tv Public Affairs Events CSPAN April 6, 2021 4:27pm-6:04pm EDT
bidens administration response. c-span.org/coronavirus. >> ceo of moderna talked about the development of moderna's covered vaccine and distribution. pepperdine university. >> tell us about you and i have heard you say have an eye for outbreak. how in the world did you end up doing what you're doing now? >> good evening, everybody. i spent my life and had a chance to work the past 25 years i've
been working and -- [inaudible] who worked i was trained to help this food outbreak, disease, infection so i've always when i look at the news, i look for what's going on, there's always an outbreak somewhere and i was between christmas and new year's. t when is infection in china,. [inaudible] these agents in china and with in a few hours saying we don't know and the next day they sentn an e-mail and all of us that we
we were able to stop the clinical study. >> thank you. doctor helen. you've done so much in the cancer world i am incredibly familiar with. talk about yourr term they. >> thanks, appreciate the opportunity to be here, this is a distinguished panel and a great opportunity so thank you. i was, i guess i still am a cancer doctor but i practiced until 2017 and i had research patient driven care and a passion from over the years i entered the ranks of executive suite to help lead our organization through difficult
times and learned a lot about healthcare administration and finance and when this opportunity arose to serve the american people, to me it was a combination of a lot of things i had done in my career including most important patient care and puttingud patients first and alo research driven data and approach to how we develop and ultimately used novel therapeutic diagnostics so i took over in december 17, 2019 totally expected my life to be about e cigarettes and other issues that were topical at the time, the opioid crisis and etc. only to find in january a similar circumstance all of a sudden we began to hear about this virus infection in wuhan, china. quickly thereafter command the
food and drug administration and the rest i think a lot of people know about what we prioritize was w number one science above everything else but number two innovation because innovation would be the most important part of saving lives. as we saw diagnostics, ventilators, therapeutics and vaccines of course, that's what we focused on. the agency and the doubling of its work over the past year, we were very fortunate to work with some incredible folks including moderna in the private sector. one major lesson from the pandemic has been the importance of the private sector and without the private sector in the country we would, in partnership with government, we wouldn't be where we are todayit so in honor to be here and thank you very much. >> thank you so much.
chiefnk medical officer of one f the largest healthcare providers, particularly interested in how your experience of the va positioned you for the role you are now playing. >> thank you so much. i am delighted to be here with external colleagues that have allowed us to have vaccines the way we do now. thank you for the opportunity to join. i'm not sure there is real preparation, when i joined healthcare pharmacy, you may be the first executive to downsize. a massive organization, over 35 million patient encounters each and every year 202,011, 120 patients, the geographic footprint across 189 hospitals,
2000 sites, my background similar to my colleagues, i am an intern, my area changedha though from molecular pharmacology to help service researches but as part of the exercise, my mentor, a terrific epidemiologist was the founders society introduced me to the study and using up tools to understand quality of performance and entities make performance better so it was pretty good training ground for obvious reason, during my tenure we had experienced during 9/11, the pandemic with tabletops and
it allows you to develop perspective how you handle the next crisis, interesting, everything about the pandemics for 30 years so i joined my colleagues and remember the early part of the year when i was working on opioids with your colleague, secretary of health and hours moderating a panel in florida on opioids but convinced the organized, probably focus on uscoronavirus. it was large-scale on this and i think it's the best possible preparation but i think none of us would have anticipated this past year has been. >> thank you so much.
let's get to some hotter question. the new york times, 11 -- 11:30 p.m., close to 4000 patients in the study, tell us about this breaking news. help our audience understand particularly about a person vaccinated and the risk of transmission. would you help us understand? >> the cdc came out with exciting news that people are getting the vaccines in a very high rate. there reporting 80% and it's
very important in the direction of the production of 90%. there is data on the contrary, israel showing the vaccines are very high, we are still in a clinical study and doctor helen and his team, trying to figure out the right way for the pandemic. early in the spring, 10000 in phase three and four dialogue with the agency within the agency, they came back to us --b [inaudible] this was very helpful to the industry because as we move, we knew every part, we don't offer
my safety. in the real world, they have these people so the safety is even higher. you might think of somebody with cancer so i think the greatness of today and the past few weeks, very high rate and in two weeks because your system needs to work in high-quality neutralizing antibody.ie on the believe the numbers over a number of cases and in the past few months, i am excited when i get up every morning, i got to my work site and check how many people have been vaccinated. about 65 years old because they
are very high risk. we are atre 73% this morning an adult over 18, 18 and above and 18 and above, 18% i think this morning so exciting to see more and more, i think this weekend a few days and rope with the premium injection, it's remarkable. the next four weeks or so incredible momentum in the country. c i believe we are moving into a world where we the vaccine, we have too many vaccines in the fridge, it's a very high program. >> yes, it is. he mentioned how fast, how in the world with moderna was able to go as fast as it did? >> a few things, i think it is
technology, that went very fast and nine vaccines in clinical studies before and other things on how to improve technology and we have manufacturing plants in the u.s., we have relied on contract manufacturers who might negotiate contracts it allows us to move as fast as we have to an early january 2020, programs in the factory so the vaccine technology a few years ago was the tool we use to make the vaccine, it shows you how it is.
