tv CNN Newsroom With Jim Acosta CNN October 23, 2021 12:00pm-1:00pm PDT
because he's already done it. he did it the last time. you know, there are times where you don't know. let's face it. when you elected barack obama, you're like, i don't know. that, that -- maybe you knew, but i have to say, i look at those, i look at some of that old footage, i'm like, man, he looked really young. i can't believe they trusted him to do all that stuff. he looks like he's 25 years old. that was before the gray hair. some of you who are very young don't remember, but i used to have black hair. but, but with terry, you know. he's done it. and you know this about terry. he knows how to work hard. this guy is the energizer bunny. he does not sleep. he does not stop. he started his own business at the age of 14. paving driveways to help pay for
college. now i don't remember exactly what i was doing at 14, but i will tell you, i was not starting my own business. and ever since, terry has brought the same grit and determination to everything he's done. from public service to business to being a husband, to being a father of five amazing children. so the guy knows how to work hard. and he's persuasive. and terry knows what it means to lead. a lot of times you see candidates say one thing to one group of people and then they act a little bit different with another group of people. they don't seem sincere. they don't want you to know what they're really all about. but with terry, you don't have to wonder what he's going to be like as governor.
you've seen him. he walks the walk. doesn't just talk the talk. as your governor, terry kept virginia on the right track after the great recession. he helped create 200,000 jobs. drove unemployment down in every city and county in virginia. not just in the sections of northern virginia that were getting tech jobs et cetera, every county. every city in virginia. he was working to make sure the people got opportunities. every single one. so when terry tells you he's going to help virginia rebuild a stronger economy that creates good jobs, when he says that he's going to invest in education and workers, when he says he's going to help families from everywhere get ahead, south and north, you can believe it. because he's done it before. and that kind of experience matters. because the work we, we need to
do is too important to just leave to chance. this pandemic has made the last couple of years incredibly hard for a lot of virginians, but thanks to leaders like the governor, president biden, we've been making progress. the national unemployment rate is the lowest it's been since the pandemic started. in virginia, it's even lower. schools have reopened. jobs are coming back. businesses are starting to recover. we're moving forward. now we've got a joyce. we can go backwards. we can plunge right book into the misguided policies and devisiveness and negatiligence we can build an economy that works for everybody. where kids have a shot at a great education and get skills
for new jobs. where we follow the science when it comes to the pandemic. where we work together and listen to each other and we move this country forward. that's what terry's running on. that's why he wants to be your governor. that's why you've got to get out there and vote. to make virginia a magnet for good jobs. to make sure our kids can go to school safely. terry talked about it. he's got a plan to boost the minimum wage to $15 an hour by 2024. help give young people like the ones in this audience the education they deserve. make healthcare more affordable for everybody. we've got half a million virginians getting help on the affordable care act. we could be doing more and terry's going to do it. talking about protecting a woman's right to make her own decisions. to keep guns out of the hands
and terry talked about wanting to work in a bipartisan way with reasonable republicans. you don't have to, he's not just saying that for the campaign. he did it when he was governor. he's walked the walk. and by the way, terry's not alone. all across the country, democrats are working to make sure that the wealthiest americans and largest corporations pay their fair share in taxes so we can do things like make childcare more affordable. so we can make real progress in the fight against climate change. all across the country, democrats are trying to make it easier to vote, not harder to vote. and push back on republicans who are trying to systemically prevent ordinary citizens from making their voices heard. just this past week, some of you
probably say every democrat in the senate. support a bill that would protect the right to vote and ban partisan gerrymandering and reduce the influence of dark money in your politics. every democrat voted for it. every republican voted against it. which by the way, it's a little bit of an aside, you have to ask yourself, why is it republicans don't want you to vote? i would assume if they think they've got better ideas they should make the case. tell us your ideas, tell us why you think they're going to be better. tell us how it's going to help that man get a job or help that young person go to college or help that person get a trade. just explain it and if you've got good ideas, people will flock to your ideas, but that's
not what they try to do. instead, you're trying to rig elections. because the truth is, people disagree with your ideas and when that doesn't work, we start fabricating lies and conspiracy theories about the last election. the one you didn't win. that's not how democracy's supposed to work. it's what makes america great. it's what makes a society a city on the hill. it's extraordinary experiment in self-government and protecting that and preserving that. that shouldn't be a partisan issue. it didn't used to be. so that's what terry and democrats everywhere are focused on. so let's shift for a moment.
