or inferior to what whites got. that was particularly humiliating when it came to travel. a lot of the facilities were just awful. because travel itself is very uncertain and difficult endeavor which you are counting on services to supply with food, places to go to the bathroom, when some sort of vehicle to get you from point a to point b on the deal action plan to travel. all of those things are put into doubt by travel segregation. they could not get anything to eat sometimes they could not go to the bathroom. or sometimes they cannot actually get on a train or a bus. things that hopefully do not normally happen to us when they travel but they happened to african-american travelers a lot.
sort of agonizing and daring also involved a stranger around other people in the system were out light of lives they would encounter if they had these difficult they would not be helpful or sympathetic. it was just very difficult. specs a part of what you're saying, that is were african-americans were most vulnerable on train travel of uncertainty. but particularly americans with this jim crow system. that is fascinating. out also like to ask about the organization of the book. as struck by how straightforward it is they had those big chapters restart with trains and then you moved to cars and then to buses and then to planes. it works very well i think, very well it gives them a coherence.
i wonder how substantive the differences are what you say? are these four different worlds do they collect into the overlap is there anything similar? is there anything special about why and how planes for example kind of the jim crow aspect to them trains, buses, and cars. they do overlap in terms of the time each of them sort of get going at a slightly different time. various points people have a choice between a lot of these options. in the organization is something i played with initially i was actually going to write about buses and cars at the same time the combustion while was invented at the same time. it takes shape more or less the same time. but they take shape in such different concepts buses are a problem product of coagulation
, a kind of descendents of the streetcar. i found as i was trying to juggle or is cars are initially used by rich people. i found i try to juggle them they were not actually the same story. so i split out those stories and i researched myself because i just had no idea whether i could do anything with it. it sort of emerged organically. but also relates nicely to the way african-americans thought about them. sometimes people can talk about just one. they thought of alternative options. that many african-americans had opinions about what was worse. ralph allen sin, pickens, others went out of their way to talk about the ways they thought buses of the most
awful of segregated transportation. talks about how awful jim crow car is. he actually never rides the bus otherwise he would've chimed in on that one. [laughter] but he really prefers to drive he is a drivers license very, very early on and always owned a car. and then planes, people generally sort of would say that planes were the best. but the problem with planes was accommodations with the layover of increasing unlikely over time. it's on the ground can be on the ground question that that
something i talk about in the book. >> i have a related question he partially entered a moment ago. i've always read about and heard people talk about the vertical integration on planes. somehow they may have to take a segregated bus to the airport, they face that once they are in the air, generally, whites and blacks sat next to each other or near each other always kind of puzzled me how people can be so hypersensitive make this special dispensation. i don't that's of the aeronautics and federal controlled airports and planes? i wonder what you think about that. >> i think the biggest things throughout the segregation era through the 60s there's always likely to be a very
limited number of african americans on planes. and in fact are the 50s the airline had an un- spoken sort of secret policy of trying to seat blacks in load them on the plane of their own separate road. in the earlier. that single seats in the front of the plane, that would be the seat the usual solitary black person on a plane would get. i wasn't entirely vertical integration. the stewardess, part of their job was to sort of rearrange people kind of tried to get black people by themselves were not seated next to white people. sometimes, especially during world war ii soldiers traveling together white children black soldier the stewardess or try get the soldier to sit somewhere else. that would cause conflict. suspected you detect a pattern similar to the buses were
blacks were asked to sit in the back of the plane? that was kind of a custom something enforced by the airlines. >> there is a reverse pattern early on and flying when planes were powered by propellers at the front of the plane. the first class section american airlines admitted that was the policy somewhat wrote to complain about it. trying to get all blacks in the same route which is something my mother experience. i once asked her about her first experience on a plane, expecting her to talk about the grandeur of flights or it being scary. instead she was like, i'm just
so amazed what a coincidence that's fascinating is always worse to be in the back. generally people try to avoid the back of the plane. with propeller planes is just the opposite really. and if your whites work i went on these flyer blogs and found people talked about them, they said the sparks could fly everywhere they were incredibly loud and nobody would want to sit there if
they did not have to. >> if you could tell us for a few minutes about the lady's car pretty thought was one of the great revelations in your book about the importance of the ladies carpet think a lot of people don't know what that is. >> that was fascinating to me praise when i first got interested, the ladies car was something that railroads developed early on in the first era of railroads. to get women to write on railways because at that time travel by train was considered dangerous and a little dirty, women were supposed to be domestic and in the home. also at that time, all men tended to smoke or chew tobacco or do something with tobacco women did not want to be around. so to make trains more appealing to women they started to set aside a separate car for women you cannot smoke or chew
tobacco. you had a more domestic environment with padded seats it was more comfortable for they also put at the end of the train because were the other problems with early railroads is the car that road right behind the while often had soot and cinders coming into it. they could set women's skirts on fire. so women did not to write in that car state had smoke of all kinds. this was to make writing on trains more appealing to them. that great. i know your book is not essentially a peace of legal history. there's quite a bit of it in there. when i first read it in manuscript i was struck by how different it was from katherine barnes book, before yours was the most comprehensive. she was a legal scholar. she did not talk about the cultural things you focus on.
