tv Anderson Cooper 360 CNN April 6, 2021 9:00pm-10:00pm PDT
good evening. ahead tonight a revealing and surprising look how the derek chauvin trial is being seen by people watching at cup foods. that's the corner store outside where george floyd died with chauvin's knee on his neck. first the trial itself. more expert testimony on the use of that knee today, although there were inconsistencies at time, the overall thrust appeared damaging to the defense. some came out under cross-examination and chauvin's instructor telling defense counsel, quote, we tell officers to stay away from the neck when possible. details now from cnn's josh campbell. >> reporter: one by one veteran members of the minneapolis police department took the stand. >> thank you. >> reporter: each part of the department's training force. today's testimony added to the chorus of police department witnesses, including the chief who said derek chauvin's use of the knee on george floyd's neck was not part of their training. >> would it be appropriate and
within training to hold a subject in that prone restrained position with a knee on the neck and a unique on the back for an extended period of time after the subject has stopped offering any resistance? >> no, sir. >> or has lost their pulse? >> no, sir. >> if you don't have a pulse on a person, you'll immediately start cpr. >> reporter: but the defense pushed back with this image. >> this is a specific kind of photograph that demonstrates the placement of a knee as it applies to prone handcuffing, correct? >> correct. >> reporter: while the witnesses emphasized a focus on minimal force and prompt medical care -- >> how soon should the person be put into the side recovery position? >> i would say sooner, the better. >> reporter: the defense asserted rules can be fluid. >> there is no strict application of every single rule, agreed, or every single technique? >> that is correct. >> have you had people say i can't breathe? >> yes, sir. >> reporter: at times, the witnesses contradicted each other. >> have you ever been trained or
trained others to say that if a person can talk, they can breathe? >> it's been said, yes. >> and you train officers if a person can talk, that means they can breathe? >> no, sir. just because they're speaking doesn't mean they're breathing adequately. >> i can't breathe. >> reporter: and in a trial defined by numerous graphic videos of george floyd's final moments. >> you would describe sometimes that the public doesn't understand that police actions can look really bad. >> that's correct, sir, yes. >> right, and but they still may be lawful even if they look bad, right? >> yes, sir. >> here we are now in the shadows of a courthouse praying for justice. >> reporter: during the trial's lunch break, george floyd's family joined the reverend al sharpton outside the courthouse. >> after we get the verdict and we get this conviction, we'll be able to breathe. >> josh campbell joins us. josh, you showed some of the
conflicting testimony. what was the sense of how today went for the defense? >> well, we've heard over a week of damning testimony against derek chauvin, mainly from his fellow officers. but today was arguably the best day yet for the defense. they were able to elicit some potentially advantageous information. for example you had one officer admitting where there had been instances where a suspect would say they were in melodies stress or couldn't breathe and that later turned out not to be the case. we're aware of the gut wrenching video of chauvin on george floyd but of course, in the u.s. criminal justice system, all the defense has to do is raise doubt in the mind of one juror to threaten the prosecution's case. anderson? >> josh campbell, appreciate it. thanks. joining us now is jeffrey stearns, an attorney for the floyd family. i'm wondering what stood out to you from the testimony you heard today? >> you know, anderson, from the lead in, a lot of people are talking about whether or not the defense has scored some points today and sure, we heard
testimony that sometimes there are unruly crowds. sometimes there might be a need to put on -- or a need to put a knee on someone's neck, however, what's critical to keep in mind, this is not the hypothetical murder trial of george floyd. this is the actual murder trial, and every person who has testified in this case has testified that what derek chauvin did was wrong and in actuality had no place in policing. >> clearly, the defense which we saw yesterday was also when they talked to the physician who attended to mr. floyd in the e.r., they tried to bring up other possible causes for his death or for asphyxia. they talked about drug use. they are clearly trying to just
raise some form of doubt about that it's absolutely clear what killed him. that it's absolutely clear what occurred. >> well, absolutely. they're trying to misdirect the jury every which way they possibly can with red herring and hypothetical after hypothetical but the prosecution will have to really focus in on what was actually found here. you know, the e.r. doctor saying his leading theory was asphyxia, that the individuals on seeking that the individuals who observed what was happening to george floyd was consistent with asphyxiation and not this red herring of a drug overdose. >> the defense today showed a picture of derek chauvin's knee on george floyd's neck, saying he followed protocol while trying to arrest him. that doesn't seem to follow what the testimony of many of the actual people who teach this said. >> yeah, absolutely.
