tv Bloomberg Technology Bloomberg January 27, 2022 11:00pm-12:00am EST
♪ announcer: from the heart of where innovation, money, and power collide, in silicon valley and beyond, this is "bloomberg technology" with emily chang. ♪ emily: i'm emily chang in san francisco and this is "bloomberg technology.” coming up, a big beat for apple and another record for apple despite supply chain issues, we will break down their quarterly report.
robinhood results are out one year out from the gamestop fiasco. we will discuss. breaking up, not so hard to do for softbank. the ceo is in top stew split after asking for $1 billion in compensation. we will get to that in a moment but first let's look at the markets. ed ludlow is here looking at the big picture. give us that snapshot. ed: spoiler, they had a great first quarter but the markets first, the nasdaq 100, closing that tech heavy index swinging from gains earlier in the session to losses. that is why i bring up apple. there focused on those rates and what will happen to those stretch valuation bank stocks with chinese adr under pressure? big reason? tesla is down, 108 billion
dollars in market cap shares with its biggest post-earnings drop since july of 2009 with semi conductors down. almost 5%. risk off sentiment in the market, the bloomberg crypto index is largely bitcoin and a other tokens selling off. let's get to those after hours earnings with robinhood, having a tough time of it in the final quarter of 2021 with equities trading revenue down 35% and the up line comes in below expectations. november december last year, there was volatility, so it was interesting to see robinhood struggling after hours. the thing about apple, it was a big beat, on the top line, almost record revenue. almost $124 billion of revenue for apple way above expectations. strengthening the new products they are talking about. christmas, the holidays, their fiscal first quarter, look like
strength. you and i were chatting a moment ago. why was the ipad not as strong? that is something to listen for in the call. did apple circumvent supply chain issues? it certainly seems so. emily: thank you. i have to ask you about this beat. what do you think given the chip crisis that everyone else seems to be dealing with? julie: i give credit to apple. they continue to stun despite the supply chain issues. we continue to see demand very strong with 19% of consumers buying a laptop in the past six months and 76 percent using streaming audio and another 50% with streaming video. the demand is strong. consumers are expected to be home, in and out of office environments. the demand for apple products continues to be strong. the folks who bought a
smartphone in the past six months of 47% in the u.s. purchase an iphone. we had demand with the bundles that was strong. they like to save money over the complexity. they are saving money. emily: we saw the resurgence of the ipad through the pandemic. what you make of the relative weakness, is it kids going back to school and us moving into a relative new phase of the pandemic? julie: it could be a new phase of the pandemic. it certainly has not become the laptop placement that some thought it would be. it certainly is a tool for those who are creative and on the go and i think the strength of the media offerings helps the ipad, but i think that one of the things we look at, too, looking at the christmas season, we look at things like 3g, consumers were forced to upgrade their smartphones, and it could be a question of consumer priorities
during the holiday quarter rather than demand for the new product. emily: we are getting headlines from the call and tim cook says that ipad revenues were lower due to supply constraints, so clearly this something apple is still feeling and it is impacting the ipad specifically. what you make of that? julie: i don't know if there is more analysis that i could offer. it is tough. i looked at the ipad pro at the upper end of the line. i looked at airpods, smart phones, smart watches. there were not many products i couldn't get within side of a week. from what i read it didn't seem like there was a supply chain impact on the consumers in the last quarter of last year. emily: so, what else are you watching? china seems to be really strong. every region was strong, except we saw relative weakness in japan, but the iphone once again getting that top spot in china after six years.
