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tv   [untitled]    October 6, 2021 8:30pm-9:00pm AST

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is that can accelerate chemical reactions without becoming parts of them. i was thought there were already metal and enzymes, but the work of benjamin list. and david mcmillan has shown that they're all at now these organic catalysts. and the idea is that this now makes the processes in all sorts of industries a lot more efficient, a lot greener, which can also tie into those and the prize in physics affecting, affecting us all with climate change. and as we now look forward to the rest of them though by wake the literature prize smarter than going to also for the peace prize, bach her in stock on for economics next week. ah, clara again, i am fully veritable with the headlines on al jazeera, the world health organization has approved the use of a malaria vaccine for children. w h o has been testing it in 3 african countries since 2019. malaria is the primary cause of childhood illness and death in sub
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saharan africa. i. some of you may know i started my career as a multi researcher, and i longed for the day that we would have an effective vaccine against this ancient and terrible diseases. and today is that day an historic day to day w, change the common doing the broad use of the world's 1st minute vaccine. austrian chancellor, sebastian, paris and 9 others are being investigated on suspicion of corruption and bribery, prosecutor trying to figure out if curse bought advertising for favorable coverage in a newspaper. gas prices in the u and u. k. a record high up by 25 percent is raising fears of soaring bills and inflation as winter approaches. limited gas supplies have combined with wising demand, as economies recover from the pandemic. while the present of the european commission says this could be the time to speed up the transition to renewables. it is
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a serious issue. i think we have to be very clear that the gas prices are skyrocketing and the but the renewables. the prices have decreased over the last 2 years and a stable. so for us is very clear that with energy in the long term, it is important to invest in renewables. that gives us stable prices and more independence because gas is important. 90 percent of the gas is important to the european union and the nobel prize in chemistry has been jointly awarded to, to scientists for their development of a precise new tool for molecular construction. the role to dish academy assigned to says the work of benjamin list, and david mcmillan had a great impact on pharmaceutical research. those are the headlines inside story is next largest there. ah.
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energy prices of record eyes in europe, many families are struggling to pay their power bills. it's triggered protests on even crisis meetings. you need us what's causing the power crunch band is the blocks push for renewable energy to blame. this is inside story with hello and welcome to the program. i'm darren jordan. europe is facing a worsting energy crisis ahead of winter gas prices of reach, record highs and supplies are running low across the block. well, around the world, demand for natural gas and oil is up. as economies reopen off to cobit 19 lock
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downs. europe has about 3 quarters of its gas in storage, much lower than normal for this time of the year. power bills are already going up . italians have been told to expect a 40 percent increase over the next few months. you finance ministers are demanding coordinated action to secure supplies. the european commission president says the crisis shows the block needs to produce its reliance on fossil fuels and invest in green energy. it is a serious issue. i think we have to be very clear that the gas prices are skyrocketing for the renewables. the prices have decreased over the last 2 years and are stable. so flash is very clear that with energy in the long term, it is important to invest in renewables. that gives us stable prices and more independence because gas is important. 90 percent of the gas is important to the
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european union. when europe relies on russia for much of its natural gas, president vitamin putin is boosting supplies through ukraine. but he says that you can only blame itself for what he calls the blocks historical push for renewables. loan, the city would go to the transition to green energy should happen smoothly, soon, and our country definitely has all the possibilities to avoid those mistakes. so we can see where unbalanced decisions he unbalanced actions and abrupt movements can bring us. you know, today, as i said before, like we can clearly see it on the european energy market. ah, so let's bring in our guess in burn switzerland, economist connie la, maya in berlin, andreas golf, our professor, public policy at the university of 8 foot and in brussels. silver pastor, really a greenpeace. you climate and energy campaign. i welcome all to the program. a connie la maya in burn. let me start with you 1st. if i may, i'm in minneapolis are saying that this energy crisis is a perfect storm of
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a number of factors. what do you think is behind the crisis? and how bad is it? a storm of a number of factors. what's behind it is back then, especially when you look at gas and maybe also cold storage is as low as it's been in, in, in more than a decade. simply because we had a very, very cold winter last year. and then we have, you know, we have did the shenanigans between europe and burn russia, all gas and politics and always the, we also have climate change to deal with. we all we, all everybody, including myself, we want to achieve the powers climate change goals. but again, from here to down, we still need investment in transitional fuels like gas and best high to come by ways. so people are not in my city and the weather is getting cold. so we are in a perfect storm of prices,