what the defense wants to do here is point to a split moment in time and say wasn't it okay that derek chauvin did this based upon training? and even if you listen to lieutenant mercil who says for a transitional period of time, maybe you can put a knee on a subject's neck. that is not consistent withholding your knee on that subject's neck for 9:29, long after they've since breathing. >> jeffrey storms, appreciate your time tonight. thank you very much. >> thank you, anderson. joining us is laura coats and jose baez and charles ramsey, former top cop in philadelphia and the district of columbia. laura, we heard that at times conflicting testimony from police officers and josh campbell's report a few minutes ago. should prosecutors feel confident or concerned tonight? >> they should feel confident. i mean, it's undoubtedly the truth that of course, at times
the defense will land a punch or two. the question for the jury is can it actually deal a blow? i don't think they dealt the blow they need to because it's undisputed of course an officer can use reasonable force to subdue or restrain a non-compliant suspect. that of course, is the truth. the question is whether they crossed a line, whether derek chauvin crossed a line away from the reasonable use of force to excessive force onward to criminal assault. again, after there is no longer any conceivable perceived threat, if you maintain the use and application of deadly force against the training, against what the imploring pleas have been from the bystanders, against even a question from one of your own men on the scenes, if you do that in a way that defies logic, training, common sense and humanity, the fact that you could have at one point used reasonable force does not
essentially immunize you from liability forbe the duration of that 9:29. so far they've been able to say hey, you can use some type of restraint. but could you keep doing it? could you have kept tasing somebody if they're already on the ground? can you kept applying deadly force? they haven't been able to answer that question. >> jose, what have you heard from the prosecution's case? what do you make of their case so far? >> well, i think they're putting together a pretty strong case. so the question is are they invoking enough emotion to carry the day? i think this is a highly emotional case. it's going to be won lost on emotion. even for the prosecution, they can carry this in that way as can the defense but i certainly don't see it in that way right now. >> chief ramsey, you know, we continue to hear from police officials and experts who say what this officer derek chauvin did was excessive force. the defense has been able to get some concessions from prosecution witnesses whether
it's the level of distraction posed by onlookers or other people saying i can't breathe, the amount of time a neck restraint takes to render someone unconscious, would you be surprised if the jury wasn't entirely clear on some of this? >> well, i wouldn't be surprised. i think they did a pretty descent job of mudding the waters, if you will, on a couple of issues. i go back to that one photograph of the handcuffing technique with the officer showing his knee on the neck but they overlook one important point and that is floyd, george floyd was already handcuffed and handcuffed before he came in contact with chauvin. the defense constantly raises these things but it doesn't fit what took place in this case and that's really what is important. so it goes back and forth. i thought probably the most effective thing in favor of the defense that i saw today was
that photograph they showed of heroin and fentanyl and a few grains of fentanyl, saying that's a lethal dose. i think that's something that i'm a very visual person and you argue whether or not drugs were the reason for mr. floyd to pass away, that's an argument there. but what they left out is the fact that people build tolerance from drugs over time. so what would kill me may not kill you if you're a regular drug user. the prosecution doesn't have this all wrapped up. they have a lot of work to do. >> jose, what do you make about the question of the defense so far? >> i hear and i see points being scored, but you don't win the case on scoring a few points and giving it the old college try. you really have to carry the day. you have to carry it consistently throughout a case if you want to win a high stakes criminal trial. especially one as complex as this, you need to have
consistent themes and you have to be able to carry the entire day, not just score a point here or there with a photograph with a good cross on one witness. it really is a difficult, a difficult thing to do to win a criminal trial. everyone says all you have to do is create reasonable doubt. that's really not that simple as people say it is. otherwise, prosecutors would lose 90% of the time as oppose to win 90% of the time. >> it's interesting you talk about creating themes and consistent themes. from a defense standpoint in this trial, would a consistent theme then be it was drugs that, you know, were a factor or the factor in mr. floyd's death and, you know, other questions about, you know, the crowd involvement? i mean, are those the kind of themes you're talking about?