julie: certainly iphone and ios is in the dominant operating system in china, but huawei has struggled, they have not brought out that killer product that everyone wants and i think it's a good sign. you know, overall. the other thing looking forward is it's not just about smart phones, tablets, or watches, it's about the ecosystem in the services that go around it in and there really isn't a company with a stronger or more cohesive experience algorithm that works throughout the ecosystem like apple does, and so, the more devices they buy, the more services or service bundles that they buy, the more likely they are to be attracted to the apple ecosystem. the second thing i looked at, you know, the biggest hype or buzz word in the industry is the metaverse. as we look forward, we think
about what will it take to create experiences, what kind of headset, what kind of ecosystem? who has developers and services ? i think it will be fun to watch apple on that dimension. emily: tim cook saying that supply constraints were worse in you one then q4, which makes you wonder if it's going to continue to get worse, is there no relief ahead? talking about the iphone on the call. i want to talk about services and apple tv plus and this business that tim cook himself that on so many years ago and has almost surpassed just about everyone's expectation. is there anything in particular on the services side that you will be watching over the next year? julie: a few things. one, certainly there is a difference who can consumers using one of these services and paying for it. we are seeing more consumers pay . the second thing is we are seeing consumers drawn towards the bundle that apple offers
that has fitness and music and video in it. they are looking for deals. capitalists want to save money. second on the list, easy. third on the list, they want to feel like they are getting a deal. and so, the breadth of the offerings are in their favor as well. 19% to 20% of their revenue is from services, and an apple number, that's a very big number. emily: they obviously need people to keep buying that hardware to take advantage of those services. the chips, part of why he saying there's new services across the board in hardware. julie, always appreciate your instant analysis, thank you for joining us. apple, developing a feature that lets iphone except payments with a tap of a credit card. currently merchants need to use terminals that communicate with the iphone via bluetooth. they have been working on this feature since 2020 when they purchased a canadian startup
robinhood in the spotlight and at the center of sec scrutiny. i want to talk about all of this and more with david chase, a former sec prosecutor. and before we dive in, i'm looking at robinhood now, the shares are plunging after hours. they missed on revenue. they missed on monthly active users and there are certainly questions surrounding some of the regulatory issues here. what do you make of robinhood a year later after the mania that was gamestop? david: i would just say, how things have changed in the last amount of time since it filed and went public, with all of the anticipation about its revenues and profitability. clearly, the market has punished robinhood's stock, given its performance to date. and certainly, apparently, continues even after the announcement on earnings. it, it, it creates a situation
where a company in the financial services industry can deal with regulatory problems and certainly it makes it easier to do so when revenues are good and things are going well for the company and it is profitable and the market is, you know, rewarding it. here, though, you've got a tremendous decline in stock price as the volume of activity in meme stocks have dwindled. prior hosts indicated that equity streaming is down 35% or so. so, with that line in trading activity, you know, you get the consequent decline in revenues. the regulatory problems of robinhood have not gone away. there is still apparently an intense sec interest in the
whole notion generally. including particularly the robinhood role in that. you still have ongoing class action litigation with respect to their decision to restrict trading during the meme stock trading frenzy, while that was going full force. in fact just in the last week or two, an individual investor won an award against robinhood in a n arbitration that may potentially be significant as it being an indication of things to come based upon an arbitrator or arbitration panel's finding that they improperly or wrongfully evidently restricted his ability to trade. emily: right.
>> for example, pinging the border flow, which robinhood has relied upon as a source of revenue over time, subject to continued regulatory and even congressional scrutiny. so even though the stock price has gone down and things are tough financially for the company, the regulatory landscape has not changed and is perhaps even getting a bit worse. emily: in the meantime, the robinhood ceo launching new products. they want to launch fully-paid lending. they intend to add more crypto services to the platform. talk to us a bit about the nuances of regulating a trading platform that is itself also a publicly traded company and the target of retail investors. david: yeah, it gets complicated real fast. the move to expand further into crypto, that might be important for the company to generate revenues to make up for the loss of equity trading and volume.
