tv ICE Acting Director Testifies Before House Appropriations Subcommittee CSPAN July 26, 2019 8:01pm-10:12pm EDT
he is comfortable with ideas, he understands the power of ideas. and with that kind of foundation and intellectual foundation, a political leader into all kinds of marvelous things,. >> author lee edwards will be our guest on in-depth. he is the author of just right plus a collection of biographies. join our live conversation with your phone calls, tweets and facebook questions. watch in-depth with author lee edwards life sunday august 4 from noon to 2:00 p.m. eastern. what to 2019 national book festival on saturday august 21 on book to be on c-span2. and now, that hearing was ice acting director matthew all on
immigration enforcement practices. this is about two hours and ten minutes. >> thank you for your patience and willingness to stay until 4:00 o'clock. we appreciate it. today we welcome matthew albans, the u.s.. immigration and custos enforcement. they stand for being here this afternoon. as we continue to monitor the challenging situation on the southern border, we look forward to hearing your perspective on the funding priority and requirements. as cheers of the subcommittee, i am committed to ensuring the integrity and strengthening integration system. but i am equally committed to making sure we do so, according
to a way that is a bullfight our american values. in particular, we must assure in accordance with our values, both violence and persecution have meaningful opportunities to seek asylum. we must get this balance right and i believe that we can if we work together. it's a choice to believe that more migrants need to be unnecessarily detained and cruel and exclusionary immigration laws need to be enacted in order to increase security in our country. our own constitution, federal law and several international agreements, serve as a foundation for the rights and protection, i believe we can be embodied in our efforts to address the humanitarian crises that are currently experience you. unfortunate, the rhetoric and the policies of this ministrationise have made achieg that balance more difficult. and by all indications have
exacerbated our challenges at the border. we must also be mindful of the resource limitation that we fa face, there is likely no area of her bill where we have sufficient resources to fully address no requirements. for instance, we have barely cracked the service to address the flow of illegal drugs in the transit zone or to protect our sovereign interest in the arctic. detention is a very expensive option and should be reserved for cases of public safety or flight risk is a valid concern. when public safety is not a concern i should use alternatives. when used as intended with appropriate management and alternatives to detention have proven to be effective in mitigating flight risk and improving compliance with immigration court requirements. for those detention is
appropriate, i remain seriously concerned about substandard conditions at ice detention facilities. in addition to what i have personally witnessed, we continue to get alerts from the media, the office of inspector general, the government accountable the office and advocacy organizations about detention facilities that do not meet minimum standards but are nevertheless allowed to continue operating. preventing these inhumane o conditions can only be achieved if ice leadership makes clear that anything less is unacceptable. and will have consequent this. i will continue to work with ice to ensure that this happens. on a more positive e note, i wat to highlight good work the ice does in areas of combating human trafficking, human smuggling, child exultation in the smuggling of fentanyl and other
opioids. in the fiscal year 2019 appropriation, the subcommittee provided additional resources to homeland security investigation for these efforts. this is a great example of f where we have worked together to accomplish shared goals and we have sustained these efforts and our fiscal year 2020 bill. lastly, i want to follow-up on the letter i sent you on july 12 about increased interior enforcement operations. i requested that you submit for the record today, the written policies and procedures which i described in that letter. this kind of transparency is very important. for us to better understand how isis leadership expects the front-line officers and agents to operate. i understand that you have submitted documents in response, i thank you for that and i look forward to reviewing them and will follow-up accordingly. before he turned to the director of a summary of his written statement, they will include in the hearing record that i first recognized our distinguished
ranking member for any remarks he wishes to make. >> thank you, madam chair. i am going to keep my remarks very brief as i know wen have been delayed by votes. welcome director. thank you for your time and your testimony before the subcommittee today. there has been a lot of change in leadership positions at the department in recent months and it is reassuring to me to have an acting director which for years really decades, of experience at the home. thank you for assuming the awesome responsibility of waiting is law enforcement and homeland security agency. i very much appreciated the other day with you and your most able staff to visit the update, help me too understand exactly where we are and where we are going, again i thank you for
your hard work. i look forward to working with you and i look forward to your testimony today. i yield back. >> the order which members will be covered questioning will be based onn the seniority when the hearing was called to order. alternating between majority and minority members. also to ensure everyone has ample opportunity to ask questions, i asked the each member stay within the allotted five minutes per round. director, please begin your statement. >> good afternoon chairwoman ranking member and distinguished members of the subcommittee. as you are aware, united states is currently facing an unprecedented national security and humanitarian crisis at herself as border. for the pastas year, a number of alien temper headed at this office porter has increased
significantly. today however, i am here to address other parts of immigrationn system the remainig desperate need of resources and funding as well as the legislation that will help put an end to the current war in crisis once and for all. the fact is, the majority of aliens encountered at or near the border are released into the interior of the united states were removal proceedings and immigration courts currently have a backlog of 900,000 cases and growing. the dedicated officers and agents are responsible for managing these cases as well of those of more than 300 aliens on docket. many aliens do not appear for removal proceedings violate the terms to detention program. and failed to appear for the hearing or comply with removal orders. the result is that the border crisis has become a national crisis. it requires a strong interior that uncertainty to orders by immigration judges. the reality is, if our
immigration laws are only enforced at the border, and you failed to provide adequate resources to ensure that those proceed with immigration process, and if order removed, or actually removed the entire system will break down. this will continue to serve as a magnet to legally enter the country. with a semi, ine come to ask for your assistance in providing ice that funding that it desperately needs to address the humanitarian crisis also the concurrent national security and public safety crises. while isis immigration enforcement is focused on the interior, the current situation darkly impacts this agency and its resource requirements. cbp, 780,633 quarters include more than 300,000 aliens and the rest on company children. notably, in the last few months i so has been forced to release
where the 250,000 members of families into the interior of the united states due to the agreement. isis resources have been overburdened by the cbp apprehended that this office porter and congress has repeated failure for transportation requirements at levels. ice is currently detaining over 53000 single adult in approximately 8000 single adults and cbp custody awaiting to be tran3 to ice. very limited detention capacity, ice much reserve detention space for those who require mandated detention along with those who pose a national security public safety or flight risk. however, based on increased enforcement activity, additional ice capacity and transportation funding is urgently needed. to ensure the security and safety of the united states, and the faithful execution of immigration laws passed by congress, ice must conduct actions against any alieny which is in violation of the law. despite what is been reported,
these are indiscriminate raids or sweeps, instead, isis operations are carefully planned based on person specific intelligence leads forcing on those of a threat as well as those who have received an order of removal from an immigration judge. approximately 90% of arrest in the interior of this country are aliens that have prior convictions, face pending criminal charges, fugitives, previously been removed from the country and have illegally reentered. which is a federal felony the ice. prosecutes. the crisis on the border is negatively impacted the interior enforcement mission and that is a public safety of our communities. resources dedicated to removing dangerous credit under criminals from the street have a workload study from the border search resulting in over 14% decrease in criminal alien arrest this fiscal year. additionally, ice has reassigned
members of operation teams to manage the daca to help her sworn to the border crisis. the failure to increase funding over the course of the last decade has created a magistrate of specific aliens who have failed to comply with orders or conditions including those of atb. without sufficient numbers and operation officers to search for interest aliens who fail to comply as well as sufficient detention space to be detained once arrested, they will continue to offer very little benefit for its cost. additional resources are also requested an fy 22 ensure the principal legal advisor the statutory responsibility to prosecute administrative cases for the courts.
more critically, and most critically, i like to highlight legislative changes that urgently needed. to be clear, the fy 20 budget request only provides the necessary funding and resources for ice to address the symptoms of the crisis. it does not have any resources solve the problem. legislative changes are the only vital option to put an end to the crisis in the victimization looking for a better life and starving the cartel and transnational criminal organizations since of illicit enterprises. after the changes, current laws continue to be exploited and the factors will only result in more illegal immigration and the manager crisis. we ask you to one, terminate the flores settlement agreement and the detention authority with respect alien minors. amend the traffic from victim reauthorization act to provide for the prompt repatriation who are not victims of human trafficking and do not express
fearar of returning to the home country. in address the credible fear stated. the current standard has proven to be s ineffective.ng by requiring the conclusion of immigration proceedings, well-intentioned court rulings by being exploited. they've created and attired illicit industry with millions of dollars be made to the sale, rental and recycling of children utilized by adult to pose as family units. despite this activity home and security has reassigned hundreds edof special agent to border patrol facilities. the same loopholes also occurred illegal immigration is a record number indicates. these are not talking point. these are facts based on over 5
years and they represent the major challenges we are currently facing by ice. every day the dedicated courageous professional women of ice worked for homeland security and public safety by executing the laws establish by congress to protect the integrity incredibly over country's borders. as well as a nationall e securiy and safety of the national white. the increase in the flow of illegal migrants in the change in those arriving at her border are putting the migrants, particularly young children at risk of harm from smugglers, traffickers, criminals and the dangers of the difficult journeb in placing pressure on her entire immigration system. ultimately, to solve the border crisis we must work collectively to ensure the take gertie as asy whole. creating a pull factor ultimately drives more people to drive to the united states and more illegal activity and delays justice for those for claims of
assignment. for the nation laws, we owe it to the citizens of our country to remainen the integrity of a serious and ongoing national crisis. day in and day out, the women and men have worked tirelessly with are mini resources to ensue the safety and security of our country. they've done this despite the mentation, personal tax, and the toll it takes on their families and personal lives. they do their jobs under the law passed by congress. a crisis that does not and, a change that is needed in your responsibility as movers of congress to act. thank you again for letting me testify. i'm honoreded and humbled. i askede you provide the funding in fy 2020 budget and i look forward to questions. >> as you know, we have serious concerns about isis ability to manage its budget within the
memes provided by congress, the lack of transparency of how ice executes its budget and exacerbates are concerned and continuing resolution, operations continue at the level funded of the prior year appropriation. for the current year, that means ice should maintain an average population of 40520 during the cran period. and yet for the first quarter ice detention bed surged on 34000 to over 46000. and this was before ae significant migrant search at the border. during the period of the cr did ice make any attempt to operate within the funding levels provided by congress in the operations and if so, what specific actions did it take? >> thank you, madam chairwoman.