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skyrocketing and the economy is also recovering from part of a pass code. it silver pastorelli in brussels. i mean, what's your take on this crisis? and i'm, and surely the expert should have seen this coming well as many people levels to said that these crisis is linked to take renewables, the, to the energy translation. actually, it's quite the opposite to because a funny thing is because the transition hasn't come fast enough on the crisis. is linked to our over reliance on gas. this is the problem here. ease at that. we have a lot of renewable energy online, but actually still a gas is the highest picket it there on the market, which is actually dictates the price is and eat, say it's what making at people feel the a, feel the energy crisis in very personally. so let's just stay with that issue of the renewables for a 2nd to bring us undress. goto address is green,
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transition is still in its early stages, which is what the experts are telling us. is there an argument here on risk that the process isn't fast enough? and we need to speed up infrastructure and supply well, you can't go fast enough for it, right? in order to fight clone crisis, you could go with, you know, full speed and everything that you can. but i would still say that the european union is going the right way with the european grid deal and, and what the various policies you know, towards the compensation. if you just think about it. i mean, after 2030, we're essentially facing our fossil fuels. we're, we're, we might, we keep gas for a little bit and not for long old coil is gonna be gone for a very short time. and, and coal is going to be phase house and most of the countries within the next decade. so it's not going fast. enough, but it is certainly taking up. see,
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i'm calling in the mail. is this common crisis? do you think going to derail the transition to green energy and also was the time frame for this transition? just too unrealistic anyway. was somebody who would i get a time frame was to it. we list the others would say it's going to slow, but i think when we just need to make sure you know, that is the energy transition. and there's the climate crisis which we all agree with. but there is also a social crisis so, so we need to make sure that in that transition there will be enough energy delivered from relatively clean sources of fossil fuels, which we still need until we have all that, all that infrastructure invested in them for renewables. and so we need to still make sure that the lights don't go out because what's happening now is, yes, we have a climate crisis. but at this point we have, we may have faced a very urgent social crisis where a lot of people with low incomes may need to decide between heat or food and that
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is not acceptable. yeah. and we'll come back to the issue of vulnerable people who did late in the program civil and come back to you. i mean, how much then does this current energy crisis in europe bring the use green transition on the fresh fruits and, and what does this mean then for its climate policy over all? well, one thing that we know for sure is data as her as other than the program i've already said to you. is it you is going in the right direction? and this is it, this is obviously very good. but at the same time what we know that the targets and the policies that say the you is put in place on that, the big umbrella, the green deal and are not fast enough or not sufficient. they do not match that they'd, i didn't match neither the urgency of the climate crisis nor what scientists are telling us that we should be doing. there has been huge consensus around at the causes of our changing climate and also on the policy measures that we should be
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adopting. and these consensus has been deaf with decades. the problem here is that and for the moment where it's not, it's not enough. it's too little we what we treat important is that we also make sure that it's not too late. all right, so, so address, i mean, you know, we're told that natural gas and cold still supply more than something like 35 percent of use total. what roland does natural gas play as a transitional resource to bridge that gap to renewables? well, natural gas has been called a physician fuel, but as far as i'm concerned for and as a bridge fuel. but as far as i'm concerned, it's not a very long range really. you know, we will need gas for the next decade or so. and we cannot phase it out immediately for a number of reasons, by the way, also including contractual reasons. we're still, europe is still tied into long term contracts, which you can just leave or otherwise will be pretty costly. but i,
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but natural gas will also pretty much give way to renewables at 2030. and that's maybe not tomorrow, but it's within less than a decade. and that is going to be pretty quick. we're going to phase in and blend in renewable fuels in the shape of renewable gases. how takes technologies, green hydrogen. these kind of things that will sooner or later, also eat into the margin of natural gas in the heart of the carbon sector, such as a steel, the heavy industries. we're talking about green steel these days already, and that's precisely where a lot of gas will still need it for the next decade, but not much longer. alright, so address, you seem quite optimistic about the transition itself. i mean, cornelia, if renewables then not sufficient yet to dump and demand, do we need to face this harsh reality? i guess that that co and dirty energy will be with us for some time to come to fill
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that energy gap. i say, yes, we do it. the matter here is to make sure that this is little girl as, as possible. and as much as the cleaner fuel, which is gas as possible. but you know, there is such an enormous, enormous investment required to get from here to an 80 and we all again we on to go to ne cyril's man is enormous investment, re cry it. so in the mean time, we need to make sure we transition so that the lights don't go out and the so silly vulnerable, don't suffer an address. let me just m touch on the issue of how you think russia views this energy crisis. i mean, we saw a quote earlier on from the russian president vladimir putin. i mean, the fact is, europe does depend on moscow for much of its gas, but is russia using the crisis for geo political leverage? um, and it wants to get north stream through up and running anyway, doesn't it?