that will inevitably make it clear the view that they think the cryptocurrency and digital assets, depending on the facts and circumstances, can be securities and should be subject to sec regulation. so, you have that as an overlay on the trading platform, you know, of a publicly traded company that has disclosure obligations given the reporting requirements and it, you know, like i said, it becomes complicated very fast. robinhood will have to continue to make periodic filings discussing operations, disclosing information that could materially impact the
price. it is running as a platform that is going to be, particularly if they advance further into crypto, treading into new territory for sure. emily: obviously this phenomenon is not going away. it's not just affecting robinhood. more broadly, how big of a task does the sec have when dealing with this avalanche of individual investors who want to say? david: yep. this is the big issue. the sec has a job. one of its main goals is investor protection but it has to balance that against the need to have fair and efficient markets. so, that delicate balance between protecting the individual investor and providing liquidity and efficiency and also, you know,
allowing financial services to conduct business profitably, kind of a light touch for regulation, is also important. so that all also has to be sorted out. emily: david chase, lots of potential flashpoints to watch out for. thank you so much. meantime, another story that we are watching, stephen breyer made it official, he will retire this summer. the 83-year-old justice joined the president at the white house, who praised him for his years of service and promised he would have a historic nominee by the end of february. president biden: i have made no decision except one, the person i will nominate will be someone with extraordinary qualifications, character, experience, and integrity, and that person will be the first black woman ever nominated to the united states supreme court. emily: silicon valley watching the nomination closely. justice breyer had a strong background in antitrust, meaning the court could be less likely
to take up those types of cases, depending on who the nominee is. coming up, intel plunges on the back of fourth-quarter results. investors are jittery over the ambitious plans to turn around the chipmaker, including a $20 billion manufacturing hub in ohio. will it pay off and when? we will talk to him, next, on . this is bloomberg. ♪
thing onto chips, i caught up with pat gelsinger along with guy johnson one day after the company reported fourth to quarter results and i asked about concerns tied to how much intel is spending, including a potential hub for a new factory in ohio. how guaranteed is the return? take a listen. >> we feel that the overall industry is expected to double and most of that is leading edge technology and intel is only one of three companies on the planet able to build at that scale and so, we feel very strong that the demand signals in the long-term are going to make these great investments. there was a time when we underinvested incapacity around supply limitations. what i wouldn't do to have more fab as city today. taken together, this is exactly plan we laid out. we are going to invest aggressively in the capital buildout. and, last week's investments
around silicon heartland? my gosh, the president, the governor. i will just tell you, even though it was in ohio, everyone of the midwest states was so excited about us bringing this new capacity into the heartland of america. the silicon valley, silicon forest, and now the silicon heartland. emily: the ceo of ford says that he sees no relief ahead when it comes to the chip crisis. elon musk yesterday said that they are going to continue to be chips limited going forward. what was your message to the president? what more can the government do to bring some of that relief? at: we believe and i have been saying since early last year that we have been seeing the shortage persisting into 2023, and maybe beyond. that said, there will be incremental improvements throughout the year, but these
are still challenging times and these nodes that we have shortages on various components, they aren't going to go away overnight. we think that we are going to be collectively fighting through the supply challenges as we go through the year. that said, manufacturing a lot of this myself, part of the strength of the model is that we have more tools to be able to respond to the shortages than other companies and that was a big piece of our q4 results. >> and i take you back -- can i take you back to the and point emily raised, you are investing huge amounts of money. the community they're looking at this and saying that this is something you have to do but i think what they are wondering is when do we start to see margins improving as you make this investment? when do we see a return coming back to more normal margins? when do you think that is? pat: we had a five-year picture
in our last call where we said 51 to 53 that starts improving as they go to the back half of that five-year periods ♪ . i guided it to 52%, right in the middle of the range for q1. overall i would say it's happening just exactly like we planned it to be. we are seeing revenue growth rates in the business areas that i laid out, everything is happening exactly like we planned it. and yep, this is a big investment cycle for us as a company. it's the right one for intel and a critical one for the industry and for our nation. i am proud of the fact that we are making these investments and you know, at some point the street is going to see that we are doing exactly what we say. we are a say do company and this leadership team is so fired up because we are seeing everything that we said. process leadership, product leadership, manufacturing as city, we are doing it on
track to deliver exactly what we said we would. >> this is one of the questions people are asking themselves, do you think the investment would be even bigger? do you think that capital investment could be greater than you are suggesting right now? pat: when we announce the site , we said these are our first two fabs. we could see up to eight abs. we thought that this could be a $100 billion investment over the decade. part of the site was a big area that we could just grow and expand in overtime and i will tell you that the new area of ohio, just perfect, so warm, and embraced, support from the
emily: welcome back to "bloomberg technology." i am emily chang in san francisco. i want to get back to the apple results. we are getting some critical insight from tim cook. what is he saying? >> it was such a blockbuster quarter. a year ago, we were shocked by $100 billion of revenue in a quarter, now they are pushing toward $125 billion. record retail sales during a pandemic is what tim cook is talking about. services revenue outperforming. listen to this, because supply
chain, mixed picture. tim: we set all-time records for developed and emerging markets and saw revenue growth across all of our product categories except for ipad, which we said would be supply constrained. as expected, in aggregate, we experienced supply constraints that were higher than the september quarter. ed: he's talking about strong year on year growth going into the fiscal second quarter, for us in the quarter we are currently in. do me a favor. dan, does the s&p 500 and nasdaq 100 turn a corner now? because apple seems to have defied the odds of the supply chain although it has impacted the ipad, coming in softer than expected. they seem to have pulled a rabbit out of a hat. emily: absolutely, and certainly i find it interesting that it was worse in q1 than q4. on the call, he said it looks like it's getting better.
