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tv   Anderson Cooper 360  CNN  July 30, 2021 9:00pm-10:00pm PDT

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good evening. we begin tonight with five words that define where we are in the pandemic. acknowledge the war has changed. those words come from a slide presented -- presentation produced within the cdc, which we learned about overnight. the war has changed. because the enemy has. the delta variant, according to the cdc presentation, travels as easily as chickenpox. meaning, every person, each person, can infect, on average, as many as nine other people. additionally, today, the agency released the study it based its new recommendation on, to wear a mask indoors, even if you've been vaccinated. and it showed that infections with the delta variant produced similar-viral loads, regardless of vaccination status. in other words, even the vaccinated, who likely won't be anywhere near as sick, thank goodness, can still spread delta. the war has changed. late today, president biden acknowledged that additional measures might be coming because of it. >> in all probability, by the
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way, we had a good day, yesterday. almost a million people got vaccinated. so i'm hopeful that people are beginning to realize how essential it is. >> the president, today, signaling some tougher tactics against this tougher adversary. the cdc study was based on a large outbreak in the massachusetts-vacation spot provi provincetown at the tip of cape cod. >> we started to get reports of some strange infection rates among vaccinated individuals. and then, as time went on, we saw more and more cases. until we, eventually, saw a number that was large enough to make a lot of us kind of scratch our head and say, wait a minute, is this something? >> and it was. but because the vast number of people in provincetown are vaccinated, few people have gotten seriously ill. that's the good news. bit later in the hour, we will speak with a doctor who was vaccinated, visited provincetown, and caught a breakthrough infection, she believes, from other vaccinated people there.
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the war has changed. and almost exclusively, among the unvaccinated, the casualties are growing. here is a public-health official in st. louis, reacting to the cdc news. >> i was filled with dread, last week, about this. and as i looked at this report and our local stats, earlier today, um, i -- i'm even more worried, now. um, icu admissions have jumped, have doubled, in the last couple of weeks here, in the st. louis region. the community-transmission levels are at an all-time high. >> even more vaccine-hesitant parts of the state. it's not just how many cases that's troubling doctors, it's also the type of patients they are seeing. >> we had about 15 patients hospitalized with covid in the middle of may. and we're at about 150, in springfield in our hospital. so, you know, it's -- it's up ten times. the -- the patients we're seeing are sicker.
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they're younger. and they seem to be getting sicker, faster. >> and the war has changed in that respect, too. but not, thank goodness, in this. according to this new internal cdc document, vaccines, even with delta, make you three times less likely to get infected and ten times less likely to get severely ill or die. let me just say that, again. vaccines make you three times less likely to get infected, and ten times less likely to get severely ill or die. they work. of the people in massachusetts in this latest-cdc study, we mentioned, no one died and only five were hospitalized. so getting a shot is, still, a great way to stay healthy and stay alive. additionally, new cdc data, out today, shows that 90% of adverse events in adolescents to the vaccine are nonserious. now, with all this in mind, more states, even some red states, have amped up calls for people to get the vaccine. georgia, for example, which is not even 39% vaccinated according to cdc data. state officials there, saying hospitalizations have risen 50% in the last two weeks. and deaths, by 18%.
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more companies are requiring employees to be vaccinated. disney and walmart becoming the latest today. in addition, walmart employees will, once again, be told to mask up, regardless of vaccination status. and of course, there is the president, late today, opening the door to new, federal measures. that said, not everyone's getting onboard. even with the threat to the unvaccinated becoming clearer than ever, today, florida's governor ron desantis issued an executive order blocking mask mandates in schools. blocking mask mandates, that would protect unvaccinated students against a virus that's exploding in his state. the governor saying there will be no lockdowns, school closures, restrictions, or mandates in his state. the war might have changed today but some on the battlefield have not. here to talk about it and take your questions are dr. peter hotez. author of the aptly titled "preventing the next pandemic vaccine diplomacy in a time of anti-science." also joining us, michael
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osterholm. dr. hotez, so, admiral brett giroir, the former assistant health secretary under the previous administration warns that the delta variant is so contagious that, if you have not been vaccinated and you did not, previously, have covid, you will become infected. what does that mean for children under the age of 12, who are ineligible to be vaccinated? >> well, it really depends on where those kids are, especially as schools open. and -- and the big vulnerability that i'm sounding the alarm about is the -- what's going on here, in the south. for instance, the state of louisiana, you've got where delta variant is accelerating now and kids are, already, starting to show up in pediatric intensive-care units. you have only got 17% of the adolescents vaccinated. 15, 16, 17% of the adolescents vaccinated. maybe, 30 to 40% of young adults. you've got the delta variant accelerating and -- and no mask mandates.