to what terry's opponent is running on. don't boo. vote. booing doesn't do nothing. booing might make you feel better, but it's not going to get terry elected. vote! now, i want you to get fired up inside and then go vote! terry's opponent, he's thinking virginians either aren't paying attention or he thinks they're gullible. now, this is someone who has been very successful. made hundreds of millions of dollars and you know what, that's great. we don't begrudge success. we want everyone in america to have a chance to pursue their dreams. that's what terry did. a a successful business person himself. but you notice that having
achieved success, terry then decided i need to give back. i need to lift people up. i need to create more ladders of opportunity for everybody else because somebody did that for me, i'm going to do it for the next group of people coming along. that's why he got into public service. his opponent, not so much. his opponent doesn't want people like him to pay a dime more in taxes to support education or childcare or all the other things that might help the next generation get ahead. although now suddenly he wants you to believe that he's discovered the middle class. terry's opponent would, he supported a policy that would cut education and public safety
and put more than 40,000 teaching jobs at risk right here in virginia and now he's telling you he's very concerned about our kids and our streets. he told some voters in private that he can't talk about a woman's right to choose while he's running, but he said that if he wins, he'll restrict the right across virginia. don't boo. so how can he claim to be the candidate for women? i don't either. as far as i can tell, the big message terry's opponent is that he's a regular guy because he wears fleece. he's accusing schools of brainwashing our kids. he's also said he wanted to audit the voting machines used in the last presidential
election again. really? encouraging the lies and conspiracy theories that we've had to live through all this time? and yet we're supposed to believe he's going to stand up for our democracy? listen, i want to emphasize this. i'm glad that the guy can play basketball. you know. many of you know, i'm a big hooper. you know, so that's a good thing. the guy can hoop. that's great. i'm less convinced that the co-ceo of one of the largest private equity firms in the world spends his time washing dishes and going grocery shopping, but who knows. maybe. but i mean, you do notice that like, whenever a wealthy person runs for office, they always
want to show you what a regular guy they are. but that's okay. but when your supporters hold a rally where they pledge allegiance to a flag that was flown at the insurrection at the capitol on january 6th, the b biggest threat to our democracy in my lifetime when you don't separate yourselves from them. when you don't think that's a problem. well, you know what? that's a problem. you can't run ads telling me you're a regular old hoops playing dish washing fleece wearing guy but quietly cultivate support from those who seek to tear down our democracy. either he actually believes in
the same conspiracy theories that resulted in a mob or he doesn't believe it but he's willing to go along with it to say or do anything to get elected. and maybe that's worse. because that says something about character and character will end up showing when you actually are in office. w when are you willing to say no to your own supporters? when are you willing to say there's some things that are more important than getting elected and maybe american democracy is one of those things !
virginia, we've got too much to get done to be dealing with the okie doke. here we are trying to recover from a global pandemic that has killed more than 700,000 americans. shut down thousands of small businesses and put millions out of work. we don't have time to be -- trumped up culture wars. this fake outrage that the right wing media has to juice their ratings and the fact he's willing to go along with it instead of talking about serious problems? that's not what this election's about. that's not what you need, virginia. instead of forcing our communities to cut back at a time when we're just --
spreading misinformation and disinformation about the last election, we should be trying to strengthen our democracy and make it easier for more people to vote in future elections. instead of stoking anger aimed at school boards and administrators who are just trying to keep our kids safe. who are just doing their jobs. stoking anger to the point where some of them are actually getting death threats. we should be making it easier for teachers and schools to give our kids the world class education they deserve and to do so safely while they're in the classroom. so we're in a turning point right now.