i think dan can hear you. let's pivot to that now and bring in dan. he is also listening in on this apple call. dan saying in his latest note that a major statement on iphone services highlighting cupertino's ability to navigate. the supply chain shortage. dan, your listening in. give us your headline takeaway about the supply chain issues and how apple has managed them. dan: ed hit the most important piece about the supply chain. as hard as the supply chain to navigate, i would say the damage has been contained. the iphone was not even on the radar to have a number like this given the supply chain issues. and importantly to ed's question, the supply chain improving in march, that is going to be big for every tech investor and in the food chain, that contrast the fears that we
are seeing from tesla and others about supply chain issues lasting throughout all of 2022. that is key. emily: why is apple managing it so much better, or so it seems, than everyone else? we heard elon musk yesterday on the tesla call saying they would continue to be chip limited, and we see this move down. dan: nine months ago, apple over ordered 20 million to 30 million iphones. they saw this happening and they have continued to do that the last few quarters. what's important is that they are proactive. in china with foxconn, they have the unique ability in terms of sourcing as well as the amount that apple orders and across the overall system. they are at the front of the line. they get dibs when it comes to getting chips. that's why cupertino continues to navigate it, but it is cook.
cook's balancing act and what he has been able to do over his last year in the chip shortage is nothing short of remarkable. emily: he was the coo of apple for all of those years and his job was to master that supply chain. we are still listening into him on the call. he says he believes they are gaining market share in iphone looking ahead. certainly, more optimistic than the other calls we have heard. what are the flashpoints for apple going to continue to be especially given this is a global issue even though apple seems to be managing it better than everyone else? dan: cook said it on the call. you aren't going to call it out specifically, but we think 250 bits per share in china. they were the number one smartphone maker in china for the first time in six years. that's important, because that is a key market for them. you look at overall supply
chain, that is going to ebb and flow. this is the strongest product cycle in a decade. in this market, we can talk about valuations all we want but if you look at what is happening on services, that is worth 1.5 trillion. this is going to be what i believe is a turnaround print for the tech sector. microsoft was key to the reversal in tech. emily: what is your take on the ipad weakness? dan: supply chain constraint. if it wasn't for supply chain, i think they would be great. i think that is something that will start to improve going into q2. that is the one area we sought saw pulled
forward from work from home unlike services and iphone where that pulls ahead. emily: let's talk about tesla and the big move down on the day. you are very bullish on elon musk and what this company has been able to pull off even in the midst of the supply chain issues. at some point, they don't have a choice they can only work with what they have. what is your outlook tesla in the year ahead as these issues persist? dan: i ultimately think it's a company that could be up from a growth perspective 70%. i think they had to be conservative coming out of the gate. ultimately, it was an overreaction, but if you look at it right now, they don't have it. the most important news that many lost over is in terms of the austin buildout. you're starting to manufacture cars with 4680 which is so important and i think they will be at the 2 million run rate, we will be buying the selloff in terms of supply chain. we will look at this and they will prove to be conservative. emily: tesla has gm and ford on its heels. there are all the very
competitive ev makers in china. how do you think tesla manages to stay ahead of the competition when consumers have more options if they want to buy an electric car? dan: there is an arms race, gm, ford, vw, china, the u.s., and others. 3% of of autos today are ev. by 2025, 10%. 30% by 2030. the moat tesla has besides the brand and model, the battery technology and distribution, that is why austin is so important in terms of that buildout. that 4680 is the differentiator into 2022. emily: continuing to listen into the apple call. cook saying the supply chain is doing very well considering the shortages. doesn't see any need for fundamental changes to the
supply chain. what are you watching to see in terms of apple, tesla, and how all of these companies manage this continuing issue? dan: just to show you, i probably got 10 emails from into institutional investors on those comments. apple is going to be the best barometer for the supply chain. tim cook's viewpoint is key for broader supply chain across technology. we are starting to see some improvement. i think right now the street is saying it's going to last through 2022. cook saying not so fast. very important in terms of broader tech and apple. emily: dan ives of weber bush securities. thank you. another story we are following, spotify down for a fifth day with the stock at its lowest level since may 2020. at the same time, the company announced it is removing the music of neil young.