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so, this is a crucible. and as schools open, for instance, in some parishes in louisiana, you are probably looking at august 9th or 10th, when schools open. this is not going to go well. i think we are going to see this big, steep acceleration. so, as bad as things are right now in the south, they're about to get worse if -- if -- for -- for lots of unvaccinated individuals. and this is why, you know, we're, you know, working overtime to try to convince people it's still not too late to get vaccinated before schools open but time's run out and you got to do it now. >> mr. osterholm, tonight, dr. fauci is calling this a different and more formidable virus. how do you think this war will change, now that we know vaccinated people infected with the delta variant can transmit the virus? >> well, things will change, a bit. but i think, anderson, the one thing we have to remember tonight, if no one takes away any, other message than this, that these vaccines, still, are highly effective in reducing severe illness and hospitalizations. and most infections. please, understand that.
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so, no matter what else we discuss tonight, that's an important issue. i think the challenge we have right now is with this increased infectivity is what does that mean? if you look at our previous surges of infection, they -- the cases have risen, very rapidly, in different parts of the country, over the last 18 months. and then, dropped rapidly. and we don't understand, exactly, why. i think it's very possible that we are going to see this surge take off in the southern states, as it is now. whether it'll spread to the other states in a meaningful way, i don't know. but i think it's possible that, by september, we'll see that this thing will just drop, again, just as it's done in a number of other locations around the world. we can't count on that but i think that's likely what'll happen. >> and professor osterholm, i think it's really important to stress what you said, which is vaccines work and vaccines are, frankly, for everybody. it's the only way out of this. i mean, we don't have to be in this situation. >> exactly right. you know, and i think one of the challenges we have is when these surges end. when these big bursts in cases,
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finally, come down, people on the other side of it that haven't been infected say, oh, well, i -- i missed it. i'm not going to get it. i made it through. you know, you can't run out the clock on this one. eventually, as was in your lead, this virus will find you. it is that infectious. so if it's not this surge, it'll be the next surge. and i think that that's an important message is that don't try to run out the clock. it won't happen. please, get vaccinated. >> dr. hotez, we got a lot of viewer questions i want to get to. marcy asks everyone talks about pfizer and moderna vaccines. what about those of us that took the j&j shot? do we need a booster? what's our level of protection? we received a lot of questions about the j&j, doctor, people are worried. should they be? >> it's one of my most frequently-asked questions. and the answer is, we do not have clinical data against the delta variant, or at least not that's been publicly made available. we have laboratory data showing that people who have virus neutral
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neutralizing antibodies to the single-dose j&j vaccine have some virus neutralizing antibodies against the delta variant. but it's way down, compared to the earlier lineages, like the uk variant. and when i look at the numbers and they're small numbers, you know, one has about -- serum from a dozen patients. another eight or nine patients are -- are -- are those who have gotten the vaccine. the decline looks similar to the decline that we saw with the south african variant. and we know that translates to a decl decline in efficacy. so i don't want to extrapolate too much but i do think a single dose will have some decline. and that means we got to really hear from the cdc and fda, very soon, about a second immunization of the j&j vaccine. or move to the mrna vaccinations. and i hope we get some word out, very soon. >> by the way, dr. hotez, right now, somebody's got the -- took the -- got the one j&j vaccine. if they want to just get a booster shot. if they want to get another shot, can they just go somewhere and do it? >> well, it -- it's not -- it's not always the case. it depends on your healthcare
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provider. and some will not authorize. and sometimes, the pharmacist will say, look, if you look at your vaccination card, i can't give you another dose. so, it really varies. and -- and this is one of the problems. the cdc really and fda really have to come out with recommendations, pretty soon. also, for the third immunization for the mrna vaccines for vulnerable populations, those on immunosuppressive therapy, transplant patients, et cetera, and also, some of the older individuals because this is what they are doing now in israel. >> professor osterholm, as we heard president biden said tonight in all probability, there will be new koe icovid restrictions. our viewer beth is wondering about that too. she asks what is the risk of outdoor transmission for fully vaccinated? should there be large-outdoor gatherings, at this point? what about that? >> well, we have learned, clearly, over the past 18 months that this virus is transmitted by what we call an aerosol. these are these kind of mist-like transmission in the air. if you want to understand what an aerosol is, just think of somebody smoking.