people have worked literally seven days a week, people are appalled night we knew everything and many times the media, every american should be truly proud of the work the agency has done last year. i've been in this business 105 years. nursing times like this,co everybody should be very proudso of our administration and the team has done. we have two to three zoo meetings in the daya sometimese have questions and need answers quickly and we make those decisions and they meet with us and know how to guide us. give us a few hours you can go
meet with the agency as it should anden they can jump on hm again have more questions and we move forward and they go and come back, it's remarkable. i have e-mails in my folder, 11:00 p.m., people just walking working nonstop. something with the phase one, test the program and then i a received a lot of credit and the funding to congress and the senate last year because the u.s. either look what you're has done, the u.s., we never cut any
corners on design and safety, phase one to phase two to phase three. but the funding of the six companies and j&j companies for proven in this portfolio, it's like a business risk we could do things in parallel where you would do it usually. usually you stop making material when you get to the phase one and you make sure they are okay to do the study. you supplement your product but that keeps adding time one after another and say no, we can't do that, that's crazy. we have this dilemma, phase two
materials so goes in and it takes business, risk and save lives. u.s. really like the way and the rest of the planet is remind people in our country, you get the moderna vaccine with tax sales because of the study in the u.s., great collaboration. >> yes, it was continues to be -- that's a great segue to doctor hahn. there's so g much in the news
about a vaccine in the fda perhaps some companies there have been some struggles or pause that might happen your trial. help the audience understand, what does it take for the fda to say a vaccine is safe and effective? i think you're on mute. o >> i'm on mute. first of all, that was a beautiful description of what i think was a really important part of last year in respect to collaboration and engagement of industry and the agency, very important. it's a robe that the future, it is how we have to conduct business moving forward. we are the agency of course take the safety of the vaccine. safely, it's not just because we were using an emergency use authorization rights in the actual law we have to assess risk-benefit we always do that when we assess any product whether it's biological or drug or device, etc. and look at both safety and efficacy as mr. vento said in the setting preventative, preventing infectious disease where people are presumably help healthier,
the bar is much higher in respect to safety so we engaged early on in conversation with industry from preclinical phase one and two as described, we did this in parallel because we didn't want one to two to three to four months of delay doing these steps but what is really important is the same level of scrutiny, the same assessment of safety was used normalat application, that's a normal application for a vaccine so it is absolutely correct no corners were cut but should demonstrate the american people that it can be done and can be done in incredibly expedited -- and iff we all work together to do this and if it hadn't worked, it had been saved, it would have
stopped. what we would have wasted hisis money and time and effort by scientists, who would have learned something but that's what we would have lost in itha would have stopped. a lotha of what's been in the ns about vaccine guidance around safety, this was very important to the agency, we communicated this through sponsors such asom moderna verbally but we also published guidance because we want the american people to know we use data carefully performed and conducted randomized medical trials including an appropriate follow-up. just from the safetypp perspective, are required 15% during the median number of people on the phase three trial had to have at least two months of safety follow-up data. in the vaccine world, you know around day 48 is when you reach the most significant side effects when you can state that
a vaccine is safe, we decided to go 60 days, some said 90 days but bottom line, we put d our stake in the ground as to what we think would be the data we need to assure the american people vaccine was safe and effective and of course that's what we saw in these clinical trials. it's a remarkable medical achievement. it is a grand slam and could not have been done without the great work of moderna, pfizer, j&j, etc. in partnership with the federal government but i want to assure folks that we use very strict criteria for the issues of safety with the vaccines and the agency will continue to do that. >> thank you. i know the hours you worked for sure, i'm not sure you went home too often in anticipation of the vaccine. i want you to talk about what it was like as you awaited the
vaccine approval and distribution and maybe follow-up how you see the vaccine in the world healthcare and aca. >> what was like, i'll discuss a little insight of what was going on, it was like kids at christmas, we were waiting for the present thanks to the great work of folkso like mr. console and mr. hong offered. we knew this would really change things so with your work, you obtain 400 compounds trial, this time with beneficiaries of that umgreat work but we use the same emergency operations approach we use for managing covid and we haveve work but i don't want the
moment to pass without a heartfelt thanks to all the individuals, we have the privilege of over one 20000 patients in 2020, ten times that number of outpatient so these were individuals experiencing the same challenges in the communities and households as healthcare providers but our organization we have work and it's not unlike what doctor hahn has seen at hhs, situational awareness, we look at the trends in our capacity and surges, the same sort of emergency operation with the vaccine because we know as soon as the vaccine was available, getting it to care providers and patients and
communities changed the game so bear with us, it's a lot to bring prepay type of emergency operation. we have some of the acceptance, unfortunately healthcare workers are not free of what is politically called vaccine hesitancy. rule number one of public health, a consistent message but this was a technology perceived as to decades in the development so it was an overnight success based on decades of preparatory work and it does the job with the viruses that bring us traditional vaccines, our job
