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tv   Bloomberg Business Week  Bloomberg  July 21, 2019 9:00am-10:00am EDT

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♪ carol: welcome to "bloomberg businessweek." i'm carol massar. jason: and i'm jason kelley. we are in bloomberg headquarters in new york. carol: have the most powerful banker in new york turns out his critics. jason: and in cannabis, alleviating pains. carol: plus, amazon's revolutionary plans to skip the checkout line. we begin with "bloomberg
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businessweek's" editor-in-chief, joel weber. we begin with jay powell. joel: take something complicated and this still it down to its most simple form. istill it down to its most simple form. the cover is an expression of that this week. jay powell, fed chair, probably the most important person in the world of finance. he heads the financial institution that is probably the most important anywhere in the world and for a year now, he's been the target of trump's friend are ire, because trump wants lower rates, lower rates, and jay powell has basically been a stoic figure through all of that. carol: we believe this is an independent organization, and for the first time we are wondering is it going to remain independent? >> and can they continue to fend off the executive branch's desire for lower rates? right? we will see what happens this next week with rate cuts. the market basically thinks there will be a rate cut.
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the bigger story is one we wanted to ask to dig into, which is for a year now we have been living through this tension between trump and powell, more from trump than from powell. it is one-sided, for sure. what effect has not had on the fed? what chris got to was, not much of an effect on a policy standpoint, but there is a certain nomination in progress right now. it will take a few months to evolve. this could be radical. jason: judy shelton is nominated for the fed. we don't know how that will go , we don't know how the nomination will go and we don't know what she might do if she gets into that seat. joel: we are at the beginning of this process. it could last the rest of the year, but it has dramatic implications for markets, for the financial viability of the whole world, and it all comes
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down to the fed and what jay powell is able to accomplish. he has been this stoic figure. we can bet he will continue to do that, but there is a lot going on here. carol: it is so timely and definitely a must-read for this week. joel weber, thank you. jason: i talked with reporter chris condon about this story. the dynamics of trump versus powell. chris judy shelton is a former : economic adviser to president trump. she is currently a director at the european bank for reconstruction and development, a position that was appointed by the president. she could be seen as one of two things. either a political partisan, because despite her past so-called hard money views, she has said recently that she would want to lower interest rates as quickly as possible if she became a fed governor.
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now, that doesn't really fit with her deeper background in thinking and writing about monetary policy and economics. when i said she is a fan of hard money, that is generally associated with aiming for very low inflation. even zero inflation. philosophically, she does not believe there ought to be a central bank setting a benchmark interest rate for the financial markets. jason: i want to stop you there, because that alone is a very provocative stance to say the least, and the idea you would have someone coming into the fed that would on a regular basis essentially be questioning, if not its very existence, certainly all the key roles that traditionally we have seen it play. how would that affect even the day-to-day operations and certainly the deliberative
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process of the fed? chris: think of it this way. sometimes an unorthodox person comes into the fed with a different view on economics. that does not describe judy shelton. she has no place in the debates that the fed holds around the table. she does not believe that debate ought to be happening. she is interested in a debate on an entirely different level. believe not, as i say, in having a central bank setting interest rates. she would rather money be considered, or be tied, to a fixed unit of measure like a weight in gold. this was a debate that was settled long time ago by the people involved in central banking around the world. she wants to revert to a much older debate. that would turn the fed on its head. i have to say that as a governor, that would not be that disruptive.