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if you can smell the smoke from their cigarette, that's the very same as if you are breathing in the air that they exhale out that has the virus in it. >> wow. >> so we do have examples of where we do have transmission in outdoor activities. where people are close together for an extended period of time. but clearly, indoor areas, by far, the biggest challenges. you and i both know, if i were in a room right now with you smoking, you would smell it. and smell it, very quickly. and so, that's what people have to understand. if you can smell a cigarette in the location you're at, then you're breathing someone else's air that may have the virus in it. >> it's really stunning to say in that way. i actually hadn't heard it said that way and makes it quite alarming. professor osterholm, stanley rights, with the delta variant and greater viral load, is six feet still the recommended difference? he is, of course, talking about social distancing. >> yeah, well, six feet is, to my mind, already outdated. when we came up with this understanding of the aerosol transmission of this virus, we've realized that it could be much further. how many times have you been 20 feet downwind from somebody
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smoking and smelled that smoke? >> yeah. >> and so, six feet works with the zero respiratory droplet idea. where if i am talking or coughing, it's like boulders coming out of my respiratory tract, out my mouth, and then falling to the ground. that's not the case here. so, if you are indoors, and again, just rule of thumb, or if you are outdoors, you can smell the smoke. you -- you can also inhale the virus. >> wow. dr. peter hotez, professor michael osterholm, thank you so much. i appreciate it. next, new notes taken by the third man a phone conversation between the former president and acting attorney general. and as you will see, they literally spell out his intention to lie about the election, in his demand of america's top law enforcement official to help him do it. we will speak to the lawmaker who brought this new evidence to light. later, the major new decision that could finally deliver the former president's tax returns to congressional investigators. that's why i started medhaul.
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this next story falls squarely into the shock but not surprised category, and if you are still lacking evidence after three troubling, new accounts of his final days that the former president was consumed with staying in office. and never mind, democracy. this one is for you. it's, perhaps, the closest we might ever get to a sign to oval office photo of him with the inscription here i am on the phone trying to overturn the election. now, we have already seen reporting that he was constantly calling acting-attorney general, jeff rosen, for evidence of voter fraud. something the previous attorney general william barr had, already, said simply did not exist. today, the house oversight
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committee released handwritten notes by mr. rosen's deputy of a december phone call that he and his boss had with the former president. here is the key portion. the handwriting isn't especially legible and it might not come across on your tv screen but quoting the former president, it reads, just say that the election was corrupt and leave the rest to me and the r congressmen. republican congressmen. in other words, just lie and other liars, myself included, we'll take it from there. we are joined now by house oversight committee chair, carolyn maloney. it's another example of the president going to extreme lengths to overturn the election his fiebl final days in the white house. but to have it handwritten by the deputy or assistant to the guy who he is talking to, what happens now? i mean, what's your committee going to do about that? or can they do? >> well, just as you said, it's highly unusual to get any documentation involving direct comments of a president of the
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united states. especially, to get handwritten ones documenting, in great detail, that he was urging the department of justice to call the election, quote, illegal and corrupt. and implied and threatened them, that they would be replaced if they didn't comply? and when doj pushed back and said this is not true, there was no signs of any corruption or illegal activity, he said just leave it to me. just go out and say it. and -- and -- and republican congressmen and -- we'll -- we'll do the rest. it -- it's shocking, beyond belief. we are in the midst of a -- of -- of an investigation. we did not have these documents, that you're revealing tonight, until early-yesterday morning. and more are coming in and we're not going to stop, until we get to the bottom -- bottom of this. so those who aided or witnessed trump's unlawful actions must answer these committee questions about the attempted subversion of our democracy.