>> i think when you talk about themes in relationship to this case, you have to look at it in the context of yes, there is this, but you would wan to point out how he wasn't following lawful orders, whether they were by his choice or his inability to do so. that's the arguable point here. but the reality is you need to be able to show, listen, this officer was doing everything consistent with his training. it's just that this specific individual was not cooperating. therefore put himself in a position of danger and peril. therefore that's where we are in the gray area. as it relates to the police and procedures and prosecution, they're all going to fall in line because of the political hot potato we're sitting in and the reality is everyone is full
aware of all the protests, of all the issues that are going on, and there is no way in the world that the minnesota police department is not going to fall in line with the prosecutors in this case. and that's something that you need to hear from the defense that this is perhaps -- their all consistent and in sync because they have to be and that has to -- that drum has to be beaten over and over and over again so that it's in the very front of everyone's minds as these jurors are deliberating in the case. >> laura, i saw you shaking your head. >> i'm shaking my head because i understand my colleague's notion what they have to say in the defense, but let's not mistake that these officers or all of these multiple law enforcement witnesses are simply falling in line because they must cave to the pressure of a sociopolitical agenda. what i'm hearing is very objective reliance of detail surrounding the training that has been universally taught. should it be universally applied. now i know that there is room to be nimble, and we expect our
police officers to be able to adapt, particularly for things that training cannot contemplate. this is not the men in black here where you have an alien life force that presents a new novel approach to what you have to do to use force. you're talking about every single aspect having been contemplated and dealt with, some being the prone suspicion, somebody handcuffed, somebody suspected of being under the influence, somebody who is no longer conscious. so it comes down to me, when you're thinking about it from the prosecutor's angle, to two questions. what did they know and what duty did they owe? what did they know at the time? they noticed he was not breathing and did not have a pulse. they knew they owed a duty of care even if they suspected drug use. they withheld the duty of care. they did not provide the aid that was necessary. and go back to that opening statement from mr. blackwell. somebody in your custody is owed a duty of care. they had no idea from toxicology reports that are only thought of and created after the fact, autopsy reports after the fact,
what they knew in the moment is that somebody was under obvious physical duress likely because of the activity of one of their officers, and what they chose to do based on that knowledge was not to perform a duty of care and so that's going to be top of mind for the jurors not at all the notions of whether the minneapolis police department is suddenly conspireing together to concoct some tale to get at a boys from the people and minneapolis and hennepin county. and finally, the final point. in the voir dire selection, they were asked a lot of questions about their thoughts on justice and the police and black lives matter and interacts with police officers in the community so we know clearly about these jurors, what we anticipate their ability to be impartial based on those things are. they're going to have to think about the psychology of all those things. the discussion to fall in line, i'm not buying that. >> we got to leave it there. >> i'm not saying that's what is occurring here. i'm saying that's specifically
what needs to be done to be able to win this case. i don't see it being done -- >> i understand. >> but certainly those things happen in trials everyday across the country, and you have to be able to show it as a defense lawyer and to put up a defense so that people can see that this is a human system, and it's going to be operated by humans which are completely imperfect. >> jose baez, laura coates, charles ramsey as well. thank you. coming up next, this is all being seen on the corner where george floyd died, people at cup foods are seeing as they gather to watch the trial in the store every day. later, breaking news on congressman matt gaetz that will not do anything to lift the cloud of allegations he is under. details ahead. cal: we've saved our money, and now we get to spend it our way. val: but we worry if we have enough to last. for retirement planning, investment advice, and more, look for a cfp® professional. cfp® professionals can help you craft a complete financial plan that gives you confidence today and tomorrow.