in civil-rights literature in the legal history literature we make a big deal is a great turning point as a milestone. a wonder to what extent your research confirm that or you agree with that but we should devote so much the plessy versus ferguson separate but unequal. >> also question i wrestled with for a long time. important to lawyers and the legal system on the ground getting launched by kicking kicked out the ladies car which is in 1883 to be the end of blah already in jim crow
well before 1896 when it was passed. already pretty much, some parts the south not all. become cast-iron later. in terms of how segregation unfolds in the south of people's experience on the ground are not as as it would become to us. other types of segregation clean the segregation. >> i would love for you take a call moment moment to talk about the gendered aspects of this >>. i was always struck by maybe the most famous examples of
african americans standing up against segregation. arena morgan in virginia, and of course rosa parks, the are obviously men what the women seem very well represented. wonder what you discovered in terms of the proportionality of people that challenge the system some more common among women are not? >> spot prominent among a lot of times at their actually challenging challenging their exclusion from a ladies carpet doing it at a time segregation laws are clearly specifying white or white blackbean the divisions of the going to court and say why can i write in ladies car iva woman.
it's kind of isn't clear doesn't really work can't really prove black women are women but you continue to have a lot of women challenging it. miscible tans transportation more people rode the bus in montgomery then mended. men often, if they challenged segregation's it would not get to court. so women had a somewhat better chance of actually taking it to court. it was maybe less dangerous for them. i think that might be part of it. >> i am also curious about families and children they were treated, is there any
softening of the system the ever detected for children? they all lumped together as individuals. their stories with children had to face some of the hazards of segregated travel. yes, i did one arresting story mary church burke became a very important black leader harassed by a conductor is kind of asking people whose little n-word is this. they were not sick spirit in the segregation there >> to the same rules they really traveled by themselves nothing
seemed to exempt people if you are a woman traveling with a white child, the story about borrowing a baby to travel. which i think it might've been based on her experience for if you had a white baby you could travel. simply note bernard latvian, a nonviolent activist and former freedom writer tells this amazing story about a streetcar in tampa was a boy with his grandmother. the convention was you have to go in the front door to pay your fair. then you had to go back and come into the streetcar to the back door. course the white supremacists of sport was a take off. she got her leg caught it was nearly killed. i think she was seven years old. he often says his motivation for being in the movement's entire life was to make sure it would never happen he really imprinted on them. probably others had similar
stories. what about age? was any softer treatment for elderly african-americans? any kind of respect given, some allowances taken? or was it just kind of a tough-minded one-size-fits-all for african-american. >> i think is a one-size-fits-all of come across incidents were old men were beat up there some famous cases of ministers being thrown off trains or beat up. if anyone met the most hostility was probably young able-bodied men. part of the whole system works was no one was really exempt from it. >> maybe could talk just a minute about the green guide.
i think there's more familiar people nil since the picture on the best pictures a couple of years ago. but that was a fastening part of the book. maybe you could say a little bit about that. >> it has been great to see people learn a little bit more about the green book. people know is on the tip of the iceberg in the sense the green book is not the first guide for african americans about where to go, they go back to the 30s in probably informally earlier there's people that would have developed among musicians and entertainers who pass around lists, here's where you can go. and then people simply began to publish. they were designed to address the fact that i was a problem for black travelers as you did not busily know where you can stay. or was the black hotel, where
is the black neighborhood, where is the place, the green guide would say wait to get your hair cut. until this information is published by various people starting with the guide published during the depression but went out of business partially because of the depression. the different ones targeted somewhat different audiences. as one that appealed to businessmen. olives did perform a function of telling people where to go. the greenback was the largest most successful of them. it was supposed to have publishes much is 2 million copies, is published by a guy named victor green was a mailman who worked in new jersey and worked in harlem.