the singer raised concerns that joe rogan is spreading vaccine misinformation, writing in a letter to the company that "they can have rogan or young, not both." spotify struck a deal with joe rogan in 2020 with more than $100 million. coming up, he wanted a billion , but softbank said, no. the likely departure of the cfo and what is next. this is bloomberg. ♪
advanced negotiations to leave the company after clashes with masayoshi son over how much he is paid. he wanted as much is $1 billion in compensation. for more on what this means is , i'm joined by her guests. what happened here? >> they could not come to terms. you know, he has played a significant role in a lot of things at softbank. a lot of key developments over the last several years. there was the turnaround with sprint before they sold out. there was getting wework back on track. remember what a nightmare that was for quite a long time. a real decline in the investment in terms of the value of that investment for softbank. one of its biggest. so he played a key role in that.
he also developed their latin american investing fund up to $8 billion. so he has played a significant role in some big events and kind of bailing out softbank and and some key ways. there was compensation to the unit of $1 billion or more. there was also wanting a spinoff of the latin american funds , again $8 billion. he wanted to have more independence there. he is from bolivia. he has an affinity for the region. really wanting to have more independence. emily: what do you make of yet another very high profile executive leaving softbank? his predecessor was also a big we all know he is a big personality. his predecessor was also a big personality. then of course masayoshi son. then you have these folks in the vision fund, many partners who have left. what do you make of the revolving door?
tom: as you said, very big personalities at softbank and they are running lots of money. they have a lot of responsibilities and there are some big egos. i don't think i am seeing anything very controversial in that. when you get those people around the table together, you are inevitably going to have disagreements. and add into the mix, a very strong personality himself, and it is an environment where they are sitting around singing kumbaya. strong personalities, lots of responsibility managing lots of money making big decisions and they really haven't been able to create an environment where these big personalities can sit around the table and get along well. it's the kind of thing that he masa will have to get his arms around eventually. you have to think, if they're going to continue to make these monumental decisions, these big investments in big companies and
working to turn them around. emily: any ideas what he's good going to be up to next? tom: he is been pushing for a long time for this independent investment fund. do you go and work for another one? do you take the latin american funds with you? the sense is he wants to have his own shop, to be the guy in charge. he wants to manage big amounts of money possibly in latin america. we don't know exactly where he's going to land. do know he is planning to leave. we we do know he is planning to leave. we don't know exactly when that is going to happen. we understand there are still negotiations underway. we are going to be working really hard to be the first to report it here on bloomberg. emily: thank you for the update. coming, shares of netflix jumping after bill ackman announces a huge new stake. netflix looks globally for new subscribers. that's next, this is bloomberg. ♪
emily: in the race to global streaming domination, netflix has invested more than $1 billion to create original korean content with the hope of re-creating the success of squid games. the ultimate goal is to win over the rest of asia including thailand and taiwan. ♪ >> netflix's korean shows are hugely popular around the world.
and the popularity of the shows helps netflix generate 366 million u.s. dollars in 2020 of which is a huge increase from level in 2019. some of the shows include kingdom which is the first korean original for netflix and remains one of the most popular shows around the world and of course we have squid game which became netflix's biggest show ever in just a month after its release in september. it generated about $900 million u.s. dollars in value and attracted over 111 million viewers around the world. and then, there is hell bound , which is also wildly popular. it figured in netflix's top 10 show list in over 19 countries. netflix started pretty small in korea.