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the food score where george perry floyd jr. took place. what none of us has been able to do is see the trial through the eyes and hearts of those who frequent that corner who visit that store and are watching the chauvin trial there. cnn sara sidner tonight reports. >> reporter: few are watching the trial more closely than the folks in the neighborhood where george floyd took his last breaths. >> everybody that comes in, takes a look at the trial. >> reporter: inside cup foods, the place where floyd allegedly paid for cigarettes with a counter fit $20 bill, every day the television is set to the trial of the former officer accused of killing him. >> this is the training that you received? >> it's sad. it's so sad and really sad to watch it in the raw. >> reporter: minneapolis resident tracy came in for breakfast with her dog adore. she reveals what everyone around here already knows, the strongest of emotions are just under the surface here. one scratch, this time in the
form of a question and sorrow flows out. how hard is it to watch this trial? >> it's mind boggling how somebody is here to serve and protect and everyone runs behind and they're the very ones who harm you. not all, but some. >> reporter: she says she can't look away even though it hurts to watch. the store owners say they have received both love and hate. especially after their former cashier testified he was the one who took the alleged fake bill from floyd. >> the policy was that if you took a counterfeit bill, you have to pay for it out of your money or your paycheck. >> reporter: christopher martin a teenager tried rectifying it with floyd. that didn't work and police were called. martin now regrets that. >> if i would have just not taken the bill, this could have been avoided. >> reporter: the store owner says the store has received dozens of fake bills over time.
>> when employees do take counterfeit bills, part of our training is they're going to be responsible to pay for it just as a deterrent. we've never made an employee pay for a counterfeit bill. >> reporter: many are sending support for christopher martin and phone calls from all over the country. >> i just felt i would make a call to you to see if there was something we could do. >> reporter: we happen to be there during one of the calls. >> done a wonderful job and this is what we need to do. >> reporter: outside the cup foods store, there is not just a memorial to george floyd anymore but it more of a community center. there is community gatherings that happen at the former gas station and a community garden all of the people help plant and take care of. ♪ on any given day, jay webb a former professional basketball player is in the square planting hope and beauty.
>> we can unify the ugly situation. >> reporter: feet away, floyd took his last breath last year and in march this year, another man's body laid dying outside the store, he was shot and killed by a resident. neighbors, business owners and activists are battling back violence and arguing over the barriers that have closed off the streets to traffic to the square for nearly a year now. but there is still love and light being shared here. >> this is our response. do your worst and we'll do our best. this is his. this is his. every direction, peace and love. >> sara sidner joins us now. sara, have people talked to you about how they will react if they don't agree with the verdict? >> yes. and i'm not sure any of us want the see some of the things that have been said to me. there are many people who are terrified about what is going to
happen in their neighborhoods, the kind of destruction they're worried about, and there are people that are telling me in no uncertain terms that in their view, from what they saw from their evaporate taj points, looking and listing to the officers that have testified so far, they're telling me if indeed derek chauvin is not convicted in some way in this case, that this place is going to -- and i'll use their term -- blow. anderson? >> sara sidner, appreciate it. thank you very much. coming up, breaking news. new reporting on matt gaetz and his pardon. one of "the new york times" correspondents who broke the story joins us.