we continually look to utilize our detention resources in the most efficient manner as possible. obstructions to offices continually look at the population to ensure that those individuals that are detained in the most appropriate for detention. many of those individuals currently detained are individuals that are mandated and must be detained by law. 74% of the individuals that are currently in ice custody are subject to mediatory detention under the immigration and nationality act. the vast majority are individuals who are public safety threat who are gang members orr individuals who may not reach the mandatory detention fro threshold but we t they are appropriate for detention and not appropriate for any release back into the community. with regard to your question on cr, the numbers we had an uptic. in the mid part of last summer
and continue to rise in the fall, that the level we have seen unfortunately during fy 19. the wholesale kitchen really system which would create more incentives for them to come illegally, we made a decision to detain as many people as we possibly could to p help prevena rush on the border. unfortunate, the numbers continue to come as a result that many of those people can be detained because their family units. >> to betterald: understand howe budgets for separation, the report that accompanied the fy 2019 appropriation, it directed ice to brief the committee on a detailed plan for operating within its budget. this was due 60 days after the date of enactment and was to be provided monthly thereafter. the first repeat was due by april 16, to date we have not received even one and by now we should have received for. why have they failed to comply
with this briefing directive? >> i'll have to look into that specifispecific. we are holding weekly migration calls with the four corners staff duringne which both cbp ad ice provide detailed information with regard to the ongoing a operations to include funding execution. we have posted a lot of material on her website and i have requirements and we will go through them and have a detailed response on each one. >> just as a follow-up, the department funding transfer authority exist to address unforeseeable and unavoidable circumstances. but it seems clear to me the ice operate with full expectation that it will be bailed out by the transfer authority that it has or some other means but the acting ice director for the
coming fiscal year, i hope the you can commit to operating within the funding levels that is appropriated by congress. >> i certainly will do my best to do so. i tell you, we have numerousio budget meetings with decisions made all the time to what operations we will have to curtail or what funding and initiatives we might not do as a result of limited funding. our detention modeling has been accurate for the past three or four years, the model that we utilize, we asked for 2000 beds. how do we receive that money as requested, shortfall. >> just as a reminder, as we move forward, appropriation bills are also laws. including continuing resolution with no less authority than the immigration and nationality act. in the authority ofls appropriation bills is arrived
directly from article one, clause seven of the u.s. constitution. i quote no moneyn should be dran from the treasury but in consequence of the procreation may by law. but when congress enacts the appropriation bills, is delayed informed analysis provided by the appropriation committee on to target the use of limited resources, i just want to emphasize, the authority is provided by congress to allow executive branch agencies to respond to unforeseen circumstances and not tont routinely augment appropriations for a particular activity. >> i will now turn to the chair of the subcommittee.
>> our final bill in session, i am pleased to be here with my colleagues to welcome you. director, i am very concerned that this ministrations policies, negatively impact the well-being of our immigrant populations. i'm especially concerned about the effects on vulnerable population like unaccompanied children. in april 2018, your predecessor director homan signed an agreement with hhs that provides for information sharing between your agencies regarding the
bedding of potential sponsors for unaccompanied children. the mere existence of this agreement has had a chilling effect on the number off potential sponsors who would otherwise have been willing to come forward to take these children out of federal government custody and care for them. not only does this make the mental and emotional stress these children already face even worse, it has led to significant additional federal cost, children remain in hhs custody for longer than necessary. it is clear to me, that this agreement is misguided at best. so, if i ask you a few questions. first, how many arrest have been made potential sponsors or their
household members since this agreement was signed. >> i don't have the exact number and we have not made any arrests since the appropriation bill since it wasng passed. it prevents us from using the age-adjusted information to make arrest. prior to that date, it is going to be around 330. >> however, you have the information from the household to which the youngster is going, isn't that correct if the youngster goes to an uncle and in that household there may be three undocumented, four undocumented family members, you have the information. is that correct? >> we would not necessarily have the information with regard to the individuals in the
household, they have some of the sharing of information that during the course of this them away, but again we are prohibit from using information to take action against the sponsor. >> how does ice ensure the safety and well-being of children e during actions and wt arrangements have been made to these children? >> certainly, we take the safety of children at the upmost importance as we plan any operation. in fact, the entire moh exist as a result of tragic circumstances in the uac replacer traffickers. it was an attempt to try to prevent traffickers and other individuals who may do harm to these children from being sponsors and cutting into their
custody. our research as we are going to these cases nearly 40% of the people had criminal records. there is certain cause for concern in regards to individuals who responded children. and your exact question, we had extensive training that we provide to our field offices, we have a juvenile in the national headquarters program who oversees how they conduct their operations. we do extensive training without. our officers trained professional law enforcement officers. we are no different than any other law enforcement to see. once you go into a residence you don't quite know what's inside that door. every law enforcement agency is faced with challenges when they go in and findency children thae unanticipated or needed caregiver to take care of them. we work very closely and generally were able to find the
parent in the country that they can have the child stay with, a family member, and most times that's generally what happens. >> as you know, the fy 19 included a provision of constrained ability to use information. resulting from this agreement with hhs to deport a sponsor or member of the household with limited exceptions like a felony conviction for child abuse or an aggravated felony. nevertheless, the agreementsrs expand in the sponsors are still concerned about what would happen to them if they were to become a sponsor. given that these protections are in place, why does ice not resend the agreement or at least amended it into effect protections provided in law and with these restrictions in place be interested to know what to conclude. , august asked the first
question. why haven't you rescinded this agreement or lease amendment to a reflect the protections provided in law. >> with regard to how we can tailor them away in a way that's more effective in compliance with the law have not reached proration. .. >> the real concern about providing enough sponsors because they were afraid that they will be picked up or grandpa will be picked up by someone in the house household. i look forward to continuing this discussion.
thank you manager. >> thank you, manager. greg robbins, yesterday we heard from sheep provost in our border patrol oversight hearing. as you can imagine, we spent a lot of time pursuing questions about the overcrowding and detention facilities at the southwest border. as you would surmise, because hhs received more funds in the supplemental to care for on company miners, border patrol was able to quickly move minors out of cbp sites and in two rr facilities. conversely, because ice did not receive in the supplemental and did not receive increase in the regular fiscal year 2019 bill, cbp is still sitting on a lot of single adults at the border with
no relief in sight. because of this backup and because the numbers of apprehensions at the border are still astronomically high cbp facilities both overflow, and border patrol are beyond capacity every single day. inspector general has published reports just the last weeks on the dangers to both the migrants and your colleagues at cbp. what are you doing to ensure that the southwest border apprehensions are a priority for beds and transport within the ice system sir? >> let me commend the chief and commend the cbp team for doing a tremendous job under these circumstances. we are in the process of ramping up our detention, unfortunately, we made a conscious decision during the resolution period to
not acquire additional detention space because we did not know where the appropriations bill would end up as a result of not getting the appropriations until february and then starting the process to identify additional beds, takes a longer time to turn them off. when hhs gives additional money they get facilities where they can turn on beds quickly when we want to turn on our facility we have to go to a contractor and they need to recruit, train and that their personnel to get up to. >> meet our standards prior to placing individuals into that, we have turned on about six or 7000 beds the be turned on by the end of august and out will be the culmination of the process once we receive the budget moving forward. our modeling indicated we would need the beds we just did not have the funds to turn them on in a timely fashion. >> yes and i am empathetic with
that plate. in that regard to moving toward solutions, is money the only challenge and does this problem extends beyond just hours? >> it certainly does. again, money helps us better deal with the symptoms of the crisis. that includes getting detention funding to relieve the overcrowding. there is saying i believe 8000 single adult males are waiting to be placed in ice custody. we can't place them into custody once we have a bed to put them in. we can't put them in the beds unless we have the money to do so. we have done many things to improve our efficiency. our average length of stay has gone down we are better utilizing the resources we have been given, but again a crisis needs a crisis and there's more bodies there than we have the capability to do so but again were just dealing with the symptoms at that.