there was a time in 2016 when netflix just entered korea. mainstream broadcasters are unwilling to license shows to netflix, but at that time there were many opportunities for mainstream broadcasters who were bound by taboos and rules on what can be shown and what cannot be shown on tv. so there were a lot of good scripts lying around in the market and that allowed netflix to zone in on these scripts and they often feature violets, sex, and unconventional topics like politics and social inequality. netflix has invested over one billion u.s. dollars in creating korean original content and they are planning 25 more korean shows in 2022. netflix's strategy is really go
local and go original. they have to hold down their investment in other asian countries for example thailand and taiwan and india where they are creating a lot of local language shows. and they are also utilizing some of the universally popular on 10, for example, korean content and japanese anime. they have invested a lot in these types of content as well because they have attracted a lot of viewers across asia no matter what culture and what country. emily: i want to stay on netflix which got a big boost thanks to bill ackman in his hedge fund pershing square purchasing 3 million shares of the streaming service. bill ackman confirming with a tweet that he is now among netflix's top 20 shareholders. more now i am joined by lucas shaw. what do you think about this investment and how much input will he have on what they decide
to do? lucas: it amounted to a big vote of confidence from a high-profile investor, somebody who has a history of being an activist, although in recent years he has not been as much. his letter made it clear that he believes in the company, in the streaming business model. so after a week of netflix shares getting destroyed on the market, you saw them pop back up the day, largely because of his investment. in terms of his role at the company, i don't sense he will have a ton of say. he is a top 20 investor, not a top 10 or top five. when i reached out to netflix, it didn't seem like there had been a lot of conversation between bill ackman and leadership, but that may change in the future. emily: how does netflix weather this bump in the road and is asia going to be the savior?
lucas: the message from the company and from everyone i have spoken with is to continue what we are doing. yes, they issued a forecast for the quarter that was not received favorably, but they continue to believe in the long-term strategy. netflix leaders don't get swayed much by the stock price going up or down. maybe they will slow down, but i think they will continue making shows that people want to watch. asia is the most important region for that. it has been europe, middle east, africa, then asia-pacific that have been vengence and where they have the most room to grow. they have been important regions. they have had a lot of success in south korea and to some extent in japan. a lot of the markets left for him don't tend to have local
on 10 industries, so it will be curious how netflix does in a place like india where they said they are frustrated with their performance thus far. emily: i have to ask you about the spotify story. the neil young joe rogan debacle. spotify elected to keep joe rogan on the platform. jo young going off the platform. -- neil young going off the platform. how serious is this? lucas: i have yet to see any evidence that this is a real problem for spotify. you young has a history of being something of an iconoclast. a few years ago, he took his music off because he didn't think their music was high enough quality. he started his own service that nobody really used. if you see a bunch of artists line up behind him and express concern, then it becomes a real crisis. as far as the #delete spotify, i guess we will see if there is any affect on numbers when spotify reports earnings next week, but i haven't heard anything from people at the company to suggest it has had a massive impact just yet. emily: even before this, spotify shares were in the process of
taking a leg down. why is that? lucas: i think there's a growing concern that their big bet on podcasting isn't going to pan out as well as people had hoped. or at least as quickly. spotify spent all this money buying podcast studios shows and when reason it is standing behind joe rogan is because he is far and away the best investment they have made. he is their most popular show by leaps and bounds, whereas the studios they have bought have not produced a lot of new hits and it hasn't led to a material change in new customers which is why you have seen the company change its strategy. when they started in podcasting, they thought it might bring in new subscribers. it also might help make them more profitable given how expensive music is. now, they are talking a lot about advertising, which is a different model. emily: we will be watching to see how this plays out. lucas shaw, thank you as always for your insights. coming up, tomorrow on bloomberg
technology it is an anniversary robinhood does not want to remember. we will speak with one person one year on from the gamestop drama. that does it for this edition of bloomberg technology. i am emily chang in san francisco. stay tuned for more coverage of apple and robinhood coming up next on bloomberg television. ♪
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