the final dice telephone previous administration. maggie haberman has the by-line and since joins us now by phone. what have you learned about the attempt to get a pardon? >> so anderson, the way it's been described to us by multiple people familiar with what took place is gaetz did two things, publicly on fox news and he tweeted it, he said that the former president should pardon really everybody. i think he mentioned a thanksgiving turkey. he talked about joe exotic, because in his words, the quote/unquote liberal crowd was going to come after allies to the president. there was also a private conversation that he had with white house officials about a blanket pardon he wanted one for himself. he was suggesting one for allies of his in congress. we're not special prosecutor chefkly who. white house officials thought it was bizarre and knocked it down pretty quickly. remember, this was not -- what we're told is white house officials did not know specifics about what gaetz was under investigation for at that point. we don't know how much gaetz
knew, but we do know at that point that it was clear that his friend, this tax collector in florida himself was under investigation related to issues regarding young girls, or young women. so all of this paints a picture of somebody who sought a blanket pardon ostensibly because he thought he would be targeted because of the an ally of the former president. but allies of the former president looking back on it questioning whether this was an effort to protect himself because he knew what was going on. he's denied wrongdoing. >> so you're not -- you don't know if he for sure knew there this was investigation but he was aware according to your reporting that this person he was linked to, the tax collector was under some form of investigation? >> correct. >> and so the white house, they didn't take this seriously at the time? >> the officials in the white
house who learned of it thought it was very strange. they were perplexed by it and didn't want to go ahead with it they thought among other things it would set a bad precedent, and it died fairly quickly. now president trump, then president trump was aware of this request. it's not clear whether he had a specific conversation with gaetz directly but it was not something that the former president pushed for for gaetz either. as far as we know. >> what does gaetz' office says this to? >> gaetz's office has acknowledged that he talked publicly about receiving a pardon. they had maintained that he was not doing so because he was under investigation for this latest issue, and, you know, we will learn more as we go, but at minimum, it is of note that he was seeking this blanket pardon at a time when an associate of his was in legal trouble. >> maggie haberman, fascinating reporting, thank you. >> thank you. >> there is more reporting how gaetz and his legal career.
joined by senior affairs correspondent. congressman gaetz is fundraising off federal charges? >> that's right, anderson. in an email today he accuses to media of publishing lies and dragging the media into political attacks and asks for money to help him fight back. and despite the federal sex crimes and investigation allegations, he shared photos of nude women with other lawmakers while on the floor of the house. gaetz is scheduled to speak at an event called women for america first at the trump resort on friday. >> so this associate of gaetz phil greenberg who was facing charges including sex trafficking of a minor, he has pleaded not guilty. he'll be in court on thursday. do we know anything about how that might impact gaetz? >> he's central to this. greenberg is gaetz' long term friend and ally.
the investigation into gaetz is actually part of a larger inquiry into sex trafficking that resulted in greenberg being indicted. greenberg is the former tax collector in seminole county, florida. he was arrested last summer and charged with a litany of crimes, including id theft, sex trafficking, and the federal investigation is currently looking at whether greenberg and gaetz sought out women online and then exchanged gifts or money for sex. greenberg and gaetz were recorded by security cameras several years ago entering the tax collector's office and rifling through some confiscated driver's licenses. gaetz denied wrongdoing and greenberg has so far pleaded not guilty. but on thursday, greenberg's case is back in court for a hearing new charges alleging that he embezzled more than $400,000 and then used the money to buy cryptocurrency and sports memorabilia. greenberg doesn't have to be in court on thursday, but the charges against him, anderson, they're adding up.