was to communicate that this wasn't somethingac new, it is something available now based oo extraordinary work for a variety of years so when we first started vaccinating individuals had early adopters they were enthusiastic the we saw the literature that shows certain categories of individuals particularly on the vaccine of the first individual at the vaccine, the mood changed. celebratory. my wife is a pediatric emergency physician and went over with nurses and doctors and it was celebratory. commissioner hahn, tears in their eyes, they know day in and day out they were there were patients, they know it could potentially be a factor to theei household, parent chronically ill, compromise children or
individuals are just healthy and in the wrong place att the wrong time and the ability to decrease transmission changed and that turned its eye. others who might have been hesitant wanted to get in line and it changed from making sure we get peopleth vaccinated to making sure we get as much vaccine as people want. not only is the vaccine proving effective with today's report from cdc but so too are the sentiments about vaccines and i think that is important. worrying about the variance, my colleagues to talk about that, let's face it, until covid, influenza, the food was the number one vaccine preventable cause of death in the u.s. citizens and healthcare workers had hesitancy about taking that vaccine despite the fact even in
healthcare you could infect and harm patients. our organization was the one who mandated flu vaccines or wearing a mask or getting removed from patient care contact. that changed it so important to educate on the ability not just open doors for better health but for better social environment across our country. >> where do you think healthcare providers are today in terms of encouraging the vaccine versus mandating? you mentioned, i am proud of the fact that we are very strict on the flu vaccine, where you think providers are to do a mandate versus encouragement? >> how to into the judgment on health services, self automate for them, it is a challenge to
not have to mandate but clearly i think with education encouragement becomes the social norm and the question changes from why are you doing this? to why are you not doing this? >> last question in this section, what is your biggest concern now as it relates to distribution, anything related to the vaccine, what is it right now? i think you are on mute. >> apologies. the reasons commissioner on said, we have extraordinary supply and description but it is asymmetric.ry i think we need to encourage the individuals to take the vaccine.
covid is not a terribly good vaccine to get the actual infection, it works for a period of time but unlike the vaccine it doesn't confront durable immunity. i think the education again now i'd be interested in my colleagues thoughts on this, it's become apparent, the vaccines are remarkable showing effectiveness against the variance.my my fear is that it will change from pandemic to more endemic and we are going to need, i will use the technology careful, not a booster with the same string t next year but seasonally with influenza. a new vaccine updated to the strengths that are there. public safety education for what comes nine months to a year from now has to begin right now the biggest concern as weig get a ld and learn from this first
episode, things to where the vaccine was delivered, we are anticipating work in 2022. >> that is a great segue, help us feel better about the future. >> if you think about the company with the virus, it was just you take. some mutations are actually stronger evolution than the previous one and they take over and keep them going so reported in the media, they are on a scale the uk and africa and
brazil, new york, california, one in india. so i agree the pandemic, we are going to have a phase with thea virus is a lot because there's so many people on the planet and i worried deeply about the next six months words going to be in the spring. then we go through the winter. if you look at the africa and brazil, countries with high rates, great strong place for
the virus to mutate start to worry about variance because. [inaudible] 2.03.0, i think it is where it is now, what we know is vaccine seems to provide high level of antibodies with the strengths in the uk, it's becoming more vibrant there. it's great new news for the people who have been vaccinated. what we have seen so far with the results string, a drop in antibodies, for people who might be infected with the less frequent strains in the u.s. right now but we are to be t
and so we will keep as long as they are well under control and one of them main things is you canno combine it. we have a program that will soon be free. phase 1 and phase 2 against dmv. i invite youou to google cmv tonight to coast as a pillar of the country. there is only one because during pregnancy would he infected eye of virus so we kept the name. and this product and phase 3
has 600 molecules. so he is the resident thread biology and is highly efficacy of the vaccine. it means that if we have a new version of vaccine and the agency has set very clear guidelines for what they expect to know what studies to give them the efficacy and save the statistics but we can then do 1.0 and combined them in the same but given the current timeline it's available for people that were back there last december. to provide them a booster but then it becomes an
issue. combines to work out to 1.0 from november for example with the vaccine was two in the same dose. we have done six in the clinic but if you look at it you look at nature. we have thousands at any given moment so nature can't do it science can do it or it it might take a little work to figure out but this is the right technology and enough people on the planet are immunized or vaccinated the virus has less and less house ability to mutate. just a number game. i think the variants will
involve pretty quickly. i think then they will slow down and i think we are just going to get a boost in one of the things were working on is the highest efficacy vaccine because the vaccine in a good year they are okay and thus we have a bad -- i take them every year because it's good practice. but the highest efficacy of flu vaccine to get you the right boost for the virus of covid into the same dose. >> let me make sure everybody is clear. l your goal is to really take care of us so that we have a flu vaccine, and covid together. >> in one dose.