lessig changes that allows us to detain families within a course of a truncated immigration proceeding where they are entitled to due process may keep them in custody in a safe, secure environment, just like we did in 2015 when we built detention and we saw the numbers drop, that will be in my opening statement it will be a huge help to that, the credible fear threshold is part of the problem. a lot of the reasons for these individuals are holding the singlet adults are holding down the beds is that they are getting credible fear but when they go through recording get in front of a judge, only less than 10% of the individuals are getting asylum there's a different standard words holds people in custody for 60 or 70
days and in that process and will be removed and will be more in line with what the ultimate decision factors would be from an immigration judge. >> yes, one quick two-part question, how quick they are single adults being re- appreciated back to their home countries and do you know the average length of stay in nice facility after being turned over from one of the cbp facilities? i'm beyond my time. i asked for a quick response. >> it depends on the circumstances. a lot depends on where it's from. some countries where we have great relations and schedule charters almost every day if we need them we can return those individuals if we have the approval order or if they don't claim asylum i would say the average length of stay is going
to be in the 40, 41 day range. >> thank you, sir. i yield back. >> mr. newhouse? >> thank you, madam chair. acting director, thank you for being here with us today and i also want to express my thanks for your service as well as all the men and women that work with you and helping to keep our nation say. thank you, very much. i wanted to talk today little bit about a couple of things. first of all some thoughts surrounding a disturbing violent attack by nat for the assailant, what that was conducted just over two weeks ago at one of your facilities in my home state of washington. in fact it's a facility that i had the pleasure of visiting a short time ago. by the way madam chair, with the conditions i observe, i believe that all of the needs were being
met well i just wanted to make sure you understood that, the things that i observed were in fact above standards i would think. but, this man under the rifle and the incendiary device as you recall attacked at the detention center in tacoma on july 13. he tried to light a propane tank he lit a car on fire authorities found a rifle in incendiary devices on here and also a collapsible baton. i'm very concerned by this. i have to tell you, i think everybody would agree with me that this is pretty frightening to have happen. certainly thankful that no officers, no detainees were injured or killed in this attack. what's even just as concerning,
even more so is to hear and read about the things that members of the radical anti- foot groups are saying about this man, their calling him a martyr and calling for more direct action just like this unfortunately this was not the first time they have attacked one of your facilities. i believe laster the same individual has wrapped his arms around her the police throat during a protest i've been thinking about this, i think a lot of us have been reflecting about what is going on in our country, our national discourse both here in washington, d and around the country. how perhaps it is a vehemence against our law enforcement and against men and women who, as you said doing the jobs we asked you to do to protect our nation and uphold our laws, how is that affecting these peoples ability
to do their jobs? i just wondered if you had any thoughts about that mr. director? >> thank you congressman. yes, i wish it was an isolated incident. as you mentioned there significantly increasing numbers of violent protests against our officers who are doing an incredibly professional football job on the most complex and difficult of circumstances incredibly well. you know, salts against our officers are up significantly. they have been on a rise the last few years. both on our officers that are out there in the field conducting law enforcement efforts as well as our contractors and detention facilities where they are being attacked and assaulted. we had a nurse that was punched in the face last year and the trauma that she suffered as a result of that is unmentionable. i've said it publicly and i have done some media appearances, i mean, no disrespect but they are
picketing the wrong people. congress is responsible for the laws we are enforcing. if there is a desire to change the laws and these people want to have the laws change they nor capitol hill is, they can come over here and pick about to come after the men and women who are patriots doing their job, again, they put their life on the line every day when they go out there. it's not just the law enforcement officers. when we had people trying to storm our office we had nine law enforcement officers being threatened. do not think there would be on the parking lot. that's not right. and it should not be that way. so, i would hope that everybody involved in this process and this issue would take a step back in a deep breath and realize that the law enforcement officer are the ones putting themselves in the proper manner and this entire process. it is those that are wishing that they did not exist that are the ones behaving in and out on
safe manner. >> i appreciate that. i thank you for your service and for being here with us today. thank you, madam chair for calling. >> first thing, i would like to respond to what you said. our country is a democracy will. i think we have the best country in the world. i think a lot of it is check and balances. i have worked in law enforcement in the past for over ten years and i agree, you have dedicated men and women who work in law enforcement, they are good people. there are also some bad people in law enforcement in that few amount of small people give a bad reputation. i think right now the country is split and a lot has to do with national media on both sides of the aisle i think our president and when he responses your boss, has inferior rated this and all people are bad, wrong, murderous
or whatever. your job is to enforce the law. we need to change the lawn we need to do that. i think when the average person in this country sees abuses of children and families, that is where a lot of this comes from. we are concerned about it. were saying this is not who we are, were saying this is certain agencies being blamed and you are probably one. so how do we deal with this? i feel strongly that where you are is you need to make sure that you focus on the immigration laws, but there's also ways to do this. we just past -- and you're going to have money coming to you now to deal with issues. because of the debate back and forth you won't be allowed to have this money for enforcement. you'll be allowed to use it for you shoe such as detention facilities that are better. to be able to put people out
that you can hold, to keep families together, and in a more humane area. i would personally, and i'm going to get to my question, i would personally like to see ice focus and you are new, just like dea is known for something, you are known for focusing -- that's what you do the best. you need to focus on the balance of one of looks like you are going after immigrant families with children i want our president puts out were going to go out and arrest 25000 people or whatever he said that number was, that doesn't help you, doesn't help our system of justice, and it scares the dickens out of these families who are here because they want a better life. we know it might be legal but when i can fix this issue until we deal with the issue of volume generally come in until we deal right now in honduras and guatemala and el salvador, countries where people won't want to come here.
that's out of your mission. your mission is when people break the law you need to enforce it. the first thing, what is your priority as far as the bad guy so to speak? the felons? and why does is seeing that the perception is that you're out there going after people who have been there for years and people have pick them up. i think that's where the problem is with ice and where you have your bad reputation for a lot of people in this country. >> unfortunately, i think there is misinformation out there that doesn't help. >> so, our priorities in our enforcement numbers are largely consistent over the past decade of seven or eight years, 90% of the people that we arrest are convicted criminals which is the largest and i'm talking about civil enforcement stuff, 90% of the individuals we arrest are convicted criminals they've had
their day in immigration court. >> felony type? or automobile speed amid tickets? >> speeding ticket, if it's not the way we find out, three out of four people we arrest, come out of our criminal program those are individuals that are sitting with another law enforcement agency haven't been arrested for some criminal violation. that's how we are aware of their presence, once their fingerprints have gone through their database they bounce off ours. 90% criminals immigration, fugitives said in a those individuals out of the country which i mentioned is a felony. but, to your larger.and with regard to restoring integrity in the immigration system, if we do nothing else besides working the criminal aliens, what we have in effect said is we will no longer be a consequence for anyone
coming to this country illegally. even if you go through the entire immigration process which congress spends hundreds of millions of dollars on with ice and doj, that order issued by the immigration judge is not worth the paper it is written on. why do we even have the process? no other law enforcement agency in the country is being asked to ignore a lawful issuer of the judges order. when you say we can only go after felons or criminals, that is it. >> i say that because that's a priority. there's 11 million people here, you kick after 11 million people. my time is that. why do you feel that you are being criticized, that there are so many people in this country that want to ban ice. from your perspective why do you think that is the case than what you think needs to be done to change that? >> again, i think that is a largely part of misconception and misunderstanding as to what
we do. look, if you want to talk about abolishing ice, then that means. >> i'm not saying that. >> and then those that say that want to abolish ice that means they don't want 140,000 criminals removed from the country every year. that means they don't want hsi removing 10000 gang members every year. they don't want hsi removing 10000 pounds of opioids across the street. we don't want the second largest agency to exist over which 544% of the cases are made out of hsi. we no longer will have counter proliferation information will want military information to go overseas. >> that's a good answer and that's what you have to get at. my time is up. >> mr. rutherford. >> thank you, madam chair. director, first i want to say thank you to the job that you and your men and women are doing out there.