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one governor has really not that much influence at the fed, but think of it in this context in which the president obviously has great disdain for the current fed chair and would like even to remove him if he could. if a person like judy shelton is installed as a governor, she would fairly or unfairly be seen as a chair in waiting. let's say trump is reelected and powell's term expired, she might then be named the next fed chair or even before that, trump could consider trying to demote powell from the chair and replacing him with judy shelton. judy shelton as a governor would not be that disruptive, but judy shelton as the chair of the fed would threaten to turn that institution upside down. jason: just as we wrap up, one of the things you address in
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your piece -- you talked to a lot of people about -- is the notion that chair jay powell may say forget it. i'm out. that seems unlikely based on the people you talked to? chris: absolutely. not a single person i spoke to who knows jay powell pretty well at all thought that was even a remote possibility. he is very squarely focused on the job he has in front of him. he could make plenty of mistakes in that job, but he is very clearly not the type of person that is going to walk away. he's not in a position that serves at the pleasure of the president. the chairman of the fed has a fixed term with other certain protections found in the law and constitution. it is not entirely clear argument, but jay powell is not seen as the type of person who will wilt under this kind of pressure. he's a pretty strong-minded and
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stoic individual, and he is very likely going to whether this just fine. carol: next, deep into the business of cannabis. jason: from the grass ceiling for women to the new trend of stoner pets. weed has come a long way. carol: it certainly has. this is "bloomberg businessweek." ♪
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carol: welcome back to "bloomberg businessweek." i'm carol massar. jason: and i'm jason kelley. join us every day on the radio from 2:00 to 5:00 wall street time. carol: you can also find us online and our mobile app. in the business section this week, a look at the cannabis industry. it is growing and global. jason: and getting bigger as state after state and country after country legalizes marijuana. the new green supply chain is global, exploding markets for cbd pet products -- carol: we call them stoner pets. jason: and even the grass
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ceiling women come up against when they tried to rise in the weed business. >> cannabis encompasses hemp and marijuana and for the last century, both have been banned. hemp is used for fiber and textiles, but got lumped in with marijuana and fell under prohibition. there has been no legal economy here. the major thing last december is the farm bill shepherded by mitch mcconnell from kentucky. he wanted the farmers to grow hemp. they legalized industrial hemp and the cbd, which doesn't get you stoned but has some of the benefits of cannabis. that is what is driving a lot of this now that there is a federally legal cannabis market in the united states. carol: that means profits made are not complicated for the other side of the cannabis market? craig: the answer is complicated but less than when you are , talking about marijuana. marijuana, the problem is there are 11 states -- where it is
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legal and their store is opened. the federal government considers marijuana like cocaine or heroin. completely illegal and that creates a lot of tension. the reason investors have pushed to hemp is some of those restrictions are gone. there is a federal market, you can grow hemp in kentucky and send it to oregon. you can make cbd products in oregon and send it to new york. there is an interstate commerce market in hemp and that is why the focus is on hemp. carol: as it becomes more traditional, that means some of the pitfalls of becoming a traditional company come along, and that includes the ability for women to be in this industry. when we started out, when cannabis, the industry, was young, there were a lot of women in that industry and prominent in higher positions. craig: and a narrative this would be a great industry for women. it wouldn't be burdened by the historical diversity problems we have seen in banking and tech, and women would thrive. carol: no glass ceiling.
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glass ceiling, because in colorado and washington when this got started, it was startups. those states took steps to limit outside investment and everyone had a fair crack. you didn't need a ton of capital to get started, so there was this narrative it would be a great place for women. turns out we have public companies, wall street has shown up some of the vc's have shown up and it is starting to look like everything else. it is more white, more male and a problem for the female executives. there are no women on these boards. it is a problem in the spotlight. jason: one of the most fascinating places this is going , we are both racing to get to the next story, stoner pets. using cannabis to help your dog in a pretty meaningful way. craig: the anecdotal stories are powerful. you talk to these people, my dog was 14 years old, i thought i was going to have to put them down. the dog wouldn't eat, couldn't jump, started giving it cannabis and several weeks later they
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were better. cbd people are using cbd too. there is very little research on this because it was banned for a century. anecdotally, people are hearing it helped buster, it helped their dog get that are with their joints, or whatever. people are trying it. is it a placebo effect? people think the placebo is a strong factor here, but who is to argue with these powerful stories? the story of the pet market has been premiumization. people want organic food for their pet. all the things we think about in the food and beverage world have shown up in pets. cbd is the premium ingredient in the pet food market right now. carol: i love that you talk about that cbd market could be worth 24 billion in the u.s. by 2023 with 27% coming from the pet market. that is pretty significant. craig: a lot of people think the cbd market will be bigger than the marijuana market at the end of the day, because there are a
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bunch of people out there, and a dog's too, that can't be stoned. you could take cbd before work, it helps you relax. there are a lot of use cases where the other product would not work. jason: you spent a lot of time looking at the biggest consumer package, the big food and beverage companies. where are they on all of this? consolation was out ahead, but it feels like everybody is looking to the pepsis, cokes, cosmetic firms. who goes in next? : cbd is legal by the letter of the law. the problem is the fda hasn't done the regulations. it is not technically legal to put cbd in food or drinks. what coke and procter & gamble and pepsi are waiting for is for the fda to come out and say we think the average adult can have 100 milligrams of cbd a day and it is safe to eat and drink.