in the fall you get the highest efficacy vaccine. you get your covid boost for the right strain of the moment. it specially for people. >> great. that's exciting. with herd immunity everybody talks about it and we hear that we are there, we are not there will never be there. talk to the audience about herd immunity and what your view is. >> for sure. you heard dr. perlin and mr. mr. bancel address those issues. you vaccine anyone who has
immunity whether it's natural immunityty protection or vaccination the case of kobe would be the number of people we can vaccinate and is there a number in people in the population that you can vaccinate so that the virus basically has nowhere to go. has trouble finding people to infect and as mr. bancel said that the number game at this point. now we have passed around over the last year 70 to 80%. for me it i just don't know that number with covid-19. if you look at measles for example herd immunity is 95%. that's 95% ofyo the population vaccinated in order to prevent the spread in order to have the measles virus not find someone to infect and without easy occasional outbreaks although that's the subpopulation and so we think it's probably in the 70 to 80% range but that is again a
lot of this depends upon howow contagious and transmissible viruses. so we are getting there but i think this is the global problem that doctors bancel described in the strategy that he described as really important and key underlying that to get us to herd immunity ultimately is monitoring of the mutations in the variants that we see from this virus and then addressing the science aced upon those variants. i would argue we haven't done that terrific of the job up until now. routers not only for vaccines but it matters for therapeutics the mamba, and the body but also matters for the diagnostic test so we need to keep a very close eye on this. we need to bring a lot of resources to bear in sequence at when we have suspicion of variants and there's a screen methodology for that in that we can do exactly what doctors
bancel described. the peak on the regulatory side and that is just like the flu vaccine every year we don't have a 30,000 person study of a new flu vaccine. we have studies that allow us to say okay if you can develop neutralized antibodies, antibodies in response to a new vaccine that should be sufficient to provide protection andff of course we have ongoing safety data as weon saw today. in the article that was published by the cdc so all those need to be a together for us to get to herd immunity and i think probably we will see somewhere around 80% will be needed before we can get that into the populations i want to emphasize it is a global issue not just a u.s. issue. >> right, thank you so much. thank you from me and from the audience. you won't be surprised that we are getting a lot of questions about masks and vaccinations.
dr. perlin we are in the same city and i hope you won't be mad at me. i want to start with you as a relate to how were we thinking about mask? the number of vaccinations that are happening every single day what is your vieww and perhaps how you are thinking about that in the larger renovation? >> i think about masks and vaccines in a similar fashion. a mask is the momentary reduction of the vaccine a durable protection and doctors bancel two spoke yellow -- eloquently about herd immunity for we need to get to the position where one person doesn't infect one or more other people but in fact has a chance to infect f fewer than one persn so the infection in the population goes away and i think
covid has heightened the sense of the important of vaccines and i mentioned prior to covid vaccine preventable causes of death so we have two get a hind it. even if you never get sick you can still carry the virus, d covid, flew to other individuals. we needd to change methods. it may be about you if you are sick or concerned but it's really about other people. so just to give you an example among health care workers who don't get vaccinations, we did some studies and they said okay can you prove this. whenen they take your blood they look or antibodies and two-thirds of individuals say i didn't get sick and i didn't get vaccinated and i didn't need it. wrong. anybody that shows that they have been exposed to the
ambulance and could have infect that patients emily members and others. so it's regrettable this notion of mass vaccinations are so polarizing. there's so much misinformation. if you get back to the first principle my first principle would the don't do-it-yourself do it to the folks you love do it for a community in your country. we need to educate the new technology like mrna. decades of science and you don't mutate yourself. they created routine to develop some antibodies and other forms of immunity. we need to get rid of some of the myths. and i say this with a great deal of passion. i'm the parent of a knock cystic child on the spectrum. vaccines do not cause autism. eckstein's have been implicated by all sorts of things then it's
out smulian correct. vaccines are a form of rejecting the people communities and country love. on the importance of vaccines building health education and wonderful universities like pepperdine i would started grade school in great preschool and health education. we need to start early and we need to be consistent and we need to use all the different faith organizations etc. to carry the message. for those who are interested in the economic repercussions of not just this pandemic but all these infectious diseases this is really the ticket to opening the economy and openingng the environment. >> doctors hahn it like to review your comments as well and
it interesting to hear dr. perlin's personal experience with his own son. would o you mind giving your viw on the -- related to the vaccine as well? >> for sure. and dr. perlin beautifully said you know back scenes and masks became an unfortunate nonscientific but often political based discussion in our country and we do have to get back to the basics, i completely agree and it's really an orchard that those who are the most vulnerable and most at risk are those who may be the most influenced by information that is not factual. vaccines are highly safe and probably the number one major and most significant public health measure we have and have never had in the history of mankind without he too dramatic iad think it's just that important.
