tv Anderson Cooper 360 CNN April 8, 2021 5:00pm-6:00pm PDT
what impact are the sanctions having? >> reporter: so u.s., the u.k., the european union have all imposed sanctions on the junta. in reality, the west doesn't have a huge amount of leverage here. so far what we haven't seen, erin, is a meaningful unified response from the international community to the crisis in myanmar. that's why those people were so desperate and that's why they risked so much to tell us their stories. >> they are so grateful. all of these governments are so grateful that you have put a voice and picture to it. to them it cannot go ignored thanks to you. thank you, clarissa. and thanks to all of you for watching. anderson starts now. good evening. we're following breaking news tonight. a mass shooting in bryant, texas, northwest of houston. just northwest of texas a&m. it happened at a local cabinet company.
today there is more testimony from the medical experts on george floyd. that is a disturbing account of a man's final seconds alive. cnn's sara sidner reports. >> that's the moment the life goes out of his body. >> reporter: today the prosecutor's medical expert did not hold back. >> mr. floyd died from a low level of oxygen and this caused dpaj to his brain that we see and it also caused a pea arrhythmia that caused his heart to stop. >> the world renowned expert
pointed to the officer's actions saying george floyd died because the officers created a scenario in which floyd's lungs were put into a vice-like grip. >> it was almost as if the surgeon had removed the lungs. along those lines. >> reporter: dr. tobin said four things caused floyd to stop breathing including his position on the concrete. >> you mentioned several reasons for mr. floyd's low oxygen. you mentioned one, handcuffs and the street, right? >> correct. >> you mentioned knee on the neck. >> yes. >> prone position. >> yes. >> and then the knee on the back arm and side. were those the four? >> yes, these are the four. >> reporter: the doctor also testified about whether drugs were the culprit that killed george floyd. as former officer derek chauvin's attorney has suggested. to that dr. tobin said floyd had
not taken a proper breath for 9 minutes and 50 seconds when paramedics finally got a breathing tube in him and by that point carbon dioxide in floyd's body had reached lethal levels. >> what's the punch line? >> the significance of all of that is it's a second reason why you know fentanyl is not causing the depression of his respiration. solely explained by what you expect to happen in somebody who doesn't have any ventilation given to them for 9 34iminutes 50 seconds. >> reporter: they pushed dr. tobin on two main issues, the potential effect of drugs on floyd's body and his breathing and his heart disease. >> that's going to affect blood flow in a person, right? it's going to make the body work a little harder to get the blood through the body? >> no, not really. it's not going to do that. >> how does that affect a person's respiratory?
>> you would expect that he would be complaining of chest pain and you would expect that he would be demonstrating very rapid respiratory rate. we don't see either. >> reporter: the last witness of the day also a doctor backed up tobin's testimony that drugs did not cause floyd's death. >> when you watch those videos and we go through them, what is his respiration? he's breathing. he's talking. he's not snoring. he is saying please, please get off of me, i want to breathe. i can't breathe. that is not a fentanyl overdose, that is somebody begging to breathe. >> sara sidner joins us from outside of the courthouse. how did the jury react to the medical expert's testimony today? >> reporter: they reacted particularly to dr. tobin, dr. martin tobin there you heard with the slight irish accent. he was so pointed and he at one point had the jury try different things to show them exactly sort
of how breathing works and use their own hands to touch parts of their neck that he was referring to and almost all, all but three jurors were doing that and at one point, anderson, the judge says to him and the jurors, now, listen, you don't have to do this after an objection from the defense. you don't have to do this. you don't have to do what he sayings but you can if you want. they did continue to do exactly what dr. martin asked them to do, dr. martin tobin in touching different parts of the neck so they could understand exactly what he was talking about when floyd was unable to breathe. >> thank you. want to bring in laura coats. and mark o'mara. you heard sara talk about the medical expert. how effective was he? >> he was absolutely the most compelling witness we've had so far and that includes the emotional testimony from the age ranging from 9 years old to
somebody half a century older. you had all of the law enforcement officials. no one expected this as opposed to a medical expert and autopsy to be this captivating. his methodical approach, cadence, rhythm of information the way he presented in digestible pieces. if you didn't know what a pulmonologist was, you were following along with the demonstratives and you were understanding watching through the lens of an expert who was pointing out the manipulation of handcuffs. identifying the four factors that contributed to the loss of oxygen that sara talked about. the demonstration of torture. this image that's indelible in my mind, anderson, of a man reduced to trying to breathe by trying to use his knuckles, his finger, his shoulder all to no avail and still to have the knee on the neck and the pressure to 91 points on his body, on his