and really, apologize for the congress, the courts and the position we have put you in and, you know it's a very difficult situation because not only have we created a bad, but, there is also this sentiment in the country that disrespects all authority. the folks that are talking about it banning ice, there is another group that was marching down the streets of new york chanting, whether we want? dead cops. when we want it? now. we just saw on television the other night to new york city police department officers having water dumped on them. you are absolutely right. people need to take a step back, take a breath, and start
respecting law enforcement. i have got some bad news for you. the president asked for $9.3 billion so that you could do your job. were only going to give you a billion it looks like. so, somewhere in there you're gonna have to transfer probably another $1.3 billion around so that you can complete your missions that's not on you, that's on us. let me ask you this. when we talk about your budget in ways that you can do your job more efficiently, you mention the criminal alien program. i was a lifelong law enforcement officer, 12 years as a share. iran a 287g program in my jail. i know how efficient and safe that was for your officers, for my officers, and for every citizen in my city. and, i have to tell you, my blood boils, when i see the cities say they're not going to
work and coordinate with ice because let me ask, do you think it is safer for you to go into a jail and arrest these criminal aliens, these are the criminals my good friend was talking about. 90% of your arrests are out of these jails. is that safer. >> it's absolutely safer. his saver for officers and the individuals were trying to arrest on the general public at large. >> is it cheaper? >> is certainly cheaper. to give you perspective, we used to get before this issue came up with sanctuary cities and people not wanting to honor detainers, talking with a field officer he used to get 200 criminals a day out of l.a. county, that has doodled down to a handful now. based on state laws that are there. that is something that we have asked congress work.
but, everybody is safer, every community is safer when law enforcement works together. we all take the same old to uphold the constitution and keep our community say. were all better when we work together. that said, there are many law enforcement agencies that would like to work with us but due to court decisions are due to executive orders or state laws or just the fear of litigation and liability, they're allowing us to do so whether there county board of supervisors or legal department won't let them. we've been asking them for years to codify the behavior and indemnify sheriffs that honor those detainers. >> most sheriffs if they know they have actions or claimants made for an individual they will gladly take them up. >> in the, the retainer issues honors somebody throws that up but look, i'm going to tell you, all i have to do is call ice and
before that individual is changed into their street clothes ice can be there to pick it up. it's just a coordination effort. i think that's a red herring that folks throughout their and they don't want to help ice. i saw the cbs report that 37 florida agencies have agreed or showed interest in being part of the 287g program but there were delays in getting agencies into the program. i think you touched on a little bit of it. can you talk about was some of the other delays might be getting into that is it budgetary for them or for you. >> it's budgetary for us is remain static for the last for five years and side directly oversaw. that has part to do with it. if were going to get somebody we don't take that lightly. all those individuals even though they have been vetted and in the check we vet them
ourselves, sometimes there's infrastructure with regard to t-1 minds so we can install -- were trying to move as quickly as possible. we do have a warrant service officer program which is a very limited delegated authority to execute warrants on our behalf at the direction of an eye supervisor. for it actually was the first place we rolled that out in nine counties and will continue to expand. >> we appreciate the partnership we have had with ice for a long time. my time has run out, thank you for your service. >> thank you madam chair. i don't want to pursue this line of questioning if you are not specifically familiar with the ongoing issues at er zero miami. are you familiar? >> i'm fairly familiar. i've been there and my staff
briefed me after they briefed you. >> so, after that meeting with them, and we got the detailed answers to questions, there were number of questions that they really do not give us an answer for. these issues of poor infrastructure, people standing out in the blazing sun, security that is working with e er zero e treating people badly, those issues are continuing and we have gotten insufficient answers related to canopies, bathroom experienceexpansion and other i. i would like you to take this document that i can get you a copy of. i want to share with you the concerns that i have on the answers not being adequate.
i still need an answer about what is being done to follow-up to make sure security officers at the facility are not treating the people who are presenting at the office of the appointment rudely. speaking rudely to them, refusing to speak to them in spanish, and really giving them a general hard time. it's a very small parking lot, there is no coverage whatsoever, i realize parking is going to be expanded but that will not happen until next year. >> i do have some updated information. >> the other issue that was not at answered adequately is a letter sent to an immigrant who is told to come for a specific appointment, when they get there, they are told that they have to call the phone line on not only that the letter is insufficient.
when they call the phone line, they are not connected with the person who speaks their language. the only option is in english. the answer that i got in writing was insufficient and did not provide me with an answer other than the policy about what is supposed to happen rather than trying to get to the bottom of what is actually happening. the other insufficient answer related to the distribution of fruit and water by volunteers, i understand in the letter that you sent to me, and a memo you sent to me you detailed that they are instructed in their letter to bring adequate food and water while they wait in that it is your liability that is an issue allowing volunteers to distribute food and water. that makes no sense to me. if you look at the configuration of that parking lot, there is no obstacle or damage or harm that could, people are simply allowed to bring food and water to help make sure we can relieve the
difficulty of the people there. so, if you can answer that question and give me more substantive specific answers to those concerns i would appreciate it. >> i did ask for that update before hand. i know the outdoor water fountains will be ready for public use on august the ninth of next year. the new parking lot on august 22. >> new parking lot in august? >> i know there's a permanent canopy project. i've been in that facility about a year, year and half, i expressed concerns about a year, year and half in which the employees are working. it is. across-the-board so i know is being reviewed by gsa and within ice for pricing and being able to put that in. >> i appreciate it. i. >> i just need to talk to you more in detail about the
concerns. the other question i want to get out, i share the military constructions affair committee and, what we are concerned about is there are conclusions in the report written by gao that looked into ice failures to consistently follow your own policies were moving forward with removal proceedings. according to gao some veterans who were removed may not have seen . ice does not know exactly how many veterans have been placed in removal proceedings or if their cases have been handled according to ice policies due to a lack of consistent record-keeping. these are really disturbing deficiencies. are you and your agencies currently working to ensure consistent limitation of handling ice and are you working to develop a policy that make sure you know how many veterans
are in your system? and that they are being interviewed properly? finally the report recommends that ice maintain complete electronic records on veterans or removal proceedings or who have been deported. you don't have a system like that, have you established one yet? >> the military veterans is something obviously that we are sensitive to. they do require and you get a much higher level of scrutiny than an ordinary removal case. often times. >> gao report says they are not. >> often times are kicked up to headquarters. we don't have an i don't know where we stand on at night be happy to get back to you about a code in our system that we can put in there so that we can readily identify which cases so for ask questions it would be easily done. with regard to complete electronic record, we don't have the system to allow that. we've made a request in the
budget to have a great star system that have not been funded. absent significant amount of funding that would allow us to have the system of record, i know cvs is working on but we don't have any of that. >> these are people who have served our country and they are supposed to be given a heightened level of review as a result of serving our country even though they are undocumented immigrants. if you don't know how many of them are in your system, then it is nearly impossible for you to treat them with the dignity and respect that they deserve and thank them for their service. so, you can't just say we don't have enough money or the capacity to do that, you have to be able to keep track. >> i was speaking of your last question. >> so, you know how many are in your system. >> the funding for that is not available. we have ways within our system that i think can be tweaked that would allow us to do that. most of the individuals, laughed
are not undocumented, their lawful permanent residents that convicted aggravated felonies. >> that's a different situation. i'm talking about the people who aren't. >> thank you madam chair mr. director for being here. i wanted to ask about family case management programs alternative to detention in june family case management program, the daily cost of family detention per individual is approximately $300, however case management programs cost around $36 a day for one family. i just wanted to ask why ice decided to terminate the family case management program. >> the family case management program was a program was a program incredibly expensive for what the ultimate result was.
in the 18 or so months that the program existed there were only 65 cases concluded, 41 were actually terminated for noncompliance. eight individual self remove, seven issued removal order and nine received relief. for the $17 million or so that was invested at that time, we received 15 removals which was about $1.16 million per removal as opposed to in regard to compliance, the rates were actually little bit lower than standard dte program for all intensive supervision program. so, in fact, and show some of the challenges with dealing with cases in a non- detained environment. three quarters of those cases, more than three and half years later still haven't been decided by the immigration courts. that shows the backlog.
if we have kept this program at the cost we were doing, we'd be up to 26, or $30 million more to go with less than a thousand cases. it's not good fiscal sense to try to keep that. there were some things in the program we found useful that we have incorporated into our current existing case management system. those that we have implemented their where we found they might have some use we've put that in there. >> so, the oig reports that they had compliance rates of 99% price check ins and 100% and tendons at immigration court hearings. when you are measuring success of the program, does ice include immigrants that it removed from the program. then later failed to comply with the requirement? and should the program only measure compliance of those who are and actively within the
program? >> the ultimate purposes for an individual to be available all due process and make their case in front of an immigration judge as to whether or not they have the right to remain in the united states. the ultimate measure should be whether or not the order issued by the judges actually adhered to. what we have seen is that most of the individuals at the end of this process receive a removal order. that's the way it is. generally they don't get that, so most of the cases end up with the removal order. atd over the past several years have been fairly level at removing about 2700 people on atd. in fact about 2014 in 2017 the budget doubled. he went from 91 million to 183.
as a result we remove 273 more people. if that same dollars would have been put into detention we could every moved ten times the number of people we did it. >> i do want to -- you did mention there are parts of the program that have been useful, these programs as you know are more humane, helping vulnerable families with young kids, pregnant women, people of health concerns and people of domestic violence. were there ever be potential to improve programs like this such as working with nonprofit organizations? a lot of them are more equipped to provide case management assistance to immigrants within the communities that they serve. i just wanted to know what the status of incorporating nonprofit organizations into these sorts of programs to provide gap services that gao care may not be providing. >> we were close with a nonprofit.