both here and in america and around the world. because there's a mood out there. we see it. there's a politics of meanness. and division. and conflict. of tribalism and cynicism. and that's one path. but the good news is there's been some other paths. and we solve big problems. and we rebuild our society in a way that gives more and more people a better life and that's the choice we face. it's a choice i believe will define not just the next few years. but the next few decades of human history, maybe longer than that. you know, i look out at some of these young people who were 2
when i was elected. not born yet. you were born. i thank you. i'm glad you were at least born. only a few months old, but he was born. so but i look at them, because i see in these young people, i see my own daughters and i think about the world we're giving to them and i think the thing about being a parent, you hear it's a cliche and then it happens and two of those cliches with true. one cliche is that boy, they grow up fast. but the other cliche is you will do anything. anything. to make sure their lives are better. you will sacrifice anything. for them.
and so right now, we're helping to determine what kind of democracy are they going to inherit. what kind of planet they're going to inherit. what kind of economy. we're going to inherit. what are we leaving for them? and it's our choice. and i'm here today because i believe virginia will make the right choice. i believe america ultimately will make the right choice. i believe you right here in virginia are going to show the rest of the country and the world that we're not going to indulge in our worst instincts. we're not going to go back to the chaos that did so much damage. we're going to move forward with people like terry leading the way.
and here's the thing, in order for that to happen, we need your help. we need you to vote. i know a lot of people are tired of politics right now. i -- listen, i'll make a confession. i never watch political shows. michelle and i, when we're at home, i'm reading. she's watching hgtv. maybe the food channel. so i understand why people might be tired of politics. and the arguments and the tweaks and the back and the forth and some of you are just plain tired because this has been hard. i understand why people are frustrated. you know, we thought that the pandemic was just about done and then suddenly, the delta comes up and kind of throws us for a loop and people are just tired. they feel cooped up.
they're not sure what's safe. all this arguments going on on tv all the time. folks wearing masks. look, i believe in wearing masks is the right thing to do for people that we care about. we do it, we do it for people who are vulnerable. not just for ourselves. but let's face it, i mean, i think it's important to acknowledge. sometimes i lose my mask, i'm like, oh, man, where is it? i understand why people just feel lieke, ah, when is this going to end? and sometimes politics in washington feels that way. right? it's like, oh, are we still arguing about guy marriage? really? i thought that ship had sailed. i, i -- i thought was pretty
clearly the right thing to do. we got republicans across the country who said yeah, that's of course and we're going to reopen that can? so i understand why sometimes folks get tired? we can't afford to be tired? and they overcome. it's hard and nobody, terry doesn't claim that by being governor, suddenly every problem is going to be solved. i didn't solve every problem when i was president. i mean, the fact is that it's hard to undo the legacy of discrimination that goes back centuries.
it's hard to deal with special interests who want to keep the status quo when you're trying to make the economy more fair and just. it's hard in a big country like this where people disagree a lot. to get everybody move ng the same direction, but we can make it better. when you've got the right person in the job, we might not -- we may not get every child the best education in the world, but we can get a lot more kids a better education. i didn't get everybody healthcare in america, but we got a whole lot more people healthcare in america. it makes a difference! when we decide to make things better. and when you've got somebody in your corner who has shown that
they will work for you who has a track record of accomplishment, then you've got to go out there and work for them. not because everything's suddenly going to be perfect, but because it's going to be better. when you've got somebody like terry who's responsible and serious. he's worth fighting for. so you got to go out there and show the cynics that you're willing to knock on doors for terry. to make the calls for terry. to tell your friends and neig neig neighbors what's at stake. we ain't got time to be tired. we don't have time to be tired. what is required is sustained effort. you know, i was thinking back because i haven't campaigned for a while. i went back to my first campaign. and i remember in the, in my
first presidential election, i spoke in grant park about a woman, 106 years old, who had voted for me. african-american. miss cooper. 106. and i tried to imagine everything that she had gone through in her life. all right. born in the shadow of slavery. deep in the midst of jim crow. a time where women, when she was born, didn't have the right to vote. much less -- and yet, she described how she, the minute she had a chance to vote, would never miss it. including up to the time where the first african-american nominee of a major party had the
chance to become president of the united states. she had witnessed all that. and i thought, now, if she's not tired, i can't be tired. if jon lewis wasn't tired, we can't be tired. if the folks who had to fight for union rights weren't tired, we can't be tired. if the suffragists weren't tired, we can't be tired. so go out there and fight and work because you're going to decide this election for generations to come. don't sit this one out and make sure you vote for democrats up and down the ballot including for state legislature where a lot of important work actually
gets done. i used to be a state legislature. don't forget them because that's what's going to help terry be able to deliver for you. and if you do, if you do these things, if you're not tired, if you work, if you vote up and down the ballot, if you get your friends and neighbors and your cousins to vote, if you do all that, we will elect terry mcauliffe. we will election halla, we will elect mark herring, we'll build on our majorities in the state legislature. we'll keep virginia on the path to a better future. i have faith in you. have faith in yourselves. get out there. get to work. yes, we can. god bless you, virginia. god bless the university. god bless the united states of america. thank you, everybody.