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it -- it is -- it is extremely serious and -- um -- we are not stopping until we get to the bottom of it. >> well, also, for the president to say, to the acting-attorney general, you know, just leave it to me. and -- and the other -- and, you know, the republican congressmen. he knows he has a stable of republican congresspeople who will propagate that lie, and he is right about that. they -- many, still, are propagating that lie. but he was so confident in not only his own ability to lie, but also that he would have a whole host of actors willing to go along with it in congress. >> well, all those that are involved should be called forward for questioning. we have gotten clearance, from doj, to question six leaders and -- and the department of justice. we are arranging those interviews for next week. we expect them to fully comply. if not, we will figure out how to force them to comply.
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and we will continue with our investigation. >> at another point during the call, um, the former president described congressman jim jordan as, quote, a fighter. and i want to play something that jordan said recently to spectrum news about his conversation with the president on january 6th. >> did you speak with president trump on january 6th? >> yeah. i mean, i speak -- i spoke with the president last week. i speak with the president all the time. i spoke with him on january 6th. i mean, i talk with president trump, all the time. i mean, that's -- that's -- i don't think that's unusual. >> on january 6th, did you speak with him before, during, or after the capitol was attacked? >> uh, i'd have to go -- i -- i spoke with him, that day, after? i think, after? i don't know if i spoke with him in the morning or not. i -- i just don't know. i'd have to go back and -- i mean, i don't -- i don't -- i don't know that -- when -- when those conversations happened. but um -- but what i know is i spoke with him all the time. >> i mean, first of all, kind of remarkable, on the day that
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democracy's attacked by our fellow citizens and he spoke to the president. a, he's just now talking about that. it's the second time, in recent days, that jordan has been shaky about his conversations with the former president on january 6th. you might think he would remember talking to the president of the united states, on the day that the capitol is being attacked. what do you make of that? >> well, i'm not surprised, at all, that he said that he talks to the president all -- all the time. that he talked to him on january 6th and we need for him to recall what these conversations were. and -- and put forward any information he has of any efforts by former-president trump to overturn the election. to pressure leaders at doj. to call it an illegal and corrupt election when it wasn't. it -- it's shocking, the allegations. actually, the proof that we're seeing is unprecedented. >> chairwoman maloney, appreciate your time.