we are given additional funds in 19 which rarely utilizing to help make that program more effective. one thing that was asked previously and is frequently both here and in the media, is you hear the cases of individuals that have been here six, seven, eight years, have they complied with other chickens and why does ice arrest them? that is what the backend looks like. individuals, those individuals who have been here, most times but appealing their case to the board of immigration appeals on the circuit court and may file a petition. those cases drag out. when we talk about it crisis, having 3 million cases on adjudicated is a crisis as well. it takes these cases so long to get to the process that the individuals are here for six or seven years. ultimately the judge orders that individual removed and we are sworn to execute that order. it says you shall take into
custody. to me, i think if you're looking at the entire force of continuum and obviously if we have a system whereby we can detain individuals for a short period of time on they have due process, make whatever claims they want for the immigration judge while they are in custody in a safe and secure environment that is sanitary and well-run and meets all of our standards and can have a decision in 50 or 60 days, that's a lot more humane than having an individual on the street for five or six or seven years where they get a family, have children, develop roots, all the while knowing they had a lawful right to be in the country. then were tearing families apart or it's noncriminal immigrants. i think it's more humane to do on the front end. if they're entitled to state the judge will let them stay. frankly, that would reduce the
pressure you seen on the border. the reason you're seeing all the people at the borders because they know we can hold them. >> i want ten by thank you for acknowledging the importance of humane his swift treatment for these families, keeping them together. you talked about the legal options they pursued, that is still their legal right to do so. thank you, you'll back. >> one item that concerns me, you talked about u.s. citizens have been detain, ice has a history of incorrectly detaining u.s. citizens, to citizens in my district were detained by ice to compensate for the arrest we require days to issue statistics on the detention of u.s.-mike they gave six months to complete the report which was due in may
we have not received any that available information. if a person can prove that with a passport or birth certificate why are they being held? what circumstances? i'll look into that to see where we stand on that. we have a specific policy with how we regard to how we handle claims artist is not have the lawful authority to say anybody is or is not a citizen. what we do is when we are provided with an evidence that someone looks to be a citizen we will release that individual from custody and instruct that individual with whatever paperwork they may need or documentation of citizenship whatever that may be. a lot of people when debbie and citizens in our country did not know they were citizens.
it's very complex the national immigration charge and that was a long time ago and is very complex and some individuals don't even know their citizens until we investigate their background until we realize at which. >> i'm not talking about cases where an individual finds out there u.s. citizens, i'm talking about individuals who have clearly said they were citizens. when trouble it's when someone looks to be a citizen. i have a list year of nine from my community and rialto and from austin texas five days contain, two days contain. these are individuals born in the united states or have been naturalized. these are in individuals who found out they were u.s. citizens, these are those who
told that they were u.s. citizens and within the process of this you advance that when they looked to be a citizen. it just strikes me that all of these individuals are latinos and that you're talking about how someone looks. so can you talk to me about. >> i was not referring to anybody's appearance and i was clear. when we reviewed the individual you look at the interview and their documentation they have evidence of being a citizen then that's when we release it from custody. from my experience and it happen personally many individuals were citizens in a border environment primarily involved in criminal activity will claim to be a noncitizen. especially when their mexicans they would claim to be a mexican national because they knew they would get turned around five hours later they were can i get prosecuted and they could come back in at well. we look at all the information
in front of us. we have no lawful authority to hold u.s. citizens. that is not a business or job but we have to look at the evidence. >> it's difficult in prior discussions we have had we also found out in the drop-down box that we had for where an individual is from that the united states is in the drop-down box. it's even difficult for you to track how many u.s. citizens you detain, even for a small portion of time. what type of racial profiling, what type of training to your officers receive so with specifically applying to u.s. citizens so we can be certain this doesn't happen as much, there has been cases recently in the press, u.s. citizens, members of congress finding u.s. citizens who were detained not a nice custody. i want to make sure we are
learning through this. can you talk about the training you receive specific to racial profile? >> sure. there's no tolerance of racial profiling and ice. it starts at the basic training level where our officers and agents receive training in the very beginning of their law enforcement career. we abide by dhs policy, we abide by doj policy. it is continually something that is stressed in our in-service trainings. we have supervisory schools, we have law enforcement training, there is no tolerance for racial profiling. >> i would still like to follow up on the documentation piece. if somebody's -- if someone has these documents and is claiming to be u.s. citizen, what is the disconnect? thank you manager.
>> thank you manager i represent a lot of border patrol agents, a lot of cbp officers a lot of vice officers also from san antonio i have to say, i do appreciate with the work that the men and women do. i don't think you should be demonized. if there is an issue with the policy then we go after the policy, we don't go after the men and women. if the current law on some of the immigration laws that we have have been around for years and it usually says laws passed by congress, you shall do certain things. so, i just want to make sure that if there is a bad apple we go after that bad apple. and i think you agree with me, but i just want to say that your men and women are probably the same people that were working under the obama administration, now under the trump administration. again, not the women and men and
women, but the policies, or someone wants just change the shall do certain things in law than congress that. you also have certain protocols that you follow and, there are folks that say there are no protocols for example, you have the performance-based national detention standards of 2011 which i think was revised in december 2016. that one again took the input from nongovernmental organization and other groups to make sure that we improved medical mental health services, access to legal services, religious opportunities, improve communication with detainees that have limited. deficiencies et cetera. on top of that, we also have in the appropriations, and i started in 2014, i'm looking at 2014 on, there are writers that we have added both myself and other members that talk about
detention standards, that talk about transparency in the ice detention centers, that talk about ice detention facility contracts for example, one of the sections prohibits ice operation and support funds for b needs to continue any contract with the provision of services to of the most recent evaluations received by the facility are less than adequate or equivalent to that. so, there's other provisions dealing with ice on this, so, one is to make sure that we understand there is a particular protocol and language that we have there. also on top of that, i think the ice nine detained jacket is 2.4 million individuals roughly, we are adding about 10000 cases to the immigration courts every week, there's over 1 million subject to final orders of removal that we have. then, out of the detain docket i
think that it's less than 2% of the undocumented individuals are actually ice custody across the 200 plus facilities that you have, so, now that i laid that out, tell me your response on the protocols, the laws, of their workload that you have any environments, again, i want to make sure that we treat people with respect and dignity. i'm talking about the folks that are under your facilities on the. so, give me your quick perspective on what i have just laid out on the structure that we have there. >> thank you congressman. i wholeheartedly agree that it is imperative that those individuals that are within our custody are kept in a safe and secure environment and are treated humanely and professionally and with dignity the entire time they are in our custody. that is what we endeavor to do. that is what our standard stew. in 2011 i think it's thicker
than this. we are actually in the process of revising some of our detention standards and we have worked closely and i know the staff has worked closely with our custody management division with regard to updating those standards. >> i'm sorry to interrupt. so you are working with the appropriation committee. are you working with ngo. >> we have a lot of ngos that work in the immigration space. we invited law enforcement in as well because they're the ones ultimately when we contract that have to implement and use the standards. we want to make sure that what we do is meaningful. some of the standards we have our 20 years old that are not relative anymore. when you talk about having a locksmith on the staff, certified locksmith, some of these jails don't have key locks anymore. we would have to ding them or give them a waiver when we do those inspections. were trying to make it more relevant to today's technology. thank you.
>> mr. price. >> thank you, madam chair. mr. director, let me return to i think it was the orders of the line of questioning about the targeting of detention and deportation and, i would say very baffling claims and counterclaims that have often been made in this area. you gave us that break down, you did not give us a breakdown and i want to ask you to do that, it was the eer o arrest it was the category. and he said 90% of those arrests either have prior criminal convictions or pending criminal charges, or immigration fugitives or previously removed from the country in illegally reentered. what is the breakdown of that
90% in terms of those were categories? >> about 66% are convicted criminals come about 21% or pending criminal charges, 2% are the fugitives, and 1% would be the illegal reentrant. >> when you say prior criminal conviction, what is the range? sue make the range in the vernacular utilizes the same throughout the law enforcement community. anybody who has been convicted of a criminal violation. in fact, we only get fingerprints from local law enforcement agencies when they submit them for a criminal violation. >> so, is entering the country illegally, coming back income is that criminal? i just want to get clear, how many of these people are violent criminals as we often say, a threat to the community. >> so, our 2018 report is online.