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that hasn't happened. right now, this is the wild west. it is treated like a health supplement like st. john's wort where there is not a ton of regulation. the big boys, the companies, will wait for the fda to say this stuff is safe and legal and here is what you can do with it. carol: in the meantime, we are seeing a global supply chain created. talk about that. craig: coming off the farm bill, the u.s. market for cbd is exploding. around the world, you are getting legal cannabis markets in places you could never have imagined even three years ago. everyone is looking to the u.s. and saying cbd is the next buzzy ingredient. coca-cola will want it. let's grow some hemp. it is happening in china, colombia, across europe, other countries in asia. hemp, because it is less restricted than marijuana, is becoming a thing at the center of the first legal global
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cannabis supply chain. jason: taylor riggs joins us now. atlor: come into my terminal gtv , we are tracking the stock performance of the big companies. take a look at this. this has a lot of people concerned about the supply chain. how do we make sure we have it all lined up where we need it to be? we've come off the highs a little bit. i would highlight big companies like canopy growth, up 40% to 150% in the last two years but there has been more scrutiny and focus on these companies. where is the next phase of growth? the pet sector, the u.s. market? some people say canada has been tapped out. just more scrutiny on these companies. carol: investors want to see performance. coming up, betsy devos came to washington as a government outsider. how she is handling the job now that she is on the inside. jason: a legal case that has ramifications in washington and on wall street. everyone is talking about
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jeffrey epstein's business and political connections coming under a lot of scrutiny. carol: this is "bloomberg businessweek." ♪
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jason: welcome back to "bloomberg businessweek." i'm jason kelley. carol: i'm carol massar. you can listen to us on radio on sirius xm channel 119, and on am 1130 in new york, 106.1 in boston, 99.1 fm in washington, d.c. and am 960 in the bay area. jason: in this week's featured section, a spotlight falls on one of donald trump's many controversial cabinet members. we are talking this week about secretary of education betsy devos. carol: while she had no government experience, she was a wealthy activist who had forrolled efforts for
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charter schools. she has taken moves to leave her mark. jason: devin leonard has tracked a lot of the cabinet. he talked about how she has measured up. devin: she went to calvin college, named after john calvin, the 16th-century theologian. her father invented the lighted sun visor and became rich, and she married dick devos, the son of the founder of the cosell and empire. --coselling empire. in michigan, this is a royal wedding. devoses.es and the jason: we should point out since you mention the name prince her , maiden name, her brother is erik prince of blackwater fame who has his own political and geo-everything story.