the idea occurred to him in part because it was mlm. one of the things employees did back in the air was se mailman where you get somewhere to eat as the black mailman break it gets in to eat, where he could stay over the black neighborhood was. when other postmen or those places were in other cities. >> fascinating. your research for this book was so prodigious. [inaudible] when you started, what were those surprises for you in terms of what you discovered this traveling black phenomenon. student there were so many bright almost every chapter has something a really did not understand until well into the research. like the surprise became to
trains. when i finally realized where the problems jim crow has entrained crashes they were the most dangerous place to be. because overtime is roast modernize and replace her old wooden cars-you to continue to use the old wooden cars as jim crow cars. so if you were in a jim crow cart you would be right between all steel while and a steel passenger cars that white people were in. and there's a period of time over the turn of the century you see all these train crashes in which most of the people who die or injured are black or someone who is riding in the jim crow car and railroad bins often run the jim crow car. this is kind of hiding in plain sight. black people complain about, talk about, they worry about nobody redoes anything about it. it was on for years and years and years.
but no one had written about it. as first reading black newspapers it was like why did they keep itemizing how many black people have any white people died in train crashes. why is this a big deal? then it ultimately realized it was sort of a technological problem on something that was one of the dangers of jim crow travel. that was one of the big surprises. in terms of cars, big surprise was segregated parking was one. never imagined i would find evidence on segregated parking. [laughter] but there was. there are places where black people could not park or there are some towns or blacks could not park on saturday that was the day for white people to shop. and there were also experiments with racial right away. psyche stop at a stop sign before white people. that did not work out that was
too crazy. [laughter] wow, wow. another question that is always intrigued me is, the significance or the importance of challenges to segregated travel for the civil rights movement. i think there was a time segregation of front and center per think we learn i was one of many different elements and segregated travel freedom rights and with the bus boycotts and that sort of thing. they seem to be really significant part of the turn to nonviolent direct action take the struggle out to the streets. did you find confirmation of that? did you expect that? and you find that really that so important? >> yes, i did. i don't know that i expected it. i was following the evidence where it led me. one of the things i found was
that even at the naacp, which was very cash-strapped for most of its history and had to dial it back during the great depression in particular, kind of decided to make education its priorities. they were under continuous pressure from members and other black people to do something about transportation. one of the things they would do would be like do a civil suit we will help you little bit. they kind of ended up being pulled into transportation. sometimes more than they plan to. and the other thing was, this is true of education also, direct action became necessary because even when organizations like the naacp or individuals when in court the transportation still does not desegregate which is why you get to the point where you have to have direct action.
this is part of what ends up beating the freedom rights early on in 1947. it is what some individuals see in terms of what they read in the newspaper and irene morgan things are desegregated. okay i'm not going to obey these laws. and then get changed maybe. >> i wonder what you would think about the fact that segregated travel, often time corporations are involved. you got bus companies like greyhound and trailways and airlines and you have the citizens as well and feels it's more front and center with travel there corporations and many of which take orders in the north. southern affiliates is greyhound and out of atlanta. i wonder how much of that is
something we should know about and that you ran into? >> i read into it a lot. corporations play an interesting role. they go along with segregation they actually initially over railroad would've really preferred not to see jim crow worry actually supply separate but equal accommodations. once it didn't they went along with it. sort of i would argue even began to see segregation as part of what they were selling. because they came depression from southern states on this. even when they did not necessarily have the law special with interstate travel it was never clear it was actually legal to segregate black people. but railroad supported it.
and so the pressure began to trend the other direction. and then as you know from the freedom rides, eventually a lot of national companies were maybe like, if we are going to be boycotted in the north were going to get a bad reputation maybe we will so go along with the desegregation. there is a kind of retail racism in the story we see part of what some of these corporations are selling is actually segregation. one of the pictures in the book is a picture from a golf station where there advertising segregated food on the road. >> let me ask you one last question will turn over to the audience ensure they have many questions that they would like to ask you, and your epilogue
at the lies and suggestions this problem is not totally behind us. that traveling black is still something african-americans have to deal with. when if you could say a bit about that. >> yes. bedtime i got to the end of the book i desperately wanted to end in the 60s but i just cannot not acknowledge this area black lives matter and traffic stops to acknowledge the ways of some of the great victories of the black freedom struggle of transportation in this sort of post segregation era were trains are no longer segregated we don't really have buffer train system anymore. the need to be a million different railroads crisscrossing every town in
the country. now we only have amtrak with a number of committed roots. a lot of what people thought in terms of buses and trains, their services that don't exist anymore. or they have limited unsatisfying ways. a lot of public money goes towards keeping up the highway and arguably black and brown people do not benefit from this culture to the same degree. black people are less likely to own cars, to live in urban areas within not even using the highways. then of course there are many problems that go drivers encounter specifically traffic stop on the road. >> fascinating. well, jennifer i think we can turn it over to the audience now for some additional
questions. >> thank you. oh my goodness that was fascinating, thank you both so much. i think we could go on for hours. we do have a great question from the audience to let me jump right in. going to start with the one really fascinating to me. traveling with kids is a challenge for everyone. with any particular challenges that young african-americans faced? eight in four -year-olds are wondering. [laughter] let's see, i think it was things about where you get stuff to eat, how do you go to the bathroom, people often they run along train rides that have to take all the food they're going to eat. sometimes when they sent their kids to relatives and sent with a giant shoebox full of sandwiches.