>> you've been listening to former president obama rally voters in virginia on behalf of gubernatorial candidate, terry mcauliffe. the state's race for governor is seen as a bellwether for the political landscape going into next year's midterms. democrats believe a strong showing by mcauliffe will bode well, but a republican victory could be a warning shot about the political direction of the country nearly a year after joe biden beat president trump for the presidency. let's go to dan in richmond. he's live in the virginia capitol where the former president just finished speaking. also with us is paul begala and with me onset, kirsten powers. dan, to you first. some familiar lines from barack obama. i covered them 13 years ago. we heard don't boo vote back then.
we heard it again today. but he really went after glenn youngkin there describing him as sort a wolf in sheep's clothing at times, maybe in a sheep's vest. playing footsy in the far right, with donald trump, to sell himself differently to virginia voters. what did you pick up on? >> you'd be forgiven to think this was a 2012 rally that you would have been at, but this was a chance for obama to shake off some political rest and he made it clear he was happy to go after republicans and it's a preview of likely what's to come in 2022. you're right. he really went after glenn youngkin, the republican opponent. sitting behind him was the democrat, terry mcauliffe, but much of obama's speech focused on youngkin. taking him apart. really going after his public persona. questioning his rallies, his ads. the way he casts himself. even mocking the fact he plays basketball in his ads.
that he's seen doing house work. it was sometimes personal attacks against youngkin. he wrapped it up by saying this might not seem like it matters, but it's about character and that character will show itself is youngkin is elected. take a look at one attack and the fact he didn't distance himself strongly enough from some folks who held a rally here in virginia and apparently pledged allegiance that was used in the insurrection. >> when you don't separate yourselves from them, when you don't think that's a problem, well, you know what? that's a frob. problem. you can't run ads telling me you're a regular old hoops playing dish watching fleece wearing guy but quietly get support from those who seek to
tear down our democracy. either he believes in the same conspiracy theories that resulted in a mob or he doesn't believe it but he's willing to go along with it. to say or do anything to get elected and maybe that's worse. because that says something about character. and character will end up showing when you're actually in office. >> yeah, jim, this rally is not necessarily about convincing voters to vote for democrats. we're in a city that voted 80% of it voted for obama in 2008 and 2012. this was less about persuasion and more about turnout. you heard obama repeatedly come back to this idea that you can't sit this election out and that
is a concern democrats have had throughout this race. they worry that voters are not as plugged in this this 2021 off year election than they were for biden in 2020. hillary clinton in 2016 and obama twice in 2008 and 2012. that's a concern and that's why you heard obama repeatedly say here this is important. the issues that elected me are on the ballot and that's why he pushed folks to get out and vote. >> all right. dan, thanks for that. and paul, the former president, he slammed the gop for trying to subvert democracy. a lot of people have been waiting for barack obama to talk about these sorts of things extensively. he did that today. let's listen. >> why is it republicans don't want you to vote? what is it that they're so afraid of? you know, it, i would assume, terry f they think they've got better ideas, why don't they just go make the case? tell us your ideas.