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devin: there's another story, but they are very conservative and both mr. and misses devos became very involved in conservative causes, especially with a focus on education and among other things, they supported -- she in particular, a furtherance of lightly regulated charter sector with a high number of schools run by for profit companies. to put it mildly, they have had mixed results for children. carol: talk about her administration and what she has been able to get done, because it sounds like she doesn't have a lot of backing from the white house nor congress, but she has been able to roll back some educational initiatives put in place under the obama administration. devin: that is the whole thing. everybody thinks you are the secretary of k-12 education. you are not. the federal government contributes maybe less than 8% of the roughly trillion dollars the federal government spends --
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actually, no, the country spends on k-12 education. but they oversee the student loan program, and that is a $1.4 trillion program, so that is where she has had the most impact. her real cause is school choice. pushing charter -- especially pushing vouchers. being able to send kids to private school. that has been her cause. carol: has she made progress on that? devin: no. i guess there was a little victory in the tax cuts and jobs bill in 2017. ted cruz got an amendment passed save,ould enable us to put money away in our college , savings account to spend on private school, but that has
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been it. she has tried to push much bigger school choice plan. she is trying to do one now and house democrats are against it. to your point before, the -- do your before, trump is not that interested in education. carol: also in featured, a story in the headlines this week. jeffrey epstein has pleaded not guilty to sexual misconduct and conspiracy charges. meanwhile, questions arising over how he allegedly built a fortune on wall street and developed powerful connections in washington. jason: reporter tom metcalf joins us from london, because he put together this map of sorts of epstein's orbit. tom, how do you get your arms around a fast-moving and pretty complicated story? fromthis involves people corporate america, manhattan high society, british royals, and effectively this is a combination of these news stories that have been flying
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around the last week or so and trying to make it for the readers a one-stop reference point in all the different strands this story has taken. carol: this story is disturbing and fascinating on many levels and beyond the allegations and charges that have been levied against him. we are wondering how did he get all of these relationships? how did he accumulate so much money? that is what you are getting at. tom: that is what everyone is chasing. at the center of this horrific story is this man who seems to have been able to keep connections with billionaires, with celebrities, socialites despite 10 years ago being known as a sex offender. that continues to befuddle everyone. this is the guy, one of america's richest people. why did he feel the need to give so much control over his
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financial affairs to a character like epstein? who, even now after years in the public eye, we really don't know what his business was about. we don't know how he accrued so much wealth or connections. what we do know, and what the article points out, is how far his web extended. how are these people connected? why are they in this orbit? jason: it is fascinating too that you lay out the assets he had. that is a huge issue for the government, a huge issue for the folks who are trying to both understand where he came from , but also figure out how they are going to dispose of that and keep him from leveraging all that. tom: i've spoken with prosecutors, and they think the asset side of things could be the key to all of this. he has two private islands in the u.s. virgin islands, as you do. he had infamous manhattan
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townhouse, in paris, and and a place in florida. all of those are up for grabs for the prosecutors. the question is, a lot of interesting things going on here. he bought a second island in 2016, spent a lot of money redeveloping what was going on there. why did the government over there allow that to happen? not just the property. he has a couple of jets, a helicopter. one of those jets and one helicopter are up for sale. carol: still ahead, nobody knows amazon like brad stone, so he is the perfect person to dig into jeff bezos' scheme to dominate another slice of retail. jason: and how uber might want to take a page from jeff bezos ' playbook. carol: this is "bloomberg businessweek." ♪ hey! i'm bill slowsky jr.,
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i live on my own now! i've got xfinity, because i like to live life in the fast lane. unlike my parents. you rambling about xfinity again? you're so cute when you get excited... anyways... i've got their app right here, i can troubleshoot. i can schedule a time for them to call me back, it's great! you have our number programmed in? ya i don't even know your phone anymore... excuse me?! what? i don't know your phone number. aw well. he doesn't know our phone number! you have our fax number, obviously... today's xfinity service. simple. easy. awesome. i'll pass. jason: welcome back to
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"bloomberg businessweek." carol: still ahead among businessweek talks. antonio neri tells us how his company could win the battle for the cloud. jason: and a special solutions question called prognosis, meeting health care issues head on. carol: and it has been a 50 years from the first moon landing. the management lessons we all learned. jason: but we begin in the
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features section. the company that reinvented retail, they are not done disrupting. carol: jeff bezos has been spending time and money on a plan to rid of the world of the cash register. jason: if you live in some major cities in america, you may have seen it. to understand what it is all about, we went to the guy who literally wrote the book on amazon and bezos. >> there are 13 of them. san francisco, chicago, new york. they are adding them slowly. it is best described as like a convenience store where you can pick up lunch or breakfast. a smattering of grocery store items, they are small. they are not large is in 2000 square feet. but the big innovation and the reason why amazon has been working on this for so long is that there are no cashiers. you walk in, you scan your app, pick up what you want and walk