now we are never 100% in the know from a clinical trial are from years of study about the safety and that's why ongoing monitoring is important areas of what we do know is exactly what's been said here today which is these mrna vaccines did not alter a person's genome and they do not have any biological basis for the thought that they may cause serious health problems associated with them and as we -- and remember mrna vaccines are not new. the agency has seen applications for mrna applications in the past so this wasn't a totally new entity when we saw that and i think the data that we are seeing such as the cdc continues to reassure us about the safety of the vaccines. but again just to get back to the really important point the dr. perlin made and that is there a lot of arguments about
well just let the virus spread, in fact everybody and we will get herd immunity to natural eviction and here's a great thing about the world we live in right now. we don't know who those people are walking down the street the doctor perlin is describing who are the most vulnerable. and you know this very well who has chemotherapy for crew is immunosuppressive or who might have hiv? so dismiss the fact that young people don't seem to get as sick and so we get through herd immunity through spread of natural infection and we would be putting a lot of people at risk and doing this for grand mom and grandpa been doing this for our country is just so, so important so the vaccine and mask wearing go hand-in-hand and we do need to do more education and then one final point, who thought a year ago, year and a
half ago that anyone in this country would be talking about phase 3 randomized trials and data monitoring boards and would be talking about levels of evidence would be talking about emergency use authorization. none of us thought that would happen. we have a moment to capture on what we have all been paying attention to and that's an advantage to educate the american people in the world on how this great science has driven innovation. >> thank you dr. hahn. mr. ban so this question comes up so often. i have two daughters myself of childbearing age and the question happens over and over again is the safety for those women pray could you shed some light on how your chief medical officer who i know well and
maybe audiences -- will you help us understand that better? >> it's something we haven't studied in pregnant women. we have done for teenagers and young children to 11 years of age. we have no clinical data on pregnant women. the cdc and the nih have presented a lot of data. it's very critical and we should all work closely together to get as many as we can. there was very exciting news sent that the baby had
antibodies from his mother. we thought this would happen and that's why lack nation is very healthy for babies health but what do we know about the science? we know the amount injected into humans. as we have proven time after time in many studies outside of the company [inaudible] it's the you put around it to protect it. that has a powerful -- so we are doing more work in collaboration
with -- who proved that it never gets intoo the nucleus of the da that's very important. this has been proven through time-lapse video where you can follow the dna and this is then shown in many academics around the country. so the safety and as far as what will happen i think it's -- and so that's basically how he believes the pregnant women can safely take the vaccine and that's the current update on pregnant women. >> if i could just jump in and add something there.
mr. bancel is exactly right the clinical data from the trials there's not a lot of data with respect to this but i think again this is a risk-benefit rajon to reason.org. g. and other stupid u.n. group in recommending it is we have tn remember that for those who have mild kopitar those who have survived covid-19 there long-term consequences and there is an increased risk for example of stillbirths and other issues if pregnant women get w in fact did. not to make it totally personal but i have a daughter who's pregnantnt and i have told her o get the vaccine because i realized the health than -- so i knew you were going to be something else but i want to throw thathi in there that is
about risk benefits. go to your doctor and have a discussion about it. >> thanknk you.org hahn. dr. perlin give our audience the word to speak their family members and friends as you think about have a comp or station and do the work to understand but could you give us a complex topics and synthesizing that brothers and would you help our audience understand speaking to a family member when they say i- just don't know what the long-termat effects will be? >> you know i have this conversation as recently as this morning with an executive here in town and this individual as you no how will i know and what
my answer was was really tough. we have experience with a lot of other vaccines that we have decades of science in which this vaccine is -- actually drew a picture of it and it doesn't go into the nucleus. it simply creates the proteins which you want your immune system to attack. so i party mentioned the importance but do it for you those around you. and in the vigil as an elderly mother in a long-term care center and the ability to reduce your likelihood of caring virus over his hesitancy but this -- there is no scientific basis for
rejecting a vaccine. there's a strong scientific basis for a personal risk as doc there hahn said. in 2020 we had the religious caring for 20,000 in patients. h the risk of death due to age, here's the kicker even if you are young and healthy you may be part of the 9.999% who do fine but maybe you have something that wasn't diagnosed and elaboration in your main system and maybe you were just unlucky. maybe you are that star football player who gets it and it doesn't go well and you know what the worst part is? is preventable.
and the communication is you are banking against science on her wrist that's not likely. againstie a risk that is absolutely could have catastrophic outcomes. >> let me of something. if you look at some of the scientific data we now have on covid if you get the fibrosis in the lungs or the kidneys you don't want anything to happen to loved one and like they said at the seminar you may be fine where you are if you are have immune health but it's not worth what could be a lifelong disability.
the 35-year-old 80 with asthma and so on and so on she can barely walk now because her lungs had been damaged by this virus. it's just awful. >> dr. perlin on the flu vaccine if you will allow me to read the question pretend dr. perlin explained how vaccines are the number one vaccine for preventable death and number one we do not know their efficacy until we after we have taken them a number two previous flus have shown them closer axioms with negative efficacy and that changes in the production to prevent this from happening and
leslie there are claims provided by health professionals of the flu vaccines do not reduce hospitalizations and deaths in the elderly population but is that true or false? >> false. so in a mild flu season they are there roughly 20,000 deaths across the united states. let me say that again 20s thousands of. and a bad flu season it's up to about 60,000. in. a pandemic year it can exced 100,000. most of these are in preventable and the flu vaccinationth is the combo vaccination from the strains that are in the hemisphere and hopefully they match but sometimes they don't get all 3% times they get two or three and sometime it's one of the three. usually it's two to three and that's pretty good. i'm waiting for not only the
combined coronavirus influenza vaccine but the holy grail of vaccines that are stable from year-to-year and part of the influenza. i don't know how many years out that is but to adapt the vaccine means the likelihood that vaccine would be a match for the strain is greater so sometimes a tragedy accelerates innovation and that's really true here. the innovation was working and we can better match the vaccines to the strains that are floating. and as to the question no one has ever done a trial to prove it prevents hospitalizations and deaths. here's a question i always get about why we get have health waters -- health workers get axne for their studies that show the exact genetics at the flu which i may be caring got to this patient that i'm treating.