of the top of my hand, two of the top five the top charge is dui, then, i know within the top five is drugs and assaults. and i do not have the numbers directly in front of me but they are on the website. we can get them to you this afternoon easily enough. >> it would help i would say to breakdown these categories a little more straightforwardly. knowing that as we discussed the prioritization, the exercise of prosecutorial discretion, the.of that discussion is to prioritize the dangers people in terms of whatever else we do in the area of detention and deportation, to prioritize people who are a threat to the community. knowing that is the purpose of the discussion, it strikes me that there would be much more
helpful way to present these statistics than 90% sounds great, great. i know why you would frame it this way, but, even 66% prior criminal convictions, that begs for a further breakdown. knowing just just be a very straightforward here about the purpose of the policy, the purpose of the discussion, the purpose of the targeting which on the subcommittee we have worked on for many years. and, by the way, nobody is saying everybody else gets a free ride. but, we have said for years that given limited resources, given the fact that we are going to deport may be 4000 people a year out of 11 the million people, there is going to be discretion exercised. and, that discretion needs to be intelligently and appropriately exercise to remove dangerous people. so, would help at least to have reese statistics that are
responsive to that concern. >> i fully agree. he ends, i wholeheartedly support being transparent. we have calls with the media with regard to all of our statistics when it comes to immigration statistics. our interview report is about 20 pages long and it breaks down by nationality, country, crying. thankfully there are not 40000, 50000 murders that we need to arrest every year. >> you would be helpful to know how many actually there are. >> about 800 last year. >> and whether we are prioritizing those people. i am going to ask you to breakdown that prior criminal convictions category more precisely. >> happy to do so. thank you to know to what extent were dealing with violent criminals. my time is fast running out. let me just quickly give you an example of another way to frame this. this has to do with the daily
count of detainees, slightly different universe. but, from september 16 to december 18, there is a 22% increase in the daily count of detainees from 39000 to 47000, with the number of individuals who had committed serious crimes dropped by over 1200 despite that overall increase. and the number of immigrant detainees who had never been convicted of even a minor violation grew by 8300 people. now, that is a different framing of statistics that puts a different light on the situation. i just speak the way in the beginning of an intelligent discussion here especially a discussion of appropriate targeting and prioritization and to the exercise of discussion needs to be a more straightforward presentation of the facts. i think what i just gave does
indicate that we have had some slippage, considerable slippage in the degree to which we are targeting dangerous people. >> so, exactly what happened there is exactly what is going on the border. that is a result of all border cases. that is when the border search began. all of those noncriminal border cases in our custody are mandatory because they're under the process and dictated by congress under section 241 of the ina. the reason the criminals dropped is because i had to redeploy officers working criminals to deal with the border search cases. that is a direct result. when we say it's a crisis, it affects the entire continuum. we are able to arrest fewer criminals. we are down 14%. we are going to arrest 15, 18 -- less going on. this is not limited to the border. they are not staying in border communities. they are dispersing into the
country. we have to manage those cases. some of those are getting involved in activities. >> we will return to this. director, before ia asked, i wanted to look at the response to the question about the ability to provide reporting about isis detention and removal of military veterans. you mentioned that part of the problem is due to the lack of funding to modernize your systems, in the 2018 congress provided an additional 6 million for this purpose and in 2020 i recommended an additional 2.5 million, both additions are
above the administrations budget request. i'm also recommending an additional 2 million for your law enforcement systems and analysis division of who do the analysis in the reporting. i'm trying to help by adding funding above what you're asking for. and if this isn't enough i think it is important that you tell us exactly what it is that you need so that you can be more transparent about your operations. >> i would like to follow up a little bit more on some of what mr. -- was talking about in regards to detention facilities in the guards that are there. i have several questions. i'm going to try to ask as many as i can in the time that i have. first of all, it's really unacceptable this sub standards conditions at ice facilities that have been reported and also that i myself have seen in my visit. i'm hoping that we will be able to make some progress on that together. one of my questions is, have you carried out a full review and
taken the necessary corrective actions to ensure the recommendations from the oig and the gal, and sizes own standards and oversight recommendations are being implemented at every detention facility that ice operates? >> yes. we have, we have a comprehensive oversight framework that we utilize. i would say that our detention facility receive more scrutiny and appropriately so. we welcome transparency, we have detention service monitors that work for headquarters that oversee facilities in the field, many of these we have office directors that are on the ground that a deal with issues on a day-to-day basis. some monitors are on-site. we have in fact, thanks to you and the committee for the additional funding in 19 for opr office we have the office of detention and oversight we are able to find 14 more positions.
>> what is the status of that. >> they will be on board by the end of this f.y.e. we expect to be able to do i believe i don't know the exact number, about 15 more inspections this year than we were able to do last year based on additional funding. obviously once we get the new inspectors on that will increase going forward. >> i was just trying to get all my questions and. >> but, would continue to hear disturbing reports that ices contracting for additional content detention capacity were basic standards are not being met. one example is a relatively new facility in texas that does not allow contact visitation unless there is a significant advance planning. i standards they contact visitation should be provided especially when minor children are involved. we are talking about civil detention a criminal detention. my question is, do you believe it's except the pulverize to enter into these agreements to
provide detention, civil detention services were reasonable opportunities where visitation with families or attorneys can't or won't be required which is contrary to your agencies own standards? >> i'm not familiar with that facility but i'll look into it. on the larger question is you all know, all of the contracts were entering into, any contract is supposed to be at the 2011 standards. and that if we don't meet those standards, then we are supposed to notify congress prior to 30 days prior to entering into that contract which we have done. those notifications have been fairly few. since i am not any arrow day-to-day i can't tell you how many they are. i only remember one or two that i sent when i was ead. i know the new contracts we are doing in order to get these capacity to deal with the border cases, we are contracting at the 2011 levels.
>> the note that i have here this is in montgomery county and that it was started using it october 2018. if i could get some additional information. >> i'll be happy to look into it. >> mr. fleischman. >> thank you again madame chair. and thank you director, this testimony is very informational and helps us all do our job. >> mr. director, the dhs secretary sent a letter dated march the 28th that states and i quote, without additional assistance, we will be forced to increase the releases of the single adult population from ice. the only population for which we can currently, effectively enforce u.s. immigration laws. when meeting with border patrol agents, the.is made, time after time that if we cannot keep up with it detaining and returning single adults, we have lost the
border. my question, do you agree, does the sentiments of the march 28 letter still hold? >> without a doubt. how can we make sure that we don't lose ground on this population sir? >> again, in dealing, dealing with the symptoms now, absent additional capacity, i don't know how you would do it. there is not a way to move the cases through the system really much quicker than they currently do. we certainly need to make sure the individuals have all the ability to access their due process rights so if they want to have appeals of their cases and the like they are free to do so and we want them to have all due process. absent additional capacity there's only so many beds we have and only so quickly we can turn them around. >> yes sir. >> from your testimony earlier and from what i have seen, it is evident resources alone will not fix this crisis. this is a complicated set of
issues. again, going back to march 28 letter, the secretary referenced a legislative proposal to congress in the coming days to address the immigration asylum policies. my question sir, do you know the status of an immigration proposal from the department or the administration? and will we see an official proposal sir? >> i don't know the exact status. i know what it contained and it would've contained the items that among others the three i mentioned in my testimony. we can certainly check and get back with you. >> is concerned. >> in a recent outbreak of measles, mumps, and chickenpox close thousands of beds. how are you managing to contain the outbreak and how many detainees are ill? and how many beds are affected?