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out. and if you look up, genetically i'm a there are dozens and dozens of cameras watching you and tracking what you do to see what you are taking. so they can charge you for it. this is amazon's big bet to revolutionize retail. carol: talk to us about how it works. i was fascinated by the weighing of items. people moving at products around. tell us how it really works. >> that is something my colleague and i were curious about when we started to research this story. one thing i knew from following amazon is that they have worked on this for an extraordinarily long time, probably longer than most companies would ever invest in a project. they started this in 2012. jeff bezos told a lieutenant go figure out a way for us to do something unique and retail, and this is what they landed on. they investigated a number of ways to make it work. they were looking at rfid chips in packages, having customers
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scan barcodes on all sorts of things. what they landed on was a a combination of sensors. there are cameras and weight sensors so they can combine a smattering of inputs to figure out what has been taken and carried away. the other thing is a small selection of cases where there is some confusion, there are good old-fashioned amazon employees looking at the footage. did he pick up a chicken panini? so one of the big questions is does this scale? carol: it sounds expensive and like a lot of technology. and you still have to have people doing things. that sounds expensive to me. sources described
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it it as the most expensive r&d project in amazon history. we talked to the technical head of the project and he did not think that was right. but they have spent millions on it. and this gets to how amazon operates. currently coming as a small convenience store but they are thinking about it as much more. we are reporting there is a 10-15,000 foot being worked on in seattle that is going to be much larger. clearly, they are looking at this not necessarily to replace cashiers in whole foods but as a lever to create a new customer experience in retail. store is store -- go kind of an experiment. the future could be much larger. carol: and the potential price is, as you write, a $12 trillion global grocery market. they want a piece of this.
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>> what they do is they go how do we get to 500 billion? walmart is still much larger in terms of annual sales. how do we get to that level? how do we become the biggest retailer in the world? arguably, they are not going to do that unless they crack 90% of all retail that happens in physical stores. jason: we talked about bezos, -- tech troubles, and even his own prime day purchases on our extra podcast. you can check that out at itunes and bloomberg.com. carol: of course i'm a amazon has got all of that money to pour into projects. it is partly because of a decision made over a decade ago to branch out into web services. aws has grown into a profit stream respected by investors and wall street. jason: bloomberg opinion says uber would be wise to do something similar. she offers them some advice. >> there is an aws hiding inside of uber.
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this is a decade that has honed their own technology to match people who want rides with drivers around the world. it has mapping and logistics technology, that is hard to do. carol: and the chief technology officer has thought about this. >> i thought that was interesting. recently, he suggested where has uber has got lots of ideas but this idea of doing aws style technology is on the background. he brought it up unannounced and made the comparison to aws on his own. carol: he does not want to do it anytime soon. >> it is clear it is not front and center. carol: the market for aws is much bigger. it's a different market potential. >> i think aws's potential audience is literally any company in the world. every company needs computing.
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and not every company in the world has an uber-like business model and needs technology underneath it. that's a big reason why it might not work. jason: what is interesting about aws is that the introduction of that radically changed the landscape of other big technology companies, the acquisitions of they make, the business strategy. it would be interesting to see if uber getting into the business would change how lyft and airbnb and others would think about this. >> it is worth noting that maybe uber does not exist without aws because it uses the same model aws invented. it might create whole categories of companies that would not have been possible otherwise. jason: we talked tech with the ceo of hpe. he told us about their plans to take their claims to the cloud. carol: plus, data management and a look at pressing issues in
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health care. jason: this is "bloomberg businessweek." ♪
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carol: welcome back to "bloomberg businessweek." jason: join us every day on the radio from 2 p.m. to 5 p.m. wall street time. carol: and find us online. jason: also in this week's exclusive interview with hewlett-packard enterprise ceo antonio neri. he has been with the company since it split in 2015. that created hpe. he took over as the ceo back in 2018. carol: and hpe recently introduced a subscription model, carving out a niche in a highly competitive space. that includes amazon and google. jason: we spoke to neri about
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his plan. >> we believe the future will be eccentric and clout central and data-driven. and the cloud has to be closer to where the data is being generated. that is the edge. the edge is where we live and work. that's where the action is. so we have a clear strategy, to provide the right conductivity with a secure connection, analytics, and move computing closer to the data. it is cheaper to move the cloud to where the data is. not the data where the cloud is. so we have made a bold statement last year to invest $4 billion to develop that set of technologies that will accelerate outcomes. carol: how much pressure are you feeling from the likes of amazon, google and others? i know you have a partnership with google, but some of these other companies that have put their stake in the ground.