neck. it's an image the jury won't be able to get out of their minds either. >> mark, how effective was that? also to have the jury participate. >> it was amazingly effective because when you have a witness or if the lawyer can be the guide for the jury, can actually walk them through an otherwise complicated series of events, then that person is going to be the guide for the jury all the way through. dr. tobin became that person like laura said, the lilting voice, irish accent helped. he brought them into his explanation. the hand on the neck was great. that got the jury involved even with the objection. even when he had them counting the breaths, because if you remember what he said, when you count them yourself, then you'll hear and i will tell you, i
thought that the respiration counting was one of the most specific and very interesting points of evidence because that completely destroyed the suggestion that fentanyl and what it causes, a decrease in respirations, which is one of the high points of the defense presentation so far on cross, he completely destroyed that. of course, other witnesses destroyed some other possibilities of a defense. i thought this witness, as laura said, the most compelling because he literally walked the jury all the way through the state's case. >> laura, it is very important what mark said about the defense clearly is pushing, you know, potential drug use as an issue. do you agree that tobin did a very effective job of kind of batting that away? >> he did. here's how. you want your witness, particularly an expert witness, to establish that rapport very quickly with your jurors. they are the ones who matter. you want them as people who are
assessing and evaluating the credibility of the witnesses to be able to feel like this person is informative, not just simply trying to influence me. it's my job as the juror to ultimately be the fact finder. i need somebody i can trust. his sort of ability to not only lay out the information through the vantage point as an expert as opposed to a layman identifying new things but also to address and resolve statements. there was even that moment talking about this phrase we keep hearing, anderson, if you can talk, you can breathe. we even heard the audio body kac cam of derek chauvin. you had him describe exactly what the human body is capable of doing even though oxygen deprivation is imminent. he walks us through that. he walked the jury through that. he had already established all of the rapport and the credibility of somebody who was
not a paid expert, had volunteered his services, had written the textbook on these things and provided demonstratives, kind of like crash test dummies, looking at the efficacy of an airbag, he was able to have people in the moment visualizing it. these jurors were no longer flies on the wall seeing it through the eyes of bystanders, they were participants. that's exactly where you want to be as a prosecutor. >> mark, you thought the defense missed a few opportunities today? >> i really did. i think they allowed tobin to go way beyond his expertise. he is a pulmonologist. a great one. he can talk about breath, he can talk about respiration but when he starts talking about everything else that he did to give the state the best evidence that they could, again, destroying fentanyl intoxication, meth intoxication, i thought the defense should
have honed him in a lot more, particularly when you have such an effective witness because you have to try and at least interrupt the flow, interrupt the cadence. i thought the defense got lulled to sitting there listening to how intriguing he was. i also want to say i think the state did a master full job through this witness of leading the knee on neck sort of behind a little bit because it was questionable is the knee really on the neck the whole time. all of that is there. they shifted from knee on knowing full body on body compression and i think that is really what caused the death. we now know that to believe dr. tobin and i think that was a great way to sort of move over to something that they can truly justify rather than just the knee on neck. >> we're joined by george floyd's cousin to talk about what they think about the family
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wellit shows your glucose ge. right on your phone and where it's heading without fingersticks. finally, technology that mak it easier for us to manage our diabetes. looks like the future, but it's available now. difficult testimony for anyone to watch and hear today at the derek chauvin trial essentially when it comes to george floyd. we have the cousin of george floyd. thank you for being with us. how are you and your family doing during this trial? >> i think we're doing about as well as you can expect. you know, the opening arguments was a very tough time for us because it was a time for many where we had to kind of re-live the video again. for me it was the first time actually seeing it, but i think we are managing as well as you can expect at this point.