how could you in good conscience do a study to compare not transferring a potentially fatal virus to an intervention that are vince transmitting a potentially fatal virus. it would be grossly unethical for the data shown that the virus is transmitted so i think the ask is really passed off to mr. bancel. you think we can manufacture something that accelerates the match because it's already worth while? can we make it even better? >> as i've said we are down to around 30 days. i think we can move to a world where we are utter match even by
region. and you can adapt. we need to make a new map of the strain.at we vaccinate health care workers and we are vaccinating the elderly in january and february. >> mr. bancel talking about you indicated the very beginning how the happenings there are the non-happenings there are hard for you to see. how can we help the rest of the world in the vaccine scenario? how are we going to help this country get the supplies that they need in order to keep citizens safe?
why your thoughts they are? >> we can do a lot of thingss as a a country as an industry. shindo we have faxing supplies around the worldnd are ready. not one company can save the planet and i hope we aren't the only vaccine that's working. just to give youe a sense in 29 for a full year we made less than 1000 for full year and i sat down with the head of manufacturing in every of 2020 and i said hey how do we make a billion doses in 21 and he looked at me kind of funny because it would be 10,000 times more.
go ask anybody making cars if they can make 10,000 times more they would look to you like you arek crazy. many companies are helping each other working together. if we are at the stage now where where -- including the sick specs seems that the u.s. government has. they are in most countries around the world. [inaudible] and then a bit of kind the u.s. and preventive vaccines
manufacturing capacity of those six companies and their partners around the world. youe have the capacity that is 0 plus billion dollars which is a remarkable number and if you look at a lot of those companies including -- we are one of them because we had no manufacturing before. j&j haven't even made those -- so the thing about 2022 i expect the capacity in thect world to e in the billions of doses. that's a lot of vaccine. and so what we need to figure out is how do we accomplish around the world what is being done with covid by the w.h.o..
i wish we had been able to move faster faster than where we are today and the funding to pay for the machines to make the vaccines -- we are working hard to do the distribution which is great and assistant before because the increasing output in some countries like in the u.s. we are not exporting from the u.s. which i hope will change as soon as the u.s. has more access to the vaccine because the same manufacturing companies inside the u.s. and outside the u.s. would take think will happen soon in the spring that will help people around the world get the vaccine to reduce the spread of the virus and the chance for a new variant. so i'm hoping for a variant list
are as we spoke about earlier. we might need less per dose. that's a 100 micrograms of vaccine and we have to see the boost at 60 micrograms so it works but it might be less. that's the only thing that we shouldld do is at 50 micrograms you have twice as much output so you can do the math easily. and we can keep more vaccines. in my opinion what we need to do is to be able to export from the u.s. as much as we canan this
year. whether they are where houston vcr somewhere and people are lining up for those vaccines so we have to do it very soon and how do we get ready for next year so we have more vaccines. it takes a long. if you say -- we need them by july cannot do that. it's a highly regulated industry we talk about quality of unical data it's very important but the quality of the product we have to make sure every dose it leaves the factory and goes to be distributedac across the country at the same high-quality and purity and to make sure that
someone who gets the vaccine they know they are getting the vaccine that is the same in a clinical study. and because of those timelines and they arege machine made. then when they arrive we spent a lot of time in what is called qualifying the machine to make sure that the machine does exactly what it's supposed tomaa do. that makes the product so when you look at the machine -- it speaks to the process. so i'm sorry to spend a lot of my time focusing on 2022 but figure out how we nailed these viruses down next year. i believe what's happening in
the country which is amazing in terms of vaccinations the number of vaccines and getting ready court -- i think the u.s. is in great shape and her biggest risk is that not everybody will be vaccinated. i don't worry about the vaccine safety but i worry about how many people will be willing to be vaccinated. we have enough and as i mentioned earlier we need to make sure everybody gets the vaccine which is why we are pushing very hard for her studies on younger children because they might be carrying the virus and keeping is spreading in theg community. we need to make sure -- and so i
spent a lot of time on 2022 because i believe it's important. we have a chance to -- the virus and the mutation rate is very slow. you have a nice window. >> thank you. this is an interesting question coming from the chat. dr. hahn i will put you on your -- put you on the spot and you can refer to your colleague spread why should we take the vaccine when the frontline covid-19 critical care alliance testifiedd to congress that are perfect in successfully treats covid? >> i'm going to address the issue of the efficacy in just a minute butg we are looking at apples and oranges here and that
of vaccine provides some long-term protection. we don't know how long long-term protection with one or two doses of the vaccine against covid-19. we are having emerging data that might very well help with respect to transmission of the virus so that's a really important public health measure. that's why we should do this and mr. bancel and dr. perlin were very eloquent about maybe this isn't as important for yourself but it's important for the country. ivermectin is an anti-parasite the drug approved for specific indications and there have been some reports of using it and these are anecdotal reports of using it either for mild covid or as a preventative for covid and we recently had some grant of my stated that had just been published that demonstrated that
ivermectin was not effective in the treatment of covid-19 mild disease. w it was randomized medical trials performed in south america so we do not have data that suggest that ivermectin is effective but that's a whole separate issue and i can tell you from the agency's perspectiveve march 3 information about ivermectin it does have side effects and they are really isn't good efficacy data that suggests it's going to be a benefit that vaccines are a totally different situation in the vaccine that you have heard both scientific and biologic as well as clinical data to support its use as a preventative measure against infection and transmissibility for covid-19 so i would strongly urge people to take this vaccine to take these vaccines and let us continue to study other anti-viral agents as they come forward to see if they
have efficacy for folks infected with covid-19. >> thank you.org hahn per the right dies so many questions that we will never get to all of them but we will attempt to do that for the listeners to get those answers for you. i do want to move to what lessons have you learned. history is the best project or of the future and i wish we had a crystal ball. if you had it to do over again what would you do differently and what are thehe lessons leard for you during this time? dr. perlin i will start with you. >> thank you. it's a privilege to be with you and the two distinguished colleagues. i would like to make about starvation.