>> it changes. i'm not sure how many we have had, for the past 6 - 8 months is been around for 5000 beds that are recorded as a result of disease. that makes -- even with the expanded capacity, when we have to quarantine a whole wing, and any one time we may have 1500 or 2000 beds that are actually vacant but the beds are within the quarantine pot and we cannot utilize them. >> yes. what efforts are you making to ensure detainees at the effective sites specifically across ice facilities have unfettered access to medical care, and what efforts are underway to make sure the population is in and reduce to new outbreaks are? >> again, with regard to not introducing the population please all standardize practices to ensure those individuals are quarantined and kept separate from the general population and not released until we are certain this past incubation
period and are clear with regard to medical and thank you to the committee for additional funding that was in the supplemental that we put directly to use. we have been leveraging additional resources from public health as i'm sure you are aware, we have sworn commission public health officers that do a lot of our medical program. that includes doctors, nurse practitioners, social workers, the plethora of medical services. they do a tremendous job. their sole existence and they take it to heart is to ensure the safety, care, and health of individuals and detention. >> one final question. what do you anticipate the outbreak will pass and what action will you need to make the facility safe to use again? >> if i knew that i would be in vegas. new people come in every day. they have no idea what they're going to catch him we have no idea what diseases individuals
they have. so it's not a new phenomenon, it's just expanded because the numbers have expanded. we've had to do this in the detention round for as long as we have held alien. >> manager. >> i want to talk a little bit about the alternative to detention. about maybe a month, month and half ago when i visited the border there wasn't significant overcrowding. i think the biggest issue right now is volume. whether it's judges, dealing with this problem and we have a serious problem, i said yesterday in the hearing that a border patrol agent said we make arrests used to be we would see them in court and that's what we do here, now, you have a whole no third diary dynamic to your mission on its holding these individuals. i want to talk about discretion with respect to your agency. you have the discretion to release nonviolent detainees on
parole or bond. home business checking, cell phone monitoring, ankle bracelets are options at your disposal. again, looking at what your mission is and we both tried to focus on the bad people, the individuals that are really, that we need the expertise of these officers to go after, that is where i would like to see your mission and i would like this country to understand that. what people are seen is were going to come out and get you, families that have been here and are afraid and local governments are not working with you, it's not where it needs to be. now, my question is we provide 20 million alternatives to detention in these programs are less costly to american taxpayers, more humane than standard detentions. they come with compliance rates
up to about 90% and when he put people in these type of situations, how fast can you expand these programs for overcrowding which i believe helps you and helps her country in the image of what a lot of people are seeing it as abusive people of families and children. >> so, in fact every, less a small percentage that claim negative credible fear and are found not to have it are released into the community. we have at this.based on funding we have about 101,000 individuals on etd. we could put based on existing funding come about 64000 people on the gps bracelet annually and keep them on their. at our current volume that's about half the number of people that came in and the month of
may, at which.we would not be able to put anybody else on a bracelet until those individuals came off. as you know on the non- detained docket those cases may go three, five, seven years such that we would be open very few individuals on a bracelet from that.forward meaning everybody else would be released. frankly what we are seen and which goes to why we serve so many resources is that the rate for these much higher. it's about 26% right now of the rate for family units on the gps. we have criminal investigations ongoing in which we have individuals under surveillance and watching them cut off the bracelet. a lot of it comes to the fact that these are not real families. it's individuals or single adult males that are renting a child in mexico, paying a smuggler or cartel, bringing them into the
country and as soon as they are processed and released they could care less what happens to the child and they go about their way cut their bracelet off. again, there's some success in regard to showing up with hearings and meetings that drops once the individual nears the end of the process because the chance of getting a removal order is going to be higher. the going for a status hearing or merit hearing they may not get an order. >> let me stop there. in policing, your job is to protect our society and the rest when people break the law. in some area where you have an the baltimore region they have a bad rap right now, we have to work to turn that around. part of that is you have a system of somebody focusing on community type policing. instead of everyone who is here waiting, whatever needs to be
done, the going to for your eyes other than if they get arrested they're going to be treated that way. you have got an image issue and as a member of congress i don't want you to have an image issue because you have a mission. that is based on the laws that we pass. you have to work on this. you have any type of program trying to work on your image now whether you believe it or not is not good for the percent of this country? >> i would love the media to publish all the tremendous things we do and we tried diligently to get our story out there. unfortunately, it is not sensational to say i stood a good job and remove this aggravated felon or ice remove this merger back to el salvador. or ice seized 1000 pounds of fat no. the stories don't get picked up. i can do as many tv shows as i
want, a lot of it falls on deaf ears. i think that's what were going to earlier. the rhetoric is so high. >> to numbers, want to.out the amount of arrests for 26000 traffic offense, this seems to be the highest numbers. i yield back. >> thank you mom and cheer. sir, director, and do you or your officers get to decide who will actually be deported out of custody? >> again, unless the individual already has had their day in immigration court has received a final order of immigration, we are the front end of that, just as a local be cap a criminal justice is. we are making the arrest on probable cause and are filing
our charging document which is a notice to appear as opposed to a complaint filed by local jurisdiction. >> your men and women make no deportation decision, correct? >> correct. the judge makes a determination. in limited circumstances there are cases in which individuals under the law are not entitled to a hearing with regard to the remove ability issues but they are in regard to asylum or other former relief. >> the reason i ask, you said it earlier, you don't get to pick and choose what laws you're going to enforce. and so, one of the things that i think people need to understand, really came up on the military issue, your officers, when they go to a 287g facility and pick up an individual on a detainer, that individual has been charged, you don't have a choice, you pick them up,
whether they have military service in their background or not, and how that will impact on their individual cases really up to the judge, not you or your officers, is that correct question. >> that's correct. the judge makes the decision on remove ability. >> so, let me change gears. while there was a decrease in the number of migrants crossing the border in june relative to may, we still have over 100,000 people across-the-board are. we are still hearing about the metering going on at the ports, cbp usually abuse or overcapacity. you just received 208.9 million in the supplemental bill. so, my question today is, do you anticipate there will get you through the end of the year, that is going to be enough, or what is the burn rate on that?
>> so, the money that we are given and we are appreciative of it for the areas in transportation, medical services, the money to get to each aside to get additional family fraud investigations and dna testing which has been proven very successful, that money is greatly appreciative and is going right to work. unfortunately we are still short and we are still short a little bit in the transportation area. our request on the supplemental was around $110 million and that need still remains. >> i tried to move 600 million over two guys from forfeiture and seizures to address the detention bands and that failed, but let me ask this also, after a successful pilot and may you mentioned rapid dna processing. ice, you all awarded a $5.2 million contract for additional dna testing and
supplies. can you give me an idea how that program is going, the rollout, how's it looking? >> it is looking i say is looking good, i mean, that from an operational perspective. from a criminal justice and victimization perspective it's looking bad because we ran the first week of it last week we opened up in seven different facilities, we have two machines in each facility and more machines to come. and it was within the first week there were 102 referrals, we found 17 instances of fraud based on dna test. in fact, it's an experience we saw, 14 of the individuals broke to the fact that they were not family units to begin with at all before they even took the dna test because they saw that was the potential. we are continuing to pursue that as it rolls out and we have additional machines and capability so the results will go up significantly. i am hopeful there is a
deterrent effect with that because the word spreads. >> and how many family groups have you discovered through that, where it's an aunt, uncle, that sort of thing? >> we have a few things going on at one time. we have had if you look at just the family fraud investigations going on in the surge that we've had going down for several months, were only getting the cases referred to us, we've had about 3000 cases referred to us through the investigative process we found about 400 to be fraudulent. most of them there are some that are family members, usually when we say that they are fraudulent they're presenting themselves as if they actually are father and son her mother and son, whatever the case may be, or were finding there actually adults. you have an uncle who is 32 years old and a kid that's 19 years old and he comes in and said this is my 17-year-old kid.
we have presented 790 prosecutions during this time in 682 have been accepted for prosecution. what were also seen that is troubling and were doing our best to combat it is a lot of individuals claim to be ua caesar or not you acs. were finding individuals 23 or 24 -year-olds coming up with 16-year-old birth certificates. were extremely concerned because they're going to go into hhs custody. the lesson we want is a 24-year-old male being in custody with a bunch of 10-year-old boys. that's an untenable situation. our overarching goal is to keep the safety of these children. we have identified 59 of those, 58 have been prosecuted it's been a tremendous partner. >> thank you for your service. i yield back. >> missed regular. >> thank you manager. on tuesday this week you told reporters that the reason ice rates were successful is because
the agency had the element of surprise. he also said that when media attention is drawn to potential ice rates it inhibits the ability of ice agents to do their job, set up your summary? >> i'm not sure is the element of surprise with the media attention that guy, but i'm not sure of the exact quotes make typically when congressional offices asked for additional information about rumored raids, ice frequently tells us that information cannot be shared because of pending operations, you know that is generally the response we receive, correct? >> that is correct except for the fact that i think it's a disservice to classify them as raids. we are going after targeted individuals who we know who they are and issued a removal for the immigration judge. i think calling the raid heightens the temperature with all these issues as opposed to just when the sheriffs goes out and executes a warrant they don't call it a rate, they're
going to arrest someone and that's what were doing. >> and in some cases there is collateral arrest made and that's where in my interpretation and my feeling, we can get into a conversation about trust and the agency and i think we've talked a lot and i know that is the.of frustration and time for folks about that relationship with the community. i think that comes with trust. and when the collateral numbers increase in very significantly by field offices, that is a concern for us. that is a policymaker. and that's when you get into a classification. and what i will call a raid is when there are significant collateral arrest made. if you want to target someone and you can highlight the criminality, that's fine. but, when you get into the collateral pieces and you start grabbing other folks in proximity and breaking windows, pulling people out of cars, those are things that heighten the level and i want to make sure that you understand that is
what we are talking about. >> i certainly do. and collateral arrest have occurred throughout the time of immigration enforcement, and they occurred our law enforcement practices are the same -- when they go into a residence and they have a warrant and they are going to identify for their safety as well as the safety of the residents of that house, they're going to identify those individuals and try to determine if they have warrants or if that individual may be has a gun on them is committing a crime in their presence they will arrest them. when i was with dea almost every time we went into a house there somebody else, many somebody else's that also ended up being arrested. is the same thing when we go in. we go in for officer safety and we know who's in the house. the last thing we want is a tragedy and have someone jump out of a closet and scare an officer. >> orders a removal is not the same as a drug dealer. i would just reject that comparison. let me move on.