>> it was the first time you had watched the video. that's interesting. >> yes. the first time that the video was sent to me i actually only listened to maybe 15, 20 seconds of it, i heard his voice and that was confirmation for me that it was actually perry so i did not watch it again. >> it was too painful to watch? >> it was too painful to watch. it was painful to hear his cries out. his crying out was painful so i couldn't even imagine allowing myself to actually watch it. >> i know before the trial -- before the trial started you said you were pessimistically optimistic about what would happen in court. i'm wondering how you feel now. >> well, i mean, i thought today was a good day for the prosecution and for us hearing
the testimony from the doctor who, you know, sort of reiterated what we've known all along, that his death was from him not being able to actually breathe and not a drug overdose as they've been trying to allude to. pessimistically optimistic is my position. we've seen this time and time again where the outcome is not what we would like to have happen. while i think i see some very good points on our side, i still reserve the right to say that it's a foregone conclusion that we'll get a conviction. >> are you, i don't know if pleased is the right word, but do you think the prosecution is working well? >> i think so. i think mr. blackwell, you know, i really like the way that -- you know, the opening statement was done. it really for me kind of spelled
it out, you know, line by line. we had a good view of what the whole process was watching the tape, breaking it down for us. i thought he did an amazing job with that, and then all of the witnesses coming back and supporting what he laid out in the beginning. i feel good about what the prosecution is doing. >> what do you hope comes out of this trial? i mean, obviously this is a pursuit for justice for george floyd, for your family. on a larger picture, you know, so many people are watching this trial, hearing all the evidence, thinking about these issues and i'm wondering if there's a larger -- something larger that you hope comes out of it? >> most definitely, like you said, we had from the very onset had two things in mind. one, that there would be
conviction for all of the officers involved in the murder of george and also that we would see some true change take place. i think the climate that we're in right now for his death being the catalyst for the movement we've seen from all over the world with people protesting, pushing for some change, so i think for us not having his death be in vain and seeing some change for generations to come is what we hope to see. >> i know you're working for that with the george floyd foundation. i wish you well and appreciate your time. >> thank you so much for having me. >> we'll have an update on the mass shooting in texas. happened in a workplace northwest of houston. a live report when we continue.
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bryant and started shooting. one employee described a local affiliate here in bryant that it sounded as if some of the machinery was having issues. that's when everybody inside the business started to run. in the end here, one person was killed, five others wounded. four of those that have been wounded we're told are in critical condition tonight. the gunman was able to get away from the scene before officers arrived and then was pursued into a neighboring county. that is where it's believed that the gunman also fired and hit a state trooper that was pursuing him in that naeighboring county. we're told that state trooper is in serious but stable condition tonight. the suspect they believe used a handgun in this shooting. they do not know what the motive might be or what set him off at this point. they are not releasing his name yet but they continue to work the scene here behind me in bryant, texas.
anderson? >> at this point they don't know a motive or at least they're not saying one. >> reporter: they do not know a motive. at least they're not saying anything publicly. they're continuing to interview witnesses and employees at the business. the police chief in bryant said the gunman was an employee of the business. not clear whether he was a current employee or former employee but had some connection to the cabinet manufacturing business in bryant. >> ed lavandera, thank you. it came only a while after president biden referenced a south carolina doctor and his wife and two children killed in their home. a former nfl player was the suspect. they're talking about ghost
guns. he called on congress to pass stronger legislation. >> whether congress acts or not, i'm going to use all the resources at my disposal as president to keep the american people safe from gun violence, but there's much more that congress can do to help that effort and they can do it right now. they've offered plenty of thoughts and prayers, members of congress, but they've passed not a single new federal law to reduce gun violence. enough prayers. time for some action. >> joining me now is georgia representative lucy mcbath whose 17-year-old son was shot and killed in 2012 while sitting with a group of friends. congresswoman mcbath, you ran for congress in part because of the killing of your son in 2012. with today's executive actions do you think the president is moving fast enough when it comes to gun control? >> well, what i know is that
president biden understands the pain of losing someone and it was definitely apparent in the rose garden today as he spoke directly to survivors like myself and advocates. he made it clear that this administration, his administration is willing to fight to keep all of our families safe and of course we know that this is a -- this is a problem that is going to take some time to dampen. it's going to take some time to create an environment in which people feel safe in their communities. everything that he's doing is tangible. these are tangible actions that we know right now are building a really strong foundation, of course which congress we have to build upon this foundation, but these are tangible efforts that he's willing to pull t, you kno forthright now, he and vice president harris. >> as a candidate he made promises around gun reform
legislation, assault weapons and he hasn't moved on those proposals. given the situation that he's in, you know, his position that legislating is, quote, a matter of timing, how patient are youing to be? >> in this culture of gun violence which has been building and building for years, anderson, it is going to take some time. it is not going to happen overnight. every piece of policy that we put forth. every move that we make. everything that we do each and every single day is building a culture for safer communities and he's acting to save lives but congress, we are the ones that have to act. we're the ones that are responsible and accountable for our constituents so it's up to us to do right by americans and put forth these life saving measures. that's our responsibility.