first i will say we need not just work but work research so i would you are mystified and thank you for partnering to put the opportunity of the big data to use. i welcome back to this but research is necessary. there's a special hardship on health careia workers and in tes of working with health care workers and we have to consider health and national security and economic and human rights issue. on the research 120,000 code positive patients and health care and even with your terrific organization and your attitude triptych researchers who have gotten for their compounds in the first human trials we don't have enough bandwidth to all do all the research. we launch something called covid
charts. the agency for health care research columbia harvard hopkins local medical college we have created a consortium to amplify the amount ofe research that can beou done. to answer questions about covid in its course and treatment and its prevention and ask susceptibility. these are all questions that it's exciting just as covid is setup for what derrida can do so too is covid is set up for how we can accelerate a new model for research. it's unprecedented that the organization actually takes this data puts it into a very secure mechanism and identifies this large consortium of researchers.
has the potential to amplify huresearch tenfold or 100-fold o we are really excited about that. on the challenge to health care workers again my thanks to each and every front-line health care provider across the country and those in public health in those in science and policy. there's something in health care call to aaa. more value better care experience higher-quality. here's another called quadruple witch is all those things but also health care workers. i think this is important concept this year. we need to build the resilience for that workforce that goes above and beyond in the final issue we live in one world. implants a crisis between other species evian flu obviously through birds and swine through and influences ultimately spread wide birds around the world picked to run a virus by human
migration in the curt commissioner hahn in mr. bancel that it doesn't become a cauldron for new variants and i think it's really important to emphasize process and international health cooperation in health policy. in making sure that vaccines are a worldwide phenomenon. health really is national security economic and human rights issue. thank you. >> thank you dr. perlin. y dr. hahn lessons learned? >> will thank you chairman smith and president for this opportunity. this has been a terrific discussion and my hats off to my colleagues on the panel, really well done. a couple of things that i think are really important. firsts of all where it is and
what the agency thinks it did right and what we are challenging we could do better. they publish something called prep which is our pandemic response back in may and june. i commissioned an outside group to look at what we had done in some recommendations and that's on line for those of you who are readjusted in seeing how that assessment of the agency responded a couple things i'd like to highlight. one is i think you saw in this pastor what we can do with a bit of money but more with mobilization of the private sector and government working together. mr. bancel said that does not mean a free pass because everyone including the company's attend upon a very rigorous discussion of safety nets so no one wants to see that, no one wants to be corner speak out but i think you saw a path moving
for the end help us expedite medical innovation and product innovation and wayne need to go back to that of week two said see the factors that went into that i would need to invest t in that great part of that is going to be investment in science and part of that's going to be education about science and part of that is going to be in beta and tech modernization because i think the issue of linking this to real-world data is l so key s dr. perlin said or they think it's really a critical part of that in a couple of other factors we identified at the agency one is more transparency. during a pandemic people wanted and were thirsty for more information. why do we make there decisions e make and how are those important and what they mean for people's health? that helps with trust and helps companies understand what the agency looks at what a makes a decision and the second major lesson i think we have learned, not learned but perhaps reemerged as an issue and that
is the importance of health disparities. we saw the most vulnerable among us were often the most effectiv weather was to get the socioeconomic conditions multigenerational households access to care suspicion of the medical community. you name it there's lots of problems there in issues and those who are most vulnerable and needed to science and the data the most were perhaps the most distrustful of it and i think we as a country perhaps as a world need to address the underlying issues there to make sure that everyone has access to these great medical innovations. moving forward those are the two big issues and going to dedicate myself to. >> thank you dr. hahn. mr. bancel. >> a few thoughts maybe. i was really extremely humbled by the quality of the
collaboration last year. i remember we used to work at the agency in january. i had just come back and it hit me in early january in late december i thought there would be an outbreak of sars or murzin when i was at davos -- i had become very committed. i was on my way to germany for business and this was the wrong place to go. they said when he are coming to kosovo and i said i don't know. they met at the department of
defense in the day when i landed and then went to the campus. i said how do we get the vaccine approved for september so my goal was september with but the respiratory virus. a new was going to come back and it was september and i didn't speak about it in september. [inaudible] i don't know but what was really remarkable to this is the cooperation. i'm very humbled. i've been doing this for 25
years and we approve collaboration between theio regulators. what was humbling for me is i have lice been known as the guy who works a lot but i work saturdays and sundays and crazy nights. i have to thank my family because i would start in the morning and my wife would bring me breakfast at 6:00 and bring me lunch at my desk as i was in lockdown the spring and she'd bring dinner and i go to bed exhausted and up again the next morning. i think for the family and i'm sure it's true for everybody as
we are all a family. i know when we heard the data from the safety board on sunday i remember walking out and saying to my wife -- and my kids and we all cried together. just knowing the vaccine was going to help. it was in our heads and our hearts that attacks would help in millions of families getting back to normal life. so if you give me another minute or two what can we do to -- i've been spending a lot of time thinking about this on my morning run and i think we can do a a few things and it doesn't require that much money.