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thank you. joining us now, cnn senior political commentator, david axelrod. david, i mean, what do you make of this? i mean, again, i'm just shocked to actually see a handwritten note by somebody listening in on the phone call taking notes while the president is saying this. just say the election is corrupt. leave the rest to me and the r congressmen. >> yeah. i mean, it is, you know, it is -- it is appalling. nothing is shocking, anderson, anymore because, you know, there's a well-established story line here and a well-established pattern. he does not believe -- he never believed in rules or laws or norms or democratic institutions. and it was very clear that he was trying to overturn the election, in any way he could. we -- we've already heard the conversations he had with state officials, local officials. you know, in georgia, asking them to find the votes that he -- that he needed. you know, he's, obviously, given amplification to crazy-conspiracy theories that
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have, one after another, been thrown out in courts of law. i mean, he -- he -- this -- this was -- you know, his idea was i'm going to take this, however i can. what's -- what's outrageous is that there were elected officials who were so willing to cooperate with him. and that is appalling. but we should note that there are, also, including these two officials of the department of justice. the acting-attorney general and his deputy. who are unwilling to do that. there were people, at the state and local level, who are unwilling to be bullied by the president of the united states and our democracy was saved by that margin. the last thing that i'd say about this is, after all of this -- after all of this -- he remains the, you know, punitive front-runner for the nomination in the next election. and that is really, deeply concern -- we had an impeachment, anderson. and the argument that was made by some of the president's
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support -- or at least some republicans in congress was, well, he's left already so it's irrelevant. part of that proceeding was going to be -- that proceeding was going to be followed by a motion to disqualify him for running from office again. if this doesn't warrant disqualification from holding public office, particularly the presidency, i don't know what does. >> yeah. but i mean, this is not going to have any impact, obviously, you know, on trump's hold on the republican party. but just to be clear. i mean, presidents aren't supposed to tell the attorney general, just say this and i'll -- i'll deal with the rest. i mean, they're supposed to be -- isn't there some -- >> listen. we went through -- we went through a national trauma in the '70s, that i remember. when richard nixon tried to -- to use the justice department to -- to protect himself from prosecution in the watergate scandal. and -- and, you know, what happened after that were a series of steps, by president
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ford, edward levi, who was appointed attorney general, to restore faith in the justice department to -- to restore faith in the rule of law. and those norms have held, for decades and decades. they've -- they were absolutely shredded by donald trump. we have never seen anything like this, certainly, in my lifetime. i think, in our history. and, you know, he just -- it was just wanton disregard for the norms of democracy. >> yeah. i mean, history is going to look back on this. and it's not going to be pretty. david axelrod, thank you very much. appreciate it. next up, what the justice department decided today about the tax returns of the former president. the congressional investigators had long hoped to access. that he i that's coming up, when we come back. for softer clothes that are gentle on your skin, try downy free & gentle. just pour into the rinse dispenser and downy will soften your clothes without dyes or perfumes.
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the justice department, today, advised that the treasury department must, in its words, turn over the former president's tax returns to the house weighs and means committee. justice said the committee chairman has invoked when it termed sufficient reasons for requesting the returns. the trump administration refused the committee's original request that triggered the ongoing battle. want to get some legal perspective now from cnn senior analyst, elie honig, author of "hatchetman how bill barr
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corrupted the justice department." and from reporter and author tim o'brien, who actually had a chance to see some of those returns as a result of a lawsuit. so, tim, as we just mentioned, you have actually seen the former president's tax returns. you can't discuss what you have seen. what do you make of today's announcement by the department of justice? >> well, there is a lot of elements in it that, i think, are important that go beyond trump, himself. i think it establishes that the -- the congress has a supervisory role to play with the executive branch. particularly, around whether or not the president -- um -- has financial conflicts of interest that can compromise how he or she might conduct their affairs while in office. i think it, also, put a very firm check on -- on a previous department of justice ruling, in 2019, under barr that, i think, essentially, tried to establish the idea that -- that the congress was only on a phishing expedition and had no
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supervisory role to play which, i think, was in keeping with barr's i think traditional view that the -- the executive branch should be more independent from oversight and congressional oversight. but i think the real, to me, anderson, what i think is a seminal development here, potentially, is they -- they are putting into print the fact that, in the modern era, a president like trump or any president who comes into office with the kinds of financial conflicts of interest that trump has, needs to be supervised more closely because it can corrupt or compromise policy making and i think that goes beyond trump. it's a new element that trump introduced when he became president. and it's -- it's good to see that being put in place something to check. >> elie, i mean, legally speaking, does the mean that the fight for congress to see the former president's taxes is over? and that they'll get his returns? >> just about, anderson. this means it's highly likely, congress will get those returns. here's how we got here. so the law says that if the house, the ways and means committee, requests the tax
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returns of any person, the department of treasury, the irs, shall furnish -- that's what the law says -- shall furnish those returns. now, the trump administration, as tim said, bill barr came up with this convoluted legal theory that, well, that doesn't really apply even though it says shall. so we are not turning over anything, unless the courts force us. today, the biden doj reversed that. shall furnish means shall furnish so we are going to turn it over, unless the courts stop us. so now, the ball is in trump's court. either, if he does nothing, then those tax returns are going to congress. or he can try to file a lawsuit to try to stop this but he is looking at a serious, uphill climb there, legally. >> but that could take a long time, couldn't it? i mean, why wouldn't he just try to tie this up in the courts? >> yeah, that's a strategy, anderson. exactly, given his history, i think it's likely he does try. >> tim, yeah, sorry, you were saying given his history? >> sorry, i didn't mean to interrupt, elie. sorry. i think in there, they have basically given him a 72-hour window to try to come back at this. so, they -- they clearly have said, we are opening a door.