tell us why you think they're going to be better. tell us why it's going to help that young man get a job or help that kid go to college or help that person get a trade? just explain it. and if you've got good ideas, people will flock to your ideas, but that's not what they try to do. instead, you're trying to rig elections because the truth is people disagree with your ideas. >> trying to rig elections. he went right after them, paul. what do you think? >> i think this fellow, obama, got a future in this business, jim. what i thought was really -- >> michelle would be against that though. >> just kidding, ma'am. i thought what he did that was really effective was that this is serious stuff. he was still playful but not
hatefully. i thought that was a very effective turn. that clip you ran, particularly important because democrats are worried. terribly worried. i've seen polling, they're terribly worried about turnout and enthusiasm. sometimes in politics, common sense isn't too common. that's what president obama just brought to this. he said look, why do you think they don't want you to vote? if they had better ideas, they'd want you to vote. they're trying to stop you from voting. when you tell people that, it will motivate them to get into this off year election that democrats are so worried about. >> and kirsten, you know, the youngkin campaign, they've been pretty surgical. pretty clinical in the way they've waged this campaign and obama was trying call them out for that. he appears in these ads wearing a fleece vest and so on and plays basketball, but yet playing footsy with the trump forces of the far right and obama tried to put that out in front of voters today.
do you think they're going to be paying attention in places like northern virginia where they're dead set against trump, but donald trump's not running. it's youngkin. >> right, but they're tieing him to donald trump and he's making it a little easier for them because of these things that president obama talked about. that's pretty agreejs to have people pledging allegiance to a flag in the insurrection. but glenn youngkin has also done a pretty good job. that's what president obama was going after. of portraying himself as a reasonable person. that he's just this reasonable republican and done as much he can to play footsy, as you said, in a way that won't get too much attention from the people that he coudoesn't want to pay attenn to it and more from people he does. there are going to be people in the suburbs, women in particular, that aren't going to like that, but there are going to be some voters that need that in order to turn out for them. >> the former president said
there's no time to be tired. political fatigue is a reality and some democrats have been fighting trump for years at this point. especially all the way back to birtherism and so on. do you think that is this message from obama today is going to motivate enough democrats to make a difference? fear is a motivator, too. and i mean, if you talk to democrats and i mean, you're a friend of terry mcauliffe. i have to ask you, how worried are you that terry mcauliffe is going to lose this race? >> i go back 34 years with terry. a dear friend of mine. our kids have grown up together. i'm biased as i could be. one of my many children works for the polling firm that's consulting for terry. so i'm all in on this race so people should know i have this very personal stake in this. and yet, yes. the campaign should be worried. it is. democrats ought to be worried.
you know virginia. it almost always votes against the president's party the year after the presidential election. so joe biden, a democrat, just won. i think virginia would want it to swing back, but there's something really noteworthy as an old guy who's done this all my life. it used to be, especially in the south, democrats ran away from their national leaders. i can't tell you how many clients i had, i'm not a dukakis democrat. you have mcauliffe welcoming him and you see the campaign trying to smoke out trump. they want trump to -- i don't think trump has the guts. every bully is a coward inside and he had had the guts to come into virginia and not campaign. there's just no way. >> and kirsten, how much of a bellwether is this?
we say this time and again. we've said this so many times that if mcauliffe loses in virginia, this means bad things for democrats in 2022. that's not necessarily the case. we don't know where things are going to be a year from now, but it sure feels like this is huge. this is big. >> i actually, i don't think it's quite as big of a bellwether as everybody's saying. it's not necessarily predictive, but we don't have anything else. >> right. >> so i think that's why people are paying so much attention to this because there's else really to look at and make any judgment on where things are. >> the thing that i find so fascinating about this race is when you have an event like you were just mentioning and they're pledging allegiance to a flag that was carried on january 6th and republicans in virginia, republicans in virginia, for them to overlook that. it's not even playing political footsy. we're talking about bedfellows
at this point. to overlook that and elect glenn youngkin despite that. to me, it means something. >> it means we're very polarized. that's what i take away from it. we're very polarized. we have a binary political system where you only get to choose between two different parties. the biggest predictor of where they're going to vote is the party. most of them are always going to go with whoever they normally go. it could hurt him to be tied too closely to trump. to make it seem like he's not excement when he's talking to the people who really want to hear it. i think a lot of that is what the president, what president obama spoke about, what paul talked about, is just turnout. it's not that the people are
voting for that, they're not even showing up to vote. that's what democrats are trying to say. you have to show up even if you're exhausted. even if you're not enthusiastic because republicans are enthusiastic so democrats are going to have to ignore their fatigue and turn out. >> thank you so much for that. it's fascinating race. we'll be watching. good to see both of you. skbl coming up, what new court documents reveal about the moment alec baldwin accidentally killed a crew member. and the set's armor expressing doubts about the capability before the tragedy. in at 9 am tomorrow morning. orrrr... you could find the answer right now in slack. and give steve a break. slack. where the future works.