and there is now increasing pressure on him to flip on gaetz, and that is one of the big things we're going watching for as we cover that case from orlando for the rest of the week. >> all right. appreciate it. paula reid, thanks. perspective on all of this from preet barratt. does it change anything for you, the idea of him seeking blanket pardon? >> it's another crazy story. we were up late on the last day of trump's presidency trying to see. who he might pardon. and we were thinking of people he might preemptively bard including his family members and including himself. we didn't know this was something maybe on the table. what i think is really a dangerous sign for matt gaetz, couple things. one is, as the reporting just suggested, you this individual, mr. greenberg in florida, who as the charges keep mounting against him and he is facing more and more jail time as additional counts are brought to bear against him, the easiest
way for him to avoid jail time, as we've seen in other cases as well is for him to flip. and who better to flip on with federal prosecutors than a sitting member of congress? so that's bad because all the incentives are in favor of him cooperating. there is perhaps audio recordings. we know there is surveillance footage. he can fill in the gaps and connect the dots with suspected bad behavior on the part of matt gaetz that has been reported but not yet proven. and the second thing i would say is a lot of the reporting suggests to the extent there were some interest on the part of people who knew matt gaetz and his alleged bad conduct were in a position to remain silent. they're no longer remaining silent. it's not a coincidence these stories are leaking out about matt gaetz showing videos of nude women on the floor of the house and he might have sought this pardon. it seems like the flood gates have happened with respect to a lot of third party witnesses who might have direct everyday of bad conduct and maybe even
illegal conduct on the part of matt gaetz. noted a good sign for him. >> does the new reporting from "the times," does it further highlight why it's a priority for the justice department and members of congress to investigate and prosecute? it's not political but they swore to uphold the prosecution. they have access to presidents who are able to grant pardons. >> there are two sides to that. there is always an incredibly important priority on prosecuting people who have taken an oath to protect the public and to serve the public. people in high office. there is also a need to be very careful and thorough and cautious because duly elected people deserve their day in court and presumption of innocence like everyone else. you at the same time want to make sure that the corrupt politicians are held to account, but also because they occupy a particularly special place in the government having been elected, you want to make sure that you cross every t and dot every i. >> going back to the greenberg hearing on thursday, is there something that you're going to be particularly looking at?
if he was to make some sort of a deal, would that be revealed in court on thursday? >> it's possible. a trial date has been set. it's not too far off, as i understand it. what sometimes will happen with somebody in ms. procedural posture, the prosecutor could signal that they need more time. they could signal that there is a plea because you have to plead guilty before you're signed up as a cooperator. any shift what's about to happen in the coming weeks to months with respect to mr. green better's case could be a sign that he is being very seriously considered and maybe even being signed up as a cooperator, which i'll say for the second time would be very, very bad news for matt gaetz. >> also, i mean, if this was done -- if mr. greenberg or whomever was finding people online and making arrangements with them through websites and the like and then there were payments being made, you know, through online payment systems or whatever, that's a pretty
easy trail to follow. >> the report again emphasizing reporting and the great scoops from maggie haberman and colleagues and others looks like matt gaetz is not the most careful human ever to have lived in america or served in congress. he looks like he left a trail. there is already surveillance footage referenced before with respect to looking at the confiscated i.d.s at an office in florida. he probably has telephone calls. he probably has toll records to corroborate what a collaborating witness might say with respect to meetings and elicit activities, sexual or otherwise by matt gaetz. so to the extent they can get a live witness to say these are the things that happened and i did with matt gaetz and you have corroborating electronic evidence to support that, i'll say it for the third time, it's very bad for matt
gaetz. >> well, we shall see. preet bharara, thanks very much. >> thanks. ramped up more today against companies criticizing those new georgia voting laws that democrats say will limit voting rights. both gop senate leader mitch mcconnell and the former president bot had to say. that when we continue. renae is not an influencer, she's more of a groundbreaker. renae runs with us on a john deere 1 series tractor. because out here, you can't fake a job well done. - [narrator] grubhub perks give you deals on all the food that makes you boogie. (upbeat music) get the food you love with perks from- - [crowd] grubhub.
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but for less with fast free shipping. visit petmeds.com today. senate republican leader mitch mcconnell ramped up criticism for the second straight day of businesses for taking positions against that new georgia voting law, which democrats say will restrict voting rights in the state. he again assailed major league baseball for moving its all-star game out of atlanta in protest to the law, a move he said was, quote, irritating one hell of a lot of republican fans. he also made a reference to delta airlines and coca-cola, both headquartered in atlanta, both which have opposed the law. >> republicans buy stock and fly on planes and drink coca-cola, too. so what i'm saying here is i think this is quite stupid to jump in the middle of a highly controversial issue particularly when they have their facts wrong. >> keeping them honest,
mcconnell hasn't always felt that way. back in 2012 in a speech to the american enterprise institute, he said that all corporations, quote shore, be free to express themselves on the issues of the day. again, quoting i mean who is afraid here? let's all have a conversation he said about the future of the country. meanwhile, the former president has weighed in, as well, in a statement over the weekend he called for a boycott of delta and coke among others but in a phone interview with a conservative cable news network newsmax, he directed some fire at mcconnell, of course harshly criticized him for his role in the january 6 riots. >> frankly, republican conservatives ever got their act together, which they should, if we had real leadership instead of mitch mcconnell and the group if we had some real leadership, what you'd be doing is something much different. they'd be boycotting these companies and those companies would be coming. that's what liberals do. they boycott anybody that speaks out they boycott them. they cancel them and boycott them. we have more people than they do.