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well you're, you're touching on a, on a very important point here. me see to sticks of maladies. to russia's hasn't done anything wrong. they have supplied the context that they're supposed to supply the promise they haven't done much more. so typically over the summer, what from does is they refill the storage of europe. and for that, they book a lot of additional capacity in tons of pipelines for crane and, and other countries and added on this, which means we're now at what $76.00 the center. so our storage being filled up and that compares about 90 percent on average, that we typically have every year. which means now the russians are using this to make the case for supply security being insured by way of bringing online will stream to their new pipeline. and which is the serious thing. hm, it's complete it. but it is,
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it is not operational. yes. so the russian analysis she's suggesting and implicitly and more more explicitly that in order to avoid a supply crunch the upcoming winter, you better make sure the european regulatory authorities back is the german regulatory authority better make sure that's happened becomes a racial ra, a c make of it, what you want, it certainly is about your politics. it is not necessarily about market behavior. yeah, that's an interesting point. you make a pastor really an interesting quote from the russian president vladimir putin. blaming the crisis on the e was what he called hysteria over transitioning to green energy. presumably putin doesn't want to see a quick transition to renewables, and he makes more money with natural gas as i was saying earlier, and it has actually nothing to do. we do with the transition to tour a new way to system. if anything, the problem is actually the opposite because we do not have that we have,
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we're not transitioning fast enough and it's over reliance on gas and gas infrastructure that has put us in the situation. and the more money we will keep pouring into into fossil fuels, the more likely we are to face this kind of crisis in the future. monday. it's a, it's really important that we really move the investments in, in a different direction. and here it's where i would like to differ a little bit from what credit it was. hey nadia, it's very important that we send this very strong signal that philosophy subsidies nita end and need to be phased out very fast. because as we all know on resources of all kinds, economic resources, either not an infinite pied, it can be divided coretta and it, it's reading for them for the market to see as well where the day where the resources should be put in. on default, if it's up to these need to be phased out and this money needs to be put into renewables, but also into storage into batteries, into interconnections and, and so on and so forth. as if this, i think, is her,
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is really of primary importance, right? now let me just get a quicker response from cornelia about the russian aspect. before we move the debates on, i mean, russia is suspected of slowing down. it's existing gas applies the list, just come out and said, no, that's not the case. if you're playing policy, it will russia with ice of us all, both. i'm politics with each other. you know, the relationship between europe and russia is not a happy one. the relationship between russia and many of the of the western world is not a happy mom. so they're playing politics with each other and, and, and, and use it as an element of russia playing politics. but there's also an element of a lot of money having been invested in. no, it's been to not just from the russian side from the european side as well as, but it, well really coming back to the renewables. we all investing in renewables. and if you look at the strong e s g guidelines, it's very high for banks. let's say this time to invest in upstream development of
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oil and gas so, so the money is flowing in the right direction and he should flow in that direction . we just need to make sure we get over that hump. and we also need to get a little bit west in europe century, less western europe century because when you go to, you know, athlete time, other places where people need mobility, they may not have the money to invest in all that an electric vehicle infrastructure. so we need to make sure we keep the we still and like we find and power whilst we move on that fast speed towards energy transition address. let's just move the debate on quick and talk about emissions. i mean, what impact you think the energy crisis then we'll have on you emission commitments . i mean, if renewables on foss enough on cold and gas as you say, a plug in the gap, how is that like it? and to play out next month, clock $26.00 in glasgow. well 1st of all, i say, you know,