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how much pressure do you feel from them. >> many have moved to the public cloud. but when you look at the enterprise level, even the midmarket, see that not many productions have the cloud. the reason is that at scale, customers realize it is cheaper for them to run it on their premises in a data center or a core location at scale. and we realized the world will be hybrid. there will be data on premises and data on where we call the the cloud. that is going to be the world as we go along. there is an opportunity to modernize that infrastructure to provide an integrated experience in a true hybrid cloud approach. and to help customers decide what is the right mix. ultimately, they have to decide based on a set of policies where they want that data to
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gravitate. for us, we are embracing the public cloud. we are providing a true hybrid cloud experience. carol: do you feel pressure from other competitors? >> we compete with everybody. on one spectrum with the providers and on another with the vendors. but we have a clear strategy. and if you look at our results we are making progress. carol: you have done a lot of acquiring of companies. is there another piece you feel you need to add on? >> we are looking at what is out there, particularly startups. and if it makes sense for our shareholders, we have a disciplined approach and it helps us accelerate our strategy.
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obviously, more and more of this intelligence comes from the software-enabled experience that makes that more intelligent, autonomous, or at the edge. so we will consider it. we are always looking for. valuations tend to be erratic as of late, but if it makes sense, we will consider it. carol: we have got trade wars underway and that we will see what comes out of the g20. but you also have the white house pushing against other trade partners. you guys do manufacturing in mexico. how do you view the trade wars? you are in 172 countries. how is it changing how you run hp? >> the reality is we have got to solve this together. i think we need to work together to solve this problem. ultimately, there needs to be a
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fair approach to this threat. but at the same time, we live in a global economy and the supply chains we have put in place are very sophisticated. we have a very large and global presence so we have been able to navigate these challenges and mitigate them. carol: now to the special solutions section, focusing on the issue of health care. jason: governments and private companies are trying to bring innovation to the health care sector. we spoke to our editor about the stories in this week's issue. >> even before the opioid crisis, the big question was what comes after opioids? what can we develop as a pain medicine and treatment that are as effective and that can step in and take the place of opioids? i think the next big thing in pain has been something people have been talking about for a long time.
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but bigger companies have had mixed success. we are looking at efforts by a handful of startups that are testing on animals and pushing it forward. there is some push by our government to speed up human trials. carol: and we are spending money. >> exactly. it is kind of exciting stuff, i mean, i think it is unlocking genes and dna. it is not a gene therapy but the underpinnings of a lot of what we need to deal with to get at developing more effective ones. pain is a tricky thing to get at. you don't want to eliminate pain entirely so that we are aware of things happening to us and there are other various other considerations. it has been a very complicated area. our and editor did a great job at looking at what is happening with the startups.
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people will be surprised. jason: and a reminder that what we understand about pain comes down to the brain. >> exactly. the thing is, i think the crisis is terrible, but in some ways, it has focused people on the fact that we have to move beyond opioids. they were effective and very lucrative. some of it being managed not the way it should have been. so there has not been in that real drive to find what is coming next. now, it is like, no, this is a priority. jason: coming up, nobu like you have never seen it before. carol: and than 50 years ago,
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americans managed to make it to the moon. it is a story about patriotism but also project management. this is "bloomberg businessweek."
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jason: welcome back to "bloomberg businessweek." carol: you can also listen to us on the radio on sirius xm channel 119, and on a.m. 1130 in new york, 106.1 in boston, 99.1 f.m. in washington, d.c. jason: a.m. 960 in the bay area, in london on dab digital, and through the bloomberg business app. carol: in pursuits about a peek behind the scenes at an iconic american restaurant. jason: anybody who is anybody goes to eat sushi at nobu. we went there with a twist. >> we have this awesome
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journalist who them up for a couple years, has been doing stunts where we sent him undercover epos locations to see what it is like to be a bother at the plaza, a ski instructor at aspen. and our latest was to have him go undercover as the maitre d' at nobu. jason: remind us of the role it plays in celebrity culture. >> nobu started in l.a.. nobu himself at a restaurant there and robert de niro convinced him to come to new york. they started this empire together. now it is around the globe and they have hotels. a billion dollar business and it is growing. they are famous for celebrities hanging out there. jason: part of what the maitre d'sees was all of the intricate behavior that happens from the restaurant side but also the client-side.