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if you want to contest it but that door is not going to stay open very long. >> tim, the justice department also cited the former president's tax returns could reveal what they said were, quote, hidden business entanglements, raising tax law and other issues, including conflicts of interest, affecting proper execution on the former president's responsibilities. do you see this as potentially revealing liabilities not only for the former president but for others in trump orbit? >> certainly. i mean, it -- it -- it would go a long way towards explaining why donald trump engaged in -- in -- in these kupcorrupt and unseemly diplomatic dances with vladimir putin and -- and other dictators. i think -- um, you know, the easy explanation at the time, i think, and -- and it was a real one and it had merit was that he had a juvenile fascination with authoritarian leaders. and he liked to preen around them. but i, also, think, always, in the back of donald trump's mind is how quickly can i make a buck? and i think that a very direct
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reason he was doing a lot of these things was in order to feather his own nest, financially. and one of the elements of a mueller investigation is robert mueller chose not to probe deeply into trump's finances, which remains a mystery to me and i think it's important those things get unearthed. again, not only in terms of trump but in terms of any president who has financial conflicts of interest that need to be scrutinized. but also, certainly, would go a long way towards explaining what motivated a lot of trump's actions. >> and, elie, if the returns go to congress, is it possible the the public would see them? >> yeah, i think it is. and potentially, fairly quickly. we know the manhattan district attorney has had these returns for almost a year, now. we're not going to see those. those are grand-jury materials. they have to remain secret. we won't see them, unless and until there is an indictment and a trial. which who knows? that's very far off, at this point. but congress should think about this because the position they have taken is we want those tax
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returns not to just embarrass the president. not to just put 'em out there but because we need them to consider specific legislation that we are thinking about. so they may want to think about the political impact of putting those tax returns out but there's really, very little to prevent it. >> yeah. elie honig, appreciate it. tim o'brien, as well. thank you. straight ahead, i will talk with a well-known pediatrician who was vaccinated against the the coronavirus. still, diagnosed with the disease after visiting provincetown, massachusetts, after a cluster of covid cases earlier this month that the cdc has been studying. that's next. and no matter what that is, walgreens is here to help you do it your way. with delivery in as little as one hour. because now... things come to you. same day vaccination appointments. because you're ready. and walgreens cash rewards you can donate back to your community. the new normal? have to admit, it does have its upside. walgreens.
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we told you, at the top of the program, about that covid outbreak in the small resort
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town of provincetown, massachusetts, with hundreds and hundreds of new cases reported. one of those infected, dr. jane is a pediatrician and specialist in global infectious diseases. first of all, how are you feeling? you said you were very frightened by your symptoms after you first came down with covid. >> yeah. i'm better. i mean, i feel lucky. you know, and every day, it's funny, to be, in a way, looking at my illness. and realizing that, every day, you can see yourself getting better. and -- and that's a powerful message that i want to give people. >> you feel lucky because you are vaccinated? >> oh, my god. i -- i -- you know, still remember the -- just the miracle of going up to cornell where i'm on faculty. and getting my first vaccine, and then my booster. and i -- i just can't tell you how proud i was. >> if you hadn't been vaccinated, what do you think would've happened with this infection? >> i -- i was -- i was dreading.