her kids have to get food from somewhere else, the option of going to the dining car was not there. and also simply kids just knowing the rules of segregation can be challenging. you had to know which bathroom to use. what was allowed and what wasn't allowed. often people do that at home. but once they left him they did not know the rules. for instance at the child lives in the north travel south their parents will have to tell them about jim crow and the colored science and the dangers. oh my goodness. >> it might i may interject in the interest of transparency, that is my nephew but i did not put them up that question. [laughter] >> thank you for clarifying we appreciate your transparency. [laughter] that was a good question what
ways did black travelers challenge segregation? couple have asked. >> so many different ways. a lot of people challenged in the courts. the naacp got a lot of letters think this happened to me what can i do about it? people also challenge it in person. rosa parks is hardly the first person who did not to give up their seat there are lots of who refused to move and had to be thrown off various conveyances. it could be a very dangerous form of challenging. see other forms of challenging. then of course people organized ways of challenging it. like the freedom rights were you had bus rides, travel and interracial groups to challenge travel segregation.
you had sit ins and bus stations, restaurants, it was just almost any conceivable weight you could challenge people, people challenged up at >> am curious as a follow-up, i guess it never happens that white people would rally to the cause. wait a second, let this person sit where they want to sit was that not unheard of? >> became much more common over time it became common on the second world war era where this shift in race relations. you also have a lot of people outside their normal area like northern white soldiers traveling with black soldiers often did not like the idea black soldiers could not travel alongside them. in fact in wartime generally
soldiers should be allowed accommodations on an unequal basis. by the second world war have questioning segregation. in the early years when their first being segregated not necessarily see it as necessary or supported something that comes in on different political shifts in the late 19th century. some think it's inconvenient. one thing about the color car and the white car if the numbers are right sometimes there are no seats in the white car and there in the colored car there's like i want to get warm going. whites sometime challenge it. they're also allowed to write in the colored car if they wanted to. they did not have the same incentive to challenge it. they had a face usually.
>> that is so interesting, thank you. >> following up the train situation, which you look into how much responsibility conductors had for deciding who was acceptable and/or legal to sit where? >> they had enormous amounts of responsibility. in many states they were delegated as policemen to make the decisions and kick people off the train. it was very challenging. they had to look at people who were racially ambiguous and decide whether they were white or black or possibly hispanic or native american. they had to then decide what they could or could not do. sometimes they were wrong. sometimes they got sued because they kicked white women into the colored car. white women sometimes they
hesitated to kick white light skin black women out of the colored car because they might be in trouble there is a difficult job very much the responsibility based >> wow, was there training? were they just left their own devices? >> there is no training i can tell. whole bunch of time sometimes but they would do is they would ask some random black person whether the person was black or not. often the person, the answer had nothing to do with what the random black person decide with achieving ally or not. >> that is really not funny. [laughter] >> gosh. once to know in your research what method of transportation turned out to be safe it's historically for travelers?
>> i would say definitely planes you could end up inconvenience you could have trouble in the cab at the airport, not be able to eat or stuck somewhere at a layover. there is not a lot of violence, there's not that much hostility for black people on planes. perhaps because they were never that many. >> that's interesting thank you. so this question comes from marilyn kendricks. she said what i was a five year old black girl in 1954 i flew through laguardia to washington national with my mother put our seats were not together. there's white businessman is set next to each of us which switch seat allow me to it sit next to my then i got sick on takeoff and then they were happy to switch. [laughter] >> i have not.
i guess must be something about the seats. i think getting sick would certainly change their mind. the airlines were ordered to no longer put black people together by a special code in the early 50s. i don't know why they end up in separate seats though. gosh, long story. mary says, did your research discover segregation laws passed the jim crow era such as connecticut which are still segregated up until the 1970s. >> i think that might have been covered by the civil rights law 1974 but maybe not. >> they start with the weight ins in 1960. there were a lot of weight ins
protest here in florida. it was a long fight. as one of the last barriers at least in florida. a lot of new wonderful research on that. none wide. >> i think the segregation in connecticut was not legal it was just customary, wasn't it? >> yes here in st. petersburg is not an ordinance but it was enforced by the police, almost always. they try to find a place where blacks could swim but was often in the most disgusting place imaginable for the railroad tracks ended it was actually the biggest issue here for years. they finally had a swim in and a spa where the learn to swim. and they won incorporate then they close the pool of course for a year but then they reopened it.