>> do you have any hope of congress actually doing it? >> yes, i do. the fact that i was able to lead a letter with my colleagues that we were able to appropriate and secure $25 million to study the effects of gun violence, do that research, collect that data to substantiate the policies that we need to put forth to save lives, we are moving forward but, you know, sometimes we have to lose forward. but we are moving forward and we're building a community of activists and movement builders on the ground and gun violence prevention organizations and my colleagues that are not willing to lay down on this. we are not giving up. >> congresswoman mcbath, i appreciate your time. i'm so sorry for your loss. >> thank you so much. ahead, democratic senator joe manchin for an exclusive interview with his relationship with president biden and the role he has with president
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opposes weakening the filibuster. he doesn't want democrats to normalize reconciliation. effectively, the stance could block the president's agenda in a divided senate. lauren fox discusses his role as power broker. >> the power in washington, clear and unequivocal. >> the reason, senator manchin tells cnn the insurrection at the capitol. >> i never thought in my life, in the history books to where our form of government had been attacked. now the british did it but not americans so something told me, wait a minute, hit the pause button. something's wrong. you can't have this many people split if they want to go to war with each other. >> reporter: insisting the only
way to move past the animosity is by working together. >> i think we can work together. i'm going to be sitting down with both sides and understanding where everybody is coming from. we should have an open, fair, secure election. if we have to put guardrails on, we have to put guardrails on so people can't take advantage of each other. >> how does that affect his relationship with the white house? >> they've been very, very kind in talking. we do have communication. >> reporter: how often? >> as often as i would like and as often as they would like. >> reporter: the president directly? >> whenever he calls, he calls and we have a good conversation. we've had a good friendship and relationship. >> reporter: and he has a warning for federal democrats. slow down on ramming through legislation like voting rights. >> reporter: some progressives think you're standing in the way of items the president could
pass. >> they can make all of these changes if they try to work towards the middle. you can't work in the fringes. you cannot work in the fringes. we want fair, open, secured elections and georgia has done some things which i thought were atrocious, okay? but i've also been a secretary of state and a governor. i know the tenth amendment. i don't think there should be an over reaching, if you will, federal elections. >> reporter: what changes -- >> well, the one thing they did, which is unbelievable to me, they took away the power of the secretary of state's office and put it in the hands of the congress and their legislature. now you have no one person you can hold accountable for. you have a whole legislature of people. >> reporter: and gun control. >> i support what the president did today from what i heard, what he's doing on executive order. the there are an awful lot of things he talked about. ghost guns should not be allowed
to be illegally made, sold or used. they're making them and you can't detect them. >> reporter: you can't support the house passed background check bill. >> not the way they've done it. >> reporter: has there been any negotiations? >> we haven't gotten a bill. we haven't gotten a bill. i'm happy to work with them. common gun sense. if you come from a gun culture suchb as i do in west virginia, i don't know a person that has a gun. >> i'm anxious and try to do something in a constructive way. >> reporter: what does he think of his new found role as rainmaker? >> the president of the senate now, i've heard them remark that to you. do you like this role? how does it feel? >> i've said it before. i'll say it again. i watched people that had power and abused it. i've watched people that sought power and destroyed it. i've watched people that had a moment of time and changed
things and used it. i would like to be that third. >> reporter: while he may not like the role he's been given, he says he knows he has a real friend in the other joe. >> i'm so pleased to understand we have a person sitting in the white house that understands the legislature, understands how congress works and should work and understands basically we've got to represent the people that we represent and i'm representing west virginia to the best of my ability. i'm trying to speak for my state. >> lauren fox joins us. it is remarkable the power that the senator now has. >> reporter: well, that's exactly right, anderson. he is that 50th vote for democrats. chuck schumer, the majority leader can't pass anything that biden sends over without joe manchin even without using the reconciliation. he made it very clear what he thinks needs to happen is democrats and republicans need to sit down and iron some of these issues out. we should note, that really takes time. when you have someone like the
house speaker saying she's hoping to pass infrastructure through her chamber by the july 4th recess, that doesn't leave you a ton of time to really have those negotiations with your republican colleagues. manchin making it clear tonight that he does have some areas where he needs to work with his democratic colleagues as well. raphael warnock has been arguing that they need to get rid of the filibuster in order to pass the voting rights bill that already passed in the house of representatives, at least just do a simple carve out. manchin making it clear he didn't support that but when he gets back to washington he wants to get into a room with warnock and his other colleagues, senator assof to have a discussion and it's important to remind them manchin needs 10 republicans, anderson. that i just don't see the math right now in the u.s. senate.