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the current crunch said we're talking about is, i mean, it is not great and it's difficult and it will affect the most vulnerable people across europe and elsewhere. but i would still say it's temporary, it is something that will go away after you know, a couple of months when, when the markets will change again. well, when we're going to have a soft, the markets. and so we probably don't have a lasting impact on, on gas markets at the energy markets more generally the, i mean it's, it's hard to predict the future. but what we have seen from that mc ready is that even a major, a major economic crisis does not put in, you know, does not do away with the structural reality is all the energy markets, which are hard wired into energy infrastructure and long term energy investment so what you gotta do is you've got to put structural breaks into that system and,
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and even a major, major crisis, did not do that. because what we've seen is that the, the greenhouse gas emissions over 29th of a 2020, they did considerably. but the picked up until the end of 20. 20. precisely, that's what happened before. and now they're picking up again and above previous levels. so we haven't learned that in essence, really we haven't gone where we should have been, which is learn the lessons from 2820 or 29 when we had a huge different greenhouse gas emissions. but then it went all back to the normal . we should have put the money more we're we're climate policies are european 50 european said some other countries did not to us did not the china did not. and others didn't either. which means overall on a, you know, on a global scale i'm, i'm almost pessimistic for this small crisis that we're seeing here having to have a lasting effect of putting structural breaks. and let me,
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let me just put that point that according to bay, i mean company know what does this all mean for the use climate commitments? does this crisis put yet more pressure on europe submissions? well, i think that i think that, you know, this is very, very, very, very clear on the car and the guidance of mrs. on the line that the green deal is really, really important. and they want to, they want to become the 1st met 0 continent in the world. so i think in co day it will really, i've you for, for, for you know, for focus for going down. the reality is how do we again, i'm a pragmatist. how do we get from here today? yes, we are pouring the investment in there. absolutely. you know, you, i would guess this is right that we, we are hired in a certain way, but you know, once investors have put a lot of money in something, it's hard to, to go against that reality. especially if you want them then to invest in something
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else because they want to have some sort of, you know, if they're in a fair investment. but if i look at the investment criteria, especially of my job banks and of all the big you know, and asset managers, they are really driving towards next 0. so if anything, the oil and gas companies are seeing a very tough time getting money in. all right, so we looked at the picture in europe. let's look around the rest of the world. if you can just briefly. i mean, prices for natural gas now reaching record levels, sylvia posterity. what does this mean? do you think for developing countries who are struggling to restart their economies in a post covered world? i think it does a few points as us have. we have already quite touch upon in the conversation that are very important. first of all is it is talking about the people who are most vulnerable and we're talk we can, we can talk about people who are most vulnerable, both in europe, but also elsewhere. and thinking about the, the at energy crisis and the price crisis right now. it's absolutely important
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state government having place, plans full. those were at most risk of, of energy poverty. and i think this is a valid point in general, even beyond europe as well. and 2nd i, i think this is also even more crucial for you for outside europe. at the point of where we are, signaling debt being best meant is worth making and debt. and what is why it was mentioned earlier, the point of around philosophy subsidies and that needs to be faced out because this continues to send the wrong signals in europe, but also elsewhere. because if you keep pouring money into a, into the st. francis fossil gas infrastructure, we will only end out okay. especially in the face of climate. what he says in climate crisis would only end up with stranded assets and we're locking in more and more emissions at witnesses a value. the think this is volley for both europe and, and outside and as europeans, i think to stick up is
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a perfect opportunity for us to make sure that we provide support to those outside of your coney. i see you nodding your head there. i mean, we're already seeing rolling electricity blackouts in china, energy companies going bust in the u. k. is this a warning? do you think the rest of the world why didn't want to do the rest of the world? i would especially look at the, at the developing world because we need to make sure we know the developing world. i think so. there's absolutely right there. we need to make sure that we help the, the developing world with the help of the cop twitter the purchase agreement and you know, funding mechanisms and we help them invest in the face. but we also need to make sure that we get over to the lights, don't go out while we're doing all the right thing. so we may need to live for a little while longer with the cleanest of the, of the, of the fossil fuels. to ensure that people still have mobility have heating, ha,