a lot of those heroes are still around. back in 1956. >> the things we take for granted being able to get in the ocean, right? right just a couple more >> this is the preamble. is it possible, even probable gas station advertising segregated restrooms was actually in a manner that might be perceived as being racist was in fact encouraging black people the reality being many gas issues in the south did not let the only not colored restroom was often segregated with defective plus better than going behind the stationer in the woods. kind of a veiled invitation.
>> it's a possible but not in that particular case for the other than the sign said was look ladies segregated restroom. it appeared to be addressed to white women in particular. you do raise a really good point in the sense there was stations were blacks could not, there some gas stations were blacks cannot even get gas. there are others where they cannot use restrooms. it was extremely common for segregated restrooms and gas stations that they were reserved for whites because not all gas stations had black restrooms. i could be wrong i think this was directed at white women nice white lady restroom for you. >> so is not a marketing tool? >> it was a marketing tool for white women. they were marketing yes.
>> how fascinating. one more question i think a number of people want to hear the answer to this. what would you want black lives matter activist today to take away from the history of transportation segregation. >> that is a really good question, really a hard one. i guess one thing i would take away from it, it was such a long struggle. it required such persistence that i guess it would tell black lives matter activist not to give up hope when things don't work. there were so many failed boycotts in failed segregated people kept coming back to it. i think persistence would probably be the biggest thing
i would take. also it takes all kinds of activism. with legal strategies to direct factions and boycotts. i think all of these things succeeded because people did more than one kind of thing. think that might be another important lesson. >> doctor jeff anything to add to that? >> no i do not think so i think it's a great answer. very tough question to end on. i would say, before we go tonight i feel remiss if i did not mention my maternal grandmother it was 4-foot 11, fancied herself the last of the abolitionists. we lived in pensacola, florida 1956 i was eight years old. i would go with her in the mornings downtown on the bus.
she would always insist on sitting in the back. we were the only ones in the back. i had no idea what was going on, for course later i was proud of her for that. but i had no idea why we're being stared at in the back of the bus. it was a wonderful memory that i have. direct line to talk about the freedom rides. spigot the wonderful evening out to thank you both so much for going to bring diane back up, but before i do that if you did not want to purchase traveling black before this program i cannot imagine you do not want to do that now. please follow the link in the chat support s and purchasing. >> thank you. and i'm going to bring diane back up i think we want to
both thank you together. i also do think the audience again for patience and forbearance as we got started this evening. we were a little bit delayed but i'm glad you're here. so, spent high blacks will come back for second just as a thank you is well doctor ray, that was really a wonderful conversation. an absolutely inspiring to read the book to and learn more so thank you so much. >> we are united in the director the entire staff of both institutions invite you both to come see us give a tour and for museums we really look forward to seeing you here. let's make that a date will mccann. >> thank you. think about your transportation methods i guess as you get there.
[laughter] [laughter] thank you to our audience and we look forward to sharing additional programs that we do in concert with each other, thanks so much. becca looked out some books being published this week. best selling author malcolm gladwell development of precision bombing during world war ii the bomber mafia. minnesota senator amy klobuchar looks at attempts to dismantle monopolies throughout american history in the book antitrust. and in stronger flex the late center john mccain also been published this week carnegie endowment senior fellows steven helsing explores the use of social media and technology to suppress dissent and the rise of digital repression. and in the age of acrimony, story john greenspan describes america's volatile political
landscape in the late 19th an early 20th century. find these titles this coming week wherever books are sold and watch for many of the authors and their future on book tv, on cspan2. ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ >> here are some programs to look out for on book tv. tonight on her quickly author interview program, "after words", "washington post" staff writer john woodrow cox reports on the effects of gun
violence on children. then former republican speaker of the house john weiner of ohio reflects on his time in congress and the future of the republican party. an investigative journalist amanda ripley shares her thoughts on how people can engage in healthy conflict resolution. that all starts this evening at 9:00 p.m. eastern on book tv. find more schedule information @booktv.org or consult your program going. >> hello everyone welcome to the book forum i am can't i have a pair of exceptional guest to discuss the infiltration of political objectives into market systems like finance and the accumulation of capitol. before we get into the program i've to quick reminders for the audience. first, we are recording this and it will be made available on our website and youtube. we encourage you to change the presentation to give us fee