>> lots to sort through. joining me are abbey phillips, and paul begala, veteran democratic strategist and political commentator. abby, what does it say this issue of the georgia voting law pushed republican leader slip to attack corporate america because they have traditionally been go allies? >> well, it does seem to be kind of like a canary in the coal mine if you're a republican. for so long corporations spoke out about taxes and regulations but now that they're talking about issues that are related to democracy, it's a huge problem on the republican side. i think there is real questions, though, about the truth and he of what mitch mcconnell had to say. he said there are -- and former president trump as well, suggesting that there are more republicans who would boycott these companies than people on the other side. i think if that were the case, i mean, these companies would be doing what is right for their bottom line.
it seems to indicate the numbers are not in their favor, and there is some real concern here, which is why they're pushing back and pushing back hard. >> president biden weighed in on this today. i want to play this for our viewers. >> it is reassuring to see that for profit operations in businesses are speaking up about how these new jim crow laws are just antithetical to who we are. >> we should point out that was not an off-the-cuff comment. the president again chose to label these new measures as jim crow laws. >> yeah, and well, he's got a good argument. handy also has a very loyal following. abby is exactly right. corporations care about the bottom line. there are over 3,000 counties in america. donald trump carried 2,562 of them. vast majority of counties.
joe biden only carried 509 counties. but those 509 biden counties account for 71% of the entire american economy. so these companies know what they're doing. and they are following their bottom line. they're following their consumers. the notion that mitch mcconnell somehow now or donald trump for that matter is andy corporate is kind of hilarious. opensecrets.org says mcconnell himself in his affiliated pacs took $4.3 million in corporate money in the last five years. so he should give the money back. if he is going to boycott, why doesn't he boycott their money and give it back? >> abby, to that point, mcconnell made clear he wants the money and says of course they should give money. but he has long been an advocate for corporations to allegedly have a voice in politics, as we pointed out, saying in 2012 corporations should be free to express themselves. it certainly does seem kind of remarkably hypocritical. >> yeah, many of us remember the
citizens united decision which allows corporations to basically give unlimited money to certain political organizations. that's something that republicans like mitch mcconnell fully support to this day. they want republicans not only -- or they want corporations not only to give them money but to use that money as a form of speech. so this is about the issue that is at hand here, not so much about whether corporations have a right to actually speak up in the public sphere but mitch we should also remember as we're talking about this, again, mitch mcconnell is defending bills that are predicated on a fundamental lie, which is that there was fraud in the last election. he was on the senate floor denouncing that lie, you know, during the impeachment proceedings and after the january 6th riot so there is a real question about whether there is backsliding going on here among some republicans who are willing to denounce the big lie but also willing to support
bills that actually are born out of that very same lie. >> in fact, paul, you know, mcconnell is now using the term "big lie" to refer to the portrayal of the georgia voting law which is it >> yeah, and george orwell is spinning so fast in his grave right now that you could play a record on him. it's really pathetic. the problem mcconnell has is, these calls for boycotts from him, it's only one dreyer but both coca-cola and delta's stock closed up today. the big boycott he called for. president trump, in the south carolina primary, february 2019, he called for a boycott for apple because he didn't like how apple was handling a terrorism case with one of their phones. today apple's share closed at $126. i don't think these corporate ceos have anything to worry about in terms of mitch mcconnell or donald trump authorizing boycotts against
them. they are following where customers are. if mcconnell wants to, he should back empowering people more, how about it, mitch, why don't you support the for the people act? and take on corporate america. >> the former president is something of a diet coke fan, didn't he have somebody who would bring in the diet coke, wasn't that the person's job? >> he had a diet coke button. >> he may call for a boycott but i don't know that he's going to follow it himself. >> he had a diet coke on his desk while he was calling for a boycott on coca-cola. >> of course he did. >> vaccine announcement this afternoon. at cases continue to swell. coming up, a new report about the mental and neurological impact of those