i just want to have that conversation about the announcements of targeted enforcement i will call them, you don't want to call them raids, so do enforcement actions impact officer safety and effectiveness? >> we try to ensure that when we go out into operations we have as much operation security as possible, when we go out to knock on her door were taken enforcement action we generally local fly officers so we are on the blue and blue situation. we make sure people in the community that would be in position to need to know do know. >> but the fewer people that know generally the more effective and probably the better for officer safety, is that peer to say? >> it depends if you're talking specifics are in general allergies. if specifics like when our operational plan was leaked to the media, that's just
concerning, yes. >> so the president announced on multiple occasions that large-scale operations were going to detain undocumented immigrants as part of operation border resolve, did you know, did the department of are you or you know they were going to announce was pending operations? >> i don't believe they reached out to us for our input. >> did that put officer safety and danger? >> the washington post reported on this in the fall. when you talk about high level that we will do x, y, and see without specifics everybody knows will do immigration enforcement. we generally take 300 - 400 arrests a day. it's no secret that were out there. >> i think the president putting millions behind it in and set up quite significantly. i would just caution, and i hear you talk about the rhetoric of this conversation.
i don't think that is a limited numbers of congress is all i would offer. thank you, sir. >> thank you madam chair. >> through director, i know we have been talking a lot about immigration, but i also want to thank your men and women that do work on the other cross-border activity which includes the national crimes, the bonding laundering, commercial fraud, intellectual property theft, cyber crimes, human rights violation, human smuggling, human trafficking, and other work that you do. i do want to thank them for the other work that they do, even though we do spend a lot of time on immigration. the other thing is, i feel that if you go to some other countries, they have their immigration court at the border. your folks have been trying to put the courts at the border, can tell you they will give me all the different excuses why,
but i think we ought to hold people at the border, and give them their day in court, give them their due process, and as you know, according to the immigration court to office, if you have 100 people, 88% of them are going to be rejected from asylum claims and then 12 are going to be accepted and unfortunately we let people into the country, they are here for two, three, five years whatever it is. immigration courts tells 44% don't show up after they are given the notice to appear. i think were doing it backwards. i think the trump of obama administration are doing it backwards. i would ask you, to have your folks reconsider the positions that they have taken in the past where we have had those immigration courts as much as possible. when we talk about immigration courts we have about 315 since we started working on it, since
2014, the first thing they do is say, we want to do video conference. well, as you know the reason they send judges to houston, to new york, san francisco and all of that is because they release people and then they want to put judges for the people are released. i think we are doing it backwards but i would appreciate that and like to follow-up. the other thing, we have been adding judges and i think that the office of principal legal advisors needs to look and have a little help. i believe your information you probably need hundred 28 additional attorneys and 41 additional support staff so the immigration judges can do the work. i think what we are missing right now our court space, we actually have more judges and courts and we are hoping that with this appropriation process working through another subcommittee that we have court space number one. number two, that we had those attorneys because you don't have
those attorneys it's hard for the judges to do the work. i would ask you also because i do know a lot of immigration judges, that you all look at the old show called night court. i do understand that your attorneys leave at 5:00 o'clock or so from what i hear from judges were somewhere five or 6:00 o'clock. and in many ways, what we need to look at that show and if we need to do up a bit of extra work we should have some night shift to address the backlog. anyway, we want to be supportive on adding more monies on that and we would like to get your thoughts on what i just mentioned. >> and i agree that we have to be inventive. i agree with what you're seeing at the po ease and holding the hearings there, i think we can leverage for that both -- they
are the biggest player, they own the courts, so, lot of this falls on the shoulder and we work closely with them. i think it holds promise. again the challenge comes into especially now with so many of the family units being the largest number of cases coming in that we can't hold them. that under florida's we can hold them long enough for the immigration. i will tell you, when i testify and i will say it again, i will take 200 attorneys before i take 200 officers. the bottleneck in the massive amount is there. we'll get more productivity because the work is there, were working closer, if we can leverage technology, we have
opened up courtrooms and our new facilities so we can move those cases through more rapidly. this is one of the ones where it is resource dependent. you're right, is not just attorneys as courtroom, facilities and support staff. we will take whatever we can get and then some. >> mr. price. >> thank you madam chairman. mr. director, let me just briefly revisit the statistics on whom you are detaining them reported to -underscore my request because i want to move on to another question. ... at some figures about the breakdowns we're discussing. it appears three of the top four categories in terms of people who are categories as criminals, criminal convictions, three of those four categories are drug offenses, d.u.i., drug -- traffic offenses, d.u.i.,
traffic offenses, more generally, and immigration offenses. now, other crimes here are very serious. many of them violent. but as far as the numbers are concerned, i would just return to m >> just return to our assertion the overall that is really not helpful. it's apparent that obscuring the discussion more than helping with it given the fact that has been in need to be on prioritizing dangerous threat to the community. i appreciateco your, about the personnel from the interior to the border has compromised your abilities but it seems to me -- it affects the overall number in
the overall racial numbers. is there any figures on that that wouldld clarify? we certainly need a breakdown of the. let me turn to something that is been in the headlines in my own district and it just puzzles me and i want you to, on it. it's a very difficult situation involving sanctuary and places of worship. how are you putting pressure on those immigrants and those supporting. in a 38 your mother of 41 of five individuals taking sanctuary in north carolina.
just out of the blue, i've intends to find two, 314,000, willfully failing or refuse to leave him for having can i or deportation. >> apparently she is one of fewer than ten undocumented immigrants living in sanctuary who receive this notion. for this impossibly high sum, they cannot possibly pay. it is my understanding that the financial penalties for violating immigration laws, do exist, they've existed since mid 90s prayed it's very rare they've gone above about a thousand dollars. so what is this all about? why is ice using these extremely severe financial penalties to
target this group of individuals, how did you determine that it should be $799 a day. actually the law states that civil penalties forig immigrants should be something like 500, but estates not more than 500 today. what is going on with these fines and how are you choosing whom to impose my questioning. >> thank you. we have been looking at this and again, what we are trained tois do, is hold individuals accountable and try to restore some integrity to the rulean of law and the immigration system. if you have individuals -- and we are applying the laws that congress has passed and authorized us to do. they have authorized the civil fines be levied on certain behavior.
one includes a fine for an individual to ignore an involuntary departure ordered by immigration judge. there is a fine forer failure to depart removal. in very strict criteria that must be met in order for that to happen. one the order was issued in person. it wasn't even the individual say they didn't know that, has to be an in-person order which is essential. and we did a federal registration on this last year. accounting for inflation and that's how it came to that amount. if we are going to have any integrity in the immigration system, i don't think we have a system whereby somebody can avail itself of all due process, work the system for five, six, 78 years and they get a result they don't agree with, takes injury in a church where they no the policy prevents him from having the law enforced againsti him. so we will use all the tools available to try to gain compliance with the lawfully
issued judge's order. part, if we want to have a secure border, there has to be consequent this for illegal entry. that means that you have to leave the country if you're ordered by a judge. if you feel, and there's a way we can find you, we will do that too. >> to think there's any doubt that these people have that you're on their case. >> no. >> why are you doing it now? how did you pick the ten people around the country that you are going to submit these finds him. >> we started this process of october last or, we have gone through the field offices, there's very defined criteria which youe have to meet to be eligible or fined. and to determine if they meet all the factors required by law
to be fined. we have gone through various field offices and they're going to their cases who avoided orders of involuntary departure in trying to find individuals that are there, some we arrested them and remove them rather than finding them. individuals that we cannot locate or are not able to find or take sink short, there are more things were cases out there than those that were fine. if you went we reviewed the did not meet the legal criteria for a fine. >> if you can let us know what the legal criteria rate certainly is a mystery to me in my community. thank you, madam chairwoman. >> we are past the time and i appreciate you agreeing to stay here beyond the 3:00 o'clock schedule that we had originally given you.
i do have some other questions that i will submit particular in regards to the treatment of pregnant women in detention that following. thank you very much for your time and i look forward to continue to work with you on some of the issues that a been raised. >> likewise thank you. [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations] [inaudible conversations]
[inaudible conversations] >> monday on c-span, vaping and the youth epidemic. congress is investigating the issues. we started apm with opponents of vaping. >> they do not associate vaping and dooling, it is like kleenex and band-aids. there has been articles written about this and studies because we have commented on it. they think they are julie they don't think there vaping. that is the truth. >> at 950 eastern, the ceo of jewel labs, a manufacture of e-cigarettes. >> we don't want any underage consumers using this product. we need to work together to make sure the no underage consumers use this product.
it is terrible for our business, terrible for public health, our reputation. none of this is good stuff. >> watch monday on c-span, online as c-span.org or listen wherever you want with the free c-span radio app. >> in 1979, a small network rolled out big ideas. let viewers make up their own mind. c-span open the door for all to see. content of congress and beyond. today that big idea is more going than ever on television and online, c-span is your unfiltered view of government so you can make up your own mind. >> house judiciary committee chair jerrold nadler told reporters his committee is considering whether or not