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trigger and the gun went off firing a live round that accidentally hit the movie's cinema tog ra. they said the prop gun had been given to the director by the armor. the armor has been identified as 24-year-old hannah gutierrez who in a podcast just last month revealed she just finished her first film as head armorer and almost didn't take the job because she wasn't sure she was ready. >> i was really nervous about it at first and i almost didn't take the job because i wasn't sure if i was ready, but doing it, it went really smoothly. >> and joining me now is cnn entertainment reporter, chloe. "the los angeles times" is reporting that hours before this fatal shooting happened, workers walked off the set according to people familiar with the matter not authorized to comment. and they're also reporting there
were multiple prop gun disch discharges. sounds like you've got the makings of an accident waiting to happen. what more are you hearing. >> this is the making of a real life nightmare. you know, you have armorers onset to make sure that these prop guns are safe. and like you said, you know, the assistant director handing this gun to alec baldwin to shoot the scene and yelling out cold gun, meaning this gun is safe to be using. to fire. that there is not going to be any sort of an accident like this. so there is a huge question as to hannah gutierrez, we haven't heard anything from her, but you did play that portion of that podcast from last month where she talks about a movie that she worked on with nicolas cage. her first film and that she was nervous to take the job. she is the daughter of a very famous armorer. we're not putting the onus on
her, but this is an active investigation, jim. and you have these reports out there that there were crew members that walked off the set because thee, two prop guns accidentally discharged. so we need more information about that. and why were there concerns about safety on the set? there are reports also that certain union workers left and people who were not part of the union came on to oversee the prop guns and the armorer department. so a lot of questions. this is an active investigation and everyone is wondering is rust going to most likely halt production completely. especially since they can't be filming anytime soon. >> that's true. let's play what baldwin's costar said just days ago about working with guns on the set. >> they have me take my gun, like, all right, what gun would you like? i was like, i don't know. an armor. you have gun experience?
what's a gun? and i was like, a little. she's like, okay, well this is how you load it. this is how we check it. make sure it's safe. she's like, okay, i'm going to put some blanks in there and i want you to go and fire a couple of rounds towards the hill. i put the belt on. i walked out, she's like make sure you pull the hammer all the way back and aim at your target. >> cringe worthy to say the least. >> absolutely. >> cringe worthy. there are petitions being forming right now in hollywood with people wanting there to be stricter laws and more safety on these sets and why use prop guns at all. also, former tweets of alec bal baldwin's are coming back to haunt him. one where he said i wonder what it would be like to accidentally shoot and kill someone referring to a police officer who shot and killed a suspect in california.
d again, this is a messy situation, a lot of questions and a true tragedy. >> and there are people out there who are trying to troll him bringing that stuff back. they should be ashamed of themselves. this is a terrible, tragic mistake and baldwin has tweeted that he's cooperating, that his heart goes out to everybody who's been affected by this. just so awful. thank you so much. we'll stay on top of that. appreciate it. coming up, big developments in the january 6th investigation. word now that a central pusher of the big lie and key figure in the scheme in the election has a date now to testify. student loan debt? stuckh move to sofi-and feel what it's like to get your money right. ♪ move your student loan debt to sofi—you could save with low rates and no fees.