all the scientists know of 20 viruses of concern for the next outbreak. this is going to come back but i don't know when. it might not be like the last time but it welcome back. it might need a different strain or inn need and. there's an awful virus in southeast asia that is pretty bad and we are just one mutation away. i don't think the nets pandemic blow -- so what we should do is we should work in partnership, work on all the science and quickly go the work on those viruses. then i think we should take them
to the clinic because you may have a differing opinion but i would argue [inaudible] the reason we could work so fast on mars -- murders -- [inaudible] we tried -- and every time the protein was the same so when the sequence was in line with the chinese government did early january we spent days looking at the structure of the protein in the sequence and they concluded
independently the moderna vaccine in cambridge -- fits exactly with their vaccine design. i said those we are going to make a decision. if it's strong the vaccine is goingroro to work and it was vey stressful for those two days. what we are reassuring asur we knew and so i think we should spend the money because it's not about the money. then we should take those to the clinic. we test for safety and in the case of last year's vaccine we did 25, 10150 micrograms because we do know the dose. before you do you look for
safety. phase 1 was the mers vaccine and we might not feel comfortable with the moderna. we have to do phase 1 for safety but the question is can he do it a bit faster because we will have a better sense of the dose. so there are a few things that could have been helpful and if you think about taking those to the clinic may be 20 million -- we should invest that money. we have a lot of academic groups to do a their work and we are keeping an eye and zika so they
need the vaccines and their new emerging viruses. theac good news we have the manufacturing capacity. i believe next time because there might be a next time we will make sure that vaccines are -- so they can go much faster. the last subject is this the most amazing country in the world. derek for me to say because i'm not american, but the willingness in this country to invest in science five oh yeah dollars we would need in moderna science before we made a penny of rocket. $5 billion.
if you went back 10 years ago but moderna in france or germany we wouldn't have enough money. you have great scientist and the debate we are having is a country on drug racing is really important.t. if we are not able to have innovation there will be no more innovation. dr. hahn will tell you there's a lot of safe to risk. i would challenge you to and i have nothing against canadians we could be sending from france. invest in the vaccine. look at td
as well. this is something very special to america. we need to preserve it. this is something special in america that we need to all preserve. innovation in science life science. thank you very much. thank you so much mr. bancel. i want to thank you personally for the sleepless nights and the technologies and innovations that you and your company have done in dr. hahn thank you for your sleepless nights the interviews the pressure and the fortitude and perseverance to get us where we were from a regulatory perspective and dr. perlin for the way that our front-line workers and hca helped you prepare for the vaccine rollout and the innovation and data insight that
you and your leadership team are providing with so many patients. it's so clear. i am so grateful to everyone for alll the questions. we could spend another hour answering all the questions. i just appreciate the engaged in and we do live in the greatest country in the world so again personally thank you from me in my role at pepperdine university as well as the ca health care. resident that to you. >> thank you deanna. chairperson smith for your leadership in this evening together i'm reminded as i listened to mr. sub 20 talk about from the time they receivedy the formula, the dna o come up with an actual vaccine
it takes me two days to do under a pile that come from learning what the virus was to creating a vaccine in just 42 days to create, to get it to production and then in 10 months and it wasn't just moderna it was you dr. hahn and your colleagues over the course of 10 months from the time we learned about it to the time it was going into people's arms this is nothingg short of historic or their grandchildren's grandchildren will be talking about the individuals on this call in the colleagues that were with them. this is a jonas salk plus marie curie plus luis pasteur plus neild armstrong going to the money creating a vaccine in the time that no one believed it was possible and the reason it was possible was because of this public-private partnership and innovation. we are standing on the shoulders of so many people in so many
places around the world. we just got a glimpse into where this is going. this is going into the flu and the zika virus and we haven't talked about it's also going to cancer research as well and to watch what is happening where the hand of god is guiding those on the skull and their colleagues to legs -- save literally millions of lives. there were millions of lives saved by people and call in their colleagues and is just incredible to witness and i just want to thank first light and on behalf of are dying in this country and this world wein owe you what debt of gratitude that can never be repaid or fully expressed but we need to let you know how much we appreciate you. thank you to all of you who have joined us on this call for the opportunity we have had to learn about what happened behind the scenes andnd to look into the future with the war to the next time we are together in the next presidential super series.