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>> yeah. brandon worked at nobu 57. this is not even the most celebrity-central one but he saw tons when he was here. and he described the seating chart as a game of risk. they have subscriptions and they know who cannot be seated with who. they have relations with the celebrities and they use the young staff who actually tell them, oh, that is a youtube star. you can't seek that person near this person. it gets kind of intense. carol: there are these corner booths and that is coveted. >> there are four booths and everyone wants those.
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everybody wants to be in that spot. there is only so much you can do. and there are issues of privacy. he said that if you are seen as a celebrity at a restaurant, it is because they want you to see them. jason: and check out the pursuits section for much more like bentley's 100th anniversary and how elvis reinvented himself and the las vegas show. carol: a good beach read. let's finish up in the remarks section with reflections on with the most amazing pursuits in american history, human history, really. that would be sending a human to the moon. with apollo 11, armstrong, and the first lunar landing. jason: that was the result of a huge collaboration on a scale seldom attempted. so what does that teach us about management? our editor outlined some lessons.
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>> we were saying we made it, we've got to the moon. now it is not like we, it is like they. those people from long ago. and now we somehow can't or at least are not doing it. in a way, it is almost faintly embarrassing celebrating this anachronism of americans walking on the moon. carol: so let's talk about it. you do take a look back 50 years at the process and some of the lessons we have learned. >> right, because think about it, the technology of the 1950's was so primitive compared to today. you carol: it's amazing we got to the moon. >> particularly in the area of computers. the onboard computer on the apollo mission was so incredibly tiny there was no computer that primitive that exists anywhere today.
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and yet it got them to the moon. so the lesson to me is not the technology but the management. so there are lessons we can take today and apply them to today's challenges whether it is cancer or global warming or whatever. carol: they had a very clear objective. >> the person who established that objective was president john f. kennedy when he said in 1961 that the u.s. had a mission to land astronauts on the moon and bring them safely home by the end of the decade, which was audaciously ambitious. carol: the here is what we will do and here is the timeframe. jason: and not universally lauded. it seemed like a fool errand in light of what was going on in the world and the country.
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>> there were incredible pressures working against this moon mission. but because the nasa people, and there were 400,000 at one point, had such a clear mission, they were able to put that aside and get going. carol: i love this line in your story. nasa itself was more of a confederation than a single agency. this whole idea of pulling everyone together for one mission. >> it must be said it did not work flawlessly. the great tragedy was that in 1967, 3 astronauts died in a routine test. they trace the back to problems with the prime contractor. it turned out that the director of nasa had not known about the problems there.
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this led to his resignation and it was a big blow at a time when, at that point, 67 was getting pretty close to 1970. but they pulled together and managed to get it done. carol: bloomberg businessweek is available on newsstands now. jason: what is your must-read? carol: what we heard from peter coy. i love the story. taking us back 50 years ago and what it took to put a man on the moon. i feel like he is kind of hinting at us that we've got some big problems and we can learn something. yours? jason: i love catching up with brad stone on amazon. he can go deep on the amazon go story but then we get to spend a little extra time with him. check that out on our podcast. carol: and you can find more stories on businessweek.com. jason: and check out our daily show. carol: more bloomberg television starts now. ♪
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david: after the company did go public, it did go down by 11%, which is a record decline after an ipo. dara: i love how this interview is starting. [laughter] dara: i really appreciate that. david: how long will it be before your driver program has no drivers? dara: the better thing than humans alone and robots alone are humans and robots working together. david: someone asked you to interview for the job as being the ceo of uber? is that right? and did you say you already had a job? dara: at first, i said no way. >> would you fix your tie, please? david: people would not recognize me if my tie was fixed. but ok. let's leave it this way. all right. ♪

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