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today. >> reporter: joel greenberg, a friend of gaetz and the tax collector in seminol county, florida, is likely to enter a deal raising the possibility he could cooperate. >> i'm sure matt gaetz isn't feeling very comfortable today. >> reporter: greenberg's attorney is saying any potential will be worked out in conjunction with a plea deal. >> if somebody signs a plea agreement deal -- >> reporter: gaetz's friendship is key to the federal investigation surrounding him. they have been friends for years posting photos together. gaetz even told a local radio station in 2017 that greenberg would make a good member of congress. >> joel greenberg has gone to the seminole county tax office. >> reporter: the plea deal is not finalized. if it goes through, it means one of gaetz' close confidantes would be cooperating putting
further pressure on the congressman. >> if he accepts a plea agreement, it will show a sense of remorse, which he does have, and a sense of acceptance of responsibility. number two, i think he's uniquely situated. >> reporter: greenberg has been awaiting trial in jail after violating the terms of his bail earlier this year. he is charged with 33 criminal counts including allegations of stalking and harassing a political opponent. one count of sex trafficking a child between 14 and 17. while details in the court records of this charge are scant, investigators believe he recruited several women online and he recruited the women to gaetz who had sex with him too according to the "new york times." gaetz has denied all allegations writing on monday, i have never, ever paid for sex and second, i as an adult man have not slept
with a 17-year-old. >> providing for flights and hotel rooms for people you're dating who are of legal age is not a crime. >> reporter: but a source tells cnn investigators are examining whether any federal campaign money was involved in paying for travel and expenses for the women. now federal investigators are scrutinizing a trip gaetz took to the bahamas and whether women were paid to travel for sex with the congressman and others. as part of a broader probe, investigators want to know if gaetz was accepting paid escorts and travel in exchange for political favors according to people familiar with the investigation. gaetz' lawyers declined to comment but a spokesman for gates denied the allegations calling them part of a general fishing exercise about investigations and consensual allegations with adults. >> let's get some perspective
from norm isen and laura coats. you heard paula, if prosecutors are thinking about offering joel greenberg a plea deal, what does it say to you about their case so far? >> anderson, thanks for having me back. it says to me that mr. greenberg must have something very serious given the nature of the charges against him. in order to get a plea deal, he's going to have to give something up. based on all of the is that thing that he's going to need to trade for. >> laura, in a plea deal situation, do -- i assume prosecutors know what is on the table, what is being offered? i mean, they know the range of what somebody can testify to. >> they will know the foundation for why the person's willing to
sort of scratch my back if you scratch mine, et cetera, i scratch yours. but the idea here, it could be a much wider net that's cast. once the plea deal arrangement, in other words a cooperation arrangement is out there you can delve in deeper, other people, bigger fish, smaller fish, a wider net being cast. but remember, agreeing to sign a cooperation deal does not end your obligations to the federal government. that's where the story really begins. and until you've actually been sentenced, you're on the hook for providing information throughout that. sometimes cooperation agreements don't end until you've actually provided the testimony that you've said you're going to provide. you backed up the information in some way and sometimes can often lead to a conviction. it can be very broad to secure that if the government is going to drop the, what, 33 felony charges against you or reduce it in any way, you better have something to show for it because prosecutors don't just bring cases based on a hunch. they already have the evidence when they have the indictment. >> norm, after the hearing today
greenberg's attorney said, quote, i'm sure matt gaetz isn't feeling very comfortable today. we showed that clip. it's kind of a snarky thing to say for an attorney. i'm not quite sure i understand the strategy of saying it -- maybe there's no strategy at all. but is -- not sure why he would kind of want to particularly worry matt gaetz if there isn't even yet a signed plea deal. >> anderson, it was a miscue. that is not best practice for a defense lawyer. the best thing to do -- i've done it for decades in represents individuals -- the best thing to do is to be very neutral until that deal is done. prosecutors will look askance at that kind of grand standing. but that being said, i think the intent was to signal to the world what i'm sure mr. greenberg's lawyers have been saying to the government, we can