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i was, for sure, feeling as if i could get sick, at any point. and i really worked hard to keep myself safe. and i was a vigilante with friends and family about how to stay safe. >> but once, i mean, if you hadn't been vaccinated and you got the delta variant in provin provincetown, i mean, you, at your age, which is probably close to my age, you would -- i mean, you're at risk. >> oh, i -- i have to tell you, there was no question that i was, already, very convinced that i couldn't get delta. i just felt like, you know, i was counting the months. and asking at -- you know, at the various places i could ask, like, does anyone know what my immunity is really about, after six months? and i'm turning 70, in the fall. and all i could think of was, every day, i was eking out
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whatever antibody i might have had. and i wanted to talk to someone about getting another shot. >> um, the -- do you know how you got -- because i -- there is a lot of people, who have dgone to province town this summer and have ended up infected and a lot of them were vaccinated, not hospitalized, thankfully, because they are vaccinated. so it's a commentary on how easy it is to catch delta. do you know how you caught it? >> yeah, absolutely. i mean, i -- i know that the two possibilities was that i love that dune tour. i used to go on it, myself, but i wanted to go on the dune tour. >> what is that? driving -- i don't know -- driving in a car on -- on dunes? >> yeah, it's up those famous, beautiful dunes in -- in provincetown. >> so you were sitting near people in a vehicle? >> well, i was in a vehicle with another friend. and there was plastic across, and just the driver. >> huh. >> and we were there 15 minutes,
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on the way up. and then, we were outside on the dunes. and then, we were 15 minutes back. >> hmm. >> so, that was really what -- and i called, and i found out that, yeah, that the -- the driver was infected, and then had been vaccinated. and then, the other was a breakfast. where we were not set in our usual place for breakfast, where we were, like, separated with guards on either side. suddenly, they removed it and we said, okay, we'll just have our breakfast. and we had breakfast with two really lovely guys. and -- and chatted. and maybe, we were exposed over, maybe, 20 to 30 minutes. >> and what is your -- i mean, people who are seeing this are maybe saying, wait a minute. you are an infectious disease specialist. you caught this. you've been vaccinated. why should i get vaccinated, if it doesn't make any difference? >> okay. well, it does make a difference because, i'll tell you what happened.
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i mean, i developed symptoms within a couple of days. and my shortness of breath was so frightening, i can't even -- i don't know how to express it. it reminded me of patients i've taken care of who were dreadfully ill and had pneumonia or cancer. children, adults. and i know what it felt like for them when they were short of breath. and i was short of breath. and i was frightened. and i had a horrible headache. and i had low-grade fever. and achy muscles. and was -- had a dry cough. and i was exhausted. and i spent, maybe, three to four days like that. >> hmm. >> so, i was really aware of what this could look like, and i was absolutely frightened. and i had to be, you know, sort of calmed down. like, people were, you know, were really helping me. >> do you think the vaccine saved your life? >> right. and that's exactly what happened. i felt, immediately, like i'm scared but i know this vaccine
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will work. and i want to tell people. i -- i feel so open hearted. i've always counseled people on not getting vaccinated. kids. and i felt like, let me talk to people. let me -- i'll -- i'll love them into taking it. i'm good like that. i can convince anybody to do anything. i wanted a chance, already, months ago. and now, i want the chance here to say don't be afraid. open yourself up to an opportunity to be well and safe. and for us, all, to work together, as a community. i'm sorry to be so preachy. but i just feel like we're all together on this and i want us -- i want to tell people about that. >> hmm. >> i'm better and i want them to know, they can talk to me. i'd be happy to talk to anybody, so they could take the vaccine. >> dr. jane, i am glad you are okay and i'm thankful that you agreed to tell your story. thank you so much.