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wanted a need, your address. let me ask you this. some ensued or touched on this issue of vulnerable people. i mean, many vulnerable people have already been hit by the economic impact globally of corona virus. now they face spiraling energy bills. what does this mean then for ordinary people or what should governments be doing to help them? well, governments can do a lot of things that we have to spin through a major can on crisis. so most of the means that we have at our disposals dispos there are tested and we know how they work. in the end it can be anything from rebates to texas. auctions to simply checks being sent out to people in portable households. probably. so some priorities need to be made, you know, to targets on the one hand, some of the industries that are important to keep and to keep running because they also my job. so people and on the other hand to, to make sure the social impact of the current crisis does not adversely affect the
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most vulnerable. so there are some calibration to be done, but i think the other thing that, that we need to make sure is that we in the end start saving energy. i mean, this is the one thing we cannot do now is take with the supply side. there is not going to be a lot of more gas coming along, nor can we just leave quantities, policies, and for a callback. and so what she, what you get otherwise, you know, the strain energy of stringency of climate policies put in question. so what you gotta do is you've got to take her with the demand side. conservation measures are important here, and then you've probably got a pretty low. ok. we're going to have him all winter konita, a final thought from you. when to foss approaching in the northern hemisphere, how to governments than help the most vulnerable in society, i mean, many people simply cannot afford to pay the energy bills. yeah, i think they need to subsidize what i need to do, how much we don't agree with sylvia we,
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we shouldn't subsidize any past that. we may need to subsidize, may, may need to give them transfer payments because we, especially in europe in the developing the, i see the world we cannot ask people pensioners, old people weak people to choose between food and heat. that's, that's just, that's not right. but i think we also need to look for that. we need to look when we need to do an energy conservation. absolutely, that's the low hanging fruit. and we need to look at all the technology when we produce like c, c, u, s, and august carbon cab to use it in storage and all of the green hydrogen and all of those things. all right, we have to leave it there. thank you very much. to all our guests, connie le, in bern, undress gulf out in berlin and silver pastor, really in brussels. thank you very much indeed. and thank you to for watching, you can see the program again any time by visiting our website, al jazeera dot com for further discussion. go to our facebook page, that's facebook dot com,
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forward slash ha inside story. and you can also join the conversation on twitter. handle is a j inside story. for me during jordan and the whole team here. good bye for now. a ah. what else can filmmaker? her son for silly catches the taliban? attention? a bounty on his head forces him to flee with his family, desperately seeking sanctuary. they journey across continents chronicling their multi year saga on their phones, midnight travellers, an odyssey of hope,
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resilience and ultimately one family's love for each other. witness on al jazeera, the latest news, as it breaks, free democrats and the creams of talking to each other, trying to iron out their differences. because together they form a large block in parliament with detailed coverage because the world's largest producer of low to feed. but children being used to meet the rising demand from around the world, the island has increased in land masses. as if rivera with this corruption is pulling the island of la paloma, out of the ocean. every war meets a devastating impact. so many environment earth rises, explore some of the efforts to recover what was lost from the syrian scientists. safeguarding one of our most valuable results is these are important samples. we
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have to make sure they are surviving to the refugees. striving to co exist with nature. okay, so what's going on there? we are simulating what happens when an elephant accomplish life off to conflict on al jazeera. ah, this is al jazeera. ah, this is a news hour on al jazeera. i'm for you back to go live from our world headquarters in doha, coming up in the next 60 minutes. today is that day on historic day, a boost for the fight against malaria, the w h o.


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