give you matt gaetz. part of what's going on now is they're proffering, as we put it, sharing the evidence and ultimately the government will want to sit down with mr. greenberg himself before they do a cooperation agreement, before they do a plea to see if that inartful statement is true and how mr. greenberg presents. >> laura, there is -- i mean, given the number of charges against the -- this guy greenberg, any sense of how many charges could -- i mean what kind of an impact a plea deal would have on his potential sentencing? >> well, normally it would be in a plea agreement, even with the scope of charges, there might be some that they're willing to reduce in terms of either what they're going to ask for of a sentence, if they do plead guilty, or reduce the number of charges or even as a possibility you could have a multiple number of convictions but ask for
sentences to run what they call concurrently. meaning it's not going to be back to back to back to back to get the wide soap of charges. but it also signals to a lot of people here, to norm's point, maybe who is not being asked to cooperate. sometimes when the defense is trying to tell the world, hey, here is who we have information on, it might signal who the government is interested in finding out information about and who does not -- who is not in the good graces. what you're seeing here is a persona non grata starting to form here and appears to be congressman gaetz. again, just saying it in front of the camera, prosecutors need more, more than innuendo, more than insinuation they want evidence and corroboration on what they may or may not already have. >> norm, it's so interesting that congressman gaetz chooses to fundraise off -- i don't know how interesting it is. it's probably -- this is what they do. but the fact -- i don't know if
it's like hoodspa or what but the fact that he's fundraising off of this, generally you would think if somebody is facing potential charges and an investigation and the person they've been paling around with and doing all sorts of things with is in jail and potentially going to get a plea deal, they might just be a little humble? >> well -- >> or at least just quiet. >> anderson, having worked on the house judiciary committee when congressman gaetz was a member, i can tell you that humility is the last thing that will come his way, but it's not smart for his exposure. he has been all over the map making public statements about this. he's decided to try it in the court of public opinion. you know, he's taken the wrong lessons from his role model,
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breztri may increase your risk of thrush, pneumonia, and osteoporosis. call your doctor if worsened breathing, chest pain, mouth or tongue swelling, problems urinating, vision changes, or eye pain occur. for real protection ask your doctor about breztri. she faced down the kkk and she won. here is part of the powerful story of a grieving black mother after the lynching of her son and her fight for justice.
♪ >> that morning, one of my cousins called and said they believe it's michael. it's him. that's all i could say was it's him. i was just numb. i couldn't believe that this was happening to us. i look outside my mom's door and it was people everywhere. i mean, everywhere in the neighborhood. they had come from far and near. my sister cynthia hamilton, she went to identify the body with my husband. >> all he had done was left his mom's house that night to walk to the service station to buy a pack of cigarettes. not knowing what was waiting for him. i can only imagine what mrs.
donald went through. >> that is an excerpt from the people versus the klan, the new cnn original series premiere this sunday night with back-to-back episodes beginning at 9:00 p.m. eastern. it's extraordinarily powerful. chris? >> thank you, anderson. i'm chris cuomo and welcome to primetime. more news breaking on our watch and big developments to discuss, specifically in the gaetz scandal. congressman gaetz's buddy joel greenberg is working on a plea deal with the feds prosecuting him for dozens of crimes, including sex potentially with a minor. now, people are getting this wrong, so this matters. they're hearing he's negotiating a plea deal and interpreting that to mean greenberg may cooperate with authorities about others. that's wrong. that means that greenberg has already been