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cnn has learned that a former top justice department official who tried to help donald trump push the big lie will testify before the house committee investigating january 6th. jeffrey clark is the first trump administration official to comply with the subpoena. he'll testify next friday. among the things lawmakers want to talk to him about, clark drafted a letter to georgia officials falsely asserting that the department of justice had found voting irregularities that impacted the outcome of the election in several states, but no such fraud existed. his testimony will be key to uncovering more about the events leading up to january 6th, but we're still learning new information about what occurred during the attack thanks to a new hbo documentary featuring unseen and disturbing footage of the riot. here's one of several eye opening moments from the
documentary, four hours at the capitol. it debunks the false claim that none of the attackers were armed. >> they were hitting officers with poles and pieces of scaffolding they had taken off the inaugural stage. there was hammers. i remember at one point, a gun actually fell out of one of the individuals of the crowd. of course i didn't have anywhere to put it. i had a long trench coat. the entire day of fighting, i had that person's gun inside my coat the entire day. i think if we had weapons, there would have been a large loss of life. maybe on both sides. it felt like we were 100-1. officers were falling off the line. they were bleeding. they were injured. i was terrified that if they broke our lines, they were going to be -- officers pick them off one by one. >> and we're joined by jamie
roberts, the director. jamie, thanks for being with us. i watched this. just incredible film making. it was hard to watch, but so important. when you dug into the footage and started the interviews, what stood out to you about the attack that maybe wasn't apparent when it was unfolding live that day? >> well, i think just first of all, the clip you just played, he said himself that gun that he retrieved but his officers believed there were other guns in the crowd. people have asserted there weren't weapons there, but they were 100-1. there were rumors that were being proven to be a different story there. i think one of the other things is the actual violence was and
how prolonged and how close the police came to being overwhelmed and thousands more entering the capitol. >> that to me stood out as well. i don't think we understood how much of a battle this was. it was armed conflict at times during those four hours. i want to play a chunk of the interview with reuben guy yag. he uses explicit language but it lays out what they were going through. >> you know, people are hyper ventilating. it was just bad. they were scared. they were really, really scared. i was in the marine corp. i had to deal with very aggressive crowds when i was in iraq. individuals themselves aren't usually a problem. but when they get collectively together and they create a mob, the mob is the weapon.
i was ready to fight. i saw a lot of shit back in my day, but i was not going to die on the floor of the fucking house of representatives. i was not going to get taken out by some insurrectionist bastard. >> apologize for that language, but he says he was strategizing about how to stab an attacker if they were overtaken. just pretty stunning stuff. what was going through their minds at that moment. >> yeah, i mean, the congressman said in iraq, and he was extremely potential all the way through the interview. he was one of the few people in there along with a few other military veterans trying to evacuate people. members of congress, when they were trapped in the house. and you know, rioters were just outside the door. they had broken into the capitol with extreme violence and got all the way to the door and smashing through the doors. i think the congressman thought
he would never see something like that america. he had seen it in remark and this time, it was americans trying to kill him and his colleagues. >> i want to play this clip as well about the congressional evacuation. >> i went through the tunnels. got to our secure location. we received word after we all got there that the rioters, you know, were essentially in control of the capitol. >> there were so many of us in that room not knowing how long we would be there. >> for hours, we were sitting there. the president didn't say a word. the president of the united states who runs the military, the commander in chief, if he says a word, things happen. to me, that was beyond the pale. >> to his point, in the film, we see when trump finally did put out his message hours later and,
and it was hours later, telling people to do home, lots of people inside the mob listened to that directive. what do you think, jamie? could that be significant in determining accountability and responsibility after the fact for donald trump? >> yeah. i mean no question that we spoke to members of the right wing organization, the proud boys, various protester, rioters, and they said they went there because donald trump told them to come and they decided to leave. 17 minutes past 4 when he put out the official message to calm everything down. people listened to that and said, okay, we'll leave. we have testimony from the people who broke into the capitol from the film saying exactly that. that was one of the things that was being discussed before we made the film was did donald trump really have an influence over the people there. not everybody, but there's a very large portion of the people there he spoke directly to them. his message goes straight to
their minds. >> all right, it's very disturbing, but job well done. excellent work. the director of four hours at the capitol, thank you so much. this incredible documentary is available now on hbo and hbo max. and really i encourage everybody to watch. thanks so much. >> thank you so much, jim. you are live in the cnn newsroom. the house committee vest gating the attack is getting ready to hear from a key witness while the fight over another continues. jeffrey clark, a former justice department official who pushed big lie and was a central player in trump's effort to overturn the election results in key states is expected to testify next friday. he would be the first trump administration official to comply with the subpoena unlike steve bannon, who is now facing possible criminal prosecution for refusing to testify. lawmakers believe the former trump adviser ha