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>> thanks, anderson. >> just ahead, how florida governor ron desantis is trying to make sure no school system can mandate masks, despite a big rise in cases and hospitalizations in his state. l. and you need it here. and here. and here. which is why the scientific expertise that helps operating rooms stay clean is now helping the places you go every day too. seek a commitment to clean. look for the ecolab science certified seal. the sleep number 360 smart bed is on sale now. it's the most comfortable, body-sensing, automatically-responding, energy-building, dually-adjustable, dad-powering, wellness-boosting, foot-warming, temperature-balancing, recovery-assisting, effortlessly life-changing proven quality night sleep we've ever made.
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as we mentioned earlier in the broadcast florida governor ron desantis has issued an executive order to fight the cdc guidance for mask mandates in schools. it orders the state to issue emergency rules to prevent any school system from florida from implementing the order. broward county did just that. he said this was to, quote, protect parents' freedom to choose whether their children wear masks. new covid cases in florida have jumped 50% in one week and as hospitalizations reach the same level as a year ago. joining us now, an infectious disease expert from florida. doctor, thank you for being with
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us. 50% jump in cases in florida is pretty sobering. what do you think about governor desantis blocking or issuing an order to block mask mandates in schools? >> let me just be very clear. the situation is grave and getting more and more so day by day. our hospitals are jam-packed and people are in long lines, waiting for -- to be seen, including children. and this is absolutely tragic. so the situation is bad. this order is based on a study that was done up at brown and it's a small study that contradicts every other study including cdc's studies in the state of florida. that study is not peer-reviewed back in may and it probably not be approved. so it's very surprising because the reality is, every leader right now should be doing their absolute best to reduce the
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transmission of this horrific virus. >> so we're learning just how transmissible this delta variant is. the cdc says it's as transmissible as chicken pox, each person can give it to nine other people. as we get close to the opening of schools in florida, do we know enough about the impact of delta on children who can't get vaccinated? what do you expect to happen when kids are back in the classroom unmasked, assuming their parents don't want them to be masked? >> i'm hoping that parents are going to do what is best for their child and for their community and ask their children to use masks. because the reality is, as i already mentioned, we are seeing very young people including young children coming into hospitals symptomatic, with covid here in the state of florida. and what we don't need is to have long term complications in these children.
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so, you know, it's like going against medical advice. you're going against the science. i can release you from the science against medical advice, but that's what it is, it's not following science and it's not following the best medicine. >> to be clear, you would say, vaccinated or not, every child, teacher, and staff in school should be wearing a mask? >> that's the recommendation of the american academy of pediatrics. and i wholeheartedly support that recommendation. it's also the recommendation of the infectious disease society of america and virtually every medical society in the united states right now. >> governor desantis spoke earlier today, i want to play a little bit of what he said. >> i have young kids. my wife and i are not going to do the masks with the kids, we never have. i want to see my kids smiling. i want them having fun. >> do we know -- i mean, do we know the possible long term effects of a child who gets covid at this point, who gets
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the delta variant? are kids susceptible to -- you said you're seeing them in the hospitals. are they also susceptible to long covid? >> yes. the children are susceptible to long covid although we don't have all the data of what that incidence is going to be or for how long they're going to have any kinds of complications. the biggest risk for children is the multisystem inflammatory system or kawasaki syndrome that we also see in some adults. even that is uncommon. but if it happens to your child, it's absolutely tragic. >> doctor, i appreciate it, thank you very much. ahead, something a little lighter but also a serious question. just what was that on the president's chin and did he really -- well, you'll see. severe rheumatoid arthritis.eo and take. it. on... with rinvoq. rinvoq a once-daily pill can dramatically improve symptoms...
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we wanted to end on something a little lighter that could maybe make you -- some people thought it was funny. others thought it was kind of gross. today president biden was meeting virtually with western governors and while listening to the conversation a staffer handed him a note, he takes it, he reads it. now, later he was holding the note in a way that cameras could capture the text. it said, sir, there is something on your chin. that happens sometimes, certainly -- and so was that awkward thing is do you tell the person there is something on your face. if it's me, i always prefer to be told, you know, there's something ngg