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president biden announced this afternoon he's moving up his deadline for every state to make all american adults eligible for covid vaccine to april 19, less than two weeks away. still he urged americans to remain vigilant. he said the country must remain on what he called a war footing to defeat the virus. michael osterholm is director of infectious disease and policy at the university of minnesota. he advised president biden's transition team. professor, it could take months for all adults to receive the vaccine despite the president moving up the deadline. what does it mean for the race against the virus we're in? >> we have a real challenge right now, because even if we were able to get the vaccines that have been promised out, it doesn't mean we'll have enough to really slow down the virus in a meaningful way. for example, if you look at two states that are leading the
country right now in terms of new cases, both michigan and minnesota, we actually have very high levels of vaccinations relative to the rest of the country and we're still seeing this rapid increase in cases. >> why is that? >> not enough people are vaccinated. if you look, we still probably have 45 to 50% of our populations throughout much of the united states that haven't been vaccinated nor have they previously had infection and developed immunity. so we've got a ways to go. it's great news these vaccines are coming, i just wish we had three or four months before this b.1.1.7 variant surge started to occur. >> what percentage of the population would have to be vaccinated in order to actually make a difference? >> well, no one actually knows a real number. but i can tell you it's going to be very high. this particular virus is highly infectious. as we've now seen from the work done in europe, it's anywhere from 50 to 100% more infectious
than the previous strains of the coronaviruses we've been dealing with. so this is going to take a lot of people to be immune before we're going to see it slow down its transmission. >> a new study published in the journal "lancet psychiatry" found as many as one in three people infected with covid-19 have had long term symptoms. i've talked to people who had what they thought were mild cases, and they have what they call covid brain fog. how worried are you about the lasting impacts of this? >> this is a huge challenge. it used to be called long haulers. we've always known that people who spend a significant amount of time in an intensive care unit on a ventilator, weeks to months, will have ongoing health problems, weeks to months, after they come out. what we haven't seen is mild patients who should recover and
in some cases they recover completely and then they develop this long term chronic problem, as you called it, the brain fog, severe challenges in terms of their heart and lungs. we don't know much about this at all. this is a real concern. it's going to be, i'm afraid, one of the legacy issues of this pandemic. >> there's data today suggesting that after two doses of moderna's vaccine the immune response could stay robust for at least two months. last week, pfizer showed efficacy was at least 90% for at least two months. -- six months. i know you're an advocate to giving a single dose of moderna or pfizer vaccine rather than waiting to give it to two people, do you still think that's a good idea? >> i think it's a critical idea. we'll see this play out around the country, what's happening in michigan and minnesota, because of the number of people we have vaccinated and those we don't.
every day the media reports on 3 million more people being vaccinated, almost half of those are people who are just getting a second dose, not a first dose. >> appreciate your expertise, thank you so much. the news continues. we'll hand it over to chris for "cuomo prime time." >> you don't have to look far to find somebody who has long haul symptoms, you work with one, brother. we have to call the whole class of it untreated, because they don't even what this is, they don't know if my mental acuity is because of age or this is the way i was before or the fog, the lung issues. people have heart issues, soft tissue issues. there's only a handful of centers around the country that are even studying it because we're in crisis. i believe that long hauler, whatever you want to call it, is actually going to be the story a year from now and ahead of that, because that's when we'll really have time to start focusing on it, kind of weed out, you know, whether people are just wrong about it or it was something